I wrote up a preview for Monday night's game at Arizona, http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2011/11/game-preview-heading-to-arizona.html. (http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2011/11/game-preview-heading-to-arizona.html.) Hoping for a birthday victory Monday night!
When I click on the link, it says Page Not Found...
He accidentally put a period at the end of the link. Here you go:
http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2011/11/game-preview-heading-to-arizona.html (http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2011/11/game-preview-heading-to-arizona.html)
It will be an ugly start to the game, as most opening games of the regular season are, but I think the Crusaders could possibly hang for a lot longer than you think, sectionee. Now pulling the game out is what I would like to see, but I fear that we might not be able to do. Good luck to the Crusaders! I will definitely be watching this game. Can't wait!!
With the way Arizona played in the preseason, we might have a chance of pulling out an upset. Can we take much away with a win. On the other hand, if we have a 10+ point loss, where does that leave us. If we can limit turnovers, we should be able to make a game of it.
Go Crusaders!
I just checked my Comcast, and ESPNU is Channel 405. And I get it!
I'll be flipping back and forth with the Bears game.
man, i can't wait for this game. time to see how we stack up against a power conference team, early in the season before teams have their rhythm.
Quote from: Valpo89 on November 05, 2011, 02:42:21 PM
I'll be flipping back and forth with the Bears game.
Is Cal opening their season Monday, as well?
Oh wait, I forget, Chicago has an American football team, right? ;)
I predict the usual against major conference opponent. Valpo falls behind big from the opening tip, then pats themselves on the back for keeping within 20 in the second half.
Quote from: DMvalpo18 on November 05, 2011, 08:32:16 PM
man, i can't wait for this game. time to see how we stack up against a power conference team, early in the season before teams have their rhythm.
I hope you're right, but I just don't think we have enough capable big people to compete with a Top 20 team. Whenever Kevin goes out, I don't know how we will stop their inside game. Which begs the question - when is the NCAA Clearinghouse going to release their Valpo hostages? I can just picture a day at the Clearinghouse - stacks of file folders that barely move, workers with empty stares who barely move, play on the internet, talk on the phone, text, come in late, take long lunches, and leave early. Very similar to a day at local courthouses everywhere.
You're expecting an awful lot from a guy who hasn't played much basketball in his life and is very very raw. As far as Vucic, he did alright the other night against Augustana, nothing outstanding, but he held his own. That's all he needs to do....it's obvious that Edwards is a face the basket player, not a 5. Vucic will have to play and at least keep the status quo.....I thought he did pretty well for not having played in almost 3 years.....
Last year we had the best back-up 5 in the HL in Kevin. He could score, defend, and rebound. He was a more-than-capable replacement for Cory when he was injured or in foul trouble. Having Kevin enabled Homer to pull Cory when he was making mistakes. Plus, there were times when Kevin gave us great minutes of his own - times when he was the most energetic, physical player on the court. There is no way we win 23 games without him, especially given that we were an undersized team overall.
Replacing Kevin's back-up minutes from a year ago is IMO the biggest challenge the coaching staff has. I have no idea if Fernandez can help fill that void, but a great opportunity is being missed to give him playing time and evaluate him in game situations. World-wide recruiting is a way of life in today's global sports world, and yet the NCAA continues to be negligent in dealing with it.
Rather than win or lose, this match is more important for the opportunity to test the team under real-game circumstances against a quality team in a hostile environment, as well as to add to their experience together, especially working the new guys into the system. In any case, we will start the season with a strong strength of schedule rating.
Latest Vegas odds have Arizona by 13. I'd love an upset; however, if we beat the odds and keep the margin to a dozen or less, I will be surprised and happy. In fact, I hope I'm wrong, but I think I might be a few points optimistic with my prediction of a 15-point margin:
Valpo 64
Arizona 79
Quote from: wh on November 06, 2011, 09:20:14 AM
Last year we had the best back-up 5 in the HL in Kevin. He could score, defend, and rebound. He was a more-than-capable replacement for Cory when he was injured or in foul trouble. Having Kevin enabled Homer to pull Cory when he was making mistakes. Plus, there were times when Kevin gave us great minutes of his own - times when he was the most energetic, physical player on the court. There is no way we win 23 games without him, especially given that we were an undersized team overall.
