http://www.tulsaworld.com/sportsextra/tu/valparaiso-s-bryce-drew-emerges-as-tu-coach-candidate/article_1e1159a7-59e1-5149-835a-efc25ebd283e.html (http://www.tulsaworld.com/sportsextra/tu/valparaiso-s-bryce-drew-emerges-as-tu-coach-candidate/article_1e1159a7-59e1-5149-835a-efc25ebd283e.html)
Win a game in the NCAA tourney or beat a major team here at Valpo first before you flirt with greener pastures.........
I have no idea who this guy is, but he and his "sources" are clueless. I don't care how many wins/tournament appearances Tulsa has or doesn't have. Bryce would never move to the middle of nowhere USA for nothing more than a lateral move to a mid major conference ranked only slightly above the Horizon League.
Do u really believe a league with the national champ, UCONN, Cincinnati and Memphis is ranked slightly above the Horizon. Who's clueless here?
Also, Tulsa offered Manning 1.2 million to stay. Where is Bryce to that, the point 2
I forgot that Tulsa will be leaving C-USA for the AAC. That changes the profile of the opportunity, but I still highly doubt Bryce would be interested.
Quote from: wh on April 13, 2014, 12:04:09 AM
I forgot that Tulsa will be leaving C-USA for the AAC. That changes the profile of the opportunity, but I still highly doubt Bryce would be interested.
Absolutely! Who wouldn't want the chance to coach against East Carolina, Tulane and Navy! The American will be a work in progress for sometime and probably ends up looking like a rehash of C-USA. Rutgers and Louisville are already gone.
Here are some comments Bryce made when he signed his new 10-year agreement in December:
"My wife and I are very comfortable living in Valparaiso," Drew said. "We love it here, we have family here and we're an hour away from Chicago. This is a great place for a family."
"I feel that with President (Mark) Heckler and Mark LaBarbera, we have great leadership at Valparaiso University," Drew said. "We had excellent talks on the current status of the basketball program and I have complete trust in their leadership."
"The commitment the school is making sends a message to recruits," Drew said. "I'm a kid who grew up here; I watched my Dad and my brother coach here. I've seen the progression of the community and the campus. We're in a top-12 league in the country right now. I'm really excited about the opportunity to keep improving our program."
Do these comments guarantee that Bryce will be here 10 years from now? Of course not. What they do say IMO is that it would take a very special opportunity to lure him away. Coaching at Tulsa University and living in Tulsa Oklahoma just doesn't fit the bill. As to the money, Bryce has already had several million dollar paydays. From everything I hear he has invested his money and lived conservatively so he doesn't have to make decisions dictated by the almighty dollar. That's a pretty great position to be in when seeking true happiness and fulfillment in life.
Obviously I want Bryce to stay put. I understand tulsa is no nwi but it's close to a million people counting the suburbs. If he leaves I'll have a place setup for him at the dinner table.
Just a guess here, but with Bryce's wife having a baby soon, I don't know if he'd be interested in adding a move to the equation. Can't imagine Homer and Janet would be too happy about a new grand baby moving away. :)
Quote from: vu72 on April 13, 2014, 08:27:04 AM
Quote from: wh on April 13, 2014, 12:04:09 AM
I forgot that Tulsa will be leaving C-USA for the AAC. That changes the profile of the opportunity, but I still highly doubt Bryce would be interested.
Absolutely! Who wouldn't want the chance to coach against East Carolina, Tulane and Navy! The American will be a work in progress for sometime and probably ends up looking like a rehash of C-USA. Rutgers and Louisville are already gone.
Not that it changes the point of your post, but Navy will remain in the Patriot League for all sports other than football.
Can't imagine that Homer/Janet would stay in Valpo if Bryce and Scott both lived in southwest.
This position may be better than what a lot of you think. The coaching position at Tulsa has been a stepping stone for great coaching success. Look at Bill Self, Nolan Richardson and Tubbu Smith as examples. All 3 coaches eventually led teams to national championships. The Tulsa metro area is over one million and has a lot of petro cash.
That being said, I am suprised they are looking at Bryce Drew right now as his coaching stock is currently low. They may want to look at the coach at SFA (Underwood) who did an outstanding job coaching this year and has a lot of experience and contacts with folks in that region.
I think the guy Tulsa should go after is Mercer coach Bob Hoffman, who is from Oklahoma City. He went to Oklahoma Baptist University which is in Shawnee, OK just outside OKC. Hoffman has coached at Oklahoma Baptist, Texas Pan-Am, Oklahoma-Norman as an asst., in the Developmental League in Texas and at Mercer.
Geez, talk about whistling through the graveyard.
Some of you guys thinking a coach worth his salt like Bryce might not at least CONSIDER leaving the bright lights of Valparaiso, IN for the balmy environs of the 46th-largest city in America are delusional.
And, equating the AAC to the Horizon League is simply comical. Look at the top five teams in that league this season: UConn, Louisville, Cincinnati, Memphis, and SMU. Who finished at the top of the Horizon this year: some commuter school in Michigan?
For the record, Tulsa is going to pay somewhere between $750,000 to $1 million a year for their next coach. How is Valpo going to counter that offer? By playing the "Bryce-please-don't-deprive-your-parents-of-their-grandbaby!" card? Classic!!
NOT EVERY COACH IS A LIFER LIKE HOMER DREW.
MOST ARE MORE LIKE SCOTT DREW.
COACHES MOVE ON TO OTHER JOBS.
YOUR NEXT COACH WILL LEAVE FOR ANOTHER JOB SOME DAY, TOO.
THAT'S LIFE IN COLLEGE BASKETBALL - DEAL WITH IT.
Quote from: Eaglebackr on April 13, 2014, 09:17:18 PMGeez, talk about whistling through the graveyard. Some of you guys thinking a coach worth his salt like Bryce might not at least CONSIDER leaving the bright lights of Valparaiso, IN for the balmy environs of the 46th-largest city in America are delusional. And, equating the AAC to the Horizon League is simply comical. Look at the top five teams in that league this season: UConn, Louisville, Cincinnati, Memphis, and SMU. Who finished at the top of the Horizon this year: some commuter school in Michigan? For the record, Tulsa is going to pay somewhere between $750,000 to $1 million a year for their next coach. How is Valpo going to counter that offer? By playing the "Bryce-please-don't-deprive-your-parents-of-their-grandbaby!" card? Classic!! NOT EVERY COACH IS A LIFER LIKE HOMER DREW. MOST ARE MORE LIKE SCOTT DREW. COACHES MOVE ON TO OTHER JOBS. YOUR NEXT COACH WILL LEAVE FOR ANOTHER JOB SOME DAY, TOO. THAT'S LIFE IN COLLEGE BASKETBALL - DEAL WITH IT.
Now I bet you all would like a "DISLIKE" button!!!
Can we get orumom and oruterry to chime in on this please?
Quote from: ARCInsider on April 13, 2014, 09:55:55 PMCan we get orumom and oruterry to chime in on this please?
Nope, their sect shunned them both for two years for posting on a Lutheran team board the last time
It's a special brand of crazy over there, isn't it?
Quote from: usc4valpo on April 13, 2014, 08:07:30 PMThat being said, I am suprised they are looking at Bryce Drew right now as his coaching stock is currently low.
You keep saying that and I can tell you that you are incorrect with that assumption.
Sorry, but Eaglebacker has some points. Once this string started I checked out the TU athletic website. They are about the same size student body wise, but they are a legit D-I program, IMO, in terms of consistently competitive teams, while VU, IMO, is a D-I MBB school trying to be D-I in others. Their facilities are very good -- 30,000 seat FB stadium, 8300 seat basketball arena, and a $31 million sports complex that includes a facility for their #15 ranked WSB team. But, I am curious though as to why they don't have a baseball team. They share the Tulsa one million person demo with ORU, but I get the strong sense that TU has the lion's share of that. They are the big show in that town and as USC mentioned, there is a lot of $$$$ there to support their recruiting. It actually is a logical next step for a guy like Bryce. But I sincerely hope (1) he is not a serious candidate (this year), and even if he is, (2) he will wait a bit longer to make a move.
Bryce Drew's stock is low? Hahahahahahaha. Hold on a second. Hahahahahahahahahaha. Ok, I'm good.
I would say "lower than at this time last year", yes. Wouldn't you?
(And if you don't think yearly swings are significant, ask Andy Enfield. And no, that's not an Amanda Marcum joke.)
If the dude interviewed with an SEC school, he's going to leave some day, but only for a major conference team.
And, no, what with UConn et al. looking to move elsewhere, the AAC isn't at that level. It'd be like getting a nicer house in Miller Park or Beach, ca. 1966.
(Plus he's not going to leave for a Presbyterian school. : )
Quote from: Eaglebackr on April 13, 2014, 09:17:18 PM
Geez, talk about whistling through the graveyard.
Some of you guys thinking a coach worth his salt like Bryce might not at least CONSIDER leaving the bright lights of Valparaiso, IN for the balmy environs of the 46th-largest city in America are delusional.
And, equating the AAC to the Horizon League is simply comical. Look at the top five teams in that league this season: UConn, Louisville, Cincinnati, Memphis, and SMU. Who finished at the top of the Horizon this year: some commuter school in Michigan?
For the record, Tulsa is going to pay somewhere between $750,000 to $1 million a year for their next coach. How is Valpo going to counter that offer? By playing the "Bryce-please-don't-deprive-your-parents-of-their-grandbaby!" card? Classic!!
NOT EVERY COACH IS A LIFER LIKE HOMER DREW.
MOST ARE MORE LIKE SCOTT DREW.
COACHES MOVE ON TO OTHER JOBS.
YOUR NEXT COACH WILL LEAVE FOR ANOTHER JOB SOME DAY, TOO.
THAT'S LIFE IN COLLEGE BASKETBALL - DEAL WITH IT.
Speaking of which, I don't see Scott Sutton's name being thrown around for the Tulsa job. Why not? He has 14 years of experience as head coach, a good career coaching record, and he's still a young guy. ORU and Tulsa are 8 miles apart. All he has to do is pack up his office and unpack it 15 minutes later. He doesn't have to move his family. Tulsa can save a ton of relocation money. He can keep whoever he wants from Tulsa's staff and take whoever he wants from ORU's staff without uprooting anyone. He's recruited the that region for years and has to be highly networked with high school and AAU coaches. Seems like the perfect win-win.
Very good point. Enfield and his model wife are in LA trying to get the USC basketball program to a competitive level. It will take some time - USC has always been a football school and they compete with UCLA.
