Should be an easy win.
Thursday, Auburn Hills, MI
Your crazy dude michigan state is a good basketball team...they beat kansas, wisconsin, and michigan. To say that's an easy win for valpo is really odd
I could think of a worse matchup, but it'd be hard....
Quote from: Zoltar on March 17, 2013, 05:15:55 PM
Should be an easy win.
Easy win for who? Are you a Spartan?
I saw Michigan St play Wisconsin and I wasn't impress with Michigan St guards. I think we match up well.
Quote from: Zoltar on March 17, 2013, 05:31:43 PMI think we match up well.
I do too, Appling/Buggs, Dawson/Broekhoff, etc., but to answer the question in the OP
THEY DARN WELL BETTER BE BECAUSE THERE IS NO WAY WE ARE A FOURTEEN SEED LET ALONE NOT THE TOP ONE OF THEM.
Tom Izzo is Mr. March Madness........and at home no less. Horrible draw for us. When is the last time MSU has lost in the first round in Izzo's tenure.....ever? I think the NCAA really punished us for how we looked in the HL tournament combined with a lack of signature wins. I don't agree with it. I think we got hosed.
It's a horrible draw in the sense that we deserved a 12 more than a 14...and should solidly have been a 13.
I'm thinking they thought they were 'doing us a favor' by giving us the closest region.
...bbbbbuut it's also REALLY close to michigan state.
eh. i still think they're beatable. let's hear it for matchups.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on March 17, 2013, 05:35:16 PM
Quote from: Zoltar on March 17, 2013, 05:31:43 PMI think we match up well.
I do too, Appling/Buggs, Dawson/Broekhoff, etc., but to answer the question in the OP
THEY DARN WELL BETTER BE BECAUSE THERE IS NO WAY WE ARE A FOURTEEN SEED LET ALONE NOT THE TOP ONE OF THEM.
Do you feel strongly about that? I highly doubt that Michigan State was the lowest 3 seed, as they sent them to Auburn Hills for their first round and kept them in the midwest region.
this game terrifies me. about the worst possible thing that could've happened was insulting us with a 14 seed like this. if we play anything like we did on tuesday night, we'll get run out of the state of michigan, not just the palace. everybody is going to have to be on their game for us to even keep this close. their post play will outman us, i hate to say.
Quote from: Valposter on March 17, 2013, 05:36:13 PM
Tom Izzo is Mr. March Madness........and at home no less. Horrible draw for us. When is the last time MSU has lost in the first round in Izzo's tenure.....ever? I think the NCAA really punished us for how we looked in the HL tournament combined with a lack of signature wins. I don't agree with it. I think we got hosed.
amen to all of this. absolutely HOSED. the other 14s are harvard, davidson, and
northwestern state. are you ****ing kidding me??? northwestern state? we could beat ANY of those others, but to be on the same line as northwestern state is a huge insult to me.
Let's hope they at least want Michigan St to play in front of an evening audience, so more of us can watch the game.
Quote from: vuweathernerd on March 17, 2013, 05:46:51 PMthe other 14s are harvard, davidson, and northwestern state. are you ****ing kidding me???
well, i think we're easily better than all with the possible exception of davidson.
who are the 13s?
Actually I'll be in the minority here, but I don't think Valpo got hosed with a 14 seed. They didn't beat anybody. The best win was Detroit? Really? 1 win vs. the RPI top 100 and you're complaining about being a 14 seed? I think it was fair and I am not remotely surprised. I have been much more surprised if they would have received a 13 seed.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on March 17, 2013, 05:55:39 PM
Quote from: vuweathernerd on March 17, 2013, 05:46:51 PMthe other 14s are harvard, davidson, and northwestern state. are you ****ing kidding me???
well, i think we're easily better than all with the possible exception of davidson.
who are the 13s?
new mexico state, boise st/la salle play-in, south dakota state, and montana.
Quote from: vuweathernerd on March 17, 2013, 05:46:51 PM
Quote from: Valposter on March 17, 2013, 05:36:13 PM
Tom Izzo is Mr. March Madness........and at home no less. Horrible draw for us. When is the last time MSU has lost in the first round in Izzo's tenure.....ever? I think the NCAA really punished us for how we looked in the HL tournament combined with a lack of signature wins. I don't agree with it. I think we got hosed.
amen to all of this. absolutely HOSED. the other 14s are harvard, davidson, and northwestern state. are you ****ing kidding me??? northwestern state? we could beat ANY of those others, but to be on the same line as northwestern state is a huge insult to me.
Northwestern State has 3 wins over the RPI top 100 vs.
Valpo's 1 Edit:2. Um...
Well friends...the world has no expectations of us...shock the nation Valpo!
Quote from: milanmiracle on March 17, 2013, 06:02:25 PM
Quote from: vuweathernerd on March 17, 2013, 05:46:51 PM
Quote from: Valposter on March 17, 2013, 05:36:13 PM
Tom Izzo is Mr. March Madness........and at home no less. Horrible draw for us. When is the last time MSU has lost in the first round in Izzo's tenure.....ever? I think the NCAA really punished us for how we looked in the HL tournament combined with a lack of signature wins. I don't agree with it. I think we got hosed.
amen to all of this. absolutely HOSED. the other 14s are harvard, davidson, and northwestern state. are you ****ing kidding me??? northwestern state? we could beat ANY of those others, but to be on the same line as northwestern state is a huge insult to me.
Northwestern State has 3 wins over the RPI top 100 vs. Valpo's 1. Um...
Valpo has 2: Detroit and EKU. 13 seed Montana has...0.
Northwestern State has an RPI of 82, BPI of 127
Valpo: 59/61
Hosed.
Quote from: milanmiracle on March 17, 2013, 06:02:25 PMNorthwestern State has 3 wins over the RPI top 100 vs. Valpo's 1. Um...
Care to explain how you get 1 out of 2?
Besides, if 2 of said (NW St) wins are over the same school...
In conclusion, they aren't ahead of us anyway. They're lower on the S-curve.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on March 17, 2013, 06:08:54 PM
Quote from: milanmiracle on March 17, 2013, 06:02:25 PMNorthwestern State has 3 wins over the RPI top 100 vs. Valpo's 1. Um...
Care to explain how you get 1 out of 2?
Besides, if 2 of said (NW St) wins are over the same school...
In conclusion, they aren't ahead of us anyway. They're lower on the S-curve.
Because I can't count. ;D
Quote from: milanmiracle on March 17, 2013, 06:02:25 PM
Quote from: vuweathernerd on March 17, 2013, 05:46:51 PM
Quote from: Valposter on March 17, 2013, 05:36:13 PM
Tom Izzo is Mr. March Madness........and at home no less. Horrible draw for us. When is the last time MSU has lost in the first round in Izzo's tenure.....ever? I think the NCAA really punished us for how we looked in the HL tournament combined with a lack of signature wins. I don't agree with it. I think we got hosed.
amen to all of this. absolutely HOSED. the other 14s are harvard, davidson, and northwestern state. are you ****ing kidding me??? northwestern state? we could beat ANY of those others, but to be on the same line as northwestern state is a huge insult to me.
Northwestern State has 3 wins over the RPI top 100 vs. Valpo's 1. Um...
two of those came against the same team, stephen f austin. and the other was louisiana tech. forgive me if i'm not impressed. oh, and none of those 3 wins came against teams ranked closer than about 15 spots behind valpo.
Valpo had 2 wins vs the top 70 - Detroit and EKU, and 7 wins VS the top 150, Montana had 2 wins VS the top 150. When compared w/Montana, Valpo did get hosed.
lol to the can't count.
(http://oi49.tinypic.com/ohqpl4.jpg)
take a gander at this shot from bracketmatrix. the seed is actual...the number after the conference is the average seed on the 95 brackets they survey.
we got screwed a little--not as much as oregon. then again, the pac-12 blew goats this year.
the only unjustifiable jump is montana. which sucks because syracuse is the only team I'd rather play in this area than MSU.
i'm slowly getting over it because I hate msu anyway.
AND HEY GUESS WHAT WE'VE ALREADY BEATEN 2 MSUs THIS YEAR LET'S MAKE IT THREEVE
It's too bad the msu this time around isn't Minot state. We'd steamroll them.
Regaurdless of if you agree with the seed or not it is what it is...either we will win or lose. What are the odds we can beat mich state...id say 1 out of 10
Quote from: truth219 on March 17, 2013, 06:31:40 PM
Regaurdless of if you agree with the seed or not it is what it is...either we will win or lose. What are the odds we can beat mich state...id say 1 out of 10
(http://t.qkme.me/3ofwsa.jpg)
One and done. The last time we played MSU in the first round, MSU went on to win the championship. It could happen again. ???
Quote from: truth219 on March 17, 2013, 06:31:40 PMWhat are the odds we can beat mich state...id say 1 out of 10
somewhere between our chances @ UNM and @ STL...not great, but not bad. I think we should go small and dare them to match up rowdy and payne rather than try to play KVW & Capo at the same time and play into their hands so to speak...
and don't pay any attention to setshot. if they couldn't even make their conference tourney championship they are not going to make the elite 8 even if they somehow get by us.
Anyone know what time the game is
Million dollar question #1: How'd we get a 14?
Million dollar question #2: Who is Brandon Wood going to root for?
Quote from: truth219 on March 17, 2013, 06:31:40 PM
Regaurdless of if you agree with the seed or not it is what it is...either we will win or lose. What are the odds we can beat mich state...id say 1 out of 10
Reguardless--does that mean if we play without guards again? When did we first play without guards? ;D
Million dollar question #3: Who is valpospartan going to root for? ;)
This clearly is the best bracket to get to the final four.
:thumbsup:
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on March 17, 2013, 06:38:06 PM
Quote from: truth219 on March 17, 2013, 06:31:40 PMWhat are the odds we can beat mich state...id say 1 out of 10
somewhere between our chances @ UNM and @ STL...not great, but not bad. I think we should go small and dare them to match up rowdy and payne rather than try to play KVW & Capo at the same time and play into their hands so to speak...
and don't pay any attention to setshot. if they couldn't even make their conference tourney championship they are not going to make the elite 8 even if they somehow get by us.
Michigan State almost always has a way of exceeding expectations at tournament time and out-performing their regular season body of work. It is uncanny.
Elite 8 would not shock me. Final Four would not shock me. Tom Izzo is a magician at tourny time.
Fun Fact: Albeit the early round nomenclature has changed, but this will technically be the first 2nd Round game for Valpo since we beat Florida State in '98.
Even if we go "one-and-done," that'll make the banner look a little cooler 8)
I hate this draw. No real disputing the #14 seed.
But it put us in Michigan one hour from East Lansing. Due to Izzo the motivator and a big home crowd, we won't catch them napping. I thought our best shot would be either a slow team or an unfocused one.
Mich State and March are the epitome of "focus". I still have nightmares of Matteen Cleaves and gang going up 20-4 on us in Cleveland.
I thought right away we got screwed. I did not want to be negative too quickly but 14 - really. I was watching predictions like crazy and barely saw any that had us below a 13. I think the selection committee has a number of strange seeds each year.
I do think VU can win. If we play our game and can be hitting on all cylinders we could surprise a team that is looking past us. Happened last year to a couple 2 seeds...... It is march - anything can happen.
Like everyone else, I'm disappointed with the seed and having to play MSU in essentially a home game. I really thought we were going to get a 13, but we basically put ourselves in the position for the committee to do that. You can't lose games to the likes of Oakland, who is down this year, Loyola, and YSU. The loss to Nebraska didn't do us any favors either. If you're going to drop games like that, you have to have one or two good wins, in the eyes of the committee, and we came up short there too with NM and SLU. Those aren't bad losses, but coupled with the others mentioned above, you open yourself up to the committee dropping you down.
I still think we are a 13, especially when compared to the other 13 seeds, but we just have to play the hand we've been dealt. It would've been nice if we didn't leave any doubt, but would've, should've, could've.
I know one thing, if the officials let Nix play like he did in the Big Ten Tourney, we are going to get killed, figuratively and quite possibly, literally. He was clobbering guys down low, especially during the Ohio State game, and the officials let them play, both ways and on both ends of the court We really need to hope for a closely officiated game, which doesn't seem to exist any more.
Go VU!
I thought this year's selection show was weak.... I like past years where they had more cameras at team parties. This year, it felt like $&@ it lets just name the teams and move on. If that is all they are going to do just post the bracket online....
VUrich is 100% correct. We haven't beat anyone and have had some really bad losses. Plus we are 1 lucky shot or one more turnover away from being in the NIT.
To me this team has been stuck in preseason mode all year. I don't see them snapping out of it and beating MSU after the showing we had on our home floor in the conf tourney.
We have the most experienced team in the nation and we do not play like it. I guess anything can happen in the NCAA tourney......
I don't think the selection committee gave their decision about our seed and location nearly as much scrutiny as we did. They basically gave MSU a home game and then looked for the closest team geographically to serve as their sacrificial lamb. We "fit the uniform."
The fact we have more posters defending the selection committee than standing up for Valpo is an absolute embarrassment to basketball fans everywhere. In no situation should it be alright that Montana gets a 13 seed and we play an rpi 9 away game as a 14 seed.
Quote from: wh on March 17, 2013, 07:31:41 PM
I don't think the selection committee gave their decision about our seed and location nearly as much scrutiny as we did. They basically gave MSU a home game and then looked for the closest team geographically to serve as their sacrificial lamb. We "fit the uniform."
I'd say that's somewhat close to accurate. I think they also thought about keeping Valpo in the midwest region, but really they just didn't worry about it too much.
Quote from: Valposter on March 17, 2013, 06:51:54 PMTom Izzo is a magician at tourny time.
Quote from: crusadermoe on March 17, 2013, 06:59:11 PMMich State and March are the epitome of "focus". I still have nightmares of Matteen Cleaves and gang going up 20-4 on us in Cleveland.
...I think--no question they are good and have been, historically--but this is a case of reputation more than actual results.
I mean, the Rolling Stones come out with a half-decent record every now and then too, but they are really trading on their reputation of a bunch of albums ago.
--2-2 in the last 2 years, less than par for the Izzo course (average 2-1 every year).
--6 final fours in the Izzo era (1995-); only 2 of those in the last 7 (same as B----r, except that msu lost to them).
--4 first round losses (all since the only title)
--yeah they killed us...when they won their only tourney (izzo here) but they beat
everyone by 11+ that year. and that was 2000. clinton was president fergodsakes.
I mean yeah, they're good, but it's not like every year they're amazing. they're beatable, both this year and in general.
Quote from: a3uge on March 17, 2013, 07:34:49 PM
The fact we have more posters defending the selection committee than standing up for Valpo is an absolute embarrassment to basketball fans everywhere. In no situation should it be alright that Montana gets a 13 seed and we play an rpi 9 away game as a 14 seed.
bravo pal, drinks on me.
