BRAND LEADERS AMONG RELIGIOUS UNIVERSITIES
Catholic - Notre Dame
Baptist - Baylor
Mormon - BYU
Evangelical - Liberty (Trump gave their graduation speech)
Methodist - SMU
Presbyterian - Presbyterian (duh)
Jewish - Yeshiva
Lutheran - WHO?
Others?
Ever since I can remember, I pictured Valpo as the preeminent Lutheran national university. It is why I enrolled way back when. Yet there are bigger Lutheran-affiliated colleges (e.g. Concordia University Wisconsin w/ >5000 -- but they are mainly commuter/online and are D-III in athletics).
Now we are on the cusp of joining the MVC and moving up in terms of national recognition. On another post about IPFW ( soon to be PUNW) there as banter about taking over their notable music program from a Purdue that has no music department. Although I posted half in jest on taking it over, it has some merit. It is a way to expand Valpo's brand and geographical footprint to all of northern Indiana
My three+ part question to all of you:
1. Who do you think is the preeminent Lutheran university in the US?
2. If it is not Valpo, then who and how can we surpass them?
3. If it is Valpo, why haven't we risen to at least a Liberty level in terms of national recognition?
+ ...... And what more can Valpo do to reach that level?
St. Olaf has us beat in terms of name recognition. Gettysburg is right up there too. Luther isn't far behind.
I say this only half in jest, but for VU to move up on the Lutheran college ladder, it would be nice to enroll, you know, some Lutherans. Preferably some Missouri Synod Lutheran kids. I hate to think how many Missouri Synod kids we actually have on campus. Maybe 50? 75? I'll bet most old-timers like me would be shocked to find out how few Missouri Lutheran kids are actually on campus. (I'm not trying to disrespect other Synods, it's just that when I attended VU, it seemed like half the kids were Missouri Synod Lutheran kids.)
It seems like the number of Lutheran kids actually on campus is a state secret. Yes, I know the website breaks down the percentage of kids by faith, but the percentage of Lutheran kids has been declining for the past 30 years at least and, from what I can tell, there seems to be zero emphasis on reversing that trend. Maybe this is an unfair example, but last fall someone on the board brought up the fact that there was an all-state football player out of Fort Wayne, a kid who attended a Lutheran high school there, and he had zero contact from VU. One of the assistant football coaches, in a reply to, I think, vu72, issued some totally unsatisfactory, cliché - ridden explanation of how hard it is to keep track of all the kids, some fall through the cracks, blah blah blah. To me this was a perfect illustration of where VU is when it comes to recruiting Lutheran students.
Sorry, VULB#62, I didn't address many of your questions.
Paul
All of the examples, 72, are excellent Lutheran Colleges but are low profile, non-national colleges/universities (and they are not D-I, do not appear on the ESPN crawler, and are VERY regional in appeal). How many people outside of Iowa have heard of Luther? How many in Florida know about St. Olaf? Wagner (not mentioned) is D-I but buried in the northeast. There is also Wittenburg, all the Concordias, Cal Lutheran, etc.
We are now in the same discussion as most bigger D-I schools but our Lutheran identity (with maybe the BYU exception, most of my list has a diluted student body membership), IMO, is not on the same level as the religious affiliations 'image' of the list I mentioned.
So, how can we ratchet up our image to the world and reach the Liberty/Baylor level of religious affilliation recognition?
Quote from: VULB#62 on May 15, 2017, 08:45:18 PMSo, how can we ratchet up our image to the world and reach the Liberty/Baylor level of religious affilliation recognition?
We could build the largest college chapel in the United States. Oh wait...................buildings don't make a religious university. We will never be the university that the Missouri Synod will be proud of any longer. Our tradition in the Lutheran Church Missouri Synod is through families that keep calling Valpo home because they keep sending their children to Valpo. One of my two sons went to Valpo.
Quote from: VULB#62 on May 15, 2017, 08:45:18 PM
All of the examples, 72, are excellent Lutheran Colleges but are low profile, non-national colleges/universities (and they are not D-I, do not appear on the ESPN crawler, and are VERY regional in appeal). How many people outside of Iowa have heard of Luther? How many in Florida know about St. Olaf? Wagner (not mentioned) is D-I but buried in the northeast. There is also Wittenburg, all the Concordias, Cal Lutheran, etc.
We are now in the same discussion as most bigger D-I schools but our Lutheran identity (with maybe the BYU exception, most of my list has a diluted student body membership), IMO, is not on the same level as the religious affiliations 'image' of the list I mentioned.
So, how can we ratchet up our image to the world and reach the Liberty/Baylor level of religious affilliation recognition?
