I thought I would start this game thread early since tickets are going fast and people need to plan earlier than usual. Since my son is going to school near UIC and I've made the trip both by train and by car I can convey some important info. Here's the info bbtds gave about the tickets:
Quote from: bbtds on December 22, 2012, 06:50:57 PMThere are seats in section 106 ($23.78 per seat-$18 plus $5.78 ticketmaster fees) and section 108 ($20.67 per seat-$15 plus $5.67 ticketmaster fees) per the Ticketmaster website for the Valpo at UIC game on Jan. 9 as of today/Saturday. http://www.ticketmaster.com/event/04004926D5085F85?artistid=843544&majorcatid=10004&minorcatid=7 (http://www.ticketmaster.com/event/04004926D5085F85?artistid=843544&majorcatid=10004&minorcatid=7)
If going by train: Take the NICTD/Southshore at the Dune Park Station. Hwy 49 north to US 12 east. After going under the bridge for Hwy 49 turn left into the Dune Park Station. I suggest taking the 3:02 p.m. westbound train, although you could also take the 5:05 p.m. westbound train which if everything goes right would get you to UIC Pavilion just as the game is starting if you buy your tickets ahead of time on ticketmaster. Cost is $7.25 for southshore train to downtown Chicago. You can pay the conductor on the train with cash or buy a ticket in the station through the vending machine using a credit card. The 3:02 train will get you to the Van Buren station (the station before the last stop at Millennium station) at 4:19 p.m. Walk west (away from the lake) through the tunnel till you come up in the park at the corner of Michigan Ave & Van Buren. Keep walking west (away from the lake) along Van Buren on the northside of the street. The elevated Loop train tracks will be overhead since this is the south end of the Loop. You will cross Wabash and State Streets and then come to Dearborn. At Dearborn turn right and you will see the
Blue line subway entrance directly in front of you. Go down the stairs into the subway. Take the Blue line train towards Forest Park. It will cost you $2.25 and you will need exact change for the fare card vending machine. Select "BUY FARE CARD" button then put your money in the machine (no credit cards or change given) then press the "VEND" button. Your fare card will pop out near the bottom right of the machine. You insert the fare card with the white side facing away from you and with the yellow arrow pointing down into the turnstyle slot. After you insert the fare card it will pop back up and you take the fare card and proceed through the turnstyle. Board the train going towards
Forest Park. At that time of day the trains run every 4 to 8 minutes. Go 3 stops to the
UIC/Halsted station (which is in the middle of the Eisenhower/I-290 expressway). After getting off the train walk in the direction the train was traveling (west-away from the lake and in the opposite direction of the Sears/Willis Tower) towards Morgan Street. You will take the stairs/escalator up to street level. You should be facing west-in the opposite direction of the Sears/Willis Tower. Turn left/south on Morgan Street. Walk south on Morgan till you get to the next street Harrison and turn right. Walk on the north side of Harrison. Go past the UIC Education/Performing Arts building, then a surface parking lot, and then the UIC Harrison Street Parking Structure (a multiple level parking garage). After the parking garage is the UIC Pavilion. Gate 2 will be the first doors you will see after the parking garage (the parking garage is attached to the Pavilion by walk ramps). If you still need to buy tickets you must walk to the west side of the Pavilion where the ticket windows face Racine Street.
If going by car: Take US 30 west to I-65 north to I-80/94 west. Take the I-94 west ramp/Bishop Ford exit after you pass the state line. Take the I-94/Bishop Ford (I-94 will become the Dan Ryan Expressway after 95th Street) to the Roosevelt/Taylor exit,
exit 52B, near downtown. Take the frontage road to a stop light and turn left on Roosevelt. Go over the Dan Ryan and then turn right on Halsted. Go to Harrison and turn left. Go past Morgan Street and look for the Harrison Street Parking Structure (multi level parking garage) on right. The parking garage is attached to the UIC Pavilion by walk ramps. It costs $5 to park for UIC events.
Returning by train: The southshore train times at the Van Buren station for returning to the Dune Park station are 8:43 p.m.,
11:03 p.m. and 12:48 p.m. So if the game ends around 9:00 or 9:15 then you will have about 1.5 hours to kill. One suggestion is to walk east on Harrison to Halsted and turn left/north on Halsted and go to Greektown. It's about 3 or 4 blocks north on Halsted. When returning home walk south on Halsted to Van Buren (about 2 blocks & turn right/west. Go 2 blocks to Peoria Street and turn left. Go 1/2 block to the entrance for the UIC/Halsted Blue line station. Take the Blue line train in the direction of O'Hare. Go 3 stops to the Jackson station. Go back the same way you came by taking the stairs up to the corner of Dearborn and Van Buren. Walk east on Van Buren till you cross Michigan Ave into the park. Take the stairs under the sign that says "METRA"(this will get you back to the Van Buren station). Take the southshore train to the Dune Park station.
Quote from: historyman on December 22, 2012, 09:51:51 PMQuote from: bbtds on December 22, 2012, 06:50:57 PM
There are seats in section 106 ($23.78 per seat-$18 plus $5.78 ticketmaster fees) and section 108 ($20.67 per seat-$15 plus $5.67 ticketmaster fees) per the Ticketmaster website for the Valpo at UIC game on Jan. 9 as of today/Saturday. http://www.ticketmaster.com/event/04004926D5085F85?artistid=843544&majorcatid=10004&minorcatid=7 (http://www.ticketmaster.com/event/04004926D5085F85?artistid=843544&majorcatid=10004&minorcatid=7)
I'm still seeing these two blocks of tickets. Maybe 100-150 seats total. Seems strange.
agibson, I'm guessing it's a matter of "Who wants to go watch UIC fall apart again for $20+ thru Ticketmaster"?