If you take the group of NMSt, Montana, Davidson and SDSt I think it would be easier to make the case that we are better than all 4 than to make the case that we are the worst. However there is no one in the Big10 that I could take more pleasure in beating than the Spartans. We got some debts to settle, even if getting them to pay up might be a bit difficult.
Much of this 14 seed issue comes full circle back to our powder-puff OOC home schedule. Everone is reluctant to come to the ARC so we sign whoever we can get, then they turn out to be so bad that everybody stays home anyway. It would be interesting to compare the results financially and RPI wise if we had just hit the road and played big dollar top 50 teams. This year in particular we might have been better off.
As I feared, it does appear that the selection committee saw the nationally televised Horizon Championship turnoverfest. After that crap game, we should be counting our lucky stars that we're a 14 and not a 15. It is humbling that Harvard got a better match-up, which suggests we're a low 14. I think we could've given New Mexico a good game. We match up poorly against MSU, and unless we shoot 80% from the field, we're looking at a double-digit blowout.
Quote from: a3uge on March 17, 2013, 07:34:49 PM
The fact we have more posters defending the selection committee than standing up for Valpo is an absolute embarrassment to basketball fans everywhere. In no situation should it be alright that Montana gets a 13 seed and we play an rpi 9 away game as a 14 seed.
Agreed. Montana is in the 28th best conference, we are in the 12th best conference. We could have stayed in the MidCon/Summit (19th best) lost 2 more games (albeit 2 to Minnesota and Belmont, but including Cal St Bakersfield), and still been a 13. Ridiculous. At least have us play Marquette at a neutral site, not Michigan St. in Michigan.
Montana has 2 wins VS teams over .500, Valpo has 12. Whether some people believe Valpo deserved a 14 seed or not, there can be zero debate that Montana deserved a better seed than Valpo.
Are they planning to release the S curve this year? Presumably Montana got bumped up (and Oregon down?... and we down?) for some reason or another.
I like the idea of hitting the road for top 50.... However this year i think the selection committee would have punished us for not winning them... Lose/lose.....
According to the representative of the committee on CBS and ESPN, they no longer use an s-curve. "Just 68 teams on a linear sheet of paper." He also seemed to indicate that geography was indeed a factor.
Well we lost the selection committee, lets see i,f this team that did not find a way to Quit can it win on the hardwood the real game, something they proved time and again this year. Last years team was 1 and 2 in the post season, this team just plays the game wins with the tools they have (Mr Buggs 22 Pt's). Being in the dance sure beets all of the other chaises! :)
Tom Izzo had a few nice things to say about Valpo. Also, a little blurb about Brandon Wood as well.
http://www.mlive.com/spartans/index.ssf/2013/03/michigan_states_tom_izzo_sees_1.html (http://www.mlive.com/spartans/index.ssf/2013/03/michigan_states_tom_izzo_sees_1.html)
Quote from: govalpogo on March 17, 2013, 08:49:22 PM
According to the representative of the committee on CBS and ESPN, they no longer use an s-curve. "Just 68 teams on a linear sheet of paper." He also seemed to indicate that geography was indeed a factor.
I don't care so much about the shape of the curve. He's suggesting that they have a ranked list, 1 to 68? Are they going to release it? ;)
It had to have been a geography reason for us being given a 14, and Montana a 13. That match-up should have been reversed. I don't have any beef with the other 13 seeds, though SDSU is a suspect 13. They were only given that because of their win at UNM, with some very bad losses outside of that game. I would have been much happier with us playing Syracuse in San Jose, as it should have been matched up if they didn't consider the geography as they did. MSU in MI? That is complete bs
At this point, I'm much more interested in the time of the game on Thursday.
Anyone know when we will find out a time?
Quote from: agibson on March 17, 2013, 08:55:49 PM
Quote from: govalpogo on March 17, 2013, 08:49:22 PM
According to the representative of the committee on CBS and ESPN, they no longer use an s-curve. "Just 68 teams on a linear sheet of paper." He also seemed to indicate that geography was indeed a factor.
I don't care so much about the shape of the curve. He's suggesting that they have a ranked list, 1 to 68? Are they going to release it? ;)
http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/blog/eye-on-college-basketball/21899662/official-ncaa-168-seed-list (http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/blog/eye-on-college-basketball/21899662/official-ncaa-168-seed-list)
Suggesting that one game (which we won) had a significant impact on our seed is complete ignorance to the underlying problem with the selection process. Teams are ordered by achievement and then adjusted to fit in a certain geographic location. If one game shifted seeds, you wouldn't see ETSU dancing. Indiana wouldn't have a 1 seed. I doubt they care enough to properly seed mid majors, let alone gain an impression of the team based on their championship game (which resulted in a win).
To offset the naysayers (chairback, milanmiracle and setshot), remember, they will be a "home" team but the location will allowa lot of Valpo fans to go and of course the other two teams fans will be rooting for Valpo, so let's call it a push!
As for MSU, sure, they are MSU but, they very recently beat Northwestern by 10 at MSU, beat Iowa by 3 in their tourney, beat Nebraska by 9 on the road, beat Iowa by 3 on the road, beat freakin Loyola by 12 at home, Louisiana Lafayette (for pete's sake) by 3 at home!!!!!
If, and it's a very big if, we play like we did at Green Bay, we win. We need to get their bigs in foul trouble and hit 3's. We have a chance, absolutely.
OK...so our seed sucks, plain and simple. Most of us thought a 13...hell most of the supposed "bracketologists" (i.e. Lunardi, etc.) had us there as well... Anyways, I agree it comes down to the strength of the offseason schedule. Need to strengthen that up big time - for example, why the hell cant we get a home and home with Baylor? Cant Bryce and Scott sit at the dinner table during the offseason and hammer something out? Yes, we did have some good non-conference opponents (St. Louis, New Mexico, Murray State) but there was a hell of a lot of crap there too (IPFW, Purdue Calumet, Chicago State). Maybe more with the Ohio Valley Conference or the Missouri Valley Conference would have helped?
Brian
Quote from: vu72 on March 17, 2013, 09:12:30 PM
To offset the naysayers (chairback, milanmiracle and setshot), remember, they will be a "home" team but the location will allowa lot of Valpo fans to go and of course the other two teams fans will be rooting for Valpo, so let's call it a push!
As for MSU, sure, they are MSU but, they very recently beat Northwestern by 10 at MSU, beat Iowa by 3 in their tourney, beat Nebraska by 9 on the road, beat Iowa by 3 on the road, beat freakin Loyola by 12 at home, Louisiana Lafayette (for pete's sake) by 3 at home!!!!!
If, and it's a very big if, we play like we did at Green Bay, we win. We need to get their bigs in foul trouble and hit 3's. We have a chance, absolutely.
Note my avatar-- I'm with you 72. Plus , how serious will MSU players take tiny Valpo? Key: Few TOs, tight D and draining tres. We can do all three, but we haven't done it all in one important game. The time is now.
ONIONS!
QuoteSECOND ROUND GAMES
THURSDAY AFTERNOON, MARCH 21 (Noon-5 p.m. ET)
Tip (ET) Network Site Game Play-by-Play/Analyst//Reporter/Producer/Director
12:15 p.m. CBS Auburn Hills I Valparaiso vs. Michigan State Verne Lundquist/Bill Raftery//Rachel Nichols/Bob Dekas/Suzanne Smith (info via Turner Sports release)
You should check out BWood's Twitter page...he is getting constant tweets
Quote from: zvillehaze on March 17, 2013, 09:05:47 PM
Quote from: agibson
I don't care so much about the shape of the curve. He's suggesting that they have a ranked list, 1 to 68? Are they going to release it? ;)
http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/blog/eye-on-college-basketball/21899662/official-ncaa-168-seed-list (http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/blog/eye-on-college-basketball/21899662/official-ncaa-168-seed-list)
Interesting! I don't understand the at-large play-in seeds at all.
Under Izzo MSU has been to the NCAA's the last 15 years. 3 times they did lose in the 1st round, but 2 of those were when they had a .500 record in conference (13-5 this year) They made the Sweet 16 10 times, the Final Four 5 times. A bad deal for VU - slim odds. Izzo is a very good coach - odds of an unfocused team are slim. I'd have rather played Michigan there.
No. 14 Crusaders face No. 3 Spartans in Michigan
http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/college/valparaiso-university/no-crusaders-face-no-spartans-in-michigan/article_a289cde7-9e9d-55ff-ac45-914bfd67156b.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/college/valparaiso-university/no-crusaders-face-no-spartans-in-michigan/article_a289cde7-9e9d-55ff-ac45-914bfd67156b.html)
Complaining about our seed/opponent isn't going to do any good. WHo is actually going? I will be there cheering our guys on. I hope they believe they can win more then the rest of you guys.
Valparaiso gets No. 14 seed, matchup with Michigan State
http://posttrib.suntimes.com/sports/18922025-556/valparaiso-gets-no-14-seed-matchup-with-michigan-state.html (http://posttrib.suntimes.com/sports/18922025-556/valparaiso-gets-no-14-seed-matchup-with-michigan-state.html)
Quote from: HC on March 17, 2013, 09:46:13 PM
Complaining about our seed/opponent isn't going to do any good. WHo is actually going? I will be there cheering our guys on. I hope they believe they can win more then the rest of you guys.
<raises hand>
12:15pm tip on CBS
http://www.mlive.com/spartans/index.ssf/2013/03/michigan_state_to_play_1215_pm.html (http://www.mlive.com/spartans/index.ssf/2013/03/michigan_state_to_play_1215_pm.html)
We open as 11 point dogs, the lowest point difference between any 14/3 match up.
Quote from: Valpo2010 on March 17, 2013, 09:51:05 PM
12:15pm tip on CBS
http://www.mlive.com/spartans/index.ssf/2013/03/michigan_state_to_play_1215_pm.html (http://www.mlive.com/spartans/index.ssf/2013/03/michigan_state_to_play_1215_pm.html)
12:15 eastern
11:15 central
Hey getting the 11:15 game on Thursday means you will be the first game up and tip off the Madness!
After watching the players react and hearing some of the interviews with Will, Eric, and Ryan, I have gained a new perspective on this game. Amid all of the lament regarding seeding, RPI, Big wins, bad losses, and a host of statistical jargon, the dreams of a basketball team and especially 6 seniors are being realized. They have spent a vast majority of their lives preparing, training, and living for this moment. For many of them, this will be their Super Bowl, their World Series, their Stanley Cup. They get to play on America's biggest college basketball stage against one of the most storied NCAA teams in the country. And maybe, just maybe, they can be that underdog that knocks off the giant, that proves the pundits wrong, and that reminds the world why College Basketball owns the month of March. This is their shot, and they've been through hell and back to earn it.
They've seen their chances slip away on missed layups and unfortunate travel calls late in the regular season, they've seen injuries appear at the worst times in tournaments, they've seen physically superior teams blow their fundamental play out of the water and take their bid away on their home court, and they've felt the pressure of being the oldest team in America, picked to win their league all the while losing head scratchers and constantly turning the ball over and even coming to within a second of ending it all in heartbreak once again. And yet...this team made it, they've clawed and scratched their way to big comebacks, impossible buzzer beaters, and have time and again dug deep and found the will to win.
The challenge before them is great, but they've waited their whole lives to try to hurdle it. So this week, I will join in the excitement of these seniors, of this team, and of this fan base that has waited 9 years for another chance at college basketball immortality. I will watch Ryan's buzzer beater 100+ more times, I will rewatch our games where hope looked its bleakest with the knowledge that somehow this team found a way to win. And I will dare to dream of an upset, maybe two or three. I hope you do as well and I remind you that this is why we are Valpo fans, and sports fans in general: for the hope that someday our "what ifs" will become "remember whens," for our belief in the underdog, and for affirmation in our faith that great adversity can be triumphed over through perseverance and prayer (perhaps starting to slip into my Easter sermon). And if the stats prove true and the season ends on Thursday, I will be disappointed...but I will celebrate the return of Valpo Basketball and begin looking forward to the dawning of a new era next year.
GO VALPO GO!!!!
Quote from: HC on March 17, 2013, 09:46:13 PM
Complaining about our seed/opponent isn't going to do any good. WHo is actually going? I will be there cheering our guys on. I hope they believe they can win more then the rest of you guys.
Looking at prices, it will only be $300-$400 for me to fly there...does that seem worth it to you guys? I absolutely hate the city of Detroit, so this is a hard choice lol
Quote from: crusaderjoe on March 17, 2013, 06:47:41 PM
Million dollar question #3: Who is valpospartan going to root for? ;)
First of all let me say that I hate this pairing.
That said, as much of a fan of VU that I am (season ticket holder for decades), I am a Michigan State University graduate and I will never root against them. Did I mention that I hate the pairing? I will be watching with sadness in my heart.
Does anyone know anything about tickets?
I'm surprised there's nothing up on the website.
They were "selling" them at the selection show party, but I think they were basically just taking reservations (with credit card info, and a commitment to buy them if available, etc.).
I'd call them up first thing tomorrow, they open at 9 AM central.
877-MY-VU-TIX (877-698-8849) or 219-464-5233
For students, they're on sale at the union, tonight and tomorrow.
Or, you can get them from ticketmaster now (not in the Valpo section, say, but you'd know you had them).
http://www.ticketmaster.com/venueartist/65562/1239566 (http://www.ticketmaster.com/venueartist/65562/1239566)
Looks to be from $150 for... I guess the whole Thursday-Saturday event?
And from $57 for the first Thursday session? (One game? Not sure.)
I really want to go... Want this team to know they have people rooting for then... Wish I could "show" my support but i cant make it.
Couldn't ask for a better group to represent Valpo. (I have said it before but this is a quality group of young adults - that play basketball.) I would definitely go if i could - since i can't - i will be sitting in front of a tv....
* my wife, an elementary teacher, said she is going to find a way to do her math lesson on game stats so that she can watch - now that is a dedicated fan.
Another couple of facts to supplement those already given.
This is Izzo's 16th straight NCAA appearance: they went to the NIT his first two season as head coach.
Their first round losses were to #7 seed NC State, #10 seed Nevada, #11 seed George Mason, and #7 seed UCLA.
They've had a seed _worse_ than this #3 seed in ten of their sixteen appearances (and were 6-4 in those games). They've never before had a #3 seed.
Overall, #14 seeds are 16-95 against #3 seeds (seems like an odd number, but that's what bbstate.com tells me), for 14%, or a little more than one win every two years.
The last was in 2010, so clearly we're due! (Ohio over Georgetown. Before that was 2006... Northwestern State over Iowa.)
[Updated for 4th first round loss. Darn "second round".]
Quote from: agibson on March 17, 2013, 11:17:45 PM
Overall, #14 seeds are 16-95 against #3 seeds (seems like an odd number, but that's what bbstate.com tells me), for 14%, or a little more than one win every two years.
The last was in 2010, so clearly we're due! (Ohio over Georgetown. Before that was 2006... Northwestern State over Iowa.)
