Thought I'd start this game thread, though I am certainly not as knowledgeable as many of the other posters on this board.
On paper, a tilt between a team that is 1-14 in conference action, playing on the road against the first place team in the conference, should not even be close.
Unfortunately, we are not playing the game on paper. I think this is going to be a tough, close contest. Not sure why I think that. I just do. A less-than-healthy Van Wijk is a cause for concern.
No excuse for VU to come out flat or uninspired. I suppose if we were to lose this game, a valid argument could be made that we don't deserve the championship. Here's the prediction:
Valpo 68
Loyola 62
Paul
I suspect this game will be one of the most difficult of the season based on what's at stake.
Valpo wins by 16..more this evening
Every game from here out is a must win! I don't even wanna think about resting on Butler unless we are up 20 with 2 minutes to go. I think the guys come out ready for Loyola and seal the deal up on Tuesday at the ARC. Loyola won't go quietly though.
81-79 Valpo
The Team needs this game,to get back on the winning track with steady hard play, to tie up 1st place. VU 68 Loyala 61
Then to move on to Butler, the game that will set the tone(Sweep,Sweep!) for the playoffs. Winning these two games will make VU the clear leader in Horizon league for the for the playoffs. Winning these games is what all of the previous 30 games were about! :)
Don't forget, Loyola is playing without Walt Gibler. He's out indefinitely with a shoulder injury, so that's one less weapon in the Ramblers's arsenal.
I'm thinking we should play Kevin Tuesday night, play him either in spurts, or for a set amount of minutes each half, with the goal of making sure the knee will be alright, and even if he doesn't do anything spectacular, at least we know how his knee will hold up in game action before the Butler game, as it is still a must win game for this team, as momentum going into the tournament. A win, and a subsequent SWEEP of Butler, will help Valpo do many things in the HL Tournament.
I have no doubt in my mind we will win this. But I don't think it will be very easy at all. I can see us pulling away a little bit at the end to make it an 8-10 point win.
Consistent with others' comments, I think this game represents a hurdle for Valpo to get over and will therefore be tough (not to mention that this game could provide something positive for an awful Loyola season). KVW should play if he is in good enough shape and Valpo needs to play this game like a tourney game.
I predict a close game until about 10 minutes left. Valpo pulls away and wins 65-51.
If KVW plays at least 15 minutes:
Valpo 76
Loyola 62
If KVW plays less than 10 minutes
Valpo 68
Loyola 60
I don't want to be Debbie downer but let's play the devils advocate. Worst case scenario we lose to Loyola and butler. Is there still a pretty good chance we host?
Loyola just beat Bradley in the BracketBuster over the weekend. Not sure what to make of that game though since Bradley is last in the MVC. Nonetheless, anyone can beat anyone on any given night in this league. If we can neutralize Averkamp I think we'll be fine, even with minor minutes given by KVW. It'll be a tough game though regardless.
Time to cleanse and exercise the ghosts from the Loyola game of last year...69-64.
http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2012/02/game-preview-loyola.html (http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2012/02/game-preview-loyola.html)
WIth how Butler's been playing lately, I think it is pretty important to win this game tomorrow night.
I agree, butler is figuring things out and playing well as of late. If we drop our last two HL games, I guess we would need help from other teams and the perfect scenario in order to keep #1 seed.
I think it would be nice to see Cleveland state in the semi. (even though it's difficult to beat a team 3 consecutive times). The other semi would be Detroit and butler. (I don't see butler losing three times to Detroit though. Brad Stevens would have some type of scheme or game plan to keep from losing again. He does his homework and would give butler the edge over mcCallum.
Quote from: oklahomamick on February 20, 2012, 08:19:27 AM
I don't want to be Debbie downer but let's play the devils advocate. Worst case scenario we lose to Loyola and butler. Is there still a pretty good chance we host?
As long as CSU loses at least once, we'd still host.
I expect CSU to lose one more
Quote from: oklahomamick on February 20, 2012, 09:21:09 AM
I think it would be nice to see Cleveland state in the semi. (even though it's difficult to beat a team 3 consecutive times). The other semi would be Detroit and butler. (I don't see butler losing three times to Detroit though. Brad Stevens would have some type of scheme or game plan to keep from losing again. He does his homework and would give butler the edge over mcCallum.
If we beat Butler Friday night, this scenario would be very interesting. We would have to beat two different teams for a third time this season. Not an easy task ever.
Valpo beat Loyola by more than 20 points in Chicago, so this should be an easy win, especially with Gibler out. I'm not sure how much Kevin will play, which influences the final score quite a bit. (Hasn't anybody seen him around campus or in the ARC the past few days to establish the status of his knee?) Still, this is arguably the most significant game for the Crusaders in years--a chance to win their first Horizon League season championship, to secure at least an NIT bid and finally raise another banner in the ARC, to have an opportunity to host the tournament and have a better chance at an NCAA spot. Oddly enough, this huge game will be against a last place team that Valpo owes payback for a humiliating loss near the close of last season.
I predict the atmosphere will be exciting and the players will respond by taking a nice lead (8-10 points) into the half, and during the second half the stands will be filled with anticipation of a post-game celebration. Final score (assuming limited minutes by Kevin):
Loyola 56
Valpo 71
i'll take valpo by a dozen, 74-62. i see no reason valpo won't win this game. kevin should be fine to give us 20 minutes or so, allowing him to rest adequately.
The only thing that concerns me is that they have nothing to lose and we might come out tight knowing the gravity of the game. The key maybe to really get into them defensively and let the offense flow from the defense and hopefully get off to a fast start.
Loyola 54
Valpo 80
It will be fairly tight most of the game, halftime score 33-30 Valpo, but in the 2nd half Valpo plays very good lockdown defense and once the players see that they have taken over the game they not only play good defense but start to explode on offense and pull away for a historic win.
Biggest game of the year so far and no media coverage at all! I was expecting something in the paper or online. Something from the University promoting the game before the day of the game. Nada...
The media coverage for Vu basketball has really dropped. It is not covered nearly as much as they were in the Mid-Con days. Valpotx brought up some good points on why lack of attendance but I think media coverage has something to do with it also. The recent online article about chartered flights for Butler and Valpo not having it was worthless. Makes no sense for Vu to do that and why it warranted an article makes no sense.
Hopefully there is a good crowd Tuesday. The team deserves a good showing by the fans.
No way Bryce has these guys coming out flat tomorrow.
Quote from: chairback on February 20, 2012, 06:24:21 PM
Biggest game of the year so far and no media coverage at all! I was expecting something in the paper or online. Something from the University promoting the game before the day of the game. Nada...
The media coverage for Vu basketball has really dropped. It is not covered nearly as much as they were in the Mid-Con days. Valpotx brought up some good points on why lack of attendance but I think media coverage has something to do with it also. The recent online article about chartered flights for Butler and Valpo not having it was worthless. Makes no sense for Vu to do that and why it warranted an article makes no sense.
Hopefully there is a good crowd Tuesday. The team deserves a good showing by the fans.
No way Bryce has these guys coming out flat tomorrow.
Good point. Valpo places ads in the local newspapers declaring the Crusaders as "Northwest Indiana's Home Team"; however, you wouldn't know it by the relative silence in the media so far about this week's games with Loyola and Butler, as well as the historic significance a win will have for VU.
After the BracketBuster game Friday that was reported on Saturday, there ought to have been various news stories in the papers or on the radio Sunday, Monday, and Tuesday with different angles that put into perspective the importance a win would mean to this program. I'm not sure whether to fault the newspapers or the publicity folks at the university, but there should have been a lot greater build up in the days before these big games. This is another example where VU doesn't take full advantage of the rare moments of note it is given.