Guys, Bryce is a decent coach, but there are others who are rising up too. Billy Donlon will not be at Wright St. for much longer.
The Tulsa job is a decent opportunity but I doubt Bryce will be coaching there next year.
Quote from: wh on April 14, 2014, 12:27:40 AM
Speaking of which, I don't see Scott Sutton's name being thrown around for the Tulsa job. Why not? He has 14 years of experience as head coach, a good career coaching record, and he's still a young guy. ORU and Tulsa are 8 miles apart. All he has to do is pack up his office and unpack it 15 minutes later. He doesn't have to move his family. Tulsa can save a ton of relocation money. He can keep whoever he wants from Tulsa's staff and take whoever he wants from ORU's staff without uprooting anyone. He's recruited the that region for years and has to be highly networked with high school and AAU coaches. Seems like the perfect win-win.
Why take a Sutton when you can get a Drew? ;)
Quote from: usc4valpo on April 13, 2014, 08:07:30 PM
That being said, I am suprised they are looking at Bryce Drew right now as his coaching stock is currently low.
You seem to have really good instincts for stocks...I have a whole bunch of stock in Enron you might want to gobble up. PM me if interested!!
If he's offered he better take it. As much as people want to get offended his stock IS low. No telling when it's going to go up again with this team.
Quote from: hoopfan22 on April 14, 2014, 08:38:22 AMNo telling when it's going to go up again with this team.
um...when they start winning everything the next three years would be a safe bet.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on April 14, 2014, 09:05:36 AM
Quote from: hoopfan22 on April 14, 2014, 08:38:22 AMNo telling when it's going to go up again with this team.
um...when they start winning everything the next three years would be a safe bet.
Until then, the stock is down, and that's fine with me.
Bryce's stock right now is about the same as it was last year. His value is in his family and legacy with the NCAA tourney/NBA. Homer and Scott's success pushes Bryce's name up more so than a 20ish win season. Granted a win in the tourney would push it up even more, but until then (as long ad Valpo stays competitive), he'll keep drawing interest from schools like Tulsa. Tulsa would be a step up for Bryce, there's no denying that, and would make for a great stepping stone job, but at Valpo he has incredible stability, is beloved by all, and has very little pressure.
If I was a Tulsa fan, I'd be slow to anoint Bryce just because of his family ties, but at the same time, would be intrigued by his name recognition and his early success at a small private school in a conference full of large public schools.
The stock being down and the stock being LOW are two totally different things. Of course it isn't as high as it was coming off a 26 win season and an NCAA tourney appearance. Saying Bryce Drew's stock is LOW is, well, idiotic.
Quote from: a3uge on April 14, 2014, 09:57:17 AM
Bryce's stock right now is about the same as it was last year. His value is in his family and legacy with the NCAA tourney/NBA. Homer and Scott's success pushes Bryce's name up more so than a 20ish win season. Granted a win in the tourney would push it up even more, but until then (as long ad Valpo stays competitive), he'll keep drawing interest from schools like Tulsa. Tulsa would be a step up for Bryce, there's no denying that, and would make for a great stepping stone job, but at Valpo he has incredible stability, is beloved by all, and has very little pressure.
If I was a Tulsa fan, I'd be slow to anoint Bryce just because of his family ties, but at the same time, would be intrigued by his name recognition and his early success at a small private school in a conference full of large public schools.
If family ties were that important, as stated earlier, Scott Sutton would be a better choice. The Sutton name in Oklahoma is much bigger than the Drew's.
Bryce isn't leaving for Tulsa. As many have pointed out Tulsa is a similar school, in basketball terms to Valpo, so it wouldn't be much of an upgrade for him. He'd be moving away from all of his family, I would imagine his brother Scott, would be the closest family down in Waco.
Unlike most coaches, Bryce has very strong ties to Valparaiso, both the city and the university. He grew up here, was the high-school star, played for his dad, was the star of the team once again. After his pro career, he coached under his dad, took over for his dad and brought the team back to the tournament. Bryce is a beloved figure in Valparaiso. He isn't going to leave for some third-tier city in Oklahoma, where he has no connections to.
If Bryce does leave, it'll be to a program that is a definite upgrade from a mid-major school, like his brother did going to Baylor in the Big 12. Tulsa isn't that much of an upgrade. I would imagine if he were to leave he'd go to the B1G or Big 12 or a similar conference, not a similar mid-major school that isn't much different than Valpo.
And I'm sure anyone at Tulsa looking for a coach did a simple Google search to find out why Valpo dropped to a .500 record - any team that loses 5 starting seniors is going to see a drop in performance. So when Mercer is hovering around .500 next year, would Bob Hoffman's stock be down/low? I think Bryce's year WITH the 5 seniors is more relevant than anything that happened last year.
If you look at Tulsa's board, Drew seems to be their fans most desirable coach, with Bob Hoffman coming in a distant second. I know this board likes to prop Bryce up to Wooden status sometimes and then drag him down when he's not, but I do think Bryce would be a great hire for Tulsa. This isn't drinking the Kool-Aid or whatever, unless you think the Tulsa fans have drank the Valpo Kool-Aid as well. Its not the job for Oral Roberts, and its not the job for Oklahoma State. It's a small private university that's smaller than Valpo in a pretty good conference. Its a step up, but its still within his league.
Quote from: ARCInsider on April 14, 2014, 09:58:19 AM
The stock being down and the stock being LOW are two totally different things. Of course it isn't as high as it was coming off a 26 win season and an NCAA tourney appearance. Saying Bryce Drew's stock is LOW is, well, idiotic.
I would think "low" would be appropriate, as in "low as opposed to where it should be". He may have been overvalued last year, and maybe under- this year. We'll see over the next few years where the market rate should be set.
(Speaking of the Homer-to-Bryce, anyone else happen to be reminded of VHS when Bob Miller retired from his perennial state champion band in 1994, and Dan Pritchett kept winning for a couple years, then had some harder times thereafter?
Nope? Just me? Figured.)
Quote from: classof2014 on April 14, 2014, 10:16:22 AM
Bryce isn't leaving for Tulsa. As many have pointed out Tulsa is a similar school, in basketball terms to Valpo, so it wouldn't be much of an upgrade for him. He'd be moving away from all of his family, I would imagine his brother Scott, would be the closest family down in Waco.
Unlike most coaches, Bryce has very strong ties to Valparaiso, both the city and the university. He grew up here, was the high-school star, played for his dad, was the star of the team once again. After his pro career, he coached under his dad, took over for his dad and brought the team back to the tournament. Bryce is a beloved figure in Valparaiso. He isn't going to leave for some third-tier city in Oklahoma, where he has no connections to.
If Bryce does leave, it'll be to a program that is a definite upgrade from a mid-major school, like his brother did going to Baylor in the Big 12. Tulsa isn't that much of an upgrade. I would imagine if he were to leave he'd go to the B1G or Big 12 or a similar conference, not a similar mid-major school that isn't much different than Valpo.
The road from Tulsa to a major program could be easier than the road from Valpo to a major program. But I don't think Bryce takes this job even if offered. He generally seems happy at Valpo, so much so that he signed a long term contract knowing full well that other schools would be knocking at his door.
ok, the wrong word. It is down. Cripes, I was not a liberal arts major.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on April 14, 2014, 11:11:39 AM
Quote from: ARCInsider on April 14, 2014, 09:58:19 AM
The stock being down and the stock being LOW are two totally different things. Of course it isn't as high as it was coming off a 26 win season and an NCAA tourney appearance. Saying Bryce Drew's stock is LOW is, well, idiotic.
I would think "low" would be appropriate, as in "low as opposed to where it should be". He may have been overvalued last year, and maybe under- this year. We'll see over the next few years where the market rate should be set.
(Speaking of the Homer-to-Bryce, anyone else happen to be reminded of VHS when Bob Miller retired from his perennial state champion band in 1994, and Dan Pritchett kept winning for a couple years, then had some harder times thereafter?
Nope? Just me? Figured.)
Low compared to who? Among young coaches who could be available, wouldn't his stock be high?
I'm not sure what in his past leads anyone to believe he would consider leaving for this job or just about any other. He is at a place that wants him, has job security (pretty much for as long as he wants to coach), just signed a 10 year extension (I know this doesn't set anything in stone, but I bet there is a big buyout clause), and has a fantastic young core of players.
If he is going to leave I hope it is before someone picks off Coach Powell so he can fill the position from within.
Don't want to sound like Panther U, but I have news from a source that Drew is safe at Valpo. Everyone can breath. Drew remains.
Even if Bryce left, Valpo is a desireable job for a coach on the rise in the lower ranks, or for an Assistant at a BCS school who wants a mid-major HC job for a few years, to get that bigger job down the line. We are in a much better position than our conference mates in regards to name recognition, and have winning teams just about every year. I don't see Bryce leaving for a Tulsa, it will be a better name in a few years.
It's not official that he's staying until I read something like this:
(http://i.imgur.com/wabCScZ.png)
Quote from: ARCInsider on April 14, 2014, 11:18:05 AMLow compared to who? Among young coaches who could be available, wouldn't his stock be high?
Compared to where he was last year as a coach with a team in the Dance. You don't compare a stock to another stock, you compare it to itself; no one says "company A is a higher value than company B! let's buy it!"
Quote from: oklahomamick on April 14, 2014, 11:23:33 AMI have news from a source that Drew is safe at Valpo.
Well, only because VUPD has really stepped it up under Asst. Chief Garber.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on April 14, 2014, 11:53:33 AM
Quote from: ARCInsider on April 14, 2014, 11:18:05 AMLow compared to who? Among young coaches who could be available, wouldn't his stock be high?
Compared to where he was last year as a coach with a team in the Dance. You don't compare a stock to another stock, you compare it to itself; no one says "company A is a higher value than company B! let's buy it!"
Quote from: oklahomamick on April 14, 2014, 11:23:33 AMI have news from a source that Drew is safe at Valpo.
Well, only because VUPD has really stepped it up under Asst. Chief Garber.
(http://i.imgur.com/iUR4w44.gif)
Quote from: a3uge on April 14, 2014, 11:38:14 AM
It's not official that he's staying until I read something like this:
(http://i.imgur.com/wabCScZ.png)
Lol One of the funniest posts I've seen in a long time.