The reason there isn't a "national Lutheran university" is largely because there aren't enough Lutherans to support it. The ELCA is in decline just like the rest of the 7 sisters and the LCMS can't make peace between the people still living in 1941 and those who want to build mega churches. The only Lutheran churches that seem to be growing right now tend to shy away from even using the word Lutheran to describe themselves.
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I found this to be VERY interesting! when you go to the LCMS website Educating our Children - School Ministry https://www.lcms.org/school-ministry (https://www.lcms.org/school-ministry) scroll down to the Lutheran High School area and click on View Directory it takes you to the.... wait for it... VU Website for Church Relations LHS Directory http://www.valpo.edu/church-relations/lhs-directory/ (http://www.valpo.edu/church-relations/lhs-directory/) . Now that was completely unexpected.
Quote from: FWalum on May 16, 2017, 08:39:47 AM
I found this to be VERY interesting! when you go to the LCMS website Educating our Children - School Ministry https://www.lcms.org/school-ministry (https://www.lcms.org/school-ministry) scroll down to the Lutheran High School area and click on View Directory it takes you to the.... wait for it... VU Website for Church Relations LHS Directory http://www.valpo.edu/church-relations/lhs-directory/ (http://www.valpo.edu/church-relations/lhs-directory/) . Now that was completely unexpected.
I'm told that the keeping of this directory started with a man named Paul Lange and continued under Jerry Speckhart. I'm sure there were many others involved over the years that my relatives are forgetting.
If you want to see where Valpo's programs and the university as a whole compares to other Lutheran colleges and universities, check out this web site:
best-lutheran-colleges.com/
Quote from: sfnmman on May 17, 2017, 07:38:42 PMbest-lutheran-colleges.com
Would certainly like to know about their "proprietary" algorithm, criteria and methodology. I certainly wouldn't come up with that order.
Valpo rated #2 behind Concordia University Wisconsin.
This mystifies me: "Recent studies showed that Valparaiso University area is relatively unsafe - the school is reported to have a rather poor rating for campus security."
Quote from: VULB#62 on May 18, 2017, 08:28:32 AM
Valpo rated #2 behind Concordia University Wisconsin.
This mystifies me: "Recent studies showed that Valparaiso University area is relatively unsafe - the school is reported to have a rather poor rating for campus security."
Well, because a website about Lutheran universities and colleges is telling me that the Valpo campus has a poor rating for campus security I
WILL start locking my car while on Valpo's campus. Wait..........I already do that.
I wonder if they got it mixed up with an urban Lutheran university.
Some other tidbits:
Valpo has the most majors -- 178. Next best is at 148. Most seem to be in the 60-90 range.
Missing is Concordia Ft. Wayne??
Minnesota has the most Lutheran colleges - 6
Quote from: VULB#62 on May 18, 2017, 09:35:00 AM
Some other tidbits:
Valpo has the most majors -- 178. Next best is at 148. Most seem to be in the 60-90 range.
Missing is Concordia Ft. Wayne??
Minnesota has the most Lutheran colleges - 6
And there in lies the problem. 1/3 of Minnesota residents are Lutherans. How many of those kids does Valpo draw? Maybe 10-15 per year. When you have all those other choices close to home, they stay home. In general kids don't want to go to far from home these days.
As for Valpo being the preeminent Lutheran University, no one else is really close. As 62 pointed out, the only other Lutheran college is Wagner. Go to their website or Gettysburg's and try to find a reference to Lutheranism. It is very clear on Valpo's website.
Many of the other Lutheran colleges are liberal arts colleges, like St. Olaf. Valpo, being a true university with dedicated faculty for the professional schools is in a different league. Capital is similar and others, like Concordia Chicago have gotten away from their original calling to survive. Concordia was a teachers college when my dad and grandfather attended. Everyone there was studying to be a Lutheran school teacher. Not any longer.
With Valpo's national rankings and D1 national tv coverage, there is zero doubt about which Lutheran University/College is at the top of the list.
That's exactly right. If you follow the U.S. News categories, Valpo is a regional or masters' university and ranks very high.
St. Olaf and Lutheran and others are "National Liberal Arts Colleges". So it's an apple vs. orange comparison. If you guy by name recognition, I argue it is Valpo thanks to ESPN. If you go by SAT scores, I suspect St. Olaf would win out and perhaps even Luther.
But in terms of a true "university," no one is close.
Quote from: VULB#62 on May 18, 2017, 08:28:32 AM
Valpo rated #2 behind Concordia University Wisconsin.
This mystifies me: "Recent studies showed that Valparaiso University area is relatively unsafe - the school is reported to have a rather poor rating for campus security."
I want to see those "recent studies." That is an unfair rap on the university and the community. Personally, I wouldn't be afraid to walk anywhere around or through the campus anytime of the day or night. Obviously, it's different with females, but that's the same anywhere. Valpo is a great community. I hate it when clueless outsiders bash it unfairly.