Replacing Kevin's back-up minutes from a year ago is IMO the biggest challenge the coaching staff has. I have no idea if Fernandez can help fill that void, but a great opportunity is being missed to give him playing time and evaluate him in game situations. World-wide recruiting is a way of life in today's global sports world, and yet the NCAA continues to be negligent in dealing with it.
wh, I think you are spot on. Vucic and Fernandez have to play those minutes and that is the big question mark on this team. As was stated earlier, Edwards is a 4 and not a 5 in any way shape or form. Kevin has the attitude and mindset of a 5 and we will need other players with the same attitude and skills. That can only come from Vucic and Fernandez. If all we get from those two is some decent defense and an occasional put back I would be extremely happy. From what we have heard about Fernandez it seems that the defensive part may be ok I just hope we get a chance to see for ourselves sooner rather than later.
Quote from: cmack on November 05, 2011, 11:25:25 PM
I predict the usual against major conference opponent. Valpo falls behind big from the opening tip, then pats themselves on the back for keeping within 20 in the second half.
What games are you remembering? In most of the games I remember recently against top teams, we usually take the lead by 4-5 for the first 5 minutes based on adrenaline, hanging tough the rest of the first half down 8 or so. Then in the second half, we get blown out of the building, losing by 20-30.
Arizona 72
Valpo 61
Arizona - 78
Valpo - 67
Valpo 61
Arizona 66
Valpo 59
Arizona 81
I won't give a score- but best of luck tonight and in the OOC Valpo.
Good luck, guys. The McKale Center is an awesome place to play and it will be rocking for opening night. However, given the way Arizona has played in their exhibitions, no reason that Valpo can't knock them off if they play well! :thumbsup:
I guess I'll go with this...
Arizona 76
Valpo 57
Don't forget about the chat room once the game starts!
Arizona 73
Valpo 52
AU 75 VU 70
Arizona 83
Valpo 56
The streak continues......
Sitting here with weathernerd in North Dakota about to watch the game! Go Valpo!
This league simply has to do better against BCS teams than it has in the past, Butler excluded.
Go out and represent the league tonight with a fury.
Good luck from Milwaukee.
I'm over in the Crusader Chat associated with this fan forum. It looks as though the "Cover It Live" setup used on Thursday night may only be available for home games, since Aaron Leavitt is the color commentator on the road, so his time will be taken adding to what Todd has to say.
I'm listening from North Dakota as well.
Gotta start getting some offensive production from the newcomers.
Good game so far at the half.
Keep it going and steal this one Valpo!
Nice half.
Kevin has certainly played big. It is great to see him for more than 6 minutes at a time. Eric certainly is playing with much more offensive confidence.
lowposter
Very good first half, 2nd unit was not so good. KVW is playing out of his mind and those couple threes by Ryan were huge. I jotted down some first half notes if you are interested. http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2011/11/arizona-game-notes-1st-half.html (http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2011/11/arizona-game-notes-1st-half.html)
I thought they were supposed to show the Homer Drew cancer video during halftime? I didn't see it on ESPNU.
Kevin is a beast. He has the mindset of an aggressive inside player something we have been missing because of Cory's face up mentality. Got to make hay when he is on the floor.
Typical valpo 2nd half against a ranked team. Just textbook. Let's see some magic Bryce!
Same concerns I had for the Crusaders when picking them for sixth.
Who on this team outside of Broekhoff and Van Wijk is going to score?
Many teams have that same concern. Who is going to score after our first two guys? Valpo has several others who can score in double figures in Harris and Edwards. I'm concerned about our second unit. They have a lot of work to do (says a guy who has never coached a game of basketball in my life).
Got away from us there in the second half, but not a bad effort and only a 9 point loss.
Game wrap up from my point of view, http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2011/11/game-wrap-up-tale-of-two-halves.html (http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2011/11/game-wrap-up-tale-of-two-halves.html)
We need that second unit to come together and figure things out!
For what it's worth...I really liked the way that the team played right down to the buzzer and cut a 20pt deficit down to 9. That being said, I think the REAL reason for the late resurgance was that Valpo ran out of toes to shoot off from shooting themselves in the foot repeatedly during that disastrous stretch in the 2nd half. ;)
sectionee, Bogan reminded me of Ryan in his first few games. When we kept talking on the old board about his ability to shoot, and yet he kept passing up shots. Like I said in the chat, some of these guys might have been told their role for this game wasn't to be the big shooter, but to get the ball to the hot hands? Bogan might have only been a role player, basically to get the ball inside, or to the hot hands at that particular moment. Hopefully, Bryce will open up the floodgates on Friday, and see what some of these guys can really do, when given the green light to shoot.