Its 16-96. They probably just forgot to add one of the games last year.
http://www.bracketscience.com/forum/thread.asp?c=1&y=&p=0&t=17582&s=BS (http://www.bracketscience.com/forum/thread.asp?c=1&y=&p=0&t=17582&s=BS)
Found this interesting, that we are called 'dangerous killers' lol:
http://insider.espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/blog/_/name/giant_killers/id/9063799/2013-ncaa-tournament-top-10-most-likely-early-upsets-college-basketball (http://insider.espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/blog/_/name/giant_killers/id/9063799/2013-ncaa-tournament-top-10-most-likely-early-upsets-college-basketball)
Quote from: 70zboy on March 17, 2013, 09:34:37 PMUnder Izzo MSU has been to the NCAA's the (1) last 15 years. (2) 3 times they did lose in the 1st round, but 2 of those were when they had a .500 record in conference (13-5 this year) They made the Sweet 16 10 times, the Final Four 5 times. A bad deal for VU - slim odds. Izzo is a very good coach - odds of an unfocused team are slim. I'd have rather played Michigan there.
--1) 1998-2013 =
16--2) 2011 + 2006 + 2004 + 2002 =
4
If it makes you feel better, the RPIForecast computer gives us unconditional chances (http://www.rpiforecast.com/tourneyodds.html (http://www.rpiforecast.com/tourneyodds.html)):
1) a 12.7% chance of winning, or around 1 in 8 (better than SDSU vs. Michigan, for those who mistakenly would rather have drawn them)
2) a 3.8% chance of winning again (Sweet 16), or around 1 in 25 (better than UCLA or Colorado St)
3) a 0.5% chance at the Elite 8, or 1 in 200 (the same as Temple).
4) a 1 in 210,280 chance of winning it all, or 53rd best even though we were given the 56th seed.
(Montana has a 1 in 340,290,000 chance, or OVER SIXTEEN HUNDRED TIMES WORSE THAN US, for those of us me & chef that are still
(http://static.giantbomb.com/uploads/scale_small/0/4608/1049228-231_1.jpg)
Also given on the same link at the bottom: CONDITIONAL probabilities.
QuoteCONDITIONAL probabilities represent the chance that a team reaches a round GIVEN THAT IT REACHED THE PREVIOUS ROUND.
We look like so:
Valparaiso 14 MW 100.0 12.7 29.9 13.4 8.9 12.9 8.1 --(100% chance we're in the dance.)
--aforementioned 12.7% chance we win Rd 1 ("2") (worse than Harvard; all other % are understood to be better than everyone below us)
--
29.9% chance we go to Sweet 16 if we beat MSU (same as UNLV)
--
13.4% chance we go to Elite 8 if we won S16 (better than Oklahoma)
--
8.9% chance we go to Final 4 if we won E8 (better than Bucknell)
--
12.9% chance we go to NC if we won regional final (better than
ELEVEN schools seeded higher than us)
--
8.1% chance we win NC if we won national semi (better than four schools seeded higher than us)
so "console one another with these words."
Computers like us more than a bunch of old biased white dudes.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on March 18, 2013, 05:52:23 AM
--2) 2011 + 2006 + 2004 + 2002 = 4
Argh! Wikipedia has 2011 as a "second round" loss. Thanks for the correction.
Quote from: agibson on March 18, 2013, 06:36:41 AM"second round"
I'm totally with you on how grade inflation makes the four games the "first round" and thirty-two the "second", though.
LINK DUMP
DetNews:"Reeling Michigan State can't help but notice its path is similar to 2000"http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20130318/OPINION03/303180346#ixzz2NtIiUCF9 (http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20130318/OPINION03/303180346#ixzz2NtIiUCF9)
QuoteFor all their success, Sunday marked just the third time in a dozen years the Spartans earned a top-16 seeding.
...
There is no doubt Michigan State has the talent to make a deep run, with its interior strength and a top-10 defense. But there's also no hiding the Spartans' flaws: They give away too many possessions — don't worry, Memphis gives away even more — and they don't shoot the 3 all that well.
And this time of year, if you're guilty of the former — Michigan State ranks 209th nationally in turnover percentage — it sure helps if you can do the latter, erasing a big deficit with less effort. Izzo's team shoots just 34.4 percent from behind the arc — 137th in the country — and the last eight games is hitting fewer than 30 percent of its 3-point attempts.
It doesn't help, either, that the Spartans' best marksman is playing with a bum shoulder or two. Harris aggravated his left shoulder again at the Big Ten tournament in Chicago this weekend. And while he shrugged off a question about the injury Sunday — "I still feel pretty good right now," he said — his coach honestly couldn't.
Five on five: Michigan State vs. Valparaisohttp://www.detroitnews.com/article/20130318/SPORTS0202/303180362/1004/ (http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20130318/SPORTS0202/303180362/1004/)
MSU:
1) turnover tale (MSU 14-1 when turning it over less than opponent)
2) appling's a-game
3) harris hurting
4) payne soaring
5) close to home
VU:
1) opening round woes
2) familiarity (apparently a game in 2000 + BWood = "familiarity")
3) common foes (uh-oh)
4) on the Horizon
5) school record for wins
Freephttp://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/gallery?Site=C4&Date=20130317&Category=SPORTS07&ArtNo=303170809&Ref=PH&Profile=1359 (http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/gallery?Site=C4&Date=20130317&Category=SPORTS07&ArtNo=303170809&Ref=PH&Profile=1359)
interesting "meet valpo" photo gallery :)
Michigan State will start NCAA run at the Palace against Valparaiso
http://www.freep.com/article/20130317/SPORTS07/130317046/Michigan-State-will-start-NCAA-run-at-the-Palace-against-Valparaiso (http://www.freep.com/article/20130317/SPORTS07/130317046/Michigan-State-will-start-NCAA-run-at-the-Palace-against-Valparaiso)
QuoteAnd the Spartans have a brief, unhappy history as a No. 3 seed. MSU was a No. 3 once before, in 1995, losing to No. 14 seed Weber State in the first round in Jud Heathcote's last game as head coach.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on March 18, 2013, 06:53:18 AMMSU was a No. 3 once before, in 1995, losing to No. 14 seed Weber State in the first round in Jud Heathcote's last game as head coach.
Nice! I missed it - didn't look before Izzo.
Fun to see the Detroit press looking past us, to Memphis.
_Maybe_ Izzo did just a little bit also, in calling us a formidable foe "to start out with".
Quote from: HC on March 17, 2013, 09:46:13 PMWHo is actually going?
*Raises Hand*
Bought tickets on stubhub last night. $350 for main floor...both sessions Thursday and Saturday. Looking forward to a fun couple days in Detroit...and by that I mean I'll be spending my free time in Windsor...
Detroit isn't bad just stay away from the East side 7 mile.
Nice radio interview with Valpo Head Coach Bryce Drew on sports talk radio station "The Score" WSCR 670am in Chicago from last evening.
http://chicago.cbslocal.com/audio/986-670-the-score-interviews/?utm_medium=dl&utm_campaign=670-the-score-interviews#986 (http://chicago.cbslocal.com/audio/986-670-the-score-interviews/?utm_medium=dl&utm_campaign=670-the-score-interviews#986)
Quote from: vufan75 on March 18, 2013, 11:42:30 AM
Nice radio interview with Valpo Head Coach Bryce Drew on sports talk radio station "The Score" WSCR 670am in Chicago from last evening.
http://chicago.cbslocal.com/audio/986-670-the-score-interviews/?utm_medium=dl&utm_campaign=670-the-score-interviews#986 (http://chicago.cbslocal.com/audio/986-670-the-score-interviews/?utm_medium=dl&utm_campaign=670-the-score-interviews#986)
Jukin' and jivin' and side-steppin' touchy questions with the best of 'em ;)
Just a quick note to say good luck to Valpo in the Dance. Its great you're playing the Palace and I hope many of you plan to attend.
I, for one, am rooting for you against MSU. Horizon League pride. I feel many of the UDM fans will be rooting for you also.
Play well and play your game, down back down and beat Sparty.
Good Luck To The Crusaders!!!
I think everyone will find this information interesting. ESPN has Montana's Non-Conf SOS was 24th in the nation. Ours was 225th! If you look at the teams they played, it doesn't look to be that much harder than ours. They played Colorado State, Idaho, San Diego, BYU, San Fransico, and South Dakota St. They also played a couple of non-D1 schools.
New Mexico was tougher than Colorado State, St. Louis was tougher than BYU, and Murray St. on the road probably pretty close to the same as SDSU as far as chances of winning goes. I would say San Diego and Nebraska/Kent State are about even. Idaho and San Fransico would have been wins for us, just like IUPUI and IPFW were. Just think about it... Had we played their schedule, our record would not be any worse, in fact, it might be better. A 24th ranked non-conf schedule would have dropped our RPI down into the 11 seeed range. However, it is crazy because I don't think theirs was any harder than ours? In fact, I think ours might have been harder. I think we need to drop some crap teams from our schedule and play a few D2 schools instead?!?! Thoughts.
Quote from: SanityLost17 on March 18, 2013, 01:52:19 PM24th ranked non-conf schedule would have dropped our RPI down into the 11 seeed range. However, it is crazy because I don't think theirs was any harder than ours?
Had nothing to do with OOC scheduling. It had everything to do with geographic location. Nothing we can do about it. It's a broken process.
I'm apparently cool now (http://www.midmajormadness.com/2013-ncaa-tournament/2013/3/18/4117680/2013-ncaa-tournament-preview-valparaiso-michigan-state) and got to do a preview for the Valpo-MSU game. I'm pissed about their seed. I'm pissed about the team they got, but damn it if I'm asked to do a respectable journalism piece I'll do my damnedest to make it sound like I'm not that pissed.
In my opinion we didn't get shafted on seed as badly as we got shafted on the team we're playing. We're easily the best of the 14 seeds. MSU or New Mexico are the best 3 seeds. I don't get why the top 3 and 14 seeds would face each other. We should be in Lexington against Marquette, which sets up a potential second round match up against BUTLER! Damn it bracketmakers, you should have listened to Tom Thibodeau: DO. YOUR. JOB.
Spot
Quote from: Kyle321n on March 18, 2013, 01:57:06 PM
I'm apparently cool now (http://www.midmajormadness.com/2013-ncaa-tournament/2013/3/18/4117680/2013-ncaa-tournament-preview-valparaiso-michigan-state) and got to do a preview for the Valpo-MSU game. I'm pissed about their seed. I'm pissed about the team they got, but damn it if I'm asked to do a respectable journalism piece I'll do my damnedest to make it sound like I'm not that pissed.
In my opinion we didn't get shafted on seed as badly as we got shafted on the team we're playing. We're easily the best of the 14 seeds. MSU or New Mexico are the best 3 seeds. I don't get why the top 3 and 14 seeds would face each other. We should be in Lexington against Marquette, which sets up a potential second round match up against BUTLER! Damn it bracketmakers, you should have listened to Tom Thibodeau: DO. YOUR. JOB.
Spot on analysis on all counts.
It's not a very deep analysis.
But, Luke Winn writing for si.com likes us.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/-college-basketball-mens-tournament/news/20130317/2013-selection-sunday-ncaa-tournament/?sct=hp_t11_a1&eref=sihp (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/-college-basketball-mens-tournament/news/20130317/2013-selection-sunday-ncaa-tournament/?sct=hp_t11_a1&eref=sihp)
Quote
Upset I Like: No. 14 Valparaiso over No. 3 Michigan State. I know, it's in Auburn Hills, and I know, Tom Izzo is not the best coach to pick against in the tournament ... but the Spartans have been inconsistent offensively, and Valparaiso is the No. 1 most experienced team in the field of 68. The Crusaders start five seniors, their entire rotation consists of upperclassmen, and they're coached by miracle-worker Bryce Drew. That's a great Cinderella formula.
A Semi-Insane, Semi-Logical Classification of All 68 Tournament Teams (http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/54555/a-semi-insane-semi-logical-classification-of-all-68-tournament-teams)
We're #57 w/out much of an explanation, insight, or anything for that matter. Plus, they use a picture of Dority in our section of the article. Plus plus, the word ****ing is used a couple times for teams underneath our slot. Is Grantland ESPN's version of Bleacher Report or Deadspin, because this is lacking any substance. I only found out because my brother posted the link to my wall.
Quote from: KL31NY on March 18, 2013, 07:41:35 PMIs Grantland ESPN's version of Bleacher Report or Deadspin
yes, albeit with better writers.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on March 18, 2013, 08:23:50 PM
Quote from: KL31NY on March 18, 2013, 07:41:35 PMIs Grantland ESPN's version of Bleacher Report or Deadspin
yes, albeit with better writers.
Huh. I _only_ know the name because Charlie Pierce, regular guest comedian/commentator (and non-sports ignoramus) on NPR's "Only a Game" apparently writes there. Never actually visited.
Valparaiso is 'coming to win'
http://posttrib.suntimes.com/sports/18946693-556/mens-basketball-valparaiso-is-coming-to-win.html (http://posttrib.suntimes.com/sports/18946693-556/mens-basketball-valparaiso-is-coming-to-win.html)
My apologies if this has already been posted somewhere:
NCAA Selection Show Viewing Party
NCAA Selection Show Viewing Party (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUAZ0HiHpIg#ws)
Good MSU interview:
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=TlmNTpo6FBk (http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=TlmNTpo6FBk)
Or
Michigan State Basketball vs. Valpariaso Preview (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TlmNTpo6FBk#ws)
Quote from: Smj on March 19, 2013, 07:44:55 AMGood MSU interview
Bad MSU spelling
"Michigan State Basketball vs. Valpariaso Preview"
they will know how to spell it come thursday...
At the risk of being "redundant", as I've failing to search high and low as to whether or not this had beenposted previously, here is Coach Izzo's view on our team.
http://www.spartansportsnetwork.com/ (http://www.spartansportsnetwork.com/)
To listen to him, you'd think they were playing against Oscar Robertson and some other dudes. Oh, Erik Buggs has also got their attention.
Clearly, their plan is to stop Erik from getting into the lane (good luck with that) and to keep the ball out of Ryan's hands. No mention of Kevin or Will or any of the other guys who can score. They have noticed our experience and it also has their attention.
It was going to be tough for VU no matter where they ended up, so it's a bonus that's it's close enough for the fans to make the trek. They just need to play lose, have some fun, and see what happens. If this tournament has taught me anything over the years, it taught me that, anything can happen. It wasn't so long ago, when no one even heard of Gonzaga, or could tell you where Butler was from. Keep the faith, and enjoy the ride, no matter how long it last. Good luck Crusaiders. Make us proud!
Quote from: jack on March 19, 2013, 12:56:07 PMThey just need to play lose
Please, no!
Freudian slip, much ;)
LOL - Ummmm....Yeah......check that...."Loose" Thanks for the correction!
Quote from: vu72 on March 19, 2013, 12:42:40 PM
At the risk of being "redundant", as I've failing to search high and low as to whether or not this had beenposted previously, here is Coach Izzo's view on our team.