Jimmy - we're laughing with you buddy, not at you. I read your blog and enjoy it. :)
Just so you know I was going to "like" your fake tweet until I saw this. ;)
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on April 14, 2014, 11:59:48 AM
Just so you know I was going to "like" your fake tweet until I saw this. ;)
Admittedly it was better than the potential "Family Ties" quip I set you up for.
That .gif is AMAZING a3uge...love it.
I think many are looking at the desirability (or lack thereof) of the Tulsa job from the wrong perspective. Moving to the AAC without a doubt gives the Tulsa job greater exposure, better tournament access, and a bigger payday...to argue any of those points is foolish and unproductive.
Where the Tulsa job loses much of its luster to me is after seeing what happened to our friends from Indianapolis during their first season in the Big East. I have no idea how the 2014-15 Tulsa depth chart compares to Butler's this season, but I think it's a safe bet that Tulsa is destined to take some major lumps in its first season (or more) of AAC play. Playing in a league with the defending national champion (UConn), and high profile programs like Memphis, Cincy, and (now) SMU will do that to you. This is a significant step-up in competition for a school with only one tourney appearance in the last decade.
For me to leave a job where I am nearly unfirable for a job where I'm destined to lose a lot of games over the next few seasons will take a major commitment of guaranteed cash. Bryce needs to be very calculating as to where and when he makes the move away from Valpo because if you make the jump and wind up getting fired, you're probably not going to get a second chance. If you don't believe me, just ask Gary Waters.
Whoa, whoa, whoa! Let's not call SMU a high profile program until they show any type of sustained success. One season does not a top program make ;)
Quote from: valpotx on April 14, 2014, 01:38:10 PMWhoa, whoa, whoa! Let's not call SMU a high profile program until they show any type of sustained success. One season does not a top program make ;)
Any program with Larry Brown on the bench qualifies in my book.
not to mention, SMU has an insane amount of cash to build a great program. How SMU uses their spending is another issue...
Note that the Tulsa basketball program has had 3 previous coaches who have gone on to bigger successes, such as winning the NCAA title. There is obviously satisfaction being a champion in a sport, and perhaps this job is a stepping stone to bigger things.
Quote from: a3uge on April 14, 2014, 09:57:17 AM
Bryce's stock right now is about the same as it was last year. His value is in his family and legacy with the NCAA tourney/NBA. Homer and Scott's success pushes Bryce's name up more so than a 20ish win season. Granted a win in the tourney would push it up even more, but until then (as long ad Valpo stays competitive), he'll keep drawing interest from schools like Tulsa. Tulsa would be a step up for Bryce, there's no denying that, and would make for a great stepping stone job, but at Valpo he has incredible stability, is beloved by all, and has very little pressure.
If I was a Tulsa fan, I'd be slow to anoint Bryce just because of his family ties, but at the same time, would be intrigued by his name recognition and his early success at a small private school in a conference full of large public schools.
Absolutely spot on. Coaches are not just graded on their past years wins and losses but by a myriad of factors. Some would say that Bryce did a better job coaching this year with 4 freshman playing significant minutes than he did last year with 5 Seniors starting. Bryce has a very high appeal to a niche market of schools along with a broader appeal to many others. I would add one more "value" to his list and that would be an ability to evaluate and recruit talent, as was shown with this years freshman class.
Quote from: FWalum on April 14, 2014, 02:12:32 PMCoaches are not just graded on their past years wins and losses but by a myriad of factors.
While I would like to believe this, my friend, there are a plethora of names that suggest otherwise. Enfield, Groce, Pearl, everyone that ever coached Xavier on a run, etc.
Just like the girl in HS that, once she suddenly got skinny, was no longer graded by how she looked in junior high...and was no longer seen with the boys she ran with then, either.
Do A.D.s look at more than just hot names? Of course.
Do they take into consideration who are the hot names at the time? Of course they do...they're far easier to sell.
Quote from: Dave_2010 on April 14, 2014, 01:44:38 PM
Quote from: valpotx on April 14, 2014, 01:38:10 PMWhoa, whoa, whoa! Let's not call SMU a high profile program until they show any type of sustained success. One season does not a top program make ;)
Any program with Larry Brown on the bench qualifies in my book.
You obviously haven't followed SMU sports in the last few decades ;). Yes, SMU has a ton of money to work with, but that doesn't mean anything, as they have ALWAYS had that money in the last 20 years, and have ALWAYS had one of the top areas to recruit from for any sports talent, being in the DFW area. Not to mention, it is rare to find an SMU alum that you want to speak with for more than 15 minutes. Think Ivy League attitude, without the Ivy League credentials ;).
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on April 14, 2014, 02:30:22 PM
Quote from: FWalum on April 14, 2014, 02:12:32 PMCoaches are not just graded on their past years wins and losses but by a myriad of factors.
While I would like to believe this, my friend, there are a plethora of names that suggest otherwise. Enfield, Groce, Pearl, everyone that ever coached Xavier on a run, etc.
Just like the girl in HS that, once she suddenly got skinny, was no longer graded by how she looked in junior high...and was no longer seen with the boys she ran with then, either.
Do A.D.s look at more than just hot names? Of course.
Do they take into consideration who are the hot names at the time? Of course they do...they're far easier to sell.
I'll give you Enfield...but Groce and Pearl are horrible examples. Groce was highly successful at Ohio for four years and had the assistant coach pedigree of Ohio St and NC St. Pearl was insanely successful at both Southern Indiana and Milwaukee before moving to Tennessee. Pearl had 12 20 win seasons before Tennessee came calling.
Quote from: ARCInsider on April 14, 2014, 03:53:30 PM
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on April 14, 2014, 02:30:22 PM
Quote from: FWalum on April 14, 2014, 02:12:32 PMCoaches are not just graded on their past years wins and losses but by a myriad of factors.
While I would like to believe this, my friend, there are a plethora of names that suggest otherwise. Enfield, Groce, Pearl, everyone that ever coached Xavier on a run, etc.
Just like the girl in HS that, once she suddenly got skinny, was no longer graded by how she looked in junior high...and was no longer seen with the boys she ran with then, either.
Do A.D.s look at more than just hot names? Of course.
Do they take into consideration who are the hot names at the time? Of course they do...they're far easier to sell.
I'll give you Enfield...but Groce and Pearl are horrible examples. Groce was highly successful at Ohio for four years and had the assistant coach pedigree of Ohio St and NC St. Pearl was insanely successful at both Southern Indiana and Milwaukee before moving to Tennessee. Pearl had 12 20 win seasons before Tennessee came calling.
And Andy Enfield had that hot wife, so it's not like he got that job on based on something trivial like his overall coaching record.
But do any of them get those jobs without the tourney run? That's what you have to answer in the affirmative in order to refute the point, and I don't believe you can.
Put another way, then why did it take each of them until that point to get a bigger job? It all happened RIGHT after their "one shining moment". Stock soared, they sold high.
Homer was a good coach before '98 happened. But how often were they calling him before vs. after?
Thank God Scott had that big tourney run or he would have never latched on at Baylor...wait...
Josh Pastner of Memphis also comes to mind.
Obviously a tourney run doesn't hurt in getting some recognition and is a "proof" of success...but as was said earlier, it is one of many factors.
Somehow I knew you'd try to come back with that.
I think we can all agree that the Baylor situation at that time was, ahem, a pretty special case. If you want to find another team where drug dealing and murder and coverup had gotten the previous coach fired, go ahead and I'll concede.
Besides, it doesn't prove your point, which is that good coaches get jobs because they are good. Scott had all of one year under his belt.
Good coaches get jobs because not only are they good, at the right time, they have success that puts them ahead of the zillion OTHER good coaches also out there. If they didn't need an NCAA run to send their stock higher, then they would have gotten the job anyway.
To clinch the argument, look at all these Tulsa coaches. Self took Tulsa to the Elite 8; left for Illinois. Speaking of, Tubby knocked off the Illini in the Dance and moved on to Georgia.
The contrary position to mine is that it's basically coincidence that all these coaches get promotions after a tourney run.
Note I'm not saying that said tourney runs MAGICALLY make these coaches better.
Simply, it's what people in a highly competitive field need: a discernible, tangible edge. It's not just "one of many"...it's probably the biggest thing. Should it be? I don't know.
But if the goal is to WIN the thing...shouldn't you go with a coach that has had success there?
Craig Neal- New Mexico
Scott Drew- Baylor
Josh Pastner- Memphis
Chris Collins- Northwestern
Kevin Ollie- UCONN (National champs, I think)
Frank Martin- Kansas State (since moved on)
Danny Manning- Tulsa (we know his deal)
Anyways...enough on this topic...but that's a list of high D1 jobs that recently went to coaches with no tourney run or even head coaching experience.
Quote from: ARCInsider on April 14, 2014, 04:47:27 PMKevin Ollie- UCONN (National champs, I think)
Frank Martin- Kansas State (since moved on)
um...both of those are like citing Gerald Ford as a support for the argument "you can get elected president out of the House of Representatives!"
Quote from: ARCInsider on April 14, 2014, 04:47:27 PMCraig Neal- New Mexico
Josh Pastner- Memphis
...and those are like citing John Tyler and Millard Fillmore as "they were the PRESIDENT!" :)
Scott Drew had one year as head coach at Valpo.
"Thanks for all of your examples, but none of those count."
Not enjoying these Drew-to-Tulsa rumors. No question TU would be a step up. Wonder why Drew hasn't squelched this rumor already if there was nothing to it. With each passing day it seems more likely there is some fire underneath all this smoke.
Paul
Quote from: 78crusader on April 14, 2014, 09:53:50 PM
Wonder why Drew hasn't squelched this rumor already if there was nothing to it. With each passing day it seems more likely there is some fire underneath all this smoke.
Paul
Didn't quite work that way for Shaka, and it was even reported on 3 news stations here in Milwaukee that he was leaving.
From the NWI Times:
http://www.nwitimes.com/blogs/sports/valparaiso-university/ (http://www.nwitimes.com/blogs/sports/valparaiso-university/)
Nice article from one of our very own...
Quote from: 78crusader on April 14, 2014, 09:53:50 PM
Not enjoying these Drew-to-Tulsa rumors. No question TU would be a step up. Wonder why Drew hasn't squelched this rumor already if there was nothing to it. With each passing day it seems more likely there is some fire underneath all this smoke.
Paul
Relax....My source told me Bryce will not be coming home to Tulsa. He is currently on the TU basketball staff and just got promoted as Danny left. We texted yesterday and he confirmed that Bryce is safe at Valpo. The source in time will most likely be the next head coach at TU the next go around, and should be. He's just not ready yet. I'm not getting this from a fan forum or the Tulsa World. I got it from a friend that is on the staff.