Quote from: okinawatyphoon on November 07, 2011, 09:26:26 PM
Typical valpo 2nd half against a ranked team. Just textbook.
Yeah, a little bit.
But, not a bad outing.
The legitimate question we're left with, from the announcers, is, "How many of the 14 minutes Kevin sat were in the disastrous 10 minute no-field goal stretch bridging half time?" I mean, not all of them, since the two points or so in that stretch were off of KVJ FT's. But, what happened in those ten minutes to take him out of his otherwise very impressive game?
Quote from: agibson on November 07, 2011, 10:24:00 PM
Quote from: okinawatyphoon on November 07, 2011, 09:26:26 PM
Typical valpo 2nd half against a ranked team. Just textbook.
The legitimate question we're left with, from the announcers, is, "How many of the 14 minutes Kevin sat were in the disastrous 10 minute no-field goal stretch bridging half time?" I mean, not all of them, since the two points or so in that stretch were off of KVJ FT's. But, what happened in those ten minutes to take him out of his otherwise very impressive game?
Erratic passing into the post, some very sloppy ballhandling on Valpo's part and Broekhoff went cold from beyond the arc during that hard luck 10 minute stretch in the first part of the second half.
During that stretch in 2H, we simply didnt take care of the ball really well. Lets face it, Arizona stepped up the intensity during that stretch and the officials kind of let things take care of themselves. Our shot selection was pretty bad once we got down by 10 points. Once Bryce got control of things later on, the offense looked better.
Kevin has got to eliminate those offensive fouls on ball screens. You simply cannot make a movement after being set. As the announcers stated, the ball handler must run off of that screen and await the timing. This will easily be corrected.
I have to say that it sounds like Arizona really paid attention to how we had some major spurts of bad ball handling/lack of scoring last season, and knew what to do to take advantage of that in the second half. If other teams focus on that, and who to really work on, we'll really be a team that others will keep in the game right until the moment that they can hit on, and really take it to us.
one of the single biggest issues i saw was that coming out of halftime, we kept trying to get things going in transition even though arizona's players were good at getting back down the court so quickly. if they have three or four players already back, don't try to beat them back up the court - take your time bringing the ball up.
and what happened with the andy katz story on the drews that was supposed to run at halftime?
I saw the Andy Katz story about the Drews during halftime of the William&Mary-St. John's game actually. It sucks that it wasn't shown during the Valpo game, but it is in the video section of the ESPN website, maybe even found on the front page of the NCAA Basketball page?
i didn't watch it beforehand, thinking it was going to air during halftime of our game. well, damn. guess it's time to watch it now.
I think it was a well played game with top notch effort. Who in the Horizon will stop Kevin? Who in the Horizon will have the speed on the perimeter to defend our shooters like AZ did tonight?
As for the second team, think Fernandez, Jakolis and (probably a first teamer) Boggs, and next year Capobianco.
Guys, we played with 9 scholarship players on the home court of the 16th ranked team. Let's look for some positives. I see a bunch.
In defense of ESPN, the Drew family story is on the front page of the NCAA BB website. You can't really say that they are not being supportive.
Agree with most of the comments about the game. Three comments: 1. It was nice to see the team stay in it through the end. I can't stand moral victories, but the effort was there down the stretch. 2. Team defense covering the guard coming around the screen out high in the second half was terrible. There had to be three or four straight possessions where the Arizona guard was wide open after a simple move coming around the screen. 3. Success for this team will be based on two things: (A) Broekhoff and Van Wijk staying healthy and (B) confident and consistent scoring emerging from Bogan, Harris, and Kenney - will need two of the three per game. Bogan looked better in spells, which is encouraging. Edwards looks lost if he feels he is not getting his points (and looks awful shooting the three) but at times seemed better on defense, hopefully Kenney will find his game as the season goes on as he usually does.
Bryce seemed to coach a good game overall - only negative was that he needed to call a timeout earlier in the second half when Arizona went up 10+ to try to change the momentum. Of course, I can't say that would have helped.
