Time to put on our big boy pants... We get a long time to rest up, practice our 3-point shooting, and watch them play two games on national TV.
Purdue 105-SIUE 74
Purdue 111 Chicago State 42 - Battle for Atlantis
Purdue 86 Marquette 71 - Gavitt Games - in Milwaukee
Purdue 106 Fairfield 64
Tennessee 78 Purdue 75 - Battle for Atlantis
Western Kentucky 77 Purdue 73 - Battle for Atlantis
Purdue 89 Arizona 64 - 7th place game Battle for Atlantis
Purdue 66 Louisville 57
and coming up...
Friday, 12/1, Purdue at Maryland - Big10 network 6pm central
Sunday, 12/3, Northwestern at Purdue - Big10 network 3pm central
Us on 12/7
and 12/10 they host IUPUI... maybe we can catch them looking ahead ?
A lot of us will be hanging our hat on the anomaly that was the Western Kentucky game... so here's a link to that Box Score...
http://statbroadcast.com/events/archived.php?id=199199
WKY won the rebounding battle 36-33 (both teams with 11 OR)
WKY was 5-12 from 3pt; PU was 8-27
WKY was 16-24 from the line, PU was 17-20
WKY had 12 TOs, PU had 13
this may have been the big stat...
PU's starters played, 32, 35,35, 29 and 20 minutes; one guy (Matt Haarms) off the bench scored 4 points in 11 minutes...
WKY's starters played 32,34,35,35 and 14; with two guys off the bench playing 24 and 21, scoring 19 points, 7 Rebs and 2 TOs
Points in the paint: WKY 38, PU 26
I think we can surprise Purdue and win this game! It will take a near perfect game, 40% from 3 point land, 80% on FTs, great rebounding and limit the turnovers.
Valpo 75
Purdue 74
-------
Okay, some reality has set in...
Valpo 70
Purdue 75
I see us competing during this game, but Purdue's depth finishes the game.
I'm not too optimistic about this one, especially on the road and the way we've been shooting from 3. 72-60 Purdue.
Our talent is good. But we are not cohesive enough or confident enough to contend with Purdue. Sorry but I say 74 to 59 Purdue.
However, this year we do have a strong on the ball point guard and people can who can release their shot high enough vs. a Big 10 teams. That has not usually been true at VU. So....on any given day we could shoot 60% and win. Or we could 30% like vs. USU.
Aw, c'mon. How about 74-60? 59 sounds so, well, not good.
I actually think we have a shot to steal a W in Mackey this year. If our offense is flowing for a majority of the game (a big if) and our bigs stay out of foul trouble, along with HOT 3 point shooting then I could see us stealing a win. We'd need to be have a great night. I've watched most of
purdue's games. They're very good but they're beatable.
I think we can win on the right night, but I wouldn't bet on us. We have a chance though.
Quote from: crusadermoe on November 29, 2017, 05:48:10 PM
Our talent is good. But we are not cohesive enough or confident enough to contend with Purdue. Sorry but I say 74 to 59 Purdue.
However, this year we do have a strong on the ball point guard and people can who can release their shot high enough vs. a Big 10 teams. That has not usually been true at VU. So....on any given day we could shoot 60% and win. Or we could 30% like vs. USU.
Confidence? Have you watched this team this year?
Quote from: a3uge on November 29, 2017, 07:43:03 PM
Quote from: crusadermoe on November 29, 2017, 05:48:10 PM
Our talent is good. But we are not cohesive enough or confident enough to contend with Purdue. Sorry but I say 74 to 59 Purdue.
However, this year we do have a strong on the ball point guard and people can who can release their shot high enough vs. a Big 10 teams. That has not usually been true at VU. So....on any given day we could shoot 60% and win. Or we could 30% like vs. USU.
Confidence? Have you watched this team this year?
Indeed. They're so confident that they feel they can try silly or lazy passes without consequence. But, I am reminded of the studies that show American students behind in every facet of academics compared to other countries but ranking number one in confidence. Let them not be those people.
Purdue 77
Valpo 68
We can't beat Purdue going 12 deep. That much I know. These are the sorts of games where our top dogs need to play, play a lot, and play well.
Piick 8 and roll with them. Coach should know who is and who is not ready for this sort of jump up in competition.
Move Golder into the starting lineup. Max / Smits / Kiser off the bench.
Gonna need Tevonn to hit 34 minutes (a 3 minute break each half). He should be exhausted for Ball State, let others pick up the slack for that one.
Quote from: SanityLost17 on November 29, 2017, 10:36:15 PM
We can't beat Purdue going 12 deep. That much I know. These are the sorts of games where our top dogs need to play, play a lot, and play well.
Piick 8 and roll with them. Coach should know who is and who is not ready for this sort of jump up in competition.
Move Golder into the starting lineup. Max / Smits / Kiser off the bench.
I agree with everything here. If we're going to keep it close we're probably going be rolling with a shorter bench. If Micah isn't having one of hot offensive nights right away Coach will probably be quick to pull him.
We're also going to need something from 4s. They need to do 2 main things. Defend and rebound. Everything else is gravy. I could see Purdue trying to take advantage of our young Power Forwards. Vince Edwards is going to be a really tough cover for our team.
This is going to have to be our cleanest game so far this year if we're going to pull this off. There's a chance we can, but if we play like we did against Utah State, I suspect we'll get beat by 10 to 20 points.
Not sure we have beaten a Big 10 team on the road since the early 1970s when we knocked off Northwestern -- a game I attended. I'm not positive, but I think we beat them handily -- by 15 or 20 points.
Purdue will be a very tough environment. I have to pick Purdue by 20+. We will get better in tough matchups as the season progresses, but chances are this will be a learning lesson for our young team.
Paul
According to Sagarin, as of right now Purdue would be favored by 15 points. I would like to see a big upset, but realistically I would view a single-digit loss as a positive result for Valpo as they continue to move forward. In fact, it would be positive from an rpi standpoint.
I would like to see the whole road trip as a way to build further cohesion in team play, especially getting some players on track (Burton, Bradford, Hazen) and adding more confidence in the center position rotation, then begin the all-important conference play with a totally healthy (particularly Walker) and even more improved team than the one that began the season 8-0.
Margin of victory is not a factor in RPI, so if we lose to Purdue by 1 or by 30, it will be all the same. Now for ratings like Sagarin and KenPom, a close loss would have a very different effect on our ratings than a blowout.
In Valparaiso's last 47 true road games against high major programs, dating back to 1993, the Crusaders are 3-44.
Road games at high major opponents
Mar. 14, 2017 -- Illinois 82-57
Dec. 7, 2016 -- Kentucky 87-63
Nov. 17, 2016 -- Oregon 76-54
Nov. 24, 2015 -- Oregon State W 63-57
Nov. 22, 2015 -- Oregon 73-67
Nov. 16, 2014 -- Missouri 56-41
Nov. 13, 2013 -- Illinois 64-52
Nov. 15, 2012 -- Nebraska 50-48
Mar. 14, 2012 -- Miami (Fla.) 66-50
Nov. 25, 2011 -- Ohio State 80-47
Nov. 7, 2011 -- Arizona 73-64
Nov. 15, 2010 -- Kansas 79-44
Dec. 9, 2009 -- at Purdue 86-62
Nov. 22, 2009 -- Michigan State 90-60
Nov. 15, 2009 -- North Carolina 88-77
Dec. 28, 2008 -- Purdue 59-45
Mar. 19, 2008 -- Washington W 72-71
Dec. 30, 2008 -- North Carolina 90-58
Dec. 22, 2008 -- Wisconsin 68-58
Nov. 20, 2008 -- Vanderbilt 87-78
Dec. 2, 2006 -- Ohio State 78-58
Nov. 21, 2006 -- North Carolina State 78-64
Dec. 18, 2005 -- Duke 104-77
Dec. 7, 2005 -- Marquette 69-54
Dec. 3, 2005 -- Iowa 72-59
Dec. 29, 2004 -- Arizona State 89-65
Dec. 19, 2004 -- Illinois 93-56
Nov. 19, 2004 -- Cincinnati 88-70
Feb. 26, 2004 -- Duke 97-63
Nov. 22, 2003 -- Marquette 75-70
Mar. 17, 2003 -- Iowa 62-60
Dec. 30, 2002 -- Missouri 65-47
Dec. 28, 2002 -- Purdue 87-55
Dec. 2, 2002 -- Cincinnati 76-50
Nov. 24, 2002 -- Syracuse 81-66
Jan. 2, 2002 -- Kansas 81-73
Dec. 30, 2001 -- Arizona 74-70
Dec. 8, 1999 -- Notre Dame 65-42
Dec. 4, 1999 -- Minnesota 57-44
Dec. 11, 1998 -- Purdue 78-70
Nov. 30, 1998 -- Illinois 53-49
Nov. 20, 1996 -- Vanderbilt 74-66
Dec. 21, 1995 -- Purdue 74-53*
Dec. 14, 1995 -- Wisconsin 90-73
Nov. 27, 1994 -- Notre Dame 77-69
Nov. 28, 1993 -- Notre Dame 95-74
Mar. 3, 1993 -- Notre Dame W 80-66
Certain big games against teams like New Mexico, St. Louis, Houston and Charlotte have been left off the list. While on a higher level than Valpo, I don't consider them high major like the aforementioned teams.
Quote from: ml2 on November 30, 2017, 11:07:43 AM
Margin of victory is not a factor in RPI, so if we lose to Purdue by 1 or by 30, it will be all the same. Now for ratings like Sagarin and KenPom, a close loss would have a very different effect on our ratings than a blowout.
I agree. Sorry if I wasn't clear. I didn't mean to suggest that the margin of victory would impact the rpi, which I know doesn't matter, but that just playing a top-ranked team like Purdue would be positive for the rpi. My point about margin of victory had to do with team confidence, which would be stronger with a single-digit loss on the road to such a high-ranking opponent rather than suffering a blowout. In addition, as you note, other ratings do consider margin of victory and road or home in their evaluations.
I think you will see all 12 guys play and our 6, or so, big guys use up a lot of their fouls especially on Haarms who has been atrocious at the line. I'd defend the 3 point line hard and let my big guys go one on one with their big guys. Defend them straight up, and if you foul make sure it isn't an and 1.
