Um.......I really......um.......think......um.......we should start......um......a game......um......thread.......um...for the Illinois.....um.....game.
Maybe Mizzzz Tainot's speech class would change Bryce's life.
Speaking of starting, I think Vashil should be starting over Moussa. He is bringing more productivity and energy and we need a good start against Illinois. We cannot get ourselves into a hole early.
I think it will be a good game, I give a 30% chance of winning it. I think our size will help us in a game like this. Won't be an easy task at all but it's not like going up against a top 5 team, Illinois is good not great and definitely a beatable team. I will be surprised if it's a complete blowout. I'm gonna say Illinois 75 to Valpo 68. Should be a good game and we will know quite a bit after this game.
Although I believe Illinois will win this game, I do not want to count out our chances completely. On paper we are a bigger team than them, which is interesting to say in comparison to a BIG 10 team. Also, they do not have a ton of experience. There roster consists of 5 freshmen and 2 seniors. It will be interesting to see how our new recruits match up against theirs.
It will also be interesting to see how we play on the road since this will also be the first time the team has traveled together. I like that we are going to a tough arena, but don't have to fly to get there. It's time for a true test Wednesday.
I agree that it will be close.
OTH, Bertrand and Rice are better athletes than anyone Valpo has currently and Abrams and Tate sure do make a great second core for the Illini. There will also probably be a bench player who steps up and makes a name for himself in this game.
Egwu, their center is probably no better or worse than Fernandez but I have a feeling Vashil will get the gitters and Moussa will step up in this game. I think Gueye already has the confidence to handle Egwu, who comes from Chicago.
Rayvonte Rice transferred from Drake and Jon Ekey transfered from IL St. Valpo has guys from IU, Alabama, Hawaii and South Florida. How do these coaches recruit so wrong?
The big key is the great freshman class that Valpo has put together. Will they step up and make their mark or will they be somewhat awed by their surroundings. I'm pretty sure Peters has played at the State Farm Center (former Assembly Hall) so that in itself could be a deciding factor for Valpo.
Valpo 71
Illinois 74
I cannot say that I am very familiar with this Illinois team, but I think that unlike previous games against big conference opponents the issue will be guard matchups (instead of Valpo's size not matching up). Dority has to play a solid and consistent game and not go 3-14 from the floor. You could argue that Valpo has no experienced point guards (is Dority really a point guard), so pressure defense and depth could really be issues (especially if we get another game with lots of foul calls). For Valpo to win, they will need three reliable scorers (as well as solid defense and not getting outrebounded). The likely three scorers would need to come from Coleman, Dority, Capobianco and Peters. All possible, but none a guarantee.
Would love to see a win since it really would build initial confidence for this new group. However, I see about a 10% chance of winning and a 74-59 final score.
I just can't see us beating Illinois after losing at Nebraska last year with a more veteran team. Our first road game may be an ugly one, but hopefully our guys surprise me!
Illinois 78
Valpo 63
Quote from: valpotx on November 11, 2013, 09:51:13 AM
I just can't see us beating Illinois after losing at Nebraska last year with a more veteran team. Our first road game may be an ugly one, but hopefully our guys surprise me!
Illinois 78
Valpo 63
Don't see how you can see we will lose this year cause last year we lost to Nebraska. Completely different team this year, both sides don't have a lot of experience and hopefully the innocence of the freshmen help us in a game like this. Like others have said Dority cannot go 3 of 14 or whatever he was from the floor and we need to be 75+% from the free throw line if we wanna win. I think we have a legitimate shot at winning, this team is capable of pulling off the upset.
Anyone know if this game is going to be tv? I was hoping it might be on the Big Ten Network.
Quote from: classof2014 on November 11, 2013, 10:17:40 AM
Quote from: valpotx on November 11, 2013, 09:51:13 AM
I just can't see us beating Illinois after losing at Nebraska last year with a more veteran team. Our first road game may be an ugly one, but hopefully our guys surprise me!
Illinois 78
Valpo 63
Don't see how you can see we will lose this year cause last year we lost to Nebraska. Completely different team this year, both sides don't have a lot of experience and hopefully the innocence of the freshmen help us in a game like this. Like others have said Dority cannot go 3 of 14 or whatever he was from the floor and we need to be 75+% from the free throw line if we wanna win. I think we have a legitimate shot at winning, this team is capable of pulling off the upset.
Agree that this is an entirely different team then the one that faced Nebraska.
Here's the box score:
https://admin.xosn.com/pdf8/986001.pdf?SPSID=20&SPID=24&DB_LANG=C&DB_OEM_ID=10.
Notice a couple of things: First, the lack of depth in scoring. Ryan was off that night and other than Kevin, nobody stepped up. Also, no Dority of Capo in that game.
This team has depth and options. Last year Kevin was usually shut down versus big name programs and if the 3 wasn't falling (2 for 15 against Nebraska) we were done.
Quote from: chipper955 on November 11, 2013, 10:31:16 AM
Anyone know if this game is going to be tv? I was hoping it might be on the Big Ten Network.
I'm fairly certain the B1G Network streams stuff online for free, don't quote me though.
The point wasn't that we have the same or similar team, or any comment in general about talent. It was the fact that we never step up in away games against even middling BCS programs over the last decade. An away game in a big arena intimidates our basketball programs for some reason. Do we have the talent to win the game, yes. But do we have that killer mentality to get it done on the road in a big game against a traditional power? I just can't see it this early on in their career.
I think having the freshmen might help us in a game like this. It might sound crazy but they don't know any better and what more would they like than knock off a big time program like Illinois. I think having Moussa in a game like this will help us a lot, he's used to playing against teams like this. This team isn't like past teams, they don't rely on the 3 anymore and have the athleticism that can match up against Illinois. This is our first true test. The freshmen always seem to be excited to get out there and show us what they've got and they haven't shied away from the moment either.
Like I've said before this group of freshmen is capable of doing something special. It has to start somewhere so why not now? This could be the year we finally get over the hump of beating a B1G caliber school.
I think we are getting too caught up with being so young. We start four 5th year seniors and not many teams can say that. These guys have been around and are not new to college basketball.