Thanks, Mick. That's quality reporting right there. (Helps that I like the result though too.)
Obviously the story had little to no merit, as it acknowledged like half a dozen bigger names that were already known to be candidates, and even admitted itself to be highly speculative.
It's funny because stories like this always reveal more about us--each of us and who we are--than about Bryce or the University of Tulsa, etc.
The one job I think would be perfect for Bryce in a few years is TCU, if it ever comes available again. They are absolutely terrible at basketball, even taking LSU's HC a few seasons ago with little success so far. It is a faith-based university (where I received my MBA ;)), has a TON of money, is in the Big 12, and is in the recruiting hotbed for all sports, in DFW (Fort Worth). If you look at their all-time basketball records, you have to go back to the Lee Nailon days for any real success, and I know you Indiana residents love hearing his name. He can put his stamp on a program, in the exact same way that Scott has done at Baylor. It would also allow Homer and Janet to move down to Texas, as Fort Worth and Waco are within a few hours of each other.
http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/college/valparaiso-university/bryce-drew-to-remain-with-crusaders-putting-to-rest-interview/article_5dae86a6-db2c-5613-a93c-c7593770d42a.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/college/valparaiso-university/bryce-drew-to-remain-with-crusaders-putting-to-rest-interview/article_5dae86a6-db2c-5613-a93c-c7593770d42a.html)
End of thread.
Good job Paul Oren.
Sounds like there were a lot of media people out there looking to get a career at Fox News.
Valpo is very fortunate that Bryce Drew has a genuine passion for his alma mater. He should have some decent team in the next couple of years as the recruits have serious potential.
Also, family to him is more important than moving up in the coaching ranks, which I have to respect. In addition, there will be "step-up" coaching opportunities for him in the upcoming years, so rest assured that these coaching candidate posts are not ending.
Quote from: Valpo89 on April 15, 2014, 10:28:29 AM
http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/college/valparaiso-university/bryce-drew-to-remain-with-crusaders-putting-to-rest-interview/article_5dae86a6-db2c-5613-a93c-c7593770d42a.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/college/valparaiso-university/bryce-drew-to-remain-with-crusaders-putting-to-rest-interview/article_5dae86a6-db2c-5613-a93c-c7593770d42a.html)
End of thread.
Good job Paul Oren.
If it wasn't Bryce saying it, I would just assume the quotes were typical coach-speak. He never flat out says, "I'm not leaving."
(I doubt he's leaving.)
I doubt Bryce Drew will pull a Nick Saban though!!
Or a Lou Saban, for those a little older...
Quote from: usc4valpo on April 15, 2014, 10:52:33 AM
Sounds like there were a lot of media people out there looking to get a career at Fox News.
(http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2004/11/02/national/networks.span.jpg)
Bryce could have put this Tulsa rumor to bed on the first day it surfaced, but for whatever reason he chose not to. Reportedly, the Times and PT left phone and text messages over multiple days, yet for some reason Bryce chose not to respond to them. Finally, he made a statement today (one clearly open to interpretation), but only after being directly confronted by Oren at an early morning workout at the ARC.
IMO this is a strange sequence of events for a guy who supposedly isn't interested in going anywhere, especially considering that we are in the midst of a critical recruiting period in which we are looking for key additions to the program. I know that if it were me and I was totally committed to staying where I was, I would be in touch with our beat reporters about 30 seconds after learning of the rumor to squelch it. And yet, Bryce chose not to.
Does this leave anyone besides me wondering what Bryce's true intentions are?
Quote from: wh on April 15, 2014, 05:16:53 PM
Bryce could have put this Tulsa rumor to bed on the first day it surfaced, but for whatever reason he chose not to. Reportedly, the Times and PT left phone and text messages over multiple days, yet for some reason Bryce chose not to respond to them. Finally, he made a statement today (one clearly open to interpretation), but only after being directly confronted by Oren at an early morning workout at the ARC.
IMO this is a strange sequence of events for a guy who supposedly isn't interested in going anywhere, especially considering that we are in the midst of a critical recruiting period in which we are looking for key additions to the program. I know that if it were me and I was totally committed to staying where I was, I would be in touch with our beat reporters about 30 seconds after learning of the rumor to squelch it. And yet, Bryce chose not to.
Does this leave anyone besides me wondering what Bryce's true intentions are?
Because everyone has a price. Even Shaka Smart. He responded the way every coach would, and responded the same way Shaka Smart did with both the UCLA and Marquette job rumors. Bryce could be using these other jobs as leverage for Valpo to up his salary, to invest more in the program, or for future jobs down the road. I don't think anyone would say that Shaka isn't completely invested in VCU, and I personally think Bryce is still 100% committed to Valpo. At least for now.
I'm not going to hold much stock in Bryce not texting back Gorches or someone like that, but I don't blame him for seeing what's out there.
Not sure how reliable the sources are for this, but report is that Bryce turned down an offer from Tulsa.
[tweet]456229926640037888[/tweet]
(http://i61.tinypic.com/qxugt0.jpg)
If true, it says he has had at least 2 direct conversations with Tulsa representatives - 1 to receive the offer and a 2nd to reject it.
At least you all can rest easy until next year around this time.
Everything you ever wanted to know about Bryce and Tulsa, interviews in Chicago, the whole 9 yards
By Paul Oren
http://www.nwitimes.com/blogs/sports/valparaiso-university/inside-the-tulsa-tip/article_06260df6-c4df-11e3-884a-0019bb2963f4.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/blogs/sports/valparaiso-university/inside-the-tulsa-tip/article_06260df6-c4df-11e3-884a-0019bb2963f4.html)
Till next time...
For those of us who have been hoping that what Bryce said after he signed a new 10 year contract about wanting to stay at Valpo for the long haul was more than just standard "coach speak," I think we have have our answer. After serious looks at Mississippi State and Tulsa 2 years ago and now Tulsa again, it seems abundantly clear that Bryce leaving is just a matter of time. Not there's anything wrong with that. Most of us spend our entire careers chasing fame and fortune at some level. I guess I just naively thought that Bryce may somehow be different - a romanticist, a chip off the old Homer block, or something like that. Oh well, time to get back to the real world.
wh - I liked your comments and I learned much from Paul's article. The issue today, not just in sports but in business at a broader perspective, is there is a lack of dedication and loyalty between the employee and the company.
In the 60's and early 70's, for the most part there was genuine committment and strong working relationships between the employer and employee. The employer would take care of its employees and vice-versa. Layoffs and short-term profits were not the priority. Employees were not jumping from company to company. When times were a little rough or sales were a little down, the company would not get rid of employees.
Today it is the opposite. There is less true committment between the company and its employees. There is less patience for positive results and profits. Very rarely do you see an employee stay with the same company for the entire career. If profits are not high, either reduce workforce and compensate them low. Make sure the CEO salaries escalate.
Now to relate to sports: few schools and professional teams have a long patience level. Valpo is the exception to this, not the rule (sometimes they are too patient - look at Tom Smith for 8 years and how they handled the Dale Carlson football situation). At football powerhouses like Alabama or Tennessee, a couple of 8-4 seasons will get you out the door. For basketball at USC, where they have not had great success, they will give Andy Enfield 3 years, and if they are not competitive or in the tournament, he and his trophy model wife will be gone. Also, if a coach turns around a program from the dumpster, the school and its supporters will expect more, and if more is not met within a certain time, then his job is in jeopardy.
IMO, Bryce will leave Valpo and find a higher profile job and the right place at the right time. And he would not be a traitor - that's how the American work experince is today. I think if all of us saw a better opportunity that would improve our quality of life, we would at least have to consider it.
Quote from: usc4valpo on April 16, 2014, 08:15:41 AM
wh - I liked your comments and I learned much from Paul's article. ................. [Me too]
IMO, Bryce will leave Valpo and find a higher profile job and the right place at the right time. And he would not be a traitor - that's how the American work experience is today. I think if all of us saw a better opportunity that would improve our quality of life, we would at least have to consider it.
Agree on all accounts. But improved quality of life may not be synonymous with moving up the corporate or athletic ladder or exponential salary increases. Sometimes less is more. It depends on the individual. I see in this Bryce scenario a great deal of care being taken by him to make sure his next move is an improvement in all phases of his and his family's life -- not just chasing the glitter of a high profile coaching position.
Yes indeed - quality of life is measured by individual ctiteria and importance. Some folks like moving up the corporate ladder. Some pursue money. Some pursue power. Some pursue enjoying what you do. Some pursue work-life balance.
The one thing I'd hate to see happen to a guy like Bryce is if he were to jump to a bigger program in the B1G, Big 12, Pac 12, etc.. and the team is unsuccessful in his first 3 to 4 seasons and Bryce is subsequently fired. Chances are he'll end back in a Mid-Major program, perhaps a program that is not at the same quality as Valpo. Obviously if he's successful at the next level, it'll do great things for him but the next level is extremely competitive when it comes to coaches and patience is no longer a virtue up their.
So let's look at the positives at staying at Valpo
- Job is secure
- He has been successful
- He is a beloved figure in town
- He has strong roots in Valpo
- Much of his family lives in the area
- Quality Mid-Major prgram
Negative at staying at Valpo
- No matter what we do we will never be consistently at the level of the Kansas's, Kentucky's, Ohio State's, etc...
- If the basketball program takes a turn for the worse his chances of moving up decrease drastically
- Less money
- Mid-major program
Positives of going to a bigger program
- More money
- Better opportunity to win a national championship
- Much more recognizable
- If successful perhaps he can get into the NBA as a coach
- Top-tier recruits
- Better facilities
Negatives of going to a bigger program
- Less secure
- More likely to get fired
- Perhaps end up at a lower level mid-major program
- Media coverage
- Harsh world
Staying at Valpo has its positives and negatives and so does going to a bigger program. If he waits perhaps that door will close if Valpo doesn't get back to the form it was in 2011/2012 and 2012/2013. As many know those big programs are high risk high reward, if he's successful he can truly become a basketball god but if not they'll leave him on the side of the road and move on. I'm glad he's at least staying around for another year and who knows perhaps he does stay here for the full 10 years of his contract. It can't hurt to shop around as you never know when that perfect opportunity will present itself and it's obvious that Bryce isn't leaving unless it's a perfect opportunity. Since he has had a chance to go to bigger programs and has chosen to stay at Valpo.