You are right Valpopal. They are not taking advantage of it at all. Just poor...
http://blogs.post-trib.com/lazerus/ (http://blogs.post-trib.com/lazerus/)
Quote from: zvillehaze on February 20, 2012, 08:53:29 PM
http://blogs.post-trib.com/lazerus/ (http://blogs.post-trib.com/lazerus/)
I see this piece by Lazerus, but it appears tonight as a "blog" and I do not think it was included in the print edition. In any case, I had seen nothing else, all of which led me to be careful and write of "relative silence" in the media. As I mentioned, I don't excuse VU for its lack in getting stories out to the media. In fact, as of tonight on the eve of the Loyola game, if you look at the VU home web page, the Loyola and Butler games are not even included among the "Upcoming Events" or "Headlines" for this week, while many other campus activities are mentioned:
http://www.valpo.edu/ (http://www.valpo.edu/)
I am pretty sure that athletics events USED to be featured on the upcoming events on the website, so I don't know what happened.
#2 on the rolling stories on the front page is about VU hoping to clinch the 1 seed tomorrow.
Not sure what you mean.
Quote from: StlVUFan on February 20, 2012, 11:15:35 PM
#2 on the rolling stories on the front page is about VU hoping to clinch the 1 seed tomorrow.
Not sure what you mean.
We are talking about the
university homepage, not the athletics homepage. That's why valpopal posted the link above.
(hat tip to the incomparable Jim Squires for trying to sort through that)
Congratulations StlVuFan for the mention in the Lazerus blog.
Sure wish Mark knew your actual last name. ;)
Quote from: chairback on February 20, 2012, 06:24:21 PM
Biggest game of the year so far and no media coverage at all! I was expecting something in the paper or online. Something from the University promoting the game before the day of the game. Nada...
The media coverage for Vu basketball has really dropped. It is not covered nearly as much as they were in the Mid-Con days. Valpotx brought up some good points on why lack of attendance but I think media coverage has something to do with it also. The recent online article about chartered flights for Butler and Valpo not having it was worthless. Makes no sense for Vu to do that and why it warranted an article makes no sense.
Hopefully there is a good crowd Tuesday. The team deserves a good showing by the fans.
No way Bryce has these guys coming out flat tomorrow.
I recall that last year we discussed at some length the issue of promotions, gifts, free admissions and whatever it would take to introduce new people to VU basketball. I can see little evidence that anything we may have tried has shown any great success and if we ever hope to be northwest Indiana's team then we first must get northwest Indiana into the darn building. This year we are going to win the conference championship with an attendence level that is close to embarrassing. We can not blame the press. We have been given both the product (team) and platform ( horizon league) that we needed to greatly increase our fan base for years to come,but can we parlay the team success for this year and next into a growing stream of gate receipts? So far I am not optimistic.
Now contrary to rumor I have never, I repeat never advocated rounding people up and herding them into the ARC at gunpoint, but anything short of that which puts people into the seats needs to be considered. We will have all summer to dream up stuff for next season, but we still have a lot of Loyola and Butler and postseason tickets to sell this year. So, which one of you guys wants to wrestle a bear at half time? I'm pretty sure we can sell more tickets if we can leave his muzzle off. thoughts?
Quote from: okinawatyphoon on February 20, 2012, 11:26:24 PM
Quote from: StlVUFan on February 20, 2012, 11:15:35 PM
#2 on the rolling stories on the front page is about VU hoping to clinch the 1 seed tomorrow.
Not sure what you mean.
We are talking about the university homepage, not the athletics homepage. That's why valpopal posted the link above.
I stand corrected, sorry for the misread.
I did just visit and see the Butler game listed, but obviously the Loyola game is not, which was valpopal's point. Well done.
Quote from: historyman on February 20, 2012, 11:38:58 PM
(hat tip to the incomparable Jim Squires for trying to sort through that)
Congratulations StlVuFan for the mention in the Lazerus blog.
Sure wish Mark knew your actual last name. ;)
Don't think I won't look for a chance to tweak him about that on Friday ;)
It's actually not the first time, but I think it's the first time by name.
I'm surprised at the lack of interest being generated as well, especially for the students. We've got the typical gameday feature stories from the Post-Trib and NWI Times, but where else is anyone generating anything?
For the UIC game last Tuesday, IMC put together a nice little video to try to draw students in
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2bdunihyU8o#ws (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2bdunihyU8o#ws)
Now we have a game that can guarantee a conference title, the first in nearly a decade, and hosting rights in the HL tournament.... and how many students even know? If most of us were disappointed w/ last week's student turnout (I was pleasantly surprised), then I would expect more of the same tonight. I hope I'm wrong. A game like this deserves a better atmosphere!
Quote from: justducky on February 21, 2012, 01:32:51 AM
Quote from: chairback on February 20, 2012, 06:24:21 PM
Biggest game of the year so far and no media coverage at all! I was expecting something in the paper or online. Something from the University promoting the game before the day of the game. Nada...
The media coverage for Vu basketball has really dropped. It is not covered nearly as much as they were in the Mid-Con days. Valpotx brought up some good points on why lack of attendance but I think media coverage has something to do with it also. The recent online article about chartered flights for Butler and Valpo not having it was worthless. Makes no sense for Vu to do that and why it warranted an article makes no sense.
Hopefully there is a good crowd Tuesday. The team deserves a good showing by the fans.
No way Bryce has these guys coming out flat tomorrow.
I recall that last year we discussed at some length the issue of promotions, gifts, free admissions and whatever it would take to introduce new people to VU basketball. I can see little evidence that anything we may have tried has shown any great success and if we ever hope to be northwest Indiana's team then we first must get northwest Indiana into the darn building. This year we are going to win the conference championship with an attendence level that is close to embarrassing. We can not blame the press. We have been given both the product (team) and platform ( horizon league) that we needed to greatly increase our fan base for years to come,but can we parlay the team success for this year and next into a growing stream of gate receipts? So far I am not optimistic.
Now contrary to rumor I have never, I repeat never advocated rounding people up and herding them into the ARC at gunpoint, but anything short of that which puts people into the seats needs to be considered. We will have all summer to dream up stuff for next season, but we still have a lot of Loyola and Butler and postseason tickets to sell this year. So, which one of you guys wants to wrestle a bear at half time? I'm pretty sure we can sell more tickets if we can leave his muzzle off. thoughts?
Up until just a few days ago Butler tickets have been bundled with other games. Now that they're no longer bundled, they're charging $20/ticket min., double the normal cost. Forcing people to buy tickets to games they aren't interested in so they can get into the one game that has piqued their interest only works if people are dying to get in the door - which they aren't. Charging $20 a ticket for the Butler game isn't going to attract new fans either or generate any good will toward the very people you're trying to attract. How do you market that? "Bring your family of 4 to the ARC on Friday for a $100 evening as the Crusaders take on the former 2-time national runner-up!" Or, "Come on up to Valpo, Butler fans so we can gouge you on ticket prices for a game with probably not much on the line vs staying home and watching it on TV for free." A s Confucius say, "Do not charge double for plywood till hurricane imminent."
I don't think the Butler fans will back away from our prices. Check out their prices for a UIC game! :o
http://www.butlersports.com/information/tickets/mbb_tickets (http://www.butlersports.com/information/tickets/mbb_tickets)
I think we'll be ready to clinch our first HL Men's Basketball championship.
