RealTimeRPI has us losing by nine: http://realtimerpi.com/rpi_281_Men.html; (http://realtimerpi.com/rpi_281_Men.html;) Teamrankings by eight: http://www.teamrankings.com/ncaa-basketball/matchup/crusaders-lions-2012-02-17 (http://www.teamrankings.com/ncaa-basketball/matchup/crusaders-lions-2012-02-17)
KenPom and Massey have both teams more evenly rated, but no score predictor. I think we can surprise this team, but we need everyone healthy and to play a decent game. As always, we need to control the boards and limit our turnovers.
Valpo 72
LMU 71
marymount has nobody over 6-9, but they have six players between 6-6 and 6-9. based solely on looking at their roster, we look fairly even matched. i'm hoping for a good game.
On paper the teams are fairly evenly matched; however, the score in this game doesn't really mean anything. This is one of the unfortunate consequences to the way the Bracketbusters is set up. The match has more of an exhibition game feeling to it. Plus, the main focus should be on the two conference games next week.
I just hope the players enjoy their trip to California and nobody gets injured. I wouldn't mind if Kevin played fewer minutes and regained his full health, while Vujic got some more minutes and experience.
Valpo 64
LMU 76
LMU will have a HUGE homecourt advantage in this game, much like we did last year. We are going into hostile territory for a primetime game and probably a full house. If we lose and Bryce is able to right the ship like Counzo Martin did last year with his team then I really don't think this game has much bearing on the season or our chances in the tournament.
Valpo 77
LMU 72
We play well, they are down from their two recent tough games against Gonzaga and St. Mary's.
The only thing to be gained from this game is a sense of our ability to take on an unknown team of potential NCAA tourney caliber. If we can man up to this challenge, *then* get back to business and win out, the gain in confidence might be significance.
Unfortunately, it is no easy task, especially since this is a bit like bread and circuses, where lesser mortals fight each other for the amusement of the ruling class ;) Obviously a real honest to goodness bracket buster event would more closely forecast a real NCAA tourney first round game. Worthy contenders would take on power conference teams at neutral sites (closer to the power conference team's home is fine with me) as a preview of what might happen in March. I wouldn't mind stipulating that the real match up in March can't be the same two teams.
Oh wait, the NCAA isn't really in charge of the basketball season, are they? Never mind...
Anyway, the only thing to do in a situation like this is develop a cold-blooded serenity about the powers-that-be and just make it about your own performance, much like I think Valpo has to do on lonely Tuesday nights when the ARC is half empty and the 1 seed is on the line. Screw them; win for winning's sake, pretend the stands are full or pretend you're on the road. Don't let the outside world dictate your performance. Find a way to generate your own energy. Then when the outside world takes notice and gives you your due, kill them with humility ;)
Easier said then done ;)
Same result as found here:
http://indiana.sbnation.com/2012/2/15/2801235/northwestern-vs-indiana-hoosiers-hold-on-vs-wildcats (http://indiana.sbnation.com/2012/2/15/2801235/northwestern-vs-indiana-hoosiers-hold-on-vs-wildcats)
Quote from: StlVUFan on February 15, 2012, 07:28:59 PM
The only thing to be gained from this game is a sense of our ability to take on an unknown team of potential NCAA tourney caliber. If we can man up to this challenge, *then* get back to business and win out, the gain in confidence might be significance.
Unfortunately, it is no easy task, especially since this is a bit like bread and circuses, where lesser mortals fight each other for the amusement of the ruling class ;) Obviously a real honest to goodness bracket buster event would more closely forecast a real NCAA tourney first round game. Worthy contenders would take on power conference teams at neutral sites (closer to the power conference team's home is fine with me) as a preview of what might happen in March. I wouldn't mind stipulating that the real match up in March can't be the same two teams.
Oh wait, the NCAA isn't really in charge of the basketball season, are they? Never mind...
Anyway, the only thing to do in a situation like this is develop a cold-blooded serenity about the powers-that-be and just make it about your own performance, much like I think Valpo has to do on lonely Tuesday nights when the ARC is half empty and the 1 seed is on the line. Screw them; win for winning's sake, pretend the stands are full or pretend you're on the road. Don't let the outside world dictate your performance. Find a way to generate your own energy. Then when the outside world takes notice and gives you your due, kill them with humility ;)
Easier said then done ;)
Kid, this is one of your finest pieces of work. I agree with every point you made and could have stated nothing in any better fashion. I am impressed, and believe that if you were nominated for "poster of the week" you would win in a landslide.
Quote from: justducky on February 15, 2012, 08:15:36 PM
Quote from: StlVUFan on February 15, 2012, 07:28:59 PM
The only thing to be gained from this game is a sense of our ability to take on an unknown team of potential NCAA tourney caliber. If we can man up to this challenge, *then* get back to business and win out, the gain in confidence might be significance.