Quote from: valpopal on November 06, 2011, 11:49:25 AM
Rather than win or lose, this match is more important for the opportunity to test the team under real-game circumstances against a quality team in a hostile environment, as well as to add to their experience together, especially working the new guys into the system. In any case, we will start the season with a strong strength of schedule rating.
Latest Vegas odds have Arizona by 13. I'd love an upset; however, if we beat the odds and keep the margin to a dozen or less, I will be surprised and happy. In fact, I hope I'm wrong, but I think I might be a few points optimistic with my prediction of a 15-point margin:
Valpo 64
Arizona 79
By the standards I set above, I'm pleased with the evening. I even called the Valpo point total. There was a drought in the beginning of the second half, something we witnessed at times last year, but I think this was an overall positive experience for the team.
In addition, I keep reminding myself that this is just the start of a two-year project. We are in a rebuilding year after losing a majority of our scoring from last season, and next year this team (hopefully with the additions of Fernandez, Jakolis, Boggs, and Capobianco) should be experienced, much more impressive, and a lot deeper.
Quote from: lowposter on November 07, 2011, 10:31:48 PM
During that stretch in 2H, we simply didnt take care of the ball really well. Lets face it, Arizona stepped up the intensity during that stretch and the officials kind of let things take care of themselves. Our shot selection was pretty bad once we got down by 10 points. Once Bryce got control of things later on, the offense looked better.
Kevin has got to eliminate those offensive fouls on ball screens. You simply cannot make a movement after being set. As the announcers stated, the ball handler must run off of that screen and await the timing. This will easily be corrected.
Those offensive fouls on Kevin were not his fault, as our dribblers left way too early for him to set the screen as the announcers mentioned. It is only natural to try and adjust if such a thing happens.
Overall, I am happy with this performance given what we lost, and playing against the team that we did. Kevin is an absolute beast, and if he continues to play 25+ minutes without fouling this year, he will be very hard to contain. Add in Ryan's 3-pt shooting getting back to what it was last season, and we will be able to run a nice 1-2 with them inside/out.
Getting 5-8 minutes from Vucic every game will definitely help Edwards and Kevin. He has definitely bulked up, gotten a little quicker, just needs to work on positioning himself better on defense to avoid dumb fouls. It also would help if we don't dribble pass to him on the offensive end. That is something Antti always struggled with too, in that it is very hard for a 7'0"+ person to reach very low for the ball under the basket.
Bogan does look like a good shooter, and I believe his turnovers are due to finding his role on the team. He is pretty quick, but initially seems indecisive when he should just let loose a shot.
Buggs looks to have turned into a faster McPherson, minus the 3-pt shot. I absolutely love his aggressiveness going to the basket, tenacious defense, and better FT stroke. He is someone we needed to step up big this year and next, and it seems like the coaching staff got that through to him. Also, you have to credit his work this past summer to get to this point.
As y'all are saying, Edwards looks a bit confused so far. I know he will turn into a good player, but he is also trying to find his role. It seems like he makes too quick of a decision to pass or shoot as soon as he touches the ball, never stopping to look around.
Overall, I never felt like the game was going to get completely out of hand like I have in all of the years after I graduated when we play these better teams. This team gives me the feel of those that I watched in person, in that they can go out and give someone a game, and if things fall in place against a good team, pull one out by a few points. I may be eating these words later in the year, but even when it got to 15-20 pts late in the second half, I still had the confidence that we would get it back to single digits. We had it within 10 pts for around 30 minutes of the game, and it isn't like they were playing their scrubs. They have the #7 ranked recruiting class as FR who are also settling in, yes, but we have lost to other teams by a lot more when they were in similar situations.
I almost forgot to mention that I really like how Bryce handled his first game! I really liked how we tried to work it into the post to allow Kevin an open basket on several occasions. It seemed like that play worked 4-5 times for him, but it also resulted in a few rushed passes. He seems to have a positive demeanor on the sidelines as well, which the players can feed off of.
I am not a big moral victory kinda guy, but that was a pretty good performance. Particularly the playing hard to the end aspect. With this being a young team, every opportunity to improve is critical and this team can build on their performance.
