So everyone keeps mentioning this name and I didn't know much about him so I decided to research him. Seems like an amazing person and very successful HEAD coach. I think he really changes kids lives with his I Am Third approach. The teams identity is I am Third. If he ever came to Valpo someday it would be like Roy Williams coming home. Bo Ryan had success coming from DIII to Wisconsin. Seems like he is recruiting DI players now for a DII school. Amazing story of growing up on a Dairy farm in Indiana and getting injured. Reminds me a John Wooden. Could be a movie. Still think you have to have patience with Matt Lottich though. Not even done with his third year yet.
I like Greg and think he's a great coach but as I said before I'm not sure there is a fit there. I don't think he'd be able to run a D1 program the same way he does his IWU program. A certain type of athletes flocks to IWU and I'm not sure D1 recruiting would go as well being run as devoutly religious as his program is run.
Quote from: tiny707 on December 21, 2018, 08:50:36 AMStill think you have to have patience with Matt Lottich though. Not even done with his third year yet.
Report to moderator Log
Agree on Lottich. Here's the thing: Bryce isn't exactly lighting it up at Vandy. Things take time.
Greg Tonagel is a great guy and has been a great coach at the NAIA level. If Valpo, at some point, were to search for a new coach, he should get strong consideration - but there is a major issue with Greg. My understanding is that he openly states that his religious beliefs are completely integrated with his coaching. This means that he expects his players to adhere to his view of Christian beliefs. If he cannot agree to keep his evangelism completely out of his coaching, and thus recruits players based on their playing ability, potential, and character and treats all players (regardless of their beliefs) with respect, then he should not be the coach at Valpo. One thing I do respect is that (again from what I understand) Greg will always be honest and forthcoming, so he would not deceive the university regarding his views on whether his religious beliefs would be imposed on players.
I do agree with you that the university needs to be patient with Matt Lottich, though I also believe that the athletic department and university need to understand his plans for achieving excellence on the court and need to take a critical look at whether he has the ability to turn things around. The effort and emphasis on team play has been sorely missing in many games this year.
Quote from: vu72 on December 21, 2018, 09:03:30 AM
Quote from: tiny707 on December 21, 2018, 08:50:36 AMStill think you have to have patience with Matt Lottich though. Not even done with his third year yet.
Report to moderator Log
Agree on Lottich. Here's the thing: Bryce isn't exactly lighting it up at Vandy. Things take time.
Bryce has had some decimating injuries this year at Vanderbilt, but has not let that create any acceptance of not reaching goals for the program (there was a recent article on espn.com on this). On top of that, Vandy just beat a ranked Arizona State team this week.
Yeah, Bryce is on the verge of something special at Vandy. They just beat Az State who was ranked 18. He lost garland, a top recruit, to injury early this season. They are still currently 7-2....
Meanwhile we are discussing hiring a coach from IWU and I'll be shocked if we finish above .500 this year. How disappointing. I still think Lottich deserves another year. I'm expecting a brutal conference record this year though.
Yeah Bryce has his program in a much stronger position than w e're currently in. Bryce, Rodger, Casey, and Jake have recruited their @$$es off and have done a hell of a job.
They took over a imperfect squad their first season that still had some talent and made it to the tourney after a rough start to the season. Their second season was rough because the roster was in a bad spot in terms of graduations and roster construction. This season they had a Top 10 recruiting class and the stars have had injuries and they're still solid.
One thing I will say about Lottich's teams are that Bryce put us in a tough spot with these giant classes every 4 seasons. He left Lottich a corvette with AP, Jubril, Shane, etcbut we all know how that season ended. Lottich has hasn't hit on many recruits his first few seasons (when recruiting HS kids): Micah, Jay (solid, not special), Parker (busy) Marty (a transfer), Mileek (maybe he develops into a good player). He probably hit on this class with Freeman (he doesn't commit to VU without Coach Dildy), Sackey (Coach Gore recruit). He's landed some good Transfers. The roster probably isn't a great Valley roster though. It's probably avg to sub par.
If I were the AD coming up with a list of future candidates there is no way Jake Diebler doesn't get a interview. A young and bright coaching mind and is a proven recruiter with strong ties to the program.
Agree with everyone, Vandy is pulling talent and is trending upwards (and they have been historically okay with being "average"). I think he'll be there for a long time to come.
I'm not sure it's fair to the current coach or the team to be tossing other names around on the board at this point in the process. I know it's part of the job and we are fans and can discuss everything, but it appeared everyone was behind Lottich and the team at the beginning of the season and thought it was going to be a great year. The last few games have been disappointing, for sure, and yes the ship is unstable, but there's still plenty of time to get it righted. Might be a long time until the next game :)
Quote from: VU2014 on December 21, 2018, 09:00:13 AM
I like Greg and think he's a great coach but as I said before I'm not sure there is a fit there. I don't think he'd be able to run a D1 program the same way he does his IWU program. A certain type of athletes flocks to IWU and I'm not sure D1 recruiting would go as well being run as devoutly religious as his program is run.
How do you think Homer coached?
Quote from: Valpo89 on December 21, 2018, 01:14:10 PM
Quote from: VU2014 on December 21, 2018, 09:00:13 AM
I like Greg and think he's a great coach but as I said before I'm not sure there is a fit there. I don't think he'd be able to run a D1 program the same way he does his IWU program. A certain type of athletes flocks to IWU and I'm not sure D1 recruiting would go as well being run as devoutly religious as his program is run.
How do you think Homer coached?
He and Bryce both have strong religious convictions, but (at least from my perspective) they kept them appropriately separate from their coaching. The reason that I say this is there were definitely players with different religious beliefs than the Drews or agnostic/indifferent religious beliefs and there were never (to my knowledge) any problems.
Quote from: Valpo89 on December 21, 2018, 01:14:10 PM
Quote from: VU2014 on December 21, 2018, 09:00:13 AM
I like Greg and think he's a great coach but as I said before I'm not sure there is a fit there. I don't think he'd be able to run a D1 program the same way he does his IWU program. A certain type of athletes flocks to IWU and I'm not sure D1 recruiting would go as well being run as devoutly religious as his program is run.
How do you think Homer coached?
There is a difference. If you follow IWU a little bit you would know exactly what I'm talking about. I'm just saying he'd probably need to alter some things if he moved up to the D1 level and started having to recruit the caliber of players we would need to succeed. Don't get me wrong he's a great coach. There is absolutely nothing wrong with being religious and in fact most of our coaches have been open about their faith and I respect that and think it's a good thing.
Would love to see Jake Diebler as coach of valpo.
Quote from: oklahomamick on December 21, 2018, 03:32:52 PM
Would love to see Jake Diebler as coach of valpo.
I am a big Jake Diebler fan, but I don't think he is ready for a D1 coaching job, especially at a high mid major school.
Quote from: valpospartan on December 21, 2018, 10:43:26 PM
Quote from: oklahomamick on December 21, 2018, 03:32:52 PM
Would love to see Jake Diebler as coach of valpo.
I am a big Jake Diebler fan, but I don't think he is ready for a D1 coaching job, especially at a high mid major school.
Jake actually has more coaching experience right now then Coach Lottich had before getting the VU Head Coaching job (2013-2016). Jake's experience: Valpo assistant 2012-2013, Ohio State video coordinator 2013-2016, Vanderbilt assistant: April 2016-present. Coach Lottich was ironically Jake's replacement on the VU staff. One major difference in their experience level is that Coach Lottich played overseas for many years, which has to be some valuable experience. I can't argue that Jake might need more seasoning before getting his first HC job but he's getting some valuable experience.
I want to emphasize I'm not ready to give Coach Lottich the boot, but I think some criticism is warranted. No matter what he deserves 4 years, imo. ML is going to have a very tough decision when that contract comes up if there isn't marketable improvement or the arrow isn't clearly pointing up. That big 2020 class is critical and if you let a coach go before then it could set the program back for quite a while if a new coach has to start recruiting from scratch. I'm rooting for Coach Lottich but I'm not going to sugarcoat it. The team needs to perform at much higher level.
