Messages

Way down on the list of considerations will be a new home for Men's Tennis. I'm pretty sure the Valley is dropping the sport.

Can't imagine the HL will let us stay on. MAC?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Single invite strikes me as a reactionary response to needing a 10th member as opposed to a plan to grow the league post-Creighton/Wichita.

Much like when the HL added Oakland a few years back, Valpo was the obvious choice to get back to 10. A solid choice that probably won't move the needle much.

I was hoping the league would go to 12, but it's final two choices were underwhelming.

Ideally, they have big plans for summer 2018.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What happens if they can't get a 7/9 vote for any of the proposed teams? Back to drawing board? Take a break and come back another time for a revote?

Generally those issues are resolved long before any formal vote takes place. Things like last night are typically a procedural rubber stamp.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Milwaukee in 2017 is the equivalent of Loyola last time around (and NKU in the last round of Horizon expansion).

The potential to be a strong member exists, but it hasn't been proven yet. Even if you give Jimmy the benefit of the doubt re: the team improving long-term, there are still serious structural questions to address.

Assuming the game of musical ADs (by far its biggest issue) is finally over, MKE still has serious concerns to address. Where the Panthers  rank in the city's sporting priority list (#4 in basketball alone)  is a cause for concern with me. The key to getting and maintaining local interest is media coverage. If you aren't getting ink/airtime it's and uphill battle. No matter how many games they win, I just can't see them jumping the Bucks, Badgers, and Marquette in terms of local attention.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Maybe StLU thinks every conference team should play a 7-game series against every other team. 3 at home, 3 on the road and one neutral site - just to be fair - and THEN we have an accurate reading of who the best team is. Maybe. But then he'd still want to take his trip to Detroit.

Only if the neutral site games are played in Detroit...wouldn't want to upset Kampe.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

18 games per team is obviously what I meant.  In that light, 90

I don't think I'm getting through to you.  18 games is nowhere near enough time to be satisfied that all the weird stuff evens out (lucky bounces, crucial bad calls, freak injuries, schedule quirks - some teams having longer road trips and more busy streaks than other teams, etc.).  You only play each time twice.  Very shaky.  To say nothing of having to settle who the #1 seed is by a frigging tiebreaker.  Billy Donlon was absolutely right last year when he complained about losing the double-bye because of a tiebreaker.

There's no way they can play enough games to iron out all the wrinkles and give a reliable read.  There's only one of the four major sports - and then only at one level - where the regular season is large enough to prove who the best team is simply by looking at the standings: Major League Baseball (by best team, obviously I mean best team in each division).

By the way, just in case you're interested, this is why I am adamantly opposed (for all the good it does me) to the wildcard system in MLB.  I'll never get my way, but I'll never give in, either

Here's where you lose me. In a 10 team,  double round robin, every team gets a pair of games, one home one away, against the other 9. If that isn't the most equitable way to determine a conference champion given the NCAA restrictions, I don't know what is. It's certainly more reasonable that a 3-5 day single elimination tournament making kids play back to backs for the first time all season.

I struggle with the idea of conference tournaments in 1 bid leagues. You aren't doing anyone any favors putting a mid-league finisher in the tournament over your best team from the last 12 weeks.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Anyone else get the sense that Valpo officials are sitting in a quiet confidence right now while Murray St. AD and President seem anxious and nervous with their tweets? Granted I would also be upset if someone reported a supposedly false story about my school. But we are getting absolutely nothing out of ML while their AD is tweeting back to fans of other MVC schools? Just seems odd to me.

There is absolutely no need for ML and Valpo to manage messages right now...when things are breaking your way, you just sit tight and let them unfold. The desperate responses coming out of Murray AD aren't a good look. That being said, the meltdown (and PantherU's) have been entertaining.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Trivia - who was the Valpo player who transferred from Evansville?

I'm stumped.  What era?

The only Valpo/Evansville transfer I knew was Bryan Bouchie heading south after 07-08. Same year Haanpaa turned pro. That off-season set us back at least 2 years. 08-09 was going to be a step back without Huff, but losing those two as well doomed us to a disaster.

Don't know of anyone going the other way off hand.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Assuming this is true:

Does this put Murray on the backburner for when Missouri State makes the move to FBS (Sun Belt/MAC/C-USA)?