I will say that it's nice to see Valpo coaches with aspirations beyond just being the head coach at VU. A desire for career advancement motivates coaches to perform at their absolute peak. What drives Bryce right now is the same thing that drove Tracy Woodson to resurrect a baseball program long left for dead. I presume the same is true for Jordan Stevens and the softball program, and I'm hoping Brian Schmack and Dave Cecchini fall in to the same boat as well (no reason to believe they don't as of yet).
Contrast this to our previous two head football coaches. For both Adams and Carlson, Valpo seemed like the reward a career of hard work. Being content in the position you have is the easiest way to kill professional development and the development of your program.
As for Bryce, opportunities to move will always be on the table. His basketball teams will continue to meet and exceed expectations because his is driven and a damn good basketball coach. I'm sure he has a short-list of qualities for his ideal job that (for reasons enumerated earlier in this thread and others) Tulsa clearly didn't meet.
Quote from: Dave_2010 on April 16, 2014, 11:46:20 AMFor both Adams and Carlson, Valpo seemed like the reward a career of hard work. Being content in the position you have is the easiest way to kill professional development and the development of your program.
First, I agree with the thoughts you have shared, with one exception, excerpted here: I don't think your second sentence necessarily follows your first. I would think getting the job you've always wanted would inspire you to work to keep it, because if you screw this one chance up, it's back to the salt mines. At least, that's my take on human nature.
Further, although I know neither Adams nor Carlson, my perspective is certainly not that they sat back contentedly rubbing their bellies instead of working at getting better. I mean, obviously they failed; I'm not sure that was the reason.
And, 2014, good analysis--Todd Lickliter comes to mind immediately as someone who jumped at the wrong opportunity.
Quote from: usc4valpo on April 16, 2014, 08:15:41 AM
wh - I liked your comments and I learned much from Paul's article. The issue today, not just in sports but in business at a broader perspective, is there is a lack of dedication and loyalty between the employee and the company.
In the 60's and early 70's, for the most part there was genuine committment and strong working relationships between the employer and employee. The employer would take care of its employees and vice-versa. Layoffs and short-term profits were not the priority. Employees were not jumping from company to company. When times were a little rough or sales were a little down, the company would not get rid of employees.
Today it is the opposite. There is less true committment between the company and its employees. There is less patience for positive results and profits. Very rarely do you see an employee stay with the same company for the entire career. If profits are not high, either reduce workforce and compensate them low. Make sure the CEO salaries escalate.
Now to relate to sports: few schools and professional teams have a long patience level. Valpo is the exception to this, not the rule (sometimes they are too patient - look at Tom Smith for 8 years and how they handled the Dale Carlson football situation). At football powerhouses like Alabama or Tennessee, a couple of 8-4 seasons will get you out the door. For basketball at USC, where they have not had great success, they will give Andy Enfield 3 years, and if they are not competitive or in the tournament, he and his trophy model wife will be gone. Also, if a coach turns around a program from the dumpster, the school and its supporters will expect more, and if more is not met within a certain time, then his job is in jeopardy.
IMO, Bryce will leave Valpo and find a higher profile job and the right place at the right time. And he would not be a traitor - that's how the American work experince is today. I think if all of us saw a better opportunity that would improve our quality of life, we would at least have to consider it.
I think that Bryce won't leave until he is offered a higher profile position at a school where he is comfortable sharing his faith with the fans and players. That means the state school jobs are probably out. Scott has said publicly that he would feel that he had hurt his players if he didn't make sure they knew about Jesus and what that can mean in their lives and beyond.
I guess that leaves lots of religious schools as options but would also think that Catholic schools (no offense intended Apostle) might not be a good fit either as the approach and teachings might not fit with a Bible Christian, which I believe Bryce might be. So, as valpotx pointed out, TCU might fit or perhaps a private, non-religious school who wouldn't find his faith and sharing to be an issue--maybe a Wake Forest, who knows.
Quote from: vu72 on April 16, 2014, 12:21:40 PMI guess that leaves lots of religious schools as options but would also think that Catholic schools (no offense intended Apostle) might not be a good fit either as the approach and teachings might not fit with a Bible Christian
right, because why would the people that actually WROTE and PRESERVED the Bible know anything about it?
My advice to Bryce on how to freely live his Christian faith AND have long term success as a college basketball coach:
1. Shy away from liberal, government-funded institutions of higher learning
2. Focus on opportunities in the Bible Belt
3. NEVER take a job anywhere in Michigan, especially the Detroit metroplex or anywhere else where CAIR bullies cowardice infidels.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on April 16, 2014, 01:09:06 PM
Quote from: vu72 on April 16, 2014, 12:21:40 PMI guess that leaves lots of religious schools as options but would also think that Catholic schools (no offense intended Apostle) might not be a good fit either as the approach and teachings might not fit with a Bible Christian
right, because why would the people that actually WROTE and PRESERVED the Bible know anything about it?
Wow! Good point. I had no idea Moses was a Catholic!! ;)
I think Bryce's stock rose after this season when he should he could win with a roster playing four freshmen a majority of the minutes in the season, even if our conference played some lackluster basketball all season. I mean we were predicted to finish sixth, and we actually finished fourth with our roster. I see Bryce going at some point, just not interested in speculating where he'll go.
Quote from: vu72 on April 16, 2014, 02:17:59 PMI had no idea Moses was a Catholic!
Jesus converted him on Mount Tabor, obviously
If you go by history, I think Chris Collins going to Northwestern is a bad decision. Any coach going to DePaul would also be a bad decision.
72 - USC used to be a Methodist school - would that count as a potential school Bryce could go?
Quote from: usc4valpo on April 16, 2014, 04:36:14 PMIf you go by history, I think Chris Collins going to Northwestern is a bad decision.
(http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/500x/48642080.jpg)
Quote from: usc4valpo on April 16, 2014, 04:38:21 PM72 - USC used to be a Methodist school - would that count as a potential school Bryce could go?
Yeah, for that matter one of the HS students my mother was recruiting to VU said "oh, no, I'm going to a *CHRISTIAN* school."
So good luck with that.
One comment that always sticks in my head was ML's about their being a succession plan in place. I think the comment was made after Bryce's 1st year as coach. After that public comment that ensured me that he isn't here for 10 years. But this program is Homer's baby and I have to assume that this comes into play more than you think.
The biggest threat to our basketball program is our current facilities. If you had to search for a coach the lack of commitment on facilities will hurt us big time. It is a major recruiting tool we need for future coaches and players.
Quote from: Chairback on April 16, 2014, 08:44:14 PMThe biggest threat to our basketball program is our current facilities. If you had to search for a coach the lack of commitment on facilities will hurt us big time. It is a major recruiting tool we need for future coaches and players.
There it is...I, for one, am shocked that it took until the 5th page of the thread to show up.
Quote from: usc4valpo on April 16, 2014, 04:38:21 PM
72 - USC used to be a Methodist school - would that count as a potential school Bryce could go?
Probably not. In the same way that SMU used to be Methodist, Wagner used to be Lutheran or Harvard used to be Presbyterian, the current state is what will be important to Coach Drew.
Quote from: Dave_2010 on April 16, 2014, 08:57:34 PM
Quote from: Chairback on April 16, 2014, 08:44:14 PMThe biggest threat to our basketball program is our current facilities. If you had to search for a coach the lack of commitment on facilities will hurt us big time. It is a major recruiting tool we need for future coaches and players.
There it is...I, for one, am shocked that it took until the 5th page of the thread to show up.
Let me see if I can make up for lost time...
I cannot imagine Bryce making a decade long commitment of pouring his heart and soul into men's basketball at Valparaiso University and taking the program to the next level without specific assurances from the administration (at least verbal) that the university will do its part by either significantly upgrading the ARC or building a new facility within a reasonable timeframe. If Dr. Heckler doesn't announce something within the next 12-24 months, Bryce will recognize he is being strung along and will go somewhere where he doesn't have to recruit with one hand tied behind his back.
At the moment that happens, Valparaiso University men's basketball will go into free fall - a parade of coaches without Bryce's standing and the Drew name trying to do the impossible and failing, crowds in the triple digits, wins in the single digits. Out of desperation, plans will be developed to rebuild the ARC, miraculously funds will be found that could never be found when Homer and Bryce were here, and we'll start from scratch. Somewhere about the same time Bryce's original 10-year contract was due to expire, we might see our next winning season, or at least hopes of one.
That IS our future if this administration doesn't step up and do what they know full well must be done to remain competitive - and do it soon. Just can't do it, some say, because we need this or that more important dorm or academic building followed by this or that more important dorm or academic building followed by this or that more important dorm or academic building? No problem, so long as everyone understands and is willing to accept that you can't have it both ways. The same logic that says you can't attract science students without competitive science facilities applies exactly for trying to attract quality basketball players without competitive basketball facilities. It will not happen.
The clocking is ticking...
Interesting Tulsa wrap-up story from the PT, including quotes from ml and encouraging comments from Bryce about how returning players are progressing:
http://posttrib.suntimes.com/sports/26889019-556/mens-basketball-bryce-drew-downplays-tulsa-speculation.html#.U09jK17Nqag (http://posttrib.suntimes.com/sports/26889019-556/mens-basketball-bryce-drew-downplays-tulsa-speculation.html#.U09jK17Nqag)
Valpo won't go into a free fall without Bryce. We will be fine with or without him in the future. We have a long history of being a winning program, and a place good coaches can go to in order to build up their resume for bigger jobs.
Quote from: wh on April 17, 2014, 12:23:32 AM
Interesting Tulsa wrap-up story from the PT, including quotes from ml and encouraging comments from Bryce about how returning players are progressing:
http://posttrib.suntimes.com/sports/26889019-556/mens-basketball-bryce-drew-downplays-tulsa-speculation.html#.U09jK17Nqag (http://posttrib.suntimes.com/sports/26889019-556/mens-basketball-bryce-drew-downplays-tulsa-speculation.html#.U09jK17Nqag)
Unfortunately, the notes on Nickerson and Chadwick were not as encouraging.
MLB:
QuoteAs we continue to do well, I anticipate this is going to be something that comes up all the time. I feel like I have more of an issue if people lose interest in him, because that means we're not doing well.
The man has a keen grasp.
Bryce:
QuoteHopefully our players keep playing well. If your name's ever brought up in speculation again, it means that the players are playing well.
And you could say the same about BDrew (not just doing well, but 'keen grasp'), but then again, how many coaches are as unwilling to take credit, or conversely, to reflect the glory on the people that got them there?