Valpo 69-67 winner on a Burton buzzer beater.
Quote from: SanityLost17 on November 29, 2017, 10:36:15 PMWe can't beat Purdue going 12 deep.
I think Matt will figure out a way for us to compete but I just don't know how he will do it.
This is the game where the need for an experienced Peters or Fazekas type 4 will be apparent. Any chance at victory depends our ability to adaquately fill in this gap. Could we see a few minutes of dual Smirollas? What could it hurt but the point spread ???
Quote from: 78crusader on November 30, 2017, 10:03:26 AM
Not sure we have beaten a Big 10 team on the road since the early 1970s when we knocked off Northwestern -- a game I attended. I'm not positive, but I think we beat them handily -- by 15 or 20 points.
Purdue will be a very tough environment. I have to pick Purdue by 20+. We will get better in tough matchups as the season progresses, but chances are this will be a learning lesson for our young team.
Paul
So based on the results listed above, Valpo has played 20 such games in the last 10 years, having won 2 and played within 12 points 7 other times. Purdue is really good and one of only a couple of teams that actually are bigger than us, particularly in the post with two huge guys (7'3" 250# and 7'2" 290#). I'm guessing we stay within 15, 78-65.
Quote from: justducky on November 30, 2017, 12:28:05 PM
Quote from: SanityLost17 on November 29, 2017, 10:36:15 PMWe can't beat Purdue going 12 deep.
I think Matt will figure out a way for us to compete but I just don't know how he will do it.
This is the game where the need for an experienced Peters or Fazekas type 4 will be apparent. Any chance at victory depends our ability to adaquately fill in this gap. Could we see a few minutes of dual Smirollas? What could it hurt but the point spread ???
I don't see how we avoid the 12-player rotation. The home-cooking, general toughness of Purdue, and our own players' challenges with NOT fouling will almost demand it. Furthermore, no lineup has really emerged in the last two games (the toughest, so far) as being the identity of the team. The best chance we have is for our bench players to come in (with very specific assignments) and execute. Offensively, our core players will not be able to play to their strength for an entire game without the bench mixing things up. In our 6 D1 games, the bench has shot 73-143 (51%). How do you take that away?
A TBT from CA
https://twitter.com/chrisartis5/status/936447779467087872
Did those uniforms have a print of the state of Indiana with VU stitched inside the state? I like it
Northwestern at Purdue on BTN at 3:00. Good chance to scout both.
I watched most of the Purdue win at Maryland. At the 1,2 and 3 positions I think we are approximately even. At the 5 they are better and at the 4 they have a senior facing our freshman. At first glance I will say Purdue over VU by a dozen. I think we may try to use all of our depth but not all will be up to the task.
Don't expect any calls to go our way. Northwestern just played at West Lafayette and got jobbed as bad as any other visiting team by these Big Ten officials.
I didn't watch Purdue northwestern today but saw Purdue won by 5. Looks like Haas had a big game for Purdue. Purdue also shot 24 free throws to northwestern's 5 total free throws which is likely the difference in the game.
I think if we can contain Haas and not have a huge free throw disparity like northwestern had, then we win. I'm fearful that our bigs are going to have a long night and lots of fouls though.
Quote from: valpolaw on December 03, 2017, 07:33:50 PM
I didn't watch Purdue northwestern today but saw Purdue won by 5. Looks like Haas had a big game for Purdue. Purdue also shot 24 free throws to northwestern's 5 total free throws which is likely the difference in the game.
Purdue is at their best when both of their bigs are consistent because it causes defenders to cheat on the perimeter and Purdue's backcourt gets more open looks from behind the arc. Haas has looked good the last few games but he is notorious for disappearing some games. They're freshman big is huge but still inconsistent as well. We need to contain them and limit the second chance points and DON'T FOUL! We need both Derrik and Jaume to step up that night.
Quote from: valpolaw on December 03, 2017, 07:33:50 PM
I think if we can contain Haas and not have a huge free disparity like northwestern had, then we win. I'm fearful that our bigs are going to have a long night and lots of fouls though.
I'm also worried about the officiating and not getting any calls. Big 10 refs are some of the most friendly hometown refs in the business. I just don't want us picking up cheap fouls early or else it could be a long night.
The stat sheet from todays game if anyone wants to take a look.
https://twitter.com/nbairdjc/status/937456411767984128
The guys are looking forward to the Purdue game
https://twitter.com/TheReal_MG3/status/937514301056802816
https://twitter.com/KWO4/status/937437881752346625
Purdue blog thinks Thursday could be a "trap game" for them. Let's hope so.
https://twitter.com/HammerAndRails/status/937468681730347008
I seem to remember a game we played @Wisconsin 10 or 12ish years ago that we should have won if not for an unreasonable foul disparity. Perhaps I am miss remembering, the disparity may not have been awful, but the last 5 minutes of the game seemed like a 4 to 1 situation with Wisconsin getting all the calls down the stretch.
Quote from: SanityLost17 on December 04, 2017, 07:12:42 AM
I seem to remember a game we played @Wisconsin 10 or 12ish years ago that we should have won if not for an unreasonable foul disparity. Perhaps I am miss remembering, the disparity may not have been awful, but the last 5 minutes of the game seemed like a 4 to 1 situation with Wisconsin getting all the calls down the stretch.
A painful memory. With about 4:30 left in that game it was like the refs said "wait a minute, we can't let Valpo win the game" and from that time on we didn't get one call.
Quote from: valpolaw on December 03, 2017, 07:33:50 PM
I didn't watch Purdue northwestern today but saw Purdue won by 5. Looks like Haas had a big game for Purdue. Purdue also shot 24 free throws to northwestern's 5 total free throws which is likely the difference in the game.
I think if we can contain Haas and not have a huge free throw disparity like northwestern had, then we win. I'm fearful that our bigs are going to have a long night and lots of fouls though.
I think Valpo has a size and athleticism advantage at the 1, 2 and 3 spots. The key will be slowing down V. Edwards and Haas. Valpo has the size to match up, but is still relatively young in the front court. Big games by Walker and Burton ... VU by 2.
We're getting some love on MVCFans Some are actually picking us to pull the upset over Purdue. I hope we prove those folks right. Go Valpo!
I'll say this: IF we can get through these next three games unscathed and avoid a let down in California I could see this team heading into it's first matchup with UNI 18-0. This won't be easy though, but it could happen. Go Valpo!
Quote from: VUGrad1314 on December 04, 2017, 01:44:03 PM
I'll say this: IF we can get through these next three games unscathed and avoid a let down in California I could see this team heading into it's first matchup with UNI 18-0. This won't be easy though, but it could happen. Go Valpo!
And ranked #12 in the country! You're a couple of steps ahead of me. Beat Purdue and maybe I'll get on your bandwagon.
Quote from: agibson on December 04, 2017, 02:13:44 PM
Quote from: VUGrad1314 on December 04, 2017, 01:44:03 PM
I'll say this: IF we can get through these next three games unscathed and avoid a let down in California I could see this team heading into it's first matchup with UNI 18-0. This won't be easy though, but it could happen. Go Valpo!
And ranked #12 in the country! You're a couple of steps ahead of me. Beat Purdue and maybe I'll get on you bandwagon.
I'd take 17-1! I think we'll be 16-2 going into the UNI game.
Anything 16-2 and above would be fantastic!
You guys are drinking way too much cool-aide. These road games are going to expose our flaws. A moral victory would be losing by less than 10 at Mackey. I think we are better than pre-season expectations, but we are not as good as our record currently indicates. Plus, at least once or twice every season we have a completely head scratching loss that makes not sense. We will have a few of those this year as well in addition to the games we are clear underdogs.
Quote from: SanityLost17 on December 04, 2017, 02:46:48 PM
You guys are drinking way too much cool-aide. These road games are going to expose our flaws. A moral victory would be losing by less than 10 at Mackey. I think we are better than pre-season expectations, but we are not as good as our record currently indicates. Plus, at least once or twice every season we have a completely head scratching loss that makes not sense. We will have a few of those this year as well in addition to the games we are clear underdogs.
Maybe. I think we have a legitimate shot against Northwestern, but we need to play a good game. The road games at Indiana St and Bradley could show some problems, especially if we don't play well. One thing I really like about this team is the talent and depth. How many different scoring leaders have we had in 8 games? How many rebounding leaders in those games? I think we have 9 players averaging above 3 rebounds per game, and no one more than 5.1. If a few players are not scoring or playing defense well, we have another 7 players eager to come in with a spark. They all know that if they get the hot hand, the rock will come to them. This team lifts each other up.
Quote from: VUGrad1314 on December 04, 2017, 01:44:03 PM
I'll say this: IF we can get through these next three games unscathed and avoid a let down in California I could see this team heading into it's first matchup with UNI 18-0. This won't be easy though, but it could happen. Go Valpo!
Absurd, Absurd, Absurd.
Anyone plan on making the drive down? I'll be in section 109.
Quote from: SanityLost17 on December 04, 2017, 02:46:48 PM
You guys are drinking way too much cool-aide. These road games are going to expose our flaws. A moral victory would be losing by less than 10 at Mackey. I think we are better than pre-season expectations, but we are not as good as our record currently indicates. Plus, at least once or twice every season we have a completely head scratching loss that makes not sense. We will have a few of those this year as well in addition to the games we are clear underdogs.
I totally agree. We are very good but we have yet to prove that we can shoot from outside, or defend, or minimize turnovers against top level competition.
Quote from: VUGrad1314 on December 04, 2017, 01:44:03 PMI'll say this: IF we can get through these next three games unscathed and avoid a let down in California I could see this team heading into it's first matchup with UNI 18-0.
If this actually happens I will gladly cook up an old VU cap (well done to an ash powder) and wash it down with a quart or gallon of cold fresh milk from Family Express. Book it! :thumbsup:
https://twitter.com/nbairdjc/status/937822971338674176
Does anyone think this long layover between games could actually hurt us? Maybe the guys won't come out sharp after its been over a week since the Utah State game?