I would love to see Jake come back and take over the reigns. Or, it would also be cool to see Jake come in as Tonagel's assistant. Or, I woudn't mind the existing staff but under a more experienced coach with more energy. I'd love - for instance - to see someone like Greg Kampe come over to Valpo. He's a riot.
Kampe can't win. Hard pass.
Troll post of the year goes to 2010....
I really want Lottich to succeed and this post to laughed at by the end of next year.
Let there be a day where he becomes Coach Take No Ls. It would be awesome. I hope he makes us all eat every single negative comment.
Quote from: VU2014 on December 21, 2018, 09:00:13 AM
I like Greg and think he's a great coach but as I said before I'm not sure there is a fit there. I don't think he'd be able to run a D1 program the same way he does his IWU program. A certain type of athletes flocks to IWU and I'm not sure D1 recruiting would go as well being run as devoutly religious as his program is run.
Please explain to me what the difference is between the successful program that Bryce Drew ran at Valpo and the successful program Greg Tonagel runs at Indiana Wesleyan as far as being run by an openly Christian coach. How is Tonagel so different than the way Bryce ran his Valpo program?
I *think* this is a compliment? Not quite sure. Either way, I do hope he succeeds. Don't we all? Isn't that why we watch? To see the team win? Win early, often, and all the time?
Quote from: bbtds on December 22, 2018, 11:09:46 AM
Quote from: VU2014 on December 21, 2018, 09:00:13 AM
I like Greg and think he's a great coach but as I said before I'm not sure there is a fit there. I don't think he'd be able to run a D1 program the same way he does his IWU program. A certain type of athletes flocks to IWU and I'm not sure D1 recruiting would go as well being run as devoutly religious as his program is run.
Please explain to me what the difference is between the successful program that Bryce Drew ran at Valpo and the successful program Greg Tonagel runs at Indiana Wesleyan as far as being run by an openly Christian coach. How is Tonagel so different than the way Bryce ran his Valpo program?
Both clearly have strong religious convictions. That, of course, is not a problem. Bryce (to my knowledge) never evangelized to his players and never expected or required participation in any religious activities. He never prioritized recruiting players who shared his religious beliefs. From my understanding, Tonagel has done all of this quite a bit at IWU and would continue this at any place he coached.
If Tonagel could make everyone confident that he can separate his role as coach and his religious beliefs, he would be a strong candidate at such a time when there was an opening.
I think Homer required his players to go to church/chapel on road games. I was with the team in Hawaii in 1995, and I think we went to church together on the Sunday before the tournament began.
Here's a dream staff: Tonagel, Diebler .... and CA!!
Quote from: bbtds on December 22, 2018, 11:09:46 AM
Quote from: VU2014 on December 21, 2018, 09:00:13 AM
I like Greg and think he's a great coach but as I said before I'm not sure there is a fit there. I don't think he'd be able to run a D1 program the same way he does his IWU program. A certain type of athletes flocks to IWU and I'm not sure D1 recruiting would go as well being run as devoutly religious as his program is run.
Please explain to me what the difference is between the successful program that Bryce Drew ran at Valpo and the successful program Greg Tonagel runs at Indiana Wesleyan as far as being run by an openly Christian coach. How is Tonagel so different than the way Bryce ran his Valpo program?
This podcast could probably give you a feel for what I'm talking about. This a faithbased sports podcast that Greg did. It's a good interview and he talks very highly about his time at Valpo and Homer. My only concern with Greg being our HC one day is that his style might be a little overbearing for some athletes and recruits. He's a proven and excellent coach. I'd love to have him as an assistant on Valpo's staff but he mentions that he feels best suited as a HC. Maybe I could be totally wrong about my assessment of Greg. He's an excellent coach but if he wants to move up to the D1 level it would have to be the right fit with the University.
https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/episode-84-greg-tonagel-indiana-wesleyan-mens-basketball/id1214996827?i=1000403871767&mt=2
Quote from: bbtds on December 22, 2018, 11:09:46 AM
Quote from: VU2014 on December 21, 2018, 09:00:13 AM
I like Greg and think he's a great coach but as I said before I'm not sure there is a fit there. I don't think he'd be able to run a D1 program the same way he does his IWU program. A certain type of athletes flocks to IWU and I'm not sure D1 recruiting would go as well being run as devoutly religious as his program is run.
Please explain to me what the difference is between the successful program that Bryce Drew ran at Valpo and the successful program Greg Tonagel runs at Indiana Wesleyan as far as being run by an openly Christian coach. How is Tonagel so different than the way Bryce ran his Valpo program?
Division 1
Bryce played in the NBA
Bryce has a brother and father that have coached in BIG games
For starters
Quote from: Valpo89 on December 22, 2018, 03:26:43 PM
I think Homer required his players to go to church/chapel on road games. I was with the team in Hawaii in 1995, and I think we went to church together on the Sunday before the tournament began.
Here's a dream staff: Tonagel, Diebler .... and CA!!
Low expectations if our dream staff only composed of former Valpo players ...assuming CA is as well?
Anyway
There are a ton of talented basketball coaches out there that never played or coached at Valpo
Times are changing
Quote from: vu84v2 on December 22, 2018, 03:04:14 PM
Quote from: bbtds on December 22, 2018, 11:09:46 AM
Quote from: VU2014 on December 21, 2018, 09:00:13 AM
I like Greg and think he's a great coach but as I said before I'm not sure there is a fit there. I don't think he'd be able to run a D1 program the same way he does his IWU program. A certain type of athletes flocks to IWU and I'm not sure D1 recruiting would go as well being run as devoutly religious as his program is run.
Please explain to me what the difference is between the successful program that Bryce Drew ran at Valpo and the successful program Greg Tonagel runs at Indiana Wesleyan as far as being run by an openly Christian coach. How is Tonagel so different than the way Bryce ran his Valpo program?
Both clearly have strong religious convictions. That, of course, is not a problem. Bryce (to my knowledge) never evangelized to his players and never expected or required participation in any religious activities. He never prioritized recruiting players who shared his religious beliefs. From my understanding, Tonagel has done all of this quite a bit at IWU and would continue this at any place he coached.
If Tonagel could make everyone confident that he can separate his role as coach and his religious beliefs, he would be a strong candidate at such a time when there was an opening.
Tonagel wanted the job. He knows exactly how Homer and Bryce operated when they were in charge of the Valpo program and he could see just how much the Valpo administration allowed the Drews to express their Christian beliefs. I don't think Greg would express his interest in the Valpo job unless he fully understood what this side of his life would be allowed at Valpo. I would assume that this would be discussed in the interview process and any issues that might come up about Greg's Christianity would be ironed out at that time. I think we are judging Greg's aptitude for being a head coach way too much on his Christianity. He's a good coach, he is allowed to express his Christianity in a certain way at IWU and I think if there was a problem with that at Valpo Greg would not be given the job.
Quote from: Valpo2013 on December 22, 2018, 04:03:27 PM
Quote from: bbtds on December 22, 2018, 11:09:46 AM
Quote from: VU2014 on December 21, 2018, 09:00:13 AM
I like Greg and think he's a great coach but as I said before I'm not sure there is a fit there. I don't think he'd be able to run a D1 program the same way he does his IWU program. A certain type of athletes flocks to IWU and I'm not sure D1 recruiting would go as well being run as devoutly religious as his program is run.
Please explain to me what the difference is between the successful program that Bryce Drew ran at Valpo and the successful program Greg Tonagel runs at Indiana Wesleyan as far as being run by an openly Christian coach. How is Tonagel so different than the way Bryce ran his Valpo program?
Division 1
Bryce played in the NBA
Bryce has a brother and father that have coached in BIG games
For starters
This has nothing to do with the way Greg would express his Christianity if he was given the job at Valpo.
BTW, has anyone noticed that the post game prayer has disappeared at Valpo games since Bryce and Coach Tracey Dorow have left Valpo. Lottich no longer expresses his Christianity in that manner.
