After having 4 games in 8 days, we get a nice week to relax, rest up, and hopefully heal some dislocated toes. After this 7 day break we get 4 games over a 9 day stretch. Then we get 5 more days off. The Horizon League: Where spacing our a schedule is non-existent. :crazy:
Wright State plays Cleveland St. on Wednesday, so we'll have a little bit of a better idea of this year's Raiders. They've beaten Detroit at home and YSU on the road while losing by 24 at Green Bay. I'd expect them to get a rightly pissed CSU so that should be a really good game.
I won't make a prediction right now because I want to see what happens in the CSU game, but this isn't going to be an easy game. When playing at Nutter the Raiders are 6-1 this season and 16-3 there last season.
The HL website is curiously missing video links, but I assume that the Valpo game will _at least_ be on HLN.
Quote from: agibson on January 12, 2015, 02:42:31 PMThe HL website is curiously missing video links, but I assume that the Valpo game will _at least_ be on HLN.
The Valpo at Wright St men's basketball game will be on ESPN 3.
http://espn.go.com/watchespn/index#type/upcoming/startDate/20150117/sport/basketball/ (http://espn.go.com/watchespn/index#type/upcoming/startDate/20150117/sport/basketball/)
Scroll to midway down the page. The link has not been set up yet but the game is on the ESPN 3 schedule.
This is going to be a close game. We will need our FTs towards the end of this game - hopefully we'll connect.
Valpo 67
WSU 64
Regarding the schedule being confusing, I believe part of the issue is not having the travel part system we did when B@#%$r was in the Horizon. I also believe we are on a new ESPN deal this season. So that may have some influence on scheduling as well. Just speculation.
As far as the game goes, it's tough to win at the Nutter Center. But I do believe we will win in a tough fought battle. Wright State is in somewhat of a rebuilding phase. Only a couple players left from their good teams from the past couple seasons. Yoho can shoot it and is their version of Alec. Arceneaux is a feisty small guard. And they're getting Griffin back from injury a couple games ago I believe. They seem to not have much of a post threat (from looking at stats only). So if we can play tough on the perimeter and force them into tough jumpers or make them face the beast that is Vashil Fernandez in the paint, we should come away with what would be our best win of the season based on the RPI (Wright State sits at 90).
Valpo 67
WSU 61
I dislike the coach of WSU and will never pick his team to win, unless they are playing Oakland then I won't pull for either team to win....my conflict ion with which HL team I dislike the most is a discussion for another thread.
I will pick Valpo to beat the snot out the Raiders, 76-60. I'm interested to see if Valpo runs that inbounds play where Vashil got the lob for an and one, WSU ran that play last year right before they played us and got a huge dunk then ran it against Valpo and turned it over. Very little would make more happier (more happy?) then to see Vashil throw down a vicious alley oop of an inbound play we sniped from them.
Nickerson is out to redeem himself, DWalker has rebound his shooting touch, Alec stays hot (I think before last game he was like 2/14 from downtown in HL play), and TWalker has a night.
We need to give Tevonn a nickname.
Although the first person to suggest "Sky" is out of the running.
After the last ESPN3 announcers ... How about Tevin which rhymes with Kevin....
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on January 12, 2015, 08:16:44 PM
We need to give Tevonn a nickname.
Although the first person to suggest "Sky" is out of the running.
How about "Moon"?
Valpo Basketball Preview 1|12|15 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwXhfLn9mLw#ws)
I've started referring to Tevonn as the Canadian Russell Westbrook.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on January 12, 2015, 08:16:44 PM
We need to give Tevonn a nickname.
Although the first person to suggest "Sky" is out of the running.
Johnny Walker Gold Label? Johnny Walker Canadian? Underground Montreal Walker (their underground walkways are very extensive)? Walker Canadian Ranger? Pont Cartier Walker (Cartier bridge [in Montreal] Walker)?
(http://images.lpcdn.ca/435x290/201111/21/429925.jpg)
Pont Jacques Cartier (Jacques Cartier bridge in Montreal crossing over the St Lawrence River)
Valpo 73
WSU 62
Reminds me of Will Ferrell race driver Ricky Bobby and his two sons, Walker and Texas Ranger.
What about T-train or the walker express
By whatever name I love his toughness. I think the play where he got hurt he was trying to fight through an illegal screen set by their 6-9, 260 lb backup center and "ran into" the guy's elbow. Then, he shows up at the postgame press conference with a huge welt under his eye and says he didn't feel pain from the blow, just energy from the crowd. That's one tough young man.
I like T-train.
Pretty soon we might have to make a poll about this. A "poll model", if you will.
Oh yeah. VU 63 WSU 56. Mostly because it's like the only score in this range of games we haven't had yet : )
Last 9 games (thru 2011; top is most recent, first is good guys):
@ 58-67
h 45-62
T 62-54
@ 68-61
h 69-63
h 63-54
@ 55-73
h 58-56
@ 71-60
Love this kid, T has almost everything I would be looking for in a player at his position. I think that Luke Gore said it best when he talked about the one play where Tevonn and Max got involved in a scrum on the floor with T finally ripping the ball away from the CSU player. Luke was like... "they're freshman and didn't care or know that this was the type of play where CSU normally out physicals their opponent" or something to that effect.
Wish on occasion that he looked like he was enjoying the moment a little more. The first time I have seen him crack a smile was in the press conference talking about the "homerun" play.
I'm a big fan of Tevonn. A gritty, gutsy player who generally makes good decisions with the ball. At times, he looks like the best player on the court (yes, even when Alec is out there). I am intrigued to (someday) see the chemistry between Tevonn and Lexus. I suspect it will be dynamite.
On a totally unrelated note, our first opponent of the year, Mizzou, was crucified by Kentucky today. If we play Kentucky, we lose by at least 50 unless we run the shot clock down to 1 second every possession. So glad they have no interest in VU.
I might have a much clearer game outlook after I watch WSU-CSU tomorrow night but it goes without question that much of our success or failure will be attributed to our point guard play. So how will our point minutes be distributed this time around? Should we go with the youngster playing his natural position as a raw rookie freshman or go with the maturity of an upperclassman who looks like a point guard freshman only because he has been transplanted to a new position?