It obviously could help getting practice time and letting guys rest up before the big 6 away game stretch. I remember Coach Lottich said in one of the interviews that he was looking forward to adding certain features to the offense over this break. I hope we can find of more consistency in our half-court offense as the season goes along. That's probably been one of our weaknesses thus far. I also think it will help Joe get into better rhythm on offense as the season goes along.
Quote from: SanityLost17 on December 04, 2017, 02:46:48 PMat least once or twice every season we have a completely head scratching loss that makes not sense.
Agree. I don't believe this team is different from past really good Valpo teams. We have some weaknesses. We will have some head scratching loss that makes not sense. I'm no sensing an 18-0 team going into the UNI game.
Just went back and looked - over the last three seasons Purdue is a combined 24-3 at home against other Big Ten teams. It is a tall order for anyone to go into that arena and get a W.
Countdown for those who love VUMBB
https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/basketball?iso=20171207T1730&p0=64&msg=Valpo+at+Purdue&font=hand&csz=1 (https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/basketball?iso=20171207T1730&p0=64&msg=Valpo+at+Purdue&font=hand&csz=1)
Love the pink!
I give Valpo a less than 5% chance of winning this game. It is nothing against Valpo - they are just a team that is developing well, but has not developed enough to play with a team like Purdue. Valpo has too few options on offense to avoid long scoring droughts and is not developed enough at the 4 and 5 to handle Purdue's bigs (many in D1 would have a problem with them). I think Valpo loses by 20-25. What I am looking for is whether there are 5-8 minute stretches when Valpo plays even with them and whether Valpo's defense is as good as it seems to be.
I think that Valpo has a much better chance against Northwestern.
ESPN game "predictor" gives Valpo a 9% chance, which sounds about right in my book. There is a chance but we'd need to have a very hot shooting night and for Purdue to not have a great game. Mackey is an very tough place to play. http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/game?gameId=400986412
Prediction:
Purdue 87
Valpo 68
All I really want is a good showing. If we can push Purdue at times during the game, I'd be very pleased. Purdue is a very strong team.
Quote from: vu84v2 on December 05, 2017, 10:13:28 AM
I give Valpo a less than 5% chance of winning this game. It is nothing against Valpo - they are just a team that is developing well, but has not developed enough to play with a team like Purdue. Valpo has too few options on offense to avoid long scoring droughts and is not developed enough at the 4 and 5 to handle Purdue's bigs (many in D1 would have a problem with them). I think Valpo loses by 20-25. What I am looking for is whether there are 5-8 minute stretches when Valpo plays even with them and whether Valpo's defense is as good as it seems to be.
I think that Valpo has a much better chance against Northwestern.
Massey gives us a 12% chance against PurWHO, and 33% against Northwestern:
https://www.masseyratings.com/team.php?t=8361&s=298892
T-Rank gives us 9% and 34%:
http://barttorvik.com/team.php?team=Valparaiso
Teamrankings gives us 5.3% and 29.5%:
https://www.teamrankings.com/ncaa-basketball/team/valparaiso-crusaders/projections
The Northwestern game is winnable, but it would take a near perfect game - an extra OR on our side with an extra DR on our side, then an extra defended 3 on our side, and an extra offensive 3 on our side - but it can happen.
While I do think Purdue kicks the crap out of us (78-57), I think this game might be looked back on throughout this year, and maybe next, as the one that really propelled us.
I appreciate this team and the hustle they've shown, but we are simply not on the mental level to compete with a Purdue right now. Sloppy passes, late defensive rotations, bad closeouts (looking at you, Derrik) are way too plentiful so far. We've gotten away with it simply because our level of competition has been bad.
The good news is we have a smart coaching staff and they will use this game to show the players the type of level they need to be at to compete with these teams. I think the NW game will be very interesting after that.
That being said, if we go into Mackey and give Purdue a game, watch out MVC.
Quote from: vu84v2 on December 05, 2017, 10:13:28 AMValpo has too few options on offense to avoid long scoring droughts and is not developed enough at the 4 and 5 to handle Purdue's bigs (many in D1 would have a problem with them). I think Valpo loses by 20-25.
It may happen like this. When their bigs get the ball down low we try to double and get burned by the open outside man. When we get the ball in the post they can cheat towards the middle creating some turnovers in the process and concede some semi contested shots from our perimeter 4's. Can we shoot lights out from beyond the arc? Probably not and if we can't it could be a long night.
I think Sorolla and Smits can learn as much from this game as they did in their previous 8. I would like to see them get some clean 1 vs 1 looks against Haas and Harrms. I am expecting some ugly play here but they can learn a lot from their mistakes.
How can Haas be defended? He backs everybody down so effortlessly that it almost looks like it is legal. How about a Lexus Williams type defensive crouch which puts our bigs heads on his midsection?
Quote from: covufan on December 05, 2017, 10:48:11 AM
Quote from: vu84v2 on December 05, 2017, 10:13:28 AM
I give Valpo a less than 5% chance of winning this game. It is nothing against Valpo - they are just a team that is developing well, but has not developed enough to play with a team like Purdue. Valpo has too few options on offense to avoid long scoring droughts and is not developed enough at the 4 and 5 to handle Purdue's bigs (many in D1 would have a problem with them). I think Valpo loses by 20-25. What I am looking for is whether there are 5-8 minute stretches when Valpo plays even with them and whether Valpo's defense is as good as it seems to be.
I think that Valpo has a much better chance against Northwestern.
Massey gives us a 12% chance against PurWHO, and 33% against Northwestern:
https://www.masseyratings.com/team.php?t=8361&s=298892
T-Rank gives us 9% and 34%:
http://barttorvik.com/team.php?team=Valparaiso
Teamrankings gives us 5.3% and 29.5%:
https://www.teamrankings.com/ncaa-basketball/team/valparaiso-crusaders/projections
The Northwestern game is winnable, but it would take a near perfect game - an extra OR on our side with an extra DR on our side, then an extra defended 3 on our side, and an extra offensive 3 on our side - but it can happen.
Remember Northwestern is on a neutral floor and our crowd may be as large as theirs!
I've been around long enough, and so have many on this board, to expect nothing less than a disheartening beat down in Mackey. I've seen too many VU teams with high hopes go up against Purdue or other "power 5" teams only to be sorely disappointed during the game and at the final outcome. If Northwestern ends up with a 24-5 disparity in free throws, how bad could it be for Valpo? Haas and his new cohort will expose Smits and Sorolla, and show why they are at VU and not a Big 10 school. It's not going to be pretty, folks. Painter knows Valpo is capable, there will be no overlooking the Crusaders and Purdue will win by 20-plus.
Quote from: Valpo89 on December 05, 2017, 12:00:28 PM
I've been around long enough, and so have many on this board, to expect nothing less than a disheartening beat down in Mackey. I've seen too many VU teams with high hopes go up against Purdue or other "power 5" teams only to be sorely disappointed during the game and at the final outcome. If Northwestern ends up with a 24-5 disparity in free throws, how bad could it be for Valpo? Haas and his new cohort will expose Smits and Sorolla, and show why they are at VU and not a Big 10 school. It's not going to be pretty, folks. Painter knows Valpo is capable, there will be no overlooking the Crusaders and Purdue will win by 20-plus.
You might be right 89, time will tell. I watched Purdue beat Marquette and I honestly thought they could be a final four team. Having said that, the last time we played at Purdue we lost by 24 (2009-2010) with a team that finished 15-17. It was Broekhoff's freshman year and our starting center was Cory Johnson at 6'7"(maybe). What we lack in experience at this point in the season we gain in speed and athleticism and I think that is what might keep us in the game. Typically Purdue is bigger and faster, like in 09-10 but that won't be the case this time. We are as big and athletic as they are. Now, being as big height wise doesn't make you as tough to be sure! It will be a very good test for our young team. I'll go with a loss of 15 or less.
I'm just ready for the game to be played!!! 8-0 is nice to look at, but I want to see some basketball :'(!
I'll know 5 minutes into warmups how the game is going to go. If we look like this...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBVqX2cmVtY
...we may pull off the upset. If we look like this...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8SNIGiS2o3A
...it could be a long evening.
Quote from: VU2014 on December 04, 2017, 10:01:55 PM
Does anyone think this long layover between games could actually hurt us? Maybe the guys won't come out sharp after its been over a week since the Utah State game?
I don't like the long layover, but not because of the fear that the guys won't come out sharp. I don't like the layover because we're getting too much attention. No chance of us sneaking up on Purdue and stealing one. None. Let's just hope this game won't be like 2002 Kentucky. We had a long layoff after the conference tournament, got a little press that said Valpo was a team to watch during that interim, then Kentucky took notice, and promptly ran us out of the building.
Quote from: crusaderjoe on December 05, 2017, 02:49:06 PM
Quote from: VU2014 on December 04, 2017, 10:01:55 PM
Does anyone think this long layover between games could actually hurt us? Maybe the guys won't come out sharp after its been over a week since the Utah State game?
I don't like the long layover, but not because of the fear that the guys won't come out sharp. I don't like the layover because we're getting too much attention. No chance of us sneaking up on Purdue and stealing one. None. Let's just hope this game won't be like 2002 Kentucky. We had a long layoff after the conference tournament, got a little press that said Valpo was a team to watch during that interim, then Kentucky took notice, and promptly ran us out of the building.
Noted. However, this isn't that Valpo team. Purdue isn't that Kentucky team. If we play a good game, we can be in this game in the final three minutes. From there, it could be interesting.
How many bus loads are headed to W. Lafayette?
Quote from: valpo64 on December 05, 2017, 03:08:23 PM
How many bus loads are headed to W. Lafayette?