Quote from: bbtds on December 22, 2018, 07:22:59 PM
Quote from: Valpo2013 on December 22, 2018, 04:03:27 PM
Quote from: bbtds on December 22, 2018, 11:09:46 AM
Quote from: VU2014 on December 21, 2018, 09:00:13 AM
I like Greg and think he's a great coach but as I said before I'm not sure there is a fit there. I don't think he'd be able to run a D1 program the same way he does his IWU program. A certain type of athletes flocks to IWU and I'm not sure D1 recruiting would go as well being run as devoutly religious as his program is run.
Please explain to me what the difference is between the successful program that Bryce Drew ran at Valpo and the successful program Greg Tonagel runs at Indiana Wesleyan as far as being run by an openly Christian coach. How is Tonagel so different than the way Bryce ran his Valpo program?
Division 1
Bryce played in the NBA
Bryce has a brother and father that have coached in BIG games
For starters
This has nothing to do with the way Greg would express his Christianity if he was given the job at Valpo.
BTW, has anyone noticed that the post game prayer has disappeared at Valpo games since Bryce and Coach Tracey Dorow have left Valpo. Lottich no longer expresses his Christianity in that manner.
Have we really stopped the post game prayer on the court? Interesting. Did that end this season? I remember when the team and the student body did it right after that big Rhode Island win a few seasons ago under Coach Lottich.
https://twitter.com/AlBillets/status/1076694021458853888
This was after the Ball State game 12/17/18. I have seen this at the end of all our home games this year. Looks like a post game prayer to me. If you attend the games you'll see it. You won't see it on the broadcast in your home.
Quote from: bbtds on December 22, 2018, 07:13:30 PMTonagel wanted the job.
Sources??
If Greg wanted to interview for the job he could have called Mark LaBarbera and I am pretty sure he would have gotten an interview. I am not saying he would have gotten the job, just an interview. Everything that I have heard about Greg tells me that he is very happy were he is at. The Tom Davis article was an antagonistic piece of journalism. Tom believed that Greg should have wanted the job.
Quote from: FWalum on December 23, 2018, 01:18:31 AM
Quote from: bbtds on December 22, 2018, 07:13:30 PMTonagel wanted the job.
Sources??
If Greg wanted to interview for the job he could have called Mark LaBarbera and I am pretty sure he would have gotten an interview. I am not saying he would have gotten the job, just an interview. Everything that I have heard about Greg tells me that he is very happy were he is at. The Tom Davis article was an antagonistic piece of journalism. Tom believed that Greg should have wanted the job.
I forgot who said it but I remember hearing the same thing. Apparently Homer vogued for him. I take whatever Tom Davis says with a grain of salt. He's down in Florida, last I heard. Davis just liked stirring the pot and taking shots whenever he could.
Only candidates in house apparently got interviews. We still don't know if Powell turned down the job to follow Bryce. I remember it came down to Lottich and Gore at the end. Luckily Coach Gore stayed on staff and became the associate HC.
A focus on winning basketball games and less on praying may do us some good
Quote from: Valpo2013 on December 23, 2018, 07:03:27 AMA focus on winning basketball games and less on praying may do us some good
Prayer has nothing to do with Lottich and the team's struggle to win games. Homer Scott and Bryce prayed plenty and won plenty.
Division II and Division III National Championships are now moving to INDY.
I thought I recently heard that either the D-12 or D-3 Finals were coming to Ft.Wayne in a year or two. Any news on that fw alum?
Per the NCAA web site, the D II tournament will be in Evansville 2019, 2020, 2021 and 2022 while the D III tournament will be in Fort Wayne those years.
Quote from: valpo64 on January 10, 2019, 01:03:50 PM
I thought I recently heard that either the D-12 or D-3 Finals were coming to Ft.Wayne in a year or two. Any news on that fw alum?
Visit Fort Wayne (https://www.visitfortwayne.com/event/ncaa-division-iii-mens-basketball-championships/21400/)
Hosted by Manchester University at the Memorial Coliseum.
Quote from: tiny707 on January 10, 2019, 12:31:35 PM
Division II and Division III National Championships are now moving to INDY.
Oh boy!
I always thought the 1.5 hour drive to Dayton for the play-in games might be interesting until I saw the price of a ticket to a Big Dance play-in game. $50 is around the cheapest. A little too much after driving to Dayton to see, at best, 11 seeds play.
I might have to see what kind of price they charge for the Div. I and Div. III national championship games.
EDIT: I now see I might have to drive to Ft Wayne or Evansville for those national championship games too.
For the first time, the NCAA Division III Men's Basketball National Championship comes to Fort Wayne at the Allen County War Memorial Coliseum. The event is hosted by Manchester University and Visit Fort Wayne. The tournament is a 61-team single-elimination tourney, with teams advancing from four regionals, to the semifinals and finals in Fort Wayne.
Friday, March 15: Semifinals at 6:00 p.m. and 8:00 p.m. (30 minutes following the conclusion of the first semifinal)
Saturday, March 16: NABC Reese's D3 All Star Game at 4:30 p.m., and Championship Finals at 7:00 p.m.
The best sources of information for NCAA D3 Basketball are www.d3hoops.com and www.d3hoopsville.com.
Ticket prices:
All session tickets (both days): $26 adults, $16 students/seniors/military, 5 and under is FREE
Single session tickets (one day): $15.50 adults, $10.50 students/seniors/military, 5 and under is FREE
Groups (10 or more):
All session tickets (both days): $21 adults, $11 students/seniors/military
Single session tickets (one day): $13.50 adults, $8.50 students/seniors/military
PARKING
CASH ONLY & SINGLE ENTRY
$6 MAIN LOT; $10 PREFERRED LOT; $18 BUS/RV
Quote from: FWalum on January 12, 2019, 12:08:46 AM
For the first time, the NCAA Division III Men's Basketball National Championship comes to Fort Wayne at the Allen County War Memorial Coliseum. The event is hosted by Manchester University and Visit Fort Wayne. The tournament is a 61-team single-elimination tourney, with teams advancing from four regionals, to the semifinals and finals in Fort Wayne.
Friday, March 15: Semifinals at 6:00 p.m. and 8:00 p.m. (30 minutes following the conclusion of the first semifinal)
Saturday, March 16: NABC Reese's D3 All Star Game at 4:30 p.m., and Championship Finals at 7:00 p.m.
The best sources of information for NCAA D3 Basketball are www.d3hoops.com and www.d3hoopsville.com.
Ticket prices:
All session tickets (both days): $26 adults, $16 students/seniors/military, 5 and under is FREE
Single session tickets (one day): $15.50 adults, $10.50 students/seniors/military, 5 and under is FREE
Groups (10 or more):
All session tickets (both days): $21 adults, $11 students/seniors/military
Single session tickets (one day): $13.50 adults, $8.50 students/seniors/military
PARKING
CASH ONLY & SINGLE ENTRY
$6 MAIN LOT; $10 PREFERRED LOT; $18 BUS/RV
Thanks for that information. I'm sure all your spelling was perfect. :-)
IWU wins first game in playoffs...
Guess we made the right choice after all with hiring Matt. You are all loving it, or at least trusting the process.
Hopefully he keeps winning...now where is that emoji of the guy beating the dead horse??
Quote from: M on March 06, 2019, 08:14:17 PM
Hopefully he keeps winning...now where is that emoji of the guy beating the dead horse??
How about just a dead horse?
(https://www.rtfacts.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/horse-skeleton.jpg)
Round two victory for IWU...made last second three to win 87-86.
Let's go, Greg! T-T-T-Time for Tonagel!
Isn't there a IWU fan message board somewhere. I wish him luck but Greg won't be coming here anytime in the near future. So let's just give this thread a rest.
He might be here sooner or later
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk
....should we still give this thread a rest?
Maybe, maybe not...maybe start a new thread with potential replacements instead of a thread for every assistant and NAIA coach we come across.