Valpo 72
UIC 63
Valpo 71 UIC 65
Valpo plays better D then YSU which will propel us to the win at UIC.
The fact that YSU beat Loyola by 2 at Loyola today, 1/5/13, doesn't hurt Valpo at all.
No gimmes this year it seems. Unless a team is an injury mess like CSU.
Valpo finds a way. 62 to 58. We can't score well this year.
Honestly, if valpo plays like they did on Saturday they might lose. Heres why i think that. Because UIC probably isnt unable to score like CSU was. Cleveland did not take advantage of our turnovers. Id like to say that we will not have as many, but turnovers seem to be a guarantee with this years squad. We had a few scoring droughts against Cleveland and if we have them in Chicago i think UIC will get a lead and ride it out. Lets be honest it hasn't been tough to scout valpo this year. Our interior game was almost nonexistent against CSU. Hopefully bogan keeps his shooting up and kenney can hit a few more. Sure Kenney had 14 but he shot 5 of 14..not exactly lighting it up. I people love rowdy because he is the ultimate team player, but what this team needs is the ultimate leader. Everyone on our team would rather pass than shoot, besides dority. I just hope we see some sort of flow to the offense, fewer minutes without points, keep the boards going, and get some more points in the paint.
Quote from: truth219 on January 07, 2013, 09:51:25 AMOur interior game was almost nonexistent against CSU.
We all would have liked to see a couple more baskets inside, but let's not exaggerate the situation. The "truth" is that our interior game beat CSU's interior easily:
Both teams started a C-F-G-G-G lineup. Our starting C-F combo scored 16 points and had 18 rebounds. Theirs had 0 points 4 rebounds.
Valpo outrebounded CSU by a large margin: 43-27, and 13 -5 on offensive rebounds, even though CSU had more chances for offensive rebounds.
Points in the paint: Valpo 28, CSU 20.
Therefore, by the stats that measure interior success, Valpo was far from "almost nonexistent."
Valpo - 66
UIC - 62
We hit our 3's, then hit our FT's at the end of the game.
The Vegas line is not out yet, but I figure UIC may be a 3-4 point favorite at home. Still, I think it is time for a Valpo road upset to ease the home loss to Loyola a bit:
Valpo 67
UIC 61
Quote from: valpopal on January 08, 2013, 12:36:01 PMThe Vegas line is not out yet, but I figure UIC may be a 3-4 point favorite at home.
I don't think vegas will have them as a 3 point favorite, especially after the loss to Cleveland St. Vegas gives Valpo a lot of credit.
I'll say Valpo 69-65 winners
Quote from: valpopal on January 07, 2013, 10:39:55 AM
Quote from: truth219 on January 07, 2013, 09:51:25 AMOur interior game was almost nonexistent against CSU.
We all would have liked to see a couple more baskets inside, but let's not exaggerate the situation. The "truth" is that our interior game beat CSU's interior easily:
Both teams started a C-F-G-G-G lineup. Our starting C-F combo scored 16 points and had 18 rebounds. Theirs had 0 points 4 rebounds.
Valpo outrebounded CSU by a large margin: 43-27, and 13 -5 on offensive rebounds, even though CSU had more chances for offensive rebounds.
Points in the paint: Valpo 28, CSU 20.
Therefore, by the stats that measure interior success, Valpo was far from "almost nonexistent."
did you really expect the "truth" to have a reasonable opinion??
I think Valpo pulls out a close one at the end.
Valpo 60
UIC 55
Quote from: oklahomamick on January 08, 2013, 12:45:09 PMThe Vegas line is not out yet, but I figure UIC may be a 3-4 point favorite at home.I don't think vegas will have them as a 3 point favorite, especially after the loss to Cleveland St. Vegas gives Valpo a lot of credit.
Vegas has Valpo -3
Prediction: Valpo still does not find offensive consistency, but plays tough and guts out a win at UIC. Valpo 63 UIC 59
nullMaybe I should have bet on my prediction of the odds since Vegas currently has UIC as a 3-point favorite. (I'm usually pretty close because I know how they figure the odds, and I was once a math major.)
The sports book I'm looking at has Valpo as the favorite by 2.5. (line has moved .5 in favor of UIC) They predict Valpo winning. You initially stated that UIC would be favored....
Quote from: oklahomamick on January 09, 2013, 10:25:48 AM
The sports book I'm looking at has Valpo as the favorite by 2.5. (line has moved .5 in favor of UIC) They predict Valpo winning. You initially stated that UIC would be favored....
Yep, I saw that and immediately pulled my comment. Sorry! Still, hard to figure though since UIC is 40 spots higher than Valpo in the current RPI and the game is on their home court. That usually would translate into at least a 3 point advantage for UIC. Still, I am also picking Valpo to win.
I will be at the Pavilion tonight for the game. If anyone attending would like to meet up, please send me a PM! Thanks and GO CRUSADERS!
The line set in Las Vegas is purely in hopes of getting the same amount wagered both ways. The average person sitting in the MGM sports book will likely not know what the RPI of either team is. Valpo's name recognition and preseason hype is going to shift the line a bit in their favor. That being said, I, like everybody else on here believes that Valpo is going to win this game!
Quote from: oklahomamick on January 09, 2013, 06:14:54 AM
Quote from: oklahomamick on January 08, 2013, 12:45:09 PMThe Vegas line is not out yet, but I figure UIC may be a 3-4 point favorite at home.I don't think vegas will have them as a 3 point favorite, especially after the loss to Cleveland St. Vegas gives Valpo a lot of credit.
Vegas has Valpo -3
Doesn't this mean that Valpo is getting 3 points, or UIC favored by 3?