Rated behind Concordia - Wisconsin??? Are you kidding?? Who in the world did this survey? While Concordia is a nice little school, it sure is not in VU's class. Maybe all the online students? That is one facet of how the Concordias as a whole saved themselves from closing some years ago. To me any comparison of VU and any of the Concordia schools is a joke.
This is a great topic and I would hope that this is strongly discussed and debated by the senior administration and the board of the university.
I do not think that Valpo should position itself as the preeminent Lutheran university, but should offer a rich Lutheran experience for those that are interested in that experience. That is the difference with some of the schools listed above. Liberty, Baylor and BYU demand that their students live by precepts according to the schools' association with that faith. Notre Dame, in my view, makes some demands similar to those schools, and I am not very familiar with the other schools. I believe that demanding that students live by the precepts of the Lutheran faith is not likely to attract the quality and quantity of students that Valpo wants.
Valparaiso needs to focus on students looking for a more personal experience, while also offering a high tier (i.e. nationally respected with the highest accreditation for most colleges) education. They compete with mid to large privates (Jesuit universities, Bradley, Drake, etc.). They should try to aggressively market students who might go to schools like Concordia (WI), but also need to recognize that some students are looking for a smaller school or more religiously focused experience. While Concordia (WI) is a good school for what it is, it does not come close to measuring up to a school like Valparaiso in the quality of its programs. In business (for instance), Concordia is accredited by the IACBE - an organization (per their own website) created to let schools who could not get accreditation...get accreditation. Valparaiso, on the other hand, is accredited by the AACSB - which is the highest accreditation body in business. Prospective students may not realize the importance of this, but they should because a whole lot more companies are going to recruit from highly accredited schools than from schools with a far lower level of measured quality. You are much more likely to get a high quality job in your field at Valparaiso.
I think the bigger challenge is competing with the mid to large privates, since they recruit faculty with similar interests in excellent teaching and have fairly substantial resources. While quality of housing/living, student experience/activities and other factors all likely contribute to prospective students' priorities, understanding that better and focusing resources on improving the most important priorities that influence whether a student selects and is happy at Valparaiso should be a major emphasis of the administration and board (hopefully it already is).
Lastly, I have to comment on the safety issue and how it relates to rankings. I would argue that Concordia (WI) is safer than Valparaiso, but so what? Both are very safe, it is just that Concordia (WI) is in a very high socioeconomic area and Valparaiso is in good to high socioeconomic area. The threshold of a safe campus is clearly met by both schools.
Re: the safety issue comparing CUW and Valpo. It should be noted that at Concordia, most if not all buildings are connected by tunnels. It is possible for resident students to never go outside to attend classes, have meals, participate in recreation/athletics for days on end. A nephew of mine graduated from there recently and the running joke there was students literally attending classes in PJs. That might make for a safer campus, but you can still get attacked in a tunnel.
My guess is that their tunnels are more related to the school being in Wisconsin and right on Lake Michigan. Without the tunnels, it would still be safer due to its remoteness and very high income neighborhood.
Interesting that in 2015 we were ranked by College Choice as the #1 Christian college in the country, but in 2016 and 2017 we didn't even make the top 50. A number of other Lutheran Universities continue to make the list. I wonder what changed??
50 Best Christian Colleges for 2017 (http://www.collegechoice.net/rankings/best-christian-colleges-and-universities/)
50 Best Christian Colleges for 2016 (http://www.collegechoice.net/rankings/best-christian-colleges-and-universities-2016/)
50 Best Christian Colleges for 2015 (http://www.valpo.edu/news/2015/06/01/college-choice-names-valparaiso-university-no-1-christian-university-no-2-overall-in-midwest/)
I think those are pay-for-play sites.
Paul
Yes. Check the ads.
Quote from: FWalum on May 24, 2017, 04:44:05 PM
Interesting that in 2015 we were ranked by College Choice as the #1 Christian college in the country, but in 2016 and 2017 we didn't even make the top 50. A number of other Lutheran Universities continue to make the list. I wonder what changed??
50 Best Christian Colleges for 2017 (http://www.collegechoice.net/rankings/best-christian-colleges-and-universities/)
50 Best Christian Colleges for 2016 (http://www.collegechoice.net/rankings/best-christian-colleges-and-universities-2016/)
50 Best Christian Colleges for 2015 (http://www.valpo.edu/news/2015/06/01/college-choice-names-valparaiso-university-no-1-christian-university-no-2-overall-in-midwest/)
We probably stopped advertising with them. And that's not a joke statement.
Yes, that list is a bizarre mix of sizes, flavors, and degrees of seriousness. Not just apples and oranges, but bananas and pineapples mixed in.
St. Olaf is uber-liberal and might be offended to be called "Christian" these days.