Gotta disagree with you on Kevin's fouls on the screens. After one call, he MUST adjust his game. There should be absolutely no movement on his behalf once he is set. A player must adjust to how the game is being called. Now, that being said, he was a beast down low. As a former low poster, I was excited to see his tenacity, his footwork and skills. This could be quite a breakout year for him. Vujic has to get more involved. It appears this coaching staff has as little confidence in him as last year's. This would have been a good situation for him to play some minutes.
Eric looks like he belongs out there in a big way. He offered just enough offense and seemed to be the quickest player on the floor. I agree with the assessments of Edwards...he must make contributions, but if it is all about his getting points, it will be a poor fit. One of the biggest jobs of the coaching staff will be to get him on board the team bus. I expected quite a bit more from Kenney. He has been thru the ropes with this team and just didnt seem like he got in a rythem last night.
Quote from: lowposter on November 07, 2011, 10:31:48 PM
During that stretch in 2H, we simply didnt take care of the ball really well. Lets face it, Arizona stepped up the intensity during that stretch and the officials kind of let things take care of themselves. Our shot selection was pretty bad once we got down by 10 points. Once Bryce got control of things later on, the offense looked better.
Kevin has got to eliminate those offensive fouls on ball screens. You simply cannot make a movement after being set. As the announcers stated, the ball handler must run off of that screen and await the timing. This will easily be corrected.
I think to my mind, the larger issue is that they shot 5/20 from 3 point range, but they missed what seemed like 4-5 in a row in the first 10 minuts of the second half. While some of that was good defense, they had some good looks at the basket but missed shots. I would have liked to see how the game would have changed if they would have hit 2 of those, just to keep the game close and put more pressure on a good team. Overall, I like the potential in this team, and they can get better. It could be an interesting year in the HL.
Holy crap, is this information from ESPN's game article correct? "[The] Crusaders ... have lost 34 straight games against Top 25 teams since Drew beat Mississippi with a buzzer beater in the 1998 NCAA tournament." That's pathetic. I knew we had a bad string of failure against good teams, but I didn't know it was that awful. What a joke.
Sad to say, Arizona did not look anything like a Top 20 team yesterday. I thought we had a real chance to steal one from an overrated team and make a national headline for the first time in 13 years. Sigh....
Quote from: rink on November 08, 2011, 09:36:24 AM
Holy crap, is this information from ESPN's game article correct? "[The] Crusaders ... have lost 34 straight games against Top 25 teams since Drew beat Mississippi with a buzzer beater in the 1998 NCAA tournament." That's pathetic. I knew we had a bad string of failure against good teams, but I didn't know it was that awful. What a joke.
Sad to say, Arizona did not look anything like a Top 20 team yesterday. I thought we had a real chance to steal one from an overrated team and make a national headline for the first time in 13 years. Sigh....
So, what does a top 25 team look like? Could it have anything to do with our defense?
So good to have rink, cmack and setshot around to cool our enthusiasm! ::)
Quote from: lowposter on November 08, 2011, 06:18:16 AM
I am not a big moral victory kinda guy, but that was a pretty good performance. Particularly the playing hard to the end aspect. With this being a young team, every opportunity to improve is critical and this team can build on their performance.
Gotta disagree with you on Kevin's fouls on the screens. After one call, he MUST adjust his game. There should be absolutely no movement on his behalf once he is set. A player must adjust to how the game is being called. Now, that being said, he was a beast down low. As a former low poster, I was excited to see his tenacity, his footwork and skills. This could be quite a breakout year for him. Vujic has to get more involved. It appears this coaching staff has as little confidence in him as last year's. This would have been a good situation for him to play some minutes.
Eric looks like he belongs out there in a big way. He offered just enough offense and seemed to be the quickest player on the floor. I agree with the assessments of Edwards...he must make contributions, but if it is all about his getting points, it will be a poor fit. One of the biggest jobs of the coaching staff will be to get him on board the team bus. I expected quite a bit more from Kenney. He has been thru the ropes with this team and just didnt seem like he got in a rythem last night.
I can understand that he needs to adjust his game if he is set and then moving, but the point is that the dribblers had already started moving before he even got within a few feet of them. He was never able to be 'set' with them jetting towards the basket long before he gets there. This is a timing thing that needs to be worked on in practice, as you see good teams waiting for the screen to be set before picking a direction to move off of the pick.
