Looked at ESPN Sportscenter tonight online, and it shows the game Friday night on ESPNU.
Late tip time and on the U. I'm going to have to go someplace to watch this one.
Valpo 71-69 winners (I can never pick against the Crusaders)
I think it's more important for Green Bay to win this at home against valpo minus a point guard. I wonder what vegas will set the spread at? Green Bay -4?
We win in the last 5 minutes:
Valpo 72
GB 64
Valpo 75
Woogie Boogie 74
I don't have an exact score but we loose by 8. I think we shoot cold and our pgs play bad. We need Keith back.
Quote from: HC on January 21, 2015, 09:12:17 PM
Late tip time and on the U. I'm going to have to go someplace to watch this one.
ESPNU - sigh. I wonder if the replay will be available to non-U subscribers on ESPN3?
I think we win this one by 6, 73-67. I think Fouse and Mays will have issues scoring down low like most teams do against us. While the length of EVN effects Sykes enough to have an off night. We win a close one and ice the game at the end with the homerun pass and free-throws.
Hoping for the win but expecting an L:
GB 71
VU 63
This game is important for UWGB's NIT seed, so I expect a loss. We'll get them back at home though.
Quote from: a3uge on January 22, 2015, 08:56:03 AM
This game is important for UWGB's NIT seed, so I expect a loss. We'll get them back at home though.
(http://i905.photobucket.com/albums/ac253/K5SS/i-see-what-you-did-there-meme.jpg)
Sykes, Love, and Fouse combine to average 10 steals a game. CSU and WSU might be more aggressive, but GB is the best defensive team in the Horizon. WSU had to invent a press to play us (usually half court pressure only under Donlon)where as GB uses it as part of their regular rotation of defenses. Add in the fact that they have a very big body in Mays, and an athletic 4 that can leap in McKinney and we are not going to have the rebound cushion we are going to need to make up for the 20+ turnovers we are going to have.
We lose by 15. Lots of turnovers for easy buckets.
With a healthy Carter I think this game is a toss-up.
With a healthy Carter and Lexus we are the better team because of depth and coaching ability.
Hopefully Carter is healthy and rust free by the return game.
Cleveland State is by far the toughest defensive team in the league. They use the full court press just about every time. GB doesn't. CSU forces the most steals in the league, GB is 3rd behind UDM and CSU. Yes, they are very strong defensively and so are we. We force perimeter shots which isn't GBs forte, their top 3 point shooter is McKinnie at 36%. GB likes getting to the rim, Vashil is the best defensive player in the league. I think Vashil is the key to the game. If he stays out of foul trouble I like our chances but this is GB and the zebras will call everything on us and nothing on them. If the refs call the game evenly I think we're the better team. This will be a close game and will come down to coaching and Wardle is an idiot so...
Just looked at the UWGB schedule... (yes, I washed my hands right after)...
The Friday Night game is:
Valparaiso (Bud Light Night) *
Interesting...
Quote from: classof2014 on January 22, 2015, 10:19:14 AM
Cleveland State is by far the toughest defensive team in the league. They use the full court press just about every time. GB doesn't. CSU forces the most steals in the league, GB is 3rd behind UDM and CSU. Yes, they are very strong defensively and so are we. We force perimeter shots which isn't GBs forte, their top 3 point shooter is McKinnie at 36%. GB likes getting to the rim, Vashil is the best defensive player in the league. I think Vashil is the key to the game. If he stays out of foul trouble I like our chances but this is GB and the zebras will call everything on us and nothing on them. If the refs call the game evenly I think we're the better team. This will be a close game and will come down to coaching and Wardle is an idiot so...
I tend to agree. It should be a very close game, coming down to turnovers, fouls and FTs. I think GB will pull out (from a diaper) the win. I hope I'm wrong.
Valpo 65
GB 67
I kind of expect/somewhat hope we play a lot of zone in this one. Mix up the defenses to keep them out of an offensive rhythm. When we are playing man, rotate who's guarding Skyes. E and Tevonn each bring a completely different style of defense. We all know what can happen if we let Sykes get comfortable and in a groove.
Offensively I want to see our guards come off the ball screen hard and attack Mays' outer hip, assuming he's guarding Vashil. Either make the refs make a call or if he gives way then turn the corner and attack. And when we do get into the lane, please pump fake. Especially Alec. GB is going to be flying all over the place trying to block shots.
Here's to Bryce outcoaching the crap out of Wardle, us taking care of the ball, and someone other than Alec having a big night (game screams Tevonn).
Valpo 64
GB 60
Quote from: talksalot on January 22, 2015, 10:41:25 AM
Just looked at the UWGB schedule... (yes, I washed my hands right after)...
The Friday Night game is:
Valparaiso (Bud Light Night) *
Interesting...
I wish the ARC sold beer (not bud light though). This would be a great way to boost attendance. Hell, even Valpo high schoolers may come, granted we turn a blind eye when when students slip them a couple brews in the hallway for a few bucks.
Quote from: agibson on January 22, 2015, 08:10:22 AMESPNU - sigh. I wonder if the replay will be available to non-U subscribers on ESPN3?
Yes, ESPN 3 does make these games available to watch on their "REPLAY" tab. Unfortunately it can be up to 3 to 5 hours after the game is over.
Quote from: valpo4life on January 22, 2015, 11:07:18 AMHere's to Bryce outcoaching the crap out of Wardle,
Well, that would really be turning the tables on "Mr. Shartmaster." It's about time.
Some KenPom stats to give us hope:Green Bay shoots a dreadful 29.8% from 3 point range, second worst in the conference. We are the 3rd best 3 point defense in the league allowing 34.8%. (NCAA average is 33.9%, we're not a good conference at defending the 3.)
Green Bay hits only 61.9% of their free throws, by far the worst in the conference. Our opponents have hit 71.0% of their free throws, something we can't really "defend" against, we've just played good FT shooting teams. Friday will not be one of those cases.
Green Bay's steal percentage is worse than CSU's. We survived that game with a victory and 19 turnovers. So we could project less turnovers against Green Bay. We also gave up 4 fast break points and 11 points off turnovers to CSU inspite our 19 turnovers.
Green Bay tends to slow teams to a crawling pace, forcing teams to take 19.3 seconds per possession. This is 35th slowest in the country. Luckily we play at a slow pace, averaging 18.3 seconds per possession. Green Bay plays a little quicker, 17.4 seconds per possession, and our average opponent will take 18.4 seconds per possession. It's why they are predicting the game go finish at 64-59
Somethings gotta give statsGreen Bay is the best 2 point shooting team in the league (37th best in the country) hitting 52.2% of their shots. We have the best 2 point shooting defense in the league (and 9th best in the country) allowing 41.3%. (NCAA average is 47.6%)
We have the best 3 point shooting team in the league hitting 37.9% of our attempts. Green Bay holds teams to 32.0% shooting from behind the arc, 2nd best in the conference.
Neither team gets their shots blocked. Green Bay is best in the league only having 7.9% of their shots blocked while Valpo is second with 8.0% of their shots getting rejected. But both teams block a lot of shots. 13.2% of the shots put up against Valpo are sent back whence it came, best in the league. Green Bay is (you guessed it!) second with 12.9% of the shots attempted against blocked.
Middle of the road statsGreen Bay's offense is ranked 5th in steals allowed, 9.7% of the time the possession results in a steal (tied with Valpo). Valpo's defense steals the ball 8.8% of the time which is ranked 4th in the conference. The NCAA average is 9.5. Not a super telling stat.
Green Bay's opponents have shot poorly from the FT line, hitting 64.5% of their shots. We hit 68.1% (about inline with the NCAA average of 68.8%), so maybe we can capitalize a little on this?
Stats that make you go Uh Oh.Green Bay's adjusted defensive efficiency is ranked 12th in the country. The raw defensive efficiency is equally troubling, ranking at 25th in the country. Our offense is very middle of the pack with a 124 adjusted rank. We are ranked 40th in raw offensive efficiency, but that just shows we've played a very weak schedule.
The only statistical category their defense is ranked over 100 in is Free Throw attempts per Field Goal attempts, they allow .38 free throws for every field goal attempted. Unfortunately we're not built to (or our offense just doesn't) capitalize on this "deficiency" as we rank 250th on the offensive side of this stat. I use quotes for deficiency, because they are still in the top 200, and it's not killed them yet. In their 4 losses they've given up an average of 26 FTs, but teams only shot 64.7%, what's beaten Green Bay is their inability to shoot from downtown, hitting 20.3% of their 3s in losses.
Keys for Valpo:
- Force Green Bay to shoot threes and limit their second chances. McKinnie, Fouse, Mays and Lowe are all excellent on the offensive glass, and they capitalize on their second looks.
- Cut off the lane from Keither. If Sykes gets to the rim he will finish. As much as we laud Vashil, he won't stop him either, as he's deft at getting the bigger defender up in the air and drawing the foul or floating it over their outstreched arms. He's also capable of finding the open man (usually Mays or Lowe) after the big has left to try to block Keifer's lay up attempts. If you keep him on the perimeter he's a lot less dangerous than he is when he gets the ball in the lane.
- Get to the free throw line, then make them. They will get into foul trouble, you can take advantage of a less than deep bench and you can get to the line. Make the shots when you get them.
Early Vegas line has UWGB by 5.
Quote from: bbtds on January 22, 2015, 12:11:58 PM
Quote from: agibson on January 22, 2015, 08:10:22 AMESPNU - sigh. I wonder if the replay will be available to non-U subscribers on ESPN3?
Yes, ESPN 3 does make these games available to watch on their "REPLAY" tab. Unfortunately it can be up to 3 to 5 hours after the game is over.
Sometimes they're up pretty quick. Within an hour of completion, say.
I was mostly concerned that the archive might _still_ be restricted to subscribers of ESPN_U_. But, I'll take your reply as one vote of confidence, at least.
Coming from the elementary school talent show, I'll have to decide whether to take in the tail-end on the radio, or wait to hopefully watch the whole thing, unspoiled?, on replay.
Quote from: a3uge on January 22, 2015, 11:28:55 AM
Quote from: talksalot on January 22, 2015, 10:41:25 AM
Just looked at the UWGB schedule... (yes, I washed my hands right after)...
The Friday Night game is:
Valparaiso (Bud Light Night) *
Interesting...
I wish the ARC sold beer (not bud light though). This would be a great way to boost attendance. Hell, even Valpo high schoolers may come, granted we turn a blind eye when when students slip them a couple brews in the hallway for a few bucks.
I like your thinking I'll spread the word if it happens. ;)
Quote from: a3uge on January 22, 2015, 08:56:03 AM
This game is important for UWGB's NIT seed, so I expect a loss. We'll get them back at home though.
This definitely sets a record for "most likes of a post predicting a vu loss"
Quote from: agibson on January 22, 2015, 01:20:50 PMI was mostly concerned that the archive might _still_ be restricted to subscribers of ESPN_U_. But, I'll take your reply as one vote of confidence, at least.
Correct, only the live broadcasts are restricted to ESPN subscribers. Non-ESPN subscribers whose internet providers provide ESPN 3 can view the replays.
Quote from: bbtds on January 22, 2015, 12:11:58 PM
Quote from: agibson on January 22, 2015, 08:10:22 AMESPNU - sigh. I wonder if the replay will be available to non-U subscribers on ESPN3?
Yes, ESPN 3 does make these games available to watch on their "REPLAY" tab. Unfortunately it can be up to 3 to 5 hours after the game is over.
This I don't understand. I have a basic cable package and get ESPNU at no additional charge. Either move to Dallas or complain loudly!! >:(
UWGB men ready for 'biggest game yet' vs. Valpo
http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/story/sports/college/uwgb/2015/01/22/uwgb-men-ready-biggest-game-yet-vs-valpo/22191529/ (http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/story/sports/college/uwgb/2015/01/22/uwgb-men-ready-biggest-game-yet-vs-valpo/22191529/)
History tells me that this game will be decided by the refs... Sorry but that is how I feel about some of the Horizon League road games.
They will call everything for the home team until the end and then try to make the calls look less one sided after they have impacted the game enough that it won't matter.
Did I wake up on the wrong side of the bed or what. ......
Quote from: Smj on January 23, 2015, 08:04:47 AM
History tells me that this game will be decided by the refs... Sorry but that is how I feel about some of the Horizon League road games.
They will call everything for the home team until the end and then try to make the calls look less one sided after they have impacted the game enough that it won't matter.
Did I wake up on the wrong side of the bed or what. ......
I'm not sure this is entirely accurate. I mean look at games we have at home. I don't think we get an inordinate calls in our favor and if anything I think we have terrible home court "advantage" when it comes to refs. I don't trust the refs to call an even game, but to say that the calls will be slanted towards the home team might be wrong. I don't think you can predict which team will get the better end of the calls for the refs tonight.
Quote from: Smj on January 23, 2015, 08:04:47 AM
History tells me that this game will be decided by the refs... Sorry but that is how I feel about some of the Horizon League road games.
They will call everything for the home team until the end and then try to make the calls look less one sided after they have impacted the game enough that it won't matter.
Did I wake up on the wrong side of the bed or what. ......
Fully agree with that statement just look at the stat line from last game in GB.
They shot 41% (21/51), 27% from 3 (3/11) for a total of: 45 points
We shot 36% (21/58), 25 % from 3 (6/17) for a total of: 48 points
-So based on those few stats you would imagine the game would've been closer than a 14 point win for GB. So what is the difference if we scored more on regular basketball plays? Fouls, we had 7 free throws (5/7) while they had 25 free throws (22/25). I remember watching this game and getting quite enraged at the refs. I'm not saying we would've won if all was equal but the refs had a very heavy influence on this game, 18 more free throw opportunities is redicilous.
Hopefully since the game is nationally televised, so the HL is broadcasted everywhere, perhaps the refs will want to call the game easily and not make a fool out of themselves in front of the country.
I was poking around on the GB message board: this is one of the funniest posts I've seen in a while:
QuoteI have noticed this in the past when checking out other message boards but I didn't realize this was a thing...Valpo fans don't like GB and despise Coach Wardle. I have no clue where that came from but it may be the weirdest one way rivalry in the league. They ripped on him winning coach of the year last year and they think they will win tonight because Wardle will mess it up.
Quote from: classof2014 on January 23, 2015, 08:25:31 AM
I was poking around on the GB message board: this is one of the funniest posts I've seen in a while:
QuoteI have noticed this in the past when checking out other message boards but I didn't realize this was a thing...Valpo fans don't like GB and despise Coach Wardle. I have no clue where that came from but it may be the weirdest one way rivalry in the league. They ripped on him winning coach of the year last year and they think they will win tonight because Wardle will mess it up.
I don't think anyone on here has called UWGB a rival. I'm not sure we despise Wardle, but at the very least, most of us consider him a laughable choice for coach of the year last year - after all, with 2 NBA players, his team failed to reach the HL Championship game for the first time in 17 years despite playing a team at home that finished below .500 in conference that was on less than 24 hours rest.
But maybe he's corrected these problems this year by making sure all of his players got laid over the offseason.
I thought it was odd GB message board only has 4 post about the Valpo game.
They don't have time to post...they're running sprints till
(https://media.zenfs.com/en-US/video/video.snl.com/SNL_1063_05_Oops_I_Crapped_My_Pants.png)
I feel like fans of other teams used to post on this board more often. We've been rude to pretty much every team in the league. Id like to say our trollability is top notch.
*waits for token Oral Roberts fan to post
Quote from: a3uge on January 23, 2015, 09:07:04 AM
Quote from: classof2014 on January 23, 2015, 08:25:31 AM
I was poking around on the GB message board: this is one of the funniest posts I've seen in a while:
QuoteI have noticed this in the past when checking out other message boards but I didn't realize this was a thing...Valpo fans don't like GB and despise Coach Wardle. I have no clue where that came from but it may be the weirdest one way rivalry in the league. They ripped on him winning coach of the year last year and they think they will win tonight because Wardle will mess it up.
I don't think anyone on here has called UWGB a rival. I'm not sure we despise Wardle, but at the very least, most of us consider him a laughable choice for coach of the year last year - after all, with 2 NBA players, his team failed to reach the HL Championship game for the first time in 17 years despite playing a team at home that finished below .500 in conference that was on less than 24 hours rest.
But maybe he's corrected these problems this year by making sure all of his players got laid over the offseason.
As far as not getting to the finals last year, I would mention in passing that his 2 NBA players were both not 100% at the time. Recently watched some video of that game and Sykes toughed it out but was limping and Brown just played bad. Don't know that this is Wardle's fault totally. However, he owns his coaching style and treatment of players which was so elegantly aired for all to read. Wardle retained despite allegations (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9308960/wisconsin-green-bay-coach-brian-wardle-keep-job-investigation)
Quote from: FWalum on January 23, 2015, 09:42:39 AM
As far as not getting to the finals last year, I would mention in passing that his 2 NBA players were both not 100% at the time. Recently watched some video of that game and Sykes toughed it out but was limping and Brown just played bad. Don't know that this is Wardle's fault totally. However, he owns his coaching style and treatment of players which was so elegantly aired for all to read. Wardle retained despite allegations (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9308960/wisconsin-green-bay-coach-brian-wardle-keep-job-investigation)
Even though Sykes was playing injured you can still put quite a bit of blame on Wardle for the loss to UWM. A good coach would have his team prepared for a big game like this and would have his team ready to play with a not 100% Sykes, who even impaired was better than a majority of UWM's players. I'm not blaming Wardle for Brown's poor play but shouldn't a first-teamer be prepared for the opportunity to play in the NCAAs. The lack of the team preparedness I do blame on the coach, it is up to him to instill confidence in his players to go in a take down a mediocre to sub-par Milwaukee team in order to advance to the finals.
GB wasn't ready for the game. That's poor coaching in my mind. UWM was, Jeter should've been coach of the year last season. Milwaukee was expected to do nothing and they won the championship and played great when it mattered most.
I don't like Wardle and never will. I think he's a great recruiter, got two NBAers on his team and both were playing there at once and couldn't even make it to the HL finals. Until Wardle proves he can do something more than make it past the first round of the tourney in my mind he's not a great coach, not to mention the numerous allegations of him in the past.
The voting was before the tournament and, didn't you guys get beat at home in the tournament championship game by the 3 seed. So does that mean Drew is a crap coach. If I remember right the next year you won on a miracle shot, with everyone healthy. Guess your logic only applies to everyone else.
Valpo was picked 4th preseason '11-'12. Weren't expected to play in the HL championship, not to mention host the whole tourney. That's coaching.
GB was the preseason favorite last year. To be fair, they played to expectations right up through February. However, the lost in the SEMIS to a mediocre Milwaukee squad.
'11-12 Detroit, McCallum and co. > Milwaukee last year.
Last, and CERTAINLY not least, Drew isn't abusive of his players.
Quote from: a3uge on January 23, 2015, 09:20:24 AM*waits for token Oral Roberts Oakland fan to post
Quote from: Grizz on January 23, 2015, 11:25:13 AMThe voting was before the tournament and, didn't you guys get beat at home in the tournament championship game by the 3 seed. So does that mean Drew is a crap coach. If I remember right the next year you won on a miracle shot, with everyone healthy. Guess your logic only applies to everyone else.
Quote from: Grizz on January 23, 2015, 11:25:13 AM
The voting was before the tournament and, didn't you guys get beat at home in the tournament championship game by the 3 seed. So does that mean Drew is a crap coach. If I remember right the next year you won on a miracle shot, with everyone healthy. Guess your logic only applies to everyone else.
I'm trying to recall, how many "future NBA players" did we have when we hit the "miracle" shot? I'm trying to recall, did we go ahead and win that game and the championship, or did we get humiliated like the team with 2 "future NBA players" and the COY did by the no. 5 seed on their home court? I'm trying to recall, when Bryce Drew did not get COY 2 years ago, wasn't the explanation from people in the know (including 1 of our local reporters with a vote) that you don't give the award to the guy whose team merely did what they were predicted to do? I'm trying to recall, didn't the same bunch the next year vote Wardle COY when GB was the preseason selection to win conference? Last, but not least, I'm trying to recall how many times in the 3 years that 2 "future NBA players" shared the court did GB represent the HL in the NCAA tournament? What if by some miracle they don't go this year? Imagine a mid major team with 2 "future NBA players" being guided by "one of the up and coming young coaches" going 5 seasons and never winning the conference tournament. I'm trying to recall, has there ever been a program in the history of the HL that has so underperformed relative to talent and expectations?
Brown never played 1 minute in the NBA and your kid who is playing over seas was a better player. YOU KNOW THAT! And the hype machine aside is Sykes at 5-9 a NBA player? would you bet on that.
Quote from: classof2014 on January 23, 2015, 10:18:55 AM
Quote from: FWalum on January 23, 2015, 09:42:39 AM
As far as not getting to the finals last year, I would mention in passing that his 2 NBA players were both not 100% at the time. Recently watched some video of that game and Sykes toughed it out but was limping and Brown just played bad. Don't know that this is Wardle's fault totally. However, he owns his coaching style and treatment of players which was so elegantly aired for all to read. Wardle retained despite allegations (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9308960/wisconsin-green-bay-coach-brian-wardle-keep-job-investigation)
Even though Sykes was playing injured you can still put quite a bit of blame on Wardle for the loss to UWM. A good coach would have his team prepared for a big game like this and would have his team ready to play with a not 100% Sykes, who even impaired was better than a majority of UWM's players. I'm not blaming Wardle for Brown's poor play but shouldn't a first-teamer be prepared for the opportunity to play in the NCAAs. The lack of the team preparedness I do blame on the coach, it is up to him to instill confidence in his players to go in a take down a mediocre to sub-par Milwaukee team in order to advance to the finals.
GB wasn't ready for the game. That's poor coaching in my mind. UWM was, Jeter should've been coach of the year last season. Milwaukee was expected to do nothing and they won the championship and played great when it mattered most.
I don't like Wardle and never will. I think he's a great recruiter, got two NBAers on his team and both were playing there at once and couldn't even make it to the HL finals. Until Wardle proves he can do something more than make it past the first round of the tourney in my mind he's not a great coach, not to mention the numerous allegations of him in the past.
They also weren't ready to represent the Horizon in the NIT 10 days later, where they lost to Belmont by 15. Were Sykes and Brown still hurt 10 days later?
Quote from: Grizz on January 23, 2015, 11:25:13 AM
The voting was before the tournament and, didn't you guys get beat at home in the tournament championship game by the 3 seed. So does that mean Drew is a crap coach. If I remember right the next year you won on a miracle shot, with everyone healthy. Guess your logic only applies to everyone else.
Never said the voting was before the tournament, doesn't make it less laughable knowing the result. No, we didn't get beat at home in the semi finals by a team on less than 24 hours rest to a team that finished below .500 in conference (comparing a team with an NBA player to UWM is laughable). And yes, we did win the conference the next year. Yes, we did score more points than the other team, which is the whole point of basketball. You inanely brought up that game - at the end UWGB was completely unprepared since for some reason Cougill was a) in the game, b) not playing for rebound, c) guarding Broekhoff for a reasonable-distance 3 point shot. Maybe, just maybe, Wardle's coaching didn't get through to him? And no, not everyone was healthy as Van Wijk was carried off the court and came back out after god knows what was injected in him. Nice try though.
I checked the record books and yes, you lost in the conference finals to the 3 seed by 20. If any other coach in the league had done that you boys on this board would crucify him. FACT.
This is a game in which the team shows it real character stays with it solid defense continues to work the ball inside on offence and rebounds strongly.This will disrupt UWGB and give the team the chance to win on the road. This team continues to grow in ways not expected I hope it can continue. If so Vu 74 UWGB 66, if not it will be a long Bus ride home. ::)
Quote from: vu72 on January 23, 2015, 12:37:06 PM
They also weren't ready to represent the Horizon in the NIT 10 days later, where they lost to Belmont by 15. Were Sykes and Brown still hurt 10 days later?
Sykes didn't play in that game, so yes. Brown played 28 minutes and had the worst game of that season, but was he hurt against Milwaukee? He played 35 minutes.
Quote from: Grizz on January 23, 2015, 12:31:34 PM
Brown never played 1 minute in the NBA and your kid who is playing over seas was a better player. YOU KNOW THAT! And the hype machine aside is Sykes at 5-9 a NBA player? would you bet on that.
You're arguing points that nobody's making. And Brown hasn't played in the NBA because he tore up his shoulder. Sykes is projected 32nd overall on NBA Draft net. So yes, I would probably bet on that. Also, he isn't listed at 5'9 on any site I could find. On ESPN, CBS, DraftExpress, NBA Draft Net, and UWGBs website he's listed as 6ft. You're just making stuff up at this point.
Quote from: Grizz on January 23, 2015, 12:43:41 PM
I checked the record books and yes, you lost in the conference finals to the 3 seed by 20. If any other coach in the league had done that you boys on this board would crucify him. FACT.
Yes, a very disappointing loss indeed. I've often wondered if we would have been better prepared to play that game had we played 6 high major teams during OOC play. I guess we'll never know... ;)
If he is 6-0, I will drive to Mayberry and buy you a dinner at the finest restaurant you have there. (Probably a Steak and Shake). I stood next to him at our game last week and while he has about 3 inches of hair, Maybe they are counting that, but I'm 5-10 and I was bigger then he was.
Quote from: Grizz on January 23, 2015, 12:43:41 PM
I checked the record books and yes, you lost in the conference finals to the 3 seed by 20. If any other coach in the league had done that you boys on this board would crucify him. FACT.
Love how you completely change topics to troll elsewhere. Wright State lost at home to the very same team that UWGB lost to and we didn't crucify Donlon. FACT.
But thanks for letting us how we would have felt in these hypothetical straw man scenarios.
Quote from: Grizz on January 23, 2015, 01:08:52 PM
If he is 6-0, I will drive to Mayberry and buy you a dinner at the finest restaurant you have there. (Probably a Steak and Shake). I stood next to him at our game last week and while he has about 3 inches of hair, Maybe they are counting that, but I'm 5-10 and I was bigger then he was.
Keep your phone ready for NBA scouts - Grizz's height estimates is the determination for whether or not a player will get drafted!
He will get measured at the NBA pre draft camp. Would you like to make a wager. My meal to what you are willing to bet. Maybe giving me fishing lessons or a ride on your 4 wheeler.
Quote from: Grizz on January 23, 2015, 01:31:40 PM
He will get measured at the NBA pre draft camp. Would you like to make a wager. My meal to what you are willing to bet. Maybe giving me fishing lessons or a ride on your 4 wheeler.
Aren't you from Detroit?
Green Bay is a good team this year. However, they are beatable, Oakland beat them. :o
They did didn't they. In fact Oakland is 2-0 against Valpo and Green Bay. If a crap team like Oakland can win, surely Valpo with all their wins over non d-1's can beat Green Bay and their crap coach. Oh, unless the refs let Skyes shoot 25 free throws.
Quote from: Grizz on January 23, 2015, 01:49:09 PM
They did didn't they. In fact Oakland is 2-0 against Valpo and Green Bay. If a crap team like Oakland can win, surely Valpo with all their wins over non d-1's can beat Green Bay and their crap coach. Oh, unless the refs let Skyes shoot 25 free throws.
Go home.
Does that mean No Bet in Mayberrynies
A man from Michigan needing fishing lessons, isn't really much of a man at all.
Did the Oakland fan board get repossessed? Why not just go over there and crack on how some of us hillbillies in Mayberry think?
Oakland should be right at the top of the league standings (with GB, Valpo and CSU) at the midway point with all these home games.
Quote from: HC on January 23, 2015, 02:01:06 PM
A man from Michigan needing fishing lessons, isn't really much of a man at all.
Did the Oakland fan board get repossessed? Why not just go over there and crack on how some of us hillbillies in Mayberry think?
Oakland should be right at the top of the league standings (with GB, Valpo and CSU) at the midway point with all these home games.
Maybe he thinks Oakland University is in Oakland, California?
Quote from: a3uge on January 23, 2015, 01:37:23 PM
Quote from: Grizz on January 23, 2015, 01:31:40 PM
He will get measured at the NBA pre draft camp. Would you like to make a wager. My meal to what you are willing to bet. Maybe giving me fishing lessons or a ride on your 4 wheeler.
Aren't you from Detroit?
We can buy him one of those $1 houses (http://www.businessinsider.com/detroit-houses-for-1-dollar-2012-2?op=1). Man is he going to be pissed when we all eat Don Quiote on his tab. I could easily rack up $75 by myself there in wine, tapas and dessert.
Quote from: Kyle321n on January 23, 2015, 02:28:50 PM
Quote from: a3uge on January 23, 2015, 01:37:23 PM
Quote from: Grizz on January 23, 2015, 01:31:40 PM
He will get measured at the NBA pre draft camp. Would you like to make a wager. My meal to what you are willing to bet. Maybe giving me fishing lessons or a ride on your 4 wheeler.
Aren't you from Detroit?
We can buy him one of those $1 houses (http://www.businessinsider.com/detroit-houses-for-1-dollar-2012-2?op=1). Man is he going to be pissed when we all eat Don Quiote on his tab. I could easily rack up $75 by myself there in wine, tapas and dessert.
Even better, let's find out which house he lived in as as a kid before his parents departed via the white flight express and buy that one for him.
Quote from: a3uge on January 23, 2015, 09:20:24 AM
I feel like fans of other teams used to post on this board more often. We've been rude to pretty much every team in the league. Id like to say our trollability is top notch.
*waits for token Oral Roberts fan to post
Beetlejuice! Beetlejuice! Beetlejuice! (Betelgeuse?)
Good on you, Grizz.
Who was the wisconsin guy who would come on, and even was at the ARC a couple of times? Was that UWM guy?
Quote from: agibson on January 23, 2015, 02:44:10 PM
Who was the wisconsin guy who would come on, and even was at the ARC a couple of times? Was that UWM guy?
The one who said UIC to the MVC was a "done deal" per sources?
Quote from: a3uge on January 23, 2015, 02:45:04 PM
Quote from: agibson on January 23, 2015, 02:44:10 PM
Who was the wisconsin guy who would come on, and even was at the ARC a couple of times? Was that UWM guy?
The one who said UIC to the MVC was a "done deal" per sources?
Jimmy aka PantherU
Quote from: Grizz on January 23, 2015, 01:08:52 PM
If he is 6-0, I will drive to Mayberry and buy you a dinner at the finest restaurant you have there. (Probably a Steak and Shake). I stood next to him at our game last week and while he has about 3 inches of hair, Maybe they are counting that, but I'm 5-10 and I was bigger then he was.
Just so you know I saw a picture of him standing next to a doorway with a height measurement and he was indeed EXACTLY 6ft!!! I'll try to find the picture for you. You better give him that dinner!! ;)
Quote from: oklahomamick on January 23, 2015, 01:45:52 PMGreen Bay is a good team this year. However, they are beatable, Oakland beat them. :o
Grizz, I posted that to agitate you....
Quote from: oklahomamick on January 23, 2015, 03:02:07 PM
Grizz, I posted that to agitate you....
let me know if it works
Quote from: Grizz on January 23, 2015, 01:56:47 PM
Does that mean No Bet in Mayberrynies
Nice having you visit. Perhaps you could come down to Valpo and watch the Crusaders in yet another post season tournament appearance. You won't have to worry about not being able to follow Oakland's post season play because of all your payday, kill the Horizon League's rpi games. Oh, and if you're from Detroit, I wouldn't be sitting around looking at your computer too long. If I were you I'd be mostly concerned about your car being stolen. And for God's sake, don't stop at the local ATM after the sun goes down!
Quote from: Grizz on January 23, 2015, 01:31:40 PM
He will get measured at the NBA pre draft camp. Would you like to make a wager. My meal to what you are willing to bet. Maybe giving me fishing lessons or a ride on your 4 wheeler.
With Sykes it's not the height. It's the leaping ability and scoring that will get him in the NBA.
Keifer Sykes Slams Green Bay to Victory at UIC (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdFkK338i4I#ws)
Grizz, what's happened to you? Your nasty comments are in contract to the thoughtful, more respectful comments I remember you making in previous years, even in strong disagreements.
Ok, I'll take the bait, Oakland is nowhere near Detroit, located in one of the richest counties in the USA we have many things to do. I know that you all just got cable and a pizza hut because I've been to many a game at your place. In the old days I would meet up with Richard Harlin before the games, of course that was when Valpo fans didnt feel the need to bad mouth other schools to make them feel better about themselfs. Back whenValpo was good, really good.
About the bet, I know some of you can't read well because you just got indoor power, but all I said was he's under six feet and would you Bet on him ever playing in the NBA. Never gave my opinion on that. Slow down when you read. Yea green bay was the host and lost but so were you. The guy there has a pretty good two year run going, give him some credit. And don't believe what you read on the Internet , if he was what you say he is, he would have been fired in this day and age.
Man, when did Valpo fans get so angry about everything? I think many of the posters on here need to watch this. Pay particular attention to the part about "we never beat our chests" and "we didn't scare so easily."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zqOYBabXmA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zqOYBabXmA)
Oren is one of them! When the sun comes up tomorrow (since we don't have electricity, and we may have some extra rage) I say we take our mob over to the newspaper stand by the general store and administer some angry mob justice.
Can the game start so everyone can go back to complaining about the refs?
Quote from: Pgmado on January 23, 2015, 05:18:28 PM
Man, when did Valpo fans get so angry about everything? I think many of the posters on here need to watch this. Pay particular attention to the part about "we never beat our chests" and "we didn't scare so easily."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zqOYBabXmA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zqOYBabXmA)
Either you are with us or you are with the terrorists (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpPABLW6F_A#)
Quote from: Pgmado on January 23, 2015, 05:18:28 PM
Man, when did Valpo fans get so angry about everything? I think many of the posters on here need to watch this. Pay particular attention to the part about "we never beat our chests" and "we didn't scare so easily."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zqOYBabXmA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zqOYBabXmA)
:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
Amen, pgmado.
Kampe disciples to the rescue of the Oakland troller. ::)
Quote from: HC on January 23, 2015, 05:32:28 PMCan the game start so everyone can go back to complaining about the refs?
Which reminds me that I was the sole supporter of last years @ GB ref crew. If the game goes as poorly tonight as that one did let me suggest ahead of time that you take the time to watch it replayed (and portions re-replayed) before you join with the lynch mob. The more I watched those replays the better I liked the ref crew and the less I liked some of you folks.
Here is how I remember your reactions to a fair, even but not perfectly called game--- Waaa :'( Waa :'( We didn't get our way!!! sniffle, sniffle!
You guys probably shouldn't have been so mean to Grizz because if we loose he's gonna try really hard to hurt our feelings. :( even more than he did earlier. ;)
Quote from: Pgmado on January 23, 2015, 05:18:28 PM
Man, when did Valpo fans get so angry about everything? I think many of the posters on here need to watch this. Pay particular attention to the part about "we never beat our chests" and "we didn't scare so easily."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zqOYBabXmA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zqOYBabXmA)
+1 :thumbsup:
Now that I'm done with the troller, I don't like our chances in this game without KC. To beat an athletic team with the best point guard in the league without any point guards just seems an almost overwhelming challenge. It would be great to win this game, but it won't be the end of the world if we don't. GB 69 Valpo 63. Obviously, I hope I'm wrong.
Here's a game link in case you want to watch the game live and don't have ESPNU:
http://firstrowusa.eu/basketball/first-valparaiso-green-bay-row581073 (http://firstrowusa.eu/basketball/first-valparaiso-green-bay-row581073)
I'm with you WH, don't think this is our time.
If we would have played Maryland, michigan st. And Pittsburgh we would have a better chance. Jk, jk grizz.
For those playing the drinking game. I've already heard one "ValparaIso."
Am I wrong again if I say Alec is player poorly the first 8 minutes?
Game changes a little when Vashil isn't on the floor.
Life is funny.
If they'd told us we'd be up 2 at half on the road at UWGB, we'd've taken it.
But after the second half of a first half like that...it feels like a bad deal instead.
Well, we weren't going to shoot 70% all day ; )
It's good to see us leading with hitting only 2 threes
Could have been valpo by 6 or so. Jabiru missed a bunny and had an open lane but lost control of the pass. Would be nice to steal one on the road. I think Green Bay will bring more defensive pressure and energy in the second. Why was Vashil off so long at the end of the 2nd half?
Quote from: oklahomamick on January 23, 2015, 09:01:46 PMWhy was Vashil off so long at the end of the 2nd half?
Fouls, guessing. But I hate the move because benching him so long effectively fouls him out anyway. If he got 3, sure, sit him, but I just hate the "get 2 fouls bench him" move.
EVN's shake, bake, and throw down was a thing of beauty. I also wondered why Vashil was off the floor so long. Worried that GB's shooting wakes up.
Strange offensive game plan this half. Go inside, fart around, lose the ball. We flat out suck this half, 7 minutes in.
Bad second half. Spread the court a little....
every possession has been a slog this half--on both sides.
certainly doesn't say much about peters for him to pass up a shot with a few seconds on the clock to force EVN to shoot from half court.
...either he doesn't know the game situation, or he needs to learn to be The Man.
Nice drive by EVN.
16 minutes into the second half, we still flat out suck. We're playing like slow, clueless children. Really ugly stuff. Can't believe we only trail by 1.
Well, having one timeout in the pocket would've really helped there.
(Of course, the other ones didn't exactly result in tic-tac-toe plays either.)
Eh, they were supposed to win. Entertaining game...we'll get them next time.
I'm about to rage. Why was Alec on the court so much he was God awful. What a bad shot at the end. I would've wanted Tevonn or Darien to take it.
Man, terrible coaching job by Bryce the entire second half, and terrible shot selection on the drives, when they were blocking everything. Bryce got outcoached by the coach that wants his players to crap their pants.
Also, Grizz, you went to Oakland University, I don't think that you should be speaking about being able to read. When you graduate from a school with a good academic reputation, then you can speak ;)
A terrific college basketball game. I wouldn't want to face ether in the NCAAs. E Victor, if playing with pain, is the real deal. What could we expect without pain? Get to the end of the season, at Valpo and we win the title game.
Most of the time I'm upset when Valpo loses but I'm actually ok with this loss. Equal teams slogged it out. Refs were consistent the entire night. One more shot and we win the game. As I said in the chat, these type of games are the reason I watch Valpo basketball. We'll get them at the ARC.
Great great game! EVN has come a long way since he took over the pg duties. That was like to heavyweights beating the snot out of each other, Valpo just couldn't get that last hit in.
Wow, holy bad. That was the least intelligent half of basketball I've ever seen Valpo play. Mistakes a'plenty and the same futile display of driving, being stuck, and throwing up a shot that had no chance. Over and over again. They had more bad possessions that half than they had good possessions. Lots of middle school quality garbage. Nasty stuff, really annoying to watch. Bad coaching, bad playing, bad basketball. Yuck.
How ridiculous that this game was even close? Either these two teams played their worst games of the season tonight or the Horizon league is a joke.
I really enjoyed that game (except for the outcome). Great defense, excellent coaching. By far Nickerson's best performance!
The announcers kept saying how great the defense was in the second half, but it was really the terrible shot selection. I did not like the alley-oop selection in this game, outside of the 1 on the inbounds pass in the second half. We threw it up from too far away, which allowed GB to adjust and foul/contest the dunk. How many trips in a row resulted in no points from both teams? This is the game that is going to haunt us for the rest of conference, as we probably had 10 opportunities in a row to take the lead again, and a commanding one at that.
Or their defenses are ranked 1 and 2 in every category, or so it seems, for a reason. This wasn't on the offense...GB and valpo played extraordinary defense. Don't think you understand how long those defenders are. Makes a drive and kick out nonexistent (although I would like to see if Carter could do it) and makes it tough inside (if you can even get there).
Both coaches are going to have a way to counter what they saw tonight in the second half, the return game should be another good one.
You guys are jumping of a cliff for no reason. Terrible shot selection tonight was a product of fantastic defense. I think putting the bigger EVN on Sykes might be a blueprint for other teams to follow.
Quote from: Valpofan00 on January 23, 2015, 10:06:56 PMI would've wanted Tevonn or Darien to take it.
Eh, neither of them were having world-beating games (2-12 and 3-8 respectively).
EVN to the hoop was really the only thing going in the 2nd half.
...Is it just me or have I or someone else here already compared Alec to Rowdy in their propensity to disappear from games (in which they are actively playing, like on the court) for seemingly-months at a time? Sykes was struggling all night but you knew he was there pretty much all game.
Is Grizz actually rink?
Rowdy and Alec are big time players with incredible talent. The one thing neither had/has yet is the ability to create off the dribble.
No one's denying that they're both t5 players in program history.
But without the ability to create off the dribble, they are vulnerable to being neutralized to the point where you're like, "oh hey bryce gonna bring him ba...wha? he's been playing?"
Quote from: HC on January 23, 2015, 10:27:34 PMRowdy and Alec are big time players with incredible talent. The one thing neither had/has yet is the ability to create off the dribble.
Alec yes, however with Rowdy you are way way off. To me this is what separates two. Rowdy moved better on offense than Alec has at this point in his career. Alec scores with either a 3 or a dump and catch down low.
What did you want Alec to do on one good wheel against that zone? I was impressed that he played as well as he did on D and was enough of a decoy to allow the other guys to at least attempt to attack the hoop.
I laughed every time the announcer touted the defenses as an explanation for the dreck on the court or dropped banal platitudes about "two heavyweights slugging it out" or some other such nonsense. That's how you spin it when you're trying to keep viewers from tuning away from a couple uninteresting mid-majors playing the sloppiest basketball on the airwaves that night.
I think it's denial to shrug off our pathetic play as the product of great defense. Looks like some others on here agree, perhaps majority of you disagree. I think we had great success in the lane the first half, UWGB adjusted, and we stubbornly and stupidly played with no adjustment.
No one else thought we looked careless, unprepared, and silly all half? I really thought it was an embarrassing performance. If UWGB makes us look like that, then playing anyone in the NCAAs with a seed of 6 or higher is going to destroy us.
Didn't seem like Alec had many touches in the second half. Seems like they could have set some hard screens to get him a few looks from 3 in the second half. Also don't know why he passed off on that in bounds play toward the end with the shot clock winding down. It would have been contested but I think he could have got off a decent shot.
We need Keith back. Like next week.
If a one point, back and forth game is uninteresting to you then you are a hard fan to please. GB defense, like Valpo's, has given teams fits all year.
We will just have to disagree this time. I will stand by the great defense caused the poor offense position especially if Alec's lack of touches and movement was due to his ankle (in which case, great job coaches using him as a decoy to at least partially open up the lane). There were some poor possessions, I keep thinking of Darien Walkers play where he lost it out of bounds trying to push the ball on a 1-3 break, and a few missed opportunities, Tevonn's missed layup near the end.
I'm not nearly as upset or discouraged after this as I was after the loss to Oakland.
Quote from: HC on January 23, 2015, 10:39:51 PMWhat did you want Alec to do on one good wheel against that zone?
Had already forgotten about that first half accident! That would explain a lot.
That Tevonn layup was bad. I don't think it hit rim, just went off the backboard to the other side, and then he hit it out of bounds. Another good opportunity squandered, and our movement in that last 10 seconds to win the game was also very poor. Why not give it to a quick guy again, and get a closer shot or foul? We settled for a long jump shot. Even if Tevonn misses another layup at the rim, I would have felt better.
Great defensive game by both teams. Refs allowed some really heavy contact around the rim. E Victor has progressed a lot but we are still a beat slow with the entry pass or seeing that the player will come open so throw the ball were he will be. We are still tentative. Also allowing the ball to get stuck on one side of the court during some possessions. The ESPN announcer was right when he said the ball needed to go from one side of the court to the other.
I am also afraid that Keith has been out long enough that it will take time for him to acclimate again. I hope he can hit the ground running soon.
Quote from: rink on January 23, 2015, 10:15:06 PM
Wow, holy bad. That was the least intelligent half of basketball I've ever seen Valpo play. Mistakes a'plenty and the same futile display of driving, being stuck, and throwing up a shot that had no chance. Over and over again. They had more bad possessions that half than they had good possessions. Lots of middle school quality garbage. Nasty stuff, really annoying to watch. Bad coaching, bad playing, bad basketball. Yuck.
How ridiculous that this game was even close? Either these two teams played their worst games of the season tonight or the Horizon league is a joke. This was a very well played game by two coaches playing a skilled game of chess. Match this with that...We saw the emergence of E. Victor and the continued fine pay of players like freshman Tevonn Walker.
Hats off to GB for stopping Alec and to Bryce for shutting down Keifer. We will continue to improve while GB has peaked. We win the title on pointsi
We shot one three pointer in the 2nd half and missed. I thought maybe Valpo could have attempted at least a few more threes.
The offense seemed very stagnant in the 2nd half. It seemed, remember I'm saying it seemed, like Valpo decided to go to Nickerson in the 2nd half for all the offense. If Darien, Tavonn or Alec got an opportunity they were supposed to take it but much like when we played higher ranking teams those players froze some and couldn't make the plays that they did in the first half. Did Green Bay's defense suddenly get that much better in the 2nd half? 1st half-34 points, 2nd half-16 points.
If Green Bay's defense was twice as good in the 2nd half what exactly did they do differently than the first half?
I would say yes they were twice as good, maybe slightly better then twice as good. They played more zone and Alec was hurting. Valpo will figure out that zone before they meet again in a few weeks.
When a defense gives you no room for any open 3's then shuts down your drives with quickness, size and strategic help then you got your hands full. Now we know how everybody feels when they try to take it to the hole against Vashil. Too bad we didn't have one more time out, but Bryce used them well and when he had to.
Is it too early to nominate Wardle for HL coach of the year? ;)
He was already crowned, along with the entire GB team, by the HL before the season started.
I saw a lot of arms being heavy on our shots from the GB defense. Whenever we were at the rim, GB would get their hands and arms in enough to keep us from getting the ball up to the backboard or rim. While in many previous games, the refs would have called these every time, tonight's officiating crew let the two teams on the court decide the outcome by hard, tough, physical play. GB's zone was tough all night. They anticipated passing lanes and where we were passing the ball, instead of waiting to see what we would do. They came prepared on defense tonight. We also had strong defense, but we just couldn't get shots to fall in the second half. Not every shot was a bad shot, some were just defended better than others. In recent weeks, we hadn't had as competitive a game between the two teams on the court as we saw tonight. I get where some of you were disappointed, and I get where some are glad that the game was competitive and close, but we'd also not had a game that was this competitive or close from beginning to end in weeks. We'd either been in blowouts or games that we put away in the last 5-8 minutes. (Grizz, yes we lost to Oakland, but that one loss was between the New Mexico game and tonight.) We currently have 4 losses in 22 games. When was the last time we lost our 4th game of the season near the end of January? In my years of following Valpo basketball, we already had four losses by the time conference play started. This was a good game to watch. I enjoyed it. I didn't like the outcome, but I was happy with how well both teams were defensively, and how they both showed they were ready for this game.
I have mixed feelings about this game. I will need to see the reply before I decide exactly what happened.
I am thinking both teams played very good defense, but neither were exactly at the top of their game offensively either. I mean, that 2nd half was pretty ugly and while I do think defense caused a good portion of it, it can't account for all of it. Lots of teams around the country play great defense, but rarely do you see 2 teams score less than 20 points in the 2nd half.
Right now I am leaning toward....Great Defenses with simultaneous offensive ineptitude. Both teams could have performed a lot better on the offensive end in the 2nd half, regardless of defensive intensity from the other side. That said, I was entertained by the game and am not very upset with the result. Looked like 2 very evenly matched teams playing hard.
BTW... I watched the game out our athletic trainer's house, because I don't get ESPNU. I asked her about a dislocated toe. She said, "if there is a torn ligament/tendon, which there usually is, you are usually looking at 6-8 weeks. If there is no tear, you are looking at 2-3 weeks." She followed it up with, "a dislocated toe with a torn tendon is a BIG deal and requires quite a bit of physical therapy."
Quote from: justducky on January 23, 2015, 10:55:35 PM
Quote from: HC on January 23, 2015, 10:39:51 PMWhat did you want Alec to do on one good wheel against that zone?
Had already forgotten about that first half accident! That would explain a lot.
They probably should have called a foul on that play.
Quote from: SanityLost17 on January 23, 2015, 11:53:55 PMBTW... I watched the game out our athletic trainer's house, because I don't get ESPNU. I asked her about a dislocated toe. She said, "if there is a torn ligament/tendon, which there usually is, you are usually looking at 6-8 weeks. If there is no tear, you are looking at 2-3 weeks." She followed it up with, "a dislocated toe with a torn tendon is a BIG deal and requires quite a bit of physical therapy."
So you are telling us that next season we will not only have Lexus back but Keith as well? :'( waaa---waaaa :'(
29 minutes for EVN. He may not be able to walk for a week!
1. Due to the substandard camera view (from 30,000 feet most of the time), it is kind of hard for me to evaluate the refs. All of the questionable plays in the final minute were replayed with a closeup view and every one looked like the right call. The rest of the game? Hard for me to judge. I hesitate to decry *or* applaud. I do think Peters got fouled on that made 3. I also thought Skara got away with a shove earlier in the game.
2. If you are going to insist that we suck because of this game, (a) you're going to also have to insist that GB sucked in this game too, (b) and you're going to have to explain how Green Bay's defense had nothing to do with it. I'm sorry, I've heard nothing on (b) so far in this thread. I'll go with Todd's description: great defense. By the way, Green Bay was stuck on 43 for a *long* time. What's your explanation of that? Either they suck too (and I did hear that a few times here) or else we played incredible defense.
3. I waver slightly between "glass half-empty" and "glass half-full", but I refuse to sign on with "glass is empty". If either one of Tevonn's layups in the final minute goes in, we're 6-1 and they're 5-2.
4. Outcoached? Please explain. I'm not on board with saying either guy got outcoached until someone backs it up with some facts.
5. Failing any such data, I'm going with "very exciting game, hard fought, tip your cap to GB".
6. The only bad thing about losing this game is not being able to stuff a loss down the throats of the idiot GB fans I heard over the WVUR broadcast, especially booing loudly that offensive foul on Fouse which was absolutely the right call. Not that they're any worse than the hometown fans of any other team, including Valpo's, but tonight, I would have loved to steal a win there just to torment them further.
I expected Green Bay to win at home even if both teams were at full strength, but with Carter out and Peters hurt in the first half, it was an accomplishment to come within a final missed shot of obtaining an upset. If Carter can return by the time Green Bay comes to the ARC, I'm hopeful Valpo will hold serve at home.
I must admit my attention to the game was distracted somewhat by the possibly more important news that Lexus had re-injured his knee during pre-game shooting, which was also on the minds of his concerned teammates.
Quote from: SanityLost17 on January 23, 2015, 11:53:55 PM
I have mixed feelings about this game. I will need to see the reply before I decide exactly what happened.
I am thinking both teams played very good defense, but neither were exactly at the top of their game offensively either. I mean, that 2nd half was pretty ugly and while I do think defense caused a good portion of it, it can't account for all of it. Lots of teams around the country play great defense, but rarely do you see 2 teams score less than 20 points in the 2nd half.
Right now I am leaning toward....Great Defenses with simultaneous offensive ineptitude. Both teams could have performed a lot better on the offensive end in the 2nd half, regardless of defensive intensity from the other side. That said, I was entertained by the game and am not very upset with the result. Looked like 2 very evenly matched teams playing hard.
BTW... I watched the game out our athletic trainer's house, because I don't get ESPNU. I asked her about a dislocated toe. She said, "if there is a torn ligament/tendon, which there usually is, you are usually looking at 6-8 weeks. If there is no tear, you are looking at 2-3 weeks." She followed it up with, "a dislocated toe with a torn tendon is a BIG deal and requires quite a bit of physical therapy."
Just got home and have enjoyed reading everyone's comments. My feelings are probably pretty close to Sanity's. It's frustrating on one hand to think we had a golden opportunity to pull the game out and didn't. On the other hand, we battled from beginning to end and gave Green Bay a real run for their money. To lose by a point on their home court without KC to run the offense, feed the post, and score over the zone is nothing to be ashamed of. A win would have been great for sure, but there is still a lot of basketball yet to be played. At this point I still like our chances.
Post game press conference
http://www.greenbayphoenix.com/mediaPortal/player.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=22500 (http://www.greenbayphoenix.com/mediaPortal/player.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=22500)
Oren's article mentions that Lexus re-injured his right knee while participating in pre-game warm-ups, had to be carried off the court, and came back to watch the game in a wheel chair. That would be disastrous if he re-tore his ACL.
Oh. NO.
...Kyrie, eleison!
Not all that concerned with the outcome - we tend to struggle in these horizon league sloggfests. We're not a team that wins with its physicality. The refs seemed to let a lot of contact go at the rim, which essentially meant the 3 point line could be taken away. We did a good job matching their physicality at the other end, but did a poor job finishing at the rim on offense (tevon), and didn't really look to kick when penetrating. Only had 5 assists.
I can't say that either team was out-coached in a 50-51 game. Sykes had 11 points on 17 shots, and Green Bay looked tired by the end of the game. Maybe their bench is just terrible, but they didn't play much at all. When Carter comes back, hopefully Valpo's bench looks much better - the lack of backup guards make it hard for someone to come in and be a "spark off the bench."
Quote from: classof2014 on January 23, 2015, 10:18:55 AM
Quote from: FWalum on January 23, 2015, 09:42:39 AM
As far as not getting to the finals last year, I would mention in passing that his 2 NBA players were both not 100% at the time. Recently watched some video of that game and Sykes toughed it out but was limping and Brown just played bad. Don't know that this is Wardle's fault totally. However, he owns his coaching style and treatment of players which was so elegantly aired for all to read. Wardle retained despite allegations (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9308960/wisconsin-green-bay-coach-brian-wardle-keep-job-investigation)
Even though Sykes was playing injured you can still put quite a bit of blame on Wardle for the loss to UWM. A good coach would have his team prepared for a big game like this and would have his team ready to play with a not 100% Sykes, who even impaired was better than a majority of UWM's players. I'm not blaming Wardle for Brown's poor play but shouldn't a first-teamer be prepared for the opportunity to play in the NCAAs. The lack of the team preparedness I do blame on the coach, it is up to him to instill confidence in his players to go in a take down a mediocre to sub-par Milwaukee team in order to advance to the finals.
GB wasn't ready for the game. That's poor coaching in my mind. UWM was, Jeter should've been coach of the year last season. Milwaukee was expected to do nothing and they won the championship and played great when it mattered most.
I don't like Wardle and never will. I think he's a great recruiter, got two NBAers on his team and both were playing there at once and couldn't even make it to the HL finals. Until Wardle proves he can do something more than make it past the first round of the tourney in my mind he's not a great coach, not to mention the numerous allegations of him in the past.
I don't know that I disagree with you, you have some very valid points. I was just putting it in perspective with our situation.
Quote from: a3uge on January 24, 2015, 08:03:04 AMNot all that concerned with the outcome - we tend to struggle in these horizon league sloggfests. We're not a team that wins with its physicality.
I agree in general, but watching this team I think they have played a more physical game then in the past, lead by Tevonn. Some of his rebounds last night showed a gritty tenacity and athletic ability that is not seen from many guards. For the stat guys out there, when was the last time we had a guard get 13 rebounds?
I'm not a basketball expert at all, but HC and the others make sense about strong D for both teams. Alex seemed injured after landing on a GB foot on his nice 3-pointer. I think he would have taken the VU shot in the last two tries. Why did Tevonn drive at the 10 second mark?
Hi Grizz! Great to see you threatening to drive to Mayberry with a bet and grabbing the fishing pole in Opie style. I bet youz recall my silver spoon jibes about OU having "champaign wishes and caviar dreams." I think that dialog is circa 2002 from my former msg.board name..
If GB and VU tie at the top I think "best win" takes the prize. At least VU beat CSU which is a sure 3rd if we do tie GB. Now we need the GB win at home twice over. Ties them and ensures we win if CSU sneaks into a 1st place tie. After that who knows how far down the ladder the "best win" contest will fall.
I think Wartle should have done the honorable thing for this game ... and played this game without a pointguard.
(btw - name spelling is intentional)
Quote from: crusadermoe on January 24, 2015, 09:24:31 AMWhy did Tevonn drive at the 10 second mark?
I actually REALLY liked that play, though not the result.
Here's why: they are thinking you are going to play for the last shot (just took last TO, fr'instance). In the back of their minds, even as you penetrate, they still think you'll probably kick it back outside and start again. So you're taking them by surprise, for one.
And two, if for some reason it doesn't work out, you foul what feels like the worst FT-shooting team since That Game of All Shaqs In That One Commercial, and try again.
It was like a 2-for-1, as it were.
Quote from: StlVUFan on January 24, 2015, 12:29:02 AMDue to the substandard camera view (from 30,000 feet most of the time), it is kind of hard for me to evaluate the refs.
I thought the same thing! It seemed like the game was 8 miles away watching it.
Interesting comments comparing Rowdy and Alec. I agree with HC's thoughts.
I do think that Rowdy was better than Alec is at this point in their respective careers. Rowdy moved more fluidly and had a softer touch. I believe that Rowdy also was better defensively. Hopefully, Alec will catch up and propel past Rowdy in a couple of years. Alec is a more vocal leader, which is important. Wouldn't it be fun to see them on the court together?
Let's see:
Two injured PGs
Best player/leading scorer hobbled for 2d half
On the HL road
2 for a gazillion in 2d half
And we lose by 1 with 2 chances to win in final seconds. As Bob Knight would say that's pretty good -- give us a chance on the last possession.
What was frustrating was about mid2d half, we did not look to make the pass to Alec in the post or to allow him to take advantage of the mismatches down low. He needs to touch the ball just to keep the rest of D honest. Our guards seemed tentative to throw entry pass. That's where Boggs and Bogan were effective.
Vashil has to hit FTs. And as someone emphasized on another game Wed, when inside go up and dunk the ball, make them foul you that the ref can't swallow his whistle.
Who predicted 6-2 1st half of season? We are where we thought we'd be. Relax and enjoy this team.
Quote from: Chairback on January 24, 2015, 12:26:26 PM
Quote from: StlVUFan on January 24, 2015, 12:29:02 AMDue to the substandard camera view (from 30,000 feet most of the time), it is kind of hard for me to evaluate the refs.
I thought the same thing! It seemed like the game was 8 miles away watching it.
Quote from: Chairback on January 24, 2015, 12:26:26 PM
Quote from: StlVUFan on January 24, 2015, 12:29:02 AMDue to the substandard camera view (from 30,000 feet most of the time), it is kind of hard for me to evaluate the refs.
I thought the same thing! It seemed like the game was 8 miles away watching it.
The PBP team was even further away than that. I'm not kidding.
Smj - similar to the movie Gangs of New York where the Butcher and Amsterdam Vallon agree to have a good gang fight without guns?
This was a fun game to watch. Yes, it sucks that we lost but it shows that we can very easily beat this team. Sykes was essentially shut down throughout the whole game, which very few, I mean very few teams have been able to do. EVN is becoming much more comfortable running the point.
Good defense lead to some terrible offense and poor shot selection for both teams. We didn't play our best game yet we still could have come out of that one with the W. This team is special, we lost on the road by 1 without our regular PG, to a very good team that is incredibly difficult to beat at home.
It's very difficult to beat a team 3 times in a season. Use this game as motivation for the rest of the season. I like our chances at going to the NCAAs this season. We should've beaten the "best" team in the conference, on the road, without our PG.
Quote from: classof2014 on January 26, 2015, 08:35:53 AMIt's very difficult to beat a team 3 times in a season.
You need to qualify this. Of the 9 teams in the HL there are only 3 to 4 that we wouldn't expect to beat 3 times in a season. In reality it isn't as hard to beat
"a team" three times in a season.
During the last 4 seasons or so I would say we could beat 40% to 50% of the teams 3 times in a season and have many times.
Quote from: historyman on January 26, 2015, 10:40:30 AM
Quote from: classof2014 on January 26, 2015, 08:35:53 AMIt's very difficult to beat a team 3 times in a season.
You need to qualify this. Of the 9 teams in the HL there are only 3 to 4 that we wouldn't expect to beat 3 times in a season. In reality it isn't as hard to beat "a team" three times in a season.
During the last 4 seasons or so I would say we could beat 40% to 50% of the teams 3 times in a season and have many times.
Time to do some sluething. Because I'm good at that.
Since joining the Horizon League we've played what I'm going to call a triple a total of 14 times. Of those 14 triples, we won the first two meetings 9 times. Here's how we faired in the finale of those triples.
Mar 7, 2008- Wright State: After winning at Wright St. in early December to open HL season, we won an OT thriller at home in March to close the HL season. In the tourney we beat them a third time in the 2nd round. WSU was a respectable 12-6 and we were underdogs in the final game.
Mar 1, 2011- Youngstown St.: We beat them at home in January, on the road in February and at home again in March. None of the games were remarkably close and YSU had 2 conference wins that season.
Mar 4, 2011- Detroit: The games were decided by 10, 8, and 10. Young Ray Jr. wasn't quite the thorn in our side at this point.
Mar 3, 2012- Butler: You guys remember when we beat the back to back National Runners-up thrice in one season? Remember how the last games wasn't even close? Let's not talk about the game that took place three days after this.
Mar 6, 2012- Detroit: I guess we do have to talk about this. We beat them there, we beat them here and the less that's talked about this game, the better.
Mar 9, 2013- Green Bay: Seven days prior we went up to their house and beat them. After surviving a 1 point scare vs. UIC, Green Bay was at our house for this thriller, complete with "The Shot From Down Under".
Mar 12, 2013- Wright State: After winning by 6 at home in January and by 7 on the road in February, it would only make sense that we punched our NCAA ticket with an 8 point win in March.
Mar 4, 2014- UIC: Unfortunately for us Milwaukee ruined Flameout 2014. But we finished their dreadful season with a 10 point win in the ARC.
Mar 7, 2014-Milwaukee: We beat the eventual NCAA representatives twice, but we couldn't complete the triple with a victory. To say this game was disappointing is an understatement.
We've fallen victim to losing the triple twice since joining the HL
Mar 8, 2008- Cleveland St.: We lost to a pretty good Cleveland St. team that had a freshman by the name of Norris Cole.
Mar 3, 2009- Wright State: Oh yeah we don't talk about this season.
7-2 when trying to beat a team for the third time in a season. I could see us getting a 10th chance this season in our 15th overall triple.