QuoteWe're recruiting some players heavily right now, and hopefully we'll be able to add a couple of pieces that can help our team for this year and the following years
You could read this as maybe no grad-year-transfers, or maybe one and a 'normal' transfer.
Does Bryce have a twitter? Seems like (assistant) coach twitter feeds might be good indications of transfer interest (recall last year when Brian Greene Jr. tweeted "Bryce Drew and Roger Powell are some good dudes", for instance. of course, then he signed with FGCU.)
*BONUS TO THE DISCURSUS Joe Dooley recently said this about him at FGCU's end-of-year banquet down here, probably in jest:
Quote"He'll be eligible for us next year," Dooley said of Auburn transfer guard Brian Greene, also a practice player this season. "Hopefully by then he learns how to reverse the ball. I think he's going to really help our perimeter if he can figure out how to get the ball to the other side of the floor."
72 - I was kidding about USC being a Christian school. Bryce will certainly be a bad fit there.
wh brings up some excellent points on recruiting. How strapped for cash is Valpo?
So, instead of having the best game day atmosphere in the Horizon League -- at least on those nights when the ARC is reasonably full, which unfortunately is not very often -- VU should commit huge amounts of money to a new and larger arena, which will sure look pretty but will also look (and sound) pretty empty on most nights? All for what? To impress some 17 year old kid on a recruiting visit? I'd rather have 3300 in a 5000 seat ARC, than, say, 3800 in a 7500 seat new arena. This is a university, not some training ground for future players in some goofy European basketball league. Does the university find ways to fund a new dorm or science building or library? Yep. Should those projects be given priority over a new basketball arena? Yep.
By the way, the University of Tulsa arena seats 8.355. According to the June 2012 issue of AthleticBusiness, "the arena was more than half empty for most games last season." (This was part of an article on declining attendance at many college programs.)
Paul
Quote from: 78crusader on April 17, 2014, 07:39:11 AM
So, instead of having the best game day atmosphere in the Horizon League -- at least on those nights when the ARC is reasonably full, which unfortunately is not very often -- VU should commit huge amounts of money to a new and larger arena, which will sure look pretty but will also look (and sound) pretty empty on most nights? All for what? To impress some 17 year old kid on a recruiting visit? I'd rather have 3300 in a 5000 seat ARC, than, say, 3800 in a 7500 seat new arena. This is a university, not some training ground for future players in some goofy European basketball league. Does the university find ways to fund a new dorm or science building or library? Yep. Should those projects be given priority over a new basketball arena? Yep.
By the way, the University of Tulsa arena seats 8.355. According to the June 2012 issue of AthleticBusiness, "the arena was more than half empty for most games last season." (This was part of an article on declining attendance at many college programs.)
Paul
I'm looking through this thread for the counterpoint that you are arguing. I can't seem to find anyone discussing the need to increase the capacity of the ARC or build a bigger arena. Upgraded facilities does not necessarily mean increased capacity.
No one can honestly think that the ARC, in it's current state, is perfectly suitable let alone a selling point for a D1 basketball program or it's "in demand" coaches.
Quote from: 78crusader on April 17, 2014, 07:39:11 AM
So, instead of having the best game day atmosphere in the Horizon League -- at least on those nights when the ARC is reasonably full, which unfortunately is not very often -- VU should commit huge amounts of money to a new and larger arena, which will sure look pretty but will also look (and sound) pretty empty on most nights? All for what? To impress some 17 year old kid on a recruiting visit? I'd rather have 3300 in a 5000 seat ARC, than, say, 3800 in a 7500 seat new arena. This is a university, not some training ground for future players in some goofy European basketball league. Does the university find ways to fund a new dorm or science building or library? Yep. Should those projects be given priority over a new basketball arena? Yep.
By the way, the University of Tulsa arena seats 8.355. According to the June 2012 issue of AthleticBusiness, "the arena was more than half empty for most games last season." (This was part of an article on declining attendance at many college programs.)
Paul
I know it is hard for many of you on this board to set aside your D-III athletic level thinking, but lets set it aside anyway and think outside of the box for a moment. Here is the event list for the Nutter Center from now until the end of the year:
http://www.nuttercenter.com/events.aspx (http://www.nuttercenter.com/events.aspx)
Ohio One Stop Shop Hop Apr 25, 2014 (Fri) 9:00 AM - 5:00 PM
Apr 26, 2014 (Sat) 9:00 AM - 3:00 PM
Oct 3, 2014 (Fri) 9:00 AM - 5:00 PM
Oct 4, 2014 (Sat) 9:00 AM - 3:00 PM
Jake Owen's Days of Gold Tour with Parmalee and special guest The Cadillac Three Apr 25, 2014
USTA Ohio State Baton Twirling Championships & Open Competition Apr 26, 2014 (Sat) 8:00 AM
USTA Ohio State Baton Twirling Championships & Open Competition Apr 27, 2014 (Sun) 8:00 AM
Wright State University Commencement May 3, 2014 (Sat) 10:00 AM
Time Warp Prom featuring Stranger May 3, 2014 (Sat) 8:00 PM - 12:00 AM Purchase your tickets today!
Battle for Life May 9, 2014 (Fri) 7:00 PM
First Annual Amigos Latinos Alumni Gala May 10, 2014 (Sat) 5:00 PM - 10:00 PM Register online
Miami Valley Career Technology Center Senior Recognition Ceremony May 16, 2014 (Fri) 7:00 PM
Greene County Career Center Senior Recognition Ceremony May 21, 2014 (Wed) 7:00 PM
Fairmont High School Graduation May 22, 2014 (Thu) 7:00 PM
Fairborn High School Graduation May 23, 2014 (Fri) 7:00 PM
Centerville High School Graduation May 24, 2014 (Sat) 10:00 AM
Northmont High School Graduation May 25, 2014 (Sun) 2:00 PM
Little Miami High School Graduation May 27, 2014 (Tue) 7:00 PM
Xenia High School Graduation May 28, 2014 (Wed) 7:00 PM
Stebbins High School Graduation May 29, 2014 (Thu) 7:00 PM
Franklin High School Graduation May 30, 2014 (Fri) 7:00 PM
Beavercreek High School Graduation May 31, 2014 (Sat) 9:00 AM
Miamisburg High School Graduation May 31, 2014 (Sat) 2:00 PM
Lebanon High School Graduation May 31, 2014 (Sat) 6:00 PM
Wayne High School Graduation Jun 1, 2014 (Sun) 2:00 PM
Springboro High School Graduation Jun 7, 2014 (Sat) 6:00 PM
Tecumseh High School Graduation Jun 8, 2014 (Sun) 2:00 PM
Ringling Bros. and Barnum & Bailey Circus presents BUILT TO AMAZE!
Monster Jam 2015
Lookie there...no WSU basketball.
I think the capacity and amenities of the ARC (bathrooms, locker rooms, concessions etc) have more to do with other options (like outside events--as crusaderjoe has pointed out) It will make for a better experience for the fans and perhaps draw bigger crowds. I'm still confused as to how a redesigned ARC will help attract better players.
Are the basketball facilities behind other similar institutions? We redid Hilltop to have a dedicated practice facility, we have a dedicated training facility for basketball, a new floor etc.
What improvements will draw better players to Valpo. Not trying to be difficult, but I'm wondering whether or not we are confusing fan comfort and experience with player needs. Valpo will still be located in Valpo, not Chicago. It will still snow--a lot. It will still be a small school and religious. These are the things--together with the coaches, that players look at when deciding where they want to play, not the comfort of the fans. What am I missing??
Quote from: vu72 on April 17, 2014, 09:34:58 AM
I think the capacity and amenities of the ARC (bathrooms, locker rooms, concessions etc) have more to do with other options (like outside events--as crusaderjoe has pointed out) It will make for a better experience for the fans and perhaps draw bigger crowds. I'm still confused as to how a redesigned ARC will help attract better players.
It may be that, along with a more attractive fan experience (and, hopefully, an increase in attendance), upgraded facilities (not a new arena) will be the tipping point in getting better players. When a recruit visits Resch, Nutter, UIC's Pavilion, even Loyola's Gentile Arena, he can visualize himself playing in those D-I environments. It's somewhat superficial, but if I was being recruited to play D-I BB, I'd want my surroundings to constantly reaffirm to me that this is, indeed, real D-I. Bryce has been very good at overcoming the ARC's recruiting liabilities. Imagine if that liability could be turned into an asset. The other thing that could weigh in is that a first rate ARC (not a palace) could persuade some higher profile, nationally known teams to visit instead of Valpo having to go on the road to play them. An attractive home schedule is also a recruiting inducement (especially for the mom's and dad's of local talent -- which it seems Bryce is going after).