Our best-- maybe only answer is that once again we will need them both and I am very glad they are both here and available. I now fully understand why Max was recruited and believe that some of our "package deal" thinking might have been erroneous. Nickerson on the other hand with his elevated half-court view and greatly extended passing and driving angles has some developable potential strengths that just can not be duplicated by someone 5 to 8 inches shorter. Despite the downside of Keith (and Lexus) being unavailable I am kind of glad that Max and E.Victor are getting this "trial by fire" test that might serve both them and the team very well in the future.
Quote from: justducky on January 14, 2015, 01:10:40 AM
Despite the downside of Keith (and Lexus) being unavailable I am kind of glad that Max and E.Victor are getting this "trial by fire" test that might serve both them and the team very well in the future.
I'm getting ahead of myself, but watching Max and EVic play makes me very excited for next season when Lexus comes back. We will legitimately have 4 guys who can play the point.
Our KenPom rating was at 77 after the CSU game, we went up to 82 yesterday and start today at 80. I haven't paid close attention to WSU's during this break but the score prediction has stayed at a steady 64-63 with a 52% chance of us winning. This has remained our 3rd hardest game according to chance of victory all season (@GB and @CSU being 1 and 2). If we win this I could see this boost us into the high 60s for KenPom and RPI into the mid 70s-low 80s (RPI Forecast has us at 88, RealTime has us at 90, and ESPN has us at 92).
This is why I don't like using RPI as a gauge of anything, WSU is 93 at ESPN despite having an 8-7 record. They put too much into strength of schedule and not enough into the quality of your play. If you play poorly against your tough opponents, it's just the same as if you played extremely well and still lost.
Quote from: Kyle321n on January 14, 2015, 08:34:38 AM
Quote from: justducky on January 14, 2015, 01:10:40 AM
Despite the downside of Keith (and Lexus) being unavailable I am kind of glad that Max and E.Victor are getting this "trial by fire" test that might serve both them and the team very well in the future.
I'm getting ahead of myself, but watching Max and EVic play makes me very excited for next season when Lexus comes back. We will legitimately have 4 guys who can play the point.
Our KenPom rating was at 77 after the CSU game, we went up to 82 yesterday and start today at 80. I haven't paid close attention to WSU's during this break but the score prediction has stayed at a steady 64-63 with a 52% chance of us winning. This has remained our 3rd hardest game according to chance of victory all season (@GB and @CSU being 1 and 2). If we win this I could see this boost us into the high 60s for KenPom and RPI into the mid 70s-low 80s (RPI Forecast has us at 88, RealTime has us at 90, and ESPN has us at 92).
This is why I don't like using RPI as a gauge of anything, WSU is 93 at ESPN despite having an 8-7 record. They put too much into strength of schedule and not enough into the quality of your play. If you play poorly against your tough opponents, it's just the same as if you played extremely well and still lost.
We are set at the point guard position until the spring of 2018! I just hope that Max is patient next year, because if we are fully healthy, I don't see him getting a lot of playing time, no matter how good he is. However, he should get LOTS of playing time his junior and senior year. Please be patient, Max!
14-15 = Carter/Max/Nickerson
15-16 = Carter/Lexus/Max (won't need Nickerson to do it anymore so he can play the 2 and the 3)
16-17 = Lexus/Max/Davidson (Davidson should be a fully capable backup by this point in case of injury, illness, etc.)
17-18 = Lexus/Max
Quote from: Kyle321n on January 14, 2015, 08:34:38 AM
Quote from: justducky on January 14, 2015, 01:10:40 AM
Despite the downside of Keith (and Lexus) being unavailable I am kind of glad that Max and E.Victor are getting this "trial by fire" test that might serve both them and the team very well in the future.
I'm getting ahead of myself, but watching Max and EVic play makes me very excited for next season when Lexus comes back. We will legitimately have 4 guys who can play the point.
Our KenPom rating was at 77 after the CSU game, we went up to 82 yesterday and start today at 80. I haven't paid close attention to WSU's during this break but the score prediction has stayed at a steady 64-63 with a 52% chance of us winning. This has remained our 3rd hardest game according to chance of victory all season (@GB and @CSU being 1 and 2). If we win this I could see this boost us into the high 60s for KenPom and RPI into the mid 70s-low 80s (RPI Forecast has us at 88, RealTime has us at 90, and ESPN has us at 92).
This is why I don't like using RPI as a gauge of anything, WSU is 93 at ESPN despite having an 8-7 record. They put too much into strength of schedule and not enough into the quality of your play. If you play poorly against your tough opponents, it's just the same as if you played extremely well and still lost.
While RPI isn't a good predictor of which team is going to win, or how good a team actually is, it is the primary basis for which seed a mid major will get (+ or - 1 based on geography). RPI was never meant for predictions - for that, use KPom or methods that take into account possession data, MOV, etc. But ultimately, at the end of the season, RPI provides a decent enough indicator or who you beat. Playing a team close shouldn't count for anything - the only thing that matters at the end of the game is which team scored more points. That's the whole object of the sport. That's what the selection committee values. At the end of the season seeding isn't meant to be a predictor, but an evaluation. This is what RPI does well, and this is what is used (for the most part). Because it's used, it will always be important enough to track.
But I think we can all agree that ESPN's BPI is the most useless stat ever (besides their QBR).
Quote from: a3uge on January 14, 2015, 11:57:22 AM
Quote from: Kyle321n on January 14, 2015, 08:34:38 AM
Quote from: justducky on January 14, 2015, 01:10:40 AM
Despite the downside of Keith (and Lexus) being unavailable I am kind of glad that Max and E.Victor are getting this "trial by fire" test that might serve both them and the team very well in the future.
I'm getting ahead of myself, but watching Max and EVic play makes me very excited for next season when Lexus comes back. We will legitimately have 4 guys who can play the point.
Our KenPom rating was at 77 after the CSU game, we went up to 82 yesterday and start today at 80. I haven't paid close attention to WSU's during this break but the score prediction has stayed at a steady 64-63 with a 52% chance of us winning. This has remained our 3rd hardest game according to chance of victory all season (@GB and @CSU being 1 and 2). If we win this I could see this boost us into the high 60s for KenPom and RPI into the mid 70s-low 80s (RPI Forecast has us at 88, RealTime has us at 90, and ESPN has us at 92).
This is why I don't like using RPI as a gauge of anything, WSU is 93 at ESPN despite having an 8-7 record. They put too much into strength of schedule and not enough into the quality of your play. If you play poorly against your tough opponents, it's just the same as if you played extremely well and still lost.
While RPI isn't a good predictor of which team is going to win, or how good a team actually is, it is the primary basis for which seed a mid major will get (+ or - 1 based on geography). RPI was never meant for predictions - for that, use KPom or methods that take into account possession data, MOV, etc. But ultimately, at the end of the season, RPI provides a decent enough indicator or who you beat. Playing a team close shouldn't count for anything - the only thing that matters at the end of the game is which team scored more points. That's the whole object of the sport. That's what the selection committee values. At the end of the season seeding isn't meant to be a predictor, but an evaluation. This is what RPI does well, and this is what is used (for the most part). Because it's used, it will always be important enough to track.
But I think we can all agree that ESPN's BPI is the most useless stat ever (besides their QBR).
Interesting, informative exchange right here...
CSU/WSU game on now on ESPN3
Quote from: wh on January 14, 2015, 06:03:44 PMCSU/WSU game on now on ESPN3
Love the powder blue footwear that Wright St is wearing. Even Donlon and the coaching staff are wearing the blue shoes. Since Wright St wears white with some kind of green trim at home and Cleveland St wears green on the road the blue shoes sure do distinguish the two teams nicely.
10-7 CSU with about 13 min to go in 1st half. Very tight and foul filled game so far.
EDIT: 28-26 CSU at half. WSU missing more shots but CSU missing some FTs and WSU hitting a few more threes.
Both Trey Lewis and Charlie Lee have missed 3 threes each for CSU. If the Vikings can get those shots to fall I think Cleve St will pull this game out.
Didn't see most of the CSU at WSU game but I did see the last 2 minutes. Cleve pulled out a win, 54-50, in what looked like a very close game the whole way. The difference in this game and the CSU/Valpo game was that CSU executed much better than WSU at the very end. There was a huge three by Mason with only seconds to go in the game.
Please tell me I'm not the only one who saw UIC clench defeat out if the jaws of victory against Detroit? One of the wildest finishes I've ever seen.
Quote from: a3uge on January 14, 2015, 09:14:45 PM
Please tell me I'm not the only one who saw UIC clench defeat out if the jaws of victory against Detroit? One of the wildest finishes I've ever seen.
You aren't. Two really bad teams and two coaches who need to be doing something else.
So UIC was up 10+ the whole game before Detroit went on a run and tied it late. UIC hit a 3, got a stop and added a free throw with 40 sec left. UIC fouls Detroit and they only hit 1 free throw. Up 3, UIC just needs to wind the clock down (till about 5 sec left of the game). Jay Harris is dribbling so Detroit doesn't foul. Harris, for whatever reason passes out to a guard, whom passes it right back to Harris... but not really, because Chris Jenkins picked him off and, of course, instead of going for the 3 to tie, he dunks it with 3.7 left. So all UIC has to do is inbound it and get fouled, hit free throws, etc.
UIC runs the home run play and the inbounder Jay Cutlers it short, Whiticker adjusts and Jerod Williams lands right on him midair, and you guessed it, gets called for a foul. In the bonus, Williams hit both free throws and Detroit wins by 1.
Quote from: a3uge on January 14, 2015, 09:34:12 PM
So UIC was up 10+ the whole game before Detroit went on a run and tied it late. UIC hit a 3, got a stop and added a free throw with 40 sec left. UIC fouls Detroit and they only hit 1 free throw. Up 3, UIC just needs to wind the clock down (till about 5 sec left of the game). Jay Harris is dribbling so Detroit doesn't foul. Harris, for whatever reason passes out to a guard, whom passes it right back to Harris... but not really, because Chris Jenkins picked him off and, of course, instead of going for the 3 to tie, he dunks it with 3.7 left. So all UIC has to do is inbound it and get fouled, hit free throws, etc.
UIC runs the home run play and the inbounder Jay Cutlers it short, Whiticker adjusts and Jerod Williams lands right on him midair, and you guessed it, gets called for a foul. In the bonus, Williams hit both free throws and Detroit wins by 1.
ineptitude at its best. ???
Quote from: vu72 on January 14, 2015, 09:41:39 PM
Quote from: a3uge on January 14, 2015, 09:34:12 PM
So UIC was up 10+ the whole game before Detroit went on a run and tied it late. UIC hit a 3, got a stop and added a free throw with 40 sec left. UIC fouls Detroit and they only hit 1 free throw. Up 3, UIC just needs to wind the clock down (till about 5 sec left of the game). Jay Harris is dribbling so Detroit doesn't foul. Harris, for whatever reason passes out to a guard, whom passes it right back to Harris... but not really, because Chris Jenkins picked him off and, of course, instead of going for the 3 to tie, he dunks it with 3.7 left. So all UIC has to do is inbound it and get fouled, hit free throws, etc.
UIC runs the home run play and the inbounder Jay Cutlers it short, Whiticker adjusts and Jerod Williams lands right on him midair, and you guessed it, gets called for a foul. In the bonus, Williams hit both free throws and Detroit wins by 1.
ineptitude at its best. ???
And great play by play
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on January 12, 2015, 08:16:44 PM
We need to give Tevonn a nickname.
Although the first person to suggest "Sky" is out of the running.
Sorry, but I just had to do it. :-[
(http://i60.tinypic.com/21etr9.jpg)
Quote from: valpopal on January 15, 2015, 01:14:13 AMQuote from: LaPorteAveApostle on January 12, 2015, 08:16:44 PMWe need to give Tevonn a nickname. Although the first person to suggest "Sky" is out of the running.
Sorry, but I just had to do it. :-[ (http://i60.tinypic.com/21etr9.jpg)
I hope you can live up to this when Monday, 5/4/2015 appears on the calendar.
May the fourth be with you
(http://i.imgur.com/6ETh4rc.png)
Quote from: valpopal on January 15, 2015, 01:14:13 AM
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on January 12, 2015, 08:16:44 PM
We need to give Tevonn a nickname.
Although the first person to suggest "Sky" is out of the running.
Sorry, but I just had to do it. :-[
(http://i60.tinypic.com/21etr9.jpg)
This looks more like my suggestion!
Quote from: covufan on January 12, 2015, 08:51:43 PM
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on January 12, 2015, 08:16:44 PM
We need to give Tevonn a nickname.
Although the first person to suggest "Sky" is out of the running.
How about "Moon"?
I don't have the time or the knowledge to put it together but how about "Loon Walker" with a Canadian lake background with Loons taking flight and an insert of the Loonie (canadian currency) with the Loon side up.
While on this subject what ever happened to our discussion of an occasional dual nation anthem? Oh Canada is a whole lot easier to sing!
covufan: "How about 'Moon'?"
(http://i58.tinypic.com/2lnbn6s.jpg)
i think "moon walker" implies going backwards, however, while the trajectory of his career is most decidedly in the opposite direction.
Wright State Plays hard sound Basketball but they are not vary athletic and the game is on the road. If Valpo plays to its record and ability VU wins.
VU 72 Wright State 67 :)
Quote from: valpopal on January 15, 2015, 11:15:49 AM
covufan: "How about 'Moon'?"
(http://i58.tinypic.com/2lnbn6s.jpg)
Moon Walker is befitting his amazing vertical. I like it!
How high can you jump on the Moon?
The gravitational field of the Moon at its surface only
162.2 cm/sec/sec
----------------- = 0.16
983 cm /sec/sec
or about 1/6th of what we feel on the surface of Earth in terms of the acceleration of gravity, so this means that for the same energy expended, you should be able to jump about 6 times higher. I can jump about 20 inches, so that means on the Moon I could jump 6 x 20 = 120 inches or 10 feet straight up!
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on January 15, 2015, 11:47:14 AM
i think "moon walker" implies going backwards, however, while the trajectory of his career is most decidedly in the opposite direction.
When I suggested it I was thinking more stratosphere, like he is walking on the moon. The picture below is perfect!!!
Quote from: valpopal on January 15, 2015, 11:15:49 AM
covufan: "How about 'Moon'?"
(http://i58.tinypic.com/2lnbn6s.jpg)
I like the T-Train coming down the lane, to inflict some pain, up and over Bobby Hain.
How about Star Walker or Star Lord Walker?
Quote from: valpotx on January 15, 2015, 03:15:21 AMMay the fourth be with you
I was going to say Star Wars Day, May the 4th (be with you).
Quote from: chef on January 15, 2015, 12:58:40 PM
I like the T-Train coming down the lane, to inflict some pain, up and over Bobby Hain.
If only we had some way to get this line, or some portion thereof, said during some broadcast just as the T-Train was going down the lane!
I keep on thinking of George Castanza's desire to be nicknamed T-bone.
Quote from: humbleopinion on January 15, 2015, 04:27:01 PM
I keep on thinking of George Castanza's desire to be nicknamed T-bone.
So we should call him Coco?
Back to even with GB! And sweet justice by the way... Oakland beats GB at home by 3.
Fantastic! Now things get interesting. (And could remain interesting - just the thing to complicate the tiebreakers.)
Too bad Wright State's RPI tanked on their home loss to CSU. It'll take some of the shine off the apple if we manage to win in Dayton.
Quote from: agibson on January 15, 2015, 08:12:03 PM
Fantastic! Now things get interesting. (And could remain interesting - just the thing to complicate the tiebreakers.)
Too bad Wright State's RPI tanked on their home loss to CSU. It'll take some of the shine off the apple if we manage to win in Dayton.
Inter-conference RPI shifts are negligible since everyone plays each other twice anyways.
Quote from: Kyle321n on January 14, 2015, 08:34:38 AMI'm getting ahead of myself, but watching Max and EVic play makes me very excited for next season when Lexus comes back. We will legitimately have 4 guys who can play the point.
Quote from: justducky on January 14, 2015, 01:10:40 AMNickerson on the other hand with his elevated half-court view and greatly extended passing and driving angles has some developable potential strengths that just can not be duplicated by someone 5 to 8 inches shorter.
Just to be clear, as long as Lexus returns fully recovered I would not expect to see Nickerson playing major minutes at point under most normal circumstances. It is those "special situation" abnormal circumstance opportunities which really intrigue me. That is where a completely healthy, rust-free, and more finely polished EVic might really shine in 15-16. Use your imagination. Plays off of time outs, post feeds, drive and dishes could all become late game plays where he might be who you want handling the ball. At least maybe---because he certainly is not there yet!
As for WSU will they zone us when EVic is in the game or put major pressure on him (hedge) in the hopes of pushing us away from the basket and creating some turnover situations? Wright State always seems to play good defense against us making it very difficult to score. I think we win but I don't know how? WSU games never seem to take the exact form or flow that I am expecting but maybe that should be credited to coach Donlon.
Sorry if this question has been asked, but watching the CSU game the other night reminded me of a certain point guard. Would you rather have EVic running the play at the end of a game or Ali Berdiel? Next game? 5 games from now if EVic continues to log significant mins at the 1?
Also as to UWGB/OAK game, the road is a bitter and cold place in any conference (see Gonzaga's escape last night). And that's why I'll repeat my point for the 28th year, mid-majors get penalized in seeding and in at large berths for road losses to lower RPI teams than the Big Conferences. "Oh it's tough to win on the road in the BIG." Yes it is. It's tough to win on the road in any conference. But if we or a GB goes 13-3 with 1 home and 2 road losses, suddenly we're no longer deserving of consideration for at large. Yet a mediocre 8-8 team from the ACC which won on the road and beat a top 20 at home should be considered.
I move on. Finally, Murray State had a really nice home win vs Belmont last night. Our Murray win will look good later. Also, those two teams would be fine jumping to the Horizon, even if the Racers are public.
Quote from: a3uge on January 15, 2015, 08:50:43 PMInter-conference RPI shifts are negligible since everyone plays each other twice anyways.
Every loss is balanced by a win, for sure. But, of course, individual teams RPI's can drift to the top or bottom of the pile.
Some had been talking about the potential for Wright State to be our best RPI win of the season to date. Looks unlikely at the moment.
UWGB may fall below us here soon, for that matter, if this Oakland loss was systemic.
The only thing that concerns me about this game is their speed. Thommason, arceneaux, and Hopkins are all extremely quick. Without Carter/Lexus I feel like they will do plenty of damage driving to the hoop. We have a major advantage at the center and forward positions. Kerena should not score very many points on Vashil. Peters and Yoho are the exact same person except Peters is a better player. We are going to need to out rebound them and hit our open shots if we want to win this game. If we don't hit our open shots, we better get a lot of offensive rebounds and put-backs.
Question Marks for the road trip:
Will Nickerson be able to finish on his drives to the basket?
How will Max fair on the road as a true freshman with very little game experience?
Can we hit our free throws at a high enough % to win close games on the road?
Will we fall in love with the 3 point shot or will we take the ball hard to the basket for better looks?
Quote from: SanityLost17 on January 16, 2015, 09:43:15 AM
The only thing that concerns me about this game is their speed. Thommason, arceneaux, and Hopkins are all extremely quick. Without Carter/Lexus I feel like they will do plenty of damage driving to the hoop. We have a major advantage at the center and forward positions. Kerena should not score very many points on Vashil. Peters and Yoho are the exact same person except Peters is a better player. We are going to need to out rebound them and hit our open shots if we want to win this game. If we don't hit our open shots, we better get a lot of offensive rebounds and put-backs.
Question Marks for the road trip:
Will Nickerson be able to finish on his drives to the basket?
How will Max fair on the road as a true freshman with very little game experience?
Can we hit our free throws at a high enough % to win close games on the road?
Will we fall in love with the 3 point shot or will we take the ball hard to the basket for better looks?
I would say the guard trio of Lewis, Lee, and Yates for Cleveland State scares me more than the guard trio for Wright State. I trust Tevonn to guard just about anyone right now in the Horizon, Darien is underrated defensively, and E's length is going to make it hard on anyone he guards. These guys did a good job on Cleveland State's guards minus Lee's tough 3's he hit. I have confidence in us defensively in this game. Just have to hit some shots and we should win.
Trying to figure out who on our team will guard their guys is a little bit of a mess. Donlon employs more line ups and odd rotation patterns than anyone I've seen. My guess for the start of the game is:
Karena<Vashil
Yoho<Alec
Hopkins<Tevonn
Thomasson<Darien
Arceneaux<EVic
Personally I'd prefer to see Hopkins guarded by EVic and let Tevonn neutralize Arceneaux's pick and pops that he's fairly good at. Hopkins seems to run the point when he's out there, and I think I'd rather EVic guard someone who isn't forcing you to run through screens on every play. In fact maybe throwing him on Thomasson might be our best option. He looks to drive to the lane more than anyone else on the team and gets to the line the most.
Quote from: valpo84 on January 16, 2015, 08:18:11 AMSorry if this question has been asked, but watching the CSU game the other night reminded me of a certain point guard. Would you rather have EVic running the play at the end of a game or Ali Berdiel? Next game? 5 games from now if EVic continues to log significant mins at the 1?
Good Comparison! High risk and high reward! Maybe he makes a fine play ooooooor maybe he dribbles it off his foot! For the near term I would pick a mature Berdiel but much of my optimism for EVic is 15-16 thinking.
Time out Valpo with 11 seconds left and down 2. You have on the floor Williams, Carter, Nickerson, Peters and you pull Smits to insert Skara or maybe Hammink. So how many plays can you design off of that? Seems like the majority would put the ball in his hands at some point but that would depend on the 5000 variables that the other coach could employ.
OK so maybe I am thinking a bit too far ahead! How do I think EVic will do in Dayton? Maybe pretty well ooooor maybe not!
Quote from: justducky on January 16, 2015, 11:26:35 AM
Quote from: valpo84 on January 16, 2015, 08:18:11 AMSorry if this question has been asked, but watching the CSU game the other night reminded me of a certain point guard. Would you rather have EVic running the play at the end of a game or Ali Berdiel? Next game? 5 games from now if EVic continues to log significant mins at the 1?
Good Comparison! High risk and high reward! Maybe he makes a fine play ooooooor maybe he dribbles it off his foot! For the near term I would pick a mature Berdiel but much of my optimism for EVic is 15-16 thinking.
Time out Valpo with 11 seconds left and down 2. You have on the floor Williams, Carter, Nickerson, Peters and you pull Smits to insert Skara or maybe Hammink. So how many plays can you design off of that? Seems like the majority would put the ball in his hands at some point but that would depend on the 5000 variables that the other coach could employ.
OK so maybe I am thinking a bit too far ahead! How do I think EVic will do in Dayton? Maybe pretty well ooooor maybe not!
[/b]
Thanks for nailing that piece of jello to the wall!! ;)
Quote from: vu72 on January 16, 2015, 11:31:47 AM
Quote from: justducky on January 16, 2015, 11:26:35 AM
Quote from: valpo84 on January 16, 2015, 08:18:11 AMSorry if this question has been asked, but watching the CSU game the other night reminded me of a certain point guard. Would you rather have EVic running the play at the end of a game or Ali Berdiel? Next game? 5 games from now if EVic continues to log significant mins at the 1?
Good Comparison! High risk and high reward! Maybe he makes a fine play ooooooor maybe he dribbles it off his foot! For the near term I would pick a mature Berdiel but much of my optimism for EVic is 15-16 thinking.
Time out Valpo with 11 seconds left and down 2. You have on the floor Williams, Carter, Nickerson, Peters and you pull Smits to insert Skara or maybe Hammink. So how many plays can you design off of that? Seems like the majority would put the ball in his hands at some point but that would depend on the 5000 variables that the other coach could employ.
OK so maybe I am thinking a bit too far ahead! How do I think EVic will do in Dayton? Maybe pretty well ooooor maybe not!
[/b]
Thanks for nailing that piece of jello to the wall!! ;)
I don't ever recall a situation quite like this one. Our 2 and only experienced (and very good) point guards are out. We have left 1 raw freshman PG that basically didn't get off the bench for several OOC games, and who is now the primary back-up for our 6-7 "point forward," who still isn't 100% recovered from major double hip surgery, and who will at times be struggling to get the ball across the mid-court line in 10 seconds against heavy pressure from quick, small defenders. Like the last game, there will be times when EVN will have to hand off to people who should never have to be counted on to bring the ball up court and start the offense, namely Alec and Jubril. We have completely lost our ability to score in transition, which was a main staple in OOC play. We have lost our ability to score quickly and in bunches, as well. We have lost our best ball distributor. In spite of all the negatives we still had enough basketball talent to beat a good CSU team at home. Will we have enough to beat WSU on the road? I don't have the faintest idea. I do know one thing. CSU had a golden opportunity to knock us off and blew it. This will be WSU's best opportunity to beat us, as well. If we can somehow eke out another win, we are going to be much harder for these teams to beat the next time around, (assuming KC is back and healthy by then). Right now, we just need a W in any form or fashion - pretty, ugly or otherwise.
I'm all for a ugly win. :thumbsup:
Quote from: Kyle321n on January 14, 2015, 08:34:38 AMThis is why I don't like using RPI as a gauge of anything, WSU is 93 at ESPN despite having an 8-7 record. They put too much into strength of schedule and not enough into the quality of your play.
:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
Quote from: vu72 on January 16, 2015, 11:31:47 AMThanks for nailing that piece of jello to the wall!!
Always glad to share my knowledge with any and all who have made the mistake of listening. ::)
Quote from: wh on January 16, 2015, 12:15:34 PMLike the last game, there will be times when EVN will have to hand off to people who should never have to be counted on to bring the ball up court and start the offense, namely Alec and Jubril.
Sadly I expect that Donlon has already come up with strategies that will eliminate or largely reduce the advantages of that option. That is his job. Perhaps Bryce is as we speak rummaging through his trick bag with the hope that he has not yet run completely out of rabbits. Time will tell.
The spread: WSU -1
Quote from: agibson on January 16, 2015, 09:42:32 AMUWGB may fall below us here soon, for that matter, if this Oakland loss was systemic.
I don't really think you can call GB's loss to Oakland a systemic loss anymore than you can call CSU's loss to Valpo a systemic loss. Both games were extremely close. Sykes had a shot at a three to tie the Oakland game but hit the front of the rim. CSU could have hit three FTs to tie the Valpo game.
Quote from: justducky on January 16, 2015, 04:54:55 PMQuote from: vu72 on January 16, 2015, 11:31:47 AMThanks for nailing that piece of jello to the wall!!
Always glad to share my knowledge with any and all who have made the mistake of listening. ::) Quote from: wh on January 16, 2015, 12:15:34 PMLike the last game, there will be times when EVN will have to hand off to people who should never have to be counted on to bring the ball up court and start the offense, namely Alec and Jubril.
Sadly I expect that Donlon has already come up with strategies that will eliminate or largely reduce the advantages of that option. That is his job. Perhaps Bryce is as we speak rummaging through his trick bag with the hope that he has not yet run completely out of rabbits. Time will tell.
Aren't we forgetting that Valpo has two players named Walker that have brought a whole load of talent and options for Bryce to use? And Alec did a good job helping EVic bring the ball up the court against CSU with some pop up help in the back court from Vashil.
Quote from: historyman on January 16, 2015, 11:39:27 PMAren't we forgetting that Valpo has two players named Walker that have brought a whole load of talent and options for Bryce to use?
I have no doubt that given some time Tevonne could be turned into an adequate point but by doing so you would not only force him out of position but also his replacement at the 2 (which would be who?). We need to remember that with these injuries and the need to hold EVN to about 20 minutes per game we are down to 8.5 players which includes Nick Davidson.
Might Darien be given a shot at point? Sure -probably our next option- but that also brings into play a whole host of combination, and rotation issues which I don't even want to think about. There just aren't any easy choices that will remove the difficulty from these games prior to Keith making a healthy return. It will be a struggle any way you approach it. My thinking remains that we should maximize our future return by splitting time between Max and EVN but who knows what Bryce might decide to try.
My prediction:
Valpo 67
WSU 66
Quote from: justducky on January 17, 2015, 01:58:42 AM
Quote from: historyman on January 16, 2015, 11:39:27 PMAren't we forgetting that Valpo has two players named Walker that have brought a whole load of talent and options for Bryce to use?
I have no doubt that given some time Tevonne could be turned into an adequate point but by doing so you would not only force him out of position but also his replacement at the 2 (which would be who?). We need to remember that with these injuries and the need to hold EVN to about 20 minutes per game we are down to 8.5 players which includes Nick Davidson.
Might Darien be given a shot at point? Sure -probably our next option- but that also brings into play a whole host of combination, and rotation issues which I don't even want to think about. There just aren't any easy choices that will remove the difficulty from these games prior to Keith making a healthy return. It will be a struggle any way you approach it. My thinking remains that we should maximize our future return by splitting time between Max and EVN but who knows what Bryce might decide to try.
This article from The Torch says EVN continues to have a great deal of pain. Let's hope he doesn't go down as well.
http://www.valpotorch.com/sports/article_7b3e37bc-9db0-11e4-965a-83e804759294.html (http://www.valpotorch.com/sports/article_7b3e37bc-9db0-11e4-965a-83e804759294.html)
Quote from: wh on January 16, 2015, 08:01:54 PM
The spread: WSU -1
Looks like the line's shifted to Valpo -1 this morning
Tough to win at the Nutter Butter Center, but Valpo has superior talent. Valpo 67 WSU62.
It will be a very close game. I think we will see a very good game from Max Joseph but there will be some very unfortunate turnovers which will lead to Raider points. The difference will be the points from Vashil by him dominating the post and the shooting from Alec Peters and Tavonn Walker.
Valpo's FT shooting will be on the low end of adequate. About 65%.
Valpo 67
Wright St 65
Saw on Twitter that Yoho is out for WSU
Quote from: hailcrusaders on January 17, 2015, 05:21:49 PMSaw on Twitter that Yoho is out for WSU
So Valpo has Yeo transfer and Yoho is out for WSU. A huge miss of some exciting potential play-by-play description for Todd in Dayton tonight.
"Yeo battles Yoho for the rebound."
Quote from: hailcrusaders on January 17, 2015, 05:21:49 PM
Saw on Twitter that Yoho is out for WSU
If that's accurate, it's a big loss for them. Too lazy to look up his stats, but he is an effective scorer and good rebounder, as well.
They mentioned the big loss of Yoyo but no mention of Keith Carter or Lexus Williams.
Terrible last 5 minutes. Totally out of sinc on offense. Not getting Peters the ball in a position he can score. For some reason Alec keeps falling down on shots, but not being fouled. EVN needs to stop shooting 3's just because he's open. He's not hitting from outside. Oh, and we look terrible against the press because we have no one with any ball handling skills.
When is KC coming back?
How in the world does Coach Brown not know that our name is pronounced Val-pa-RAISE-o, not RISE-o? Wasn't he a college bb coach for a million years? Also, his broadcast partner sitting 2 feet away from him has pronounced it correctly about 50 times by now.
Coach Brown has a twang...similar to okies.
About 6 minutes into the game, we were up by 9-12. I didn't think this was going to be much of a game. However, we are in 4 minutes into the 2nd half down by 2.
Peters not getting any looks and hasn't scored a fg.
E.Vick should not be running point.
Win or lose, Bryce has got to get T. Walker involved in bringing the ball down the court. This is just terrible.
Love the charge call when Wright State guy is running parallel to Walker.
T taking over down the stretch!!! Two really physical drives to the basket.
T. Walker getting to the rim. He's getting fouled and bumped every time before he gets to the rim. Refs could call it before the shot, however he's finishing at the rim. Vashil isn't playing very well on the defensive side. WSU lowers his shoulder and is getting position often.
Give the ball to T-train and get out his way choo choo lol
Did the announcer say there were 7,000 in attendance? Good turnout.
4-2. So much better than 3-2.
Vashil turned his offense up in the later part of 2nd half. Ended up scoring well above his average. T. Walker can penetrate the lane.
I saw 2nd half, Bryce used the other guards to bring it up. Once in the half court, he had E.Victor run the offense. Good tactical change.
See that several points are already listed here, so I will keep my theme going. Another awesome game from Vashil! I want the posters who said that he is a waste of a scholarship 2 seasons ago, last season, and gave up on him earlier this season, to eat crow and admit they were wrong :). You know who you are, don't make me say it ;).
Great Game winning in Ohio! ;D now Wisconsin!!!
Quote from: valpotx on January 17, 2015, 08:03:10 PM
See that several points are already listed here, so I will keep my theme going. Another awesome game from Vashil! I want the posters who said that he is a waste of a scholarship 2 seasons ago, last season, and gave up on him earlier this season, to eat crow and admit they were wrong :). You know who you are, don't make me say it ;).
Everytime he has a good game you bring this up. I feel bad enough dont rub it in. ;)
See, doesn't that feel better? :) Now I don't have to say it after each game he does really well.
Seriously though, I can't wait until KC comes back, as we look lost bringing the ball up. If not for basically doubling up WSU in rebounds, we lose this game. I can't tell because live stats wasn't working, but I have to think that we had 20 offensive rebounds.
Valpo's size and strength inside compensated for the shaky ball handling at the point in the absence of Keith, as the 17 offensive rebounds balanced the 18 turnovers. The rematch at the ARC should be an interesting game if both teams are at full strength by then.
Quote from: wh on January 17, 2015, 07:06:28 PM
How in the world does Coach Brown not know that our name is pronounced Val-pa-RAISE-o, not RISE-o? Wasn't he a college bb coach for a million years? Also, his broadcast partner sitting 2 feet away from him has pronounced it correctly about 50 times by now.
Aside from the mispronunciation, Brown is an outstanding color commentator - best in the HL hands down. He's adds so much insight that casual fans wouldn't consider. The play-by-play announcer is very professional as well. Good broadcast team...
I believe there is one more game to win in Ohio before getting to Wisconsin. I will take credit for the win as I watched from about 6 minutes left in the first half and the first 5 minutes of the second half before turning the game off to let Valpo regain the lead. I also turned it on to watch Alec miss a free throw and see WSU hit a three on the ensuing possession. Made sure the game was over before checking in. You are all welcome! ;D
Seriously though, get that toe better KC! Everyone else keep scrapping for the W's!
Quote from: wh on January 17, 2015, 07:06:28 PM
How in the world does Coach Brown not know that our name is pronounced Val-pa-RAISE-o, not RISE-o? Wasn't he a college bb coach for a million years? Also, his broadcast partner sitting 2 feet away from him has pronounced it correctly about 50 times by now.
Friend of mine was playing a drinking game. Every time Coach Brown said "Valpara
Iso" he took a drink. My friend was drunk by halftime.
Quote from: wh on January 17, 2015, 06:50:55 PM
Terrible last 5 minutes. Totally out of sinc on offense. Not getting Peters the ball in a position he can score. For some reason Alec keeps falling down on shots, but not being fouled. EVN needs to stop shooting 3's just because he's open. He's not hitting from outside. Oh, and we look terrible against the press because we have no one with any ball handling skills.
When is KC coming back?
Now, weren't you the one that said we should be enjoying ourselves since our record is now 17-3?
Another good game for Adekoya, who has been excellent in conference play. Though he only played 11 minutes, he had 7 points, grabbed 4 offensive rebounds, shot 3-4 from the foul line, and added an assist, while not committing any fouls or turnovers.
Quote from: bbtds on January 17, 2015, 08:21:39 PM
Quote from: wh on January 17, 2015, 06:50:55 PM
Terrible last 5 minutes. Totally out of sinc on offense. Not getting Peters the ball in a position he can score. For some reason Alec keeps falling down on shots, but not being fouled. EVN needs to stop shooting 3's just because he's open. He's not hitting from outside. Oh, and we look terrible against the press because we have no one with any ball handling skills.
When is KC coming back?
Now, weren't you the one that said we should be enjoying ourselves since our record is now 17-3?
Touche' my good man! ;)
Watched Nolan RPI again tonight...
Started at 90 this morning... we were at 94 by tip off... 1 minute before the final horn we had fallen to 97. Next update... we jumped to 85, GB is 81.... Wright state fell all the way from 132 to 134. Yoho Ho !!
BGSU beat Ball State 58-46
Stony Brook Embarrassed Maine... 82-39... not a typo
VMI beat ETSA 85-79
Tennessee beat Missou 59-51
Southern Univ 70 Ark-PB 60
lone bright spots
Drake Upsets Indiana State 84-78
Eastern Kentucky beats SUIE 78-62
Murray State up 19 at the half on Tennessee State
IPFW up 3 at the half at the MaBee Center :))))
JMU UP 3 at the half against Elon
Portland vs. Pepperdine shortly.
Vashil has improved so much this year. He looks like a totally different player on offense. So much more confident with the ball. Cut the turnovers way down. Happy for him. :thumbsup:
I see the attendance was 7664. Big crowd! As to the game itself, you have to give Coach Donlon and his players credit. They lost one of their main guys (and one of their only guys with height), yet they battled from beginning to end. They took full advantage of the fact we don't have any point guards and pressed the heck out of us. Exciting, nerve wracking game!
Bryce Drew saved the game by turning Nickerson into a "half court point guard" and letting T-Walker break the press.
30+ Minutes is a lot for Vashil. I hope we can play him a lot less against YSU so he is fresh for Green Bay.
I firmly believe KC is more important to our team than Yoho is to their team. KC scores points and makes everyone else better. Peters suffered tonight because we didn't have a point guard.
Is the average HL player younger than normal? Every team we face their announcers seem to talk about their youth/inexperience, but never talk about ours. 140 out of 200 of our minutes tonight were played by somebody in their 1st or 2nd season in D1 basketball. If all teams are like that, perhaps the HL will be really good in the next few years?
No credit to Donlon. He was out coached by Drew big time tonight. Missing top point guards, on the road, in front of a big crowd and Donlon's team gets beat by a guy playing his 6th(ish) year of basketball and a bunch of underclass men.
I haven't paid much attention this week, but it was good to see KC off crutches while on the bench tonight. Get well soon!
Bryce coached a heckuva game. The plays he called to break the zone defense are absolutely genius. Also as someone already mentioned, having T-Walker pass the timeline before handing the ball to E. also drastically reduced the number of turnovers.
If you told me before the game that Alec will shoot 2-8, and the whole team will shoot 25% from behind the arc, on the road in front of 7500 fans, I would have never guessed we won the game. Hats off to the whole team and especially the coaching staff.
Quote from: wh on January 17, 2015, 07:14:22 PM Win or lose, Bryce has got to get T. Walker involved in bringing the ball down the court. This is just terrible.
Quote from: SanityLost17 on January 17, 2015, 08:58:48 PMBryce Drew saved the game by turning Nickerson into a "half court point guard" and letting T-Walker break the press.
Quote from: historyman on January 16, 2015, 11:39:27 PMQuote from: historyman on January 16, 2015, 11:39:27 PMQuote from: justducky on January 16, 2015, 04:54:55 PMQuote
Quote from: vu72 on January 16, 2015, 11:31:47 AM
Thanks for nailing that piece of jello to the wall!!
Always glad to share my knowledge with any and all who have made the mistake of listening. Quote
Quote from: wh on January 16, 2015, 12:15:34 PM
Like the last game, there will be times when EVN will have to hand off to people who should never have to be counted on to bring the ball up court and start the offense, namely Alec and Jubril.
QuoteSadly I expect that Donlon has already come up with strategies that will eliminate or largely reduce the advantages of that option. That is his job. Perhaps Bryce is as we speak rummaging through his trick bag with the hope that he has not yet run completely out of rabbits. Time will tell.
Aren't we forgetting that Valpo has two players named Walker that have brought a whole load of talent and options for Bryce to use?
You'd think Bryce had read this message board before the game-----and after watching Nickerson bring the ball up court thought "why not have a talented Tavonn bring it up court for EVN?"
I missed the game but watched the replay late last night. What hit me was simply "boys against men"! Forget about our size advantage on the front line, it's our guards that I'm talking about. Big Ten type guards. Max Joseph is 6'1 205#, T Walker is 6'1" 195#, D Walker is 6'3" 215#. Wright State counters with guys 5'9" 160#, 6'2" 175# and 6'4" 170#.
As the game(s) progress, the muscle and weight differences will no doubt wear our opponents down.
I think all of this extra playing time at the point guard position is going to make Nickerson a FORCE at the #3 spot next year. If he is relatively pain free by next year, and not worn out from having to bring the ball up the floor, I think we could have one hell of a 6-8 slasher from the sides. A player like him will really help us against high major teams.
Talk about having some depth. I think you bring a guy like D. Walker off the bench so that he is the primary scoring threat when Carter, T. Walker and Peters get a rest. I think sometimes we put our "best 5" in the starting lineup and then when we make our 1st round of substitutions we are left with nobody on the floor who "wants to be the man" to take the shots.
Carter / Lexus
T. Walker / D. Walker
Nickerson / Hammink
Peters / Skara
Smits / Jubril
Quote from: SanityLost17 on January 18, 2015, 09:42:31 AMCarter / Lexus T. Walker / D. Walker Nickerson / Hammink Peters / Skara Smits / Jubril
What a scary lineup, especially when you think that Max Joseph and Relvao (red shirt maybe?) and the UMKC transfer will also be there waiting for an opportunity. This a really really deep and diverse (in terms of talents) team.
Quote from: ValpoFan on January 18, 2015, 11:19:00 AM
Quote from: SanityLost17 on January 18, 2015, 09:42:31 AMCarter / Lexus T. Walker / D. Walker Nickerson / Hammink Peters / Skara Smits / Jubril
What a scary lineup, especially when you think that Max Joseph and Relvao (red shirt maybe?) and the UMKC transfer will also be there waiting for an opportunity. This a really really deep and diverse (in terms of talents) team.
Let's not forget Davidson. I like what I have seen when he has been on the court this year, and I am hoping he will add depth to the bench next year. Though in limited time thus far this year, Nick has shot 43% (6-14) from the 3-pt. line, 100% (6-6) from the free throw line, and committed only 6 turnovers in nearly 90 minutes of play.
Quote from: ValpoFan on January 18, 2015, 11:19:00 AM
Quote from: SanityLost17 on January 18, 2015, 09:42:31 AMCarter / Lexus T. Walker / D. Walker Nickerson / Hammink Peters / Skara Smits / Jubril
What a scary lineup, especially when you think that Max Joseph and Relvao (red shirt maybe?) and the UMKC transfer will also be there waiting for an opportunity. This a really really deep and diverse (in terms of talents) team.
Yes, Yes but I have asked this before. Who is the shot blocker? Vashil helps the guards defensively with his presence in the middle. He alters shots, forces drivers to pull hope for jumps shots or floaters and grabs rebounds. He plays above the rim. It would be very hard for our guards to drive the lane against a shot blocker, but fortunately, the HL doesn't have very many good ones.
Don't get me wrong, I liked Kevin Van Wijk. He was a better fundamental basketball player than Vashil (Vashil has only been playing for 6 years). But I really enjoy the athleticism that Vashil brings to the table. We also had another player who played above the rim in Moussa. Again, Kevin was a much better basketball player. The HL is full of centers who bang and post with a decent outside jumper. But it's the major conferences who have players who can jump out of the gym and have the athleticism. Why do you think we settle for jumpers and three's against the Missouri's and New Mexico's? Even Nebraska. Because we aren't as athletic and they have guys that can throw our shots back.
The big guys coming in are very different type of players than Vashil and bring different skill sets.
We need another Vashil or pay the NCAA to grant him another year.
Team
1 Cleveland State 5 1 11 9
2 Valparaiso 4 1 17 3
3 Green Bay 4 1 15 4
4 Detroit 3 2 9 10
5 Oakland 2 2 6 12
6 Wright State 2 3 10 9
7 Milwaukee 1 3 6 12
8 UIC 1 3 5 14
9 Youngstown State 0 6 9 12