Valpo - 75
Loyola - 61
Let's face it......we have a bunch of lame students....I will call them "nerds" and they have no school spirit....thank God we do have a few that
show up and support the team. Tonight we should have 3500 to 4000, bet it is closer to 2800. I hope I am wrong.
The local newspaper should have had it as their headline...VALPO TO PLAY FOR TITLE.....FRONT PAGE SPORTS....I am sure that is not the case.
BD will be gone in a heartbeat if the right job opens up.....maybe Northwestern....he deserves better support here.
Frustrated Fan
Quote from: Flip Flop on February 21, 2012, 01:46:44 PM
Let's face it......we have a bunch of lame students....I will call them "nerds" and they have no school spirit....thank God we do have a few that
show up and support the team. Tonight we should have 3500 to 4000, bet it is closer to 2800. I hope I am wrong.
The local newspaper should have had it as their headline...VALPO TO PLAY FOR TITLE.....FRONT PAGE SPORTS....I am sure that is not the case.
BD will be gone in a heartbeat if the right job opens up.....maybe Northwestern....he deserves better support here.
Frustrated Fan
i resemble that remark! ;) but in all seriousness, students have gotten more apathetic over the last few years. i had a core group (there were about 7 or 8 of us normally) that went to as many home games as our schedules allowed. unfortunately, we've all now graduated and can't nag other groups of friends into showing up.
Quote from: valpopal on February 20, 2012, 07:04:00 PM
Quote from: chairback on February 20, 2012, 06:24:21 PM
Biggest game of the year so far and no media coverage at all! I was expecting something in the paper or online. Something from the University promoting the game before the day of the game. Nada...
The media coverage for Vu basketball has really dropped. It is not covered nearly as much as they were in the Mid-Con days. Valpotx brought up some good points on why lack of attendance but I think media coverage has something to do with it also. The recent online article about chartered flights for Butler and Valpo not having it was worthless. Makes no sense for Vu to do that and why it warranted an article makes no sense.
Hopefully there is a good crowd Tuesday. The team deserves a good showing by the fans.
No way Bryce has these guys coming out flat tomorrow.
Good point. Valpo places ads in the local newspapers declaring the Crusaders as "Northwest Indiana's Home Team"; however, you wouldn't know it by the relative silence in the media so far about this week's games with Loyola and Butler, as well as the historic significance a win will have for VU.
After the BracketBuster game Friday that was reported on Saturday, there ought to have been various news stories in the papers or on the radio Sunday, Monday, and Tuesday with different angles that put into perspective the importance a win would mean to this program. I'm not sure whether to fault the newspapers or the publicity folks at the university, but there should have been a lot greater build up in the days before these big games. This is another example where VU doesn't take full advantage of the rare moments of note it is given.
I think the issue is what defines "big game"? Is it a big game to those who closely follow Valpo basketball or the Horizon League? Of course! Is it a big game for the causal fan who's interest in college basketball is what's on SportsCenter? Probably not. I know I've brought this up before, but making the NCAA tournament is the only thing that matters to most people. If Valpo were to host the tourney, and make the finals, check out the difference in press coverage. I bet it will be significant.
While the Horizon League is a step up in competition (dispite this year), making the tourney and knowing you were likley going to the tourney matterred. How will people view this season if Valpo doesn't go dancing? It will be interesting to be sure.
Quote from: Flip Flop on February 21, 2012, 01:46:44 PM
Let's face it......we have a bunch of lame students....I will call them "nerds" and they have no school spirit....thank God we do have a few that
show up and support the team. Tonight we should have 3500 to 4000, bet it is closer to 2800. I hope I am wrong.
The local newspaper should have had it as their headline...VALPO TO PLAY FOR TITLE.....FRONT PAGE SPORTS....I am sure that is not the case.
BD will be gone in a heartbeat if the right job opens up.....maybe Northwestern....he deserves better support here.
Frustrated Fan
Again, I point out in this day and age of SportCenter and the Bracketology, the NCAA's are all that matter. Most people don't care who wins the Big East, yet alone the Horizon League. Go to the NCAA's for a few years in a row and you'll watch the students and fans return.
In a last minute push for student attendance this evening, ML sent an e-mail to Valpo students this afternoon:
| Come out and support the Crusaders tonight! |
(http://www.valpo.edu/common/images/lyris/imc/Mark_L.jpg)
Mark LaBarbera
Director of Athletics
| Tonight, Feb. 21, at 7 p.m. in the ARC, our men's basketball team plays Loyola University. Our team currently sits atop the Horizon League. A win tonight secures Valpo's first Horizon League basketball championship, the right to host the nationally televised league tournament in the ARC, and a postseason appearance. Let's show our players the support they deserve. If you don't have class this evening, make some noise at the ARC. GO CRUSADERS! |
I have been told that recruit Clay Yeo ought to be at the game tonight. I hope he gets to witness an exciting atmosphere and victory celebration.
Quote from: StlVUFan on February 21, 2012, 09:01:00 AM
Quote from: historyman on February 20, 2012, 11:38:58 PM
(hat tip to the incomparable Jim Squires for trying to sort through that)
Congratulations StlVuFan for the mention in the Lazerus blog.
Sure wish Mark knew your actual last name. ;)
Don't think I won't look for a chance to tweak him about that on Friday ;)
It's actually not the first time, but I think it's the first time by name.
Maybe he thought there were two of you doing the 'incomparable work'??
Amazing the excitment on the Loyola Board! The post says "Valpo tonight" The responses? Nada. ??? And we aren't crazy about our fans! :crazy:
Ugh, stuck in class tonight... >:(
Bryce will not leave for a Northwestern, are you kidding me?? That is such an absurd comment. If he ever left, he would leave for a team that is well supported on the basketball front.
Personally, I don't see him leaving anytime in the next decade, if he leaves at all. He has more ties to the university than Scott had, job security, the chance to have a 20 win season each year, and a campus that has undergone some major improvements.
Quote from: valpotx on February 21, 2012, 04:52:19 PMBryce will not leave for a Northwestern, are you kidding me??
I have to agree with this. I believe that if the Northwestern job opened up, it will go to someone that doesn't have as much promise for a bright future in coaching. It could go to the next big, successful IVY League head coach, and a career coaching record of more than one year. No offense to Bryce, but when it comes to the values and expectations of graduating students at Northwestern, he would be coming in with a very low graduation rate of 0, in terms of 0 scholarship athletes, as our only graduating seniors are walk-ons.
Quote from: valpotx on February 21, 2012, 04:52:19 PM
Bryce will not leave for a Northwestern, are you kidding me?? That is such an absurd comment. If he ever left, he would leave for a team that is well supported on the basketball front.
Personally, I don't see him leaving anytime in the next decade, if he leaves at all. He has more ties to the university than Scott had, job security, the chance to have a 20 win season each year, and a campus that has undergone some major improvements.
It is also not inconceivable that Scott felt: (1) "called" to spearhead the Baylor reclimation project, and (2) secure that he left Valpo in good hands with his Dad who stepped back in. If both of these things were not true, there's a chance he'd still be here. Maybe not a great chance (I don't want to minimize the "ambition" component that was undoubtedly there), but a chance.
Serious question: Should Valpo continue to have a basketball team if it generates very little local interest or student interest? Theoretically, you fund a Division I program because it generates excitement for the school and possibly impacts enrollment and donations, If it is generating no buzz ANYWHERE even locally,......why spend a healthy sum each year to put a team on the court? Just roll out a D-3 program and call it a day.
I would HATE to see it. But I'm baffled by the apathy of the students and the community. The tickets are a bargain and students get in free. Joining the Horizon League ought to have boosted regular season crowds. But I truly think we had better crowds come out to see UMKC or Southern Utah at the ARC than we see at the ARC on the webcasts now.