Quote from: crusaderjoe on April 17, 2014, 09:23:36 AMQuote from: 78crusader on April 17, 2014, 07:39:11 AMSo, instead of having the best game day atmosphere in the Horizon League -- at least on those nights when the ARC is reasonably full, which unfortunately is not very often -- VU should commit huge amounts of money to a new and larger arena, which will sure look pretty but will also look (and sound) pretty empty on most nights? All for what? To impress some 17 year old kid on a recruiting visit? I'd rather have 3300 in a 5000 seat ARC, than, say, 3800 in a 7500 seat new arena. This is a university, not some training ground for future players in some goofy European basketball league. Does the university find ways to fund a new dorm or science building or library? Yep. Should those projects be given priority over a new basketball arena? Yep. By the way, the University of Tulsa arena seats 8.355. According to the June 2012 issue of AthleticBusiness, "the arena was more than half empty for most games last season." (This was part of an article on declining attendance at many college programs.) Paul
I know it is hard for many of you on this board to set aside your D-III athletic level thinking, but lets set it aside anyway and think outside of the box for a moment. Here is the event list for the Nutter Center from now until the end of the year: http://www.nuttercenter.com/events.aspx (http://www.nuttercenter.com/events.aspx) Ohio One Stop Shop Hop Apr 25, 2014 (Fri) 9:00 AM - 5:00 PM Apr 26, 2014 (Sat) 9:00 AM - 3:00 PM Oct 3, 2014 (Fri) 9:00 AM - 5:00 PM Oct 4, 2014 (Sat) 9:00 AM - 3:00 PM Jake Owen's Days of Gold Tour with Parmalee and special guest The Cadillac Three Apr 25, 2014 USTA Ohio State Baton Twirling Championships & Open Competition Apr 26, 2014 (Sat) 8:00 AM USTA Ohio State Baton Twirling Championships & Open Competition Apr 27, 2014 (Sun) 8:00 AM Wright State University Commencement May 3, 2014 (Sat) 10:00 AM Time Warp Prom featuring Stranger May 3, 2014 (Sat) 8:00 PM - 12:00 AM Purchase your tickets today! Battle for Life May 9, 2014 (Fri) 7:00 PM First Annual Amigos Latinos Alumni Gala May 10, 2014 (Sat) 5:00 PM - 10:00 PM Register online Miami Valley Career Technology Center Senior Recognition Ceremony May 16, 2014 (Fri) 7:00 PM Greene County Career Center Senior Recognition Ceremony May 21, 2014 (Wed) 7:00 PM Fairmont High School Graduation May 22, 2014 (Thu) 7:00 PM Fairborn High School Graduation May 23, 2014 (Fri) 7:00 PM Centerville High School Graduation May 24, 2014 (Sat) 10:00 AM Northmont High School Graduation May 25, 2014 (Sun) 2:00 PM Little Miami High School Graduation May 27, 2014 (Tue) 7:00 PM Xenia High School Graduation May 28, 2014 (Wed) 7:00 PM Stebbins High School Graduation May 29, 2014 (Thu) 7:00 PM Franklin High School Graduation May 30, 2014 (Fri) 7:00 PM Beavercreek High School Graduation May 31, 2014 (Sat) 9:00 AM Miamisburg High School Graduation May 31, 2014 (Sat) 2:00 PM Lebanon High School Graduation May 31, 2014 (Sat) 6:00 PM Wayne High School Graduation Jun 1, 2014 (Sun) 2:00 PM Springboro High School Graduation Jun 7, 2014 (Sat) 6:00 PM Tecumseh High School Graduation Jun 8, 2014 (Sun) 2:00 PM Ringling Bros. and Barnum & Bailey Circus presents BUILT TO AMAZE! Monster Jam 2015 Lookie there...no WSU basketball.
Tulsa Public Schools hold their graduations at the Maybee Center on the campus of Oral Roberts University.
When I heard the rumors of TU going after Bryce, I texted Shea Seals who is on staff and the all-time leading scorer in TU history. He confirmed that Bryce was safe at Valpo. TU has been a stepping stone for coaching as most mid-majors are. TU needs to hire a TU guy just like Valpo did. I hope my friend Shea will become head coach one day at TU and if he does, he will be like Bryce and turn down other jobs in order to work at his alma matta. TU needs a hometown ledgend like Valpo to avoid the coaches who are 3 years and move to a better job.
Are we amune to it just because Bryce is a home town legend? Will he be like his father and coach 15 + years at Valpo and retire at Valpo? Brad Stevens left his mid-major, Scott Drew left his mid-major and the story goes on. Will Bryce follow the majority or be like his father? Time will tell. But if theres an increased committment to b'ball and its facilities, Bryce stays and retires like his father. Can Valpo invest and get the ROI as Butler or Creighton? Why not?
mick, in terms of college, Scott didn't bleed brown and gold. He was a Butler grad, and a good recruiter of the foreign pipeline. His going to Baylor was a good move for him to create his own program from a program that needed a rebirth after a tragedy. I could see Bruce being at VU to stay.
In terms of the ARC, it needs upgrades to parts of the facility, but I see that happening after the fieldhouse has been built and the non-football, basketball, and volleyball teams have moved their training and locker rooms there. After this is done, I could see the equipment room being moved to the fieldhouse, and that space becomes a new, bigger concession stand, and then have a couple of restrooms created on the parking lot side of the ARC. I don't care if the bleachers become chairbacks, just that the necessary amenities are taken care of first.
Run, if that sequence happens as I also think it will, then the ARC becomes essentailly a BB, VB and FB facility. So that means the potential to (1) build a lower bowl of permanent chairback seats and (2) popping out the north wall for added bleacher seating to compensate for the reduction of seating below (while adding additional basement and ground floor space). Capacity would remain about what it is now or maybe increase 500 or so. That, to me, would evoke a true D-I look and feel (with the associated ammenities improvements, of course).
If that happens, MBB, WBB and VB might even have to vacate for a season and play in an alternative facility (unless temporary bleachers could be set up in the field house ??? ) Just speculating.
(http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/500x/48668186.jpg)
I'm more worried about Roger Powell leaving during the summer, than for Bryce to leave this year, as he recruited many of our current players from the Chicagoland area. I have been hoping that if Bryce leaves, that Roger would take over for a few years, to have some form of continuity.
Quote from: crusaderjoe on April 17, 2014, 09:23:36 AM
Quote from: 78crusader on April 17, 2014, 07:39:11 AM
So, instead of having the best game day atmosphere in the Horizon League -- at least on those nights when the ARC is reasonably full, which unfortunately is not very often -- VU should commit huge amounts of money to a new and larger arena, which will sure look pretty but will also look (and sound) pretty empty on most nights? All for what? To impress some 17 year old kid on a recruiting visit? I'd rather have 3300 in a 5000 seat ARC, than, say, 3800 in a 7500 seat new arena. This is a university, not some training ground for future players in some goofy European basketball league. Does the university find ways to fund a new dorm or science building or library? Yep. Should those projects be given priority over a new basketball arena? Yep.
By the way, the University of Tulsa arena seats 8.355. According to the June 2012 issue of AthleticBusiness, "the arena was more than half empty for most games last season." (This was part of an article on declining attendance at many college programs.)
Paul
I know it is hard for many of you on this board to set aside your D-III athletic level thinking, but lets set it aside anyway and think outside of the box for a moment. Here is the event list for the Nutter Center from now until the end of the year:
http://www.nuttercenter.com/events.aspx (http://www.nuttercenter.com/events.aspx)
Ohio One Stop Shop Hop Apr 25, 2014 (Fri) 9:00 AM - 5:00 PM
Apr 26, 2014 (Sat) 9:00 AM - 3:00 PM
Oct 3, 2014 (Fri) 9:00 AM - 5:00 PM
Oct 4, 2014 (Sat) 9:00 AM - 3:00 PM
Jake Owen's Days of Gold Tour with Parmalee and special guest The Cadillac Three Apr 25, 2014
USTA Ohio State Baton Twirling Championships & Open Competition Apr 26, 2014 (Sat) 8:00 AM
USTA Ohio State Baton Twirling Championships & Open Competition Apr 27, 2014 (Sun) 8:00 AM
Wright State University Commencement May 3, 2014 (Sat) 10:00 AM
Time Warp Prom featuring Stranger May 3, 2014 (Sat) 8:00 PM - 12:00 AM Purchase your tickets today!
Battle for Life May 9, 2014 (Fri) 7:00 PM
First Annual Amigos Latinos Alumni Gala May 10, 2014 (Sat) 5:00 PM - 10:00 PM Register online
Miami Valley Career Technology Center Senior Recognition Ceremony May 16, 2014 (Fri) 7:00 PM
Greene County Career Center Senior Recognition Ceremony May 21, 2014 (Wed) 7:00 PM
Fairmont High School Graduation May 22, 2014 (Thu) 7:00 PM
Fairborn High School Graduation May 23, 2014 (Fri) 7:00 PM
Centerville High School Graduation May 24, 2014 (Sat) 10:00 AM
Northmont High School Graduation May 25, 2014 (Sun) 2:00 PM
Little Miami High School Graduation May 27, 2014 (Tue) 7:00 PM
Xenia High School Graduation May 28, 2014 (Wed) 7:00 PM
Stebbins High School Graduation May 29, 2014 (Thu) 7:00 PM
Franklin High School Graduation May 30, 2014 (Fri) 7:00 PM
Beavercreek High School Graduation May 31, 2014 (Sat) 9:00 AM
Miamisburg High School Graduation May 31, 2014 (Sat) 2:00 PM
Lebanon High School Graduation May 31, 2014 (Sat) 6:00 PM
Wayne High School Graduation Jun 1, 2014 (Sun) 2:00 PM
Springboro High School Graduation Jun 7, 2014 (Sat) 6:00 PM
Tecumseh High School Graduation Jun 8, 2014 (Sun) 2:00 PM
Ringling Bros. and Barnum & Bailey Circus presents BUILT TO AMAZE!
Monster Jam 2015
Lookie there...no WSU basketball.
Valpo could build another billion dollar Barclays Center and it wouldn't get those events. Building a new arena won't attract Jake Owen. Maybe we could attract the Indiana Jr Ribbon Twirling Championship, but because it's Valparaiso, IN, a shiny new multipurpose arena will still yield minimal results.
In terms of a college basketball recruiting standpoint, I'm not sure how big of a role facilities are playing - in 2010 SIU renovated their arena ($30 million!) and their RPI has barely squeaked past 200 since. Green Bay hasn't made the tourney since they've moved in the Resch Center (the leagues best venue). The only people who seem to truly care are conference selection committees.
That's not to say we don't need to do something about the ARC. We do, or at least, we need to actually do some long term planning. We don't have any donors who give a bleep about athletics, but at the same time, it doesn't seem like the university has even tried to raise money for ARC renovations. I don't think we should go overboard with a new arena, but at the very least, we need to spruce up the ARC a bit. I don't think its a lost cause. We could get rid of that stupid track, build out the concourse a bit (by that, I mean actually have a concourse), and add proper bleachers under the home basket. Simple changes that won't cost $30 million for a new arena.
Quote from: valpotx on April 17, 2014, 11:29:09 AM
I'm more worried about Roger Powell leaving during the summer, than for Bryce to leave this year, as he recruited many of our current players from the Chicagoland area. I have been hoping that if Bryce leaves, that Roger would take over for a few years, to have some form of continuity.
Bryce Leaves, Roger Leaves. IMO. Roger leaves before bryce though. I wouldn't be shocked if he's gone this offseason.
If a new fieldhouse was built, they could renovate the ARC to be more of an arena. Right now it's like trying to fit Optimus Prime for child seats. There's only so much expansion you can do when the requirements are still a multipurpose collapsible facility.
I think the master plan hints at keeping the ARC for basketball and building a fieldhouse for practices, students, academic offices etc.
Like I said, the ARC can be renovated and still be nice. My idea has always been to tear out the track and make the seating on the bleacher side seamless to the floor, shift the court back to the bleachers and move the existing chairbacks forward. Then will the space from the old track, build a proper media box/platform as well as 3 or 4 other corporate (Family Express lol) pseudo luxury boxes. Nothing fancy, just some comfy chairs and some TVs. Eliminate the back entrance the students come in, fill that space with a tunnel or something. Not entirely sure on this. Build proper bleachers (platforms with foldable chairs) underneath the current home basket, move all concessions to a renovated concourse.