Adding one to maintain the status quo makes me nervous because it indicates that the Valley is reactive instead of proactive when it comes to realignment, much like the HL has been dealing with life post-Butler. Whether we agreed with the schools chosen, the proactive/aggressive stance demonstrated by a move to 11 or 12 would make me more comfortable about the league's long term outlook.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

On a more serious note, some posters advised that facilities had nothing to do with the MVC passing us over last time. But we have a reference to them during this visit. So which is it? They either are part of an overall consideration or they are not.

My hunch is that they decided for a handful of (foolish) reasons that they wanted Loyola and "facilities" was the most convenient/believable excuse they could muster.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I wonder what Murray St would look like without the last two years...

They would still have those 3 straight losses to Valpo...not sayin, just sayin.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm pretty sure that is where IPFW plays their home games normally. I think it was more like 3 or 4 to 1. Also I think Dane Fife had a lot to do with getting this scheduled before he left for Michigan state.

Used to play there. Poor attendance moved them to a 2000 seat campus gym a few years back. Last time we played there (December 2015?) was in the smaller gym.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Why not create Pioneer Classic with some games between Valpo, Drake, Butler and Dayton?  Coordinate so that they matchups are on the weekend of the football game.

Safe to say that format wouldn't work for butt-headed reasons. What could be workable is a requirement that member schools play some minimum number of OOC games across all sports (including at least one MBB game). I'm sure our friends in Indianapolis (to a lesser extent Dayton and Davidson) would pitch a fit, but where else are they going to play football?

The HL did something similar with Belmont for a few years and it led to some interesting games. Who at the two schools wouldn't want to see Derrik Smits vs Marist before he graduates?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Creighton out drew Omaha 10-1 and Marquette out drew Milwaukee 7-1 in the latest data I found (http://i.turner.ncaa.com/sites/default/files/images/2016/06/09/2016_release_mens_basketball_attendance_final.pdf). Neither is a particularly good look and a fair comparison in my book.

The problem with both schools is the same problem that I have with Valpo in the HL. Urban commuter schools don't move the needle in their markets like more traditional schools.

To draw, most schools need 2 things:

1- An actively engaged student body and alumni base.
2- A local media that cares and is willing promote.

I know from personal experience living in Milwaukee and Cleveland that the urban commuter schools that make up the HL have little of both. I'm willing to bet Omaha is in the same boat.

If a tree falls in the forest and nobody is there to hear, does it make any noise?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I (any MVC fan) doesn't get this facination the MVC gets with certain schools. 4 years ago it was UMKC and UIC. They are very bad programs in markets they don't register even as blip on. This time it appears that UN-O is that team. I don't freaking get it.

I suppose the thought is to reclaim part of the Omaha market that was lost with Creighton. UNO doesn't exist in Omaha. It plays in front of 1,500 people a night in a hockey arena 10 minutes from Creighton playing in front of 18,000. UNO isn't in the sports section until page 4. UNO spends more money on hockey than all other sports combined. I hate everything about UNO.

Make it Valpo. Make it Murray State. If they much force a 12th right now I guess UWM is as good as it gets. Even that doesn't make me happy. I'd much rather wait for a 12th to appear and stand out above the rest.

I think you're likely to have the same problems with Milwaukee as you do with Omaha (though they don't have Hockey). UWM plays miles off its campus in a building that literally sits in the shadow of the home of Milwaukee's real players: Marquette and the Bucks. Throw in the Badgers and UWM is already sitting 4th in the city's basketball landscape. That's before counting all of the Chicago transplants and fans of convenience who live there as well.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What about an East/West split?

UWM
Loyola
Valpo
Indiana St
Evansville
Murray St

Bradley
Illinois St
So Illinois
No Iowa
Drake
Missouri St

As an aside, if we're bringing a second HL school with us, I'd prefer Green Bay, Wright State, or even Oakland to UWM. In no way is this a rumor, just my $0.02.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If the MVC is serious about adding a school with an athletic department as dysfunctional as Milwaukee's it proves they learned nothing from the Loyola decision last time. I totally understand losing out to Murray State, but UWM is inexcusable.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The MVC needs Valpo more than Valpo needs the MVC. I don't think they're at liberty to be making demands for Valpo to up and spend $20 million. So what, Valpo says no, we don't have $20 million laying around and they go with UMKC instead? How does the MVC win in that situation?