Quote from: wh on February 21, 2012, 10:29:56 AMUp until just a few days ago Butler tickets have been bundled with other games. Now that they're no longer bundled, they're charging $20/ticket min., double the normal cost. Forcing people to buy tickets to games they aren't interested in so they can get into the one game that has piqued their interest only works if people are dying to get in the door - which they aren't. Charging $20 a ticket for the Butler game isn't going to attract new fans either or generate any good will toward the very people you're trying to attract. How do you market that? "Bring your family of 4 to the ARC on Friday for a $100 evening as the Crusaders take on the former 2-time national runner-up!" Or, "Come on up to Valpo, Butler fans so we can gouge you on ticket prices for a game with probably not much on the line vs staying home and watching it on TV for free." A s Confucius say, "Do not charge double for plywood till hurricane imminent."
Not saying I like it as a consumer, but the job of any program is to maximize the revenue generated by ticket sales, and this is done by gauging the demand and adjusting the price accordingly. What Valpo did this year is something that Butler (and any other program where season ticket demand < available seats) has done for years. It may seem sinister, but has much more to do with keeping tickets from opposing fans than it does with gouging anyone.
1. Season ticket holders are largely unaffected by any of this. If anything, the process may encourage fans wanting tickets to a few choice games to just buy the season tickets so they don't have to wait for specific games to come available. That is good for the program.
2. Once season ticket sales close, "packages" of 2 to 6 games go on sale. That tends to keep opponents from cherry picking good seats for a single game, knowing they'll be paying for additional tickets they can't use. Conversely, local fans may buy a package that includes the game they want, decide to attend the other games in the package and become a fan. (I have friends, an IU and Purdue grad, who bought Butler season tickets in the early '90's just to get on the priority list for NCAA tournament games hosted in Indianapolis; they began attending games, enjoyed them and had 4 season tickets for more than 15 years).
3. When single game tickets go on sale, the intent is indeed to maximize revenue by adjusting price to demand. You may call it "gouging", but if Valpo sells out a game against Butler @ $20 a ticket, but has 2.000 unsold $10 tickets for a game against YSU, it's hard to argue against where the price is set. FWIW, locals can avoid this "gouging" by either buying season tickets or package deals. If anything, this strategy is set up to "gouge" the Butler fans who wait until single game tickets go on sale.
Butler's gone even further and offered a tiered pricing on single game tickets based upon the "attractiveness" of the game. All this, along with increases in season ticket prices, has drawn some criticism from fans. But these are also the same fans who want to retain a coach by paying him $1 million+ per year and want upgraded facilities. Despite all the complaining about the cost, 7,000+ come to Hinkle (10,000 for Saturday's BracketBuster game) and lay down their cash.
If Valpo has the success all of you predict, you may be facing similar challenges in retaining a young, successful coach. It doesn't appear your university is thrilled about supporting athletic programs through the use of general funds, so if you want to keep your basketball program moving forward, you'll need the funding to come from somewhere.
Quote from: Flip Flop on February 21, 2012, 01:46:44 PM
Let's face it......we have a bunch of lame students....I will call them "nerds" and they have no school spirit....thank God we do have a few that
show up and support the team. Tonight we should have 3500 to 4000, bet it is closer to 2800. I hope I am wrong.
The local newspaper should have had it as their headline...VALPO TO PLAY FOR TITLE.....FRONT PAGE SPORTS....I am sure that is not the case.
BD will be gone in a heartbeat if the right job opens up.....maybe Northwestern....he deserves better support here.
Frustrated Fan
Jeez, give the fans and students some time. When Valpo was always in the hunt for the Mid-Con, the students showed up for the games. After a few years of not going to the Mid-Con championship, then the move to HL, the fans have not shown up as much. Now that the team is competing for an HL championship, the fans will start to show up. I think Bryce will be here for a few more years. I, for one, am looking forward to our chances this year, and the future under Bryce. He is getting my support!
I'll be watching this one from home. The usual scenario: not worth the trouble/expense of a babysitter, can watch a bit of at home with the kids, the rest with the wife. Or, I could go to the game by myself, perhaps. I'll likely come out in-person Friday, even if a family conflict has developed....
I sort of stumbled across the fact that the game's going to be broadcast on WYIN (Lakeshore Public TV); did they make a bigger deal out of that, in the past? I wonder what call they'll use. If memory serves, Dick would sometimes do a TV call separate from Todd's radio call; but that's unfortunately not an option this year.
I'll be very curious to see how Valpo handles this one! By rights, perhaps, we should give them a 10-20 point beat-down. It'll be interesting to see how many minutes KVW plays, and to what effect. Gibler (2nd leading scorer, 2nd leading rebounder) may be out, but he was also out in their victory over Bradley.
Go Valpo!
agibson, part of the attendance might be due to a family saying, "Why pay $80+ to go watch the game at the ARC, when I can watch on my HDTV by an HDMI-cable and computer for free/a few bucks, and have my own pop, popcorn, beer, pizza, whatever?" The students might do the same thing, this way they can do some homework at the same time?
In terms of the Lakeshore Public Television feed, that will be thru Loyola. Valpo used to be covered by LSPTV, but a few years ago, rlh said that they wouldn't be covering our games anymore because Lakeshore wanted VU to pay a major fee to broadcast the games.
The person responsible for the internet broadcast needs to be unemployed tomorrow morning...this is ridiculous.
Sorry my chat isn't working, but this one is coming down to the wire. Knew they wouldn't go easy...
Just got home...tied. This is embarrassing.
I can't watch this.
Quote from: 78crusader on February 21, 2012, 08:52:36 PM
Just got home...tied. This is embarrassing.
Your team just clinched the #1 seed ... are you still "embarrassed"??
Wow, that was close! I wish that the HLN would have worked! Grrr.
Well, looks like many people predicted the difficulty of this game! Thank God they won...what a terrible night of homework it would've been with another L to Loyola at home at the end of the season. HL Champs...good. NIT bid...better. Beat Butler?...Icing on the cake. Win the HL Tourney...that's the goal.
Quote from: govalpogo on February 21, 2012, 09:23:34 PM
Beat Butler?...Icing on the cake.
According to Lazerus, this game is "meaningless" ... no different than the IPFW or IUPUI games. Winning won't help you get into the NCAA Tourney, so why try. It's the "Valpo Way". ??? (I know, I don't get it either, but that's the way they operate around here).
Simple. Because it's Butler! ;D
Oh, it's a huge game still! Butler is on a tear and Valpo desperately needs some momentum heading into the tourney. Play your hearts out! But perform well without the pressure i.e. MO St. last year! GO VALPO GO!
I'm waiting for tourney tickets to on line.
Jeez, why are Loyola announcers announcing at VALPO?!!
Lakeshore is just horrible.
My internet feed went down with 14 seconds to go in OT and I couldn't get the radio feed either. You think that they would have that figured out by now. :crazy:
Quote from: zvillehaze on February 21, 2012, 09:28:56 PM
Quote from: govalpogo on February 21, 2012, 09:23:34 PM
Beat Butler?...Icing on the cake.
According to Lazerus, this game is "meaningless" ... no different than the IPFW or IUPUI games. Winning won't help you get into the NCAA Tourney, so why try. It's the "Valpo Way". ??? (I know, I don't get it either, but that's the way they operate around here).
If the Crusaders don't stem Butler's considerable momentum now, there may be no one who will.
Quote from: valpofan11 on February 21, 2012, 09:41:10 PM
Jeez, why are Loyola announcers announcing at VALPO?!!