This is a reminder that we're a work in progress and playing a quicker, more athletic team: Illinois 84, Valpo 65.
Quote from: classof2014 on November 11, 2013, 10:40:00 AMQuote from: chipper955 on November 11, 2013, 10:31:16 AMAnyone know if this game is going to be tv? I was hoping it might be on the Big Ten Network.
I'm fairly certain the B1G Network streams stuff online for free, don't quote me though.
http://btn.com/shows/ (http://btn.com/shows/)
If you go to Wednesday, they show that the game will be on BTN. That's good news for us!
Excellent video on Coach Powell and Illinois/Valparaiso:
Inside Valpo Athletics: Roger Powell Jr. 11|11|13 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDYLkZWxZsY#ws)
Quote from: Kyle321n on November 11, 2013, 11:26:33 AM
Quote from: classof2014 on November 11, 2013, 10:40:00 AMQuote from: chipper955 on November 11, 2013, 10:31:16 AMAnyone know if this game is going to be tv? I was hoping it might be on the Big Ten Network.
I'm fairly certain the B1G Network streams stuff online for free, don't quote me though.
http://btn.com/shows/ (http://btn.com/shows/)
If you go to Wednesday, they show that the game will be on BTN. That's good news for us!
I think it says that it will be on the internet (BTN/BTNTOGO) I think Purdue or Penn State will get the TV nod.
Quote from: Chairback on November 11, 2013, 06:38:06 AM[Vashil] is bringing more productivity and energy and we need a good start against Illinois.
I think, though, that that is actually EXACTLY what you want in your second unit.
Quote from: vu72 on November 11, 2013, 10:33:04 AMDon't see how you can see we will lose this year cause last year we lost to Nebraska. Completely different team this year, both sides don't have a lot of experience and hopefully the innocence of the freshmen help us in a game like this. Like others have said Dority cannot go 3 of 14 or whatever he was from the floor and we need to be 75+% from the free throw line if we wanna win. I think we have a legitimate shot at winning, this team is capable of pulling off the upset.
Agree that this is an entirely different team then the one that faced Nebraska.
But that's exactly the point: if last year's team, loaded and experienced, couldn't pull off a road win at a terrible B1G team, why should this year's model, without the experience, pull off a road win at a decent (mid-tier) B1G team?
That's not to say they can't, but if you made me bet two years ago on the outcomes, I'd've gone all in on last year, not this.
Quote from: classof2014 on November 11, 2013, 10:40:00 AMI'm fairly certain the B1G Network streams stuff online for free, don't quote me though.
Only if you have a cable program that includes the BTN. If not, oh well. Of course SOMEONE HERE cough will find and post a pirate link, though, should it come to that...
Quote from: Chairback on November 11, 2013, 11:07:09 AMWe start four 5th year seniors and not many teams can say that.
including us! (it's 2 5th years, Gueye & Capo. Dority and Coleman are regular seniors.)
Quote from: vu72 on November 11, 2013, 11:50:35 AMQuote from: Kyle321n on November 11, 2013, 11:26:33 AMQuote from: classof2014 on November 11, 2013, 10:40:00 AMQuote from: chipper955 on November 11, 2013, 10:31:16 AMAnyone know if this game is going to be tv? I was hoping it might be on the Big Ten Network.
I'm fairly certain the B1G Network streams stuff online for free, don't quote me though.
http://btn.com/shows/ (http://btn.com/shows/) If you go to Wednesday, they show that the game will be on BTN. That's good news for us!
I think it says that it will be on the internet (BTN/BTNTOGO) I think Purdue or Penn State will get the TV nod.
http://bigtennetwork.stats.com/cbk/scoreboard.asp?day=20131113&conf=003 (http://bigtennetwork.stats.com/cbk/scoreboard.asp?day=20131113&conf=003)
According to this it's on TV and the Go App. Looks like Purdue and PSU won't even be on the net.
From yesterday's game recap on the athletics site:
QuoteValparaiso (2-0) makes its first national television appearance of the season on Wednesday in its road opener, as the Crusaders travel to Champaign, Ill. to take on Big Ten foe Illinois. The 6:30 p.m. tipoff will be televised nationally on the Big Ten Network.
I'm not sure where it got in people's heads that Illinois is inexperienced. Their starting line-up against Jacksonville State was 3 juniors and 2 seniors. Yes, 1 senior and 1 junior are new to U of I. They are coming in from Drake and Illinois State. The bench has 5 freshmen and a sophomore. That is pretty much who Valpo will see Wednesday evening in the Illini rotation.
Quote from: valpotx on November 11, 2013, 09:51:13 AMOur first road game may be an ugly one, but hopefully our guys surprise me!
The uglier this game gets the better our showing could be. I just can not see much advantage in running a controlled, finesse, last year style 3 point shooting contest.
On the job I was always told that there is money in confusion so I suggest that we go for the money and create as much confusion as possible . Illinois understands no better than us how the new rules will be called so lets run a test case with aggressive play on offense, and as many different looks on defense as we can put together. Take it to the hole repeatedly, frequently send people to the offensive glass, and if it looks like they are more back on their heels than we are then turn this game into our first war of attrition style effort. I don't care if we finish the game with Chadwick in the post and Davidson at the 2 or 3 as long as we are within striking distance at the end. For added emphasis I think that Bryce should ceremonially burn last years playbook.
That said I would still pick Illinois to win by 5 to 12 points.
Quote from: valpopal on November 11, 2013, 11:50:12 AM
Excellent video on Coach Powell and Illinois/Valparaiso:
Inside Valpo Athletics: Roger Powell Jr. 11|11|13 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDYLkZWxZsY#ws)
That is a great video and my respect and admiration for Coach Powell increased 1000% after hearing him talk. He seems to be so down to earth, yet his faith walk is just outstanding and to be admired. God bless him and his family!
In terms of coaching and recruiting, he is the real deal. If he stays awhile at Valpo given his recruiting ability and connections, I think Valpo can get back to a place of prominence nationally. Maybe the 2nd time around game announcers will actually learn how to pronounce Valparaiso correctly more often. ;)
I wasn't able to make it, but Roger spoke at Morning Prayer last Monday, as part of their usual Monday line-up of faculty, staff, and student speakers.