RPIForecast currently gives us a 44% chance, and we're the 'dog by 1.7 points (the .7 is probably one of them rimming Boganny shots).
RealTimeRPI says UIC 69-59.
I say hell with 'em both. Valpo, 56-54.
UIC just lost to Cleveland State by 10. I will be fully ashamed if we lose this game. Time for this team make a statement on the road with an easy win.
Quote from: valpo4life on January 09, 2013, 01:11:42 PM
UIC just lost to Cleveland State by 10. I will be fully ashamed if we lose this game. Time for this team make a statement on the road with an easy win.
i very much doubt that this will be an easy win on the road. what we've seen since the start of conference play is that anybody can win or lose on a given night, regardless of location. hell, uic might come out looking to prove something after their loss to csu from the other night.
On the road. Can't score.
UIC 71, VU 58
I'm feeling it for the B&G.... VU 68, UIC 57
I just saw Valpo is a 4 point favorite. Lets get that cover!
The video and audio feed from UIC is awful...
nice three from Ryan to end the half. Wish other players could make three's.
Anyone else thinks this feed is terrible?
Feed is horrible. Audio bad too.
Quote from: motowntitan on January 09, 2013, 08:37:07 PM
Anyone else thinks this feed is terrible?
Sucks... I am not sure but wondering if UIC is using dial-up...
Getting worse.
Am i the only one that watches a second.... pause a second... Watch a second.... Pause....
can only watch 2 seconds before it freezes for 8 seconds.
Todd's radio call is about three minutes ahead of the Horizon League feed right now. Score is 53-52, Ryan just misses a 3. On the feed, it's 48-46 UIC before the under-8 timeout.
yes, it is UIC
HL should fined UI
here's a thought how about everybody disconnect and I'll tell you if it gets better....
(actually - i just gave up .)
I gave up.....listening to the radio
I never turned on the sound -- just watching from about 5 minutes left in the 2nd half.
Stupid question from a football guy: why do we weave in the back half of the forecourt for 7-10 seconds without even presenting a challenge to the opponent before we enter into our attack? I ask this because it seems like UIC is a poised to attack us as soon as they cross midcourt.
Big plays in the last 2 minutes. Huge road win.
CBS sportstracker was about 45 seconds ahead of Todd... who is now 5:31 ahead of the Video.
Nice Road Win !... Gotta Believe 2 more on the road coming up... then the Wright State comes in and they're 3-0...
Rowdie ! What can be added to the stats already....
See Y'all at the Klotsche Center on Saturday!!
Some gutsy performances tonight! Some clutch shots down the stretch! And most importantly, a road WIN for the Crusaders! Fun game to watch (because we won). Our biggest lead was 6, their's was 9. Teams were a combined 43 of 48 from the stripe, good for almost 90%!
Quote from: VULB#62 on January 09, 2013, 09:17:14 PM
I never turned on the sound -- just watching from about 5 minutes left in the 2nd half.
Stupid question from a football guy: why do we weave in the back half of the forecourt for 7-10 seconds without even presenting a challenge to the opponent before we enter into our attack? I ask this because it seems like UIC is a poised to attack us as soon as they cross midcourt.
Just need a simple answer. And was happy that we got the win but the video at my end crapped out with 40.5 left and the score closer than the final.
My wife stayed with the video and then it died with a minute of game left. Horrible video from UIC. HL should be pissed because the announcer kept saying the game was being brought to us by the HorizonLeague. Not the best advertising.
As for the game - I stick by my earlier statement that we do better when refs blow their whistles even with capo and KVW fouling out.... "Letting them play" does not seem to be good for us. Way to pull out a tough road win!!!!
Quote from: govalpogo on January 09, 2013, 09:22:40 PM
Some gutsy performances tonight! Some clutch shots down the stretch! And most importantly, a road WIN for the Crusaders! Fun game to watch (because we won). Our biggest lead was 6, their's was 9. Teams were a combined 43 of 48 from the stripe, good for almost 90%!
The biggest reason why I loved this game is because we won ... playing 5 on 8. Pissing all over home cooking is a huge rush.
And losing such a game would make me very ornery. This is the kind of game that used to make me say, "We damn well better win this game now!"
Quote from: StlVUFan on January 09, 2013, 09:28:05 PM
Quote from: govalpogo on January 09, 2013, 09:22:40 PM
Some gutsy performances tonight! Some clutch shots down the stretch! And most importantly, a road WIN for the Crusaders! Fun game to watch (because we won). Our biggest lead was 6, their's was 9. Teams were a combined 43 of 48 from the stripe, good for almost 90%!
The biggest reason why I loved this game is because we won ... playing 5 on 8. Pissing all over home cooking is a huge rush.
And losing such a game would make me very ornery. This is the kind of game that used to make me say, "We damn well better win this game now!"
If we lost, I'm not sure ornery would do my mood justice... ;) Cantankerous perhaps.
The thing that was missed on the video feed at the end was Bogan hitting 2 clutch FT's and Kenney hitting 4 clutch FT's. In between UIC's Talton hit 2 FT's and a lay-up, lay-up by Humes and the final points by UIC was a three by Talton. With 1 second to go Kenney finished the scoring with his second of 2 FT's for the 5 point win.
Since UIC was behind they fouled every time Valpo got the ball in the last 40 seconds.
I just realized I forgot to mention the DUNK, yes a dunk, by Boggs on a feed from Broekhoff before the FT's by Bogan and Kenney.
If this Valpo team ever learned not to turnover the ball so much they sure would make it easier on themselves and come away with the win sooner.
Quote from: oklahomamick on January 09, 2013, 08:49:51 PM
HL should fined UI
Crummy video feed shut down with time on the clock. We switched to radio & Todd was in his interview with Luke. It's bad enough that the feed stunk, but then the ending was missed. Thanks HL/UIC. Oh, and then there was the UIC announcers - really bad! If you don't believe it, ask cOpobianco.