Unfortunately, it is no easy task, especially since this is a bit like bread and circuses, where lesser mortals fight each other for the amusement of the ruling class ;) Obviously a real honest to goodness bracket buster event would more closely forecast a real NCAA tourney first round game. Worthy contenders would take on power conference teams at neutral sites (closer to the power conference team's home is fine with me) as a preview of what might happen in March. I wouldn't mind stipulating that the real match up in March can't be the same two teams.
Oh wait, the NCAA isn't really in charge of the basketball season, are they? Never mind...
Anyway, the only thing to do in a situation like this is develop a cold-blooded serenity about the powers-that-be and just make it about your own performance, much like I think Valpo has to do on lonely Tuesday nights when the ARC is half empty and the 1 seed is on the line. Screw them; win for winning's sake, pretend the stands are full or pretend you're on the road. Don't let the outside world dictate your performance. Find a way to generate your own energy. Then when the outside world takes notice and gives you your due, kill them with humility ;)
Easier said then done ;)
Kid, this is one of your finest pieces of work. I agree with every point you made and could have stated nothing in any better fashion. I am impressed, and believe that if you were nominated for "poster of the week" you would win in a landslide.
:)
What can I say, I've been in a Kyle state of mind lately (www.midmajority.com (http://www.midmajority.com)).
Quote from: valpopal on February 15, 2012, 05:57:38 PM
On paper the teams are fairly evenly matched; however, the score in this game doesn't really mean anything. This is one of the unfortunate consequences to the way the Bracketbusters is set up. The match has more of an exhibition game feeling to it. Plus, the main focus should be on the two conference games next week.
I just hope the players enjoy their trip to California and nobody gets injured. I wouldn't mind if Kevin played fewer minutes and regained his full health, while Vujic got some more minutes and experience.
Valpo 64
LMU 76
L-Marymount beat #21 St Mary's last night 75-60 and by doing so have jumped just ahead of us with a RPI of 90. My guess is that this changes nothing and that both teams still have no chance of either an NCAA or NIT at large bid. Since the only thing that matters then is their league standings and tournaments one could speculate that perhaps some unspoken or spoken understanding exists as to the goals and conduct of this game.
I agree with Valpopal on VanWijk and Vucic. Why not start the game with the intent of getting Vucic no less than 12 minutes and Kevin no more than 17. Within those stated constraints you will do pretty much anything else you can do to win. Maybe you would even want to start Vucic at the 5 Edwards at the 4 with Broekhoff at the 3. That might give us a sneak preview of Both Edwards playing a true 4 and Ryan playing a true 3. Then perhaps at the 16 minute mark you start going towards your more traditional rotations. If nothing else it would be an interesting look.
Loyola- Marymount 80 Valpo 73 but then who really cares?
Quote from: justducky on February 16, 2012, 02:39:02 AM
Quote from: valpopal on February 15, 2012, 05:57:38 PM
On paper the teams are fairly evenly matched; however, the score in this game doesn't really mean anything. This is one of the unfortunate consequences to the way the Bracketbusters is set up. The match has more of an exhibition game feeling to it. Plus, the main focus should be on the two conference games next week.
I just hope the players enjoy their trip to California and nobody gets injured. I wouldn't mind if Kevin played fewer minutes and regained his full health, while Vujic got some more minutes and experience.
Valpo 64
LMU 76
L-Marymount beat #21 St Mary's last night 75-60 and by doing so have jumped just ahead of us with a RPI of 90. My guess is that this changes nothing and that both teams still have no chance of either an NCAA or NIT at large bid. Since the only thing that matters then is their league standings and tournaments one could speculate that perhaps some unspoken or spoken understanding exists as to the goals and conduct of this game.
I agree with Valpopal on VanWijk and Vucic. Why not start the game with the intent of getting Vucic no less than 12 minutes and Kevin no more than 17. Within those stated constraints you will do pretty much anything else you can do to win. Maybe you would even want to start Vucic at the 5 Edwards at the 4 with Broekhoff at the 3. That might give us a sneak preview of Both Edwards playing a true 4 and Ryan playing a true 3. Then perhaps at the 16 minute mark you start going towards your more traditional rotations. If nothing else it would be an interesting look.
Loyola- Marymount 80 Valpo 73 but then who really cares?
i don't know the state of the wcc standings, so i can't speak for marymount. but if we win the conference regular season championship, we're guaranteed no worse than an nit autobid. but i agree that there's no way we get an ncaa at-large. too spotty of a record with some losses that really shouldn't have happened.