Looks like the recording's up on the web site.
http://www.valpo.edu/chapel/sundayworship/sermons.php (http://www.valpo.edu/chapel/sundayworship/sermons.php)
https://soundcloud.com/valpochapel/roger-powell-speaks-at-morning (https://soundcloud.com/valpochapel/roger-powell-speaks-at-morning)
Seems like the recording cut off the reading. Not sure if that was appointed for the day, or if he picked it. Seems to be the Tower of Babel. Gensis 11. From the... King James?
I am optimistic about this team but not insane. I think we will lose but it ain't going to be a north park kind of loss. We are still trying to find our mixture so I think we will be within 15. We will have a couple offensive lulls that will put us behind.
The question will be if this team thinks that they "belong" at that level. If we go in there with a chip on our shoulders who knows but since I am a betting man - I would rather not put money on them. However, for me the important thing is that we look respectable - It will be nationally televised. No matter the outcome this will be an excellent learning opportunity that will really help to develop this team.
As for the Illinois line-up ... I actually like our freshman better than some of theirs. And, I totally agree that we have experience just not all at Valpo... Our 5th year seniors are very experienced and we have a couple players (actually a few) that have played at some good sized programs.
As for Vashil starting - totally agree that he seems better once play begins but I bet Moussa does better on the jump...
:twocents:
One thing that will be interesting will but what will the road uniforms look like??? Perhaps you'll be able to read the name on the back and they won't look like yellow highlighter markers on the court.
Quote from: valpotx on November 11, 2013, 10:51:57 AM
The point wasn't that we have the same or similar team, or any comment in general about talent. It was the fact that we never step up in away games against even middling BCS programs over the last decade. An away game in a big arena intimidates our basketball programs for some reason. Do we have the talent to win the game, yes. But do we have that killer mentality to get it done on the road in a big game against a traditional power? I just can't see it this early on in their career.
I realize Valpo hasn't beaten a BCS team since Washington in '08, but that is a program issue and shouldn't really impact THIS team. As 2014 points out, this year's roster is made up of young guys who weren't around for previous losses to BCS teams and older guys like Capobianco, Gueye and Dority who came from BCS schools and shouldn't be intimidated by the environment.
I won't predict a score, but I think it should be a single-digit game.
I'm hoping that we're no longer a 3-point shooting team that will work into our advantage. In games last year when we played higher level schools (Nebraska, Saint Louis, New Mexico, and Michigan State) We were a dismal 28% (22/79) from 3-point land. Those numbers would have been much worse because we shot the ball pretty well against New Mexico.
Nebraska - 2/15 from 3 and shot .340 (16/47)
Saint Louis - 5/21 from 3 and shot .326 (15/46)
New Mexico - 8/18 from 3 and shot .486 (18/37)
Michigan State - 7/25 from 3 and shot .352 (19/54)
In all of those games we were unable to hit 20 buckets and reach the 60 point mark. The only game we shot well in was the New Mexico game but the decent shooting performance was completely nullified by the 23 turnovers we committed. Last year we always seemed to shrink in games against bigger programs and shot terribly. Last year we lived by the 3 and died by the 3. If we shot well in big games we could have beaten teams like the four mentioned above, but only one game we shot decently and the other games were awful offensive performances. If we wanna beat Illinois we cannot shoot 32% from the floor but this team is way different and isn't a sharp shooting team and have guys that can get to the basket for high percentage layups. So long as we don't try to do something that we are not we should be able to give Illinois a run for their money.
Are we gonna win? I don't know, probably not. Will we score more than 60? Yes. I think the biggest keys to the game will be not to try a 3 pointer every other shot, make our layups, make our free throws, and take care of the ball, if they do those things our chances of winning are much, much higher. If I were to bet on this game I would put my money on Illinois but we have a legitimate shot at pulling off the upset.
We're not the 3-point shooting team that we were last year, I really like that about our team. Cause we lived by the 3 and died by the 3. In games where we were shooting lights out we could beat anybody but when we had a night where we were awful from the 3 were could get killed by anybody. This team is different, I have a good feeling about this one.
Would anyone else mind seeing Coleman take a "point forward" role so Dority can be more of a shooting guard? I think in that first unit Coleman has the best ball handling skills and if Dority brings the ball up every time I could see Illinois pressing to force TOs.
I would much rather see Dority in the shooting guard position... He is not a point guard and we look better when he is in a two spot...
I'm not predicting a win, but a close game. If we can keep them off the offensive boards and limit our turnovers, we have a chance.
Valpo 67
Illinois 71
Valpo 78 Illinois 75. But then we lose to James Madison.
Quote from: Kyle321n on November 12, 2013, 10:26:10 AMWould anyone else mind seeing Coleman take a "point forward" role so Dority can be more of a shooting guard? I think in that first unit Coleman has the best ball handling skills and if Dority brings the ball up every time I could see Illinois pressing to force TOs.
Just from memory, but I believe that Coleman did play big minutes as point in Junior college. Again from memory I think his assist to turnover ratio was unimpressive at something like 1.1 to 1. As much as his overall play has improved it does make me wonder how he might do if given the chance. This is just one of those issues where I am pretty sure that the staff knows best and if there was some kind of advantage by doing so the change would be made. Our starting and substitute guard play (including LaVonte) already looks to be well above my expectations so maybe Bryce could do some shuffling with positive effects. When you add Carter to this mix of guards then it looks to me to be one very special bunch!
Todd interviews Bryce in his first coach's preview show of the season:
Valpo Basketballl Preview 11|12|13 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VH6pGg5r_uQ#ws)
Quote from: valpopal on November 12, 2013, 05:55:58 PM
Todd interviews Bryce in his first coach's preview show of the season:
Valpo Basketballl Preview 11|12|13 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VH6pGg5r_uQ#ws)
So, is Todd standing in a hole or is Bryce really 6'7"?? :crazy:
Just watched LIU-Brooklyn nearly take down IU in Bloomington.