I thought announcers were fine, the feed was really bad but Matt says that is fixable. Any road win is a good road win, one down two to go on this trip. For those wondering the bus trip to Milwaukee was sold out so we should have a nice showing from our fans!
Dority nada ice 2nd half. Brogan maybe should've put the sleeve on the other arm tonight.
Quote from: HC on January 09, 2013, 06:46:33 PMI just saw Valpo is a 4 point favorite. Lets get that cover!
Those taking Valpo and the points really had to be happy to see/hear that Matt Kenney hit those last 2 free throws.
Quote from: VULB#62 on January 09, 2013, 09:24:56 PM
Quote from: VULB#62 on January 09, 2013, 09:17:14 PM
I never turned on the sound -- just watching from about 5 minutes left in the 2nd half.
Stupid question from a football guy: why do we weave in the back half of the forecourt for 7-10 seconds without even presenting a challenge to the opponent before we enter into our attack? I ask this because it seems like UIC is a poised to attack us as soon as they cross midcourt.
Just need a simple answer. And was happy that we got the win but the video at my end crapped out with 40.5 left and the score closer than the final.
The idea of the "weave" is that the player being screened or given the ball should look to turn the corner, if he doesn't feel he can then he either passes or screens for the next player in the"weave" who should be then looking to turn the corner on his man if the switch is not performed properly or the man guarding him looks to go over the screen and gets delayed. I agree that we don't really look to take advantage of the "weave" too often.
Quote from: StlVUFan on January 09, 2013, 09:28:05 PMThe biggest reason why I loved this game is because we won ... playing 5 on 8. Pissing all over home cooking is a huge rush.
Honestly, were we watching the same game? 30 to 18 FT shots...Valpo's favor...16 personal fouls to UIC's 22. How exactly was this home cooking? Would've been worse had the refs actually bought some of the flops your big men had against Crittle.
You guys stepped up and made clutch shots down the stretch...hats off to you. You deserved the win. But to say this was 5 vs 8 makes you look like you have no idea what you're talking about.
Btw, as far as the stream, I don't think it was just a UIC issue tonight....Green Bay apparently had struggles as well. I heard one of the UIC announcers say they just started using the HD equipment, so that may have sucked up too much HL bandwidth. In any case, you could've selected a lower quality...medium ran fine for me most of the time....however, near the end I had to switch to low and it was almost unwatchable. The audio has been horrendous at UIC for years....have to agree with you on that one.
Quote from: BigDFromUIC on January 09, 2013, 11:11:11 PMYou guys stepped up and made clutch shots down the stretch...hats off to you. You deserved the win. But to say this was 5 vs 8 makes you look like you have no idea what you're talking about.
It's just one fan's opinion. I would say there were a few calls that went against Valpo in critical situations that I would have liked to go Valpo's way but overall the refs had no real effect on the outcome of the game. But again, my opinion is also just one fan's opinion.
HC, who's Brogan? Is he the better shooting Bogan that we're hoping to get soon?
I never felt like the refs were one sided. Did not like seeing both our big guys foul out but at least these refs were somewhat consistent and kept it from being a shoving match....
However, I am a basketball purist and like the finesse game. Some basketball teams just want to foul and push players around thinking that if they foul hard enough players will think twice about driving the lane. If I wanted to see that I would watch football.
"The views and opinions expressed in this response are soley those of the authors. These views and opinions do not necessarily represent those of Other Valpo fans and/or any/all contributors to this site."
Just got home from the game. It's the first time I've been to the UIC pavilion. It's a nice venue for basketball. It has comfortable chair back seating, a jumbo tron at one end, a lively student band, and a parking garage that is literally within a few feet of the building. The game was really enjoyable to watch. Both teams had several nice runs, with Valpo having the good fortune of making the last one and then holding on for the victory. Congratulations to the Crusaders on a hard fought win over a good team!
Don't think I've ever seen a basketball game when a few things didn't boggle my mind. I'll try and post after every game, what went unusually different that night.
Erik Buggs stole the opening pass of the 2nd half and went in for an uncontested lay-up; Ben Boggs caught a breakaway pass for an uncontested lay-up. Valpo was officially given ZERO fast break points tonight.
On the second possession of the second half, Ryan Broekhoff clearly blocked a shot from the top of the key, with about 1.5 left on the shot clock, as the rebound went loose it was called a shot clocked violation, Broekhoff finished the game with ZERO blocked shots.
Then finally, with 2.31 left in the game, Crittle backed down Capobianco, who went down hard, after Bobby hits the floor, Crittle turns and lays it in. The official rules this a three point play opportunity. I'd guess if this film was shown to 20 other major college refs 0 would have called this a three - point play. Here's my sample of 20 - 13 a charge, 5 a block, no basket 1-1, and two no call. Anybody else see this play as a three-point play?
Quote from: BigDFromUIC on January 09, 2013, 11:11:11 PM
Quote from: StlVUFan on January 09, 2013, 09:28:05 PMThe biggest reason why I loved this game is because we won ... playing 5 on 8. Pissing all over home cooking is a huge rush.
Honestly, were we watching the same game? 30 to 18 FT shots...Valpo's favor...16 personal fouls to UIC's 22. How exactly was this home cooking? Would've been worse had the refs actually bought some of the flops your big men had against Crittle.
You guys stepped up and made clutch shots down the stretch...hats off to you. You deserved the win. But to say this was 5 vs 8 makes you look like you have no idea what you're talking about.