If I'm not sure whether something has already been posted, I just apologize up front for possibly being redundant. So far, that's been enough to keep our resident "masters of minutia" at bay. ;)
Quote from: truth219 on March 17, 2013, 06:31:40 PMWhat are the odds we can beat mich state...id say 1 out of 10
According to Massey, 21% http://www.masseyratings.com/team.php?t=8361&s=193573 (http://www.masseyratings.com/team.php?t=8361&s=193573)
According to Real Time RPI, we lose 62-59 http://realtimerpi.com/rpi_281_Men.html (http://realtimerpi.com/rpi_281_Men.html)
According to Sagarin, we lose by 13.
I'd say the odds are much better than when we last faced MSU in the NCAA tournament.
We've played Sparty twice, lost by an average of 28.5 (30 then 27). This year, we've played in this type of arena with this type of crowd, once: the Pit in Albuquerque.... scares the crap out of me...
anyway, my OTHER bracket has Miami winning it all. without a bunch of research, I believe we have a history of losing to the national champion one year before they win it all.
BTW... I'll be in the ballroom watching the game... got too much real work to do after being in Florida for a week...
Quote from: covufan on March 19, 2013, 03:42:26 PMAccording to Real Time RPI, we lose 62-59 http://realtimerpi.com/rpi_281_Men.html (http://realtimerpi.com/rpi_281_Men.html)
Wild! Something seems broken there.
Fairly consistent ~10.5 point dogs in Vegas?
Quote from: talksalot on March 19, 2013, 04:57:42 PMBTW... I'll be in the ballroom watching the game...
Too bad!
But, does that mean a viewing party at VU has been announced, or is in the works?
Thank you NCAA for scheduling the game smack dab in the middle of my squadron change of command ceremony... So unfortunately, I won't be in the chat. I plan on DVRing the game and watching it when I get home from work.
nerd, i'm in the same boat.
except replace "my squadron change of command ceremony" with "a funeral (not my own)"
and
instead of "DVRing" put "not knowing what the hell to do without a dvr any more"
Freep:Ex-Michigan State, -Valparaiso hoopster Brandon Wood has advice for both teamshttp://www.freep.com/article/20130319/SPORTS07/303190107/ (http://www.freep.com/article/20130319/SPORTS07/303190107/)
Efficient offense why Valparaiso can be potent vs. Michigan State (with videos)http://www.freep.com/article/20130319/SPORTS07/303190105/ (http://www.freep.com/article/20130319/SPORTS07/303190105/)
No, that doesn't mean "we can be potent with videos!" the lede:
QuoteApparently, Valparaiso is a combination of Indiana, Michigan and Wisconsin, with a forward who is a fusion of Ohio State's Deshaun Thomas and Indiana's Christian Watford, and a center who reminds Derrick Nix of Gonzaga star Kelly Olynyk.
...
There are valid reasons for concern, and not just on the Valpo side ...
"Boy, we've not played against anybody that's started five seniors ever, that I can remember," Izzo said. "This is unique."
...
And that's really the scariest thing about Valparaiso, the offensive efficiency. The Crusaders are sixth in the nation in field-goal percentage (48.9), share the ball and have multiple shooters other than Broekhoff.
"They're like Wisconsin," Payne said, "but they go a lot harder than Wisconsin."
It's no secret how the Spartans will defend the Crusaders. Izzo plays man-to-man defense at all times, though he may have to use a small lineup more often to allow Branden Dawson to guard Broekhoff for stretches.
It's less certain what Drew will do against MSU.
If we want to pull the upset I think the magic number is 10. We need to have less than 10 turnovers and hit more than 10 3s. A quick scan of the box scores tells me that it's been done at least once this season.
Also, I think we'll know how this game plays out in the first 5 minutes. If we miss a couple 3s, turn the ball over and allow MSU to run in the first 5 minutes we could be in for a long morning. I think the guys will give them a fight on Thursday though.
Quote from: wh on March 19, 2013, 01:27:19 PM
Quote from: vu72 on March 19, 2013, 12:42:40 PM
At the risk of being "redundant", as I've failing to search high and low as to whether or not this had beenposted previously, here is Coach Izzo's view on our team.
If I'm not sure whether something has already been posted, I just apologize up front for possibly being redundant. So far, that's been enough to keep our resident "masters of minutia" at bay. ;)
Do you know the singular of minutia? Minutia is plural for all who may not have known that.
Yes, please plan man-to-man defense against us, so that Buggs is not left wide open!
Quote from: bbtds on March 19, 2013, 11:54:50 PMDo you know the singular of minutia? Minutia is plural for all who may not have known that.
Actually, minutia IS singular...minutiae is the plural for all who may not possess a degree in dead languages.
(http://www.mememaker.net/static/images/memes/1559764.jpg)
(http://www.mememaker.net/static/images/memes/1559771.jpg)
Robert Morris - 59. The reigning 2012 NCAA Champion, University of the Commonwealth of Kentucky - 57. It CAN be done. And they rushed the court BTW.
It is really hard to imagine how Kentucky has fallen so far. With no disrespect to Robert Morris (maybe we should get them in the Horizon!), Kentucky found out how hard it is to play on the road in a small facility. Still, even without Noel, they have multiple McDonald All Americans.
Anyway, back to THE game. In reading the reports, it is interesting that they focus on how much bigger they are, without any reference to Bobby, who will not be pushed around. In that sense, we are much better than last year as last year our back-up was a skinny 6'8" guy who would much prefer to play on the outside.
It will be an interesting game...
Quote from: vu72 on March 20, 2013, 09:41:57 AMlast year our back-up was a skinny 6'8" guy who would much prefer to play on the outside.
who are you referring to? richie edwards was not skinny, and was fairly capable of holding his own down on the block.
While our seeding and matchup may not have been great, I feel we got a favorable position on this shirt at least...
(http://images.footballfanatics.com/FFImage/thumb.aspx?i=/productimages/_1167000/altimages/FF_1167507ALT5_xl.jpg&w=600)
http://www.footballfanatics.com/COLLEGE_Valparaiso_Crusaders/NCAA_2013_March_Madness_Final_Four_Mens_Basketball_Championship_Youth_68_Team_Ball_T-Shirt_-_White (http://www.footballfanatics.com/COLLEGE_Valparaiso_Crusaders/NCAA_2013_March_Madness_Final_Four_Mens_Basketball_Championship_Youth_68_Team_Ball_T-Shirt_-_White)
Quote from: vuweathernerd on March 20, 2013, 09:53:38 AM
Quote from: vu72 on March 20, 2013, 09:41:57 AMlast year our back-up was a skinny 6'8" guy who would much prefer to play on the outside.
who are you referring to? richie edwards was not skinny, and was fairly capable of holding his own down on the block.
[/b]
Well, he was compared to Bobby. Richie was way out of position playing the five. He is a natural 3 or 4.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on March 20, 2013, 06:40:14 AM
Quote from: bbtds on March 19, 2013, 11:54:50 PMDo you know the singular of minutia? Minutia is plural for all who may not have known that.
Actually, minutia IS singular...minutiae is the plural for all who may not possess a degree in dead languages.
(http://www.mememaker.net/static/images/memes/1559764.jpg)
I surrender. I apparently read this wrong.
mi·nu·ti·a (m-nsh-, -sh, -ny-)
n. pl. mi·nu·ti·ae (-sh-)
A small or trivial detail: "the minutiae of experimental and mathematical procedure" (Frederick Turner).
According to my local listings, the Michigan State and Valparaiso press conferences will be on the Big Ten Network starting at 11:50 CT TODAY! It'll be MSU at 11:50am, VU at 12:20pm, then repeating for the following two hours.
Valpo can really only play on big at a time where Michigan State will likely play two. This could play to Valpo's advantage if Broekhoff can get open looks off of screens that Michigan State big men don't want to run around. Of course, MSU can probably counter with a smaller lineup.
I think that Kentucky lost because they didn't care about the NIT. It also didn't help that they had to play on the road (since Lexington was hosting a regional). In general, I think that teams that have high turnover from season to season will logically have huge performance variance from one year to the next.
Here was my prophetic quote before the Green Bay end of the regular season game:
Quote from: a3uge on February 28, 2013, 10:15:59 AM
I feel like Valpo does a pretty good job of winning games down the stretch that don't really have a bearing on things... The Missouri State and EKU bracketbusters... the game vs Butler last year. I know Valpo will be playing for pride, so I don't think they'll lay an egg, but I think the lack of pressure is almost good for Valpo. Valpo played loose during the EKU game and absolutely destroyed them.
In a weird way, Valpo is kind of in the same situation. True, if they lose, the season's over, and so are the careers of Broekhoff, Buggs, KVW, Kenney, and Bogan. But there's no overbearing pressure on them to win. There's very little expectations for the team, so they can play loose knowing that they can walk out of the gym with their heads held up if they fight hard. They don't have much to lose and their goal is to be a spoiler, not to make a championship run (like MSU's goal).
If Valpo shoots well, getting killed on the boards might not matter. Michigan State might get 3,4 changes to score on certain possessions, but that can be evened out by great 3-point shooting.
Valpo is 40th in the country in 3-point shooting and 6th in FG%. In the regular season Green Bay game I mentioned, Valpo was 60% FG and 56% 3P. If they shoot with confidence, they can make a game out of it. In March, Valpo's been shooting the 3-ball at 43.1. Overall, we have two shooters over 40% and one at 39%. MSU, for comparison sake, has a March 3-point percentage of 31.5%. They recently struggled with their shot against Iowa. They have one shooter who doesn't attempt many 3's over 45%, and one shooter at 39.7%. The rest are below 32%.
So I think the key to any mid major knocking off a power team is great shooting. That's how Norfolk St got it done last year. Another key will be to get Michigan State into foul trouble, which I think can be done with KVW playing his style. I think HL refs get so used to Kevin drawing contact under the basket that they let it go. Hopefully we get a ticky-tack ref that Kevin can take advantage of down-low.
Quote from: a3uge on March 20, 2013, 01:00:41 PMHopefully we get a ticky-tack ref that Kevin can take advantage of down-low.
I've seen no ref in the tournament so far (okay, only 2 games in the Big Dance played as of yet) or any of the CIT, CBI or NIT games who has called it close. The only refs that have ruined a game are the Richmond/Charlotte refs in the A-10 tournament. It seems the refs are taking the position to let the players decide the games no matter how much physical play and hacking are going on.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on March 19, 2013, 07:08:06 PMFreep:
Ex-Michigan State, -Valparaiso hoopster Brandon Wood has advice for both teams
http://www.freep.com/article/20130319/SPORTS07/303190107/ (http://www.freep.com/article/20130319/SPORTS07/303190107/)
Was just thinking of Brandon and this game. Thanks for the link.
Quote from: bbtds on March 20, 2013, 03:36:44 PM
Quote from: a3uge on March 20, 2013, 01:00:41 PMHopefully we get a ticky-tack ref that Kevin can take advantage of down-low.
I've seen no ref in the tournament so far (okay, only 2 games in the Big Dance played as of yet) or any of the CIT, CBI or NIT games who has called it close. The only refs that have ruined a game are the Richmond/Charlotte refs in the A-10 tournament. It seems the refs are taking the position to let the players decide the games no matter how much physical play and hacking are going on.
Which is a good way to NOT let the players decide the game.
Quote from: covufan on March 20, 2013, 04:08:34 PM
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on March 19, 2013, 07:08:06 PMFreep:
Ex-Michigan State, -Valparaiso hoopster Brandon Wood has advice for both teams
http://www.freep.com/article/20130319/SPORTS07/303190107/ (http://www.freep.com/article/20130319/SPORTS07/303190107/)
Was just thinking of Brandon and this game. Thanks for the link.
Brandon is right - we can't be intimidated. I don't think with a senior starting lineup that we'll have that problem. We can win this game!
Quote from: VULB#62 on March 20, 2013, 07:22:32 AM
Robert Morris - 59. The reigning 2012 NCAA Champion, University of the Commonwealth of Kentucky - 57. It CAN be done. And they rushed the court BTW.
Wow. The way to show the NCAA committee that you belonged is to win the NIT, not lose a first round game, at home, as a #1 seed. If these two played six more games, three at each home floor, I don't see Robert Morris winning another. Good for them and basketball!
Quote from: StlVUFan on March 20, 2013, 04:12:31 PM
Quote from: bbtds on March 20, 2013, 03:36:44 PM
Quote from: a3uge on March 20, 2013, 01:00:41 PMHopefully we get a ticky-tack ref that Kevin can take advantage of down-low.
I've seen no ref in the tournament so far (okay, only 2 games in the Big Dance played as of yet) or any of the CIT, CBI or NIT games who has called it close. The only refs that have ruined a game are the Richmond/Charlotte refs in the A-10 tournament. It seems the refs are taking the position to let the players decide the games no matter how much physical play and hacking are going on.
Which is a good way to NOT let the players decide the game.
I beg to differ. It does let the players decide the game just not in the way you want the game to be decided. Both players can play physically if they know the ref is not going to call it close. It does change the game into a more physical game which lets the players determine the outcome of the game. That may not be your desire because you want to see basic basketball--shooting, passing, dribbling--instead of one players ability to out muscle another player.
Quote from: bbtds on March 20, 2013, 04:48:37 PM
Quote from: StlVUFan on March 20, 2013, 04:12:31 PM
Quote from: bbtds on March 20, 2013, 03:36:44 PM
Quote from: a3uge on March 20, 2013, 01:00:41 PMHopefully we get a ticky-tack ref that Kevin can take advantage of down-low.
I've seen no ref in the tournament so far (okay, only 2 games in the Big Dance played as of yet) or any of the CIT, CBI or NIT games who has called it close. The only refs that have ruined a game are the Richmond/Charlotte refs in the A-10 tournament. It seems the refs are taking the position to let the players decide the games no matter how much physical play and hacking are going on.
Which is a good way to NOT let the players decide the game.
I beg to differ. It does let the players decide the game just not in the way you want the game to be decided. Both players can play physically if they know the ref is not going to call it close. It does change the game into a more physical game which lets the players determine the outcome of the game. That may not be your desire because you want to see basic basketball--shooting, passing, dribbling--instead of one players ability to out muscle another player.
Wrong. I want fouls that are committed to be called. If they are not, then the referees are deciding the game.
What you mean to say is you don't want fouls called that aren't legitimate fouls. Neither do I. I wish just once somebody would tell the truth in this never-ending debate.
If a player commits a legitimate foul and the referee calls it, the player has decided the outcome, not the referee.
I am very much looking forward to this game, and I think that our shots will be on. I really hope that they don't sag off of Buggs, as that will make it so much better to watch. If they are playing a tight man-to-man defense, I think it can be done. I predict a tie going into the last possession of the game, which we will have. Rowdy drives down the lane and shoots a fadeaway jumper to win it :).
Prediction with them playing on Buggs:
Valpo 77
MSU 75
If they sag on Buggs:
MSU 81
Valpo 68
AUSSIE AUSSIE AUSSIE! OI OI OI! http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/ncaa-tournament/mens-tournament/brokehoff-hopes-for-chance-to-face-former-australian-teammates/article_8f84b1d3-7674-53a6-a925-9a8ba7da4dd7.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/ncaa-tournament/mens-tournament/brokehoff-hopes-for-chance-to-face-former-australian-teammates/article_8f84b1d3-7674-53a6-a925-9a8ba7da4dd7.html)
Quote from: valpotx on March 20, 2013, 05:51:54 PM
I am very much looking forward to this game, and I think that our shots will be on. I really hope that they don't sag off of Buggs, as that will make it so much better to watch. If they are playing a tight man-to-man defense, I think it can be done. I predict a tie going into the last possession of the game, which we will have. Rowdy drives down the lane and shoots a fadeaway jumper to win it :).
Prediction with them playing on Buggs:
Valpo 77
MSU 75
If they sag on Buggs:
MSU 81
Valpo 68
I think the Erik sagging defense is more of a gimmick within the HL, run by opponents that feel we have an advantage down low with Kevin or at the wing with Ryan that they cannot otherwise overcome. I doubt if MSU feels that they are overmatched by either Kevin or Ryan. Remember, Billy Donavan commented after the championship game that their game plan was to make Erik Buggs beat them - but the irony was he in fact did beat them. I'm sure MSU has watched plenty of film from that game, as well as other recent games. Lastly, New Mexico and St. Louis - both very good teams - played Erik straight up and came away with double digit wins.
You are a little bit off our 6'10 PF Adreian Payne shoots about 1-2 3's per game so it's not like he doesn't shoot many. Gary Harris our SG is shooting 41% from 3 and has been our most consistent shooter all year. He has been injured a lot though so whenever he isn't shooting very well like against Ohio state recently I just assume his shoulder popped out again. Also our backup PG Travis Trice is a pretty good shooter about 40% on the year. Don't forget about Russell Byrd though he's the best shooter on the team.
Quote from: wh on March 20, 2013, 07:12:50 PMI think the Erik sagging defense is more of a gimmick within the HL, run by opponents that feel we have an advantage down low with Kevin or at the wing with Ryan that they cannot otherwise overcome. I doubt if MSU feels that they are overmatched by either Kevin or Ryan. Remember, Billy Donavan commented after the championship game that their game plan was to make Erik Buggs beat them - but the irony was he in fact did beat them. I'm sure MSU has watched plenty of film from that game, as well as other recent games. Lastly, New Mexico and St. Louis - both very good teams - played Erik straight up and came away with double digit wins.
I'll slightly disagree, because SLU didn't play Buggs straight up. This is a tweet from the HL's Bill Potter:
Bill Potter@billpotter_HL2 Dec
When Valpo gets into offense set, SLU puts 6'8" Cory Remekun on him, but parks him in middle. SLU not chasing him off screens at all. #HLMBB
I watched that game and agree with Bill's assessment. The difference is that WSU's Billy Donlon tried doing that with a guard, instead of using a bigger defender like SLU did. The obvious advantage of using a big is that he can contest layups if Buggs drives AND he is available as a help defender in the paint against Valpo's other players. The WSU guard sagging off Buggs could do neither of those.
I doubt MSU tries this, but if they wanted to, they could use Payne to "guard" Buggs. This would a.) eliminate the potential Payne on Broekhoff mismatch on the perimeter by allowing either Dawson or Harris to chase Ryan through screens, and b.) allow Payne, the team's leading shot blocker, to roam the lane and help on KVW or be available if Broekhoff tries to post up a smaller defender. :twocents: It's not MSU's style to do this, but I guess we'll see tomorrow! Good luck!
Quote from: Spartan24 on March 20, 2013, 07:44:07 PMYou are a little bit off our 6'10 PF Adreian Payne shoots about 1-2 3's per game so it's not like he doesn't shoot many. Gary Harris our SG is shooting 41% from 3 and has been our most consistent shooter all year. He has been injured a lot though so whenever he isn't shooting very well like against Ohio state recently I just assume his shoulder popped out again. Also our backup PG Travis Trice is a pretty good shooter about 40% on the year. Don't forget about Russell Byrd though he's the best shooter on the team.
??? ? In Practices only, Byrd has shot poorly all season long in game situations. If we could just get Valpo to wear MSU's practice jersey Byrd would get a double / double. But sadly Valpo will wear game Jerseys, pencil in Byrd for 3 points, 3 Rebounds and 3 turnovers.
I was just kidding about that last part ;D
WSU put a bigger guy on Buggs in the 2nd half. It worked for a while.
From one of Oren's game day pieces
http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/ncaa-tournament/mens-tournament/wood-provides-bond-between-valparaiso-and-michigan-state/article_1dd1853c-a662-5352-9983-2ecc314b6c6d.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/ncaa-tournament/mens-tournament/wood-provides-bond-between-valparaiso-and-michigan-state/article_1dd1853c-a662-5352-9983-2ecc314b6c6d.html)
Quote
Wood isn't the only Michigan State player with ties to the Crusaders. Sophomore walk-on Keenan Wetzel attended Valparaiso two years ago but was never cleared to practice with the team. Wetzel transferred to East Lansing last season and has been a valued member of the scout team for the last two years.
"Everyone on our team respects those guys," Wetzel said. "I'm friends with a couple of them and there is no way that we're going to overlook them."
Had anyone heard of this Wetzel guy? What's the story?
Quote from: agibson on March 20, 2013, 09:36:19 PM
From one of Oren's game day pieces
http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/ncaa-tournament/mens-tournament/wood-provides-bond-between-valparaiso-and-michigan-state/article_1dd1853c-a662-5352-9983-2ecc314b6c6d.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/ncaa-tournament/mens-tournament/wood-provides-bond-between-valparaiso-and-michigan-state/article_1dd1853c-a662-5352-9983-2ecc314b6c6d.html)
Quote
Wood isn't the only Michigan State player with ties to the Crusaders. Sophomore walk-on Keenan Wetzel attended Valparaiso two years ago but was never cleared to practice with the team. Wetzel transferred to East Lansing last season and has been a valued member of the scout team for the last two years.
"Everyone on our team respects those guys," Wetzel said. "I'm friends with a couple of them and there is no way that we're going to overlook them."
Had anyone heard of this Wetzel guy? What's the story?
I do remember the name, he was supposed to be a pretty good walk-on a couple of years ago and then disappeared from the roster never to be heard from (until now) again. I don't know the story other than he was never cleared to practice and evidently transferred to Michigan State.
Why so many fans who know Valpo's offensive style inside and out continue to provide detailed observations about how MSU could beat us defensively on this VERY public message forum is beyond me. Are you a fan or a scout for MSU?
GenXer, probably because a) the MSU coaches should have better things to do than read our message board and b) if they are earning their inflated salaries they have already figured these things out from watching video.
I agree with you to the extent that SSSSHHH in general until the game is being played, though. It's a bit like telling Verlander, "hey, man, do you know you have a no-hitter going? ...it's totally sweet"
Quote from: HC on March 20, 2013, 09:09:31 PM
WSU put a bigger guy on Buggs in the 2nd half. It worked for a while.
Good point, HC. They used 6'2" Bramanti in the first half and I think they tried 6'6" Young in the second. Is that right?
I wasn't surprised that Crews employed that strategy in the SLU game because he did the same thing in Evansville - Butler games in the early '90's. He would assign 7'1" Sasha Hupmann to Butler's Tim Bowen (a 5'9" guard very similar to Buggs) and dare Bowen to shoot from 15 feet or beyond. Driving (like Buggs did successfully against WSU) wasn't an option because a seven-footer was planted in the middle of the lane.
Not sure what Izzo will do. Very similar situation to the MSU-Butler Final Four matchup when Butler had a point guard (Nored) who wasn't a perimeter threat. I should know how they played it then, but I can't really remember.
Friends, I wanted to ask for your advice/help.
Briefly: I no longer have a DVR. I must play a funeral at 1 PM Eastern tomorrow. This is a conundrum.
Does anyone know of any online sources that are not live streams? I.e., a pausable feed, like the B1G Network has with football games? I know how to get live streams, but obviously that is no help.
Watching during the funeral is out. No choir loft, plus I often cheer loudly at inopportune moments (such as baby sleeping) so I am hardly dependable.
Plus I plan on doing a lot of cheering :)
any ideas?
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on March 20, 2013, 09:56:39 PM
Friends, I wanted to ask for your advice/help.
Briefly: I no longer have a DVR. I must play a funeral at 1 PM Eastern tomorrow. This is a conundrum.
Does anyone know of any online sources that are not live streams? I.e., a pausable feed, like the B1G Network has with football games? I know how to get live streams, but obviously that is no help.
Watching during the funeral is out. No choir loft, plus I often cheer loudly at inopportune moments (such as baby sleeping) so I am hardly dependable.
Plus I plan on doing a lot of cheering :)
any ideas?
I feel your pain. No ideas. Question: are you part of a military honor guard? I work for the military. Perhaps you can PM me on the subject. Good luck tomorrow!
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on March 20, 2013, 09:51:38 PMGenXer, probably because a) the MSU coaches should have better things to do than read our message board and b) if they are earning their inflated salaries they have already figured these things out from watching video. I agree with you to the extent that SSSSHHH in general until the game is being played, though. It's a bit like telling Verlander, "hey, man, do you know you have a no-hitter going? ...it's totally sweet"
Sort of. I saw a post a few back that completely described in great detail how I would go about defending Valpo. It wasn't necessarily just "play off Buggs", which everyone knows by now. I'm just wondering why anyone would think it was a good idea to bring this philosophy out on a Valpo fan forum the night before the biggest game in 9 years... Unless they aren't a Valpo fan?
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on March 20, 2013, 09:56:39 PM
Friends, I wanted to ask for your advice/help.
Briefly: I no longer have a DVR. I must play a funeral at 1 PM Eastern tomorrow. This is a conundrum.
Does anyone know of any online sources that are not live streams? I.e., a pausable feed, like the B1G Network has with football games? I know how to get live streams, but obviously that is no help.
Watching during the funeral is out. No choir loft, plus I often cheer loudly at inopportune moments (such as baby sleeping) so I am hardly dependable.
Plus I plan on doing a lot of cheering :)
any ideas?
I'd check out CBSSports.com. It's already showing a replay available for the JMU-Long Island game played a few hours ago. You should be able to catch a replay of the Valpo game there ... unfortunately, you'll need to navigate through their main webpage to get there ... SPOILER ALERT!!!
FWIW, I'm now watching the JMU-LIU replay just two hours after it finished through CBSSports.com ... I hope this is available to you tomorrow.
What's wrong with
http://www.ncaa.com/march-madness (http://www.ncaa.com/march-madness)
?
There's the down side that it's a little hard to get the replay started without seeing the score. But, if you can tolerate that, it might be OK...
I think, in past seasons, the replays were even up fairly promptly.
I doubt I'll be able to watch the game "properly" during the day. But, I suspect I will have it on now and then, in the background, etc. And devote more attention to it if it gets interesting.
I'll have to come back to it in more detail later... but it might be Saturday night :(
Quote from: ValpoGenXer on March 20, 2013, 09:47:10 PM
Why so many fans who know Valpo's offensive style inside and out continue to provide detailed observations about how MSU could beat us defensively on this VERY public message forum is beyond me. Are you a fan or a scout for MSU?
Just when you think you've heard it all...
Please tell me you're not serious about anything you just said.
If you don't think MSU assistants read this board you are delusional. It's not like Valpo is a known commodity to a B1G - they'll take any scouting they can get. That's just a fact.
Quote from: agibson on March 20, 2013, 10:16:17 PM
What's wrong with
http://www.ncaa.com/march-madness (http://www.ncaa.com/march-madness)
?
That's what I was referring to, since the links on CBSSports.com take you there. I agree that it will be hard to get through all those links without seeing the score, so maybe LaPorte could have a friend cue the replay up for him.
Quote from: ValpoGenXer on March 20, 2013, 10:30:37 PM
If you don't think MSU assistants read this board you are delusional. It's not like Valpo is a known commodity to a B1G - they'll take any scouting they can get. That's just a fact.
FWIW, I've received several calls from Dane Fife, but I recognized his number and let them go to voicemail. :-X
Quote from: zvillehaze on March 20, 2013, 11:12:56 PM
Quote from: ValpoGenXer on March 20, 2013, 10:30:37 PM
If you don't think MSU assistants read this board you are delusional. It's not like Valpo is a known commodity to a B1G - they'll take any scouting they can get. That's just a fact.
FWIW, I've received several calls from Dane Fife, but I recognized his number and let them go to voicemail. :-X
We all appreciate that. ;)
You know, I was just thinking...One time earlier in the season after a particularly poor shooting game, I commented that I don't know why anyone would ever play anything but zone against us. You don't suppose Dane read that, do you? :)
Quote from: ValpoGenXer on March 20, 2013, 10:30:37 PM
If you don't think MSU assistants read this board you are delusional. It's not like Valpo is a known commodity to a B1G - they'll take any scouting they can get. That's just a fact.
AHEEMMMEMEEEMMM...
It's really important that Michigan State guard Buggs very closely on the perimeter, as he is our best 3-point shooter. It's also best to foul Broekhoff at every chance because he's a poor free-throw shooter. Don't foul Buggs, he's like a 95% free throw shooter. Leave Bogan open for the 3-pointer because he can't buy a bucket from out there. Finally, Van Wijk can't make a layup to save his life. Force the ball down low to him and back off, because he'll definitely miss those open layups when given a chance.
Also, it might be wise to call timeouts periodically after a Michigan State run because Drew rarely uses his timeouts and the MSU players will be very gassed at that point. It's a proven stat that when Bryce doesn't use a timeout in the entire second half, the Crusaders are 22-0. So call timeouts often.
Crusaders focused on business
http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/ncaa-tournament/crusaders-focused-on-business/article_f159418e-d2d1-5e78-be9f-93e3475bc96d.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/ncaa-tournament/crusaders-focused-on-business/article_f159418e-d2d1-5e78-be9f-93e3475bc96d.html)
Wood provides bond between Valparaiso and Michigan State
http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/ncaa-tournament/mens-tournament/wood-provides-bond-between-valparaiso-and-michigan-state/article_1dd1853c-a662-5352-9983-2ecc314b6c6d.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/ncaa-tournament/mens-tournament/wood-provides-bond-between-valparaiso-and-michigan-state/article_1dd1853c-a662-5352-9983-2ecc314b6c6d.html)
Crusaders face large task against big, physical Spartans
http://posttrib.suntimes.com/sports/18993142-556/crusaders-face-large-task-against-big-physical-spartans.html (http://posttrib.suntimes.com/sports/18993142-556/crusaders-face-large-task-against-big-physical-spartans.html)
VU glad 'business trip' closer to home than in previous years
http://posttrib.suntimes.com/sports/18993801-556/vu-glad-business-trip-closer-to-home-than-in-previous-years.html (http://posttrib.suntimes.com/sports/18993801-556/vu-glad-business-trip-closer-to-home-than-in-previous-years.html)
http://nyti.ms/148yQKX (http://nyti.ms/148yQKX)
Does that link work? New York Times piece on the team.
Quote from: agibson on March 21, 2013, 12:04:41 AMNew York Times piece on the team.
QuoteAsked this week if he would ever leave Valparaiso, Drew said, "I'm very, very happy being here."
;D
Thank you to everyone for the suggestions. If someone happens to think of it, I'd appreciate a PM with a link to the game to avoid spoilers, but I don't want anyone to have to compromise their own viewing experience. Thanks.
EDIT: maybe won't be able to without a cable subscription? oh well, serves me right.
AXE body spray trolling MSU:
(http://oi45.tinypic.com/28844kn.jpg)
(http://i50.tinypic.com/11kv2g9.png)
and the piece o'resistance:
(http://i49.tinypic.com/25uru5k.png)
(one Michigan fan comments, "maybe not a good idea to alienate half your clientele", which, hilarious)
also, Luke Winn, who's been banging the national drum for the upset as loudly as anyone, placing us #9 on picks to spring the upset:
(http://i48.tinypic.com/1608umq.png)
The replays of the play-in games, and even their live broadcasts, didn't seem to require a login.
But there was a login button , so maybe that changes to day.
Unfortunately, it's all one big flash app. So, I'm not sure it's possible to get a direct link to a game.
You'd have to get someone to use your computer to cue (queue?) it for you.
Funny story this morning, which shows how far and wide "the shot" has gone. I work at a military base in Houston. I drive up to the security gate and the guard says "how you doin"? I say "terrific, the NCAA tourney starts today and my alma mater, Valparaiso, opens it up against Michigan State". He looks a little surprised, apparently not being a huge basketball fan. He then says "oh yeah, what ever happened to that guy Drew" (while saying this he puts is arms up as if to take a shot) I tell him he's now the coach, and he says (surprised) "so he took over for the father?" and I say "oh yeah, don't bet against Valpo"!! As I drive off into the sunset, eh, parking lot.
Does the fact that we have BCS conference transfers on the team help with the "not being intimidated" factor for this team? Bogan, Boggs and Capo played against these types of teams during the conference seasons so hopefully they can impart to the rest of the guys that we have no reason to play scared. One hour and 10 min to tip off and I have already chewed my nails down to the cuticle...
On your feet...
Valparaiso's Fight Song (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCAJercEhhI#)
Good luck boys!
Quote from: crusaderjoe on March 21, 2013, 10:08:59 AM
On your feet...
Valparaiso's Fight Song (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCAJercEhhI#)
Good luck boys!
That's the ring tone on my phone! ;D
By the way, no WAKE radio app today, darn it. Proprietary reasons, according to their website.
Go get'm Valpo!
Izzo's wearing Valpo colors on his tie? What the heck, I'll predict 63-62 good guys.
Just a reminder, the chat room is open: http://www.valpofanzone.com/forum/index.php?board=13.0 (http://www.valpofanzone.com/forum/index.php?board=13.0)
Have had some good looks but are playing scared. When was the last time you saw Ryan throw up an air ball?
Ryan looks scared. He's playing horrible and therefore there is no way we can stay in this game. We need our best player to have at least an average game. His a air ball and turnover underneath our basketball for an easy dunk are the first...
Quote from: StlVUFan on March 21, 2013, 10:27:20 AM
By the way, no WAKE radio app today, darn it. Proprietary reasons, according to their website.
That really sucks.
22% fg shooting won't get it done. Everyone cold.
Starting to slip away. Ryan has to start sinking some shots. I was hoping that the free throws would spark him.
Stop adjusting everything when going to the rim or shooting. If you adjust your shot you don't get the call.
This is what happens when valpo plays a good team...they crumble. It happens time and time again.
Valpo's only shot at this one was to hit their shots. They can't miss that many point blank shots from underneath and have a prayer at hanging with MS.
Got to come out with a purpose in the second half, and make it respectable.
It's going to sound ridiculous, but we're playing really well aside from the shooting issues. Not a lot of turnovers, good patient play, open looks, hanging very tough on defense, lots of energy, active feet, active hands. I'm not a Drew apologist, but I think he did a really good job getting his guys fired up to play. The shots just didn't fall. A normal shooting day, and we trail by a basket. An above average shooting day, and we're sitting at half time with a lead.
Yes, missing shots has been the key. And I agree wtih Rink that we looked good otherwise.
Not sure why we passed up so many open 3's. Buggs should not be trying to drive and kick against MSU. Just doesn't work.
When they started hitting 3s it was over. I think they need to just start bombing from deep and that increases the number of possessions and the number of long rebounds that they can get with smaller size. MSU got too many 2nd chance points early but size can't be taught or done with hustle.
I think you are watching a different game than me. Forced shots, no fluidity in the offensive, tentative......
The team looks scared and beat and not fired up.
20 points in 24 minutes of basketball. Uggg...........very frustrating.
This should be an audition for Ryan for his professional career. I'm afraid that his chances to play in the NBA are fading.
Are you kidding me! Can we miss any more shots? We need to deck somebody, Kenney should have gotten on the floor for that loose ball.
Finally, Bobby and Kevin on the court together! I have been calling for this since midway through the first half.
Deer in the headlights look should not be there with the maturity this team should have.
This is embarrassing.
This isn't fun. but at least it's not as frustrating as the first game against Arizona. And with four stations doing the broadcasting, we'll be able to see the end of the game.
Halftime 35-18. Yikes...
Tough game for KVW. Sorry to see him end his career on a sour note.
Why didn't we bomb away (esp. Kenney) and full court press when we got within 15. Odds of catching them would be 200:1 but hey it's your one shot in life to get a memory.
If Buggs had made his 2 intentional foul FTs and Ryan hit his open 3 we come within 10 with 8+ minutes.
Why leave anything on the court?
Quote from: crusadermoe on March 21, 2013, 01:15:40 PM
Why didn't we bomb away (esp. Kenney) and full court press when we got within 15. Odds of catching them would be 200:1 but hey it's your one shot in life to get a memory.
If Buggs had made his 2 intentional foul FTs and Ryan hit his open 3 we come within 10 with 8+ minutes.
Why leave anything on the court?
That was a series of big missed shots as the door had a crack in it. Kudos to the team for not giving up till the final whistle. 65-54 is better than 70-35 and for that, I am grateful. Congratulations Crusaders on a very good season. Seniors, way to play with dignity to the end. Let's build on it for next year!
Quote from: crusadermoe on March 21, 2013, 01:15:40 PM
Why didn't we bomb away (esp. Kenney) and full court press when we got within 15. Odds of catching them would be 200:1 but hey it's your one shot in life to get a memory.
If Buggs had made his 2 intentional foul FTs and Ryan hit his open 3 we come within 10 with 8+ minutes.
Why leave anything on the court?
And Kevin hit his layup...
Can't help but think we lost this game in a sense last year--in the HL final.
We played, not like the team in the nation with the most experience, but like tournament newbies. And I will always wonder if we'd gotten this out of our system last year, if we wouldn't have won our game this year.
Kind of like SophBryce getting blown out by Arizona, and then doing better each year thereafter.
Also, ladies and gentlemen, BEN FLIPPIN BOGGS!
FIFTEEN points in eleven minutes! 4-6, incl 3-4 downtown, 4-4 at the line...what does a guy have to do to get more PT around here?
Drew will have you guys in the tourney more years than not. Enjoyed my time on your board; hope to see you all again.
Terrible shooting effort. They gave us wide open looks throughout the game, and we missed way too many 3s/layups to compete against a top team. Good recovery in the end to lose by 11, even when they kept their starters in until 1:30 or so. Good career for those leaving us, and thank you for getting us back. Hopefully those coming in will get us past the first game in the coming years! Thank you Seniors for your efforts, and righting our basketball ship! :)
I will be hoping that MSU advances far into the tournament, as you can't hate Izzo. Other big programs are easy to hate, but not MSU
I'm as critical as anyone, and honestly I didn't see any signs of playing scared or "deer in headlights". I thought we played tough, confident, and looked like we belonged every step of the way. We even out-hustled them, IMO. But when shots don't fall and you have a size/speed/depth/skill disadvantage going in, there isn't much you can do. If we shoot to average, it's an extremely close game.
Actually, if they shoot to average, they may have won.
This is what was supposed to happen. I was hoping they'd show more poise in the first half, but it's easier said than done.
This is why Kampe plays as many of the Big Boys as he can, to try to prepare his team for this kind of a game. I dunno if it really works, but that's the theory.
Early on, I thought they kept us in it by their mistakes, though I could be wrong. That one play where MSU flubbed the dunk, Ryan came up with it, and then dished it right back to the home team to get the dunk right.
All in all, I think they tried their best to rise up to the challenge, but it's easy to talk about how your game plan when you step onto the Big Stage. It's another thing to actually do it.
Here's what never fails to amaze me: if I was one of Valpo players out there, I'd be an emotional wreck and you'd be able to tell it easily watching at home. How they keep their composure while their season is dying before their eyes is beyond me.
Hats off to them.
Quote from: rink on March 21, 2013, 01:34:07 PM
I'm as critical as anyone, and honestly I didn't see any signs of playing scared or "deer in headlights". I thought we played tough, confident, and looked like we belonged every step of the way. We even out-hustled them, IMO. But when shots don't fall and you have a size/speed/depth/skill disadvantage going in, there isn't much you can do. If we shoot to average, it's an extremely close game.
:thumbsup: :clap:
LaPorteAveApostle good point and I think you are right. If we would have gotten it out of system last year....
I've enjoyed watching this team but excited about the future. Next years Horizon League overall will be a better league.
Clearly we had SOME open looks that we missed and missed some bunnies too, but, those bunnies were attempted with HUGE guys in their face and those threes--most were defended very well. The biggest problem was one and done shot wise. I haven't seen us out rebounded like this maybe ever.
What a game for Erik. Unbelievable effort as he had to be dead tired. Why wasn't Will playing more?
Anyway, we finished the entire year not losing by more than 13 points to anyone. Very impressive. It will now be a very long off season. I'm starting the attidepressants tomorrow. :(
I feel we might have "bombed away" in the 2nd half if we had timeouts used better than Bryce used them. We were gassed during that "comeback", so hopefully in the offseason, Bryce learns how to manage time out use in future games.
Quote from: StlVUFan on March 21, 2013, 01:38:10 PM
This is why Kampe plays as many of the Big Boys as he can, to try to prepare his team for this kind of a game. I dunno if it really works, but that's the theory.
Hats off to them.
Izzo has always done the same thing. Some early season losses oft time pay dividends later on.
Once more, I applaud this special senior class, a great group of guys on and off the court. They brought Valpo back to the NCAA tournament, but the true impact might be felt in future years if the high profile brought about by their accomplishments results in strong recruiting classes and increased support for the basketball program.
In fact, we can already anticipate a large promising freshman group who should view the players in the picture below as models and inspiration. My thanks to the seniors: take a final bow and then hold your heads up high! :clap: :clap: :clap:
(http://i48.tinypic.com/33u4w2p.jpg)
Quote from: Chairback on March 21, 2013, 01:42:38 PMLaPorteAveApostle good point and I think you are right. If we would have gotten it out of system last year....
Even an NIT run last year could have helped.
Quote from: Chairback on March 21, 2013, 01:42:38 PMI've enjoyed watching this team but excited about the future. Next years Horizon League overall will be a better league.
I miss these guys already. The Horizon will be better next year, but Valpo will likely be more like Butler was last year with a 100 to 130 rpi at best. Maybe dangerous late season. This year was fun! And interesting!
Quote from: justducky on March 21, 2013, 02:05:37 PMI miss these guys already.
this. +1000.
So glad to be back in the tournament, and they deserved it.
I knew this day would come again...just didn't think that Ole Miss would have a Bryce Drew and Valpo have a Keith Carter before it did :/
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on March 21, 2013, 02:08:32 PM
I knew this day would come again...just didn't think that Ole Miss would have a Bryce Drew and Valpo have a Keith Carter before it did :/
Haha, too ironic to get over that.
Here's my recap of the game (http://www.midmajormadness.com/2013-ncaa-tournament/2013/3/21/4132480/2013-ncaa-tournament-recap-michigan-state-65-valparaiso-54)
I'll put together a postmortem for the season once the entire HL is done.
Quote from: valpospartan on March 21, 2013, 01:54:41 PM
Quote from: StlVUFan on March 21, 2013, 01:38:10 PM
This is why Kampe plays as many of the Big Boys as he can, to try to prepare his team for this kind of a game. I dunno if it really works, but that's the theory.
Hats off to them.
Izzo has always done the same thing. Some early season losses oft time pay dividends later on.
That's to his credit, believe me, but his team *is* one of the "Big Boys" I was talking about ;)
Hats off to a great team and a special year! the best to the Seniors wherever life takes you .. :)
Could you imagine us with only 7 turnovers and forcing 17 and losing? MSU will be a very tough out. A fantastic effort in any event.
Rowdy and van wijk blew our chances of winning this game by going for a combined 2-17...that's god awful for being out two best players.
So is it going to be a while before we get back to the tourney? It seems like our time in it has come and gone pretty fast. And it will be strange indeed to not see Ryan in a Valpo uniform anymore.
Quote from: DMvalpo18 on March 21, 2013, 03:50:03 PMSo is it going to be a while before we get back to the tourney? It seems like our time in it has come and gone pretty fast. And it will be strange indeed to not see Ryan in a Valpo uniform anymore.
We definitely have a chance if Junior leaves for the NBA next season. If he leaves, I'm going say we're the 3rd best team in the league which gives us a good shot at making the tournament with a conference tourney run.
Quote from: Kyle321n on March 21, 2013, 04:09:12 PM
Quote from: DMvalpo18 on March 21, 2013, 03:50:03 PMSo is it going to be a while before we get back to the tourney? It seems like our time in it has come and gone pretty fast. And it will be strange indeed to not see Ryan in a Valpo uniform anymore.
We definitely have a chance if Junior leaves for the NBA next season. If he leaves, I'm going say we're the 3rd best team in the league which gives us a good shot at making the tournament with a conference tourney run.
Even if he doesn't leave, I doubt they will be the issue, but they will be pretty good. They lose Minnerath and Anderson. They had no bench. The teams to beat will be Wright State, Cleveland State, Green Bay and YSU.
I know I'm tardy to the party but the one thing that infuriated me was the rebounding. We got freaking killed on the glass! At one point we were down 44-18 in that stat.
I love that the guys played hard for 40 minutes! And I know this isn't an ideal game but Bryce HAS to manage his timeouts better. We were out of timeouts with 14 and change remaining. I don't care what's going on, that's unacceptable.