Seems to me we get pretty good recruits...maybe the lackluster facilities is more of an issue for us then it is to the recruits. I would imagine their main goal is to get good enough to play professionally somewhere. While Valpo may not have what we view as a recruitable facility we do have a pretty good track record of getting guys professional contracts (albeit overseas).
Remember all the $$ the State of Ohio poured into Cleveland State's facility. The result? There is more to a successful program than an expensive facility that seats alot of people...just ask CSU.
Quote from: vu72 on April 16, 2014, 12:21:40 PMI guess that leaves lots of religious schools as options but would also think that Catholic schools (no offense intended Apostle) might not be a good fit either as the approach and teachings might not fit with a Bible Christian, which I believe Bryce might be. So, as valpotx pointed out, TCU might fit or perhaps a private, non-religious school who wouldn't find his faith and sharing to be an issue--maybe a Wake Forest, who knows.
Wake Forest is still very much a Baptist school. Hard to mistake it as a non-religious school when, much like VU, you have this building in the middle of your campus.
(http://users.wfu.edu/burtoneg/chapel.JPG)
If Manning doesn't work out IMO this is the perfect fit for Bryce.
Quote from: valpo64 on April 17, 2014, 01:35:00 PMRemember all the $$ the State of Ohio poured into Cleveland State's facility. The result? There is more to a successful program than an expensive facility that seats alot of people...just ask CSU.
To that point, the Wolstein Center has been hemorrhaging money to the tune of $1M annually since the day it opened in 1991 (certainly since the Gund/Quicken Loans Arena opened in 94). Several years ago, the university hired Comcast Spectacor to run the arena. Little has changed since then. Things have actually gotten to the point that the university is considering tearing down the building and replacing it.
From a financial perspective, the general rule is that for an arena to break even on its operating costs, it must host approximately 200 events per year...this number does not take in to account any money used to service the construction debt either. Though this doesn't apply 100% to Valpo since any construction/renovations would be paid for largely through donations and operations would be subsidized by the university, it certainly highlights why "just build an arena" is not a viable response to every one of the athletic department's problems. In fact, it has the potential to cause more problems than it solves.
Quote from: Dave_2010 on April 17, 2014, 02:30:59 PM
Quote from: valpo64 on April 17, 2014, 01:35:00 PMRemember all the $$ the State of Ohio poured into Cleveland State's facility. The result? There is more to a successful program than an expensive facility that seats alot of people...just ask CSU.
To that point, the Wolstein Center has been hemorrhaging money to the tune of $1M annually since the day it opened in 1991 (certainly since the Gund/Quicken Loans Arena opened in 94). Several years ago, the university hired Comcast Spectacor to run the arena. Little has changed since then. Things have actually gotten to the point that the university is considering tearing down the building and replacing it.
From a financial perspective, the general rule is that for an arena to break even on its operating costs, it must host approximately 200 events per year...this number does not take in to account any money used to service the construction debt either. Though this doesn't apply 100% to Valpo since any construction/renovations would be paid for largely through donations and operations would be subsidized by the university, it certainly highlights why "just build an arena" is not a viable response to every one of the athletic department's problems. In fact, it has the potential to cause more problems than it solves.
http://www.valpofanzone.com/forum/index.php?topic=716.0 (http://www.valpofanzone.com/forum/index.php?topic=716.0)
If most of us can recall, the Facilities string contains all of these same discussions almost verbatim. The sports scene is pretty slow right now so it's understandable ::) It's kind of fun to go back and see how failthful we all are to the previous arguements.
Quote from: FWalum on April 17, 2014, 02:04:36 PM
Quote from: vu72 on April 16, 2014, 12:21:40 PMI guess that leaves lots of religious schools as options but would also think that Catholic schools (no offense intended Apostle) might not be a good fit either as the approach and teachings might not fit with a Bible Christian, which I believe Bryce might be. So, as valpotx pointed out, TCU might fit or perhaps a private, non-religious school who wouldn't find his faith and sharing to be an issue--maybe a Wake Forest, who knows.
Wake Forest is still very much a Baptist school. Hard to mistake it as a non-religious school when, much like VU, you have this building in the middle of your campus.
(http://users.wfu.edu/burtoneg/chapel.JPG)
If Manning doesn't work out IMO this is the perfect fit for Bryce.
Thanks for this information FWalum. I didn't know that. My understanding is that "Bible Christians" pretty much follow the Baptist traditions,so Wake Forest, being private, religious and Baptist, would indeed be a great fit for Bryce, just not anytime soon!!
Quote from: FWalum on April 17, 2014, 02:04:36 PM
Quote from: vu72 on April 16, 2014, 12:21:40 PMI guess that leaves lots of religious schools as options but would also think that Catholic schools (no offense intended Apostle) might not be a good fit either as the approach and teachings might not fit with a Bible Christian, which I believe Bryce might be. So, as valpotx pointed out, TCU might fit or perhaps a private, non-religious school who wouldn't find his faith and sharing to be an issue--maybe a Wake Forest, who knows.
Wake Forest is still very much a Baptist school. Hard to mistake it as a non-religious school when, much like VU, you have this building in the middle of your campus.
(http://users.wfu.edu/burtoneg/chapel.JPG)
If Manning doesn't work out IMO this is the perfect fit for Bryce.
The University of Maryland has a very similar chapel on their campus, but is certainly not a religious school:
(http://weddings.umd.edu/portals/7/The%20Main%20Chapel/reg-1.jpg)
shocking that having a building that looks like a town hall or a mormon temple would not by itself make a "Christian" university.
Wow, what is wrong at Missouri for him to want the Tulsa job instead???
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/10797288/frank-haith-missouri-tigers-deal-coach-tulsa-golden-hurricane-per-sources (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/10797288/frank-haith-missouri-tigers-deal-coach-tulsa-golden-hurricane-per-sources)
I wonder if Missouri would go after Matt Painter again? Talk about "stock being lower."
Quote from: crusaderjoe on April 17, 2014, 09:23:36 AMFairmont High School Graduation May 22, 2014 (Thu) 7:00 PM
Fairborn High School Graduation May 23, 2014 (Fri) 7:00 PM
Centerville High School Graduation May 24, 2014 (Sat) 10:00 AM
Northmont High School Graduation May 25, 2014 (Sun) 2:00 PM
Little Miami High School Graduation May 27, 2014 (Tue) 7:00 PM
Xenia High School Graduation May 28, 2014 (Wed) 7:00 PM
Stebbins High School Graduation May 29, 2014 (Thu) 7:00 PM
Franklin High School Graduation May 30, 2014 (Fri) 7:00 PM
Beavercreek High School Graduation May 31, 2014 (Sat) 9:00 AM
Miamisburg High School Graduation May 31, 2014 (Sat) 2:00 PM
Lebanon High School Graduation May 31, 2014 (Sat) 6:00 PM
Wayne High School Graduation Jun 1, 2014 (Sun) 2:00 PM
Springboro High School Graduation Jun 7, 2014 (Sat) 6:00 PM
Tecumseh High School Graduation Jun 8, 2014 (Sun) 2:00 PM
How can they recruit athletes to such a HIGH SCHOOL gym even if it seats over 10,000.
Quote from: VULB#62 on April 17, 2014, 02:38:14 PM
Quote from: Dave_2010 on April 17, 2014, 02:30:59 PM
Quote from: valpo64 on April 17, 2014, 01:35:00 PMRemember all the $$ the State of Ohio poured into Cleveland State's facility. The result? There is more to a successful program than an expensive facility that seats alot of people...just ask CSU.
To that point, the Wolstein Center has been hemorrhaging money to the tune of $1M annually since the day it opened in 1991 (certainly since the Gund/Quicken Loans Arena opened in 94). Several years ago, the university hired Comcast Spectacor to run the arena. Little has changed since then. Things have actually gotten to the point that the university is considering tearing down the building and replacing it.
From a financial perspective, the general rule is that for an arena to break even on its operating costs, it must host approximately 200 events per year...this number does not take in to account any money used to service the construction debt either. Though this doesn't apply 100% to Valpo since any construction/renovations would be paid for largely through donations and operations would be subsidized by the university, it certainly highlights why "just build an arena" is not a viable response to every one of the athletic department's problems. In fact, it has the potential to cause more problems than it solves.
http://www.valpofanzone.com/forum/index.php?topic=716.0 (http://www.valpofanzone.com/forum/index.php?topic=716.0)
If most of us can recall, the Facilities string contains all of these same discussions almost verbatim. The sports scene is pretty slow right now so it's understandable ::) It's kind of fun to go back and see how failthful we all are to the previous arguements.
To be fair, every thread, when long enough, will gravitate to a Bryce Drew leaving and facilities discussion. Since this thread (I think, I'm not even sure which one I'm on) has to do with Bryce Drew leaving, we were destined to start a facilities discussion by the 3rd or 4th page.
Quote from: valpotx on April 17, 2014, 03:09:53 PM
Wow, what is wrong at Missouri for him to want the Tulsa job instead???
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/10797288/frank-haith-missouri-tigers-deal-coach-tulsa-golden-hurricane-per-sources (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/10797288/frank-haith-missouri-tigers-deal-coach-tulsa-golden-hurricane-per-sources)
Wow.........Wow........Wow..........Wow!!!!!!!!
Haith must have a reason but something must be pretty rotten for Frank in Columbia-Mizzzzzzourah!!!!
And Haith isn't a TU guy either so he won't stay. Maybe he thinks the AAC is better than the SEC in basketball? After I say it sounds so stupid.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on April 17, 2014, 03:03:10 PM
shocking that having a building that looks like a town hall or a mormon temple would not by itself make a "Christian" university.
Which was the exact point of my post.
...i'm sorry i concurred with the opinion expressed by your picture with words rather than clicking your new like button
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on April 18, 2014, 09:33:45 PM
...i'm sorry i concurred with the opinion expressed by your picture with words rather than clicking your new like button
It certainly would have been clearer than your snarky reply was.
Cruadermoe can tell you that every one here in "Mo" is GLAD Haith left for Tulsa.
He pulled off a 10-year deal for a slight raise in pay over his Mo. contract. I do suspect that Bryce makes less than the $1.875 per year that Haith is getting.