Losing 34 straight games against top 25 teams is pretty disheartening, but if you count Butler (and was Washington ranked the season we beat them??), it doesn't look quite so bad. But yes, it would definitely be nice to upset a team once in a while... :thumbsup:
No, Washington was not ranked. If they were ranked that year, they would have been in the NCAA tournament rather than the CBI we played them in.
Quote from: okinawatyphoon on November 08, 2011, 02:46:20 PM
Losing 34 straight games against top 25 teams is pretty disheartening, but if you count Butler (and was Washington ranked the season we beat them??), it doesn't look quite so bad. But yes, it would definitely be nice to upset a team once in a while... :thumbsup:
Last win over a ranked team was 1998 ... that means Butler wasn't ranked last season when you beat them.
I thought it was a very good effort last night and the team did show a lot of heart in not giving up when the deficit got to 20. It seems like a meaningless thing, but when Bryce is talking to a HS recruit, it's clearly a positive to be able to talk about a 9 point loss vs. a 20 or 25 point loss.
i think what typhoon was trying to say is that they were ranked at one point during that season, both for butler and for washington. we're all fully aware that they weren't ranked when we played them, but his point is that we have beaten teams that were fully capable of being ranked.
I believe that Valpo's win in the first game of the 1998-1999 seaason against South Carolina was the last time Valpo beat a ranked team. If memory serves me, they were ranked #25.
Of course that is one game after the 1998 NCAA tourament.
Quote from: EddieCabot on November 08, 2011, 03:49:41 PM
Quote from: okinawatyphoon on November 08, 2011, 02:46:20 PM
Losing 34 straight games against top 25 teams is pretty disheartening, but if you count Butler (and was Washington ranked the season we beat them??), it doesn't look quite so bad. But yes, it would definitely be nice to upset a team once in a while... :thumbsup:
I thought it was a very good effort last night and the team did show a lot of heart in not giving up when the deficit got to 20. It seems like a meaningless thing, but when Bryce is talking to a HS recruit, it's clearly a positive to be able to talk about a 9 point loss vs. a 20 or 25 point loss.
I agree. They easily could have gotten into a defeatist mindset after being down by more than 15, but they gathered themselves together and fought back in the last few minutes to at least make it close. It's a good gauge of our team's attitude, and I like it.
Quote from: rink on November 08, 2011, 09:36:24 AM
Holy crap, is this information from ESPN's game article correct? "[The] Crusaders ... have lost 34 straight games against Top 25 teams since Drew beat Mississippi with a buzzer beater in the 1998 NCAA tournament." That's pathetic. I knew we had a bad string of failure against good teams, but I didn't know it was that awful. What a joke.
Sad to say, Arizona did not look anything like a Top 20 team yesterday. I thought we had a real chance to steal one from an overrated team and make a national headline for the first time in 13 years. Sigh....
Are you going to post this same comment in a couple of weeks when we get knocked around by Ohio State? It isn't like the team is playing the #25 or #24 ranked team in the country. A lot of our ranked opponents seem to fall in the top 10.
Quote from: vu72 on November 08, 2011, 09:49:35 AM
So good to have rink, cmack and setshot around to cool our enthusiasm! ::)
I think you sometimes fail to see without these "enthusiasm coolers," for lack of a better phrase, this board is so one-sided. The board needs these guys to provide some balance. We all know this team is not just a joyful ride every year to the Horizon League title and a trip to the NCAA tournament. Realism is necessary when discussing this team. I'll grant you cmack, and especially setshot and rink can go terribly overboard with the criticism. There must be some posters that challenge all the eternal optimism. Yes, its an exageration of the reality but I believe it's simply a balance to the brown and gold colored thinking of many posters.
I just rewatched the first 10 minutes of the 2nd half of the Arizona game from last night.
Here are Valpo's numbers from that 10 minute stretch:
Turnovers: 6
Missed shots: Van Wijk=3 FG (fouled twice), 1 FT, (2 offensive fouls)
Broekhoff=2 treys
Buggs=2 FG
Bogan=1 trey
Kenney=1 trey
Edwards=1 FG
Made shots: Van Wijk=3 FT, 1 FG
Kenney=1 FG
Time Outs: Arizona 1 at 15:32
Valpo 1 at 13:12
Media 1 at 11:24
At the 10:00 mark of the 2nd half the score was Arizona 52, Valpo 37
Halftime score was Arizona 32, Valpo 30
Quote from: historyman on November 08, 2011, 06:07:29 PM
I think you sometimes fail to see without these "enthusiasm coolers," for lack of a better phrase, this board is so one-sided. The board needs these guys to provide some balance.