LMU is currently sitting 4th in the West Coast Conference behind St. Mary's, Gonzaga, and BYU. Besides St. Mary's and Gonzaga, the league doesn't really have any strength to it. I watched this game online last night, and LMU got the lead and held on it for 98% of the ghame. It was early in the 2nd half where St. Mary's got a short-lived lead. I thought momentum might shift to the Gaels, but then the Lions continued playing the game they'd been playing all game long. It was a good physical game, and based on the final score, I hope LMU gives us a good physical game that we can build momentum going into the Loyola Ramblers and Butler games. I'm not certain about the game tomorrow night, but as long as we can use it to our advantage on Tuesday and next Saturday, I'm almost certain we can make this game help us get the HL regular season title and autobid to the NIT.
(edit: I forgot that conference realignment hit the WCC, and they added BYU to their league. I don't really feel it changed the outlook of the game or anything in my post, besides the first line. I can't say that BYU has changed the conference strength until they've really been in it for a few years or so.)
Courtesy of pgmado's twitter account
QuoteValparaiso big man Kevin Van Wijk will not travel to California in order to rest for final Horizon League games.
Hope we can still put on a good showing without KVW. Richie and Hrvoje will need to step up defensively so LMU doesn't run amok in the paint...
Smart decision on Bryce's part to leave KVW home.
I am changing my prediction with the KVW information:
LMU 78
Valpo 68
This is great news that Kevin is staying behind to rest. This game is meaningless and a distraction for the real goal....winning out the HL and securing home cooking for the tournament.
All this talk about the HL tournament reminds me oh so much of similar talk a year ago. That sure didnt work out, did it?
Ed
Quote from: valporun on February 16, 2012, 09:55:54 AM
I watched this game online last night
On what platform? I looked at espn3 this morning, and didn't see it in the Replay tab, but maybe it hasn't been loaded yet.
LMU 81
Valpo 66
Playing these Bracketbuster games is just a bad idea and I hope this is our last one.
Paul
I guess I am still in the minority in thinking that these games are good for us. I know that the student-athletes really enjoy getting to play an extra out-of-conference team, and if you are doing well, you get to test yourself against a quality opponent. We will have plenty of time to rest up after the game, so we can't use it as an excuse if we don't play well against Loyola.
I'll bet Kevin was a little disappointed in not getting to take a trip to California. :)
At least no one on here has suggested forfeiting the game, as they did on the Cleveland State message board in the wake of Tuesday's crushing loss.
Quote from: StlVUFan on February 16, 2012, 11:25:43 AM
Quote from: valporun on February 16, 2012, 09:55:54 AM
I watched this game online last night
On what platform? I looked at espn3 this morning, and didn't see it in the Replay tab, but maybe it hasn't been loaded yet.
It was linked thru the foreign First Row Sports website, not the US one that apparently got blocked by our "favorite" government.
Quote from: valporun on February 16, 2012, 12:41:06 PM
Quote from: StlVUFan on February 16, 2012, 11:25:43 AM
Quote from: valporun on February 16, 2012, 09:55:54 AM
I watched this game online last night
On what platform? I looked at espn3 this morning, and didn't see it in the Replay tab, but maybe it hasn't been loaded yet.
It was linked thru the foreign First Row Sports website, not the US one that apparently got blocked by our "favorite" government.
Had a feeling. Just found out about that. They don't keep archives, so it's too late now ;)
Quote from: KL31NY on February 16, 2012, 10:48:59 AMValparaiso big man Kevin Van Wijk will not travel to California in order to rest for final Horizon League games.
That might indicate that things are not as hunky dory as we have been led to believe with Kevin's knee and or back.
Quote from: FWalum on February 16, 2012, 01:13:32 PM
Quote from: KL31NY on February 16, 2012, 10:48:59 AMValparaiso big man Kevin Van Wijk will not travel to California in order to rest for final Horizon League games.
That might indicate that things are not as hunky dory as we have been led to believe with Kevin's knee and or back.
Jet lag and elevation can be problems on a back and knee during a quick trip like this will be. We'll need Kevin for the final two HL games, not Loyola Marymount in Los Angeles. If this were a home game, then Kevin might have played sparingly.
Quote from: FWalum on February 16, 2012, 01:13:32 PM
Quote from: KL31NY on February 16, 2012, 10:48:59 AMValparaiso big man Kevin Van Wijk will not travel to California in order to rest for final Horizon League games.
That might indicate that things are not as hunky dory as we have been led to believe with Kevin's knee and or back.
I agree with FWAlum. I think this may not bode well for Kevin being in great shape for the last 2 HL home games and most importantly for the HL tourney in our own back yard. I do think Valpo can beat Loyola without Kevin but I would hate to see him miss the HL tourney. Valpo needs Kevin bad. That was evidenced by the difference in the YSU and UIC games.