I don't care if we win tomorrow night. Sure, it would be great to get a W, but I don't expect that will happen. This is what I really want: that we give the Illini fits, just like LIU-Brooklyn did to IU tonight. That we play well. That we don't wilt again on the big TV stage against a big time program. That we live up to our billing as a traditional mid-major power and, for the first time in a long time, play tough against a BCS opponent. That we put a big scare in a quality opponent, just like LIU did tonight in a very, very tough environment. This is what I want.
Paul
I was thinking more about jordan Coleman at the point.... I do not "know" Jordan but the more I think about his temperament the more I think he could get down on himself if he did not do well in that position. Dortity does seem more flexible?
Here is a different thought (depending on his defensive ability).... Start Lexus instead of Alec. I think we are weaker at the point anyway. And when Keith is eligible Alec will lose his starting spot. Easier to take it from Lexus than Alec.
I highly doubt that Alec will be leaving the starting lineup at any point this season. Even though Coleman has played well, he will probably be the guy dropped down when Carter becomes eligible. Several people have stated on here that Alec was promised starts, which is one of the reasons he came here, and he hasn't done much negative to drop him down.
Chances are if anybody were to lose his starting job it would be Peters. Nothing against him but once Carter becomes eligible he takes over the point, Dority moves to the 2, and I think Coleman takes over at the three. There is without a doubt Peters will still get the 25+ minutes a game, he'd just become the sixth man which pretty much gets starting minutes. Personally, I think starting is a bit overrated, its more important who finishes games than starts them. Peters will get tons of playing time this season, whether he starts once Carter is available is the question.
I just think Coleman gets the edge due to his seniority and if Coleman keeps playing at a high level I don't see how we cannot have him in there. Nothing against Alec he's gonna get a ton of playing time, I just think Coleman gets the start over Peters due to seniority.
Quote from: Smj on November 13, 2013, 09:04:32 AM
Here is a different thought (depending on his defensive ability).... Start Lexus instead of Alec. I think we are weaker at the point anyway. And when Keith is eligible Alec will lose his starting spot. Easier to take it from Lexus than Alec.
Quote from: valpotx on November 13, 2013, 09:51:47 AM
I highly doubt that Alec will be leaving the starting lineup at any point this season. Even though Coleman has played well, he will probably be the guy dropped down when Carter becomes eligible. Several people have stated on here that Alec was promised starts, which is one of the reasons he came here, and he hasn't done much negative to drop him down.
I was going to wait a little while to consider this but I think this should be it's own thread: "Who should start when Carter becomes eligible". IMHO I think we should start Carter, Coleman and Peters and have Williams-Dority-Yeo as the second unit coming off the bench.
- Carter will obviously play the majority of the time at point, but giving him 12-15 minutes off a night with Williams spelling him would be good for Lexus's development.
- I think if you split Coleman and Dority's time 50-50 you'd be better off. Coleman gives you more athleticism and better defense, while Dority might give you more scoring (I'm still not sold on that point, as I believe Coleman can give you 10-12 a night). I don't think their styles really work together on the court.
- Peters and Yeo can play together when you want to go smaller with Peters at the 4 for Bobby (or even Bobby at the 5 if Vashil or Moussa get in foul trouble). But for the most part I can see Peters getting the most minutes at the 3 with Yeo spelling him.
Back to Illinois. They are very vulnerable to second chance points. I don't know who Egwu is going to guard, but both Bobby and Moussa need to have a big game and be look to crash the offensive board. If we can get inside scoring and offensive rebounds, I think we will stand a good shot of winning. Defensively we need to be ready to provide helpside defense. Illinois runs a lot of motion offense, especially against man defense. When J-State went into their zone, Illinois tried to run some motion, but for the most part the stood still and passed the ball around the perimeter and looked to get it to Egwu. Maybe we should switch up defenses on them frequently to try to confuse them. We also need to get a body on Egwu. He can shoot it from 15 feet or so, but he's much more comfortable with his back to the basket.
This is worth a look: Coach Powell playing for Illinois in national semi-final game.
The Rev vs Louisville (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6r28_8UGZg#ws)
Quote from: Kyle321n on November 13, 2013, 10:28:45 AM"Who should start when Carter becomes eligible". IMHO I think we should start Carter, Coleman and Peters and have Williams-Dority-Yeo as the second unit coming off the bench.
No need for a new thread. You just ended it.
If Paul Oren says "as long as Peters is at VU he's starting", I believe it. I don't ever remember, as TX said, that it was written here that he was promised starts, but clearly something is in people's mind about it.
In a bigger sense, it's Gueye-Capo-Peters-Coleman-Carter, and we can roll a second unit of Vashil-Chadwick-Yeo-Dority-Williams, if we wanted to sub that way. That's impressive.
Quote from: valpopal on November 13, 2013, 10:37:29 AM
This is worth a look: Coach Powell playing for Illinois in national semi-final game.
The Rev vs Louisville (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6r28_8UGZg#ws)
Love the rebound of his own shot for a dunk! Need more of that from all players, who seem to fade back after shooting, not even maintaining the spot they shot from.
Some interesting chatter on the Illinois message board:
http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/Forums/showthread.php?t=20539 (http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/Forums/showthread.php?t=20539)
When Carter comes it's Bobby who should go to the bench. Peters is a scorer and you need to leave him in.
Quote from: Chairback on November 13, 2013, 12:08:46 PM
When Carter comes it's Bobby who should go to the bench. Peters is a scorer and you need to leave him in.
Honestly, Moussa/Vashil should go to the bench. Is the jump ball really that important? Just move Bobby to the 5, Alec to the 4, Coleman the 3, Dority the 2, and Carter the 1.
Am I crazy for wanting to try starting Lexus at point until Carter is ready? Trial by fire sure helped Eric Buggs and I see a lot of potential in Lexus' game.
Williams
Carter
Coleman
Peters
Rotate Cap/Vashil/Mousse
6th man Yeo?
I am very curious to see this Illinois game and have no clue what will happen
Big Ten Network only streams if you subscribe to a cable plan, btw. I do see a spot on first row sports for it, though
Quote from: Chairback on November 13, 2013, 12:08:46 PMWhen Carter comes it's Bobby who should go to the bench.
Oh, right, because replacing a 6-10 dude with a 6-0 dude totally doesn't negate our height advantage over almost everyone on our schedule.
MattCarter! Where have you been in forever, man?