Maybe not, Greg needs his own thread. Too much history.
I stand by my comments here on this thread.
No. Division 1 is a different situation. I think the legendary Dale Carlson came from NAIA with great qualifications.
No, no, no. If Greg wants the job, he can interview and beat out the top contenders from the national search. No more simply handing the program down to the next guy based on connections/religion/etc. We've hit our limitations on that.
Honestly I'd be willing to give Tonagel a shot at this point, even though I don't think he's the best choice. I think he's an excellent coach but maybe not a perfect culture fit for reason I've stated in other threads. For the record I do think NAIA coaches can make this leap from a x's and o's and development standpoint but it would be a huge risk from a recruiting stand point.
I don't care where the next coach comes from... I just want to win and feel like I cheer for a strong program again.
This guy just keeps winning...
I've said it before and I'll say it again - Hire Tonagel!!! It would certainly be a pay bump for him and there's incentive from being an alumni
Has the best college player in the state of Indiana...
There are a number of good candidates. Bryce is not coaching, Powell, Tonagel, Deibler, Nunez.
I also think it's important that we have assistants who stay. That has been a revolving door the last 3 years.
This is not Matt's fault. Just wasn't ready.
2020 Crossroads League Champions. That is 11 out of 15 years...
Posting for informational purposes only in no way is this an endorsement of firing Lottich and hiring Tonagel but he is about to cruise to another crossroads league championship. His IWU Wildcats are up by more than 20 points and are less than two minutes away from another Title.
Let's go Coach Tonagel!!!!!
9-0 so far......
Quote from: tiny707 on December 02, 2020, 12:03:01 PM
9-0 so far......
Lottich just got a contract extension. For better or worse he is here to stay. This thread needs to take pause for a while.
Tonagel is an excellent coach. He recruited the best player in the NAIA (Kyle Mangas from Warsaw) and puts tons of talent around him. I don't know how the NAIA to D1 jump would be, however. That's a massive step up.
Now 16-0 since last post...
19-1 record now...
Quote from: tiny707 on January 17, 2021, 02:37:10 PM
19-1 record now...
Yes, he's a good coach. But it's apples and oranges. NAIA coaches can make the transition (old Green Bay coach (after Wardle) did it I believe).
From my understanding Tonagel consistently recruits the best at that level. But recruiting D1 athletes is just different. Maybe Tonagel would work I don't know, but I stated my concerns in the past. Lottich isn't going anywhere
Quote from: VU2014 on January 17, 2021, 06:59:58 PM
Quote from: tiny707 on January 17, 2021, 02:37:10 PM
19-1 record now...
Yes, he's a good coach. But it's apples and oranges. NAIA coaches can make the transition (old Green Bay coach (after Wardle) did it I believe).
From my understanding Tonagel consistently recruits the best at that level. But recruiting D1 athletes is just different. Maybe Tonagel would work I don't know, but I stated my concerns in the past. Lottich isn't going anywhere
Linc Darner went to GB from Florida Southern, after winning an NCAA D-2 national championship.
And where is Linc Darner now?
Quote from: valpo64 on January 19, 2021, 11:30:47 AM
And where is Linc Darner now?
My guess is sitting at home during the pandemic spending his settlement
https://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/story/sports/college/uwgb/2020/05/29/fired-uwgb-basketball-coach-linc-darner-guaranteed-least-720-000-settlement/5285514002/
According to the agreement obtained Friday through an open records request, Darner was paid $120,000 on May 21 and will receive $120,000 on the first business day in January.
Darner also will receive monthly payments of $20,000 from May 1, 2021, through April 1, 2023.
If Darner has not landed a head coaching or assistant job before that time — he agreed to make a reasonable and diligent effort to do so — he will receive an additional $20,000 per month beginning May 1, 2023, and going through April 1, 2024.
Quote from: bbtds on January 19, 2021, 08:32:27 PM
Quote from: valpo64 on January 19, 2021, 11:30:47 AM
And where is Linc Darner now?
My guess is sitting at home during the pandemic spending his settlement
https://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/story/sports/college/uwgb/2020/05/29/fired-uwgb-basketball-coach-linc-darner-guaranteed-least-720-000-settlement/5285514002/
According to the agreement obtained Friday through an open records request, Darner was paid $120,000 on May 21 and will receive $120,000 on the first business day in January.
Darner also will receive monthly payments of $20,000 from May 1, 2021, through April 1, 2023.
If Darner has not landed a head coaching or assistant job before that time — he agreed to make a reasonable and diligent effort to do so — he will receive an additional $20,000 per month beginning May 1, 2023, and going through April 1, 2024.
That is one solid buyout for a first time D1 coach. But these buyout could be punitive if there is no out clause. I can begin to know what is in the contract language for Lottich's deal but I'm guessing he's making more than Linc was being in the MVC and he's on his 2nd deal.
Quote from: VU2014 on January 19, 2021, 09:14:53 PM
Quote from: bbtds on January 19, 2021, 08:32:27 PM
Quote from: valpo64 on January 19, 2021, 11:30:47 AM
And where is Linc Darner now?
My guess is sitting at home during the pandemic spending his settlement
https://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/story/sports/college/uwgb/2020/05/29/fired-uwgb-basketball-coach-linc-darner-guaranteed-least-720-000-settlement/5285514002/
According to the agreement obtained Friday through an open records request, Darner was paid $120,000 on May 21 and will receive $120,000 on the first business day in January.
Darner also will receive monthly payments of $20,000 from May 1, 2021, through April 1, 2023.
If Darner has not landed a head coaching or assistant job before that time — he agreed to make a reasonable and diligent effort to do so — he will receive an additional $20,000 per month beginning May 1, 2023, and going through April 1, 2024.
That is one solid buyout for a first time D1 coach. But these buyout could be punitive if there is no out clause. I can begin to know what is in the contract language for Lottich's deal but I'm guessing he's making more than Linc was being in the MVC and he's on his 2nd deal.
Since COVID: no 2020 NCAA tournament revenue sharing, no summer camps, no gate/concessions/parking package receipts, "temporary" elimination of non-revenue sports. The university couldn't buy out the ARC janitor, let alone the men's basketball coach.
If Lottich's agent got him any kind of a decent buyout after the last three years I'm going to ask him to negotiate my brother's next prenup.
Let's combine the topics of the "Drew" and the "Tonagel", and maybe even throw in the "Darner."
Current record is 6-1, 5-0 at home and a 5 game winning streak.
Tonagel probably awards playing time based on defense!
I know NAIA and D2 aren't remotely the same thing but we need to consider this as we evaluate the state of the program and the head coaching position: Indiana State lost a bunch of players to transfer and then lost its best player to injury after hiring a D2 coach and has now started the year 3-1 with victories over Green Bay and Old Dominion (Not great shakes as programs but not slouches either). The point is this: Indiana State has all the same excuses Lottich can use and is still doing much better than Lottich is despite Lottich having the advantage of having been at the helm of the program for many years by this point. Maybe we need to look at a guy like Tonagel who has a history of winning albeit at a lower level and see if he can bring that winning to this level. Maybe it's not so much the competition he faces and he's actually a good coach. Maybe it will translate. Might as well give it a try. At this point I'm open to anything and honestly hiring Tonagel made just as much sense at the time as hiring Lottich did if not more. Let's at least give the guy an interview for Pete's sake (which if I remember correctly we didn't last time).
Quote from: VUGrad1314 on November 19, 2021, 01:57:50 AM
I know NAIA and D2 aren't remotely the same thing but we need to consider this as we evaluate the state of the program and the head coaching position: Indiana State lost a bunch of players to transfer and then lost its best player to injury after hiring a D2 coach and has now started the year 3-1 with victories over Green Bay and Old Dominion (Not great shakes as programs but not slouches either). The point is this: Indiana State has all the same excuses Lottich can use and is still doing much better than Lottich is despite Lottich having the advantage of having been at the helm of the program for many years by this point. Maybe we need to look at a guy like Tonagel who has a history of winning albeit at a lower level and see if he can bring that winning to this level. Maybe it's not so much the competition he faces and he's actually a good coach. Maybe it will translate. Might as well give it a try. At this point I'm open to anything and honestly hiring Tonagel made just as much sense at the time as hiring Lottich did if not more. Let's at least give the guy an interview for Pete's sake (which if I remember correctly we didn't last time).