As of last month it was 2. I'm sure many people are planning on driving down there as well.
https://twitter.com/ValpoAlumni/status/930157578713272322
This just emphasizes how tough Mackey is of a place to play. That is an impressive group of teams that probably were more tested then we are going in there on Thursday.
https://twitter.com/ChrisForman12/status/938157705650475019
Quote from: VU2014 on December 05, 2017, 03:38:37 PM
This just emphasizes how tough Mackey is of a place to play. That is an impressive group of teams that probably were more tested then we are going in there on Thursday.
https://twitter.com/ChrisForman12/status/938157705650475019
When we win we will be in select Company and By reading Above know we why can't, Change is hard!!!! hope the team has not read This!!!! :(
https://twitter.com/NWIOren/status/938183294277111808
https://twitter.com/NWIOren/status/938183511265169413
https://twitter.com/NWIOren/status/938183710859579393
https://twitter.com/NWIOren/status/938184634331955200
https://twitter.com/NWIOren/status/938185049081511936
https://twitter.com/NWIOren/status/938186147993411584
https://twitter.com/MichaelOsipoff/status/938182219356688384
https://twitter.com/MichaelOsipoff/status/938182783561814016
https://twitter.com/MichaelOsipoff/status/938183442424049665
https://twitter.com/MichaelOsipoff/status/938183601031655427
https://twitter.com/MichaelOsipoff/status/938183700055035904
After seeing us in person against Utah State, for us to win in Mackey, we need out mid range game to fluoirish. We need Smits and Sorolla to attack the rim like Linssen did against u St. We need to both defend the perimeter and score form the wings/perimeter to have a chance. They will work that ball down low against us, how we defend and answer will have a big outcome on this game. Honestly, this a potential Sweet 16 dark horse FF contender. Stay in the game with them and come out better than we did against Kentucky last year. We win, awesome. We don't but gave them fits all night still a win.
Before we deify these guys...
W. Kentucky postgame press conference:
https://purdue.rivals.com/news/purdue-s-bahamas-misery-continues-with-loss-to-western-kentucky
What if Purdue was one of us?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Gx1Pv02w3Q
One thing is for certain, we can't expect to go another 20-years for a top 25 win (home or away).
If we do, then we don't belong in the same breath as UNI or other giant slayers in this MVC. IMO we need Top 25 wins every class (4-years) to keep the program moving in a positive direction. If you argue Top 40, then I'd agree there even.
We've done very solid things these last 25-years, but that's not enough in a conference with Big Boy Programs. Wipe the board clean, this is a new quarter century. Excited to see us grow this year. Truly hoping we have a fellow MVC compatriot crack the Top 25 this year!
Good to hear that Matt will continue the deep player rotation against Purdue. This is the sign of a confident coach developing his team, in his way, on his timetable.
Short term this might make things a bit uglier but for March 2018 and beyond I love it. :thumbsup:
Quote from: justducky on December 05, 2017, 07:26:57 PM
Good to hear that Matt will continue the deep player rotation against Purdue. This is the sign of a confident coach developing his team, in his way, on his timetable.
Short term this might make things a bit uglier but for March 2018 and beyond I love it. :thumbsup:
Maybe. Sure it challenges the offensive rhythm, but if the bench is productive (and it has been against so-so opposition) I like a deep rotation as good insurance against fouling out and injuries and a good way to keep the players fresh enough to play intense defense.
Coach may say that he'll play everyone on Thursday but if we have any sort of run going with a 1 lineup he's going ride them till they force him make a switch. These are the types of games you don't worry about the minutes log as long as you still have a chance to win the game. If we get blown out yeah, I could see him keeping guys legs fresh for Saturday against Ball State (which just beat #9 Notre Dame in South Bend tonight).
It will be interesting to see how coach subs and rotates guys if they get into foul trouble (with Big 10 refs officiating this game they won't be friendly with the whistle to Valpo...)
I hope we don't get caught looking past Purdue while we are preparing for Ball St. ::)
When: Thursday, December 7th
Where: Mackey Arena, West Lafayette IN
Tip: 6:30 (ET) (approximate)
TV: FS1
h-man: Saw this on the Purdue message board. Apparently the start time is dependent on when other games finish.
Quote from: vu72 on December 05, 2017, 11:31:58 AMRemember Northwestern is on a neutral floor and our crowd may be as large as theirs!
Not really. My guess will be 1/4 Valpo fans. There will be a big Valpo fan group but the numbers Northwestern brings to Rosemont is normally about 1/2 to 2/3 of the All State Arena. 17,500 is capacity for basketball.
I'll take the under at 7,000 folks in the seats next Thursday night... UNLESS Valpo goes into the game 10-0...
Stat for the game at Mackey... "somethings gotta give"
Scoring Margin
1. Kansas +30.6
2. Cincinnati +25.1
3. Villanova +23.8
4. Miami (FL) +22.1
5. Virginia Tech +21.9
6. West Virginia +21.2
7. Texas Tech +20.5
8. Duke +20.3
9. UNLV +19.9
10. Georgetown +19.8
11. Florida State +19.6
12. Wichita State +19.5
13. Purdue +19.4
14. Arizona State +19.1
15. Xavier +19.1
16. Michigan State +18.2
17. Oklahoma State +18.1
18. Kansas State +17.8
19. Valparaiso +17.5
20. Virginia +16.9
Countdown continues!
https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/basketball?iso=20171207T1730&p0=64&msg=Valpo+at+Purdue&font=hand&csz=1
These in-state rivalry games are always fun! Hopefully Purdue will give us a good game! ;D
SOS: Real time RPI Sagarin Pomeroy
VALPO 266 319 312
PURDUE 48 27 42
Quote from: Just Sayin on December 06, 2017, 09:18:45 AM
SOS: Real time RPI Sagarin Pomeroy
VALPO 266 319 312
PURDUE 48 27 42
No doubt we are the underdogs going into their building.
Forget the ratings---IMO your guards can play with theirs--However, their seven footer might be a problem. BY the way, SIU has to play another top 25 in Nevada on Dec. 22 in Vegas Tourney--this will be an interesting game for the reason that Jordan Caroline, their good forward transferred from SIU to Nevada after his frosh season--in fact Nevada has tons of D-1 transfers
https://twitter.com/nbairdjc/status/938432693536161792
Scouting Purdue basketball vs. Valparaiso
Probable lineups and storylines for the Boilermakers' in-state non-conference matchup.
Nathan Baird, Journal & Courier
Dec. 6, 2017
http://www.jconline.com/story/sports/college/purdue/basketball/2017/12/06/scouting-purdue-basketball-vs-valparaiso/922203001/
Quote from: VU2014 on December 06, 2017, 09:29:37 AM
Quote from: Just Sayin on December 06, 2017, 09:18:45 AM
SOS: Real time RPI Sagarin Pomeroy
VALPO 266 319 312
PURDUE 48 27 42
No doubt we are the underdogs going into their building.
These aren't ratings, they're Strength of Schedule. SoS is just one factor in determining each of the above ranking/ratings. If your point is that Purdue has played a tougher schedule so far, point noted.
Valpo is 58th in RealTimeRPI, 73rd in Sagarin, and 84th in Pomeroy.
Purdue is 29th, 8th, and 10th, respectively.
Using Massey's Composite of 28 ranking systems (as of Sunday), Purdue is 10th and Valpo is 65th.
https://www.masseyratings.com/cb/compare.htm
Coach Lottich will be on 107.5 FM & 1070 The Fan radio in Indianapolis today. I'm sure he'll be talking about the upcoming Purdue game and the undefeated start to the season.
https://tunein.com/radio/1070-The-Fan-s29499/
https://twitter.com/TonyD1070/status/938449212496404481
I didn't realize Purdue starts 4 seniors. That was similar to us when we made the NIT run.
This VU team is going to be tough to beat come February and March. However, there is a pretty good chance we are going to get smoked tomorrow night and I would be pleased to escape December with a 3-4 record, although I suspect 2-5 is equally likely.
Paul
Matt doesn't sound too intimidated:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLv1In6TU08
We aren't sneaking up on anybody tomorrow. The Purdue beat guys made sure to remind them that Ball State beat Notre Dame last night and their fans were tweet at them to not sleep on us. Ball State didn't do us any favors last night. It just gave their players a reminder that ranked teams can fall to good mid-majors.
https://twitter.com/nbairdjc/status/938492442491400197
https://twitter.com/nbairdjc/status/938493917766520832
Here's a kick in the teeth for everyone. Opening spread Purdue -16.
Quote from: wh on December 06, 2017, 03:26:34 PM
Here's a kick in the teeth for everyone. Opening spread Purdue -16.
Not really. Just as I expected a week ago:
November 30, 2017, 10:47:25 AM
According to Sagarin, as of right now Purdue would be favored by 15 points. I would like to see a big upset, but realistically I would view a single-digit loss as a positive result for Valpo as they continue to move forward.
Quote from: valpopal on December 06, 2017, 04:19:05 PM
Quote from: wh on December 06, 2017, 03:26:34 PM
Here's a kick in the teeth for everyone. Opening spread Purdue -16.
Not really. Just as I expected a week ago:
November 30, 2017, 10:47:25 AM
According to Sagarin, as of right now Purdue would be favored by 15 points. I would like to see a big upset, but realistically I would view a single-digit loss as a positive result for Valpo as they continue to move forward.
last week RealTimeRpi had us down 18....today it's 87-67
Quote from: wh on December 06, 2017, 03:26:34 PM
Here's a kick in the teeth for everyone. Opening spread Purdue -16.
Quote from: valpopal on December 06, 2017, 04:19:05 PM
Quote from: wh on December 06, 2017, 03:26:34 PM
Here's a kick in the teeth for everyone. Opening spread Purdue -16.
Not really. Just as I expected a week ago:
November 30, 2017, 10:47:25 AM
According to Sagarin, as of right now Purdue would be favored by 15 points. I would like to see a big upset, but realistically I would view a single-digit loss as a positive result for Valpo as they continue to move forward.
About what I expected as well. Massey has us at -12, T-Rank has -16, and RTPower has us at -20.
Would love to see about a 6-8 point spread with about 3 minutes left, and then we light it up!
Quote from: wh on December 06, 2017, 03:26:34 PM
Here's a kick in the teeth for everyone. Opening spread Purdue -16.
Valpo will cover that.
Most up to date KenPom has us at 81 and Purdue at 9 so spread by Vegas is on par. Let's make a good showing in West Lafayette tomorrow. I hope Matt and company treat this like a post season game and play their butts off. Purdue has size but we got moxie. Here's hoping moxie wins out.i
As a reminder, we are on FS1 tomorrow so national exposure. I think everyone has access to FS1
Quote from: ValpoDad89 on December 06, 2017, 07:40:54 PMAs a reminder, we are on FS1 tomorrow so national exposure. I think everyone has access to FS1
It's not ESPN, but it's in a fair number of households.
Quote from: wh on December 06, 2017, 03:26:34 PM
Here's a kick in the teeth for everyone. Opening spread Purdue -16.
• Loyola was a 16 point underdog to Florida tonight.
• Ball State was an 18 point underdog to Notre Dame last night.
• W. Kentucky was a 19 point underdog to Purdue 13 days ago
Interesting, huh?
Local Comcast in Valpo has the game at 5:30 on channel 237 FS1.
Nolan's spread is now 15. real time RPI still has the spread at 20.
RealTimeRpi says we beat Loyola at home by 17 and beat them at the Gentile Center by 1.now THAT'S a home court advantage.
Went to check the Vegas line and found us featured in a nice article.
http://www.vegasinsider.com/college-basketball/scoreboard/previews/valparaiso-@-purdue.cfm/date/12-07-17
Current line 15.5
Boy, with the Ball State and ISU results over the in state big boys, then Loyola last night, this is actually setting up to be a huge disappointment if we don't give Purdue a serious game.
https://twitter.com/TheAndyKatz/status/938795755174842378
College basketball today: Don't underestimate Valparaiso, Iowa-Iowa State a hidden gem game
Andy Katz | NCAA.com Correspondent
Last Updated - Dec 7, 2017 10:32 EST
Contact |Archive |RSS
Here is what you need to know in college basketball for Thursday, December 7:
1. Valparaiso at Purdue is one of those danger games for the high-major team. Valpo is good, as in this team can upset a team in the first-round of the NCAA tournament good if they get a bid out of the Missouri Valley. The Crusaders are undefeated at 8-0 and have a couple of big-time scorers in Tevonn Walker and Bakari Evelyn. And the other thing that Valpo has, which most teams don't, are a couple of 7-footers in Derrik Smith and Jaume Sorolla. Purdue has great size with Isaac Haas and Matt Haarms. So this will be quite a test for the Boilermakers. Mackey Arena was rocking for home games against Louisville and Northwestern. It needs to be again for this one against nearby Valpo. This game is no joke.
.......... http://www.ncaa.com/news/basketball-men/article/2017-12-07/college-basketball-today-dont-underestimate-valparaiso-iowa
Anyone want to take any guesses as to the starting lineup? Sorolla and Smits for size? Linssen for rebounding toughness and motor? Burton for scoring punch? Golder/Walker/Evelyn for perimeter defense? So many combinations I'm sure we'll find one that works I just hope we do so in time to give ourselves a chance to win this
Valpo starting line up:
PG—Bakari Evelyn
SG—Tevonn Walker
SF—Joe Burton
PF—Parker Hazen
C—Jaume Sorolla
The biggest question mark is who Coach will use at PF. I'm worried about Smits, Sorolla, Hazen, Mileek and Linssen all getting into foul trouble tonight. Well to be fair I'm worried about everyone getting into foul trouble.
Quote from: VU2014 on December 07, 2017, 10:34:30 AM
Valpo starting line up:
PG—Bakari Evelyn
SG—Tevonn Walker
SF—Joe Burton
PF—Parker Hazen
C—Jaume Sorolla
The biggest question mark is who Coach will use at PF. I'm worried about Smits, Sorolla, Hazen, Mileek and Linssen all getting into foul trouble tonight. Well to be fair I'm worried about everyone getting into foul trouble.
To be sure, particularly on a BIG floor. At the same time our depth will serve us well. Three deep at the 5 and multiple options at all positions. We will have to double the post. It will be a huge challenge.
Others have said it already, but I think tonight will be a big let down like many other big games Valpo has had in the past. I think we will get exposed in the post and see Purdue's bigs have their way with our bigs. This will lead to foul trouble and many free throws for Purdue never allowing us to get in the game. Hope I'm wrong but this is what I'm expecting.
What if we focus on limiting their looks from the perimeter? That way they have to rely on their bogs where we can at least match their size a little.
Quote from: talksalot on December 07, 2017, 06:01:31 AMLocal Comcast in Valpo has the game at 5:30 on channel 237 FS1.
It must depend on your flavor of Valpo Comcast. For me FS1 is in the 400's. Maybe 405.
Quote from: VUGrad1314 on December 07, 2017, 12:21:13 PM
What if we focus on limiting their looks from the perimeter? That way they have to rely on their bogs where we can at least match their size a little.
It sounds kind of like Northwestern tried that. Didn't double the post, and Purdue's big guy had a field day.
Quote from: VUGrad1314 on December 07, 2017, 12:21:13 PM
What if we focus on limiting their looks from the perimeter? That way they have to rely on their bogs where we can at least match their size a little.
Purdue is a very good 3pt shooting team. They shoot 41.0% as a team. Dakota Mathias & PJ Thompson are crazy good shooters. Both are shooting over .500 from 3 this season. Ryan Cline is another great shooter but he's had a rough start to the season so far.
On the bright-side Valpo defends the perimeter pretty well as a team but we have lapses in defense sometimes like the 1st half of the Utah State game, but we came back strong defending the 3 after halftime. We need max effort on defense tonight from everyone.
Quote from: agibson on December 07, 2017, 12:41:20 PM
Quote from: talksalot on December 07, 2017, 06:01:31 AMLocal Comcast in Valpo has the game at 5:30 on channel 237 FS1.
It must depend on your flavor of Valpo Comcast. For me FS1 is in the 400's. Maybe 405.
Channel 408 is the non-HD option. Channel 237 is HD.
Their bigs have a huge impact on both ends, but from what I've seen they don't close out on the perimeter any better than our bigs do. I expect we'll get some pretty good perimeter looks.
So as close as a week ago I was ready to see the positive in nearly any outcome of this game. Now I want a win and will settle for nothing less.
What was going to be a relaxing evening of Vu Basketball on the couch has now had me wired all day.
SEE WHAT YOU PEOPLE DID TO ME?!
Quote from: NativeCheesehead on December 07, 2017, 04:31:40 PMWhat was going to be a relaxing evening of Vu Basketball on the couch has now had me wired all day.
SEE WHAT YOU PEOPLE DID TO ME?!
:) For a team this young, much satisfaction can be taken watching their game to game individual and group improvements. I am expecting a good effort and a good showing. If that comes with an 18 point loss then I will still sleep like a baby.
Next year my expectations will rightly be enormous and my sleep might be a bit more fitful.
https://twitter.com/nbairdjc/status/938905380628975616
Quote from: vu72 on December 07, 2017, 08:27:44 AM
Went to check the Vegas line and found us featured in a nice article.
http://www.vegasinsider.com/college-basketball/scoreboard/previews/valparaiso-@-purdue.cfm/date/12-07-17
Current line 15.5
STATS INC. wrote that story and used one of my quotes, while referring to it as the "Lafayette newspaper." SHAME!
Line moves to Valpo +15 and the O/U added a point and is now at 148. 3 scenarios could play out here. Valpo gets blown out of the gym( 60% possible), Valpo keeps it within single digits( 35% possible). Valpo wins( 5% possible). My personal pick:
VU: 68
Purdue: 79
No changes to the starting lineup:
https://twitter.com/valpoathletics/status/938900898822131713
My way to specific Prediction....
They jump out on us early as we can't hit anything and they drain some early 3's. Something like 20 to 6. We settle down and shots start falling Get it to within 5 with under 10 to play. End up losing by about 14. The same 14 points we spotted them in the opening run they had to start the game.
https://twitter.com/MichaelOsipoff/status/938909308141662208
Pre-game radio show: https://tunein.com/radio/The-Source-951-s23659/
Sloppy with the ball early. Could be nerves. 4 turnovers from us. Purdue isn't very hot offensively.
The offense from both teams has been bad to begin the game. Valpo NEEDS to take advantage of Purdue's slow start!
I can't wait until there's a like 13-3 foul disparity at halftime...
I am getting so tired of watching Smits making some kind of fundamental mistake on almost every possession on both ends of the floor.
We're a second half team, right?
Well......f&@$.
So many dumb mistakes
Lottich trying too many combinations, bradford, hazen, linseen, kiser cant compete keep them out
Quote from: NativeCheesehead on December 07, 2017, 06:02:07 PM
I am getting so tired of watching Smits making some kind of fundamental mistake on almost every possession on both ends of the floor.
And BINGO, that's why Sorolla is our better center hands down.
I agree that we seem to be trying too many different rotations and no one seems to be getting in a rhythm. We need to trim the rotation.
Why isn't Golder playing more?
*sigh* Yuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuup. >:(
Lottich more interested in getting everyone equal playing time than winning the game. Too late now.
Also, just because Bryce wasted timeouts like nobody's business, doesn't mean that Lottich should watch Smits implode the team on both ends for 4 minutes straight.
That 28-8 run is a killer
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I'd like to request, based on the results of this first half, that some of you social posters slow your roll.
As was on display tonight, we are a YOUNG team just trying to figure out our identity. The 8-0 was some solid growth in the early season, this "can" be a big learning experience.
I'm not down on the guys, we already knew our offense was our biggest flaw through 8 games. I suspect we settle down a bit in the 2nd half but this is still a strong experienced Top 25 team.
I'm not certain on this, but UF sounded like a "younger" team playing Loyola yesterday. Still a massive win by a league mate, but inexperienced (yet highly talented) teams like UF have more flaws.
PU and NW play in a grind it out B1G, so we were never going to stun them into complacency. I stand behind a 3-4 December record as a likely outcome. 4-3 would be a huge December.
I blame this on Lottich, did he really think a 12 man rotation was going to work. Obviously we are trying combinations that will work, but I thought Matt would have had a better rotation game plan. First off TAKE HAZEN OUT of the starting line up. Y do they continue to keep him in the starting 5 :o :o. He killed any type of momentum we had when he fell down. He falls over himself. We need Smits, Sorrolla, Walker, Golder, Evelyn, Burton, Joseph, and maybe Mcmillian/Bradford in the rotation.
Big dose of reality tonight.