Btw, as far as the stream, I don't think it was just a UIC issue tonight....Green Bay apparently had struggles as well. I heard one of the UIC announcers say they just started using the HD equipment, so that may have sucked up too much HL bandwidth. In any case, you could've selected a lower quality...medium ran fine for me most of the time....however, near the end I had to switch to low and it was almost unwatchable. The audio has been horrendous at UIC for years....have to agree with you on that one.
Uh....it might have helped that we had about 6-7 FT attempts in the last 15 seconds or so because you guys were trying to catch up. Without you trying to play catch up, the fouls and FT attempts would be much closer. Simple fact is that Crittle drops his shoulder into the defender every time, which is not a block if the defender maintains his position. The defender has just as much right to their space as he does trying to bully his way inside. His elbows and shoulders were ridiculous.
Quote from: valpotx on January 10, 2013, 02:03:59 AMSimple fact is that Crittle drops his shoulder into the defender every time, which is not a block if the defender maintains his position. The defender has just as much right to their space as he does trying to bully his way inside. His elbows and shoulders were ridiculous.
Very much agreed.
Bobby and Kevin bascially fouled out guarding Crittle. How did Vashil do? I know he only had 1-2 minutes guarding him but wondered how he defended him since he doesn't have the pounds on him.
Quote from: BigDFromUIC on January 09, 2013, 11:11:11 PM
Quote from: StlVUFan on January 09, 2013, 09:28:05 PMThe biggest reason why I loved this game is because we won ... playing 5 on 8. Pissing all over home cooking is a huge rush.
Honestly, were we watching the same game? 30 to 18 FT shots...Valpo's favor...16 personal fouls to UIC's 22. How exactly was this home cooking? Would've been worse had the refs actually bought some of the flops your big men had against Crittle.
I don't mean to sound objective, because I'm not. I did see a couple of plays where Valpo might have gotten away with something. There were several very questionable calls that went against Valpo, and because it was a tight game I felt like the refs were going to hand you the win. It was an emotional outburst. I don't *really* believe that ever happens.
Then again, comparing fouls is not the best measurement for referee neutrality. It ignores the possibility that one side simply fouled more. I thought at least 2 of KVW's fouls were highly questionable, and there were a couple of other calls/non-calls that had me seething.
A couple of oservations from last night's game: Rowdy seems to be more aggressive of late including trying to make things happen by driving to the hoop. I like this a lot and shows he is taking on the role of the guy who HAS to make things happen when we stall. At the same time I thought he was a bit sloppy with his passes which is very unlike him.
Dority played well and may have been the differance maker but gets too aggressive sometimes and drives in only to have his shot rejected or turns it over.
We would be in trouble in games like last night, going up against a Josh Crittle, without having Bobby on the team. Richie Edwards would have been killed by Crittle, not that Bobby and Kevin wern't, but with a battle down low it helped to have two bigs available. Combined, Bobby and Kevin had the better of Krittle and his replacement.
There is something wrong with Matt as he isn't playing to his potential. Not sure exactly what I'm getting at, but he is struggling.
Will had a bad night ut so did most of our guys, with more than one air-ball. This is just something we will have to deal with, that being an inconsistent night from various players. We can just hope that on any given night someone other than Ryan can hit their shots.
Overall a well played game with us again winning the rebound war against another physical team. We had 15 TOs, which is slightly better than our season average. Hopefully that continues to improve.
Quote from: chef on January 10, 2013, 12:54:39 AMThen finally, with 2.31 left in the game, Crittle backed down Capobianco, who went down hard, after Bobby hits the floor, Crittle turns and lays it in. The official rules this a three point play opportunity. I'd guess if this film was shown to 20 other major college refs 0 would have called this a three - point play. Here's my sample of 20 - 13 a charge, 5 a block, no basket 1-1, and two no call. Anybody else see this play as a three-point play?
I had the advantage of listening to the radio call then going back to the HL feed to try to watch the end of the game. In my opinion no call might have been the best choice but I also couldn't argue with either a block or a charge. I do think that if the block call was legit then the continuation was also ok (slight delay but not what I was expecting from having already listened to the radio call). But your angle might have been better.
Quote from: vu72 on January 10, 2013, 09:39:55 AMDority played well and may have been the differance maker but gets too aggressive sometimes and drives in only to have his shot rejected or turns it over.
We went the first 14 or so minutes with only 3 turnovers then end up with 15 which is still way too many. 3 times that I remember Buggs took it towards the hole with no clear plan or advantage and on all of these plays bad things happened. Dority has a better chance of throwing up a shot in these situations but is not as good as Erik in finding an open teammate.
The difference between this being a good team and a very good team is about 3 fewer turnovers per game and I hope they can figure it out.
Another double-double: 21 points and 10 rebounds. Despite polls elsewhere or the rankings in record books, I am convinced this is again the best individual performer and team player in the Horizon League, as well as the best Valpo player since Bryce wore the uniform.
(http://i50.tinypic.com/35hh1xs.jpg)
Quote from: valpopal on January 10, 2013, 01:07:59 PM
Another double-double: 21 points and 10 rebounds. Despite polls elsewhere or the rankings in record books, I am convinced this is again the best individual performer and team player in the Horizon League, as well as the best Valpo player since Bryce wore the uniform.
Since he was just named the top mid major player in the country, I would hope so.
Quote from: wh on January 10, 2013, 01:44:23 PM
Quote from: valpopal on January 10, 2013, 01:07:59 PM
Another double-double: 21 points and 10 rebounds. Despite polls elsewhere or the rankings in record books, I am convinced this is again the best individual performer and team player in the Horizon League, as well as the best Valpo player since Bryce wore the uniform.
Since he was just named the top mid major player in the country, I would hope so.