I agree on this. Remember, we hired a guy named Homer Drew whose previous coaching spot was at Indiana-South Bend (NAIA) and Bethel University (D3). As I recall, Homer did a fair job at Valpo. ::)
Quote from: vu72 on November 19, 2021, 08:41:10 AM
Quote from: VUGrad1314 on November 19, 2021, 01:57:50 AM
I know NAIA and D2 aren't remotely the same thing but we need to consider this as we evaluate the state of the program and the head coaching position: Indiana State lost a bunch of players to transfer and then lost its best player to injury after hiring a D2 coach and has now started the year 3-1 with victories over Green Bay and Old Dominion (Not great shakes as programs but not slouches either). The point is this: Indiana State has all the same excuses Lottich can use and is still doing much better than Lottich is despite Lottich having the advantage of having been at the helm of the program for many years by this point. Maybe we need to look at a guy like Tonagel who has a history of winning albeit at a lower level and see if he can bring that winning to this level. Maybe it's not so much the competition he faces and he's actually a good coach. Maybe it will translate. Might as well give it a try. At this point I'm open to anything and honestly hiring Tonagel made just as much sense at the time as hiring Lottich did if not more. Let's at least give the guy an interview for Pete's sake (which if I remember correctly we didn't last time).
I agree on this. Remember, we hired a guy named Homer Drew whose previous coaching spot was at Indiana-South Bend (NAIA) and Bethel University (D3). As I recall, Homer did a fair job at Valpo. ::)
Homer Drew didn't have a winning season until year 6 including 3 straight years of 5 or less wins. You guys would have been all over him. No way he survives the current world.
Quote from: IndyValpo on November 19, 2021, 08:58:48 AMQuote from: vu72 on November 19, 2021, 08:41:10 AMQuote from: VUGrad1314 on November 19, 2021, 01:57:50 AMI know NAIA and D2 aren't remotely the same thing but we need to consider this as we evaluate the state of the program and the head coaching position: Indiana State lost a bunch of players to transfer and then lost its best player to injury after hiring a D2 coach and has now started the year 3-1 with victories over Green Bay and Old Dominion (Not great shakes as programs but not slouches either). The point is this: Indiana State has all the same excuses Lottich can use and is still doing much better than Lottich is despite Lottich having the advantage of having been at the helm of the program for many years by this point. Maybe we need to look at a guy like Tonagel who has a history of winning albeit at a lower level and see if he can bring that winning to this level. Maybe it's not so much the competition he faces and he's actually a good coach. Maybe it will translate. Might as well give it a try. At this point I'm open to anything and honestly hiring Tonagel made just as much sense at the time as hiring Lottich did if not more. Let's at least give the guy an interview for Pete's sake (which if I remember correctly we didn't last time).
I agree on this. Remember, we hired a guy named Homer Drew whose previous coaching spot was at Indiana-South Bend (NAIA) and Bethel University (D3). As I recall, Homer did a fair job at Valpo. ::)
Homer Drew didn't have a winning season until year 6 including 3 straight years of 5 or less wins. You guys would have been all over him. No way he survives the current world.
We had no history to speak of prior to Homer Drew. We weren't in a prestigious multibid conference back then. It made much more sense to be patient then because what did we have to lose? Does Lottich have a Mr Basketball son ready to join the team and resurrect the program that we don't know about? If we're being honest Homer got lucky that Bryce came around when he did and decided to stay home and play for him. It saved him and it saved our program moreso than anything else that happened. Had Bryce not been a High School senior\Valpo commit at the time I doubt Homer would have lasted much longer. There is much more at stake for the program in the current world. if we continue to fall too far behind our MVC peers we may well dig a hole we can never get out of like Evansville except they have much stronger fan support that can carry them through lean times. That said, the MVC might well tank this conference by its own hand if they are seriously going to add awful programs like UMKC and Arlington....
Quote from: IndyValpo on November 19, 2021, 08:58:48 AMHomer Drew didn't have a winning season until year 6 including 3 straight years of 5 or less wins. You guys would have been all over him. No way he survives the current world.
Valpo had a losing record is 12 of the previous 13 years prior to Homer arriving and that one year finished at 13-12. Now, Matt on the other hand, inherited a team that won 30 games and had a winning record in the previous 6 years. Yes, we switched conferences, but come on, if he can't turn this ship around with the talent on board then it just might be time to steer clear of the iceberg.
Quote from: vu72 on November 19, 2021, 08:41:10 AM
Quote from: VUGrad1314 on November 19, 2021, 01:57:50 AM
I know NAIA and D2 aren't remotely the same thing but we need to consider this as we evaluate the state of the program and the head coaching position: Indiana State lost a bunch of players to transfer and then lost its best player to injury after hiring a D2 coach and has now started the year 3-1 with victories over Green Bay and Old Dominion (Not great shakes as programs but not slouches either). The point is this: Indiana State has all the same excuses Lottich can use and is still doing much better than Lottich is despite Lottich having the advantage of having been at the helm of the program for many years by this point. Maybe we need to look at a guy like Tonagel who has a history of winning albeit at a lower level and see if he can bring that winning to this level. Maybe it's not so much the competition he faces and he's actually a good coach. Maybe it will translate. Might as well give it a try. At this point I'm open to anything and honestly hiring Tonagel made just as much sense at the time as hiring Lottich did if not more. Let's at least give the guy an interview for Pete's sake (which if I remember correctly we didn't last time).
I agree on this. Remember, we hired a guy named Homer Drew whose previous coaching spot was at Indiana-South Bend (NAIA) and Bethel University (D3). As I recall, Homer did a fair job at Valpo. ::)
Yes, but his record the first four years would have gotten him fired today. Of course, expectations were a tad different in 1992.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Quote from: covufan on November 19, 2021, 12:49:33 PMQuote from: vu72 on November 19, 2021, 08:41:10 AMQuote from: VUGrad1314 on November 19, 2021, 01:57:50 AMI know NAIA and D2 aren't remotely the same thing but we need to consider this as we evaluate the state of the program and the head coaching position: Indiana State lost a bunch of players to transfer and then lost its best player to injury after hiring a D2 coach and has now started the year 3-1 with victories over Green Bay and Old Dominion (Not great shakes as programs but not slouches either). The point is this: Indiana State has all the same excuses Lottich can use and is still doing much better than Lottich is despite Lottich having the advantage of having been at the helm of the program for many years by this point. Maybe we need to look at a guy like Tonagel who has a history of winning albeit at a lower level and see if he can bring that winning to this level. Maybe it's not so much the competition he faces and he's actually a good coach. Maybe it will translate. Might as well give it a try. At this point I'm open to anything and honestly hiring Tonagel made just as much sense at the time as hiring Lottich did if not more. Let's at least give the guy an interview for Pete's sake (which if I remember correctly we didn't last time).
I agree on this. Remember, we hired a guy named Homer Drew whose previous coaching spot was at Indiana-South Bend (NAIA) and Bethel University (D3). As I recall, Homer did a fair job at Valpo. ::)
Yes, but his record the first four years would have gotten him fired today. Of course, expectations were a tad different in 1992. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Yeah we've gone from a school just trying to survive as a D1 program to a school that is supposed to be a mid major power. That's a big difference. I fear if we want to hold on to that hope of realizing that potential one day we are running out of time to be patient and may need to make a move soon.
Has Tonagel ever been considered a candidate for a D1 school?
I didn't know that VU was considered a mid-major power.
Quote from: VU75 on November 19, 2021, 05:13:42 PM
Has Tonagel ever been considered a candidate for a D1 school?
