I will say this - as of today Valpo is #245 in the Sagarin and Campbell is #246! This has got to be a prime time showdown and made for a College Gameday Saturday. Imagine a group at Campbell of about 50 behind Fowler, Corso and Herbstreit.
Quote from: usc4valpo on October 21, 2012, 04:03:09 PM
I will say this - as of today Valpo is #245 in the Sagarin and Campbell is #246! This has got to be a prime time showdown and made for a College Gameday Saturday. Imagine a group at Campbell of about 50 behind Fowler, Corso and Herbstreit.
better than south bend...
I predict that Campbell will say "this is BS" and go FCS scholarship within 3 years. They are in the south and FB is too important to show a losing record against non-scholarship programs.
I imagine that Stetson and Mercer will do the same down the line
Quote from: valpotx on October 22, 2012, 02:01:40 PMI imagine that Stetson and Mercer will do the same down the line
Quote from: VULB#62 on October 21, 2012, 05:25:40 PMI predict that Campbell will say "this is BS" and go FCS scholarship within 3 years. They are in the south and FB is too important to show a losing record against non-scholarship programs.
Why doesn't Valpo consider this?
Quote from: willy on October 22, 2012, 03:09:34 PM
Quote from: valpotx on October 22, 2012, 02:01:40 PMI imagine that Stetson and Mercer will do the same down the line
Quote from: VULB#62 on October 21, 2012, 05:25:40 PMI predict that Campbell will say "this is BS" and go FCS scholarship within 3 years. They are in the south and FB is too important to show a losing record against non-scholarship programs.
Why doesn't Valpo consider this?
$$$$
To go FCS scholarship the stadium seating requirements alone are much too much for VU.
Stetson invested $6+ million in their Athletic Training Facility that opened this year just to go FCS non-scholarship in football. They also pulled in MSO, WSO and WLAX.
The link:
Stetson Athletics Training Facility Tour (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJbmpADj7aY#ws)
Mercer is building a a stadium and huge field house (lockers and training facilities) to go FCS non-scholarship.
I agree with ValpoTX. The PFL is only a stepping stone.
Quote from: Valpo2010 on October 22, 2012, 03:53:59 PM
Quote from: willy on October 22, 2012, 03:09:34 PM
Quote from: valpotx on October 22, 2012, 02:01:40 PMI imagine that Stetson and Mercer will do the same down the line
Quote from: VULB#62 on October 21, 2012, 05:25:40 PMI predict that Campbell will say "this is BS" and go FCS scholarship within 3 years. They are in the south and FB is too important to show a losing record against non-scholarship programs.
Why doesn't Valpo consider this?
$$$$
Valpo barely supports a non scholarship team, they certainly wouldn't pony up the $$$ for full scholarship.
BTW, if you recall in another string about the FB lockers at Valpo, the Stetson videos show what we don't have.
Quote from: milanmiracle on October 22, 2012, 05:40:43 PM
Quote from: Valpo2010 on October 22, 2012, 03:53:59 PM
Quote from: willy on October 22, 2012, 03:09:34 PM
Quote from: valpotx on October 22, 2012, 02:01:40 PMI imagine that Stetson and Mercer will do the same down the line
Quote from: VULB#62 on October 21, 2012, 05:25:40 PMI predict that Campbell will say "this is BS" and go FCS scholarship within 3 years. They are in the south and FB is too important to show a losing record against non-scholarship programs.
Why doesn't Valpo consider this?
$$$$
Valpo barely supports a non scholarship team, they certainly wouldn't pony up the $$$ for full scholarship.
Why is this? I looked up Campbell, Stetson,Mercer and Valpos tuition rates and Valpos is the second highest. How can these other universities have such nice facilities and support there programs and valpo can't? Do they have better alumni?
Campbell, Stetson, and Mercer are all located in the football hotbed of the South. Valpo isn't. The money for football is huge in the South. Valpo would be lucky to get enough football money to survive because we're lost in the hotbeds of the B1G and Notre Dame.
Conversely they are in SEC and ACC country. But there is a big difference -- down there everybody is into 'ball. And the only 'ball is FOOTBALL. So any school embarking on this path will throw big bucks at it. It's a way of life.
And actually, college athletics is a way of life as well. Most schools place a heavy emphasis there with capital investment. Take Presbyterian College: 1300 students -- bricks and mortar football stadium for 6500 and play scholarship FCS. Baseball and soccer facilities are beautiful. Basketball arena seats only 2,000, however.
Quote from: valporun on October 23, 2012, 12:22:03 AMCampbell, Stetson, and Mercer are all located in the football hotbed of the South. Valpo isn't. The money for football is huge in the South. Valpo would be lucky to get enough football money to survive because we're lost in the hotbeds of the B1G and Notre Dame.
Campbell is in North Carolina and I wouldn't consider that a football state, More of a basketball state with the Tar Heels and Blue Devils. Dayton, Drake, and Butler all seem to be able to have better facilities and winning programs in both football and basketball and they to are in the middle of Big Ten Country. I don't think Valpo can use that as an excuse.