We'll miss Kevin defensively. LMU 83, VU 65
this hurts our interior depth. this means that richie will start in kvw's place and vucic will come off the bench to spell him. i think there's a slight chance that vucic and richie might see a little bit of mutual time on the floor, giving a more traditional look, but i fully expect one to be on the bench resting while the other's on the floor for the majority of the game.
i disagree with paul's bracketbuster statement, and hope that we continue to take part in the bracketbuster as a conference. it's generally a great measuring stick to see how we might play against a comparable team from another conference. but over the last couple years, i've started becoming more sympathetic to the argument of moving it to the early non-con schedule. this late in the season, it does conceivably become more of a distraction than it helps.
These games should be played in December instead of unconvincing everyone with mid February games. KVW staying back is just for further rest, he will be fine for Tuesday.
Quote from: valpotx on February 16, 2012, 12:15:21 PM
I guess I am still in the minority in thinking that these games are good for us. I know that the student-athletes really enjoy getting to play an extra out-of-conference team, and if you are doing well, you get to test yourself against a quality opponent. We will have plenty of time to rest up after the game, so we can't use it as an excuse if we don't play well against Loyola.
Quote from: vuweathernerd on February 16, 2012, 02:44:00 PMi disagree with paul's bracketbuster statement, and hope that we continue to take part in the bracketbuster as a conference. it's generally a great measuring stick to see how we might play against a comparable team from another conference. but over the last couple years, i've started becoming more sympathetic to the argument of moving it to the early non-con schedule. this late in the season, it does conceivably become more of a distraction than it helps.
Not sure if it is a minority or not, but I like seeing the matchups as well. I also agree that with only 2 or 3 HL games left in the regular season, that the team's focus should be on the HL games. Either early conference or pre-conference schedule might be better. Maybe the ProBowl weekend, since most of the media attention will be on the upcoming Super Bowl Weekend. Just a thought.
Quote from: covufan on February 16, 2012, 07:29:19 PM
Quote from: valpotx on February 16, 2012, 12:15:21 PM
I guess I am still in the minority in thinking that these games are good for us. I know that the student-athletes really enjoy getting to play an extra out-of-conference team, and if you are doing well, you get to test yourself against a quality opponent. We will have plenty of time to rest up after the game, so we can't use it as an excuse if we don't play well against Loyola.
Quote from: vuweathernerd on February 16, 2012, 02:44:00 PMi disagree with paul's bracketbuster statement, and hope that we continue to take part in the bracketbuster as a conference. it's generally a great measuring stick to see how we might play against a comparable team from another conference. but over the last couple years, i've started becoming more sympathetic to the argument of moving it to the early non-con schedule. this late in the season, it does conceivably become more of a distraction than it helps.
Not sure if it is a minority or not, but I like seeing the matchups as well. I also agree that with only 2 or 3 HL games left in the regular season, that the team's focus should be on the HL games. Either early conference or pre-conference schedule might be better. Maybe the ProBowl weekend, since most of the media attention will be on the upcoming Super Bowl Weekend. Just a thought.
i do kind of understand the timing as they're currently scheduled. because it gives teams a chance to actually prove themselves and allows for more accurate gauging of matchups.
I believe that Bryce not taking KVW on this trip definitely shows how much BracketBusters mean in general. This game means absolutely nothing. Possibly the difference in a 13 and 14, etc, if they do make the tournament. The top five matchups (Murray St vs. St. Marys, Creighton vs LBSU) may actually have slight implications, but these games seem to put more pressure on lower level teams than it is worth. Since the matchups were annonced, Murray St. had their first loss, St. Mary's lost at home to LMU, Creighton has lost three in a row, and Cleveland St. (who also has a televised game) has tanked. It does help teams get more exposure, but when everyone gets exposure these days, what does it matter?
I do believe that these games may be more meaningful in late January or earlier in February. December would be too early (it wouldn't be known who is the elite of mid-majordom), and February is too late, because all the cards are pretty much already on the table (ie, any HL team needs to win their league to make it, and imo, one loss or win against another good mid-major team won't change much for the top few matchups).
Anyways, I hope Valpo doesn't lose any momentum or get injured, and anything more than that is a pro. I think with the HL having games on ESPN networks fairly regularly, there doesn't seem to be much need for the added exposure.
Personally, I really like the Brackbuster games the way they are. Coaches will always find something to complain about with the schedule.
I like it. I really want to see a full power Valpo take on Loyola Marymount. They have gotten votes in the Mid Major Top 25 lately. Maybe just my opinion, but a solid win might give us a better rank in the tourney and/or a better look by NIT/CIT. I think the opposite could be true with a loss.