Lakeshore is just horrible.
lakeshore sports doesn't cover valpo anymore, just the two chicago schools.
Quote from: nkvu on February 21, 2012, 09:48:19 PM
My internet feed went down with 14 seconds to go in OT and I couldn't get the radio feed either. You think that they would have that figured out by now. :crazy:
the quality of hln was as bad tonight as it's been in the three years of its existence. skipping, freezing, dropping - absolute disgrace.
Quote from: vuweathernerd on February 21, 2012, 09:51:14 PM
Quote from: nkvu on February 21, 2012, 09:48:19 PM
My internet feed went down with 14 seconds to go in OT and I couldn't get the radio feed either. You think that they would have that figured out by now. :crazy:
the quality of hln was as bad tonight as it's been in the three years of its existence. skipping, freezing, dropping - absolute disgrace.
Amen, brother!
Quote from: valpofan11 on February 21, 2012, 09:41:10 PMJeez, why are Loyola announcers announcing at VALPO?!! Lakeshore is just horrible.
Loyla PAYS Lakeshore TV to carry their games. Valpo thought that was an insanely stupid idea that actually detracted from crowds at the ARC and thought they deserved to be compensated for the games airing on Lakeshore. I agree with Valpo. They would attract more donors than Loyola ever will on an Indiana station
Quote from: crusadermoe on February 21, 2012, 05:20:37 PM
Serious question: Should Valpo continue to have a basketball team if it generates very little local interest or student interest? Theoretically, you fund a Division I program because it generates excitement for the school and possibly impacts enrollment and donations, If it is generating no buzz ANYWHERE even locally,......why spend a healthy sum each year to put a team on the court? Just roll out a D-3 program and call it a day.
I would HATE to see it. But I'm baffled by the apathy of the students and the community. The tickets are a bargain and students get in free. Joining the Horizon League ought to have boosted regular season crowds. But I truly think we had better crowds come out to see UMKC or Southern Utah at the ARC than we see at the ARC on the webcasts now.
Wow, you must not have been the ARC tonight. The scene there was exactly the opposite of what you are describing! I get your point though, since historically we have been barely noticed. That is, after the shot and up until just about now. Now that we have won the regular season HL crown, we have a good chance to get an ncaa tournament bid. If we do that, and bryce is the guy who brings valpo back to the tournament, then interest will undoubtedly go up! At least, you would think so...
Quote from: vuweathernerd on February 21, 2012, 09:51:14 PMQuote from: nkvu on February 21, 2012, 09:48:19 PMMy internet feed went down with 14 seconds to go in OT and I couldn't get the radio feed either. You think that they would have that figured out by now. :crazy:
the quality of hln was as bad tonight as it's been in the three years of its existence. skipping, freezing, dropping - absolute disgrace.
It was probably because of the large amount of people who were trying to access it. After all, its still the internet and is never perfect. If all of a sudden a couple thousand people try and get on at the same time...well u get the idea...not that it helps any :)
http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2012/02/game-wrap-up-feels-good-to-be-1.html (http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2012/02/game-wrap-up-feels-good-to-be-1.html)
We have video of the mid court celebration and a link to the locker room party. Exciting way to win the title!
Some thoughts about the game:
First and foremost - Good win and congratulations on winning the HL! :thumbsup:
Second - why was Buggs guarding Averkamp, down low, time after time? :crazy:
Third - coaches are constantly telling players to raise their arms on defense. The reason was illustrated by loyola, tonight, as they thwarted many VU passes because they kept their arms up. ::)
Just my :twocents:
Because valpo switches every screen. Loyola figured that out and Averkamp would set the first pick just to get buggs or bogan on him then head for the post.
http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2012/02/game-wrap-up-feels-good-to-be-1.html (http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2012/02/game-wrap-up-feels-good-to-be-1.html)
QuoteSerious question: Should Valpo continue to have a basketball team if it generates very little local interest or student interest? Theoretically, you fund a Division I program because it generates excitement for the school and possibly impacts enrollment and donations, If it is generating no buzz ANYWHERE even locally,......why spend a healthy sum each year to put a team on the court? Just roll out a D-3 program and call it a day.
I would HATE to see it. But I'm baffled by the apathy of the students and the community. The tickets are a bargain and students get in free. Joining the Horizon League ought to have boosted regular season crowds. But I truly think we had better crowds come out to see UMKC or Southern Utah at the ARC than we see at the ARC on the webcasts now.
Well then you aren't going to be pleased when you hear that Valpo is on Spring Break during the tourney I believe.
This was the first game I attended this year and it was a great win for the program. Ok, I am going to be a little late to the party, but the atmosphere has really changed. The new video and sound system is a great addition to the facility. There has been a marked movement towards "events" during the timeouts and there is certainly a different vibe than in the past. Not sure, for those who simply enjoy college basketball if this makes for a more comfortable setting, but hey....that's sports marketing!
I too was baffled by the guarding of Averkamp by guards, particularly Buggs. It started much earlier than during a switch. Using Kenney on him at the end was more effective. Averkamp was the best player on the floor and we certainly were lucky on his 4th foul...that was as bad of a call as I have seen in over 25 years of watching games at VU.
Perhaps the "Bracketbuster Flue" with the considerable travel to and from SoCal had an effect, but after the early 8-0 run, VU really looked lethargic. Nice shooting game by Will Bogans. His 3 point shot was on the money, but his biggest offensive play was the attack of the basket from the corner (Averkamp with 4 fouls could only watch) and his little 10 footer on the next possession. But Will, you gotta hit the free throws! Nice game.
KVW didnt look as effective as anticipated. He had either 2 or 3 rebounds and wasnt a factor on the boards. I expected more out of him. Perhaps the knee or back was giving him issues. Speaking of rebounding, and I havent consulted the stats...VU was killed on the offensive boards the first half. The two rather large young men in VU travel gear sitting at the end of the bench will hopefully give assistance on the boards next year.
What a progression Ryan has made in a year. The word on him last year was that he was too "unselfish" and while that still applies, he has made great strides. What a great player. The quick release on the 3's he hit in the 2nd half was a thing of beauty. Possibly the 2nd biggest play of the night was his defensive rebound, dribble coast to almost coast and feed to KVW for a layup.
Loyola played well and the 1/3/1 zone give us fits. That is a new look - the non trap/deny the reversal pass by placing the point man at the top to twart reversal rather than trap. With Buggs on the floor, it was compounded by his inability to shoot the open shot. Kenney hit a huge 3 by faking a pass and creating time and space for a look. I would have liked to seen the ball pounded to KVW a little more down the stretch, but VU was content to settle for 3's.
Bryce has given a huge boost to this program, more than I expected. This team lost it's two leading scorers and hasnt missed a beat. In fact, the team chemistry appears to be much better than last year. While the passing game last year was excellent, this year was even better...at least against man to man. The zone caused problems.
Do not expect a 25 year coaching run from this talented young man. He is going to be far too hot a commodity to be able to hold onto in this community/university. Enjoy this while we can as big campus and bright lights will be calling...quickly.
lowposter
Quote from: lowposter on February 22, 2012, 07:18:04 AM
This was the first game I attended this year and it was a great win for the program. Ok, I am going to be a little late to the party, but the atmosphere has really changed. The new video and sound system is a great addition to the facility. There has been a marked movement towards "events" during the timeouts and there is certainly a different vibe than in the past. Not sure, for those who simply enjoy college basketball if this makes for a more comfortable setting, but hey....that's sports marketing!