Wake up call as to how much they need to improve to play at this level of competition.
Now everybody's had time on the floor and gotten a taste of the big time, let's see if we can compete for a half.
Quote from: VUSWIM08-12 on December 07, 2017, 06:27:44 PM
I blame this on Lottich, did he really think a 12 man rotation was going to work. Obviously we are trying combinations that will work, but I thought Matt would have had a better rotation game plan. First off TAKE HAZEN OUT of the starting line up. Y do they continue to keep him in the starting 5 :o :o. He killed any type of momentum we had when he fell down. He falls over himself. We need Smits, Sorrolla, Walker, Golder, Evelyn, Burton, Joseph, and maybe Mcmillian/Bradford in the rotation.
Coach is in his 2nd year of coaching (HC) at any level. Take a step back and let's see how he progresses from here, I still think well of his upside.
I'm as emotional as the next guy, surprised I'm not the one making such posts!!! I'm sort of glad we got ______-slapped in the first half. No one learns from success, rather from failure. And BOYYYYY did we fail in the first half.
Still, let's see a good 2nd guys. We know you have it in you.
Quote from: VUSWIM08-12 on December 07, 2017, 06:27:44 PM
I blame this on Lottich, did he really think a 12 man rotation was going to work. Obviously we are trying combinations that will work, but I thought Matt would have had a better rotation game plan. First off TAKE HAZEN OUT of the starting line up. Y do they continue to keep him in the starting 5 :o :o. He killed any type of momentum we had when he fell down. He falls over himself. We need Smits, Sorrolla, Walker, Golder, Evelyn, Burton, Joseph, and maybe Mcmillian/Bradford in the rotation.
The 12 man rotation is cool vs lesser competition because its goal is to find the best lineup for the second half. Vs Purdue it's idiotic, because they can shoot Valpo out of the game quickly if Valpo stalls on offense. Also, starting Hazen and only giving Golder 6 minutes is really baffling. Golder not being the first man off the bench is flat out criminal.
One week until Northwestern, will be very interested to see the mental growth in that time.
2nd half, Hazen starts while Golder sits on the bench. Insanity.
Is Golder injured? Or suspended?
Donezo, just needlessly aggravating to watch at this point. We'll see you on Saturday.
Quote from: a3uge on December 07, 2017, 06:43:29 PM
2nd half, Hazen starts while Golder sits on the bench. Insanity.
:crazy: :crazy:
I can't watch, but from Paul Oren's tweets, sounds like Purdue is getting every whistle. Not a surprise, but disappointing.
Also, the shooting % looks awful. I wonder if the sight lines in a bigger arena are bothering the team, because they seem to shoot better than this at the ARC.
To quote the New Yorker Magazine: "Yes, I Know, but other than that Mrs. Lincoln, How was the play?"
Sufficiently embarrassed after this performance...
Purdue is clearly the better team and the refs weren't a help in that 1st half but this was a TERRIBLE and unacceptable performance tonight. Credit Purdue who is a dominated this game.
WE NEED TO BE BETTER. This was an atrocious performance.
Lost the first half by 20 and the second half by 10.
Maybe if they played a third half it would be even.
Then again, maybe not.
before the game was over...
Valpo RPI 54 .5902 SOS 267 .4536
After the Final was posted the SOS 182 .4886
We are still in a 6-way tie for longest winning streak of the year at 8
Scoring Margin
1. Kansas +25.6
2. Cincinnati +25.1
3. Villanova +23.8
4. Virginia Tech +22.4
5. Miami (FL) +22.1
6. West Virginia +21.2
7. Texas Tech +20.5
8. Purdue +20.4
Maybe we could do something about the 9th game of the year... last year, it was at Rupp Arena... over the past 32 years, we are 16-16 in the 9th game of the year....
Quote from: FieldGoodie05 on December 07, 2017, 06:33:03 PMI'm sort of glad we got ______-slapped in the first half. No one learns from success, rather from failure. And BOYYYYY did we fail in the first half.
This statement somewhat contradicts your earlier defenses of the soft non-con schedule that created this problem. Why couldn't we have taken our lumps earlier where the support of our home crowds could help us through tough stretches and potentially to to meaningful wins or so that they could learn how to play in tough road environments sooner? We came out shellshocked tonight. Why? Bad scheduling. In addition to never having faced an opponent like Purdue we had also never seen that kind of environment. Tougher games would have left us in better position to take advantage of Purdue's slow start and give ourselves a chance. The level of opponent we've played did not prepare us for this game. Young team or not we shouldn't have this many identity or rotation questions in game 9 with the season nearly 30% over. Answers should be surfacing now and all we have are questions. Why? Because our first 3 or so games were little more than glorified exhibitions. Hopefully this game teaches us what we need to know before conference play starts. I still believe in our coach and our team but this just shows that if we want to consistently challenge and beat teams like Purdue and contend for at large bids we need to schedule better non-con opponents so that we 1. Can learn about our team faster 2. Have them grow quicker and 3. Not pin so much of our postseason hopes on just a handful of games that we must have in order to be considered.
I have said many times I don't know hoops well enough to diagnose differences in outcomes.
But it does make sense that a faster tougher team will expose a lot of issues in a team not familiar with each other yet. On the good side, our guys can jump and run with Purdue. That has not been the case in other years. Burton is starting to roll and he is a shooter that we need badly.
I think this has been a good schedule for this team. Build some confidence. Get whipped a couple of times. Then go west for some test runs and come back to the MVC with your best mix of players and roles.
Quote from: vu72 on December 06, 2017, 07:40:13 AM
These in-state rivalry games are always fun! Hopefully Purdue will give us a good game! ;D
I think that was a big affirmative.
Quote from: VUGrad1314 on December 07, 2017, 07:41:30 PM
Quote from: FieldGoodie05 on December 07, 2017, 06:33:03 PMI'm sort of glad we got ______-slapped in the first half. No one learns from success, rather from failure. And BOYYYYY did we fail in the first half.
This statement somewhat contradicts your earlier defenses of the soft non-con schedule that created this problem. Why couldn't we have taken our lumps earlier where the support of our home crowds could help us through tough stretches and potentially to to meaningful wins or so that they could learn how to play in tough road environments sooner? We came out shellshocked tonight. Why? Bad scheduling. In addition to never having faced an opponent like Purdue we had also never seen that kind of environment. Tougher games would have left us in better position to take advantage of Purdue's slow start and give ourselves a chance. The level of opponent we've played did not prepare us for this game. Young team or not we shouldn't have this many identity or rotation questions in game 9 with the season nearly 30% over. Answers should be surfacing now and all we have are questions. Why? Because our first 3 or so games were little more than glorified exhibitions. Hopefully this game teaches us what we need to know before conference play starts. I still believe in our coach and our team but this just shows that if we want to consistently challenge and beat teams like Purdue and contend for at large bids we need to schedule better non-con opponents so that we 1. Can learn about our team faster 2. Have them grow quicker and 3. Not pin so much of our postseason hopes on just a handful of games that we must have in order to be considered.
Tevonn, Joseph, Sorolla, Smits, Bradford, Kiser played at Kentucky and Oregon last year. Burton played in the Big 12. Bakari played in the Big 10. For Hazen, Linssen, McMillan, and Golder it was a new experience, but what difference does it make if it's the 1st game of the year vs the 9th game of the year? If we got killed by Kentucky in game 2 would this lineup look significantly different? I doubt it.
I sure didn't think we would catch ourselves looking past Purdue and directly at Ball State. That is what happened, correct? Cause if that was a concentrated effort at Purdue we have a lot to learn about concentrating our effort.
I don't think any VU player performed up to their abilities or my expectations.
With that said my 3-4 prediction for December is now looking much more realistic. :thumbsup: Honestly this was the team I was expecting to see in November.
Quote from: a3uge on December 07, 2017, 06:43:29 PM2nd half, Hazen starts while Golder sits on the bench. Insanity.
Hazen will develop into a top notch defender but not tonight. In an effort to share the blame Golder contributed little as well.
We need to remember that we had and have no at-large potential for 17-18. So the difference between a 70 RPI vs a 125 is of only minor importance. Let Matt develop his team, in his way and at his pace. I am confident we will be liking the results.
Quote from: VUGrad1314 on December 07, 2017, 07:41:30 PM
Quote from: FieldGoodie05 on December 07, 2017, 06:33:03 PMI'm sort of glad we got ______-slapped in the first half. No one learns from success, rather from failure. And BOYYYYY did we fail in the first half.
This statement somewhat contradicts your earlier defenses of the soft non-con schedule that created this problem. Why couldn't we have taken our lumps earlier where the support of our home crowds could help us through tough stretches and potentially to to meaningful wins or so that they could learn how to play in tough road environments sooner? We came out shellshocked tonight. Why? Bad scheduling. In addition to never having faced an opponent like Purdue we had also never seen that kind of environment. Tougher games would have left us in better position to take advantage of Purdue's slow start and give ourselves a chance. The level of opponent we've played did not prepare us for this game. Young team or not we shouldn't have this many identity or rotation questions in game 9 with the season nearly 30% over. Answers should be surfacing now and all we have are questions. Why? Because our first 3 or so games were little more than glorified exhibitions. Hopefully this game teaches us what we need to know before conference play starts. I still believe in our coach and our team but this just shows that if we want to consistently challenge and beat teams like Purdue and contend for at large bids we need to schedule better non-con opponents so that we 1. Can learn about our team faster 2. Have them grow quicker and 3. Not pin so much of our postseason hopes on just a handful of games that we must have in order to be considered.
Oh that's right, I'm the one that said 18-0 could happen?
before the game was over...
Valpo RPI #54 .5902 SOS 267 .4536
After the Final was posted the #53 .5907 SOS 181 .4886 and that SOS will continue to get better as we take on #125 BSU and #118 Northwestern
Quote from: justducky on December 07, 2017, 08:09:21 PM
I don't think any VU player performed up to their abilities or my expectations.
With that said my 3-4 prediction for December is now looking much more realistic. [emoji106] Honestly this was the team I was expecting to see in November.
Quote from: a3uge on December 07, 2017, 06:43:29 PM2nd half, Hazen starts while Golder sits on the bench. Insanity.