Quote from: willy on October 23, 2012, 06:54:29 AM
Dayton, Drake, and Butler all seem to be able to have better facilities and winning programs in both football and basketball and they too are in the middle of Big Ten Country. I don't think Valpo can use that as an excuse.
Point well taken.
Based on where Valpo is in locale, they have to contend with Illinois, Northwestern, and Notre Dame for any kind of football attention. Illinois is playing about as well as Valpo, but they have a new coach in Champaign, Northwestern is playing Fitzgerald football, and well Notre Dame is Notre Dame, and they'll get attention win or lose. Valpo just isn't going to break out of that, even if Dayton, Drake, and Butler are in the same geographic area.
Ohio is football country, so Dayton will get money for it, even if they have to share a stadium with high schools and soccer. Drake benefits from being a football state as well. Butler will get support because of the city they are in, and the alumni that give it money. Valpo is still going to struggle because we're not going to put money into a program that has to get what it can for players. Kids in the Chicago proper and suburbs want to get away from home, and for some of them, Valpo is too close to home. Also, some of the suburb kids can afford Valpo, but they want the party lifestyle of the Big Ten, not the dry campus small town feel of Valpo.
Quote from: valporun on October 23, 2012, 12:39:57 PMBased on where Valpo is in locale, they have to contend with Illinois, Northwestern, and Notre Dame for any kind of football attention. Illinois is playing about as well as Valpo, but they have a new coach in Champaign, Northwestern is playing Fitzgerald football, and well Notre Dame is Notre Dame, and they'll get attention win or lose. Valpo just isn't going to break out of that, even if Dayton, Drake, and Butler are in the same geographic area. Ohio is football country, so Dayton will get money for it, even if they have to share a stadium with high schools and soccer. Drake benefits from being a football state as well. Butler will get support because of the city they are in, and the alumni that give it money. Valpo is still going to struggle because we're not going to put money into a program that has to get what it can for players. Kids in the Chicago proper and suburbs want to get away from home, and for some of them, Valpo is too close to home. Also, some of the suburb kids can afford Valpo, but they want the party lifestyle of the Big Ten, not the dry campus small town feel of Valpo.
These all sound like excuses to me. Not all kids want to get away from home and party. I think Valpos location should be an advantage not a disadvantage. Drakes roster is loaded with Illinois talent from right here in Valpos backyard. I think most kids want to stay within a 4 hour radius of home. Proof of that would be 61 Ohio players on Dayton's roster. The problem is Drake has 35 Illinois kids and 19 Iowa kids, so much for Iowa being a football hotbed! Butler has 44 Illinois kids and Valpo 29 Illinois kids. Some of the best football in the country is played in the chicagoland area ask Drake and Butler. We are losing the recruiting battle and games to universities that are stealing kids away that are in our own backyard and thats the problem. If Valpo doen't want to put money into the program then I guess the phrase "you get what you pay for" fits!!!!!
Quote from: willy on October 23, 2012, 02:45:58 PM
Quote from: valporun on October 23, 2012, 12:39:57 PMBased on where Valpo is in locale, they have to contend with Illinois, Northwestern, and Notre Dame for any kind of football attention. Illinois is playing about as well as Valpo, but they have a new coach in Champaign, Northwestern is playing Fitzgerald football, and well Notre Dame is Notre Dame, and they'll get attention win or lose. Valpo just isn't going to break out of that, even if Dayton, Drake, and Butler are in the same geographic area. Ohio is football country, so Dayton will get money for it, even if they have to share a stadium with high schools and soccer. Drake benefits from being a football state as well. Butler will get support because of the city they are in, and the alumni that give it money. Valpo is still going to struggle because we're not going to put money into a program that has to get what it can for players. Kids in the Chicago proper and suburbs want to get away from home, and for some of them, Valpo is too close to home. Also, some of the suburb kids can afford Valpo, but they want the party lifestyle of the Big Ten, not the dry campus small town feel of Valpo.
These all sound like excuses to me. Not all kids want to get away from home and party. I think Valpos location should be an advantage not a disadvantage. Drakes roster is loaded with Illinois talent from right here in Valpos backyard. I think most kids want to stay within a 4 hour radius of home. Proof of that would be 61 Ohio players on Dayton's roster. The problem is Drake has 35 Illinois kids and 19 Iowa kids, so much for Iowa being a football hotbed! Butler has 44 Illinois kids and Valpo 29 Illinois kids. Some of the best football in the country is played in the chicagoland area ask Drake and Butler. We are losing the recruiting battle and games to universities that are stealing kids away that are in our own backyard and thats the problem. If Valpo doen't want to put money into the program then I guess the phrase "you get what you pay for" fits!!!!!
I think we could all agree that the States with traditionally powerful football programs include Ohio, Florida, California and Texas. Valpo has 17 players hailing from those states while Drake has 5. My point? Where the kids come from means ZERO, it has to do with talent and coaching. I think the talent is improving, I'm not sure about the coaching.