But I'm hoping those voting in polls on the Horizon League would get the message as well. As another thread points out, the just released College Hoops Daily All-Conference Picks for the 1st Half of the Season, like the league's preseason poll, chose McCallum over Broekhoff.
Quote from: motowntitan on January 09, 2013, 08:37:07 PM
Anyone else thinks this feed is terrible?
For me the "high" quality feed, which was the default, got pretty bad. The "medium" was mostly OK, though I eventually switched to "low" where the buffering was basically OK but the video quality was very bad.
The audio was poor throughout. And, a little strange that the higher the quality feed, the further it was behind the action. Could be minutes of difference between even medium and low.
As another admitted "football guy", I liked "VU62's question about all the horizontal ball movement that seems to burn of a lot of clock from our possessions.
Quote from: oklahomamick on January 10, 2013, 07:23:07 AM
Quote from: valpotx on January 10, 2013, 02:03:59 AMSimple fact is that Crittle drops his shoulder into the defender every time, which is not a block if the defender maintains his position. The defender has just as much right to their space as he does trying to bully his way inside. His elbows and shoulders were ridiculous.
Very much agreed.
Bobby and Kevin bascially fouled out guarding Crittle. How did Vashil do? I know he only had 1-2 minutes guarding him but wondered how he defended him since he doesn't have the pounds on him.
Didn't play...played a short lineup those last 2 or so minutes. Just can't afford to have a free throw liability like Vashil out there in that situation
Quote from: valpotx on January 10, 2013, 02:03:59 AMUh....it might have helped that we had about 6-7 FT attempts in the last 15 seconds or so because you guys were trying to catch up. Without you trying to play catch up, the fouls and FT attempts would be much closer. Simple fact is that Crittle drops his shoulder into the defender every time, which is not a block if the defender maintains his position. The defender has just as much right to their space as he does trying to bully his way inside. His elbows and shoulders were ridiculous.
Right, but even take those 6-7 FTs off....even if you take 12 FTs off, it's still hard to say UIC got home-cooking...come on. For UIC to get home-cooking, you'd have to see a clear bias in officiating, and that wasn't even close to being the case. Crittle is a beast down low....big, physical player. There have been games this year where he's been whistled for the offensive. Last night, they let the guys play...on both ends. And it probably didn't help your cause when your big men were clearly flopping....you're not going to get the benefit of calls when you establish that you're pretending to get fouled.
Quote from: stlvufandon't mean to sound objective, because I'm not. I did see a couple of plays where Valpo might have gotten away with something. There were several very questionable calls that went against Valpo, and because it was a tight game I felt like the refs were going to hand you the win. It was an emotional outburst. I don't *really* believe that ever happens.
Then again, comparing fouls is not the best measurement for referee neutrality. It ignores the possibility that one side simply fouled more. I thought at least 2 of KVW's fouls were highly questionable, and there were a couple of other calls/non-calls that had me seething.
stlvufan, couldn't any fan of either team say that? That there were questionable calls on both ends?...seriously, there were a number of calls I thought UIC got screwed out of as well. Every game there are mind-blowing calls for both sides. Doesn't mean home-cooking. I mean it's bad enough we get beat at home by you guys, but you don't need to make it worse by saying the only way we even stayed close was because of officiating help...that's just a slap in the face. I would argue that UIC has the least home court advantage of any team in the HL....many opposing fans find their way to the Pavilion, and we have hardly gotten any of the typical home cooking that other teams seem to get around the conference when we play them on the road. Maybe we should visit this again when we play at Valpo...and we'll compare officiating then.
Quote from: BigDFromUIC on January 10, 2013, 06:26:51 PMstlvufan, couldn't any fan of either team say that? That there were questionable calls on both ends?...seriously, there were a number of calls I thought UIC got screwed out of as well. Every game there are mind-blowing calls for both sides. Doesn't mean home-cooking. I mean it's bad enough we get beat at home by you guys, but you don't need to make it worse by saying the only way we even stayed close was because of officiating help...that's just a slap in the face. I would argue that UIC has the least home court advantage of any team in the HL....many opposing fans find their way to the Pavilion, and we have hardly gotten any of the typical home cooking that other teams seem to get around the conference when we play them on the road. Maybe we should visit this again when we play at Valpo...and we'll compare officiating then.
I have to agree with BigDFromUIC. I don't believe that the refs officiated in any way that gave the game to UIC. Yes, there were some controversial calls but it doesn't mean all the calls went against Valpo or came close to all of them going against Valpo.
Wondered about the Crittle shoulder but didn't see a lot one way or another. The Official Scorer may be a different story and again, not biased one way or another just weird interpretation of the facts. See chef's analysis which I would never challenge:
Don't think I've ever seen a basketball game when a few things didn't boggle my mind. I'll try and post after every game, what went unusually different that night.
Erik Buggs stole the opening pass of the 2nd half and went in for an uncontested lay-up; Ben Boggs caught a breakaway pass for an uncontested lay-up. Valpo was officially given ZERO fast break points tonight.
On the second possession of the second half, Ryan Broekhoff clearly blocked a shot from the top of the key, with about 1.5 left on the shot clock, as the rebound went loose it was called a shot clocked violation, Broekhoff finished the game with ZERO blocked shots.
Then finally, with 2.31 left in the game, Crittle backed down Capobianco, who went down hard, after Bobby hits the floor, Crittle turns and lays it in. The official rules this a three point play opportunity. I'd guess if this film was shown to 20 other major college refs 0 would have called this a three - point play. Here's my sample of 20 - 13 a charge, 5 a block, no basket 1-1, and two no call. Anybody else see this play as a three-point play?
Quote from: justducky on January 10, 2013, 11:47:05 AMIn my opinion no call might have been the best choice but I also couldn't argue with either a block or a charge. I do think that if the block call was legit then the continuation was also ok (slight delay but not what I was expecting from having already listened to the radio call).