I totally get not taking Kevin on the trip, don't get me wrong. I don't like not playing to win every game. I don't think we can get a loss from here out.
http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2012/02/game-preview-bracket-buster.html (http://sectionee.blogspot.com/2012/02/game-preview-bracket-buster.html)
A special guest writer is going to the game and will be writing a post for us. Hope to have it Saturday night. Until then, here is a preview.
Just wanted to share with everyone a comment I found on the Milwaukee message board. No guarantees on accuracy of the statement, but I found it rather interesting.
"Learned tonight: After two more years, the Horizon League is pulling out of this event.
Once the MEAC and SWAC got involved, you knew that BracketBusters was terribly bloated.
We're reportedly looking to do a challenge series instead, sometime early in the season."
Big :thumbsup: if this is correct
Now, I WOULD support a challenge series against the MVC, or a similar ranking conference (upper mid-major conference like ours).
Here is a brief audio interview with Bryce about the BracketBusters, Loyola Marymount, and the strength of the Horizon League:
http://siriusxmsports.posterous.com/valparaiso-coach-bryce-drew-joined-mark-packe (http://siriusxmsports.posterous.com/valparaiso-coach-bryce-drew-joined-mark-packe)
QuoteNow, I WOULD support a challenge series against the MVC, or a similar ranking conference (upper mid-major conference like ours).
Agreed. Both conferences have 10 teams, so we could have a 5 year agreement where each Horizon League team plays 2 MVC teams a year (1 home, 1 away).
I'm guessing (and hoping) this is just another example of bad journalism poorly sourced by NBC:
"The 2012 Crusaders are atop the Horizon League standings, but may have to finish the season without their best player, Kevin Van Wijk, who suffered a knee injury earlier in the month."
http://beyondthearc.nbcsports.com/2012/02/16/ten-bracketbuster-teams-casual-fans-need-to-know-more-about/ (http://beyondthearc.nbcsports.com/2012/02/16/ten-bracketbuster-teams-casual-fans-need-to-know-more-about/)
Quote from: valpopal on February 17, 2012, 09:00:18 AM
I'm guessing (and hoping) this is just another example of bad journalism poorly sourced by NBC:
"The 2012 Crusaders are atop the Horizon League standings, but may have to finish the season without their best player, Kevin Van Wijk, who suffered a knee injury earlier in the month."
http://beyondthearc.nbcsports.com/2012/02/16/ten-bracketbuster-teams-casual-fans-need-to-know-more-about/ (http://beyondthearc.nbcsports.com/2012/02/16/ten-bracketbuster-teams-casual-fans-need-to-know-more-about/)
Also a reference to
Kevin Broekhoff? Wow.......
Quote from: valpopal on February 17, 2012, 09:00:18 AM
I'm guessing (and hoping) this is just another example of bad journalism poorly sourced by NBC:
"The 2012 Crusaders are atop the Horizon League standings, but may have to finish the season without their best player, Kevin Van Wijk, who suffered a knee injury earlier in the month."
http://beyondthearc.nbcsports.com/2012/02/16/ten-bracketbuster-teams-casual-fans-need-to-know-more-about/ (http://beyondthearc.nbcsports.com/2012/02/16/ten-bracketbuster-teams-casual-fans-need-to-know-more-about/)
I'm discounting the story by NBC but maybe FWAlum and whoever else mentioned it have better intuition and KVW really is out for the rest of the season or at least not nearly at full strength. This is where Valpo can make up an excuse or go out and prove to the HL that they are not so dependent on one player. I say Valpo needs to prove this is a
TEAM. The Valpo Way or whatever you want to call it.
I suspect they are wrong as he didn't look all that bad against UIC and he'll have another week of rest from that game until the Loyola game.
Here's a question: Some have said that there were other teams who deserved a TV game yet Valpo got one in prime time. Could ESPN be influenced by the fact that in the past two TV games Valpo has had in the Bracketbuster, that we have played well and indeed won. If I'm on to something (versus being on something) then this game may have more significance than first thought.
My comment was sure speculation. I have not talked to anyone in the program. I only suggested it because of experience with players that have come back a little too early only to have to sit an extra game. If you remember in the UIC game there was a play were Kevin did like an awkward half split, he continued to play but left the game a few minutes later and had limited minutes after that. I mentioned it in the chat and thought he looked a little more tentative after that incident. In other words, don't read too much into what I said. The following article touches on Kevin waking up sore the next day.
Valpo heads West for Bracketbuster (http://posttrib.suntimes.com/sports/10695263-419/valparaiso-heads-west-for-bracketbuster.html)
Interesting comments about the HL pulling out of the Bracketbuster. The Valley currently has a challenge in place with the Mountain West through 2012. With conference realignment in play however, I wonder if that challenge will be extended to future years. Who knows, but even if the MVC is unavailable, they may as well have an HL/MAC challenge during the interim since it seems like we play a lot of MAC teams anyway. It will be interesting to see what exactly happens if anything on the "challenge" front.
I am sure that our name helps us get the ESPN bracketbuster games when we have a decent RPI, but I believe our match-up is one of the top 10 in combined RPI, so it only makes sense with 13 televised.
Quote from: valpopal on February 17, 2012, 07:04:33 AM
Here is a brief audio interview with Bryce about the BracketBusters, Loyola Marymount, and the strength of the Horizon League:
http://siriusxmsports.posterous.com/valparaiso-coach-bryce-drew-joined-mark-packe (http://siriusxmsports.posterous.com/valparaiso-coach-bryce-drew-joined-mark-packe)
Well, um, I ah, um, thought Bryce, um did a pretty good job, um, in describing our situation, um, and how strong the Horizon League has been, um, and how tough they currently are, um.
Quote from: crusaderjoe on February 17, 2012, 12:17:59 PM
Interesting comments about the HL pulling out of the Bracketbuster. The Valley currently has a challenge in place with the Mountain West through 2012. With conference realignment in play however, I wonder if that challenge will be extended to future years. Who knows, but even if the MVC is unavailable, they may as well have an HL/MAC challenge during the interim since it seems like we play a lot of MAC teams anyway. It will be interesting to see what exactly happens if anything on the "challenge" front.
Keep in mind that in the next couple of years, the Mountain West will dissolve and those teams will join a big conference with C-USA. Could be the chance to start something up with the Valley.
If we can't get something going with the Valley, then the MAC would be a good option. Could be called the "Bus League" Challenge.
Living in St. Louis, I'm kinda partial to the A-10 myself ;)
Now that this thread has been jacked, and I enabled it too, back to tonight's game. I'm basically conceding this game to LMU. I don't think we'll have the horses inside to contend with their bigs, and the momentum coming off the road win at Moraga against St. Mary's. Not having Kevin, for good reason, won't help us inside because Richie is in the same boat as Jay and Matt, better off the bench for that quick energy boost to help change the momentum or the pace of the game.
Quote from: valporun on February 17, 2012, 01:23:37 PM
Now that this thread has been jacked, and I enabled it too, back to tonight's game. I'm basically conceding this game to LMU. I don't think we'll have the horses inside to contend with their bigs, and the momentum coming off the road win at Moraga against St. Mary's. Not having Kevin, for good reason, won't help us inside because Richie is in the same boat as Jay and Matt, better off the bench for that quick energy boost to help change the momentum or the pace of the game.
they don't have much in the way of bigs - nobody over 6-9. i think the combo of richie and vucic will be okay. do i expect us to win? not as much, now that kevin got left behind. (a decision i completely support, fwiw.) but i think that if we have a decent night shooting the ball, and play our standard defense, we'll be fine.
Quote from: KL31NY on February 16, 2012, 10:48:59 AM
Courtesy of pgmado's twitter account
QuoteValparaiso big man Kevin Van Wijk will not travel to California in order to rest for final Horizon League games.
Hope we can still put on a good showing without KVW. Richie and Hrvoje will need to step up defensively so LMU doesn't run amok in the paint...
GREAT coaching move! There's nothing to be gained from this game other than what has already been stated, so getting Kevin healthy will be a big help for the Horizon League Tourney. Heck, once the double bye is locked up, I might rest him then too.
No Kevin = almost total reliance on closely guarded outside jump shots. I fully expect a major beatdown. I will be surprised if we come within 10 points. Obviously, I hope I'm wrong - but I doubt it.
Quote from: milanmiracle on February 17, 2012, 04:10:24 PM
Quote from: KL31NY on February 16, 2012, 10:48:59 AM
Courtesy of pgmado's twitter account
QuoteValparaiso big man Kevin Van Wijk will not travel to California in order to rest for final Horizon League games.
Hope we can still put on a good showing without KVW. Richie and Hrvoje will need to step up defensively so LMU doesn't run amok in the paint...
GREAT coaching move! There's nothing to be gained from this game other than what has already been stated, so getting Kevin healthy will be a big help for the Horizon League Tourney. Heck, once the double bye is locked up, I might rest him then too.
Which it is -- now. No future tense needed ;) Did you mean home court advantage?
I love matt's energy, but when is he going to learn that you can't jump in the air without knowing what you are going to do with the ball.
I agree, Matt looked like crap tonight. Both he and Boggs jump WAY too much when they have the ball, without first seeing where they are going to throw or shoot it.