I actually think the question is, has Greg Tonagel ever wanted to be considered a candidate for a D1 program? I don't believe that he has, but if there is someone on this board who knows Greg personally then maybe they could end the speculation on this board that VU has slighted Greg by not offering him the opportunity to interview.
Quote from: FWalum on November 20, 2021, 04:08:34 PM
Quote from: VU75 on November 19, 2021, 05:13:42 PM
Has Tonagel ever been considered a candidate for a D1 school?
I actually think the question is, has Greg Tonagel ever wanted to be considered a candidate for a D1 program? I don't believe that he has, but if there is someone on this board who knows Greg personally then maybe they could end the speculation on this board that VU has slighted Greg by not offering him the opportunity to interview.
I have heard from a source very close to Greg that VU is the only job he really wants, other than where he is.
1314 - not sure I agree with your assessment. Drew's team were gradually improving before Bryce Drew. also, back then they were not committed at all - in fact this was a school that gave Tom Smith tenure.
Quote from: Valpo89 on November 20, 2021, 05:59:30 PM
Quote from: FWalum on November 20, 2021, 04:08:34 PM
Quote from: VU75 on November 19, 2021, 05:13:42 PM
Has Tonagel ever been considered a candidate for a D1 school?
I actually think the question is, has Greg Tonagel ever wanted to be considered a candidate for a D1 program? I don't believe that he has, but if there is someone on this board who knows Greg personally then maybe they could end the speculation on this board that VU has slighted Greg by not offering him the opportunity to interview.
I have heard from a source very close to Greg that VU is the only job he really wants, other than where he is.
He knows how to coach. He's gotta be better than what we have now. Give him a shot if this is his dream job.
Having taken classes with Greg, I can vouch that the guy is extremely smart. I was surprised that he was a basketball player, to be honest, as he was always top of the class in Chemistry, Biology, etc. Very similar to Antti Nikkila. Not what you would expect from D-1 basketball players.
QuoteHe knows how to coach. He's gotta be better than what we have now. Give him a shot if this is his dream job.
I agree with this. He has a proven record of success. Will it translate to Division I? The hoop is still 10 feet, so I think it's worth a shot.
There's a lot of mediocre basketball programs. We need to think outside the box
Hey 89, can you teach me how to like someone's post more than one time? You liked mj's post above 4 times. :cheers:
Bo Ryan... UW Platville, UW Milwaukee, UW. Success at all levels.
This guy has a nice resume too.
2019-Present – Ohio State Assistant Coach
2017-2019 – (3 years) Vanderbilt Assistant Coach
2014-2016 (3 years)– Ohio State Video Coordinator
2012-2013 (2 years) – Valparaiso – Assistant Coach
2011 (1 year) – Valparaiso – Director of Operations
It would be good if we could get Ryan or Alec involved in the program when they finish their playing career.
Alec may be a possibility but not Ryan since he has a few ponds to cross...
Quote from: Chairback on November 21, 2021, 04:33:52 PM
It would be good if we could get Ryan or Alec involved in the program when they finish their playing career.
I remember posting the same sentiment about Ryan a few years ago, and Koala either liked the post or said something affirmative (can't recall which). He was playing in Europe at the time. Also, isn't his wife American?
Quote from: wh on November 21, 2021, 06:13:53 PM
Quote from: Chairback on November 21, 2021, 04:33:52 PM
It would be good if we could get Ryan or Alec involved in the program when they finish their playing career.
I remember posting the same sentiment about Ryan a few years ago, and Koala either liked the post or said something affirmative (can't recall which). He was playing in Europe at the time. Also, isn't his wife American?
Yes, and a Valpo grad.
Indiana Wesleyan ranked #11 in the country.
Be careful hiring within the Valpo "family". We need a fresh start. Then again, he may be a cheap hire.
Tonagel is one of the winniest D2 coaches in the last decade or longer. Indiana State is doing quite well with former D2 coach. Tonagel's coaching philosophy is in line with Drew's. And I don't know, Bryce and Scott seem to be doing quite well.
Quote from: tjjvalpo on January 10, 2023, 10:20:36 PM
Tonagel is one of the winniest D2 coaches in the last decade or longer. Indiana State is doing quite well with former D2 coach. Tonagel's coaching philosophy is in line with Drew's. And I don't know, Bryce and Scott seem to be doing quite well.
Just to be clear. IWU is not NCAA D-II. IWU is NAIA. But I agree with your followup, TJJ.
Both D-II and NAIA designations involve recruiting full ride scholarship players. So the mechanics are the same. The difference, of course, is degree. But be mindful, Greg was an NCAA D-I starter as a player and a D-I coach. He knows the D-I landscape.
But creating a legendary coaching career at a NAIA multiple national champion doesn't suddenly lessen Greg' coaching skills nor his grasp of the game. It's still 5 athletes v. 5 athletes, a ball and two baskets. His record is impeccable. Especially coming out of Valpo (he was on the the VU coaching staff as merely the DBO) and turning a consistently losing IWU program around in just his first year.
All I'm saying is be careful hiring within the family. Also, a big part is recruiting and dealing with NIL and transfers.
Quote from: usc4valpo on January 11, 2023, 05:50:02 AM
All I'm saying is be careful hiring within the family. Also, a big part is recruiting and dealing with NIL and transfers.
I hear ya, SC :)
And all I am saying is you don't close your eyes just because a candidate happens to have a Valpo degree. A person at least deserves to be high on a candidate short list with the following qualifications regardless of level of collegiate coaching and alma mater:
HEAD coaching experience (to date) - 18 seasons
Winning seasons - 17; Losing seasons - 0
Overall coaching record to date - 491- 120
Winning percentage to date - 80.3%
National Championships - 3
#1 Final National Polls - 4
Conference championships - 12
All Americans - 24
About the 22-23 campaign: 13-4 record to date. Have beaten the #4, #5, #22 and #25 ranked teams in NAIA. Tonagel projects to surpass 500 career wins this season at the ripe old age of 45 (I believe). IWU just announced landing a Liberty University (FCS) transfer with 3 years of eligibility. Currently ranked #7 in the country.
I can't emphasize enough the value of successful head coaching experience. Then add youthful enthusiasm if you are lucky. Not gonna find many of those kind of guys walking around. We learned very quickly that we can't have a new HC learn on-the-job what it's like to be a HC. Unless an assistant has had a diverse and rising career associated with winning programs at the D-I level (yes, here D-I is crucial), we also need to beware.
Could Greg's current NAIA team beat Matt's current MVC Division I team?
Quote from: tiny707 on January 11, 2023, 11:12:55 AM
Could Greg's current NAIA team beat Matt's current MVC Division I team?
I would love to match them up with the winner getting to finish the season with their team of choice. Unfortunately Greg might win and still leave us with Matt in charge!
I understand the concerns about Greg Tonagel being within the family, but look at this from a different perspective - should he be considered if he were not part of the Valpo family? Given his success and ability to build a strong and sustainable system, I would say that he should be considered.
I met Greg Tonagel once when he was on Valpo's staff (chef introduced me). It was a long time ago, but it was a very interesting and insightful discussion. Greg was very candid about how some Valpo players (one specifically) were unable to reach their potential because they lacked effort. My guess is that this candidness and direct approach to addressing issues is part of his DNA and makes him a darn good coach - and that this could foster the change needed at Valpo.
However, I see two possible things that could prevent him for getting the coaching job at Valpo (as I tread towards the third rail)
1. Valpo may place a high priority on hiring a minority as coach. I am all for hiring the right coach, regardless of race or ethnicity, but a lot of recent hires (AD, VP of Admissions) are from racial/ethnic minority groups. Couple this with Valpo's stated strategic goal of being certified as a Hispanic Serving Institution - which requires that 25% of the student body be Hispanic. While diversity is very important, it is unclear how Valpo is weighing diversity and the demonstrated ability to meet job requirements in hiring decisions.
2. Evangelism. From what I have seen in prior posts over the last few years, Greg believes strongly that he should vigorously evangelize about his faith in all aspects of his life - including as a coach. He would need to find a compromise approach at Valpo - if that is possible - that respects people of all faiths (or no faith). The Drews were (and are) certainly very strong in their faith - but I also believe they found a compromise that was highly professional - so that model would seem to work well. Indeed, I know that some of Valpo's best players did not share the Drew's religious beliefs and, to my knowledge, there was never an issue.
Quote from: tiny707 on January 11, 2023, 11:12:55 AM
Could Greg's current NAIA team beat Matt's current MVC Division I team?
No idea. But could Cedarville almost beat Valpo?
Some things to think about. Here's the IWU top players
MAXWELL, 7'0 Center (Grad) - 15.9 p/p/g, 27.1 min/g, 100 RB, 30 ASST
BUCHANAN, 6'7" FWD (Fr) - 13.5 p/p/g, 24.7 min/g, 68 RB, 10 ASST
KLIEWER, 6'3" G (Soph) - 12.3 p/p/g, 31.1 min/g, 83 RB, 39 ASST
PIERCEFIELD, 6'0" G (Sr) - 11.7 p/p/g, 31.2 min/g, 40 RB, 58 ASST
SMITH, 6'0"" G (Sr) - 11.3 p/p/g, 31.1 min/g, 91 RB, 57 ASST
See anything interesting? How about........ All five score in double figures. Playing time pretty spread out. Two of top three rebounders are guards. All five have double digit assist totals.
TEAM:
Scoring - 81.1 ppg v. 67.3
Total FG% - 49.3%
3Pt % - 38.9%
FT% - 73.9%
Assts - 16.1 pg
Asst/TO ratio - 1.3
How might all that translate to a competitive game against the current Valpo crew? To my very untrained eye, I see unselfish, coordinated play. I figure there must be a system in place to get players open for good shots. And they make their shots and FTs.
vu84v2 - I am starting to buy into Tonagel - but, in the today's Valpo wokeness, Tonagel may not want to coach there because of his beliefs.
SC, you're right, that's the big question. Not because of the obvious competitive challenge, but the environment he'd be entering.
While I have concerns about wokeness, I do not believe this is a wokeness issue since it would be no different 5, 10 or 20 years ago. Any person is fully entitled to pursue their religious beliefs, and if that includes evangelizing and trying to convert others on their personal time - fine. But in a professional workplace setting you need to respect that others in your workplace have different beliefs and that they are equally entitled to their beliefs. At Valpo, this applies to fellow workers, students, players, etc. Additionally, in a professional workplace you need to recognize your role in representing the organization and that you do not get to state that your faith is somehow the organization's faith.
vu84v2 - totally agree. I'm still mad and embarrassed by those stupid dog mascots.
The more I think about it, the more I'd like Valpo to take a good look at Tonagel. I think having a system and a coaching identity is important, which is what Tonagel would bring to the table.
Give him a 3 year deal and see what happens. Our program is at rock bottom so we can afford to take a risk.
Guys, I'm just gonna say, if you think VU has somehow lapsed into a state of wokeness because of decisions like the mascot and a few other things that point the diversity meter in that direction, then I will gently but firmly assert that you ain't seen wokeness. I'm not questioning your right to disagree with these decisions and leanings, but I am suggesting that placed on a spectrum against the backdrop of higher ed generally, VU's center of gravity remains solidly traditional.
As I've noted elsewhere on this board, this presents both opportunity and challenge for Valpo. It is neither woke nor evangelical, but rather operates within more of a mainstream that sadly can get drowned out and overlooked amidst the extremes. But it's in that balance that VU offers something worthwhile for students who seek a blend of familiar comfort and healthy discomfort.
So how does this relate to a potential Coach Tonagel hire at VU? Others have said it: He may well have to be willing to adjust, in terms of how he practices his faith and values on an everyday basis. I may be making unwarranted assumptions, but it appears that his present school is a great fit for his worldview, to the point where it may be a bit of a bubble. There's nothing wrong with that. I know other folks with very woke views who struggle being outside of their bubbles. If one cannot engage a wider community without significant discomfort, then maybe it's best to stay in a bubble.
On the coaching merits, I agree with VULB#62 and others that Tonagel is an intriguing candidate. This guy knows how to build and coach a winning basketball team. How that translates into a move from NAIA to mid-major D1 we don't know, which is why I'd call this a higher risk/higher reward hire were it to come to fruition. And while some might tag it an inside the family hire, I think it would be a much bolder choice than selecting a more standard-brand pick, such as an assistant coach at a major program who appears ready for his first head coaching job.
I think an interview at a minimum should be in the works. I still think the mascots suck.
Quote from: David81 on January 12, 2023, 11:13:15 AM
Guys, I'm just gonna say, if you think VU has somehow lapsed into a state of wokeness because of decisions like the mascot and a few other things that point the diversity meter in that direction, then I will gently but firmly assert that you ain't seen wokeness. I'm not questioning your right to disagree with these decisions and leanings, but I am suggesting that placed on a spectrum against the backdrop of higher ed generally, VU's center of gravity remains solidly traditional.
As I've noted elsewhere on this board, this presents both opportunity and challenge for Valpo. It is neither woke nor evangelical, but rather operates within more of a mainstream that sadly can get drowned out and overlooked amidst the extremes. But it's in that balance that VU offers something worthwhile for students who seek a blend of familiar comfort and healthy discomfort.
So how does this relate to a potential Coach Tonagel hire at VU? Others have said it: He may well have to be willing to adjust, in terms of how he practices his faith and values on an everyday basis. I may be making unwarranted assumptions, but it appears that his present school is a great fit for his worldview, to the point where it may be a bit of a bubble. There's nothing wrong with that. I know other folks with very woke views who struggle being outside of their bubbles. If one cannot engage a wider community without significant discomfort, then maybe it's best to stay in a bubble.
On the coaching merits, I agree with VULB#62 and others that Tonagel is an intriguing candidate. This guy knows how to build and coach a winning basketball team. How that translates into a move from NAIA to mid-major D1 we don't know, which is why I'd call this a higher risk/higher reward hire were it to come to fruition. And while some might tag it an inside the family hire, I think it would be a much bolder choice than selecting a more standard-brand pick, such as an assistant coach at a major program who appears ready for his first head coaching job.
The extremes of the past have morphed into the mainstream of the present. Kinda like the frog sitting in a pot of cold water while the heat is slowly rising and the frog is unaware of his impending doom.
What concerns me about Greg is that it's been 7 years since the job opened up and yet he's chosen to stay exactly where he is while the demands of a DI job have gotten infinitely more complicated with the explosion of the portal and NIL.
Quote from: usc4valpo on January 12, 2023, 12:02:54 PM
I think an interview at a minimum should be in the works. I still think the mascots suck.
if this guy tonagel was so good why hasn't he been picked up by another d1 team?
Obviously he isnt d1 level
Some think only Valpo guys can/ coach...so short sighted
Some people are comfortable with their lot in life. Hard to be unhappy with winning every year in addition to the titles. Probably has total control and a supportive admin. Plenty of examples of coaches that had success at lower levels and worked way up to continue success. Bo Ryan, Bruce Pearl etc..
Quote from: beacons23 on January 12, 2023, 09:04:07 PM
Quote from: usc4valpo on January 12, 2023, 12:02:54 PM
I think an interview at a minimum should be in the works. I still think the mascots suck.
if this guy tonagel was so good why hasn't he been picked up by another d1 team?
Obviously he isnt d1 level
Some think only Valpo guys can/ coach...so short sighted
Well, how many times do D1 teams pick their new head coaches from NAIA?
I'll defer to hoops followers much more knowledgeable than me to determine whether Tonagel is a viable D1 coaching candidate.
But at this point I'd automatically dismiss no one who has shown the ability to win at the collegiate level. While an NAIA coach would be a reach, the guy who brought VU into its modern era of D! basketball had a similar background. Maybe lightning doesn't strike twice, but I agree with those who say that someone like Tonagel at least merits an initial interview.
I seem to remember that when ML was hired, Tonagel said he would only be interested in the Valpo head coach job on the D-1 level. I seem to also remember that he was "snubbed" as far as interviewing was concerned, in fact, maybe he was not even interviewed. Perhaps someone remembers more details surrounding Matt's hiring as H C.
Paul Oren's recent article on coaches firing, etc. was one of great insight, sensitivity, and a mature look at the hiring and firing of coaches. Some of the posters on this blog could use some of Paul's classy approach to the head coaching position assessment and personal comments pertaining to Matt Lottich.
Great article, Paul.
64 - I get where you are coming from, and we disagree at times, but this program is a complete mess and change is ALWAYS difficult. A dismissal is never smooth or a Hallmark moment, whether it is in sport or business. We are also talking about employees in volatile positions making great income.
Quote from: usc4valpo on January 12, 2023, 12:02:54 PM
I think an interview at a minimum should be in the works. I still think the mascots suck.
He's absolutely worth interviewing. He's very well-regarded throughout the state of Indiana's high school ranks, too, and that's certainly an area where Valparaiso could do a better job. His success at Indiana Wesleyan has been impressive. He's recruited incredibly well, both with high school and transfer players. How does that translate to the MVC? I have no idea. It's a much higher level of basketball, and it's not as free flowing of a pace as the Crossroads League is, but he's worth a conversation.
Quote from: usc4valpo on January 13, 2023, 10:11:37 AM
64 - I get where you are coming from, and we disagree at times, but this program is a complete mess and change is ALWAYS difficult. A dismissal is never smooth or a Hallmark moment, whether it is in sport or business. We are also talking about employees in volatile positions making great income.
Yes, it sucks to lose your job. But when you are someone who has made a substantial income the last few years ... you would think he has saved a lot. He and his family will be fine, and he will bounce back somewhere else.
As for Tonagel, I have heard that he has used "Dream Job" to describe his interest in becoming Valparaiso head coach. He isn't the type to just jump from job to job. He has a lot of kids, and while they have roots in Marion, Valpo would be his ideal destination job. His brother and family live in Valpo, so that would be another positive.
To add to 89's comment below, and this may be quite a stretch. But another factor in Greg's faith is that of witnessing. Could it be, that in his mind and accounting for his lack of ladder climbing, is that Valpo is one of only a very few places (IWU being another) where he could be comfortable practicing his beliefs and witnessing the way he wants? And what better way for him to witness than turning around this moribund program the same way he did IWU?
AFTERTHOUGHT ADDENDUM
I'm not talking proselytizing or revivals at center court. Just a guy with known devout beliefs who, by his actions, performance and results, displays to the world that he is also a very good coach, one who will represent the university in the best of lights.
Now, the Valpo he graduated from years ago is a different Valpo today. Even if offered a crack at the challenge, he might realize it's not what he expected and say no thanks. Valpo may call him in and during the interview process realize that there isn't a fit.
But the only way either party will find out is when they talk.
usc I agree the program is a mess and that something has to change. My remark is directed at those who take the "low" road in comments concerning Coach Lottich. I believe it is called "respect" for others. Again, Paul's comments were right on the money.
64 - total respect to you.
Latest Numbers
15 - overall wins
4 - overall losses
9 - conference wins
0 - conference losses
7 - current national rank
Would Tonegal have to take a pay cut from IWU? I'm serious here.
If Tonegal is a candidate, we'll this guy is far better.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_McCollum
Quote from: usc4valpo on January 15, 2023, 10:57:02 AM
Would Tonegal have to take a pay cut from IWU? I'm serious here.
Don't know for sure. Very little info out there on coaching salaries at IWU. I did see one article a week or so ago, but couldn't get back to it today, that mentioned coaching salaries in the mid $60s, but that seems too low for the HBB coach. My guess is that $350K (About what Matt makes now) would be a bump up. How big a bump? IDK.
Ben McCollum would be a great choice
Quote from: usc4valpo on January 15, 2023, 10:59:30 AM
If Tonegal is a candidate, we'll this guy is far better.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_McCollum
Both great possible candidates. Both have coached at only one school. Both come with the same critique about them: "Well, if he is so good why isn't he at a D-I program?"
Is McCollum FAR better? Here's the tale of the tape. You be the judge.
McCollum TonagelYears as HC 14 17
Record 344-84 478-118
Win %. 80.5%. 79.5%
Losing seasons 2 0
Conference titles 10 12
National titles 4 3
McCullum is a far better coach. His team right now would destroy Valpo. And for once we hire outside of the family, which hasn't been done in awhile
Quote from: usc4valpo on January 15, 2023, 01:27:06 PM
McCullum is a far better coach. His team right now would destroy Valpo.
Can't argue with those facts.
Valpo could do a lot worse than having a subset of members from this forum serve on a search committee for a new coach.
Quote from: vu84v2 on January 15, 2023, 03:43:43 PM
Valpo could do a lot worse than having a subset of members from this forum serve on a search committee for a new coach.
Actually, I can picture several loyal and knowledgeable VU alums on this board adding value to such a committee, beginning with '72 and '62 and many others.
I would willing to contribute as long as we have 6 packs of Lagunitas to brainstorm.
If Tonagel became the new Valparaiso University MBB Head Coach, I'd renew my season tickets immediately.
In reference to my earlier posting in this thread, Tonagel's name was mentioned when Lottich was hired. Perhaps Paul Oren recalls the details regarding his situation and could enlighten us on the circumstances that were mentioned in the process. My recollection is that Tonagel said he would only take the Head Coaching position at Valpo with respect to any D-1 job. Am I close, Paul?
NAIA Div 2 to D1 is tougher than NCAA Div. 2 to D1. I go with McCullum at NW Mo. St. and get a fresh perspective.
If and when Valpo enters into a national search, we all might be very surprised by not only the number of interested candidates, but also the conferences represented by said candidates. Witness the candidate pool for Coach Foxes job. Mark said that he had people from Big 5 conferences and a hundred applications. I think some of you have lost perspective on Valpo's national reputation. Yes, the facilities aren't the very good (and I'm certainly all for a new arena) but players play, they aren't enjoying the private boxes or the extra bathrooms. If facilities won championships, Nebraska would be a perennial power. Take a look and tell me there are better ones out there.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wtyAsWFF0Fw
Quote from: vu72 on January 16, 2023, 04:50:26 PM
Take a look and tell me there are better ones out there.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wtyAsWFF0Fw
If you check out the two kids conducting the tour it's obvious what they forgot. Despite each having overdeveloped thumbs from gaming and loading music onto all the electronics, including the smart TV in the toilet, they have scrawny muscle mass. Where was the dedicated basketball weight room with pearl handled dumbbells and bars? 🤪
Two words for all of that, Russ. OSTENTATIOUSLY OBSCENE.
Ya know what's more obscene?
Their record the last three years — 24 wins and 67 losses (9-50 B1G). Six, only six (6) winning seasons since 2000.
Didja make your point? Here's one affirmative vote 😁
Quote from: vu84v2 on January 15, 2023, 03:43:43 PM
Valpo could do a lot worse than having a subset of members from this forum serve on a search committee for a new coach.
I had to chuckle at this until I realized you might be serious. People are catching grief for our mascots, just wait until they find out message board people are helping with coach selection!
Given how the mascot selection, change from crusader to beacons, and keeping Lottich long past time has all gone, I'd be willing to bet this message board could collectively make better decisions
Call Greg please..
Lands IU transfer....
Quote from: valpolaw on January 17, 2023, 06:52:41 PM
Given how the mascot selection, change from crusader to beacons, and keeping Lottich long past time has all gone, I'd be willing to bet this message board could collectively make better decisions
I know, the alumni were so pissed off about the name change and mascot that they only gave a record amount of money on Day of Giving! ;)
Quote from: tiny707 on April 23, 2023, 03:46:41 PM
Lands IU transfer....
Sounds great, in reality it is a COVID senior walk on who played a total of 30 minutes in 4 years. Doesn't mean he can't contribute.