Isn't suggesting that negativity adds positivity a contradictio in terminis? ;)
history, are you certain the timeout at 15:32 was called by Arizona, or was it the 16 min. media timeout? In the first ten minutes, if you're as accurate, then there would have been 4 timeouts, two team and two media.
Quote from: valporun on November 09, 2011, 12:41:29 AM
history, are you certain the timeout at 15:32 was called by Arizona, or was it the 16 min. media timeout? In the first ten minutes, if you're as accurate, then there would have been 4 timeouts, two team and two media.
Yes, I'm sure Arizona called a time out at 15:32. When rewatching the DVR recording I noticed that after Broekhoff lost a pass from Bogan out of bounds at the 16:12 mark the refs did not call a media time out. It wasn't until Arizona called a time out at 15:32 that the first time out was called. I believe they called time out because the Wildcat player was nearly tied up and Arizona was afraid of losing possession of the ball. All I can tell you is those are the timeouts on the DVR recording. I was surprised also that another media time out was not called before the 10:00 mark.
Quote from: okinawatyphoon on November 08, 2011, 02:46:20 PM
Losing 34 straight games against top 25 teams is pretty disheartening, but if you count Butler (and was Washington ranked the season we beat them??), it doesn't look quite so bad. But yes, it would definitely be nice to upset a team once in a while... :thumbsup:
I think we all need to take a look at reality for a moment. When a poster says losing 34 straight is a "joke", what did he expect?
Here is reality: Sagarin has had his rankings published for 13 years, going back to 98-99, just after out Sweet 16 run. since then the highest we have been ranked at the end of a season is 62 in 01-02. The next highest year was 02-03 witha 93 ranking and then last year and 07-08 when we finished ranked 94. So, over 13 years we've been in the top 100 5 times.
Now, let's think about the 34 games. How many were at the ARC? 3 or 4? How many were on a nuetral floor? 4 or 5? The odds of a top 90 team beating a top 25 team on their floor are astronomical. Still, we almost did it on several occasions. So, is it a "joke" or pathetic? I don't think so.
Quote from: vu72 on November 09, 2011, 08:43:32 AM
Quote from: okinawatyphoon on November 08, 2011, 02:46:20 PM
Losing 34 straight games against top 25 teams is pretty disheartening, but if you count Butler (and was Washington ranked the season we beat them??), it doesn't look quite so bad. But yes, it would definitely be nice to upset a team once in a while... :thumbsup:
I think we all need to take a look at reality for a moment. When a poster says losing 34 straight is a "joke", what did he expect?
Here is reality: Sagarin has had his rankings published for 13 years, going back to 98-99, just after out Sweet 16 run. since then the highest we have been ranked at the end of a season is 62 in 01-02. The next highest year was 02-03 witha 93 ranking and then last year and 07-08 when we finished ranked 94. So, over 13 years we've been in the top 100 5 times.
Now, let's think about the 34 games. How many were at the ARC? 3 or 4? How many were on a nuetral floor? 4 or 5? The odds of a top 90 team beating a top 25 team on their floor are astronomical. Still, we almost did it on several occasions. So, is it a "joke" or pathetic? I don't think so.
All good points, plus as sectionee mentioned earlier many of those games were against not only Top 25 but Top 10 teams. Homer had a propensity for scheduling perennial powerhouses, not just teams that happened to be ranked at the time. I'm sure everyone recalls that we played the No.1 ranked team in the country five consecutive years.
Quote from: historyman on November 08, 2011, 06:07:29 PM
Quote from: vu72 on November 08, 2011, 09:49:35 AM
So good to have rink, cmack and setshot around to cool our enthusiasm! ::)
I think you sometimes fail to see without these "enthusiasm coolers," for lack of a better phrase, this board is so one-sided. The board needs these guys to provide some balance. We all know this team is not just a joyful ride every year to the Horizon League title and a trip to the NCAA tournament. Realism is necessary when discussing this team. I'll grant you cmack, and especially setshot and rink can go terribly overboard with the criticism. There must be some posters that challenge all the eternal optimism. Yes, its an exageration of the reality but I believe it's simply a balance to the brown and gold colored thinking of many posters.