Not a bad effort after that embarrassing first 10 minutes of play. I think we win that game with KVW.
Quote from: FWalum on February 17, 2012, 09:17:03 PM
I love matt's energy, but when is he going to learn that you can't jump in the air without knowing what you are going to do with the ball.
Ditto for Ben...
Starting Vucic who can't score along with Eric who can't score and Ben who rarely scores put us in a deep hole at the beginning of both halves. I suppose it makes some sense (maybe) to keep Richie in his normal rotation until Kevin gets back, but you're basically giving the game away in the process.
I will be so happy when next year comes and we have more options at the 3, 4 and 5. We have far too many minutes being played by 1's and 2's.
I agree, wh. I will enjoy seeing our deep bench next year, when Kevin doesn't have to play 25+ minutes a game, same for Ryan.
Well, not a bad game, all things considered. Fairly tough defense (LMU just doesn't move the ball! We passed _so much_ more than they, and it led to better shots) and some streaky good three point shooting kept it respectable. Amazing how long we hung around in the first half with e.g. two points, without Loyola running away with it.
Is Loyola known for their transition offense? Was this some sort of calculated risk, trading any hope of offensive rebounds to end their transition game? Or was it just bad rebounding? I guess that's the only excuse on the defensive end...
Also, how about that 3 from Vucic? It almost went in, surprisingly. I guess he is a second coming of Calum McLeod, more of a mid-range/outside 7' player.
It's funny how their fans forum is saying our bigs haven't played a team like that before. Well, our only true post player didn't make the trip, so I don't think you can say that fairly lol.
Found their board and posts to be pretty knowledgeable prior to the game. Then after the game they made it sound like they really schooled us and how great they played... They do realize that we started a kid tonight who has averaged about five minutes and 1.7 points a game in place of our second leading scorer and rebounder, don't they?? We left the two time Horizon League player of the week at HOME. I wonder what the outcome would have been like if we would have had Van Wijk and they were missing Drew Viney or Anthony Ireland. As far as athletic big men, they ought to try Eli Holman and LaMarcus Lowe on for size.
Matt kenney is always not very good, every game I watch.
Has any team missed more bunnies than valpo over the last decade?
Lmu looked pretty terrible for most of the game, should have beat them despite the VW excuse.
Quote from: rink on February 18, 2012, 04:06:37 AM
Matt kenney is always not very good, every game I watch.
Has any team missed more bunnies than valpo over the last decade?
Lmu looked pretty terrible for most of the game, should have beat them despite the VW excuse.
Yes, they missed a lot of layups last night.
But rink, have you seen the 2-point field goal percentage rankings this year?
KVW or not, we still should have won this game...once again, Buggs is still a disappointment, when you are totally not an offensive threat to score, a lot of effort is wasted and he is the epitome of that...now let's win the conference! GO VALPO!
Does anyone know why Broekhoff played very little in the last 5 minutes?
I agree with other posters that it was a good decision by Bryce to leave KVW at home. The big games are in the next 17 days and Valpo needs to dominate the Loyola game to prevent a "too big" Butler game.
Bracketbuster is a good format for giving mid-majors visibility when basketball is the national sports focus. Doing it in December just competes with football. A "conference challenge" is good for the Horizon if it is against the MVC or A10. Frankly, the MAC has not done much for years and the bottom half of their conference is pretty weak.
Quote from: rink on February 18, 2012, 04:06:37 AM
Matt kenney is always not very good, every game I watch.
You need to watch more games ;)
Quote from: vu84v2 on February 18, 2012, 12:02:43 PM
Does anyone know why Broekhoff played very little in the last 5 minutes?
I figured by that time Bryce had pretty much conceded and didn't want Ryan to get hurt as KVW did against Cleveland State.
Quote from: StlVUFan on February 18, 2012, 06:46:20 PM
Quote from: rink on February 18, 2012, 04:06:37 AM
Matt kenney is always not very good, every game I watch.
You need to watch more games ;)
Or watch less....
Quote from: StlVUFan on February 15, 2012, 07:28:59 PMObviously a real honest to goodness bracket buster event would more closely forecast a real NCAA tourney first round game. Worthy contenders would take on power conference teams at neutral sites (closer to the power conference team's home is fine with me) as a preview of what might happen in March. I wouldn't mind stipulating that the real match up in March can't be the same two teams.
http://www.daytondailynews.com/dayton-sports/wright-state-university-raiders/commentary-bracketbusters-has-run-its-course-1330932.html?cxtype=rss_wsu (http://www.daytondailynews.com/dayton-sports/wright-state-university-raiders/commentary-bracketbusters-has-run-its-course-1330932.html?cxtype=rss_wsu)
Looks like I'm not the only one who thinks this way ;)
Quote from: valpo64 on February 18, 2012, 11:03:28 AM
KVW or not, we still should have won this game...once again, Buggs is still a disappointment, when you are totally not an offensive threat to score, a lot of effort is wasted and he is the epitome of that...now let's win the conference! GO VALPO!