Tidbits from the Ilini board:
http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=824407&postcount=59 (http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=824407&postcount=59)
QuoteValpo Message Board:
http://www.valpofanzone.com/forum/index.php?board=2.0 (http://www.valpofanzone.com/forum/index.php?board=2.0)
Pretty intelligent and passionate fan base.
thank you. thankyouverymuch. /elvis'd
Also, who is the 50s alum grandpa that would be rooting for the Illini tonight? Would said person also root for the house in blackjack? http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=823689&postcount=29 (http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=823689&postcount=29)
Toward that end, who is the grad student IN OUR OWN ATHLETIC DEPT that thinks we will lose by 20?
http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=824522&postcount=66 (http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=824522&postcount=66)
Moreover, who on this board thinks that this year's team will be better than last year's?
http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=824526&postcount=67 (http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=824526&postcount=67)
Liked this exchange (posts 90-91):
QuoteHow do you guys compare Peters to Nate Taphorn from Northwestern. Taphorn impressed me in the game I've watched, but it was against weak competition. He's going to need to add strength, but the kid is a competitor for a freshman.
QuoteWatched Peters play Taphorn many times and Valpo definitely got the better end of that deal. Stronger, more athletic, better defender and in my opinion shoots the ball just as well. Both smart players but Peters can make more happen for you. Peters team actually shut Taphorn out in one of their games - Nobody shut Peters out.
One of their guys did a preview on us:
http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=825597&postcount=87 (http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=825597&postcount=87)
Highlights thereof:
QuoteThe Crusaders are led by head coach Bryce Drew (yes, he's related to Scott Drew)
...didn't see that coming. maybe it's a young board. that's like "Charlie Sheen (yes, he's related to Emilio Estevez)"
QuoteThink of Peters as a poor man's Robbie Hummel. Yes, because he's white, but also because ...
SENTENCES I DIDN'T FINISH READING
Quotetake a look at Fernandez and Gueye. Two shot blockers and large human beings occupy the middle for Valpo (though not usually at the same time). Fernandez has a little more experience at the D1 level, but he is also smaller than Gueye.
um...well, one outta 2 ain't bad, kid.
Quote from: valpotx on November 13, 2013, 09:51:47 AMSeveral people have stated on here that Alec was promised starts
I'm not doubting this, but it doesn't sound like Valpo or the Drews. What I remember is some comments that as long as Alec was in a VU uniform, he'd be starting. I took that to mean that his skills, especially during practice, have shown that he'll be in the starting lineup for the foreseeable future. I can see Bryce promising a chance to start, if earned during practice.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on November 13, 2013, 12:49:12 PMToward that end, who is the grad student IN OUR OWN ATHLETIC DEPT that thinks we will lose by 20?
http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=824522&postcount=66 (http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=824522&postcount=66)
Hmmm. Of course, if I'm a 22-23 year old recent grad with no Valpo exposure before the job offer, I might side with the Big Ten team as well. However, I don't think I'd predict a loss by 20 of my employer and future degree grantor to a friend that posts on the oppositions fan board. Hopefully, this person will be impressed tonight, and get his friend to post something more positive.
http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=826956&postcount=106 (http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=826956&postcount=106)
QuoteTurns out Gueye has significantly more experience than Fernandez, so I was wrong about that in my preview. Shows how thorough I am doesn't it? (In all seriousness, I try to be pretty thorough, I don't know how I missed his years at Alabama).
Guy with 7 posts on their forum is thorough and missed the PREVIOUS team Gueye was on... It's not like he went Alabama>>JUCO>>Valpo buddy...
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on November 13, 2013, 12:49:12 PM
Moreover, who on this board thinks that this year's team will be better than last year's?
http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=824526&postcount=67 (http://www.illinoisloyalty.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=824526&postcount=67)
I would say we're more balanced this year, but definitely not better. A game between the two teams would be fun though.
'12-13 Valpo 72
'13-14 Valpo 64
I'm glad we get to see this game on B1G Network in HD as opposed to the grainy Horizon League Network. I still feel I haven't seen Valpo yet.
My expert analysis. Or excerpt analysis (have a lot more stuff floating in my head)
Illinois is a young team that may or may not be a tournament team. Last year Illinois was a bubblish team and won a game as a 7 seed against Colorado. Their shining moment of last season was their last second wide open layup against 1 overall Indiana (whom as a 1 seed didn't make it past the Sweet 16). They also had good wins over Gonzaga and Butler. They didn't have any embarrassing losses that we can laugh at. Their final RPI was 40 (Valpo's was school record 58 ).
As for this year, Lundari has them as a bubble team (out). The preseason coaches poll from the B1G doesn't seem to exist, so you have to look at rankings from random guys at CBS Sports and USA Today. Most of these predictions have Illinois as 7 or 8 seed (out of 10ish teams). All of these polls have them below Indiana, whom just narrowly escaped LIU-Brooklyn (projected 4th in the NEC). LIU actually had the ball down 1 with the shot clock off, missed, and had another last second shot after IU missed the front end of the ensuing 1 and 1. But that's neither here nor there.
This is a game that Valpo hasn't won in forever. Other Horizon League teams have had more success against power conference teams. Green Bay beat Marquette last year, UIC beat Colorado St, and Cleveland St beat Vanderbilt. Of course we all know about Butler. If we want to turn the corner and own the Horizon, we need to be able to beat unranked power conference teams every once in awhile. True, these opportunities may not happen often, but if Valpo wants to be a top tier mid major, we need to win these games.
As much as I want Valpo to win this game, I'm not sure this is the year they'll beat a middle of the pack power conference team on the road. But hey, if LIU can almost knock off Indiana, Valpo can beat Illinois. Hopefully we dig down and fight hard in the half filled State Farm Oyster/UFO Arena, make 40 of 50 free throws and pull out a win.
In the house!
I'm in the chat for once if anyone wants to join.
God B1G announcers are the worst. Just cheerleaders for B1G Teams.
Bobby has to play perimeter d, my lord.
15-8 Illinois. So far same old story.
Paul Y
Gueye just looks brutal offensively. Valpo doesn't have an inside presence and unfortunately not as many shooters as last year. Lexus seemed to be running the offense more effectively than Dority.
I don't say this very often but the refs in this game sucked a$$... Bryce got a tech but he waited too long.
Make our free throws this is a completely different game. Overall Valpo hung tough the whole way didn't expect them to win. We had our chances got the game within a position a few times and had the ball with the ability to tie or take the lead. Never could get over the hump. Valpo will be good this year, but they need to work on their free throws. Going 11/20 is just not going to do it. Make 5 of those this game comes down to the wire. Overall I thought the team played well and just couldn't break through and get over the hump when they brought within a possession.
Overall this is kinda what I thought it was gonna be. Valpo would have their chances but unfortunately they couldn't capitalize.
That was a good effort by our guys overall, and the score makes it look worse than it was, as it should have been a single digit victory for Illinois. Unfortunately, that was a game we could and should have won. You should never lose to a team that goes through 2-2/18+ stretches on offense. We had our chance with the ball twice down two, with us jump passing it to Illinois, and then Bobby for some terrible reason trying a drop shot from beyond the free throw line. Illinois will only get better and be a middle-pack Big 10 team, but they were there for the picking. This wasn't the usual BCS team that does not miss a single 3 against us, so it was that 1 out of 10 chance we had at winning against a good program. Too bad, but I am encouraged by our defense and think we will be a top 2 HL team if we can play like this the rest of the season.
We need to develop a go-to guy on this team. When we brought it to 2 a few times I was looking for Rowdy to drain a 3 but he unfortunately wasn't there. Not a bad performance at all. Didn't expect them to win and you can't win 'em all.
Okay so I did not like the refs but I really like our team. Hope this is a confidence boost because we kept up with then and at one point when we were within 2 with about 4 minutes I thought we might be really close at the end.
Respectable loss....
A disappointing but predictable performance tonight from Valpo. It seems like we see a variation of this game every time we play a major conference school.
The free throws killed us tonight. When we were down 2 with 6:13 and then 5:28 left to play, I would have liked to see a freshman step up. Instead we get 2 bad possession from seniors and that was that. I guess there's always next time...
This one hurts more than I thought it would because the boys clearly had momentum and opportunity to take the win tonight...and then were outscored 12-1 or some such number. Woof. Overall, I love the tenacity shown by the team, coming back 3 times to keep Illinois on their toes. Some bad shot selection from both teams, but they had just enough skill to overcome. Their tough floaters down the stretch were killer...ours were air balls...speaking of, did a ton of shots get tipped tonight or was there an unfortunate number of shots that missed everything?
Stay hungry Valpo!
Oh, and the Horizon League is looking up if we're gonna finish 6th!
6:43 to go when we cut it 49-47.
no change in score until 4:41.
only problem was they scored, not us. and then again, and again. and again.
For over 6 minutes--the last 6 of the game, almost, we had nothing but a Coleman FT. We got 4 points in the last 31 seconds to break the 50 mark.
You're not going to get calls on the road vs. the B1G.
As far as freshman vs. senior, I don't think that makes a whole lot of sense. I think the freshmen would have had the same results and then you'd be wishing we had someone experienced handling the ball in those matters.
Lexus and Lavonte need to work on finishing the drive a little better. They would get the needed step, but seemed to choke when they thought that their shot would be altered at the rim. Go up strong young man, and make them bring the contact, don't anticipate it all of the time! I really like this team, and believe we will be in the postseason in some form again this year.
Not a fan of bobby in the paint or really at all besides when he shoots the 3. I think he makes WAY too many mistakes for a senior. Refs were absolute :censored:. Announcers were obviously rooting for Illinois. And we just couldn't finish at the rack. Rebounding killed us more than free throws in my opinion.
I won't say that the refs were terrible, but there were several times where the replays showed us getting hit on the head or hand, and the announcers saying it should have been a foul. Impressive that we kept out of foul trouble for the most part, even without getting away with as much at the Illini apparently did.
Blech. Carter cannot come soon enough. I'm going to completely lose it if I see Dority drive wildly into the lane one more time and heave up a shot... Overall, I can't really point to anyone having a good game. Even the freshmen. Gueye had some steals and some blocks, but also had a horrible foul with the 1 and 1 and only had 2 rebounds, one being an offensive rebound that was immediately tied up. Capo finally seemed to develop an outside shot, but no points down low? Just a really ugly game by everyone.
And all of these guys need to practice free throws. This is going to be even more important this year with the amount of fouls called. Missing the front end of a 1 and 1 is brutal.
Actually, these guys need to practice shooting in general. How many airballs did we witness?
Most of them were tipped so maybe 1
IL's desperation three at the end of the first half and our woeful FT shooting, that's the ballgame. The ticky tack fouls against us were just icing on the cake.
Meanwhile, Bucknell defeats Penn St in Happy Valley tonight, nice BCS win for the program's perception. When will we get the bleeping job done!? Embarrassing drought continues...
I would agree on the 3 at the end of the the first half I was like, that's game, we're not winning. That was pretty much a five point swing. Bobby was open under the basket and would have had the easy 2 but instead we turned it over and a desperation 3 going in. Big difference between going in down by 3 compared to 8. Changed the whole feel of the game for us. We need Keith Carter now, with him we probably win this game. Also no presence down low is gonna hurt.
Like I said before if we make our FTs this is a one possession game in the last minute of the game. This one was ours for the taking.
Valpo played an Illinois team, as good or better than any in the Horizon League, on the road and kept the game as close as two points late in the second half. In addition, they did that with freshmen playing 76 minutes, which in past seasons would have led to a huge blowout.
As I mentioned in a preseason thread, this is an encouraging situation. If the team can use this stretch of three away games against Illinois, Ohio, and Evansville as a lesson to toughen themselves, no mater the results, they will benefit in the future, especially when the more important conference play arrives along with Keith Carter.
As others have noted, two glaring weaknesses tonight: free throws and rebounding, both of which should improve by the time the conference schedule starts. On the other hand, the defense seems better than I expected at this point in the season, and the freshmen (Williams, Peters, Yeo) are maturing quicker than I thought they would. In fact, the stat that stood out to me as significant: the freshmen had an amazing 0 turnovers in their 76 minutes of play.