I'm all for "realism" and "balance". Even I have been critical when a clear lack of effort is obvious. But, people who post things like this:
I predict the usual against major conference opponent. Valpo falls behind big from the opening tip, then pats themselves on the back for keeping within 20 in the second half.Are obviously just trying to throw a wet blanket on the start of a new season. There is no "balance" to statements like this. I reviewed the predictions for the AZ game and found estimates from 5(2) to a 27 point loss. Are those who predict such losses being "realistic" or just plain negative for the sake of being grumpy?? ???
Hats off to Purdue University for making the trip up US421.
Playing tough opponents is good for VU. The mental makeup of the teams has been strong enough to take a pounding. Lets face it, college basketball players have been playing against all levels of competition for years. As 10 year olds, most of them were heads above (literally and figuratively) the kids at the YMCA league. As they moved into HS and serious AAU, they knew where they stood and used tough competition to measure their progress and their deficiencies.
Games against teams like Ohio State (and to a degree Arizona) point out the weaknesses, normally raw athletic abilities and serve as a lesson to the players that they CANNOT count on their athletic abilities to win these games. Look at the first 10 minutes of 2H against Arizona. That was worth the trip. The one on one tendancies, quick 3 point shots on the first pass, the in traffic passes will not work against these types of teams, particularly after adjustments are made. To Bryce's credit, he got the team back on track in the last 10 minutes to finish strong. Let's see who learned from that lesson. No moral victory here, but a good lesson. More of the same vs THE Ohio State University soon. Butler has been able to combine pretty good athletes, with the ability to play within a system that causes the big boys problems. They are the model at this time.
Quote from: vu72 on November 09, 2011, 09:13:58 AM
I'm all for "realism" and "balance". Even I have been critical when a clear lack of effort is obvious. But, people who post things like this:
I predict the usual against major conference opponent. Valpo falls behind big from the opening tip, then pats themselves on the back for keeping within 20 in the second half.
Are obviously just trying to throw a wet blanket on the start of a new season. There is no "balance" to statements like this. I reviewed the predictions for the AZ game and found estimates from 5(2) to a 27 point loss. Are those who predict such losses being "realistic" or just plain negative for the sake of being grumpy?? ???
I think maybe the way the statement was worded was somewhat "grumpy." But has not the past record of Valpo proven that in games against "major" top ranked teams they have sometimes fallen behind big and then coasted to a 20 to 30 point loss? Sometimes even a 40 point loss. To me the prediction that Valpo would lose to Arizona and keep the score within 20 in the second half could be interpreted as realistic. Valpo had not proven that much against Hillsdale or Augustana, except what a great player Kevin Van Wijk is when his back is healthy, what an outstanding shooter and scorer Ryan Broekhoff is and that Erik Buggs had improved his FT shooting and was just as quick as last year on defense. Nothing has been proven about whether the bench will help pick up some of the scoring slack which left with the departures of Wood and Johnson. Past performance of the Crusaders said this losing to Arizona by around 20 could have happened. It wouldn't have surprised me. I was very pleased to see that Valpo hung with Arizona through the first half and was able to take a lead a few times until their shooting went cold in the second half and Arizona toughened up their defense or fouled Kevin 2 or more times. I was also very happy to see Valpo brought back the confidence they had in the first half and out scored Arizona in the 2nd part of the 2nd half to finish the game 9 points down instead of 17 or 18 down or even possibly more than 20 points down. Yes, that statement was worded in a "grumpy" way due to frustration with past performance against top ranked teams but I would not call it unrealistic. How easily Valpo could have fallen to a 20 plus point loss if Bryce had not rallied them and the shooting stayed cold. This prediction could have easily happened. Certainly not the proper way to state a prediction but certainly not unrealistic.
http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2011/11/pps-for-arizona-game.html (http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2011/11/pps-for-arizona-game.html)
I used the statistics from the game as a warm up for my advanced math students today.
Quote from: sectionee on November 10, 2011, 03:43:05 PM
http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2011/11/pps-for-arizona-game.html (http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2011/11/pps-for-arizona-game.html)
I used the statistics from the game as a warm up for my advanced math students today.
is this going to be a regular occurrence? lol. maybe if i had math professors doing things like this, i wouldn't have failed calculus so badly.