Quote from: vu72 on January 10, 2013, 07:04:17 PMWondered about the Crittle shoulder but didn't see a lot one way or another.
Bang-bang, some contact between two very large bodies followed by an apparent flop. A hard call to make. 72 and I both watched it and neither of us are completely certain what we saw. That may be why neither of us is out there in a striped shirt with a whistle.
Quote from: BigDFromUIC on January 10, 2013, 06:26:51 PM
Quote from: valpotx on January 10, 2013, 02:03:59 AMUh....it might have helped that we had about 6-7 FT attempts in the last 15 seconds or so because you guys were trying to catch up. Without you trying to play catch up, the fouls and FT attempts would be much closer. Simple fact is that Crittle drops his shoulder into the defender every time, which is not a block if the defender maintains his position. The defender has just as much right to their space as he does trying to bully his way inside. His elbows and shoulders were ridiculous.
Right, but even take those 6-7 FTs off....even if you take 12 FTs off, it's still hard to say UIC got home-cooking...come on. For UIC to get home-cooking, you'd have to see a clear bias in officiating, and that wasn't even close to being the case. Crittle is a beast down low....big, physical player. There have been games this year where he's been whistled for the offensive. Last night, they let the guys play...on both ends. And it probably didn't help your cause when your big men were clearly flopping....you're not going to get the benefit of calls when you establish that you're pretending to get fouled.
Quote from: stlvufandon't mean to sound objective, because I'm not. I did see a couple of plays where Valpo might have gotten away with something. There were several very questionable calls that went against Valpo, and because it was a tight game I felt like the refs were going to hand you the win. It was an emotional outburst. I don't *really* believe that ever happens.
Then again, comparing fouls is not the best measurement for referee neutrality. It ignores the possibility that one side simply fouled more. I thought at least 2 of KVW's fouls were highly questionable, and there were a couple of other calls/non-calls that had me seething.
stlvufan, couldn't any fan of either team say that? That there were questionable calls on both ends?...seriously, there were a number of calls I thought UIC got screwed out of as well. Every game there are mind-blowing calls for both sides. Doesn't mean home-cooking. I mean it's bad enough we get beat at home by you guys, but you don't need to make it worse by saying the only way we even stayed close was because of officiating help...that's just a slap in the face. I would argue that UIC has the least home court advantage of any team in the HL....many opposing fans find their way to the Pavilion, and we have hardly gotten any of the typical home cooking that other teams seem to get around the conference when we play them on the road. Maybe we should visit this again when we play at Valpo...and we'll compare officiating then.
Of course! It was a very nerve-wracking game for me. Furthermore, the video was choppy, and I did miss a few minutes here and there.
You're trying to use rationality to engage an emotional argument.
I was blowing off steam. Now, I was telling you honestly how I felt about the game. I would have to watch again to see if I agree with you, but did you miss the part where I did admit seeing a couple of plays where Valpo got away with something?
I think it would have been a slap in the face if I'd come on your message board and said that. Moreover, I think I was expressing more what my reaction *would have been* had we lost. Since we won, I obviously have no serious complaint. Win is all that matters.
Quote from: chef on January 10, 2013, 12:54:39 AMDon't think I've ever seen a basketball game when a few things didn't boggle my mind. I'll try and post after every game, what went unusually different that night. Erik Buggs stole the opening pass of the 2nd half and went in for an uncontested lay-up; Ben Boggs caught a breakaway pass for an uncontested lay-up. Valpo was officially given ZERO fast break points tonight. On the second possession of the second half, Ryan Broekhoff clearly blocked a shot from the top of the key, with about 1.5 left on the shot clock, as the rebound went loose it was called a shot clocked violation, Broekhoff finished the game with ZERO blocked shots. Then finally, with 2.31 left in the game, Crittle backed down Capobianco, who went down hard, after Bobby hits the floor, Crittle turns and lays it in. The official rules this a three point play opportunity. I'd guess if this film was shown to 20 other major college refs 0 would have called this a three - point play. Here's my sample of 20 - 13 a charge, 5 a block, no basket 1-1, and two no call. Anybody else see this play as a three-point play?
chef, do you ever report these "problems" to the opponents' AD? It would seem easy to fix if the video archives of these games can be reviewed on the HLN.
That's right, UIC wasn't able to and still can't get a full video of the game put up on the HL website.
I would normally report these to the stat keeper (or SID) if I notice it during the game, but in this case the mistakes weren't spotted until on the way home.
Quote from: historyman on January 11, 2013, 02:37:06 AM
Quote from: chef on January 10, 2013, 12:54:39 AMDon't think I've ever seen a basketball game when a few things didn't boggle my mind. I'll try and post after every game, what went unusually different that night. Erik Buggs stole the opening pass of the 2nd half and went in for an uncontested lay-up; Ben Boggs caught a breakaway pass for an uncontested lay-up. Valpo was officially given ZERO fast break points tonight. On the second possession of the second half, Ryan Broekhoff clearly blocked a shot from the top of the key, with about 1.5 left on the shot clock, as the rebound went loose it was called a shot clocked violation, Broekhoff finished the game with ZERO blocked shots. Then finally, with 2.31 left in the game, Crittle backed down Capobianco, who went down hard, after Bobby hits the floor, Crittle turns and lays it in. The official rules this a three point play opportunity. I'd guess if this film was shown to 20 other major college refs 0 would have called this a three - point play. Here's my sample of 20 - 13 a charge, 5 a block, no basket 1-1, and two no call. Anybody else see this play as a three-point play?
chef, do you ever report these "problems" to the opponents' AD? It would seem easy to fix if the video archives of these games can be reviewed on the HLN.