Hazen will develop into a top notch defender but not tonight. In an effort to share the blame Golder contributed little as well.
We need to remember that we had and have no at-large potential for 17-18. So the difference between a 70 RPI vs a 125 is of only minor importance. Let Matt develop his team, in his way and at his pace. I am confident we will be liking the results.
If Lottich is treating games as practice instead of trying to win, he should be let go. The program should be beyond that at this point.
Golder at least brings some aggressiveness, and has been shooting the ball well from deep. Hazen... I'm not really sure what he brings.
I'm baffled why Golder doesn't get more playing time and why Hazen continues to start.
Quote from: valpolaw on December 07, 2017, 08:31:57 PM
I'm baffled why Golder doesn't get more playing time and why Hazen continues to start.
They sort of play two different positions. Agreed Golder has played much better but Golder is more a swing guy who can play both the 2 and the 3 and maybe the 4 against smaller lineups.
My theory on why Parker is playing is that Coach Lottich doesn't want him to lose confidence. But boy do I have to say the 4 is one of the obvious weak spot of this team. It could very well be a strength in the future but both Parker and Mileek are for sure taking their lumps right now. They sure look raw out there. You can see potential in them but they're both making freshman mistakes. It's been a while since Valpo didn't have a polished PF out there. You have to look back to before, Peters & Kevin Van Wijk. Both of those guys were much more polished if memory serves me correct. Much more game ready.
Quote from: VU2014 on December 07, 2017, 08:47:29 PM
Quote from: valpolaw on December 07, 2017, 08:31:57 PM
I'm baffled why Golder doesn't get more playing time and why Hazen continues to start.
They sort of play two different positions. Agreed Golder has played much better but Golder is more a swing guy who can play both the 2 and the 3 and maybe the 4 against smaller lineups.
My theory on why Parker is playing is that Coach Lottich doesn't want him to lose confidence. But boy do I have to say the 4 is one of the obvious weak spot of this team. It could very well be a strength in the future but both Parker and Mileek are for sure taking their lumps right now. They sure look raw out there. You can see potential in them but their both making freshman mistakes. It's been a while since Valpo didn't have a polished PF out there. You have to look back to before, Peters & Kevin Van Wijk. Both of those guys were much more polished if memory serves me correct. Much more game ready.
I think KVW was a post player, but both Capobianco and Richie Edwards were very skilled and polished players at the 4.
Purdue Starters vs Valpo
Senior vs Sophomore (edge PU)
Sophomore vs Senior (push)
Senior vs Junior (edge PU)
Senior vs Freshmen (edge PU)
Senior vs Sophomore (edge PU)
Are we seeing a trend here? Please please please step off the cliff. I'm noticing a lot of VU ppl think that all of the sudden we are supposed to be a level ahead of the senior class we just lost. We can't replace Alec/Shane/Adekoya with 9 underclassmen WHO SIMPLY HAVENT PLAYED TOGETHER.
Ok Bakari and Burton played high major....so what. They were practice dummies on last years team. You don't get game reps on scout team. I'd call them preferred sophomores at best becausecof their high level skill.
This team is terribly young and the vulnerability cane through tonight. I'm going to watch just as excited for BSU as I would have if we only lost by 12-pts. In many ways we had a better shot at Kentucky last year because we had 3 seniors and they had how many freshmen on their squad?
Next up!!!
Disappointed in how panicked we looked. We would drive and just throw a last second pass that was easily intercepted. We definitely had a chance to change the game in the first 7-8 minutes, while Purdue struggled to find their shot. If we hadn't committed so many dumb turnovers during that time period, it is a very different game for the last 30 minutes. All they did was collapse on the ball as we drove, it wasn't anything complex that should have given us as many fits as it did. On to Ball State!
Hazen and McMillan are 4s with the size and physical ability to guard Vince Edwards and double down on the post. Golder and Kiser are much too small for those assignments. Putting Burton at the 4 and Golder at the 3 might have solved a few things but reveals new problems in the process. Its like I have said all along in that the power forward position will be our Achillies' heel. So Matt is trying to develop what he has. If you want to fire him for that you might get just a little bit of argument from members of this board. :lol:
Quote from: a3uge on December 07, 2017, 08:21:26 PMIf Lottich is treating games as practice instead of trying to win, he should be let go. The program should be beyond that at this point.
:o I really can't believe you said that so I will refrain from saying what I am thinking. :rant:
Valparaiso falls flat on national stage against Purdue
Paul Oren Times Correspondent
Dec 7, 2017 Updated 22 min ago
WEST LAFAYETTE — Blessed with the bright lights all to itself on Thursday night, the Valparaiso men's basketball team came down with a terrible case of stage fright at Mackey Arena.
Purdue ripped off a 21-4 run to blow open a close game and the Crusaders had just four assists to 18 turnovers as the No. 21 Boilermakers routed previously undefeated Valparaiso 80-50 in a nationally televised contest.
............ http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/college/valparaiso-university/valparaiso-falls-flat-on-national-stage-against-purdue/article_0963bddd-95b6-5f05-ba24-e422e7d473a3.html
https://twitter.com/PostTribSports/status/938973870211641345
https://twitter.com/nbairdjc/status/938966136665919488
https://twitter.com/nbairdjc/status/938973788951187456
Not good pub...
https://twitter.com/MattGlenesk/status/938975079026761729
Quote from: Valpo89 on December 05, 2017, 12:00:28 PM
I've been around long enough, and so have many on this board, to expect nothing less than a disheartening beat down in Mackey. I've seen too many VU teams with high hopes go up against Purdue or other "power 5" teams only to be sorely disappointed during the game and at the final outcome. If Northwestern ends up with a 24-5 disparity in free throws, how bad could it be for Valpo? Haas and his new cohort will expose Smits and Sorolla, and show why they are at VU and not a Big 10 school. It's not going to be pretty, folks. Painter knows Valpo is capable, there will be no overlooking the Crusaders and Purdue will win by 20-plus.
Hmm. This is interesting.
Quote from: Valpo89 on December 07, 2017, 09:46:19 PM
Quote from: Valpo89 on December 05, 2017, 12:00:28 PM
I've been around long enough, and so have many on this board, to expect nothing less than a disheartening beat down in Mackey. I've seen too many VU teams with high hopes go up against Purdue or other "power 5" teams only to be sorely disappointed during the game and at the final outcome. If Northwestern ends up with a 24-5 disparity in free throws, how bad could it be for Valpo? Haas and his new cohort will expose Smits and Sorolla, and show why they are at VU and not a Big 10 school. It's not going to be pretty, folks. Painter knows Valpo is capable, there will be no overlooking the Crusaders and Purdue will win by 20-plus.
Hmm. This is interesting.
While Smits got exposed, Sorrola held his own. He had as many rebounds as Haas and Haarms combined. The Purdue centers shot a combined 40%. It's also odd to suggest Purdue and Rutgers are equal in competition because they play in the same conference. I'm confident a mediocre Big 10 team that makes the tournament will get blown out by Purdue on the road.
Looked back over the play-by-play to start the game. Wanted to see the TO battle come to life.
In the first 2 min 26 sec we had (4) TO.
Then the rest of the first half we added (7) more TO to finish the half with 11.
TO + 0/7 three pointers made vs their 4/11 (12 pts) and that's how we put up the least first half points and set ourselves up for a beat down.
In the 2nd half we still had a couple more TO than preferred but that's how we put up a more normal offensive output in the 2nd half. Valuing the ball is key on a young team that doesn't have an offensive identity yet + we are shooting low % so less room for error.
Defeat was a certainty, if we go 1-1 these next two games I'll be very proud of these guys. Means we have the moxy that got us all excited in a couple muddling games down in Savannah.
P.S. How did the game get away from us? We were (-12) from deep and (-10) from the charity stripe. That's (-22) before we could even develop points in the paint. Looking forward to PU killing it in the big ten. This is one of their better teams of the last 20 years. Listening to a couple PU fans from work and they say it's been decades since they had this level of inside-out threat combination. I'm really impressed with their G play, lockdown defenders that shoot high %.
At times we seemed very slow and tentative for a team that was supposed to be athletic and fly past the opposition down the court.
Quote from: Valpo89 on December 07, 2017, 09:46:19 PM
Quote from: Valpo89 on December 05, 2017, 12:00:28 PM
I've been around long enough, and so have many on this board, to expect nothing less than a disheartening beat down in Mackey. I've seen too many VU teams with high hopes go up against Purdue or other "power 5" teams only to be sorely disappointed during the game and at the final outcome. If Northwestern ends up with a 24-5 disparity in free throws, how bad could it be for Valpo? Haas and his new cohort will expose Smits and Sorolla, and show why they are at VU and not a Big 10 school. It's not going to be pretty, folks. Painter knows Valpo is capable, there will be no overlooking the Crusaders and Purdue will win by 20-plus.
Hmm. This is interesting.
Would you mind looking into your crystal ball and tell me how the Northwestern game is going to play out? My wife and I are trying to decide whether it's worth the journey to the Big City. lol
ER, you guys are still 8-1--I wish we were :thumbsup:
Losing to these big schools doesn't bother me as much as the WAY we lose. It seems like we only rarely have a competitive game.
It would be nice to have a Ball St v. Notre Dame/ Indiana St v. Indiana/Drake v. Wake Forest type outcome -- where we actually beat a big school. But if we can't do that, then I would expect us to be competitive --at least most of the time. Instead, we get pummeled most of the time. All too often it seems these games are 40-19 at the half. That is what bothers me.
Paul
Big questions going forward:
- Who are our shooters? Against athletic teams it is not as easy to get to the rim or score in transition. Who is going to consistently hit 3's/jumpers?
- Will our 4's develop in time? It is a weak spot, but we couldn't be more young at that position, nowhere to go but up.
- When will we narrow the bench? My personal opinion is that it is a recipe for disaster, but I have no problem with it early in the season.
- How will players react to having their flaws exposed? Do we have the sort of players to learn from game film making them look bad?
I never expected us to win but the way we played out of the gates really kind of ticks me off. Purdue was pretty bad to start the game and we were literally turning the ball over left and right. I get there are some nerves but still...