I too was baffled by the guarding of Averkamp by guards, particularly Buggs. It started much earlier than during a switch. Using Kenney on him at the end was more effective. Averkamp was the best player on the floor and we certainly were lucky on his 4th foul...that was as bad of a call as I have seen in over 25 years of watching games at VU.
Perhaps the "Bracketbuster Flue" with the considerable travel to and from SoCal had an effect, but after the early 8-0 run, VU really looked lethargic. Nice shooting game by Will Bogans. His 3 point shot was on the money, but his biggest offensive play was the attack of the basket from the corner (Averkamp with 4 fouls could only watch) and his little 10 footer on the next possession. But Will, you gotta hit the free throws! Nice game.
KVW didnt look as effective as anticipated. He had either 2 or 3 rebounds and wasnt a factor on the boards. I expected more out of him. Perhaps the knee or back was giving him issues. Speaking of rebounding, and I havent consulted the stats...VU was killed on the offensive boards the first half. The two rather large young men in VU travel gear sitting at the end of the bench will hopefully give assistance on the boards next year.
What a progression Ryan has made in a year. The word on him last year was that he was too "unselfish" and while that still applies, he has made great strides. What a great player. The quick release on the 3's he hit in the 2nd half was a thing of beauty. Possibly the 2nd biggest play of the night was his defensive rebound, dribble coast to almost coast and feed to KVW for a layup.
Loyola played well and the 1/3/1 zone give us fits. That is a new look - the non trap/deny the reversal pass by placing the point man at the top to twart reversal rather than trap. With Buggs on the floor, it was compounded by his inability to shoot the open shot. Kenney hit a huge 3 by faking a pass and creating time and space for a look. I would have liked to seen the ball pounded to KVW a little more down the stretch, but VU was content to settle for 3's.
Bryce has given a huge boost to this program, more than I expected. This team lost it's two leading scorers and hasnt missed a beat. In fact, the team chemistry appears to be much better than last year. While the passing game last year was excellent, this year was even better...at least against man to man. The zone caused problems.
Do not expect a 25 year coaching run from this talented young man. He is going to be far too hot a commodity to be able to hold onto in this community/university. Enjoy this while we can as big campus and bright lights will be calling...quickly.
lowposter
Very nice comments and I agree with just about everything you said.
If Loyola was at full strength, they would have beaten us, probably by double digits, IMO. We didn't necessarily win this game in as much as Loyola gave it away.
Defensive rebounding was atrocious, IMO. I lost count of how many 2nd, 3rd, and even 4th chance attemps Loyola had on offense during the course of the game.
I'm not complaining, but you are right about Avercamp's fourth foul--it was a garbage call. IMO, it is that play that you can circle that changed the course of the game. The call resulted in a six point swing, not to mention that Loyola's major offensive threat had four fouls with over eight to go as a result.
Jay Harris should have sat on the bench much longer that he did in the second half. Not sure where the kid's mind was last night. He was MIA. C'mon Jay, you are better than that!
The zone defense Loyola threw at us caused us issues. I wouldn't be surprised to see another team throw a similar defense at us down the road this year.
Nice to be regular season champions. Congratulations to the kids.
All in all, a good evening and reason to celebrate. Unfortunately I still get the feeling that we as a ballclub are very beatable right now.
crusaderjoe:
Gotta agree with your last comment. There was nothing about last night that screamed "dominant team". Not even whispered. It is a very good team that does certain things well, but this was for the championship and was against a one win conference team. We looked "beatable".
Just checked the box score....3339 in attendance. Lots of empty seats for the biggest game of the year. The student section was much better than in the past couple of years, but there just isnt the support there that one would expect.
If the sports marketing department is going to use asset utilization management to price tickets for the big games, then perhaps they should figure out a way to get more folks in the stands for the other home games of the year. An extra 1000 people in the seats, even at $5 a tix would have generated $$$ and atmosphere. This community/area just doesnt support VU as it should...and I cannot figure out why.
lowposter
Quote from: Valpo10 on February 21, 2012, 11:03:03 PM
QuoteSerious question: Should Valpo continue to have a basketball team if it generates very little local interest or student interest? Theoretically, you fund a Division I program because it generates excitement for the school and possibly impacts enrollment and donations, If it is generating no buzz ANYWHERE even locally,......why spend a healthy sum each year to put a team on the court? Just roll out a D-3 program and call it a day.
I would HATE to see it. But I'm baffled by the apathy of the students and the community. The tickets are a bargain and students get in free. Joining the Horizon League ought to have boosted regular season crowds. But I truly think we had better crowds come out to see UMKC or Southern Utah at the ARC than we see at the ARC on the webcasts now.
Well then you aren't going to be pleased when you hear that Valpo is on Spring Break during the tourney I believe.
Courtesy the Valparaizone's official facebook account:
QuoteHorizon League Champs! Valpo will host the HL league tournament and has clinched no worse than a bid to the NIT. Our first tournament game will be Saturday, March 3rd at 7:30 p.m. at the ARC! Dorms will be open an extra day to allow everyone to stay on campus and go to the game! Plan on being there!
As of now, this is the only mention of such a plan that I have seen, but we are crazy if we don't do something like this. We need to bring some students out for the tourney...
PS: Haven't gone through the whole topic to see if this has been addressed, but how weak was the court storming yesterday? It was more like a trickle of water from a faucet than a true rush IMO.
Quote from: KL31NY on February 22, 2012, 08:38:26 AM
Quote from: Valpo10 on February 21, 2012, 11:03:03 PM
QuoteSerious question: Should Valpo continue to have a basketball team if it generates very little local interest or student interest? Theoretically, you fund a Division I program because it generates excitement for the school and possibly impacts enrollment and donations, If it is generating no buzz ANYWHERE even locally,......why spend a healthy sum each year to put a team on the court? Just roll out a D-3 program and call it a day.
I would HATE to see it. But I'm baffled by the apathy of the students and the community. The tickets are a bargain and students get in free. Joining the Horizon League ought to have boosted regular season crowds. But I truly think we had better crowds come out to see UMKC or Southern Utah at the ARC than we see at the ARC on the webcasts now.
Well then you aren't going to be pleased when you hear that Valpo is on Spring Break during the tourney I believe.
Courtesy the Valparaizone's official facebook account:
QuoteHorizon League Champs! Valpo will host the HL league tournament and has clinched no worse than a bid to the NIT. Our first tournament game will be Saturday, March 3rd at 7:30 p.m. at the ARC! Dorms will be open an extra day to allow everyone to stay on campus and go to the game! Plan on being there!
As of now, this is the only mention of such a plan that I have seen, but we are crazy if we don't do something like this. We need to bring some students out for the tourney...
PS: Haven't gone through the whole topic to see if this has been addressed, but how weak was the court storming yesterday? It was more like a trickle of water from a faucet than a true rush IMO.
Better than TCU's court storming the other week.
A couple of things:
1) Are students really going to be motivated to stay on campus? Will other things like the Union be open on Saturday?
2) Assuming we win on Saturday, is Valpo going to keep the dorms/food/Union open until at least Tuesday night?
Prospects look bleak...
Good win, sometimes have to grind out the games where you are not 'on.'
What game did TCU storm?? Their basketball has not been good since 1997-1998, the year Lee Nailon was there. We actually would have played TCU instead of Florida State in the second round, had TCU's 4 seed held that year.
Quote from: valpotx on February 22, 2012, 10:58:07 AM
Good win, sometimes have to grind out the games where you are not 'on.'
What game did TCU storm?? Their basketball has not been good since 1997-1998, the year Lee Nailon was there. We actually would have played TCU instead of Florida State in the second round, had TCU's 4 seed held that year.