I have a feeling that the MVC sans Wichita State isn't what's holding Valpo back from spending tens of millions on athletic facilities.

I don't disagree with the sentiment, but that we actually believe "the MVC needs Valpo more than Valpo needs the MVC" is probably how we have earned the mantle of the HL's most arrogant/obnoxious fan base.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Gentleman, there are only so many weekends in the spring semester for OUTDOOR SPORTS.

Go celebrate Easter your way, they will do it their way.

That argument would have more validity if every other Valpo team hadn't managed to clear its schedule.

BYU refuses to play any Sunday games and still manages to function at a higher level than us.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Is omaha a better candidate than umkc? 

At the end of the midwestern mid major conference shake up, umkc will be in a different conference.  The kangaroos will be in either the mvc, (can't believe I said that) back into the summit or in the HL (can't believe I said that either) one thing is certain their time in the WAC is coming to an end

I would think so. Brand new facility and a commitment to stepping up to D1. Omaha has more of a Northern Kentucky feel, while UMKC has proven itself to be more like IUPUI...along for the ride but not really committed.

My only concern with Omaha would be them dealing with the same issues UWM has in relation to Marquette...no matter what they do, they'll always be little brother to Creighton. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Let's be honest, the odds of those kids being in chapel this morning were slim-to-none anyway...unless their parents showed up and dragged them there.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Is Tevonn a graduate transfer candidate?  I hadn't thought so...

There is zero chance he leaves to another college if he's a traditional senior.

Graduating college in 3 years is actually quite easy, especially when you have the support system these schools give athletes. Every scholarship basketball player I've ever known has been working on his masters by the fall of his 4th year of eligibility.

These guys are taking classes year round so they can take the minimum in season. Take 12 credits in 3 fall semesters, 3 spring semesters, and 4 summer semesters and you have the 120 required for a bachelors by the start of your senior fall.

EDIT: to clarify, I'm talking about people I know personally, not college athletes in general.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah that most likely won't be happening under President Heckler unfortunately... They've had 4 yrs to do something and haven't done anything but kick the tire down the road.

That's largely because Heckler has managed to get the university in debt up to its eyeballs on building projects over the last few years. Say what you will about Harre, but at least he paid for buildings before breaking ground.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

WHAT IF..... the HL announces the addition of two new, well-qualified (<150 RPI, within the HL footprint, etc.)  members BEFORE the MVC completes their due diligence? What would we do? Can't ever imagine LeCrone pulling that off (and I certainly don't even have a guess which two schools would even fit into that scenario), but it sure would make for an interesting quandary, wouldn't it?

It's an interesting thought experiment for sure, but one without many good answers. The absolute perfect solution would be Murray State and Belmont, but we've been saying that since the league was down to 8. Since it didn't work then, I can't imagine it now seeing as how the HL's standing has declined since then.

Robert Morris in Pittsburgh was intriguing a couple of years ago (perhaps paired with one of the private, Buffalo schools) but the bloom seems to be off the rose after consecutive rough seasons.

None of the top tier Summit schools are worth it as far as I'm concerned, and we certainly want nothing to do with IUPUI (or UMKC - WAC, but the point stands).

An intriguing possibility is an MVC raid to land a pair of public (InSt, IlSt,UNI) or private (E'Ville,Loyola,Drake) schools spooked by Wichita's exit. There are dozens of reasons why this Durant happen, not the least of which are the HL's lack of media money/exposure, cache, and leadership needed to pull off anything that bold.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Also, "the MVC with Murray State, Belmont and Valpo would be better than it was with WSU", IMO, it wouldn't be better than it was with Wichita State.  With the Shockers, it was pretty much a guarantee that if someone other than WSU won the conference tournament, the MVC would get 2 bids.  While all 3 programs can be very solid to good, none of them have earned an at-large bid in the last 15 years.

It all depends on how you define "better conference." An MVC that includes Valpo, Belmont, and Murray State would be wildly entertaining to watch. It is also unlikely to be a multi-bid league with any regularity.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk