Figured this deserves its own thread...and if there were a previous one it would be under the previous administration.Congrats to Coach Dorow for officially inking her very own VU recruit!http://www.valpoathletics.com/wbasketball/news/2012-13/12435/womens-hoops-inks-isaac-to-national-letter-of-intent/ (http://www.valpoathletics.com/wbasketball/news/2012-13/12435/womens-hoops-inks-isaac-to-national-letter-of-intent/)
(http://heraldnews.suntimes.com/csp/cms/sites/dt.common.streams.StreamServer.cls?STREAMOID=AYGipqbbQFClwqs5IvwtMM$daE2N3K4ZzOUsqbU5sYukWeZ5$Nse8EBKYGoNEm7FWCsjLu883Ygn4B49Lvm9bPe2QeMKQdVeZmXF$9l$4uCZ8QDXhaHEp3rvzXRJFdy0KqPHLoMevcTLo3h8xh70Y6N_U_CryOsw6FTOdKL_jpQ-&CONTENTTYPE=image/jpeg)
Aliyah IsaacSTATUS: signed NLI (early period)
HEIGHT: 5'9"
POSITION: off guard
FROM: Richton Park, IL
ATTENDS: Marian Catholic
AAU: the Illinois XCitement (no wonder our kids text the way they do)
COACH DOROW SAYS: "Aliyah is a lock-down defender and with Laura (Richards) graduating, we will be losing our most physical perimeter defender. Aliyah will not back down from her opponent. She will put pressure on people and keep them in front of her. Aliyah also handles the ball well, and she should be a perfect fit in our offensive system."
VIDEO: from HS Cube http://www.highschoolcube.com/students/aliyah-isaac (http://www.highschoolcube.com/students/aliyah-isaac)
MARIAN CATHOLIC: Practically in the Region, MCHS has produced a number of D1 basketball players--lately, they've been mostly women. (For instance, MCHS '09 Kaila Turner of #2 Notre Dame!) Teammates Megan Walsh (Truman State) and Melanie Ransom (Davidson) have also signed, and there are more in this pipeline: the team was ranked #1 preseason by the Southtown Star (in fact the team stars are actually underclass guards Teniya Page and Ashton Millender. ESCC Coach of the Year Annie Byrne has said ""It's probably easier to say which [B1G] teams
aren't looking at Teniya"!).
http://www.marianchs.com/athletics/womens-basketball/images/wbkb.jpg (http://www.marianchs.com/athletics/womens-basketball/images/wbkb.jpg)
(http://www.eastsuburbancc.com/images/MarianNLI11-14.jpg)
Earlier this year the team put up 101 against Kenosha (WI) Tremper, led in that game by Isaac with 11.
http://seasonpass.suntimes.com/news_article/show/201984?referrer_id=681664 (http://seasonpass.suntimes.com/news_article/show/201984?referrer_id=681664)
They were 4A Regional Champs (IL's largest classification), and more impressively, champions of the ESCC (East Suburban Catholic Conference) which produced one other 4A regional champ and 3 3A regional champs (one of whom was 2-7 in conference)! Thursday night, MCHS won the sectional over conference rival Marist on a half-court (more like a step-back-NBA-three-distance, but who am I to spoil a great story) at the buzzer by Millender:
http://seasonpass.suntimes.com/news_article/show/230409?referrer_id=650026 (http://seasonpass.suntimes.com/news_article/show/230409?referrer_id=650026)
Video is worth a watch. Ransom is set to inbound, but switches out for Walsh at last second. How often do you see that?
http://www.highschoolcube.com/highlight/oh-my-marian-catholic-s-aston--55053 (http://www.highschoolcube.com/highlight/oh-my-marian-catholic-s-aston--55053)
This is why people love sports. "Oh my" is right!
Video from other side of court with cool replays: http://www.marianchs.com/athletics/womens-basketball/womens-basketball.php (http://www.marianchs.com/athletics/womens-basketball/womens-basketball.php)
(http://cdn1.ngin.com/attachments/photo/2242/7808/GBKmomac-STS-022213-01_medium.jpg)
(Aliyah is #23) At 30-1, they advance to Monday's Illinois Wesleyan Supersectional vs. Peoria Richwoods.
Unfortunately Isaac did not merit all-conference selection. The ESCC credits her with 40 points, but surely that is merely the 9-game conference season. She did not make a 3-pointer. Isaac, however, keys the defense for a school that gave up 38 points a game over a grueling conference slate (while averaging 65 themselves).
http://www.eastsuburbancc.com/html/documents/wbkbscoring_001.pdf (http://www.eastsuburbancc.com/html/documents/wbkbscoring_001.pdf)
(http://bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com/nwitimes.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/0/6c/06cc329e-08b2-555c-b26e-ffc75a498171/50a31c753484b.preview-620.jpg)
SCOUTING: MWRR, from the Montini Fall League wrap-up, 2011 (prior to her junior season):
QuoteExtremely athletic small forward is a high intensity player with an explosive first step allowing her to get easy shots in the lane. Displayed great fundamentals on the defensive end, with the lateral quickness to stifle opposing guards and the strength to body up with post players. Should work on releasing her shot at the peak of her jump and finishing through contact in the lane.
http://www.midwestrecruitingreport.com/news/article/54/Montini-Fall-League-Top-Prospect-1023.php (http://www.midwestrecruitingreport.com/news/article/54/Montini-Fall-League-Top-Prospect-1023.php)
She was named one of 7 top performers on the day (MCHS the only school with 2).
UPSHOT: This is a good pickup--playing where she does, she's not underscouted, and she's proven herself against tough competition for several years. While she may never be an outside threat, or even a scoring force, she will be one of those girls who does whatever is needed on the floor without concern for glamour. Offense wins beauty contests--defense wins championships. Let's hope she can challenge for a rotation spot by her sophomore year and maybe even start as an upperclasswoman? (
feel free to shock us with earlier arrival dates, btw)
I do look forward to Coach Dorow's recruits. Hopefully she gets some height in the incoming class!
Aliyah Isaac and Marian Catholic advance to the IHSA Final Four this weekend after a big win over Peoria Richwoods.
http://www.marianchs.com/athletics/womens-basketball/womens-basketball.php (http://www.marianchs.com/athletics/womens-basketball/womens-basketball.php)
Not clear that she started; she scored 2 points. They play perennial power Whitney Young Friday.
This will be an interesting recruit. Based on what was provided she averaged about 4.4 points per game in her conference season so point production is not what she is bringing. We have 5 (now 4 open spots) so some defense is always welcomed.
Coach did mention her defensive attributes in her comments in that article, not really anything on offense, so it makes sense
We need bigs, period. If we aren't careful, we are going to end up with a team of guards in 2 years.
No worries. As I understand it, all the rest of the players being recruited are in fact post players.
I hope that's not fiction, and that it's ex-Post fact. OH!
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on February 28, 2013, 02:21:06 PM
I hope that's not fiction, and that it's ex-Post fact. OH!
First of all, LOL! This was very well done, my friend. You and I have a VERY similar personality, sense of humor and intellect. Anyways, kudos to you.
Second, thank you for a fantastic overview of Aliyah. She's a great kid and what has been written here is basically on the money. Expect her to be the Eric Buggs of the women's team. Coach is very excited about her and from what I've heard from some friends is that she is just starting to come into her own as a D1 level talent. The word is, if her jumper continues to come along, we are getting a possible high major player here.
Well done Coach D!
Quote from: mgovalpo on February 28, 2013, 02:06:37 PM
No worries. As I understand it, all the rest of the players being recruited are in fact post players.
Very true. Hopefully there's news on this front soon...
Nice article on the MCHS girls team headed to state.
http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/high-school/illinois/marian-girls-headed-to-state/article_cdb69995-e1b7-5387-a92d-1834a0ba799b.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/high-school/illinois/marian-girls-headed-to-state/article_cdb69995-e1b7-5387-a92d-1834a0ba799b.html)
Interesting fact to come out of story (ignore the worst typo-ridden sentence I've seen in a while):
QuoteThey're [SIC(k)] journey to the tourney didn't being [SIC seriously?] in October, but last spring when the players made a decision. Instead of playing for several AAU teams, the Spartans stayed together and played for the Illinois Defenders.
#deplorablejournalism #admirableteamwork
Isaac does not currently start, although it seems she did earlier in the season.
http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/high-school/illinois/scouting-the-ihsa-class-a-girls-basketball-state-finals/article_c26a39fa-7ea8-51f1-b4d5-783f1e5a029f.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/high-school/illinois/scouting-the-ihsa-class-a-girls-basketball-state-finals/article_c26a39fa-7ea8-51f1-b4d5-783f1e5a029f.html)
The Marian Catholic (now 32-1) girls hammered Whitney Young tonight...63-39 in the state semi-finals...and the game was nowhere near that close. Isaac had four points, but did an OUTSTANDING job of helping to shut down Linnae Harper who struggled to find her game all night. Isaac and one other player for Marian split time guarding her. Harper is a top-10 recruit in the 2013 class and is headed to Kentucky...she averages 19 points, 9 rebounds and 6 assists.
If you have nothing better to do with your Saturday night, they will be playing 29-3 Rolling Meadows in the state championship game tomorrow night at 8:15. The game is televised on Channel 248 on Comcast Valpo.
Marian Catholic, as I said is 32-1...their only loss is a 61-55 decision to Rolling Meadows on December 28.
If you don't get IHSA TV on your local dial/cable system, the IHSA does show the state championship activities on ihsa.org, or at ihsa.playonsports.com. (Don't mix this up, and put ihsa.com, or you'll get the website for the International Horse Show Association, a running joke of all fans of Illinois high school sports.) You would also be able to watch last night's win over Whitney Young, so you can see how Issac played.
...and Coach Dorow's first recruit is a STATE CHAMPION!
Congrats Aliyah Isaac and the MCHS girls on avenging their only loss of the season with a 48-47 win in the title game against Rolling Meadow!
(http://www.tigerdistrict.com/images/products/large/001-1118/LSU_Tigers_Purple_All_we_Do_is_win_Man.jpg)
Not sure how much this will effect next years Women's team but Coach Dorow has 3 more scholarships that will need to be filled next year. Soph Shaquira Scott, Redshirt Soph Maegan Callaway and Junior Tabitha Gerardot will be leaving the team. Gerardot, who will be graduating in May, plans to work on her Masters at another school that offers Linguistics. She will be hard to replace being on the second team Horizon League and averaging 15 pts & 9 rebounds per game. Scott averaged 8.5 pts per game and just wants a change. Callaway has been injured a great deal of the time and wants to go to a lower level of competition. Dorow seemed to be the most disappointed with Gerardot's leaving. Dorow now has 5 scholarships available besides the one recruit from the fall signing period.
Quote from: RS on March 30, 2013, 01:11:08 PM
Not sure how much this will effect next years Women's team but Coach Dorow has 3 more scholarships that will need to be filled next year. Soph Shaquira Scott, Redshirt Soph Maegan Callaway and Junior Tabitha Gerardot will be leaving the team. Gerardot, who will be graduating in May, plans to work on her Masters at another school that offers Linguistics. She will be hard to replace being on the second team Horizon League and averaging 15 pts & 9 rebounds per game. Scott averaged 8.5 pts per game and just wants a change. Callaway has been injured a great deal of the time and wants to go to a lower level of competition. Dorow seemed to be the most disappointed with Gerardot's leaving. Dorow now has 5 scholarships available besides the one recruit from the fall signing period.
All I can say is WOW! I assume that Tabitha will be able to play right way where ever she goes using the graduate school loophole.
Quote from: RS on March 30, 2013, 01:11:08 PMDorow seemed to be the most disappointed with Gerardot's leaving.
um...yeah, yeah, I'd believe that.
she's not the only one.
ouch.
That absolutely sucks for the women's program, but if Tabitha is only moving because of school, it is much better than what Wood did on the men's side for more winning/exposure. I don't see Scott and Callaway as being big losses
Quote from: RS on March 30, 2013, 01:11:08 PMNot sure how much this will effect next years Women's team but Coach Dorow has 3 more scholarships that will need to be filled next year. Soph Shaquira Scott, Redshirt Soph Maegan Callaway and Junior Tabitha Gerardot will be leaving the team. Gerardot, who will be graduating in May, plans to work on her Masters at another school that offers Linguistics. She will be hard to replace being on the second team Horizon League and averaging 15 pts & 9 rebounds per game. Scott averaged 8.5 pts per game and just wants a change. Callaway has been injured a great deal of the time and wants to go to a lower level of competition. Dorow seemed to be the most disappointed with Gerardot's leaving. Dorow now has 5 scholarships available besides the one recruit from the fall signing period.
Losing a 15/9 contributor on a team that doesn't score well and has no size is devastating. Rumor had Scott leaving so that is not a surprise but hurts. Callaway was going to play minutes next year (if healthy) simply due to lack of size. We now have one C/PF left on the roster and Horton seems more comfortable on the wing. The basically complete strike out in the early signing period (I don't consider Issacs early) just became even more crippling.
I think we now have 7 scholarships available. Doesn't women's BB get 15?
Quote from: IndyValpo on March 30, 2013, 09:30:46 PMDoesn't women's BB get 15?
yes. and i'm probably violating title ix by not making them a scholarship spreadsheet.
http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/gerardot-among-three-players-leaving-vu-women-s-basketball-team/article_bbd6ddff-12f8-502c-a2b7-71a7394cdaab.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/gerardot-among-three-players-leaving-vu-women-s-basketball-team/article_bbd6ddff-12f8-502c-a2b7-71a7394cdaab.html)
The Gerardot thing's been coming for a while. Just a by-product of year around schooling. These players are getting their schooling done prior to senior year, and if Valpo doesn't offer the after grad work they want to get in, they have no choice but to leave. She will have another year to play no matter where she goes. She's, by far, the biggest loss of what has transpired. I believe Scott was contemplating the move after her Freshman season, even after the injury, but stuck it out another season. She didn't develop the way I thought she would. Unless she moves down, she'll be sitting again. Callaway really never panned out at this level, and could onld go short burst at best. I don't think going to play at a lower level will be the answer for her. No matter the level, you still have to get up and down the floor and contribute minutes. I wish all of the players weel that are departing. i heard we have a big coming our way. Stay tuned.
I would think that the women's teams would be much more open to the graduate degree loophole. It seems that young women in general are much more dedicated to academics and would have more of a proclivity to graduate early. Or maybe young women just aren't that concerned about playing that last year if they get their degree early. Is it possible to pick up a couple of Bogan/Boggs type players? Are there other players out there doing what Geradot is doing?
I'm sure there are other players out there that we can pick up, with some diligent work on the recruiting work. You are right though, it's always been said that, men go to college to play basketball, and women play basketball to go to college. I would think that very few women aspire to play beyong college compare to the men's side.
The other thing about the women's game, the WNBA is still a league waiting to get their true identity. I think this year, they are getting a lot more regular exposure from ESPN, maybe a Britney Griner effect, but they just haven't had the great exposure needed to lure a real variety of college athletes. Also, the WNBA doesn't have a one year out of high school rule, they basically expect their players to be four-year college athletes first, being more of a leadership-based league than the NBA. I mean look at some of the teams, i.e. the Chicago Sky, that have been around for a bit, but haven't been much more than just something to do on a summer's day?
I suspect another factor is $$$. Unless you're an elite player, there really isn't much money in the ladies game.....yet. Basketball for most women is a springboard to a quality edjucation to allow them to pursue what they really want to do with their life. I still enjoy watching it as much as I do the men's game. The fact that it's still played below the rim (mostly!) keeps it true to the intent when it was developed.
Quote from: ValpoHoops on February 28, 2013, 10:37:29 PMQuote from: mgovalpo on February 28, 2013, 02:06:37 PM
No worries. As I understand it, all the rest of the players being recruited are in fact post players.
Very true. Hopefully there's news on this front soon...
This as of late February and still no additional signings.
Quote from: IndyValpo on April 18, 2013, 01:41:40 PM
Quote from: ValpoHoops on February 28, 2013, 10:37:29 PMQuote from: mgovalpo on February 28, 2013, 02:06:37 PM
No worries. As I understand it, all the rest of the players being recruited are in fact post players.
Very true. Hopefully there's news on this front soon...
This as of late February and still no additional signings.
Late signing period started yesterday. News is on the way.
Yay, a big for the women! To be one of 20 children, wow.
http://valpoathletics.com/wbasketball/news/2012-13/12650/womens-hoops-inks-karungi-to-national-letter-of-intent/ (http://valpoathletics.com/wbasketball/news/2012-13/12650/womens-hoops-inks-karungi-to-national-letter-of-intent/)
She sounds pretty awesome. Yay for Ugandans too.
In other news, our other recruit, Aliyah Isaac has been selected for the McLegends game!
http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/high-school/illinois/times-players-of-the-year-to-be-on-same-team/article_6716e9aa-70f1-58c9-af09-a45131d46a16.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/high-school/illinois/times-players-of-the-year-to-be-on-same-team/article_6716e9aa-70f1-58c9-af09-a45131d46a16.html)
(clickworthy just for the picture juxtaposing the IL and IN Times POYs)
QuoteThe all-star team also features four players from Marian Catholic: Briana Narcissi, Melanie Ransom, Megan Walsh and Aliyah Isaac. Lowell standouts Katie Bobos and Mackenzie Kreutz will also play.
McLegends XI
When: 11 a.m. (girls), 2 p.m. (boys), today
Where: Thornton High School, Harvey
Tickets: $8 (available at the door)
http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/karungi-finds-new-family-at-valparaiso/article_6caf0c82-6e51-554a-bb7f-23a133f41f59.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/karungi-finds-new-family-at-valparaiso/article_6caf0c82-6e51-554a-bb7f-23a133f41f59.html)
This looks like a good signing.....some size, good kid.
A couple of interesting points:
She played at Northern Oklahoma - Tonkawa as opposed to Northern Oklahoma - Enid.
The article says she has 2 years left, maybe 3. Her JC website calls her a Freshman.
The article also says there are 4 open scholarships left, but I think it is six. Hopefully we sign at least 3 more and head into next year with 12 players. We still need C/PF help.
Aliyah Isaac--8 points in the McLegends game! (They got it handed to them though, 100-79...No, I did not write the title to this article)
http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/high-school/boys-basketball/high-school-all-stars-get-a-quarter-pounding-in-mclegends/article_acb77068-6ed0-58ad-ba09-202d04a2cdd3.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/high-school/boys-basketball/high-school-all-stars-get-a-quarter-pounding-in-mclegends/article_acb77068-6ed0-58ad-ba09-202d04a2cdd3.html)
QuoteA McRobbery: Ronald McDonald was in the gym and the red-haired symbol got into the game, too. Marian Catholic's Aliyah Isaac was called for a foul that put Ronnie Mac on the free throw line.
Most agreed it was a phantom whistle.
"I did not foul Ronald McDonald," Isaac said. "I think he owes me some Chicken McNuggets."
Isaac has signed to play at Valparaiso University next school year. The 5-foot-9 guard said she can't wait to get to Crusaderville.
"I loved it as soon as I got there," Isaac said. "It's close to home (45 minutes) and I can come home on
weekends. It will be my first year playing point guard so I have a lot of work to do."
(emphasis added) Interesting...
Why is this staff having so much trouble signing players? C/PF playing time is almost a guarantee but.....
I suspect the team's record, along with a new coachinfg staff and some added uncertainty isn't helping our cause. True, a C/PF could get some floor time right away, but it seems like we always get into the signing game a bit late. I think a ton of effort needs to go into developing our young players this off season or we will be in the same boat as last season, minus our best player. The girl from Uganda can't help us next season I don't believe. With the players we lost, we certainly have some ground to make up. I think it's a must, if we are to compete at the level we plan on, we MUST get some size into our camp. I believe Horton will be our biggest of the active players unless we get some signings. That won't cut it. With as many available scholarships as we have, surely we can get some help from somewhere.
Quote from: jack on April 24, 2013, 09:11:59 AM
I suspect the team's record, along with a new coachinfg staff and some added uncertainty isn't helping our cause. True, a C/PF could get some floor time right away, but it seems like we always get into the signing game a bit late. I think a ton of effort needs to go into developing our young players this off season or we will be in the same boat as last season, minus our best player. The girl from Uganda can't help us next season I don't believe. With the players we lost, we certainly have some ground to make up. I think it's a must, if we are to compete at the level we plan on, we MUST get some size into our camp. I believe Horton will be our biggest of the active players unless we get some signings. That won't cut it. With as many available scholarships as we have, surely we can get some help from somewhere.
I am afraid given our current group of nine players, without Geradot, Lange, Richards and Scott we will have a challenging year to say the least. Our new big will play and probably a lot. You are right Horton is the only C/PF left and truely in a better situation she is a 3.
Given the open spots and a new coaching staff our seeming inability to find players is troubling.
Maybe it isn't an inability to find players, but an inability to sell the program after one year sample sales size? Granted, you would think any girl would want to go to a school where she can play immediately, like 2013-14 Valparaiso University, but when there are too many question marks, some of these girls might not want to be thrown to the wolves so fast, when they aren't even close to being the best option in girls basketball?
Quote from: valporun on April 24, 2013, 09:54:37 AM
Maybe it isn't an inability to find players, but an inability to sell the program after one year sample sales size? Granted, you would think any girl would want to go to a school where she can play immediately, like 2013-14 Valparaiso University, but when there are too many question marks, some of these girls might not want to be thrown to the wolves so fast, when they aren't even close to being the best option in girls basketball?
Right, many players think I'll go there but I really hope to sit for a year or two before I play....happens all the time.
The beauty of selling a new program is you can say basically whatever you want it to be, much easier than say what our football coach has to go through.
Most, if not all, good high school players that are difference makers have already signed -- which leaves the coaching staff to become more creative in their recruiting efforts (transfers, graduate students...). Juco players will be available but that usually brings its own difficulties....academics, transferring classes, etc. Transfers out of our program, whether they are good players or bad, can kill a program because it is so hard to replace them when it is so late. And we have to replace 3! That was why it was of utmost importance to have a solid early recruiting class in the fall so that if there was unforseen issues we would not have so many scholarships to fill at this time. Then you will always be playing catch-up. It is probably a forgone conclusion that the program will be set back (once again) for the next year or 2 but now we just need to hope it doesn't affect the program longer than that.
New coaches have a small window of opportunity to enthusiastically sell recruits on how the program will be better under them and what their vision is. And with each passing recruiting year that message becomes harder to sell especially if the program is not getting better and maybe even worse. It is obvious which Valpo coaches have had success in selling that message and which ones have not. Also IMO, when a coach refers to their 1st recruiting class as "Year 0" - that is just an excuse. Makes me think that they weren't up for the challenge when they took the job.
I'm not really sure I've ever been around players, mens or womens, that enter a college program hoping to sit for a year or two. I suppose that could happen with the big time programs where they really don't have an opportunty to play early on, but I believe for programs the size of Valpo's, these kids are coming in, in hopes of competing for minutes right off the bat.
If I'm a female big, looking to play college ball, I'm looking at the roster, and prospects, not to see what my competition is, but what kind of help I'm going to get on the floor. When you look at our roster, the one thing that stands out is that, we are flooded with guards. I believe with the new signee, that puts us at 7. We basically have guards, and Horton. To a possible recruit, this may be troublesome. I hope they peak some interest in a big or two, who are looking at scholastics first, with hopes of getting some minutes early on.
I also hope them men's program allows their practice squad to work with us again. Not having bigs to go up against in practice would be a problem as well.
Quote from: vubballfan on April 24, 2013, 11:02:35 AMMost, if not all, good high school players that are difference makers have already signed -- which leaves the coaching staff to become more creative in their recruiting efforts (transfers, graduate students...). Juco players will be available but that usually brings its own difficulties....academics, transferring classes, etc. Transfers out of our program, whether they are good players or bad, can kill a program because it is so hard to replace them when it is so late. And we have to replace 3! That was why it was of utmost importance to have a solid early recruiting class in the fall so that if there was unforseen issues we would not have so many scholarships to fill at this time. Then you will always be playing catch-up. It is probably a forgone conclusion that the program will be set back (once again) for the next year or 2 but now we just need to hope it doesn't affect the program longer than that.
New coaches have a small window of opportunity to enthusiastically sell recruits on how the program will be better under them and what their vision is. And with each passing recruiting year that message becomes harder to sell especially if the program is not getting better and maybe even worse. It is obvious which Valpo coaches have had success in selling that message and which ones have not. Also IMO, when a coach refers to their 1st recruiting class as "Year 0" - that is just an excuse. Makes me think that they weren't up for the challenge when they took the job.
All excellent points and unfortunately an accurate glimpse into the future sitting here today.
Quote from: mgovalpo on April 18, 2013, 02:36:02 PMLate signing period started yesterday. News is on the way.
More than a week goes by......one additional player is the news???
Quote from: IndyValpo on April 26, 2013, 09:13:05 AM
Quote from: mgovalpo on April 18, 2013, 02:36:02 PMLate signing period started yesterday. News is on the way.
More than a week goes by......one additional player is the news???
Doesn't sound too promising. So, we've picked up 2 players then? 1 guard, and 1 big?
Maybe we will have a campus call-out to fill the roster. I would think we want 12 to start the season. We have blown through two data bases of potential recruits with little success.
Are we even recruiting at this point or have we given up....
Quote from: IndyValpo on May 01, 2013, 09:04:48 AMAre we even recruiting at this point or have we given up....
What kind of a statement is that???
Quote from: FWalum on May 01, 2013, 09:46:57 AMWhat kind of a statement is that???
A clever, sarcastic comment for effect or not.....
Quote from: IndyValpo on May 01, 2013, 09:52:23 AMQuote from: FWalum on May 01, 2013, 09:46:57 AMWhat kind of a statement is that???
A clever, sarcastic comment for effect or not.....
Overall our new coach Dorow is only doing slightly better than Keith Freeman. Essentially she was outcoached by Keith in both of the Wright State games and doesn't have any history of success at the Div. I level. I think she deserves more time but it certainly hasn't been a smooth start.
Time management at the end of close games will be something to review in the off season i would think.
I understand they've had some "prospects" in camp lately. With the spring off season session winding down, I guess we just wait and see if we get any John Hancocks.
The coaches are in the learning process as well. We shall see what they have learned.
Don't you mean Luke Hancock, jack?
http://www.hark.com/clips/cfvqznvyts-mr-callahan-i-need-your-john-hancock-on-these-reports (http://www.hark.com/clips/cfvqznvyts-mr-callahan-i-need-your-john-hancock-on-these-reports)
Quote from: jack on May 01, 2013, 02:57:19 PM
The coaches are in the learning process as well. We shall see what they have learned.
But why is an established, albeit in a downswing, D-I WBB program functioning as a learn-on-the-job incubator for the coaching staff? ???
As I understand it, they do recruit scholarship athletes in D-II, right? Except, in D-I, the sights are set higher and the talent levels are better. Doesn't everyone subscribe to the same recruit info sources? So.... You hit the road. You appear at HS and AAU games. You show interest in potential players. I realize that you don't want to just sign bodies to fill slots, but what's the
real problem?
Quote from: VULB#62 on May 01, 2013, 09:06:16 PMI realize that you don't want to just sign bodies to fill slots
Sadly with nine players this late in the process you need to sign bodies to fill slots. We need to add at least one more C/PF just so we can practice 5 on 5. We can add 3 and next year still have 5 openings we may or may not be able to fill.
Is there a junior college for WBB? What about transfers? Sounds like we need quality and quantity, but as time progresses, quantity will become more important.
Women's basketball and all other sports would be available at most JuCos, as well as the ability to transfer
We've picked up JuCo and DII before. I think it's about interest. We are a small, very guard heavy squad, with virtually no size at any possition. We were in a shooting slump all of last season, and our star player is leaving to play in the big ten. We have a young, unproven coaching staff, and I can't say for sure, but it seems we aren't all that aggressive at recruiting. If I'm a decent player, and a guard, I'm looking for a school that needs guards. If I'm a decent player, and a big, I'm looking at the roster and seeing if I'm going to get any help inside. Let's face it, we are definitely in a rebuilding phase. Our only hope is to spark some interest in a player who likes the school, area, what they have to offer academically, and the ability to have a little fun playing for their 4 years of school, but doesn't take it too seriously.
Quote from: jack on May 03, 2013, 12:12:02 PM
We've picked up JuCo and DII before. I think it's about interest. We are a small, very guard heavy squad, with virtually no size at any possition. We were in a shooting slump all of last season, and our star player is leaving to play in the big ten. We have a young, unproven coaching staff, and I can't say for sure, but it seems we aren't all that aggressive at recruiting. If I'm a decent player, and a guard, I'm looking for a school that needs guards. If I'm a decent player, and a big, I'm looking at the roster and seeing if I'm going to get any help inside. Let's face it, we are definitely in a rebuilding phase. Our only hope is to spark some interest in a player who likes the school, area, what they have to offer academically, and the ability to have a little fun playing for their 4 years of school, but doesn't take it too seriously.
Oh, oh. I'd rather have a "go get 'em" mentality about recruiting and excuse a few in game tactical blunders than be tactically perfect with little or no talent.
Quote from: jack on May 03, 2013, 12:12:02 PMwe aren't all that aggressive at recruiting.
Or were we overly aggressive chasing a only a few, striking out and having no or a limited fall back up plan?
We are now three weeks into the signing period and the silence is deafening.
At this point this staff has lost/chased more players away than added (5 to 3).
Quote from: IndyValpo on May 07, 2013, 11:41:38 AMAt this point this staff has lost/chased more players away than added (5 to 3).
At this rate we won't be able to field a starting 5 in 4 years! :/
It is very difficult for me to see the current state of the women's basketball program. This is not going to be an easy or timely fix. Recruiting can be very difficult at a school like Valpo, but good recruiters can still sell a story, a vision, and a belief in the future. Something is wrong here. I hope someone figures it out. Good luck to the girls that are going to have to fight their way through a more than difficult season.
Quote from: Girlsbbfan on May 13, 2013, 12:12:48 PM
It is very difficult for me to see the current state of the women's basketball program. This is not going to be an easy or timely fix. Recruiting can be very difficult at a school like Valpo, but good recruiters can still sell a story, a vision, and a belief in the future. Something is wrong here. I hope someone figures it out. Good luck to the girls that are going to have to fight their way through a more than difficult season.
It may be difficult but Keith Freeman always managed to get a couple of Indiana All Stars etc each year. There does seem to be a problem as so many players have decided to leave. We all know that style of play is a big deal and apparently our coach is pretty demanding. Apparently too demanding for some. As with the football team it may take a few years to get this thing turned around. It's only year two...
Too demanding can work if it transfers to success on the court, unfortunately we have not seen that success so far. There would be a ray of hope if we could see some positive signs on the recruiting front. Right now it looks like an impossible situation.
Quote from: vu72 on May 13, 2013, 12:28:23 PMAs with the football team it may take a few years to get this thing turned around. It's only year two...
Not sure the football team is a fair comparison. At least the ladies were competitive - eleven losses by 10 points or less. The recruiting is not where most would like to see it after the first season - maybe next years' recruiting will be better. Maybe the coaching staff is quieting looking at transfers and JUCO's to fill the remaining roster spots. I think there is much upside with this program.
Quote from: covufan on May 13, 2013, 01:33:49 PMI think there is much upside with this program.
I do too, and I don't buy this:
Quote from: Girlsbbfan on May 13, 2013, 12:12:48 PMRecruiting can be very difficult at a school like Valpo
at all!
Ask Roger Powell and Bryce if boo-hoo it's so hard. While the women do not have as much history of success, it's there (and nearly as many postseason wins, for that matter).
It's a good school in a good location. Not sure what makes it so hard other than the lack of success lately. Could be a lot worse...
Difficult does not mean impossible. High academic requirements, physical location, old gym, non promotion of womens team, poor game attendance, a new coach, and continued team struggles, make recruiting at Valpo difficult on the women's side. A great education trade for playing basketball and there is not one region player on the roster. Regardless it can and should be done. My point is new coach or not, there should be way more positive recruiting results.
Many of the issues you mentioned are present in 99% of women's basketball programs at the D-1 level: poor game attendance, not promoting women's teams, old gym, physical location. High academic requirements are not as big of a deal in the women's game versus the men's. Many top men's players would not qualify at Valpo as they figure that they will just play basketball for their career, whereas most women's basketball players study more in HS/college since they know that there aren't as many professional athletic opportunities available for them.
Quote from: valpotx on May 13, 2013, 03:14:28 PMMany of the issues you mentioned are present in 99% of women's basketball programs at the D-1 level: poor game attendance, not promoting women's teams, old gym, physical location. High academic requirements are not as big of a deal in the women's game versus the men's. Many top men's players would not qualify at Valpo as they figure that they will just play basketball for their career, whereas most women's basketball players study more in HS/college since they know that there aren't as many professional athletic opportunities available for them.
spot on. i was going to say "a little longer and this qualifies for the Post Hall of Fame" but considering it's you, it's plenty long! :)
Well I think we agree at some level. The question is where are all the recruits?
A very valid question. I did for the ladies what I did for the men last year, so as to not violate Title IX, one of the most overrated pieces of legislation in the history of laws:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlQ2tPhus3WCdDZ2VW1nNkYzdmVzbVJGYk1OZTYwTkE&usp=sharing
And I knew it was bad, but I didn't realize just how much so until seeing it visually. To fill in an extra blank I hope that Sharon Karungi will get 3 years not just 2 since she only played one year of JUCO.
Here's the thing--even if the 3 that left stayed, we STILL would have fewer players than the year before! We have SIX scholarships available for the fall. I can understand wanting the perfect fit (to avoid transfers down the road), but wouldn't you think you could take a COUPLE chances just to give yourselves bodies?
And only one returner logged more than 500 minutes last year (Capo-LVD range).
Ye gods. Ye'd think SOMEONE would want a $200K scholarship, no??!?
At this rate of attrition (arithmetic not geometric) we will have only enough for a starting 5 next year, and only one player in 2015-16 (a year earlier than currently predicted!).
LAA, to quote Norman Dale, "it's gonna be a lonely bench".
I think more and more schools will find themselves in the same predicament as time goes on. It rarely affects the men's game in this fasion, though you'll always have quality players leave for the NBA. When the ladies stay on campus pretty much year round, and get out ahead on their studies, they can get their degrees in 3 years, and for some, just don't want to put in the grind it takes on the body to continue to play the last year they are elgiable. I know Tab left, stating that Valpo didn't offer the after grad work she was looking for. Maybe so, maybe not. It'll be interesting to see if she tries to walk on down at IU, as it won't be a scholarship situation. If she does, and makes the squad, good for her. It would have been an expensive venture to stay at Valpo another year, and not play. Like I've stated before, men go to college to play basketball, and women play basketball to go to college. Very few have aspirations to play beyond their college days.
Unfortunately, the women who do play to learn, would like to do so in a quality program that can compete. There just seems to be too much adversity with the ladies program right now to attract some really good help. I hope I am wrong.
Quote from: jack on May 14, 2013, 02:45:21 PMIf she does, and makes the squad, good for her.
Based on IU's performance last year, I don't see how they can do without her...
Quote from: jack on May 14, 2013, 02:45:21 PMI know Tab left, stating that Valpo didn't offer the after grad work she was looking for. Maybe so, maybe not. It'll be interesting to see if she tries to walk on down at IU, as it won't be a scholarship situation.
What makes you think she is not getting a scholarship? They added 6 freshmen but still have one spot available. She was announced by their coach as joining the team as a transfer. With 10 sophs and freshmen she may play quite a bit.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on May 13, 2013, 05:24:27 PMWe have SIX scholarships available for the fall. I can understand wanting the perfect fit (to avoid transfers down the road), but wouldn't you think you could take a COUPLE chances just to give yourselves bodies?
This is the part that I can't figure out. It is not this hard to add players.
I believe I read somewhere if she joined the squad it wouldn't be through a scholarship. maybe something has changed. I still am not convinced she'll play for them next season.
There is an article on the front page of the IU Women's basketball website that says she is playing so I think it is a done deal. http://www.iuhoosiers.com/sports/w-baskbl/spec-rel/050213aaa.html (http://www.iuhoosiers.com/sports/w-baskbl/spec-rel/050213aaa.html) She will be playing with fellow Fort Wayne cager Andrea Newbauer.
Quote from: IndyValpo on May 14, 2013, 03:15:43 PMIt is not this hard to add players.
Yes. We should be getting more news, but the silence is deafening. Difficult to get some players I can see, especially if they have offers from the Big Ten, etc. We should be scouring every state's senior all-staters for young women that are smart and want to continue playing basketball at the Div I level. I just looked at the 2013 Indiana Girls All-Stars. They all have college offers, but three stand out to me: IPFW, IUPUI and Grand Valley State. Valpo should be able to compete with these schools. I'm sure there are others, especially in the surrounding states, that could play for Valpo.
Now I'm assuming the May 15 deadline will apply here as well (incoming freshwomen)...it would be really nice to hear something today.
...pretty please?
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on May 15, 2013, 03:07:39 PMNow I'm assuming the May 15 deadline will apply here as well (incoming freshwomen)...it would be really nice to hear something today. ...pretty please?
That's what she said...............meaning Coach Dorow, of course. :-[
If you two weren't such mortal enemies, I'd accuse you of being Saders03 for saying that :)
I'd much rather hear from Coach Dorow than him anyway though ;)
LAA, I agree with you about hearing about the recruiting from Coach Dorow, but Saders always gave us an update on the fashion sense of Coach Dorow...why would anyone want to miss out on that? :P
Perhaps someone here can do a newspaper article reviewing the team's status at the end of year one. I would love to know where are coaching staff thinkswe are in terms of recruiting and the future.
It appears we are nowhere with recruiting. And I'm not one to subscribe to the idea that the players that left prematurely, did so due to the coaching staff. Tab left, as it turns out, for a valid reason. Scott, felt out of place at Valpo and was talked into another year last season, and Calloway probably left on mutual terms. I still think we have a decent core of players at the guard possition, but let's face it, if we don't get Horton some help inside, it will be a very rough season indeed.
This coaching squad needs some serious recruiting help. There is a HUGE difference between recruiting at the D2 level, then at the D1 level. HUGE!!!
http://www.valpoathletics.com/wbasketball/roster/2010-11/4333/erika-lang/ (http://www.valpoathletics.com/wbasketball/roster/2010-11/4333/erika-lang/)
Does anyone know if Erika Lang is still a Valpo student?
Quote from: jack on May 20, 2013, 07:59:39 AMThere is a HUGE difference between recruiting at the D2 level, then at the D1 level. HUGE!!!
I'm guessing that the coaching staff is learning this as we speak.
We have six open scholarships. Even if 2 of the three transfers (Gerardot, Scott Callaway) were coming back, we'd still have four open scholarships. I can see losing girls that we've offered to similar or better programs, but we should have been making offers as soon as we knew their verbals. Hopefully, we'll see some movement with some transfers from other programs - all other Division I talent is gone by now.
(http://www.valpoathletics.com/media/basketball-women/2012-13/Action%20Shots/Dorow_22113_7637.jpg)
"Why not Valpo?
The fans love my outfits!"
Quote from: covufan on May 20, 2013, 11:35:14 AMHopefully, we'll see some movement with some transfers from other programs - all other Division I talent is gone by now.
At this point unfortunately we need to be way past D1 talent. We need 1-3 players who can play next year. Transfers would be great but that does fill the 9 player line up we have for next season.
Relax people, just because you don't hear anything doesn't mean nothing is happening.
It was my understanding that Isaac, and Karungi, the big from Uganda, have actually signed, though I haven't seen a formal anouncement yet. I'm also not sure if either have to sit a year or could contribute right away.
I hope they are both as billed, but we are still in need of some inside help. Our only next best bet inside with the current roster would be Weidmann, and that certainly isn't in her wheelhouse.
Once again, we need to build on speed with so many guards, and start getting Dean much more involved. Freshman jitters, and lack of minutes can't be an issue for her this season. we need her, and she's probably one of out quickest players.
At the end of the day, we have to sign at least one more big to have any hope of competing.
Quote from: jack on May 21, 2013, 07:22:46 AMIt was my understanding that Isaac, and Karungi, the big from Uganda, have actually signed, though I haven't seen a formal anouncement yet.
they have signed, yes, and these are the formal announcements:
http://www.valpoathletics.com/wbasketball/news/2012-13/12435/womens-hoops-inks-isaac-to-national-letter-of-intent/ (http://www.valpoathletics.com/wbasketball/news/2012-13/12435/womens-hoops-inks-isaac-to-national-letter-of-intent/)
http://www.valpoathletics.com/wbasketball/news/2012-13/12650/womens-hoops-inks-karungi-to-national-letter-of-intent/ (http://www.valpoathletics.com/wbasketball/news/2012-13/12650/womens-hoops-inks-karungi-to-national-letter-of-intent/)
Quote from: jack on May 21, 2013, 07:22:46 AMI'm also not sure if either have to sit a year or could contribute right away.
I'm not sure if you're referring to not being
ready to play (i.e. redshirt) vs. not being
able to play (i.e. NCAA stuff) but there is no problem with Isaac--your typical incoming freshman, so no NCAA problems--she has a diploma from a good school. With only 9 warm bodies, I can confidently say she's not going to sit out the year either.
As to Karungi, Paul Oren made it clear that the question is not "will she be allowed to play this year?" but "will she be allowed to play in 2015-16?":
QuoteKarungi will have at least two years of eligibility remaining with the possibility of a third.
http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/karungi-finds-new-family-at-valparaiso/article_6caf0c82-6e51-554a-bb7f-23a133f41f59.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/karungi-finds-new-family-at-valparaiso/article_6caf0c82-6e51-554a-bb7f-23a133f41f59.html)
Quote from: valpo4life on May 20, 2013, 10:46:20 PMRelax people, just because you don't hear anything doesn't mean nothing is happening.
While that's hopefully true, one would have thought that the May 15th deadline would have prompted some action. I mean: D1 program with history of success, good university, mid-major conference, plenty of PT available...
Thanks LP. Not sure what I was thinking with Isaac, and I agree, she will no doubt be asked to play a lot of minutes. Her "D" may help keep some games close. I just wasn't really sure about Karungi. I was thinking we could see help from her in 14 / 15, but your saying it could be 15 / 16?
I think Karungi definetly has two years of eligibility remainings -- 2013-14 and 2014-15 -- after playing one year at a junior/community college. As with many international players, the question may be whether or not she has four years of eligibility or, as with KVW, is limited to three based on prior experience.
Quote from: jack on May 21, 2013, 09:25:08 AMI just wasn't really sure about Karungi. I was thinking we could see help from her in 14 / 15, but your saying it could be 15 / 16?
I think Karangi will help us immediately whether we add more players or not.
Quote from: valpo4life on May 20, 2013, 10:46:20 PMRelax people, just because you don't hear anything doesn't mean nothing is happening.
Kind of reminds me of Kevin Bacon in the parade scene of Animal House...."Remain calm, all is well".
I honestly thought we had a 'letter of intent" signed as well, but for the life of me, I can't recall the player. Of course, as we've seen too many times, the intent letters aren't worth the paper they are written on.
Quote from: IndyValpo on May 21, 2013, 10:07:01 AMKind of reminds me of Kevin Bacon in the parade scene of Animal House...."Remain clam, all is well".
If we do this, we'll get shelled...
Quote from: valporun on May 21, 2013, 11:30:18 AMIf we do this, we'll get shelled...
wish i'd thought of it first! Indy logged back in and fixed it...or did you do it to him? :)
Anyway, Jack, sorry to confuse you. Karungi
is eligible for 2013-14 and 2014-15. She only played one year of JUCO, so it's hoped she's going to have 2015-16 too, but obv. the NCAA has to sign off on that.
Luckily as we all know they are not a great bunch of sticklers.
I think the women's game is making strides at the professional level, but at the end of the day, I still think far too many of these young ladies aspire to do something different with their lives, be it business, or raising families, after college ball is over. That certainly isn't a bad thing, just realitiy.
Not entirely relevant, but a good place to put this:
http://www.indystar.com/article/20130514/SPORTS02/305140068/Why-would-Heritage-Christian-seventh-grader-Katlyn-Gilbert-commit-Evansville- (http://www.indystar.com/article/20130514/SPORTS02/305140068/Why-would-Heritage-Christian-seventh-grader-Katlyn-Gilbert-commit-Evansville-)
Maybe this is the answer to our recruiting woes!
insert "Mr. Show: Recruiters" video again
Quote from: valpo4life on May 20, 2013, 10:46:20 PM
Relax people, just because you don't hear anything doesn't mean nothing is happening.
What is happening? At what point can we stop relaxing and begin to question our recruiting ability?
I'm afraid that point has come and gone my friend.
Kent Brockman: So Professor would you say it's time for everyone to panic?
Professor: Yes I would Kent.
Panic is wasted energy. We will see where we are at come November. We still have some quality talent, it all will hinge on who steps up. Our best leader hasn't been asked to lead yet.
Quote from: VU75 on June 01, 2013, 12:12:34 PMKent Brockman: So Professor would you say it's time for everyone to panic?
I, for one, WELCOME our new Phoenix overlords!
"I, For One, Welcome Our New Insect Overlords" - The Simpsons (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKbFb6TPVEA#ws)
Quote from: jack on June 01, 2013, 07:23:26 PM
Our best leader hasn't been asked to lead yet.
Leaders do it without being asked to, just saying. So whoever you had in mind, clearly isn't one.
Not entirely true. Some must wait until it's there time to lead. Last year's leaders have moved on. Let's see what happens. ;) I have my eye on a couple. I don't suppose it really matters if we don't get them all some help though.
And people say there's no interest in WBB on this board...look at us! We're averaging more than FIFTY PPR (posts per recruit) ;)
I'm praying we hear we're getting some help this season to spark even more interest. I still like our core group. It hurt losing Tab and Scott prematurely, but things happen for a reason, and it may give others a chance to step up. I think we'll see Weidmann moving into more of a 3 / 4 roll. We will need to lean on Horton a lot this season, and we have to get Dean going with many more minutes. I still feel she's one of our better defenders. I still see a Carr, Richardson, and Milller rotation, along with our new guard pick up. One of them will have to take charge and run the floor. I think we'll have enough speed on both sides of the ball to make things interesting, but we MUST get some help on the boards to replace Tab, and because we haven't shown yet that we can be consistent making buckets. I think Dean will help out a bit more this season with that as well. If we can just start knocking down some perimeter shots it could open up a lot of opportunities for us.
Just thinking out loud here. ;)
Jack, love your support and enthusiasm for the Women's team. Based on Mark's track record with hiring coaches, I think we need to give Coach Dorow a chance to settle in find her stride along with some of the younger players.
Quote from: FWalum on June 04, 2013, 05:05:34 PM
Jack, love your support and enthusiasm for the Women's team. Based on Mark's track record with hiring coaches, I think we need to give Coach Dorow a chance to settle in find her stride along with some of the younger players.
I would agree with this. Coach Dorow will need some bodies on the practice floor come October.
I'm certainly all about giving these coaches there time to settle in. Rome wasn't built in a day, and it's a given she lost some players she hadn't planned on for next year. I also agree, we have to have some help on the practice floor. We need bigs on our bigs (not sure who those are yet) to get them ready for league play. There has to be some athletes on campus that can help out - volley ball, softball, and once again, the men's squad.
My concern is the lack of either interest from prospects, or tenacious recruitment, which ever the case may be. I think we all learned some things from last season, including the coaching staff. I would have bet on more "W"s then we ended up with. This squad needs a productive summer and fall. With the new rule changes, we can get started earlier, and need to.
I'm willing to give Coach Dorow and the staff some time to build a recruiting resume. This feels a little like what Coach Carlson had to deal with in "building from the ground up" because of the length of losing records and recruiting struggles had from Freeman's last few seasons to Coach Dorow's first year coaching record at VU. Sure, she can discuss her D-II coaching career, but what a D-I recruit needs is a D-I record to look at. Right now, this coaching staff only has a one-year sample size. That is an adversity this coaching staff has to work with until they have a sample size of a couple of seasons. We'll just have to look at this in the same means as we did in the first three seasons of Coach Carlson's recruiting means, regardless of the differences in sport, coaching ability, and roster size.
I am told that Valpo has received a verbal commitment from Anne Hamilton, a 6' shooting guard from Minnetonka MN, class of 2014:
http://www.minnesotafury.com/girls/profile.php?player=653 (http://www.minnesotafury.com/girls/profile.php?player=653)
Huzzah! She's a matchup nightmare at the guard position...
any chance she can graduate THIS year? :/
What is it about Valpo that seems to only attract guards, on the ladies side? Or is it, that is where our recruiting gravitates to? Near as I can tell, we will have 6 unused scholarships next season. I'm not sure how that works, but can someone enlighten me to whether or not we lose some because of this? I know back in the day it worked that way on the mens side.
Do players today have far too high of expectations, or is it something else? Knowing that most women players not only won't, but don't have the desire to play on beyond college, how can we have 6 - 200k scholarships that don't spark any interest? It's a quality edjucational facility, that is recognized everywhere. A degree from Valpo can open countless doors to valuable employment opportunities, but yet...................??? I just don't get it. There has to be something I am missing here. Someone please enlighten me. Seriously, I'd like to hear some other opinions about this.
Quote from: jack on June 07, 2013, 04:20:24 PM
What is it about Valpo that seems to only attract guards, on the ladies side? Or is it, that is where our recruiting gravitates to? Near as I can tell, we will have 6 unused scholarships next season. I'm not sure how that works, but can someone enlighten me to whether or not we lose some because of this? I know back in the day it worked that way on the mens side.
Do players today have far too high of expectations, or is it something else? Knowing that most women players not only won't, but don't have the desire to play on beyond college, how can we have 6 - 200k scholarships that don't spark any interest? It's a quality edjucational facility, that is recognized everywhere. A degree from Valpo can open countless doors to valuable employment opportunities, but yet...................??? I just don't get it. There has to be something I am missing here. Someone please enlighten me. Seriously, I'd like to hear some other opinions about this.
I think this is the sentiment of most on the board. Why? With little to no information, we are left to our own devices, or is it vices?.
Quote from: jack on June 07, 2013, 04:20:24 PMWhat is it about Valpo that seems to only attract guards
Hey, she's 6 foot. Probably end up in the front court anyway :)
But yeah, we don't have a lot of info here. Oh well.
You don't lose scholarships for their lack of use...it just looks dumb, like grenades left on your ammo belt after the firefight.
Nice to see that Hamilton, in addition to being a good basketball player, is also the team captain as well as a great student with a 4.0 GPA and membership in various honor societies. A nice combination of athleticism, academics, and leadership skills! :clap:
Quote from: valpopal on June 07, 2013, 03:45:32 PMI am told that Valpo has received a verbal commitment from Anne Hamilton, a 6' shooting guard from Minnetonka MN, class of 2014:
http://www.minnesotafury.com/girls/profile.php?player=653 (http://www.minnesotafury.com/girls/profile.php?player=653)
This sounds like a good get. Nice way to start off the next class. Looking at the rosters for this program there are several posts currently undecided. Hopefully we are looking at them as well.
I see Hamilton playing a SF for us.
Another transfer who will redshirt (sorry if this has been posted earlier)
http://www.mtexpress.com/index2.php?ID=2005147693 (http://www.mtexpress.com/index2.php?ID=2005147693)
Quote from: vu72 on June 14, 2013, 01:39:49 PM
Another transfer who will redshirt (sorry if this has been posted earlier)
http://www.mtexpress.com/index2.php?ID=2005147693 (http://www.mtexpress.com/index2.php?ID=2005147693)
I thought I had heard of Jerry Finkbeiner, the coach of Utah State who released Haylee Thompson of her scholarship, before. He is the former women's coach at Oral Roberts. With a name like Finkbeiner it's hard to forget.
http://www.newson6.com/story/17756558/finkbeiner-leaving-oru-to-coach-at-utah-state (http://www.newson6.com/story/17756558/finkbeiner-leaving-oru-to-coach-at-utah-state)
The NCAA should really look into each case of a student/athlete being released from their scholarship. Jared Drew from Saint Louis (screwed by Crews) and Haylee Thompson from Utah State should be able to play immediately.
Yeah, this is why the NCAA sucks.
Did you have any idea that the NCAA voted to allow 4-year scholarships? Not much has changed, though, because the kids don't really know they can ask for that.
Great section of the article, after she is described as able to suit up next year for a D2 school:
QuoteBut she found the redshirt year playing on a Valparaiso "scout team" attractive.
She liked Valparaiso's second-year coach Tracey Dorow, the former Illinois State/Northern Michigan player who led the Crusaders to a 11-20 record last winter after spending 14 years at Division 2 Ferris State in Michigan with a 232-163 mark.
At Utah State, Thompson said she was mainly a post player in the No. 5 position, guarding an opponent's best post player and only picking up her offensive responsibilities toward the end of the 2012-13 Aggies' campaign.
"I definitely felt like I could have done more on offense than I was allowed to do (at Utah State). I made a high percentage of my shots. I know I can be a great offensive player but just didn't get the chance," she said.
"The main thing is I like making a team better and doing the little things to make a team successful," Thompson said.
Haylee added, "Valparaiso's offense is centered around their posts—a lot like we did at Wood River—while Utah State's offense was guard-oriented. I hope to play more of the No. 4 power forward where I can post up and also play outside."
At Utah State this past season, Thompson played 31 games and started nine of them. But Aggies coach Jerry Finkbeiner told her in April that she didn't fit into the team's future plans.
She averaged 12 minutes per game, 2.4 rebounds and 2.3 points; ranked second on the team in field goal percentage, .484, on 31-of-64 shooting; ranked fourth in offensive rebounds, 32; and ranked seventh in free throw shooting, 8-for-12, .667, on the country's second-best free throw shooting squad, 80%.
Utah State (18-14) set a school record for points scored in a season and ranked fifth nationally in 2012-13 with a 76.5 ppg scoring average.
That's a highly effective shooter, and she's only 18 NOW. That's 7.9 reb/40 and 7.7 pts/40, btw. And she's still "new" to basketball...
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on June 14, 2013, 02:28:43 PM
Yeah, this is why the NCAA sucks.
Did you have any idea that the NCAA voted to allow 4-year scholarships? Not much has changed, though, because the kids don't really know they can ask for that.
Yes, but nobody wants to tie down for 4 years, the coaches or the student/athletes. That is why I suggested 2 year scholarships with no option for 1 year. One chance to transfer but if you make a second mistake you either don't play the sport or stick with your mistake.
Quote from: bbtds on June 14, 2013, 01:59:47 PM
Quote from: vu72 on June 14, 2013, 01:39:49 PM
Another transfer who will redshirt (sorry if this has been posted earlier)
http://www.mtexpress.com/index2.php?ID=2005147693 (http://www.mtexpress.com/index2.php?ID=2005147693)
I thought I had heard of Jerry Finkbeiner, the coach of Utah State who released Haylee Thompson of her scholarship, before. He is the former women's coach at Oral Roberts. With a name like Finkbeiner it's hard to forget.
http://www.newson6.com/story/17756558/finkbeiner-leaving-oru-to-coach-at-utah-state (http://www.newson6.com/story/17756558/finkbeiner-leaving-oru-to-coach-at-utah-state)
The NCAA should really look into each case of a student/athlete being released from their scholarship. Jared Drew from Saint Louis (screwed by Crews) and Haylee Thompson from Utah State should be able to play immediately.
Looks like a good fit for VU.
A freshman player who plays every game, averages 12 minutes a game, and is then released from their scholarship. She should be able to play immediately. No questions asked.
Quote from: bbtds on June 14, 2013, 03:47:38 PMYes, but nobody wants to tie down for 4 years, the coaches or the student/athletes
Dude, the athlete is ALREADY tied down, remember? The coach/institution has ALL the cards. Look at the dude trying to transfer from Oklahoma State in football, or that guy who wanted to leave Wisconsin in basketball a year or so back. Look at Eddie Vanderdoes NOW for cripey.
Quote from: covufan on June 14, 2013, 06:01:36 PMA freshman player who plays every game, averages 12 minutes a game, and is then released from their scholarship. She should be able to play immediately. No questions asked.
Can I give a freakin' AMEN.
LAA, would you do away with letters of intent all together? I do agree that athletes sometimes get the short end of the stick...but when a guy like Vanderdoes takes up a scholarship (and as a result turns ND away from recruiting other players) and THEN decides he wants out (with a shaky at best story), what is the school to do? On the flip side, when a school treats an athlete like Thompson was treated, what is the athlete to do?
How would you fix the system?
Quote from: ARCInsider on June 14, 2013, 09:54:59 PMLAA, would you do away with letters of intent all together?
I'm glad you asked! Yes!
"In exchange for something, here is some nothing" -- the NCAA to the student-athlete
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/college-football/news/20130604/eddie-vanderdoes-national-letter-of-intent/ (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/college-football/news/20130604/eddie-vanderdoes-national-letter-of-intent/)
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on June 15, 2013, 01:31:24 PM
Quote from: ARCInsider on June 14, 2013, 09:54:59 PMLAA, would you do away with letters of intent all together?
I'm glad you asked! Yes!
"In exchange for something, here is some nothing" -- the NCAA to the student-athlete
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/college-football/news/20130604/eddie-vanderdoes-national-letter-of-intent/ (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/college-football/news/20130604/eddie-vanderdoes-national-letter-of-intent/)
Not that I disagree that the NLI system is broken...BUT, regarding EV...
1) Why bother signing the NLI? He wasn't forced to. It's a contract, just like any other contract...the language in the contract is clear. His age is irrelevant, just like it would be if he signed on a car loan or a mortgage or any other contract. (I know coaches breaking contracts will be mentioned...the specific language of those contracts matter...not every contract is created equally.)
2) Why did the NCAA deny his request when they have granted many others?
3) If he really wants to be closer to home to be near a sick relative, why UCLA? Six hours from home is hardly different than a plane ride home. He could have picked Cal or Stanford and been much closer to home.
If we did away with NLIs, would you be okay with Bryce having to continue to recruit Davidson/Yeo/Williams/Adekoya up until school starts? Ultimately, that's what he would have to do.
Let's come up with a system that works well for everyone...what would you do instead of NLIs?
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on June 14, 2013, 07:39:18 PM
Quote from: bbtds on June 14, 2013, 03:47:38 PMYes, but nobody wants to tie down for 4 years, the coaches or the student/athletes
Dude, the athlete is ALREADY tied down, remember? The coach/institution has ALL the cards. Look at the dude trying to transfer from Oklahoma State in football, or that guy who wanted to leave Wisconsin in basketball a year or so back. Look at Eddie Vanderdoes NOW for cripey.
Quote from: covufan on June 14, 2013, 06:01:36 PMA freshman player who plays every game, averages 12 minutes a game, and is then released from their scholarship. She should be able to play immediately. No questions asked.
Can I give a freakin' AMEN.
In business, people sign non-competes and non-disclosures all the time and are bound by them if they decide to voluntarily leave for greener pastures. It protects the hiring company from people who might steal intellectual property, etc. That's appropriate, logical and fair. However, if a person is fired, he/she is usually free to sign on with a competitor because the laws of our land guarantee each of us the ability to earn a living doing what we have been trained for.
I view this as a similar situation. This kid upheld her part of the NLI hiring process and, apparently, got fired despite that. Termination was not her choice. She did not attempt to transfer. Her compensation (a degree) was denied her (unless she would pay for it herself and cease doing what she was trained to do that her got her admitted (hired) in the first place). As in business, the non-compete (NLI) should be void and she should be free to go where she wants (and is wanted) and play immediately. Her rights have been denied, pure and simple.
Quote from: ARCInsider on June 15, 2013, 02:54:30 PMNot that I disagree that the NLI system is broken...BUT, regarding EV...
1) bad/no legal advice. Signing it does nothing for him--as an elite talent, he could go wherever he wants. It's like Pascal's Wager, with no positive outcome, only "meh." and "HOLY CRAP!!!1!"
2) I don't think you're thinking of the same thing. If you are, please give an example. In this case, the school is the one that has the power to bind or release.
3) He could have picked UC-Santa Barbara by your logic. The kid should go where he wants. It really shouldn't matter why.
Bottom line: these kids should be paid, not serfs.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on June 15, 2013, 07:18:24 PM
Quote from: ARCInsider on June 15, 2013, 02:54:30 PMNot that I disagree that the NLI system is broken...BUT, regarding EV...
1) bad/no legal advice. Signing it does nothing for him--as an elite talent, he could go wherever he wants. It's like Pascal's Wager, with no positive outcome, only "meh." and "HOLY CRAP!!!1!"
2) I don't think you're thinking of the same thing. If you are, please give an example. In this case, the school is the one that has the power to bind or release.
3) He could have picked UC-Santa Barbara by your logic. The kid should go where he wants. It really shouldn't matter why.
Bottom line: these kids should be paid, not serfs.
The bottom line is, HE signed the contract. Whether or not it is a good contract is a moot point. He knew what he was getting into, or he at least had every opportunity to. It's not ND's job to explain the contract to him or double and triple check with him to make sure he REALLY wants to sign it. He shouldn't have signed it.
I think there is an easy fix to this. NLIs are binding on both sides for the first year of the scholarship. If a school releases a student athlete, he or she should be free to transfer and play immediately. That would protect both sides.
That doesn't make sense. So the school can change its mind, but the kid can't?
Ridiculous.
PROTIP: when given the choice to side between a corporation worth nine figures and a preternaturally-talented eighteen-year-old kid, side with the latter. Anyone who doesn't is a Yankees fan who roots for the house in blackjack.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on June 15, 2013, 09:09:04 PM
That doesn't make sense. So the school can change its mind, but the kid can't?
Ridiculous.
PROTIP: when given the choice to side between a corporation worth nine figures and a preternaturally-talented eighteen-year-old kid, side with the latter. Anyone who doesn't is a Yankees fan who roots for the house in blackjack.
Neither side can change their mind in the first year. But I suppose you are right that after the first year the school has a choice but the player does not.
So, I'll ask you again...how would you fix it? If you allow kids to choose whatever they want, whenever they want, doesn't it just become chaos?
And is being a Notre Dame fan roughly equivalent to being a Yankees' fan? I believe it might be. But I don't root for the house in blackjack...so I only somewhat resemble that remark.
Quote from: ARCInsider on June 15, 2013, 09:17:28 PMBut I don't root for the house in blackjack...so I only somewhat resemble that remark.
:)
What you are proposing is that the school be allowed to change its mind. "Sorry kid! But you're immediately eligible somewhere else! ...What? All the dance cards are full? Oh welp!" But if the KID wants to change his/her mind, there should be some kind of appeals process, because right now what has to happen is ND giving in, but they don't want to, because of the precedent it would set.
Bottom line: the elite kids don't ever have to sign because any school that knows its sauce will hold their space. It might better be argued that the NLI helps the middle and lower classes of athlete.
The gate needs to swing both ways when it comes to scholarships. These schools invest a lot of time and money bringing in a player, and planning and building their programs around these players. A lot is at stake for these programs, and coaches, if a player decides to "de-commit". The situation with Ladd sticks out when discussing this. Leaving how she did was a major blow to the program, and possibly cost Freeman his job. I personally feel she should have sat out longer than she did before being allowed to play at Evansville.
I also think there needs to be a penalty for the school if a player is doing all they can to honor their commitment, and the school decides to release the player against their will. There are other schools this player could have gone with but chose the offer a particular school extended. perhaps loss of a scholarship for a period of time may be in order.
It also brings up another interesting issue. Situations like with Tabitha. You build a program around a specific player, you extend a scholarship and all the expense that comes with it, planning on a 4 year stint. As with our program, and going year round, these players can get their degrees in 3 years. I understand a player moving on to do after grad work elswhere, but I'm not sure I agree that they can take a year of elgeability with them to play elsewhere. I know she's not extended a 1 year scholarship, but if a school is so heavily invested in your edjucation, and pays your summer expenses so you can school year round, it may make sense to have to forfeit your final year of eldgeability, in all fairness to the school that had built you into their 4 year plan. Don't get me wrong, I wish Tab all the best, I'm just not sure I agree with how that situation works.
jack, Tabitha was originally recruited by Coach Freeman, so I don't know that Coach Dorow intended on Tabitha being the focal point for this coming season? Sure, Tab was in Coach Freeman's plans for four years, but Coach Dorow inherited her, and only went with her because what other scorers did she have from a roster that spent most of the season in the trainer's room, and not on the basketball court? While I hate the thought of changing the parameters of scholarships and NLIs to be even more confusing in wording than they already are, I think I have to agree that if a coach who recruited the player who is losing the scholarship for anything other than academic reasons, should be losing that scholarship for the next season or for the remainder of the time the student-athlete would have been on campus. Therefore, if the transfer we're getting was under this idea, than Coach Finkbiner, and any other coach who wants to pull this punch, would have to lose one scholarship for the next three years, or however many remained for the scholarship athlete they pulled the scholarship from. I guess this is my only way of making a scholarship bind for more than just the sport the athlete was signed to.
In terms of the penalties for losing the scholarship for anything other than academics, would be transfers, criminal matters, or the player loses eligibility for sanctions the NCAA deems necessary (i.e. inappropriate benefits or losing time due to playing overseas for teams that had professional contracts associated with them.) Academics, while an institutional and coaching staff control issue, can't always be a punishment towards the coaching staff, as they may have done all they could to get the student-athlete to attend classes and do the work, but with the Men's "One-and-Done" rule for basketball, those players already know their decision, so unless the NCAA requires attendance checks of all athletes, how can you cut scholarships for academic purposes without changing the "one-and-done" rule first?
I understand that Tab was recruited by Freeman, and I also know their is an exemption to the rule to allow the player to leave if the recruited coach leaves, without losing a year of play, but I'm not sure in what year you are allowed to do so. I think the fact that Tab played one year under Dorrow, and still had a year remaining should account for something though. Kind of, a giving back to the institution that provided and payed for your edjucation. If it's true that she left because Valpo didn't offer the after grad work she wanted to do, so be it, but maybe a player leaves the elgeability behind if they graduate early and decide to leave. Just my opinion.
As for cutting scholarships due to academics, I'm not sure what you're meaning here. I don't think a school should lose a scholarship if a player isn't keeping up academically. I think they should if the player is keeping their part up, and is only let go because they aren't fitting into the game plan. I suppose that too would be subject to whether or not the recruiting coach is still there or not. If Dorrow didn't extend another year scholarship to Tab, by all means she should have the right to play elsewhere for her final year of elgeability. There will never be a perfect plan that protect both the school and the player, but I do believe they can make it fairer for both.
If a school posted this some where for student/athletes to read do you think in the end the said school might actually end up with more NLI signed? Especially a school where the length of time a coach stays at the school is longer than most other schools.
Here is what the NLI guarantees the school:
• The player cannot be recruited by any other school.
• The player must enroll at the school for at least a year, or he/she must give up 25 percent of college athletic eligibility.
• Once said player is enrolled at the school, he/she is bound by NCAA transfer rules, which allow the school's coach to decide if the player can transfer and receive an athletic scholarship anywhere else. (Also, the athlete still must sit out a year after transferring regardless of whether the program released him or her to receive a scholarship.)
• All these penalties stay in effect even if the school fires the head coach or the head coach leaves (usually basketball) or the assistant coach who recruited the player takes a new job within a week of National Signing Day (usually football).
Here is what the NLI guarantees a player:
• Other schools aren't allowed to recruit him.
That's it.
Here is what the NLI guarantees a player:
• Other schools aren't allowed to recruit him.
That's it.
Here in lies the problem.
historyman, I'm not sure that posting the information about NLIs around the athletic facilities would make a difference. Too many freshmen are way too impressionable and listen to the voices they are most familiar with, not the one(s) that recruited them to the school they signed with. The sales pitch is too perfect about playing time and happiness, but once they get to campus, most of the phone calls the athlete makes home involve unhappiness with the coach who promised playing time and being the main focus of the program in coming years, but the player isn't ready, so instead of talking with the coaches who recruited them, they call their AAU or high school coach about the unhappiness and what their next move should be.
jack, in terms of the academics, if the student athlete flunks out, the program should lose the scholarship the player would have had for either the next season or the remainder of time the athlete would have been in college with that program. If the coach opts out of the scholarship because the player doesn't fit the plans, maybe that should be punishable by a lost scholarship for the upcoming season, but who knows what loopholes or anti-trust issues would be involved there?
This is a real nice discussion, but................is there any word on adding players for next year? We still sit at nine.
If nothing changes after today, I think we will be sitting at 10, if all goes as planned. We sit at 7 now, and I'm hoping we sign 3. We shall see. Wishful thinking probably on my part, but none the less, You may be right, we settle in at 9. Can't even get a scrimmage in at that. It goes back to the earlier comments about how we could have so many un-used scholarships. I'm shocked really. Time to invest in some help with recruiting probably.
I'm not sure I agree with the loss of scholarship for the program if a player flunks out. You'd like to think coaches could have more influence with getting these players to commit academically, but the reality is, if you put this in play, you open the door for some academic "hanky panky". Especially on the men's side. If a player flunks out, they should probably lose all NCAA elgeability at that point. That, more than anything would be your incentive. It's still about the edjucation. Priority one.
Quote from: IndyValpo on June 20, 2013, 02:19:07 PM
This is a real nice discussion, but................is there any word on adding players for next year? We still sit at nine.
Nine plus one red-shirt (transfer from Utah State), so at least they can scrimage until an injury. Five open slots in June should not be acceptable.
Quote from: jack on June 20, 2013, 04:08:49 PMIt's still about the edjucation. Priority one.
Matthew 7:5
http://www.jspell.com/public-spell-checker.html (http://www.jspell.com/public-spell-checker.html)
Per PO's twitter feed, we have picked up Annemarie Hamlet, a transfer from Oakland who will sit out this year and have 3 years after that. Averaged 7 ppg as a freshman and led the team in 3's. Her sister may also use the "Brandon Wood" rule to play her final season at Valpo next year. And also just would like to point out the girl's rarely scrimmage each other in practice, there's a scout team for that. Carry on.
Is her sister named MarieAnne Wanatah?
Seriously, let's take both, because we need anyone with internal gonads at this point.
Walkons...never really see walkons with girls, do we?
I'm tempted to say because there are 15 scholarships, there's no need...but are there gender etc. reasons?
Valpo had some walk-ons on the women's team when I was a student from 1999-2004. They didn't get many minutes, but Coach Freeman had them. I know there was Heather Furr and Megan Bess, and I want to say that Julie Bigler started out as a walk-on before getting a scholarship late in her time with the team. Recently, I don't know how many walk-ons the team had, but there were a few scholarship players that should have been walk-ons first.
I don't recall any walk ons in the past several years actually.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on June 20, 2013, 07:32:56 PMIs her sister named MarieAnne Wanatah?
OK, I'll admit I laughed at this! :lol:
Quote from: valporun on June 21, 2013, 12:42:12 PMMegan Bess
BLAST FROM THE PAST well done.
Quote from: covufan on June 21, 2013, 03:07:23 PMOK, I'll admit I laughed at this!
thank you. you made my day.
Quote from: bbtds on June 20, 2013, 04:45:07 PMMatthew 7:5
i thought jack was spelling it that way on purpose.
Working on updating the Women's Scholarship chart...
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on June 20, 2013, 07:32:56 PMIs her sister named MarieAnne Wanatah?
Let's hope it's not Marie Anne Hamleton, because then we'd have one of those to go with Annemarie Hamlet and Anne Hamilton.
Kind of the women's version of Buggs-Boggs-Bogan-n-Broekhoff.
But seriously, folks, two things: women's scholarship chart is updated
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlQ2tPhus3WCdDZ2VW1nNkYzdmVzbVJGYk1OZTYwTkE#gid=0
AND
the women beat the men in getting the first class of 2018 player! (Last year's roster is still there, just hidden--click to unhide if you like)
Turns out her sister is Elizabeth Hamlet, and she's a 5'11" blonde, something VU can always use more of.
(http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/oakl/sports/w-baskbl/auto_headshot/7985205.jpeg)
She played in 86 games in 3 years at Oakland, starting 39 and scoring 422 points with 117 assists.
FT% freshman: 60%ish. Sophomore: 65%. Last year: 78%.
So...let's get her too.
(http://www.theoaklandpress.com/content/articles/2012/11/16/sports/grizzlies/doc50a6fc8b090072149401293.jpg)
Quote from: valporun on June 21, 2013, 12:42:12 PM
Valpo had some walk-ons on the women's team when I was a student from 1999-2004. They didn't get many minutes, but Coach Freeman had them. I know there was Heather Furr and Megan Bess, and I want to say that Julie Bigler started out as a walk-on before getting a scholarship late in her time with the team. Recently, I don't know how many walk-ons the team had, but there were a few scholarship players that should have been walk-ons first.
Ah yes, Heather Furr. Transferred to a smaller program after 2 years, I believe, and then starred in the Lingerie Football League
Here is Annemarie Hamlet's bio from Oakland. She may very well be the best player in our program. Note that she and her sister are tied as the All-time leader scorer at their high school....
http://www.ougrizzlies.com/sports/w-baskbl/mtt/hamlet_annemarie00.html (http://www.ougrizzlies.com/sports/w-baskbl/mtt/hamlet_annemarie00.html)
And her sister...
http://www.ougrizzlies.com/sports/w-baskbl/mtt/hamlet_elizabeth00.html (http://www.ougrizzlies.com/sports/w-baskbl/mtt/hamlet_elizabeth00.html)
Quote from: jack on June 21, 2013, 03:02:13 PMI don't recall any walk ons in the past several years actually.
Last one was Erika Lang three years ago. Only other walk-on I can remember is Amy Govert who was a softball player.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on June 24, 2013, 09:39:28 AM
Quote from: valpotx on June 23, 2013, 11:13:56 PMstarred in the Lingerie Football League
furreal?
Haha. Yes:
www.lflus.com/chicagobliss (http://www.lflus.com/chicagobliss)
She was the 2010-2011 MVP
wow.
um.
now there's a scholarship sport to add. title IX friendly and all.
Apparantly there are still some players of value available for next season......unfortunately this one chose Butler.
http://www.butlersports.com/sports/w-baskbl/2013-14/releases/20130624hkrvoc (http://www.butlersports.com/sports/w-baskbl/2013-14/releases/20130624hkrvoc)
Probably not even on our radar. Sometimes you have put in a little work for the best apples and not settle for the low hanging fruit. Kudos to Butler. I suspect if they were after her we wouldn't even be in the running, but there are still some players out there that can be had. It seems we've settled with where we are at.
We add another guard from Minnesota for 2014......same AAU team as Anne Hamilton.
http://www.minnesotafury.com/girls/profile.php?player=878 (http://www.minnesotafury.com/girls/profile.php?player=878)
Tough to guage production without minutes played per stats. Unusual that she apparently shoots a better 3pt % than 2pt %. A bit low on the ft %. Must be their pt guard if she's only averaging 2.9 pg, or she just doesn't get the minutes.
I keep hoping to see a post commit. Keep your fingers crossed!
Quote from: jack on June 26, 2013, 07:31:40 AM
Tough to guage production without minutes played per stats. Unusual that she apparently shoots a better 3pt % than 2pt %. A bit low on the ft %. Must be their pt guard if she's only averaging 2.9 pg, or she just doesn't get the minutes.
I keep hoping to see a post commit. Keep your fingers crossed!
[/b]
They are working on a 6'2" player from this same team.
Quote from: vu72 on June 26, 2013, 10:10:35 AMThey are working on a 6'2" player from this same team.
I would assume it is.....http://www.minnesotafury.com/girls/profile.php?player=868 (http://www.minnesotafury.com/girls/profile.php?player=868)
Quote from: IndyValpo on June 26, 2013, 11:31:30 AM
Quote from: vu72 on June 26, 2013, 10:10:35 AMThey are working on a 6'2" player from this same team.
I would assume it is.....http://www.minnesotafury.com/girls/profile.php?player=868 (http://www.minnesotafury.com/girls/profile.php?player=868)
Ah, could be!!
This young lady would be a great addition. Appears to be talented in several fields, and quite imtellegent. Love the ft %.
Sorry. I forgot the spelling police were lurking. Unfortunately, spell check doesn't work on this site, and the N and M are right next to each other. I'll do my best to spot check for you in the future.
More info on our incoming players from Minnesota. Someone has actually rated the top 200 HS prospects for 2014 in the state of Minnesota for girls BB, plus has a watch list!
Ours are #31 and #43 which means what I do not know.
http://minnesotahoops.blogspot.com/2013/05/girls-player-rankings-2014s.html (http://minnesotahoops.blogspot.com/2013/05/girls-player-rankings-2014s.html)
Quote from: IndyValpo on June 26, 2013, 03:21:03 PMOurs are #31 and #43 which means what I do not know.
I'll tell you what--either that guy's wrong or we are. Only 7 or 8 men get D1 scholarships out of MN in a given year, it seems (http://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2012/03/23/good-question-how-hard-is-it-to-get-a-b-ball-scholarship/ (http://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2012/03/23/good-question-how-hard-is-it-to-get-a-b-ball-scholarship/)), and so multiplying that by 1.153 (or 15 over 13, womens' over mens' scholarships available) means probably 9 girls in MN merit D1 in a given year.
Checking that against that list, it seems that twice that number in this class at least have offers. I'd rather think this guy's wrong.
No offense to Arden Skoglund or U-rule.
There are 5025 scholarships in WBB D1 (although, they don't all get used. Ask Coach Dorow), which if strictly divided by population (they aren't, but MN isn't TX or CA or FL either) would mean that 86 women from MN should get scholarships on average. (Also this means 74 dudes should too, but they're not.)
So...hmmm.
Also: still nothing official (on the VU WBB news site that is) on Hamlet or Thompson or Donchetz (the latter not surprising however since she's a verbal HS commit) but the transfers...why the heck not?
Oren is on it:
http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/thompson-finds-right-fit-with-valparaiso-university-women-s-basketball/article_7b574125-b205-58ee-987b-bd4ac95976c0.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/thompson-finds-right-fit-with-valparaiso-university-women-s-basketball/article_7b574125-b205-58ee-987b-bd4ac95976c0.html)
Quote"I'm thrilled to have Haylee in the program," Valparaiso coach Tracey Dorow said. "When we watched her on film we saw all the little things that we need. She can run the floor and finish. She's really good at scoring from 15 feet and in."
Thompson admitted that perimeter shooting isn't her specialty, but is eager to expand her range while she sits out next season. The Idaho native averaged 2.3 points and 2.4 rebounds in 31 games while making nine starts as a freshman. Thompson added nine blocks and 14 steals.
"I'm the down and dirty type of player and I'll basically do anything a coach needs me to do," Thompson said. "My post coach in Utah described me as someone who would run through walls. That's the kind of player I am."
Oren hasn't tweeted anything about Donchetz. #SimonIMeanPaulSays
Also, Haylee Thompson played football in HS. Maybe she can give the guys a boost.
WBB scholarship chart is updated
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlQ2tPhus3WCdDZ2VW1nNkYzdmVzbVJGYk1OZTYwTkE#gid=0 (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlQ2tPhus3WCdDZ2VW1nNkYzdmVzbVJGYk1OZTYwTkE#gid=0)
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on June 26, 2013, 07:13:50 PM
Quote from: IndyValpo on June 26, 2013, 03:21:03 PMOurs are #31 and #43 which means what I do not know.
I'll tell you what--either that guy's wrong or we are. Only 7 or 8 men get D1 scholarships out of MN in a given year, it seems (http://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2012/03/23/good-question-how-hard-is-it-to-get-a-b-ball-scholarship/ (http://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2012/03/23/good-question-how-hard-is-it-to-get-a-b-ball-scholarship/)), and so multiplying that by 1.153 (or 15 over 13, womens' over mens' scholarships available) means probably 9 girls in MN merit D1 in a given year.
Checking that against that list, it seems that twice that number in this class at least have offers. I'd rather think this guy's wrong.
No offense to Arden Skoglund or U-rule.
There are 5025 scholarships in WBB D1 (although, they don't all get used. Ask Coach Dorow), which if strictly divided by population (they aren't, but MN isn't TX or CA or FL either) would mean that 86 women from MN should get scholarships on average. (Also this means 74 dudes should too, but they're not.)
So...hmmm.
OK, then think Cory Johnson, Nate Wolters and Alec Brown, as well as half of the Gopher lineup. The level of play in MN is very good. I'd be shocked if only 7 or 8 D1's go out each year. Valpo women have also had very good luck with Minnesota gals.
The other thing to keep in mind is that there is only one D1 school in Minnesota when it comes to basketball. Now, Indiana obviously has more players but what, 11 D1 teams?
The collection of wing players continues....the latest to commit is for 2015..per todays Indianapolis Star.
http://www.ncsasports.org/womens-basketball-recruiting/in/indianapolis/heritage-christian-school/allison-schofield (http://www.ncsasports.org/womens-basketball-recruiting/in/indianapolis/heritage-christian-school/allison-schofield)
http://www.indianablizzard.com/JONES2015.html (http://www.indianablizzard.com/JONES2015.html)
http://kyprephoops.com/1213/2013MarINGirls.html (http://kyprephoops.com/1213/2013MarINGirls.html)
After the famine, this is a veritable FEAST...and a 2015?
The girls now have 2 '18s and a '19 before the men have any '18s!
WH, or whoever it was freaking out about men's recruiting...you have my permission to freak out a lil.
Quote from: vu72 on June 26, 2013, 08:45:27 PMThe other thing to keep in mind is that there is only one D1 school in Minnesota when it comes to basketball. Now, Indiana obviously has more players but what, 11 D1 teams?
That doesn't mean anything in the current discussion; all that means is kids go elsewhere.
http://blogs.indystar.com/preps/archives/11661 (http://blogs.indystar.com/preps/archives/11661)
Here's the original article Indy referred to. According to that KY guy, she's not in the top 25 for her class (juniors) and not in the top 78 of the state (at least). Eh...those things are just dartboards, pretty much, anyway. Nobody knows all the players in the next conference over, let alone the whole state.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on June 26, 2013, 07:30:41 PMWBB scholarship chart is updated
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlQ2tPhus3WCdDZ2VW1nNkYzdmVzbVJGYk1OZTYwTkE#gid=0
Thanks for updating. Nice to see some color where before there were just areas of blank.
I did notice that Aliyah Isaac is on there twice in 14-15, and Thompson is missing that year.
Thanks for keeping these charts updated, they are a good reference.
jack, you have many posts with a lot of spelling mistakes, and I wasn't sure if it was something to do with your geographic background or education, so rather than be nitpicky, I just left it alone. I have to inquire about your "intelligence" when you spell intelligent incorrectly (intellegent).
Quote from: valporun on June 27, 2013, 01:05:50 PM
jack, you have many posts with a lot of spelling mistakes, and I wasn't sure if it was something to do with your geographic background or education, so rather than be nitpicky, I just left it alone. I have to inquire about your "intelligence" when you spell intelligent incorrectly (intellegent).
I'm sure spelling mistakes bother you younguns much more than it does us old farts. It's not something I lose sleep over. It appears I get my point across, regardless of the spelling or verbage. I suspect I've been around, been involved, and participated in this game long before you were born. If this were critical typing, I would certainly spend the time to proof read for spelling errors, but it isn't, so I won't. If ever I type something that you just don't understand, ask me, and I shall clarify.
Carry on.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on June 26, 2013, 07:30:41 PM
Also: still nothing official (on the VU WBB news site that is) on Hamlet or Thompson or Donchetz (the latter not surprising however since she's a verbal HS commit) but the transfers...why the heck not?
NCAA rules, is the short answer. Coaches (or university representatives) can't make any public statements regarding recruits until they sign a NLI. Since transfers (or walk-on freshmen) don't sign NLI's, they can't be announced until they start attending classes. That could be in a week if they're in summer school, or in August if not.
For the freshmen example, Butler men added two walk-ons in their incoming freshman class who verbally committed in January and March of this year. The official announcement (
http://butlersports.com/sports/m-baskbl/2012-13/releases/20130625qs4swg (http://butlersports.com/sports/m-baskbl/2012-13/releases/20130625qs4swg) ) wasn't made until this week, once they started summer school classes.
What about coaches because We may have added one. http://www.siusalukis.com/sports/w-baskbl/mtt/mesalam_paige00.html (http://www.siusalukis.com/sports/w-baskbl/mtt/mesalam_paige00.html)
Quote from: jack on June 26, 2013, 01:22:24 PM
Sorry. I forgot the spelling police were lurking. Unfortunately, spell check doesn't work on this site, and the N and M are right next to each other. I'll do my best to spot check for you in the future.
Jack, I think it was meant in fun. In baseball terms, you served up a cookie right down the heart of the plate and LAA just couldn't let it go by. It was too juicy.
I wouldn't lose any sleep over it.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on June 27, 2013, 07:58:35 AM
Quote from: vu72 on June 26, 2013, 08:45:27 PMThe other thing to keep in mind is that there is only one D1 school in Minnesota when it comes to basketball. Now, Indiana obviously has more players but what, 11 D1 teams?
That doesn't mean anything in the current discussion; all that means is kids go elsewhere.
http://blogs.indystar.com/preps/archives/11661 (http://blogs.indystar.com/preps/archives/11661)
Here's the original article Indy referred to. According to that KY guy, she's not in the top 25 for her class (juniors) and not in the top 78 of the state (at least). Eh...those things are just dartboards, pretty much, anyway. Nobody knows all the players in the next conference over, let alone the whole state.
I think you missed my point (shocking I know :o) which simply is(I'm trying to help here) that Minnesota may have fewer players (your point) but, because there is only one D1 program in the state a team like Valpo has a shot at some of the best in the state. Remember that girls don't think so much about a career in basketball but rather to the (perhaps) family atmosphere, religious nature or high academics of Valpo.
We picked up 3 for sures, with one being a walk on, with 2 being able to help right away, and one sitting a year. possibly may get one more to help now. The Minn. ladies are a year out.
Yeah, things went from "oh, bleak" to "oblique" to "oh, all right" to "oh, all right!" pretty quickly there.
Quote from: jack on June 28, 2013, 06:01:33 AMWe picked up 3 for sures, with one being a walk on, with 2 being able to help right away, and one sitting a year
Help! What are you saying here? I know of two for next year and two transfers. Who is the walk-on?
Not sure of the name. Just what I heard. I suspect she'll be a practice player, but you just never know about these things. My best guess is, we picked up 4 players, with 2 being elgeable emmediately. I've certainly been wrong before.
I may have missed this earlier but in The Times article today about the VU women's BB program it mentioned another recruit for next year. Jasmyn Walker a 5'10 guard from Muskegon MI has verbally committed to VU. Holds schools all time rebounding record after junior year in HS.
I believe Walker is identified as a class of 2014 recruit.
Valpo has reportedly received a verbal commit from Allison Schofield (2015), 5'10" from Heritage Christian High School and AAU Indiana Elite.
http://www.ncsasports.org/womens-basketball-recruiting/in/indianapolis/heritage-christian-school/allison-schofield (http://www.ncsasports.org/womens-basketball-recruiting/in/indianapolis/heritage-christian-school/allison-schofield)
IndyValpo had that (#168) above.
Official announcement of incoming players:
http://valpoathletics.com/wbasketball/news/2013-14/12803/womens-basketball-announces-addition-of-four-newcomers/ (http://valpoathletics.com/wbasketball/news/2013-14/12803/womens-basketball-announces-addition-of-four-newcomers/)
That's great! Excited about Elizabeth Hamlet and now we are up to 11 active bodies for next year.
I mean, this looks pretty good now, especially compared to a couple months ago, right?
(http://s9.postimg.org/db3t19p27/Screen_shot_2013_07_18_at_3_32_00_PM.png)
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlQ2tPhus3WCdDZ2VW1nNkYzdmVzbVJGYk1OZTYwTkE (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlQ2tPhus3WCdDZ2VW1nNkYzdmVzbVJGYk1OZTYwTkE)
Interesting, given our prior talk about walk-ons, that it turns out, per Paul Oren in the NWITimes, that Miller is a walk-on herself. Which is good, because, no offense, I didn't think she sounded like she had the pedigree for a full scholarship.
http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/college/valparaiso-university/elizabeth-hamlet-joins-sister-annemarie-on-valparaiso-women-s-basketball/article_2998f1a3-a663-5330-bef1-6d3e96a86d7e.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/college/valparaiso-university/elizabeth-hamlet-joins-sister-annemarie-on-valparaiso-women-s-basketball/article_2998f1a3-a663-5330-bef1-6d3e96a86d7e.html)
But don't think that I'm losing Faith in the women here.
Great to see we have 11 available this year. Things are looking up! Add to that we have some talent coming in that will certainly help out on the practice squad, and we could see some emmediate improvement this season. Looking at the chart, one thing that sticks out is the 2014 - 2015 season. We could actually be a factor in the HL this season. Another thing I find interesting, and wonder how often this has happened at Valpo - We will only have 1 senior (Carr) on the squad. Anyone know the last time this has happened? May not be as unusual as I'm thinking it is.
Kudos to the staff for getting us to a workable level for 2013-2014. With 11 they have a fighting chance. I like adding a senior to the mix. It will be a struggle with over 60% of points and rebounds gone from last year.
The future definitely looks better than it did two months ago!
Quote from: jack on July 19, 2013, 09:09:55 AMAnother thing I find interesting, and wonder how often this has happened at Valpo - We will only have 1 senior (Carr) on the squad.
Looks like 07-08 Sanna Helenius.
Thanks for the info. I guess it hasn't been that long ago, but I'm guessing it doesn't happen all that frequently at any school either.