Quote from: classof2014 on November 13, 2013, 09:51:05 PM
I would agree on the 3 at the end of the the first half I was like, that's game, we're not winning. That was pretty much a five point swing. Bobby was open under the basket and would have had the easy 2 but instead we turned it over and a desperation 3 going in. Big difference between going in down by 3 compared to 8. Changed the whole feel of the game for us. We need Keith Carter now, with him we probably win this game. Also no presence down low is gonna hurt.
Like I said before if we make our FTs this is a one possession game in the last minute of the game. This one was ours for the taking.
I'm sure Kieth Carter would have helped, but I'm not going to say he's a 10 point or so difference maker until I actually see him play.
And the missed FT is really annoying. I think we missed the front end of a one and one at least twice too. But you can't say "if we shoot free throws better" without mentioning the flatlander's horrible shooting. If they have an average night shooting, then we see Davidson check in at the end of the game.
Quote from: valpopal on November 13, 2013, 09:58:20 PM
As others have noted, two glaring weaknesses tonight: free throws and rebounding, both of which should improve by the time the conference schedule starts. On the other hand, the defense seems better than I expected at this point in the season, and the freshmen (Williams, Peters, Yeo) are maturing quicker than I thought they would. In fact, the stat that stood out to me as significant: the freshmen had an amazing 0 turnovers in their 76 minutes of play.
Honestly I couldn't really think of too many actual positives, but I think the lack of turnovers by the freshmen is a great sign, especially since we're used to seeing Valpo cough the ball up like they're in a cold doctor's office getting a checkup.
Couldn't watch the game but saw the ESPN crawler a couple of times and was pleasantly surprised that we were hanging in through most of the game. Then hit the Valpo site and noted that Coleman led in Points, Rebounds and assists, yet no one acknowledged that. Seems like that is a major performance from a kid who was a reserve last year.
I was very impressed by the freshmen. They put the upperclassmen to shame (perhaps aside from Coleman, who showed flashes of brilliance but also was sloppy at times). This team needs to shoot free throws until their elbows buckle....There is simply no excuse for that abysmal effort from the line.
Unlike most posters on this board, I have seen Carter play, and he is better and more talented than anyone on this team. Valpo will be a much tougher team when he suits up. It will be interesting to see how Dority plays at the SG position. I think he will thrive. However, he's a duck out of water as a PG.
Illinois is an average to below-average B1G team this year, but they are clearly superior to the Nebraska team of 2012 that embarrassed us. So the year-to-year comparison is a positive for us.
p.s., As an aside, why did the board's Spell Check want to change "below-average" to "bullfrog"? Who'd have thunk.
At this point in the season, I see Dority going to the 6th man spot, and Coleman staying at the 2 when Carter comes back. Jordan has really improved, and it definitely deserves a mention. He did the one stupid 'jump before you know where you are throwing the ball' play when we were down by 2 late in the game, but other than that, had a solid game.
Quote from: atkins on November 13, 2013, 10:50:07 PMIllinois is an average to below-average B1G team this year, but they are clearly superior to the Nebraska team of 2012 that embarrassed us. So the year-to-year comparison is a positive for us.
The same thing had occured to me. This years bunch might have won out there (Neb) by a dozen and maybe more. Then the next question is how would the 11/13/2012 Crusaders have fared tonight against Illinois? Because of depth issues and some poor matchups I doubt if the outcome would have been much different and perhaps not as good. We also only had 12 turnovers on the night and that could have been 20 with the 2012 team.
I am a long way from predicting anything like last years success but I now think we can stay very close at Ohio and can win at Evansville. A lot of work still to do but Bryce seems to have a surplus of potential talents to work with.
Quote from: classof2014 on November 13, 2013, 09:51:05 PMWe need Keith Carter now, with him we probably win this game
Can't agree with this. I don't believe Valpo wins this game with Carter. He is not the Lord and Savior. Keith might have lessened the difference by challenging the Illini with more skill at the rim and better passing and shooting but how does Carter make up 13 points?
Quote from: a3uge on November 13, 2013, 10:00:34 PM(we would have seen) Davidson check in at the end of the game.
I guessed you missed it because Davidson did check in at the very end of the game when the outcome was decided.
I think the difference between the 2012 team in Nebraska and the 2013 team in Illinois that 2013 they had nothing to lose. I think there was a lot of pressure on the 2012 team not only in Nebraska but the entire the season. There were a lot of expectations for the 12 team. They were afraid to make a mistake or fail. You could also see it in the semi final of the HL tournament. The 13 team played Illinois with a sense of "we have nothing to lose, we are supposed to lose, lets show people wrong attitude."
We were in the bonus with more than 8 minutes to go. I thought we were trying to get the hole and draw fouls too much. I could tell the game plan was to get to the free throw line (even though we are struggling there). Bryce was very upset with the refs on a couple of drives to the hole.
I like that we have some shot blockers this year. Illinois always thought twice about driving to the basket and often altered their shots. This helped the defense tremendously.
Don't know if it was mentioned or not. But the Big 10 network said that our coaching staff has the 5th most points scored among all coaching staffs in the country!!!!!
Quote from: oklahomamick on November 14, 2013, 07:06:40 AMDon't know if it was mentioned or not. But the Big 10 network said that our coaching staff has the 5th most points scored among all coaching staffs in the country!!!!!
Fun fact but depressing that the coaches don't win games by playing the game on the court.
All i know is Big Bobby C needs to sit next to the coaches during the game as often as possible.
I am usually among the cynics, but I was very impressed. I know football much better than hoops.
But to my eye, these players are more athletic and stronger than last year other than Matt Kenney. They drive to the hoop stronger, especially Peters. More guys can get their own shot. Last year it seemed guys had to catch and shoot.
Also passes are stronger and sharper so turnovers were low. I think they have a much bigger upside than last year's team because Rowdy, Kevin, and Erik were as good as they were going to be.