The only bright spots:
-Joe Burton showed he can create his own shot.
-At the beginning of the game we played decent defense & rebounded well
I get we're young and inexperienced but that game was unacceptable. We couldn't even make open looks when we got them.
Purdue was very well prepared and amped up after ISU, Ball State and Loyola knocked off P5 teams. They weren't sleeping on us but even if they were we weren't going to beat them with the way we're playing.
I really want to see us play better against Ball State.
Let's not get too down on this VU team. Purdue is an excellent basketball team who will do very well in both the Big Ten and post-season.
Just for some perspective, over the last three years Purdue's Big 10 season records are 14-4, 12-6, and 12-6. As near as I can tell, they only have lost one conference game every year at Mackey Arena. That means that the best Big 10 teams struggle when playing Purdue, especially on the road.
The key for this VU team will be to see how much they grow from this loss, especially taking care of the basketball.
Despite this loss I still think we can beat Ball State and Northwestern; and if we do that we can still put forth a decent resume. If we do well in conference we could still be in the conversation; and if we do okay, we can still land in the NIT possibly hosting a game. This should be our minimum goal as a program going forward every year. Go Valpo!
No doubt Purdue is a great team. If they're playing well that team has Sweet 16 written all over them, but the way we looked so offensively inept at times is a concern.
I think we'll be better going forward but I hope the team can figure things out offensively because other the Joe last night it was brutal. I still think we're a strong defensive team which is the real strength of this team but the way we looked offensively last night.
I'm not even "on the ledge" with this team after last night because I know we're a better team then what we showed last night but that was just brutal to watch. I thought we should have played better. Credit to Purdue though.
I wish we could have played some better competition earlier in the season that could have prepared us better for the game. Probably would have helped if we could have went Ball State then Northwestern and then Purdue. But I know that's not how scheduling works. You take games when you can get them and the scheduling doesn't workout the way we'd all like.
Last night was a nice slice of humble pie.
Clearly it was a case of stage fright against a team loaded with Seniors and good enough to be in the Final Four. We are a VERY young team and it showed when we finally played a high quality team. I'm not too worried as the identity of this team is still a work in progress. Is it Tevonn's team? Should be and I think the team was showing deference to him. When he is off, like last night or is being double teamed, others need to step up like Joe did. All that will shake out and as Matt has said from the beginning, "we will be a much better team at the end of the season than at the beginning"
Ba
Quote from: VUGrad1314 on December 08, 2017, 09:42:40 AMDespite this loss I still think we can beat Ball State and Northwestern; and if we do that we can still put forth a decent resume. If we do well in conference we could still be in the conversation; and if we do okay, we can still land in the NIT possibly hosting a game. This should be our minimum goal as a program going forward every year. Go Valpo!
ll Ball State - yes, Northwestern - I think too much brown and gold kool aid is being consumed.
A blurb about the Valpo/Purdue game.
https://twitter.com/hoopvilleadam/status/939142273014562817
Well worth the listen. Paul did a post-game breakdown with NWI Times Jim Peters and CJ Peters.
https://twitter.com/nwioren/status/939041536645373952
Quote from: FieldGoodie05 on December 07, 2017, 06:08:59 PM
Quote from: NativeCheesehead on December 07, 2017, 06:02:07 PM
I am getting so tired of watching Smits making some kind of fundamental mistake on almost every possession on both ends of the floor.
And BINGO, that's why Sorolla is our better center hands down.
But watching Smits drive past their back-up big was a thing of beauty!
Quote from: valpolaw on December 07, 2017, 06:11:27 PM
I agree that we seem to be trying too many different rotations and no one seems to be getting in a rhythm. We need to trim the rotation.
Why isn't Golder playing more?
I like Golder's game a lot. But a line of 12 minutes, 0-2 shooting, and 2 PF's doesn't exactly scream "hot hand" in this game.
Well.........that sucked but at least we aren't in the horizon league anymore.
Quote from: VU2014 on December 08, 2017, 09:20:42 AM
I never expected us to win but the way we played out of the gates really kind of ticks me off. Purdue was pretty bad to start the game and we were literally turning the ball over left and right. I get there are some nerves but still...
The only bright spots:
-Joe Burton showed he can create his own shot.
-At the beginning of the game we played decent defense & rebounded well
I get we're young and inexperienced but that game was unacceptable. We couldn't even make open looks when we got them.
Purdue was very well prepared and amped up after ISU, Ball State and Loyola knocked off P5 teams. They weren't sleeping on us but even if they were we weren't going to beat them with the way we're playing.
I really want to see us play better against Ball State.
Ditto to all the above.
Everyone here needs to remember that Purdue and most other B1G teams do not lose at home. Paul mentioned in one of his tweets that we did not lose the game because of the refs, but as a young team, we let Purdue and the style of play frustrate us tremendously. The tone of play was set by the refs allowing PU to use single hand hand-checking, arm bars, hip-checking and other physical defensive actions and we were not ready mentally for that type of game. In other words, ball pressure was a bitch causing us to fumble around getting into our offense. It didn't help that we were not allowed the same latitude in some situations including the two "cylinder" rule fouls on some pretty decent traps. Smits also had a nice block on Haarms that even my Purdue friends thought was clean. Other than the first 8 minutes of the game, Purdue played loose and we were wound tight.
Very disappointed that we were not mentally prepared to compete, let's hope the lesson is learned.
Quote from: agibson on December 08, 2017, 11:33:26 AM
Quote from: FieldGoodie05 on December 07, 2017, 06:08:59 PM
Quote from: NativeCheesehead on December 07, 2017, 06:02:07 PM
I am getting so tired of watching Smits making some kind of fundamental mistake on almost every possession on both ends of the floor.
And BINGO, that's why Sorolla is our better center hands down.
But watching Smits drive past their back-up big was a thing of beauty!
Absolutely agree. I think by the end of this season we could see him improve his consistency in time for a solid last two years.
Sorolla did it last year, just hope he too improves his consistency. These two continue to improve and I'm happier with them this year than expected. Our F position has a year of growing pains ahead of it, not that either are bad. Just deer in the head lights, young.
You know what would help both Sorolla and Smits? If they quit trying to lay the ball in or going for two-foot jump hooks and instead start dunking the damn thing. And I mean trying to do that every time. That's a much higher percentage play for a seven-footer, it will also result in getting to the line more (refs are more likely to blow the whistle when you are finishing strong) and fewer blocked/missed shots. Even the BTN announcers commented on a couple of our misses inside could have been avoided by going for a dunk instead.
I love having bigs that have a midrange game as much as anyone, but how many bunnies do we have to miss before we alter our strategy here?
And besides, dunks are fun! If I was that tall, I'd dunk everything, all the time: the ball, my warm-ups, extra shoes, leftovers from dinner, you name it.
Quote from: bigmosmithfan1 on December 08, 2017, 02:53:47 PM
You know what would help both Sorolla and Smits? If they quit trying to lay the ball in or going for two-foot jump hooks and instead start dunking the damn thing. And I mean trying to do that every time. That's a much higher percentage play for a seven-footer, it will also result in getting to the line more (refs are more likely to blow the whistle when you are finishing strong) and fewer blocked/missed shots. Even the BTN announcers commented on a couple of our misses inside could have been avoided by going for a dunk instead.
I love having bigs that have a midrange game as much as anyone, but how many bunnies do we have to miss before we alter our strategy here?
And besides, dunks are fun! If I was that tall, I'd dunk everything, all the time: the ball, my warm-ups, extra shoes, leftovers from dinner, you name it.
Are we certain they are athletic enough to dunk over opponents in such a scenario? All dunks I've seen are uncontested and I'm never amazed at how emphatic it was. Derek got a few this year with authority but I think the rim was slanting downward at the time!!!
Quote from: bbtds on December 07, 2017, 07:53:25 PMI sure didn't think we would catch ourselves looking past Purdue and directly at Ball State. That is what happened, correct? Cause if that was a concentrated effort at Purdue we have a lot to learn about concentrating our effort.
Hmmmm ??? I need to mull on this for a while.
Quote from: SanityLost17 on December 08, 2017, 08:37:39 AM- Who are our shooters? Against athletic teams it is not as easy to get to the rim or score in transition. Who is going to consistently hit 3's/jumpers?
- Will our 4's develop in time? It is a weak spot, but we couldn't be more young at that position, nowhere to go but up.
Purdue challenged us to beat them inside or with inside outside ball movement resulting in drained 3 pointers. We failed at both. They conceded open 10-12 foot jumpers to both Smits and Sorolla but that didn't happen either. As for our freshmen I didn't realize that Hazen has yet to connect on a 3.
Quote from: bigmosmithfan1 on December 08, 2017, 02:53:47 PMAnd besides, dunks are fun!
Just a reminder, we are looking for someone to sponsor DUNKS in the ARC...
suggestions already made include:
a plumber (for the "Steve's Plumbing Flush")
Betty Crocker (for their Dunkeroos)
and obviously Dunkin Donuts or Family Express Cravin' Donut Dunk ....
perhaps a "Slam Dunk Course of the Game"? That's a Comm-100 Slam Dunk Course of the game!
Quote from: justducky on December 08, 2017, 03:47:21 PMAs for our freshmen I didn't realize that Hazen has yet to connect on a 3.
And he had at least one look that was _wide_ open against Purdue.
Quote from: VUGrad1314 on December 08, 2017, 09:42:40 AM
Despite this loss I still think we can beat Ball State and Northwestern; and if we do that we can still put forth a decent resume. If we do well in conference we could still be in the conversation; and if we do okay, we can still land in the NIT possibly hosting a game. This should be our minimum goal as a program going forward every year. Go Valpo!
I really hope you're correct but the reality of a team that has it's shooting disappear en mass will probably send us to the lower middle of the conference and take us out of the conversation for a post season spot other than the CIT/CBI.
So for a reality check, Valpo faced a bunch of ham and eggers to get some confidence and then reality hit when they faced Purdue. There is potential on this team but there is a lot of room to improvement. What disappoints me is that Smits has not improved as much as I would expect from a player is his third year in the program.
Valpo should beat Ball State but Northwestern is a real stretch.