Quote from: vuweathernerd on March 21, 2013, 05:25:24 PM
I know I'm tardy to the party but the one thing that infuriated me was the rebounding. We got freaking killed on the glass! At one point we were down 44-18 in that stat.
I love that the guys played hard for 40 minutes! And I know this isn't an ideal game but Bryce HAS to manage his timeouts better. We were out of timeouts with 14 and change remaining. I don't care what's going on, that's unacceptable.
MSU is always near the top in rebound margin. We made it easy for them on the MSU defensive rebounding end, as we missed a great number of shots.
When you play MSU you really need to have that portion of Dennis Rodman's brain for rebounding injected in your whole team - but just the rebounding part.
Quote from: vuweathernerd on March 21, 2013, 05:25:24 PMI know I'm tardy to the party but the one thing that infuriated me was the rebounding. We got freaking killed on the glass! At one point we were down 44-18 in that stat.
I do agree that this is one area that really stands out. 17 ORebs for MSU and only 14 DRebs for us. We keep MSU off the boards on 5 of those ORebs, Rowdy hits 2 more 3's, Kevin hits 3 shots and we're golden!
Quote from: vu72 on March 21, 2013, 04:34:33 PM
Quote from: Kyle321n on March 21, 2013, 04:09:12 PM
Quote from: DMvalpo18 on March 21, 2013, 03:50:03 PMSo is it going to be a while before we get back to the tourney? It seems like our time in it has come and gone pretty fast. And it will be strange indeed to not see Ryan in a Valpo uniform anymore.
We definitely have a chance if Junior leaves for the NBA next season. If he leaves, I'm going say we're the 3rd best team in the league which gives us a good shot at making the tournament with a conference tourney run.
Even if he doesn't leave, I doubt they will be the issue, but they will be pretty good. They lose Minnerath and Anderson. They had no bench. The teams to beat will be Wright State, Cleveland State, Green Bay and YSU.
I agree. Considering the year that Wright State had this year, that definitely puts them in that top tier. Green Bay just has some great talent with Sykes and Brown, and Cleveland State had lots of young talent that will be more mature. The question is if our recruiting class is going to be ready to compete at this level and be solid contributors right away. Or maybe they won't need to be relied upon so heavily because of the few we have returning and a couple of transfers? Is it too early for this conversation? Haha.
Bobby is going to be good next year, and I am sure our head coach will give him more freedom to shoot the 3, a la Dan Oppland/Raitis/Kikas several years ago. I say head coach, because I am not sure who that will be next year lol. Bryce showed on the big stage that he can't manage his timeouts, or make too many adjustments against superior competition. I am sure this turned away some suitors, but it won't turn away them all. I am hoping that he comes back to keep our recruiting class together, and that he works on his in-game management to keep up with these types of teams. I hate to say it, but maybe he should reach out to Stevens...
Yes congrats seniors, you guys made for exciting 4-5 years! Your accomplishments now have a place in Valpo sports, forever. Don't ever forget that.
You are all class players,who dedicated your sweat, blood, time to getting VU back to the Dance. We are grateful. :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
:clap: :clap: :clap:
Just got home from Auburn Hills and can't express how proud of this group I am. They were simply physically overmatched today, and that's ok. Going in, we all knew it was going to come down to how many shots we made. MSU was going to get a million offensive rebounds and we were not going to get easy looks. That happened, we just didn't shoot it very well unfortunately.
The team this year gave us moments we will never forget...Ryan's shot against Green Bay, the comeback at Detroit and making it to the first NCAA Tournament since 2004. They have a TON to be proud of and absolutely nothing to be ashamed of, including today's game. Michigan State was one of the few teams that - quite simply - we had little chance against because of their physicality.
To respond to some of the criticism of Bryce's timeouts...he was trying to keep us in the game when we were missing EVERYTHING! There was a stretch where we ATTEMPTED two shots in four minutes, and Bryce used two of the timeouts then. If he hadn't, MSU may have extended their lead even more. He used them when he felt he had to. Yes, we were out of them at the end, but if he hadn't used them early, it may have been a 25-point lead at that point, and it wouldn't have mattered.
We had seven TO's against Michigan State...partly because we weren't very agressive for stretches, partly because we just plain took care of the ball better.
I am proud to say that I am a Valpo grad when our players play like they did for 40 minutes. I don't care if we make shots, I care how hard they play. I'm proud of them, and I have memories I won't soon let go of. These seniors (and the other guys too...) represent our school with great class, passion and they are the men that truly put VALPO out for the world to see...
I dunno, tx, I'm not sure saving timeouts would have helped, and I'm thinking he felt he had to use them when he did because stuff wasn't working. When you're desperately searching for some way to stop the bleeding, saving timeouts doesn't seem all that important.
I echo what everyone has said.....it was a great season and I'm very proud of our team. I'm just thankful for the invaluable exposure that the university received recently. The countless news articles around the country, the AXE austronaut commercial, tons of replays of "the Shot", and lots of TV time have been incredible. It also ignited tons of alumni pride all around the world. I just hope that the administration continues to get on board with the importance of how a great athletics program can promote and improve a university like Valpo. :twocents:
Gleaning data from box scores...searching for consolation in numbers:
--Boggs' day today was the only time all year someone playing double-digit minutes had more points than minutes played. In pts/40 min, he posted a 54.5 ppg.
--The only other to come close was Capo with 13 pts in 13 min @CSU
--Boggs' 2 in 1 min vs DET was the only other time anyone this year ever had more points than minutes.
henceforth March 21 will be BOGGSDAY.
--When Rowdy shot 50% or better this year, VU was 13-2.
Watch this terrible interview after our game. Talk about someone that needs to stay behind a desk, and away from TV lol:
http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/tag/_/name/2013-auburn-hills-region (http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/tag/_/name/2013-auburn-hills-region)
Quote from: vuweathernerd on March 21, 2013, 05:25:24 PM
I know I'm tardy to the party but the one thing that infuriated me was the rebounding. We got freaking killed on the glass! At one point we were down 44-18 in that stat.
I love that the guys played hard for 40 minutes! And I know this isn't an ideal game but Bryce HAS to manage his timeouts better. We were out of timeouts with 14 and change remaining. I don't care what's going on, that's unacceptable.
Well, that's why you aren't a coach. Bryce knows his team and what they needed. Obviously it worked as we out scored them in the second half. did you forget about all the tv timeouts? They work just the same as a real one.
You guys are amazing. Now valpotx thinks Bryce should reach out to Stevens, a guy he has beaten three straight. The timeouts? We won the second half. so much for his timeout management.
It's not too early to talk about next year. sure we will be, on average, pretty young, but we will have three seniors in bobby, Lavonte and Jordan plus transfer studs like Keith Carter plus the kid from Rice and a more experienced Vashil.
Add a very talented freshman class and we may make a run again. I can't wait.
Quote from: vu72 on March 21, 2013, 10:17:11 PM
Quote from: vuweathernerd on March 21, 2013, 05:25:24 PM
I know I'm tardy to the party but the one thing that infuriated me was the rebounding. We got freaking killed on the glass! At one point we were down 44-18 in that stat.
I love that the guys played hard for 40 minutes! And I know this isn't an ideal game but Bryce HAS to manage his timeouts better. We were out of timeouts with 14 and change remaining. I don't care what's going on, that's unacceptable.
Well, that's why you aren't a coach. Bryce knows his team and what they needed. Obviously it worked as we out scored them in the second half. did you forget about all the tv timeouts? They work just the same as a real one.
You're right - I'm not a coach. And Bryce does know the guys better than I do.But still, his burning of timeouts this season has at times been absurd. I don't like the idea of burning two timeouts in a 30 second span, especially only midway through the first half. And I disagree about those early timeouts working - the Spartans closed the first half with a 26-5 run.
Quote from: valpotx on March 21, 2013, 09:09:23 PM
Watch this terrible interview after our game. Talk about someone that needs to stay behind a desk, and away from TV lol:
http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/tag/_/name/2013-auburn-hills-region (http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/tag/_/name/2013-auburn-hills-region)
Which interview are you talking about? The one where some guy is talking to Adrian Payne?
The run in the first half had nothing to do with time outs. There's a long TV one at under 8 and under 4. Had a lot to do with rebounding.
I'll remember Rowdy congratulating Boggs at the end for his last few minutes scoring.
Frustrating game but 19 for 54 was the story plus O bounds for Mich St.
Lessons taught -- bringing in Vashil for a couple minutes to learn what type of work he needs to do in offseason and being banged around by Nix. Lesson delivered-- when he was stuffed on potential dunk.
Proud of these seniors and their efforts and 2 horizon league championships and 1 NCAA and 1 nit. Good luck in your future endeavors.
Thought I saw Milo Stovall at the game.
Quote from: vu72
Well, that's why you aren't a coach.
Whoa, harsh reaction to someone's legitimate critique of unusually liberal use of timeouts. I mean, maybe you disagree, but why the uber defensive stance that Bryce knows best? I'd say there's a lot of room for doubt here.
Quote from: vu72
Obviously it worked as we out scored them in the second half.
Quote from: vu72 on March 21, 2013, 10:28:22 PM
We won the second half. so much for his timeout management.
No chance this had anything to do with the other team coasting while we played normal ball? I'm not down on the team's performance today, I think we played solid and were just bitten by abnormally cold shooting, but let's not kid ourselves into thinking that if point differnetial had any significance in this tournament, we wouldn't have lost by a bit more than 11....
Quote from: StlVUFan on March 21, 2013, 11:08:28 PM
Quote from: valpotx on March 21, 2013, 09:09:23 PM
Watch this terrible interview after our game. Talk about someone that needs to stay behind a desk, and away from TV lol:
http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/tag/_/name/2013-auburn-hills-region (http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/tag/_/name/2013-auburn-hills-region)
Which interview are you talking about? The one where some guy is talking to Adrian Payne?
Yes, that interview. That reporter is absolutely terrible in that scenario, and needs to stick to just writing. He looks like he is about to faint having to think up questions :).
In regards to 72, yes, I think that he should reach out to Stevens about in-game management against better opposition. I don't care that Bryce has beaten him 3 times. I am simply talking about how Stevens prepares his guys for superior competition. The school down south does not play scared against these types of teams, and it has been this way for several years now for them. We seem to panic when we see the name on other team's jerseys, and can't shoot to save our lives in those games. We got plenty of open looks, but just put way too little or way too much on each. We have fantastic shooters, and they never play like it against top teams. So yes, bite the bullet, and reach out to someone that has been there and done that.
Also, as rink mentioned, MSU took their foot off the pedal quite a bit towards the end, which is why we got to an 11 point loss. Yes, they kept their starters in, but they seemed to just be working on going through their offensive plays, to prepare for later in the tourney. I am proud of our guys and their overall effort to fight back to a respectable looking loss, but it could have been worse.
I just wish i could let these seniors know how much i have enjoyed watching them play.... I also hope they remember everything positive that they accomplished.
I'll miss seeing them in a Valpo Jersey ... Thanks team!!!
Like father,like son:one and done. :'(
Quote from: setshot on March 22, 2013, 09:27:06 AM
Like father,like son:one and done. :'(
Ignore! Again just trying to poke a sore spot. His agenda is way too clear.
ESPN's bottom line last night certainly poured salt in the wound...
VALPO: Lost 6 straight NCAA Tournament Games.
Uncalled for!
A fact is a fact even if it hurts your feelings. Espn isn't pouring salt on a wound. They are giving facts. Boo hoo
Quote from: truth219 on March 22, 2013, 09:58:54 AM
A fact is a fact even if it hurts your feelings. Espn isn't pouring salt on a wound. They are giving facts. Boo hoo
I have to agree with truth. Just because it hurts for some fans to read a fact doesn't mean that ESPN should avoid reporting the real facts.
Should ESPN not have reported that Lance Armstrong was accused of using performance enhancing drugs because it shocked his fans who saw him as such a positive role model and hurt their feelings?
Quote from: bbtds on March 22, 2013, 10:11:23 AM
Quote from: truth219 on March 22, 2013, 09:58:54 AM
A fact is a fact even if it hurts your feelings. Espn isn't pouring salt on a wound. They are giving facts. Boo hoo
I have to agree with truth. Just because it hurts for some fans to read a fact doesn't mean that ESPN should avoid reporting the real facts.
Should ESPN not have reported that Lance Armstrong was accused of using performance enhancing drugs because it shocked his fans who saw him as such a positive role model and hurt their feelings?
I found it odd, especially since they haven't really made a point of doing it for any other "Cinderella" seed.
Not pointing out that Valpo has now lost 6 straight NCAAT games over the span of 15 years would be the same as not reporting on Lance Armstrong's doping, got it ::)
Quote from: vu72 on March 21, 2013, 10:28:22 PM
You guys are amazing. Now valpotx thinks Bryce should reach out to Stevens, a guy he has beaten three straight. The timeouts? We won the second half. so much for his timeout management.
It's not too early to talk about next year. sure we will be, on average, pretty young, but we will have three seniors in bobby, Lavonte and Jordan plus transfer studs like Keith Carter plus the kid from Rice and a more experienced Vashil.
Add a very talented freshman class and we may make a run again. I can't wait.
Not only that, but Bryce has also won 48 games in his first two seasons ... I doubt that very many others have done that! Not sure why anyone is criticizing him at this point. :crazy:
It seems like Stevens talks a lot about picking up things from other coaches ... guys like Todd Lickliter, Paul Patterson of little Taylor University and Shaka Smart (before they were in the same conference). In Bryce's case, he probably doesn't need much advice, but if he does, he has two great resources in his family to contact.
How many of these wins are against top quality competition? There is a huge difference in getting your guys ready to play the other mid-majors we can beat on a routine basis, versus getting them prepared to beat a BCS school. Again, I love Bryce as our coach, but I am realistic in regards to his current HC level
Quote from: valpo04 on March 22, 2013, 10:20:16 AM
Not pointing out that Valpo has now lost 6 straight NCAAT games over the span of 15 years would be the same as not reporting on Lance Armstrong's doping, got it ::)
It's more like putting up there "Loyola: failed to advance in NCAA tournament since 1983" or
"Chicago Cubs: still hapless since 1945, or 1908, depending how low your bar is"
Quote from: valpotx on March 22, 2013, 11:55:06 AM
How many of these wins are against top quality competition? There is a huge difference in getting your guys ready to play the other mid-majors we can beat on a routine basis, versus getting them prepared to beat a BCS school. Again, I love Bryce as our coach, but I am realistic in regards to his current HC level
A fair observation. I think the "getting prepared" has more to do with talent and, matchups. Valpo would have had a much better chance against any of the others 3's. Having said that, in general the difference in mid-major talent and BCS talent is size, speed, athleticism. We have some--Bobby has size, Erik is as fast as any BCS player and a guy like Jordan Coleman has athleticism. Now, put that across a whole team so that a Ryn Broekhoff can't be double teamed or put shooting ability with Erik's speed so that the bigs can't camp down low, and you might have something.