NWITimes
Game rep
http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/upset-bid-falls-short-for-valparaiso/article_abf22a0d-5f00-534e-a9a9-5bd6877a012a.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/basketball/college/upset-bid-falls-short-for-valparaiso/article_abf22a0d-5f00-534e-a9a9-5bd6877a012a.html)
Blog wrap
http://www.nwitimes.com/blogs/sports/valparaiso-university/wrapping-up-illinois/article_b5f045ea-4cfc-11e3-bc92-0019bb2963f4.html (http://www.nwitimes.com/blogs/sports/valparaiso-university/wrapping-up-illinois/article_b5f045ea-4cfc-11e3-bc92-0019bb2963f4.html)
Post-Trib
Game rep
http://posttrib.suntimes.com/sports/23737522-556/crusaders-hang-tough-but-illini-pull-away.html (http://posttrib.suntimes.com/sports/23737522-556/crusaders-hang-tough-but-illini-pull-away.html)
Notebook of sorts
http://posttrib.suntimes.com/sports/23741884-556/illini-game-a-homecoming-of-sorts-for-valparaisos-alec-peters.html (http://posttrib.suntimes.com/sports/23741884-556/illini-game-a-homecoming-of-sorts-for-valparaisos-alec-peters.html)
Before anyone rags on Dority too much, he was playing with a sprained ankle. Those were 2 big-time shots he hit, even though MC and A3 will note that I was mad about the first one because his foot was on the line. Gamer, though.
After sleeping on it a night I feel a lot better from the loss. Our defense was stellar and kept us in the game. I know the bigs don't do much offensively but they make up for it on the defensive side of the ball. I'm not gonna bash Dority, he's playing the PG position when he's not a PG, makes it real tough for him.
Jordan Coleman looked really, really good. Had one bad play, it happened to occur at a terrible time but he had 15 point, 8 boards, two assists, and a block. Dority didn't look awful, he's just out of position and you can't blame him for that. The one I have been the most disappointed with this season is Bobby, he looked awful, made a few 3's, turned the ball over 5 times, had 4 fouls, and only 3 rebounds. We needed him to step up and he didn't.
I thought the freshmen played really well. I would love to see Peters get going from the 3 soon but if the shot isn't there he's not forcing stuff up, no shot is better than a bad shot. Yeo and Williams looked pretty good as well.
Going into Assembly Hall and going stride for stride with the Illini is definitely nice. Most teams that have freshmen play 75 minutes against a B1G team get blown out of the water. And we were not the lesser team in this game, both teams seemed evenly matched and Illinois got a few more breaks than we did and they made their free throws and we didn't.
Hopefully we can come out running against Ohio. Valpo is gonna finish in the top of the HL, we went stride for stride with Illinois, and with our best player in street clothes. So far the only disappointment in the season has been Capo, he looks awful and once Carter comes eligible if he still plays like this he should go to the bench. 5 turnovers and 4 fouls in 20 minutes of play is ridiculous, he accounted for almost half of our turnovers.
Bryce's post-game press conference:
Bryce Drew - Illini postgame remarks (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6GZ93hdmhvk#)
Quote from: classof2014 on November 14, 2013, 09:25:02 AMAfter sleeping on it a night I feel a lot better from the loss. Our defense was stellar and kept us in the game.
Was not able to watch the game, but looking at the stats I agree that our defense played well -except for allowing 18 Offensive rebounds. Luckily, they only got 11 second chance points on those rebounds. Those rebounds allowed Illinois to shoot 14 more times - that and a few FTs is the difference in the game.
This team can play. Looking forward to watching many good games this year!
Quote from: hoopfan22 on November 14, 2013, 08:50:14 AMAll i know is Big Bobby C needs to sit next to the coaches during the game as often as possible.
I 100% agree with this. He gave up 3 uncontested 3's the first 15 mins. He didn't get out and guard them or wasn't quick enough to. He isn't scoring down low, he is turning the ball over and he's not rebounding.
In regards to Dority, while he forced shots down the lane at times he also hit some key shots where Illinois could have gone on a run. I really like him and like his aggressiveness.
Quote from: govalpogo on November 13, 2013, 09:01:48 PM
Oh, and the Horizon League is looking up if we're gonna finish 6th!
The BTN guys made basically this point. I only turned the game on at our high water mark, and haven't watched the first 34 mins yet. But, at that point in the game, the BYN guys (obviously a home team call) were very complementary to Valpo.
I would not be over complementary of our defense...
I thought our zone was very slow to rotate giving Illinois a plethora of wide open 3 point shots. We are lucky that they missed most of them! Also, a good defense does not allow a team to get so many offensive rebounds. We seemed to have trouble finding a man to box out while in the zone.
We have a lot to work on! However, we are much further along than I thought we would be at this point of the season.
Quote from: agibson on November 14, 2013, 02:16:41 PM
Quote from: govalpogo on November 13, 2013, 09:01:48 PM
Oh, and the Horizon League is looking up if we're gonna finish 6th!
The BTN guys made basically this point. I only turned the game on at our high water mark, and haven't watched the first 34 mins yet. But, at that point in the game, the BYN guys (obviously a home team call) were very complementary to Valpo.
So it was your fault that we turned a solid run into a loss!!!! ;)
In regards to defense, I have to disagree with SanityLost17. The whole point of our zone defense was to FORCE a poor 3-pt shooting team into taking those shots, versus letting them take penetration shots. I feel that we did very well overall on defense, in contesting a lot of shots, and making them take fade-away jumpers. We did give away a lot of offensive rebounds, but that seemed to be because Illinois players were very well taught in tipping a ball out to the perimeter if they couldn't get a firm grasp on it. They got some offensive rebounds around the rim, but I remember far more tips out to the 3-pt line.
Phew! It's been a day since making the sudden decision to spend the last evening in Illinois country.
I sat right in front of of 4 guys with 2 of them being Valpo grads and all 4 Illini season ticket holders. 3 of them were dressed in orange. Many times they were cheering for both teams. The people that sold us a program were Valpo grads but worked at State Farm Center, I believe, to make money for their benevolent group, wearing orange (might be required). There was a couple from NW Indiana with the husband wearing orange and the wife Valpo gear. The couple said they were season ticket holders at the ARC and the husband had a lot of family from U of I.
All together it was a worth while trip.
I really hope the team sees the positives and carry a can-do attitude over to Sunday's game in Athens. It seems Ohio is a very beatable team.