That's right, UIC wasn't able to and still can't get a full video of the game put up on the HL website.
I'm pretty sure that the full game has been up since yesterday morning...since I watched part of it. There are no highlights of the game, however, which is much to my own chagrin.
Quote from: historyman on January 11, 2013, 02:37:06 AM
Quote from: chef on January 10, 2013, 12:54:39 AMDon't think I've ever seen a basketball game when a few things didn't boggle my mind. I'll try and post after every game, what went unusually different that night. Erik Buggs stole the opening pass of the 2nd half and went in for an uncontested lay-up; Ben Boggs caught a breakaway pass for an uncontested lay-up. Valpo was officially given ZERO fast break points tonight. On the second possession of the second half, Ryan Broekhoff clearly blocked a shot from the top of the key, with about 1.5 left on the shot clock, as the rebound went loose it was called a shot clocked violation, Broekhoff finished the game with ZERO blocked shots. Then finally, with 2.31 left in the game, Crittle backed down Capobianco, who went down hard, after Bobby hits the floor, Crittle turns and lays it in. The official rules this a three point play opportunity. I'd guess if this film was shown to 20 other major college refs 0 would have called this a three - point play. Here's my sample of 20 - 13 a charge, 5 a block, no basket 1-1, and two no call. Anybody else see this play as a three-point play?
chef, do you ever report these "problems" to the opponents' AD? It would seem easy to fix if the video archives of these games can be reviewed on the HLN.
That's right, UIC wasn't able to and still can't get a full video of the game put up on the HL website.
That's got to be disappointing for Bryce. He spent an entire timeout drawing up that fast break play for Boggs ... to not get credit for it stinks. Also, I couldn't find a play-by-play on the UIC site, but on Valpo's website, it shows the Boggs basket as a dunk. Careless work by someone.
It seems like these issues could be fixed through some communication between the SIDs of the schools. As historyman points out, there's obviously video to substantiate the claims.
I wonder if this happens elsewhere, or only at UIC? I'm sure Valpo has support staff traveling with them to these games ... maybe someone should follow the online stats to make sure Valpo is getting credit for things like their fast break points. Live and learn.
The foul call is obviously a different situation, as it was made by the oncourt officials. However, I'm sure that Bryce and staff are able to send video of questionable calls like that to the league office to be evaluated. Can't fix that game, but maybe if LeCrone is aware of it, he'll make sure they get it right the next time.
BTW: The Boggs play showed up as a dunk on the UIC play-by-play log, that's why you see it that way on the Valpo web site. Clearly it was not a dunk.
Quote from: govalpogo on January 11, 2013, 08:42:00 AMI'm pretty sure that the full game has been up since yesterday morning...since I watched part of it. There are no highlights of the game, however, which is much to my own chagrin.
The last 24 seconds of the Valpo at UIC game are not archived even though it comes in 2 parts on the HLN site. Now that is pretty bad. Who watches a replay of a game only to miss the last 24 seconds?
Funny! Does that mean they archived... the medium quality feed? Which might have been far enough behind to miss some game time when they shut the server down?
Quote from: govalpogo on January 11, 2013, 08:42:00 AM
Quote from: historyman on January 11, 2013, 02:37:06 AM
Quote from: chef on January 10, 2013, 12:54:39 AMDon't think I've ever seen a basketball game when a few things didn't boggle my mind. I'll try and post after every game, what went unusually different that night. Erik Buggs stole the opening pass of the 2nd half and went in for an uncontested lay-up; Ben Boggs caught a breakaway pass for an uncontested lay-up. Valpo was officially given ZERO fast break points tonight. On the second possession of the second half, Ryan Broekhoff clearly blocked a shot from the top of the key, with about 1.5 left on the shot clock, as the rebound went loose it was called a shot clocked violation, Broekhoff finished the game with ZERO blocked shots. Then finally, with 2.31 left in the game, Crittle backed down Capobianco, who went down hard, after Bobby hits the floor, Crittle turns and lays it in. The official rules this a three point play opportunity. I'd guess if this film was shown to 20 other major college refs 0 would have called this a three - point play. Here's my sample of 20 - 13 a charge, 5 a block, no basket 1-1, and two no call. Anybody else see this play as a three-point play?
chef, do you ever report these "problems" to the opponents' AD? It would seem easy to fix if the video archives of these games can be reviewed on the HLN.
That's right, UIC wasn't able to and still can't get a full video of the game put up on the HL website.
I'm pretty sure that the full game has been up since yesterday morning...since I watched part of it. There are no highlights of the game, however, which is much to my own chagrin.
However, at the moment, that is the *only* Valpo game archived. No Loyola game, no CSU game.
stlvufan,
ESPN app for my iPad has a few archived games....
Milwaukee
Cleveland state
Murray state
Northern Illinois
(And a bunch of games from last year ... Including our final game - I avoided that one - not really wanting to live that one over.)
Quote from: Smj on January 13, 2013, 01:03:19 PM
stlvufan,
ESPN app for my iPad has a few archived games....
Milwaukee
Cleveland state
Murray state
Northern Illinois
(And a bunch of games from last year ... Including our final game - I avoided that one - not really wanting to live that one over.)
Thanks, I forgot that the CSU game was on ESPNU. Actually, I did go back and watch it already.
I'm still waiting for the Loyola game.
Quote from: StlVUFan on January 13, 2013, 05:09:26 PM
I'm still waiting for the Loyola game.
Skip it - who wants to see us lose....
Quote from: Smj on January 13, 2013, 06:44:08 PM
Quote from: StlVUFan on January 13, 2013, 05:09:26 PM
I'm still waiting for the Loyola game.
Skip it - who wants to see us lose....
It should be there, period.