Lee Nailon... 89, am I confused or did I just experience a 1994 IHSAA Final Four negative flashback?
Wow, just went to wikipedia and did not know he was from Indiana. Weird that he went to TCU, as not many Hoosiers come to play basketball in TX!
My first memory of Lee was that same year (or the year before) when he punched a guy from UNLV in the first 2 minutes of the game to be ejected.
Quote from: valpotx on February 22, 2012, 10:58:07 AM
Good win, sometimes have to grind out the games where you are not 'on.'
What game did TCU storm?? Their basketball has not been good since 1997-1998, the year Lee Nailon was there. We actually would have played TCU instead of Florida State in the second round, had TCU's 4 seed held that year.
They beat UNLV a couple of weeks ago.
Quote from: valpotx on February 22, 2012, 12:08:27 PM
Wow, just went to wikipedia and did not know he was from Indiana. Weird that he went to TCU, as not many Hoosiers come to play basketball in TX!
My first memory of Lee was that same year (or the year before) when he punched a guy from UNLV in the first 2 minutes of the game to be ejected.
Here's a trip in the wayback machine...Lee Nailon and South Bend Clay beat Bryce and Valpo to win the Indiana state championship in 94.
Quote from: milanmiracle on February 22, 2012, 02:59:19 PM
Quote from: valpotx on February 22, 2012, 12:08:27 PM
Wow, just went to wikipedia and did not know he was from Indiana. Weird that he went to TCU, as not many Hoosiers come to play basketball in TX!
My first memory of Lee was that same year (or the year before) when he punched a guy from UNLV in the first 2 minutes of the game to be ejected.
Here's a trip in the wayback machine...Lee Nailon and South Bend Clay beat Bryce and Valpo to win the Indiana state championship in 94.
Negative flashback confirmed. Thanks :(
Quote from: lowposter on February 22, 2012, 07:18:04 AMBryce has given a huge boost to this program, more than I expected. This team lost it's two leading scorers and hasnt missed a beat. In fact, the team chemistry appears to be much better than last year. While the passing game last year was excellent, this year was even better...at least against man to man. The zone caused problems.
Do not expect a 25 year coaching run from this talented young man. He is going to be far too hot a commodity to be able to hold onto in this community/university. Enjoy this while we can as big campus and bright lights will be calling...quickly.
While I agree with this, I hold out hope that Bryce would desire to stay here at Valpo, as Mark Few has stayed at Gonzaga and Brad Stevens with Butler. If the right program called Bryce, I couldn't blame him for leaving, especially for the chance to build his own program - like his brother with Baylor.
Yes St. Lu, that gives me a negative flashback for sure. Worst day of my life. :)
Quote from: KL31NY on February 22, 2012, 08:38:26 AM
PS: Haven't gone through the whole topic to see if this has been addressed, but how weak was the court storming yesterday? It was more like a trickle of water from a faucet than a true rush IMO.
I wasn't there in person. Did they let them on the floor, or did a small number sneak past? I know that in past games they've sort of roped off the victory bell. Maybe they've also roped in the students?
Quote from: crusaderjoe on February 22, 2012, 07:37:15 AMI lost count of how many 2nd, 3rd, and even 4th chance attemps Loyola had on offense during the course of the game.
At least two 4th chance attempts.
Quote from: crusaderjoe on February 22, 2012, 07:37:15 AMUnfortunately I still get the feeling that we as a ballclub are very beatable right now.
Unfortunately, I agree. Hopefully they can turn it back on for the next games, against tougher competition. It would be a shame to squander the home-court advantage.
Quote from: covufan on February 22, 2012, 03:59:41 PM
Quote from: lowposter on February 22, 2012, 07:18:04 AMBryce has given a huge boost to this program, more than I expected. This team lost it's two leading scorers and hasnt missed a beat. In fact, the team chemistry appears to be much better than last year. While the passing game last year was excellent, this year was even better...at least against man to man. The zone caused problems.
Do not expect a 25 year coaching run from this talented young man. He is going to be far too hot a commodity to be able to hold onto in this community/university. Enjoy this while we can as big campus and bright lights will be calling...quickly.
While I agree with this, I hold out hope that Bryce would desire to stay here at Valpo, as Mark Few has stayed at Gonzaga and Brad Stevens with Butler. If the right program called Bryce, I couldn't blame him for leaving, especially for the chance to build his own program - like his brother with Baylor.
It will be interesting to see how the University responds when the Drew-led gravy train is over and Valpo basketball falls off the cliff due to inferior facilities and no working plan in place to do anything about it. Like everything if life, having your cake and eating it too never lasts forever - nor should it.
Quote from: MattCarter on February 21, 2012, 10:32:40 PM[The bad HLN connection] It was probably because of the large amount of people who were trying to access it. After all, its still the internet and is never perfect. If all of a sudden a couple thousand people try and get on at the same time...well u get the idea...not that it helps any
Yes, sure. But, you can also pay for a better connection. Did they just not anticipate the number of users, and the load? Or did they choose not to pay to support it? Were they let down by their provider, who couldn't deliver on promises?
Quote from: agibson on February 22, 2012, 04:20:08 PM
Quote from: MattCarter on February 21, 2012, 10:32:40 PM[The bad HLN connection] It was probably because of the large amount of people who were trying to access it. After all, its still the internet and is never perfect. If all of a sudden a couple thousand people try and get on at the same time...well u get the idea...not that it helps any
Yes, sure. But, you can also pay for a better connection. Did they just not anticipate the number of users, and the load? Or did they choose not to pay to support it? Were they let down by their provider, who couldn't deliver on promises?
I did not have any problems with the connection until HLN cut the feed at about the 20 second mark in overtime, but then again I was watching on a 50 mbps FIOS network. That would lead me to believe that the issue was not HLN but some other network issue.
Quote from: Valpo89 on February 22, 2012, 04:09:29 PM
Yes St. Lu, that gives me a negative flashback for sure. Worst day of my life. :)
Same here. The first example I ever mention when talking about giving away a championship, blowing an 8 point lead with less than a minute remaining. The ride back from Indy was the longest I have endured. I think the guard who hit the shot to send the game into overtime was named Jaraan Cornell.
I still don't understand the coaching decision and why the Valpo players were standing inside the arc when only a 3-point shot could tie the game. They should have been bothering players in the three-point range and conceding the two-point shot. If anything, they even could have given a foul. That final minute and the coaching decision erased the magnificent performance, nearly 70 points scored, by Tim Bishop and Bryce Drew, as well as the undefeated championship. A horrible memory from one of the greatest seasons of high school basketball.
Quote from: FWalum on February 22, 2012, 04:25:33 PMI did not have any problems with the connection until HLN cut the feed at about the 20 second mark in overtime, but then again I was watching on a 50 mbps FIOS network. That would lead me to believe that the issue was not HLN but some other network issue.
Interesting! In the chat room here, a number (at least three) of people were reporting multiple synchronized outages. Of WAKE as well as HLN, if memory serves.
ESPN3 (with the WYIN Loyola feed) was reportedly more stable.
Quote from: agibson on February 22, 2012, 04:34:39 PM
Quote from: FWalum on February 22, 2012, 04:25:33 PMI did not have any problems with the connection until HLN cut the feed at about the 20 second mark in overtime, but then again I was watching on a 50 mbps FIOS network. That would lead me to believe that the issue was not HLN but some other network issue.
Interesting! In the chat room here, a number (at least three) of people were reporting multiple synchronized outages. Of WAKE as well as HLN, if memory serves.
ESPN3 (with the WYIN Loyola feed) was reportedly more stable.