Just curious how Buggs was a disappointment. In the game I watched, his energy single-handedly sparked his teammates and led to the second half comeback. He had a couple nice steals, pushed the ball in transition and set up shooters for open 3s in transition. His effort was not unnoticed by his teammates, who mobbed him in the huddle when LMU was forced to take a timeout.
I think this kid gets a bad rap, moreso than any other player on the team. Is he a legit outside threat? Obviously not, but at least he knows it and almost always plays within himself. He doesn't fall into the trap of opponents sagging off of him to force up bad shots, which many less intelligent players would be tempted to do.
Also, posters on here constantly note that when/if he gets in foul trouble, our offense goes into a lull. That, to me, shows how important he is to this team and its prospect for success.
Buggs, like everyone else, is far from a perfect player but he is a lot better, in my opinion, than what he is often given credit for.
Very well put! Does Erik have flaws? Certainly but all the guys do.
Quote from: crusaderboy on February 19, 2012, 07:29:25 AM
Quote from: valpo64 on February 18, 2012, 11:03:28 AM
KVW or not, we still should have won this game...once again, Buggs is still a disappointment, when you are totally not an offensive threat to score, a lot of effort is wasted and he is the epitome of that...now let's win the conference! GO VALPO!
Just curious how Buggs was a disappointment. In the game I watched, his energy single-handedly sparked his teammates and led to the second half comeback. He had a couple nice steals, pushed the ball in transition and set up shooters for open 3s in transition. His effort was not unnoticed by his teammates, who mobbed him in the huddle when LMU was forced to take a timeout.
I think this kid gets a bad rap, moreso than any other player on the team. Is he a legit outside threat? Obviously not, but at least he knows it and almost always plays within himself. He doesn't fall into the trap of opponents sagging off of him to force up bad shots, which many less intelligent players would be tempted to do.
Also, posters on here constantly note that when/if he gets in foul trouble, our offense goes into a lull. That, to me, shows how important he is to this team and its prospect for success.
Buggs, like everyone else, is far from a perfect player but he is a lot better, in my opinion, than what he is often given credit for.
:thumbsup:
From my chair in Milwaukee, I thought the only reason Valpo lost that game was the absence of Kevin Van Wijk.
Quote from: dylanrocks on February 19, 2012, 07:23:27 PM
From my chair in Milwaukee, I thought the only reason Valpo lost that game was the absence of Kevin Van Wijk.
And them hitting some really off the wall shots! Playing on the west coast at their gym and without Kevin, I think we showed pretty well.
Quote from: vu72 on February 19, 2012, 07:32:09 PM
Quote from: dylanrocks on February 19, 2012, 07:23:27 PM
From my chair in Milwaukee, I thought the only reason Valpo lost that game was the absence of Kevin Van Wijk.
And them hitting some really off the wall shots! Playing on the west coast at their gym and without Kevin, I think we showed pretty well.
I have to agree. We are a much easier team to defend without Kevin in the lineup. Don't get me wrong I like what Edward's has been able to do of late, but Kevin is a completely different player than anyone else. The high screen and roll was not defended nearly as aggressively as it was with Kevin in the game, this made it seem that our offense and movement was mostly moving away from the basket. I did think that our defense, especially in the second half was very good. LMU has some very good players and while I think that we still had way too many early turnovers, by the end of the game they had as many or more than we did.
Quote from: StlVUFan on February 18, 2012, 11:37:26 PM
Quote from: StlVUFan on February 15, 2012, 07:28:59 PMObviously a real honest to goodness bracket buster event would more closely forecast a real NCAA tourney first round game. Worthy contenders would take on power conference teams at neutral sites (closer to the power conference team's home is fine with me) as a preview of what might happen in March. I wouldn't mind stipulating that the real match up in March can't be the same two teams.
http://www.daytondailynews.com/dayton-sports/wright-state-university-raiders/commentary-bracketbusters-has-run-its-course-1330932.html?cxtype=rss_wsu (http://www.daytondailynews.com/dayton-sports/wright-state-university-raiders/commentary-bracketbusters-has-run-its-course-1330932.html?cxtype=rss_wsu)
Looks like I'm not the only one who thinks this way ;)
I like the idea of some mid-major teams playing bubble teams from the Big Six conferences, especially if they get the return game. Teams should earn the right for the bracket-buster games, other teams that have saved the weekend can pick up games with similar conferences, with the return game the following year.