The next question needs to be: Are the new guys coming in going to close the gap? Is Keith Carter or Lexus Williams a bcs quality point? Can Adykoya provide that quick, athletic inside presence? Can Alec Peters score like Ryan and not be doubled because we have too many other weapons? Time will tell...
I completely agree with you, vu72, regarding talent and match-ups, but I respectfully disagree that Valpo's chances would have been better against the other 3's. The others are just as good as MSU (which was the third or fourth-best team in the Big 10) and would have presented similarly tough match-up headaches. Based on the games so far, we're lucky we did not have to play Harvard or Florida Gulf Coast, both of which look like much better teams than Valpo.
I am optimistic about next year, but I was far too optimistic about this year's team, so I'll keep it under control until I see the new group in action. Carter is a more-complete guard than any we had on the court this year. Peters already seems to be a better shooter than Ryan (whose shooting was streaky and inconsistent throughout the year). Our guards and forwards did not consistently create their own shots (except for Buggs at the end of the season), but it appears that both Peters and Yeo have that innate ability. I really do think the wildcard for 2013-14 is Vashil. I hope he has a monster year...can't help but like that guy.
I've got to agree with 72 here. All of the #3 seeds are good (by definition they are supposed to be!) but Michigan State was going to be a particularly tough matchup. MSU in recent years has the trademark of very good defense, good rebounding and many athletic players as starters and on the bench.
Valpo's main way of combating that was their experience and ability to play well together. More specifically, if you looked at the offensive sets by Valpo, they ended up with very good ball movement and often a good look for three. Broekhoff went 2-11 from the field and 1-9 from three, and that made a big difference. Against a very good defensive and rebounding team, poor shooting would doom anyone to failure. Second, Nix had an outstanding game: 25 points and 15 rebounds and Valpo had no answer for him. There is no one like that in the HL.
Having been at the prior tournament games against Arizona and Michigan State (in 2000?), while I watch this one on TV, Valpo looked better than in those games. Yesterday, they didn't hit shots, and when Ryan and Kevin didn't score well, there was no other credible option until Buggs started hitting. I'd submit that if Ryan would have went 4-9 from three there would have been a whole lot more pressure on MSU's players, and a better scenario for Valpo to get back into better defensive sets. As it was, the team played well against a very tough opponent.
The way MSU used Nix is exactly how Detroit should've used Holman. Good coaching vs. McCallum coaching.
Oh, well, at least we have football to look forward to. ;)
Spartans taking care of business:
MSU 70 - Memphis 48
Makes ya feel better about our result, don't it?
I am rooting for MSU to win it all... Makes any result feel better if you can say you got beat by the champs... However, appling's injury could hinder them.
So far, MSU is reminding me of how the 2000 tournament played out. We held them under 70 points, then each game after that, they scored 70+, on their way to the NCAA Championship.
It will be interesting to see how Michigan and Michigan State play from here, especially playing their first two games at the friendly confines of the Palace of Auburn Hills. Both look great.
One last word on timeouts, for now: I think the unspoken undercurrent to this conversation is "if this is how Bryce burns through timeouts with the most experienced lineup in the country, how is he going to handle them when a much less-experienced team is having problems on the floor?"
And that is troublesome. But we'll burn that bridge when we get there.
Trying to remember who here had a problem with Bryce having no timeouts left in the final stretch against Detroit...you do what you have to do to stay in the game.
Bill Belichick is undoubtedly the best coach in the NFL over the last decade-plus. He throws away timeouts (and concomitant challenge flags) like they are McDonalds wrappers, much to the chagrin of Patriots fans. His use of timeouts is frustratingly bad at times. Bryce obviously has a long, long way to go to become a Belichick (or even a Brad Stevens), but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt in calling timeouts. This was a senior-led team, so timeouts called by the bench should not have played as large of a role this year, but there were a lot of lapses at inopportune times by the group, thereby necessitating the timeouts.
Quote from: atkins on March 23, 2013, 10:32:46 PM
Bill Belichick is undoubtedly the best coach in the NFL over the last decade-plus. He throws away timeouts (and concomitant challenge flags) like they are McDonalds wrappers, much to the chagrin of Patriots fans. His use of timeouts is frustratingly bad at times. Bryce obviously has a long, long way to go to become a Belichick (or even a Brad Stevens), but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt in calling timeouts. This was a senior-led team, so timeouts called by the bench should not have played as large of a role this year, but there were a lot of lapses at inopportune times by the group, thereby necessitating the timeouts.
Not once this season has anyone brought up anything about Bryce mismanaging timeouts. Then we have a game where we were in constant jeopardy of being blown out and we use timeouts to try to stop the bleeding, and Bryce needs to go to "counseling." Someone already said it. If he didn't try to do something to stop MSU's momentum at crucial times during the game, having timeouts to burn at the end of the game would have been meaningless. Or, are we supposed to believe that someone who played hundreds and hundreds of games on the big stage at every level of basketball and who has several years of asst and head coaching experience suddenly lost his head, his cool, or his common sense? You guys need to stop embarrassing yourselves with this unfair, uneducated criticism.
By the way, did anyone notice how Brad "the counselor" replied when asked what went wrong in the final play of Butler's loss to Marquette. Needing a 3 to tie, they threw it in the back court to Andrew Smith, who took a couple of dribbles at the top of key, stumbled over someone's foot, and klutzed up a wild off-the-mark "throw" at the gun. Stevens said they had 2 plays set-up depending on the defense, and the team ran the wrong one. In other words, 'I called the right play, but the team didn't execute.' Bryce would
never dump on his players like that. Instead, he would keep it all inside and we would be saying 'Bryce called a timeout for that? What a terrible play!" And, 'Maybe Bryce should get some counseling from "Brad" on how to close out a game.'
Quote from: wh on March 24, 2013, 03:43:44 AM
Not once this season has anyone brought up anything about Bryce mismanaging timeouts.
wrong. it's been lamented about a fair few times, less so on the boards, but more frequently in game chats. specifically finding ourselves in situations where we only have 1 left around the 10 minute mark, or burning 3 in the first half. there's got to be better ways to weather the storm than burn 3 timeouts in a 5 minute span. intentionally slow the pace down and make sure everyone understands before ever getting into those situations that sometimes you're going to have to take a second to collect yourself individually. it can be done.
Quote from: wh on March 24, 2013, 03:43:44 AM
Quote from: atkins on March 23, 2013, 10:32:46 PM
Bill Belichick is undoubtedly the best coach in the NFL over the last decade-plus. He throws away timeouts (and concomitant challenge flags) like they are McDonalds wrappers, much to the chagrin of Patriots fans. His use of timeouts is frustratingly bad at times. Bryce obviously has a long, long way to go to become a Belichick (or even a Brad Stevens), but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt in calling timeouts. This was a senior-led team, so timeouts called by the bench should not have played as large of a role this year, but there were a lot of lapses at inopportune times by the group, thereby necessitating the timeouts.
Not once this season has anyone brought up anything about Bryce mismanaging timeouts. Then we have a game where we were in constant jeopardy of being blown out and we use timeouts to try to stop the bleeding, and Bryce needs to go to "counseling." Someone already said it. If he didn't try to do something to stop MSU's momentum at crucial times during the game, having timeouts to burn at the end of the game would have been meaningless. Or, are we supposed to believe that someone who played hundreds and hundreds of games on the big stage at every level of basketball and who has several years of asst and head coaching experience suddenly lost his head, his cool, or his common sense? You guys need to stop embarrassing yourselves with this unfair, uneducated criticism.
By the way, did anyone notice how Brad "the counselor" replied when asked what went wrong in the final play of Butler's loss to Marquette. Needing a 3 to tie, they threw it in the back court to Andrew Smith, who took a couple of dribbles at the top of key, stumbled over someone's foot, and klutzed up a wild off-the-mark "throw" at the gun. Stevens said they had 2 plays set-up depending on the defense, and the team ran the wrong one. In other words, 'I called the right play, but the team didn't execute.' Bryce would never dump on his players like that. Instead, he would keep it all inside and we would be saying 'Bryce called a timeout for that? What a terrible play!" And, 'Maybe Bryce should get some counseling from "Brad" on how to close out a game.'
:thumbsup: :clap: :thewave:
Quote from: vuweathernerd on March 24, 2013, 07:37:50 AM
Quote from: wh on March 24, 2013, 03:43:44 AM
Not once this season has anyone brought up anything about Bryce mismanaging timeouts.
wrong. it's been lamented about a fair few times, less so on the boards, but more frequently in game chats. specifically finding ourselves in situations where we only have 1 left around the 10 minute mark, or burning 3 in the first half. there's got to be better ways to weather the storm than burn 3 timeouts in a 5 minute span. intentionally slow the pace down and make sure everyone understands before ever getting into those situations that sometimes you're going to have to take a second to collect yourself individually. it can be done.
Not very high on my list of concerns when it comes to evaluating a coaches performance unless you start saying "darn we could have won that game if only we had a timeout or two left at the end of the game". Really don't remember saying that at anytime this year even though I did think a time or two that we could have used the timeouts more judiciously. However, I am not in the huddle and don't know the situation and as a knowledgable fan I have a lot of faith that Bryce knows his team and how to best instruct and motivate them.
My post was intended as a defense of Bryce re: calling timeouts. He's the head coach, so he knows when a timeout is necessary and/or helpful, and even if he were horrible at timeout-management (which he's not), that would not be an impediment to success.
Quote from: wh on March 24, 2013, 03:43:44 AMNot once this season has anyone brought up anything about Bryce mismanaging timeouts.
This is not true. I believe I read several times someone complaining that Bryce had run through his timeouts with 3 or 4 minutes to go in the game.
Quote from: wh on March 24, 2013, 03:43:44 AM
Quote from: atkins on March 23, 2013, 10:32:46 PM
Bill Belichick is undoubtedly the best coach in the NFL over the last decade-plus. He throws away timeouts (and concomitant challenge flags) like they are McDonalds wrappers, much to the chagrin of Patriots fans. His use of timeouts is frustratingly bad at times. Bryce obviously has a long, long way to go to become a Belichick (or even a Brad Stevens), but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt in calling timeouts. This was a senior-led team, so timeouts called by the bench should not have played as large of a role this year, but there were a lot of lapses at inopportune times by the group, thereby necessitating the timeouts.
Not once this season has anyone brought up anything about Bryce mismanaging timeouts. Then we have a game where we were in constant jeopardy of being blown out and we use timeouts to try to stop the bleeding, and Bryce needs to go to "counseling." Someone already said it. If he didn't try to do something to stop MSU's momentum at crucial times during the game, having timeouts to burn at the end of the game would have been meaningless. Or, are we supposed to believe that someone who played hundreds and hundreds of games on the big stage at every level of basketball and who has several years of asst and head coaching experience suddenly lost his head, his cool, or his common sense? You guys need to stop embarrassing yourselves with this unfair, uneducated criticism.
By the way, did anyone notice how Brad "the counselor" replied when asked what went wrong in the final play of Butler's loss to Marquette. Needing a 3 to tie, they threw it in the back court to Andrew Smith, who took a couple of dribbles at the top of key, stumbled over someone's foot, and klutzed up a wild off-the-mark "throw" at the gun. Stevens said they had 2 plays set-up depending on the defense, and the team ran the wrong one. In other words, 'I called the right play, but the team didn't execute.' Bryce would never dump on his players like that. Instead, he would keep it all inside and we would be saying 'Bryce called a timeout for that? What a terrible play!" And, 'Maybe Bryce should get some counseling from "Brad" on how to close out a game.'
There are many ways to calm the team down when you are struggling that don't include using ALL of your timeouts with 14 minutes left in the game. Someone mentioned that you can slow the pace down to try and calm them, which is just one of those options. Just watch how some of these coaches manage such situations, that are still left in the tournament! You will see them stand at halfcourt and use some clock, so the guys can slow their minds down, but still get a play in to start around 10-12 seconds left. Are you saying that the only way our team could stop a run is to call a timeout?? Yes, Bryce knows the team, but there had to be several other ways to switch it up without calling 2-3 timeouts in a few minute span.
You have your opinion, and I have mine, and just because someone doesn't agree with you, doesn't mean they are 'uneducated' in saying that Bryce should look to others who have had success on the BIG stage as a COACH. Just because you played in the NBA and overseas doesn't mean that you are going to be an excellent in-game coach. It's the same to say that just because you can recruit solid players, doesn't make you a great COACH, which is the constant criticism you hear about Scott Drew.
I am sure that Bryce will become a better in-game coach in the years to come, but there have been way too many examples over the last 2 seasons that show he still needs some work before he can be successful at a larger program. He will always be able to recruit top talent, but it will be how he uses that talent, to determine how successful he will become.
Again, I have NEVER said that he is a poor coach, just that he has a lot of work to do to be able to beat the big boys like some of the other mid-major teams do. We always have similar/better talent to these teams that cause such upsets on the big stage, but we tend to get blown out in each game. I am not speaking about a UNM or SLU, as their names do not cause you to panic when you are playing against them. I am talking about the UNC, MSU, Duke-type teams, that can cause a player to play nervous in just knowing that you are playing against a storied program. You can say that we only lost by 11 to MSU, but they definitely took their foot off the pedal with the last 5-6 minutes to go, which got it below 20.
Quote from: vuweathernerd on March 24, 2013, 07:37:50 AMwrong. it's been lamented about a fair few times, less so on the boards, but more frequently in game chats. specifically finding ourselves in situations where we only have 1 left around the 10 minute mark, or burning 3 in the first half. there's got to be better ways to weather the storm than burn 3 timeouts in a 5 minute span. intentionally slow the pace down and make sure everyone understands before ever getting into those situations that sometimes you're going to have to take a second to collect yourself individually. it can be done.
too true! amen. and a whole bunch of emoticon smilies. i'll be uneducated with you and tx any day.
EDIT: Having identified an undercurrent, let's then talk about what this is really about, since some people are all Allen Iverson and being like "timeouts? we talkin' bout TIMEOUTS?"
This whole timeout discussion is actually an avatar for concerns that Bryce still has in-game coaching edges to smooth off. (And I am fine with that, because the more of those he has, the more likely he is to stay at VU!) Still, when your average season is 24-10, you're clearly doing a lot of things right, regardless of inherited situation. As a player, Bryce pretty much always had his finger on the pulse of the game (most of the exceptions I can think of date back to high school days, which is obviously unfair since I did a lot of dumb things in high school that I'd prefer weren't remembered by anyone, least of all me).
As a coach, though, Homer always did, or at least seemed to. It was like when you were 6 or 8 and you knew your dad had it all under control. He knew when to call the timeouts and when not; he knew when to get on the refs and when to lay off; he even knew when (and how--which is just as important) to get a tech. Which, every time it happened, I always felt like it was the first time ever.
But it's like going from being a star actor to a director--same set, different chair. It's unfair to expect him to manage a game like his father who had what, 400 games under his belt as head coach when he first came to VU.
In the end, if this, and the possibility of him leaving, are all we really have to complain about at this point, we're doing pretty well.