In my case, the synchronized outages were the HLN broadcasts of the Valpo game and the Butler game. Both went out at *exactly* the same moment each time, while the Green Bay game trucked merrily on with nary a glitch.
Bryce just does not seem like the same situation as Scott. He seems to have pride in his alma mater, likes the community, and already made a good amount of money playing professional basketball. I would have to think it would take a special university/situation to take him away with these factors.
Quote from: agibson on February 22, 2012, 04:20:08 PMQuote from: MattCarter on February 21, 2012, 10:32:40 PM[The bad HLN connection] It was probably because of the large amount of people who were trying to access it. After all, its still the internet and is never perfect. If all of a sudden a couple thousand people try and get on at the same time...well u get the idea...not that it helps any
Yes, sure. But, you can also pay for a better connection. Did they just not anticipate the number of users, and the load? Or did they choose not to pay to support it? Were they let down by their provider, who couldn't deliver on promises?
I also use the UStream service (for other things) that Horizon Uses. I can tell that they are a premium, paid user of the service because there are no google ads or takeover commercials. As to what level they subscribe to, I do not know. I would assume that they purchase based on the entire league's volume at the highest tier but if they ran out of bandwidth, that could explain it.
Quote from: valpotx on February 22, 2012, 04:59:06 PM
Bryce just does not seem like the same situation as Scott. He seems to have pride in his alma mater, likes the community, and already made a good amount of money playing professional basketball. I would have to think it would take a special university/situation to take him away with these factors.
Agreed. The Baylor situation was Scott's chance to build a program - new facilities, agreements with administration for several years before competitiveness, program at bottom, in big conference, oh and $$$. I don't see another situation like that coming around.
Quote from: agibson on February 22, 2012, 04:16:15 PM
Quote from: KL31NY on February 22, 2012, 08:38:26 AM
PS: Haven't gone through the whole topic to see if this has been addressed, but how weak was the court storming yesterday? It was more like a trickle of water from a faucet than a true rush IMO.
I wasn't there in person. Did they let them on the floor, or did a small number sneak past? I know that in past games they've sort of roped off the victory bell. Maybe they've also roped in the students?
Most games they have had the rope, but they also will let students and players interact if the team comes over. Last night, the people I talked to pre-game said they'd use that rope to escort Loyola and the refs out and allow the students to rush the court.
However, one of my friends inadvertently let the news of CSU's loss roll through the student crowd. With "less significance" to the game, I guess people weren't as enthused when the staff let them run out. A group of around a dozen launched out early, and then it was two or three people at a time following them out in a "trickle" like I stated before. It was nowhere close to Butler last season where they was a clear storming by the students en masse.
Yeah, one student blurting out the details that could have waited until after the game ruins the fun, although how many students thought about rushing the court, then thought, "Why rush the court after beating Loyola?" I wouldn't be surprised to see more students rush the floor Friday night with a win over Butler at home, mostly because the game will be on ESPNU again.
Quote from: milanmiracle on February 22, 2012, 02:59:19 PM
Quote from: valpotx on February 22, 2012, 12:08:27 PM
Wow, just went to wikipedia and did not know he was from Indiana. Weird that he went to TCU, as not many Hoosiers come to play basketball in TX!
My first memory of Lee was that same year (or the year before) when he punched a guy from UNLV in the first 2 minutes of the game to be ejected.
Here's a trip in the wayback machine...Lee Nailon and South Bend Clay beat Bryce and Valpo to win the Indiana state championship in 94.
Thanks a lot for reminding me of this game. I was there & couldn't believe that Valpo let the game slip away.
Quote from: valporun on February 22, 2012, 10:31:18 PM
Yeah, one student blurting out the details that could have waited until after the game ruins the fun, although how many students thought about rushing the court, then thought, "Why rush the court after beating Loyola?" I wouldn't be surprised to see more students rush the floor Friday night with a win over Butler at home, mostly because the game will be on ESPNU again.
Thread hijacking: Question for debate- should students storm the court after a win over Butler? I lean "Nay." Butler is the two-time reigning NCAA finalist as a positive argument. However, last year's storming was 18-odd years of frustration released, especially after the close call in '08. It just wouldn't be the same. Any other thoughts while this question is up?
Quote from: KL31NY on February 22, 2012, 11:09:56 PM
Quote from: valporun on February 22, 2012, 10:31:18 PM
Yeah, one student blurting out the details that could have waited until after the game ruins the fun, although how many students thought about rushing the court, then thought, "Why rush the court after beating Loyola?" I wouldn't be surprised to see more students rush the floor Friday night with a win over Butler at home, mostly because the game will be on ESPNU again.
Thread hijacking: Question for debate- should students storm the court after a win over Butler? I lean "Nay." Butler is the two-time reigning NCAA finalist as a positive argument. However, last year's storming was 18-odd years of frustration released, especially after the close call in '08. It just wouldn't be the same. Any other thoughts while this question is up?
i go strong "no." 2 time defending national runner up or not, the fact of the matter is that we're ahead of them in the standings. and the only argument i can come up with to support what happened the other night is that the win clinched the regular season title. so we aren't even playing for that on friday. there is no good reason to have the students rush the court friday night. but due to the apathetic nature of the majority of the current student body, they won't know any better and will probably rush the floor anyway. hopefully some current students can take the lead, recognize that there's no reason to do so, and prevent a needless storming.
We should not storm the court unless we win the HL tournament championship. When you are the team on top of the conference, you are not supposed to storm unless it is an opponent you weren't supposed to beat (Butler last year). We can beat Butler, and have beaten them twice in a row = no need this time.
Run, do you remember us ever storming the court from 1999-2004? I really can't remember seeing/being a part of that. We were always expected to win our conference home games, the tournament, as well as just about every visiting non-conference opponent.
tx, at that point, we didn't storm because we were so used to winning it didn't matter. Now that we're the team on top, these kids will copy what they see on ESPN, and its sister stations, because they don't care what game it is, it's ESPN. That's all they think about, otherwise they would be at every game, no question. ESPN coverage changes how students react to the outcome of games. Plus, from 1999-2004, how often was there really national tv exposure for Valpo? Mostly, once a year, and that was on ESPN2 from Fort Wayne or Kansas City. Now that we're on ESPNU two or three times a year, we have the exposure, and that's why the students show up, because they like the "being seen on tv by their parents and friends".
The current court storming fad, without proper leadership of a handful of seniors saying, "NO, DON'T DO IT TONIGHT", won't change. They just react to what they see happen. I don't know if any of you saw the SWAC game Monday night on ESPNU with Texas Southern and Mississippi Valley St., but the MVS students stormed the court, and they won their conference by about 4 games, and that didn't stop those kids, so I don't see it stopping Valpo students from doing it either.
I don't care if the students storm the court every night if there are enough students to fill more than the center circle. If storming the court would be matched with 500 students in attendance, I'd be quite content.
My daughter, who is a student and not much of a sports fan, attended Tuesday's game, had fun, and is looking forward to coming to the Butler game with friends. It's possible that the idea of seeing bball as entertainment is getting some traction.
Just read all the comments. I was hoping for some fine points and I believe we had that all around. Good opinions everyone, especially valporun w/ depth getting at the heart of the student section makeup these days. humble, lol. tx and vu, very true.
Long story short, a win over Butler should not be enough to storm the court. Let's see if the student section agrees come Friday.
Quote from: vuweathernerd on February 22, 2012, 11:43:19 PMa needless storming
Sounds like a book title about fan support for Valpo athletics. So many exciting things yet the fans get excited over the wrong things because they are just a few steps behind.