Quote from: willy on October 23, 2012, 02:45:58 PM
Quote from: valporun on October 23, 2012, 12:39:57 PMBased on where Valpo is in locale, they have to contend with Illinois, Northwestern, and Notre Dame for any kind of football attention. Illinois is playing about as well as Valpo, but they have a new coach in Champaign, Northwestern is playing Fitzgerald football, and well Notre Dame is Notre Dame, and they'll get attention win or lose. Valpo just isn't going to break out of that, even if Dayton, Drake, and Butler are in the same geographic area. Ohio is football country, so Dayton will get money for it, even if they have to share a stadium with high schools and soccer. Drake benefits from being a football state as well. Butler will get support because of the city they are in, and the alumni that give it money. Valpo is still going to struggle because we're not going to put money into a program that has to get what it can for players. Kids in the Chicago proper and suburbs want to get away from home, and for some of them, Valpo is too close to home. Also, some of the suburb kids can afford Valpo, but they want the party lifestyle of the Big Ten, not the dry campus small town feel of Valpo.
These all sound like excuses to me. Not all kids want to get away from home and party. I think Valpos location should be an advantage not a disadvantage. Drakes roster is loaded with Illinois talent from right here in Valpos backyard. I think most kids want to stay within a 4 hour radius of home. Proof of that would be 61 Ohio players on Dayton's roster. The problem is Drake has 35 Illinois kids and 19 Iowa kids, so much for Iowa being a football hotbed! Butler has 44 Illinois kids and Valpo 29 Illinois kids. Some of the best football in the country is played in the chicagoland area ask Drake and Butler. We are losing the recruiting battle and games to universities that are stealing kids away that are in our own backyard and thats the problem. If Valpo doen't want to put money into the program then I guess the phrase "you get what you pay for" fits!!!!!
I just want to touch on this, though it's
FAR from the reason Valpo isn't performing well on the football field.
I believe there is some truth to the fact that not everybody wants to party in college, however considering that 44% of high school seniors have had an alcoholic drink in the last 30 days, the number of people wanting to party in college are probably higher than you think. About 73% of college students drink at least occasionally. I know my wife and I spent most (almost all) weekends at Purdue (or other universities) because of Valpo's lack of nightlife and parties.
To put this in perspective, Butler has a "drunk bus" that runs between campus and Broad Ripple on Friday and Saturday. In case you aren't aware, Broad Ripple is an area consisting of somewhere between 10-15 bars. Valpo isn't Indy, and I get this...however I do believe that the inability to drink alcohol at a tailgate as an over 21 adult along with the university curtailing much of the Greek system, there isn't much of a typical college scene. Do I think it's the only thing a recruit looks at? Absolutely not! Do I think it matters? Yea, a little bit. Of all the colleges I visited or had friends at, Valpo far and away had the most stringent alcohol policy. For the record, Notre Dame was a party from the word GO. You couldn't go to a dorm, or an apartment complex without finding a party. At the time you could drink in your dorm room, just not in the hallways, but it had to be in a plastic cup. They may have been a little too far over the edge for a typical college campus. Just offering a different perspective.
FWIW Valpo is the only FCS school, I believe, in northern Indiana and is 118 miles away from the closest FCS school, NIU, in the midwest. Butler is 154 miles south and Indiana State is 168 miles south as well. There are no FCS programs to the east and none into lower Michigan. That we are in the middle of Northwestern, Purdue and ND (FBS schools) is not an issue -- the kids we want could maybe walk on (a few of them) but wouldn't be offered scholarships. We want kids who are FCS caliber kids who fell through the MVFC cracks or kids who would warrant a D-II FB scholarship, but would rather attend and play for a national D-I university.
They are out there. Valpo just has to get them to enroll. But a pathetic W-L record since 2007 (10-52) and only 2 wins in the last 4 seasons with most losses of the epic scale does not inspire players to risk it. A high school senior didn't even check college FB scores until just a year or two ago. Maybe as junior he might even check college athletic web sites to research what schools (and their records and facilities) he might consider. Either way, he has only one memory of VU football -- lopsided losses. In his mind Valpo and winning do not compute. Past PFL titles are ancient history.
It comes down to winning some games, sure, but that is not enough. If I was a young man considering attending a university like Valpo purely for academics and campus life (OK, Milan maybe not the party life ;) ), it would certainly be in the mix and has much to draw my attention. However, if I were that same young man, but also loved football and wanted to continue to play football as an undergraduate, right now I wouldn't sign up. That's because no matter what people tell me on my visit on a recruiting trip, the physical evidence I would see around me would cause me to question the university's commitment to the one athletic program that I want to be a part of. Then I go to Butler and see the new Butler Bowl. I visit a D-III school like Franklin or DePauw and note how nice the football surroundings are. I want to feel good about my decision and my 4 year experience. I conclude that I don't want to lose most of my games over 4 years at a school that hasn't made the same commitment to football that I did.
Quote from: VULB#62 on October 23, 2012, 06:15:58 PMIt comes down to winning some games, sure, but that is not enough. If I was a young man considering attending a university like Valpo purely for academics and campus life (OK, Milan maybe not the party life ;) ), it would certainly be in the mix and has much to draw my attention. However, if I were that same young man, but also loved football and wanted to continue to play football as an undergraduate, right now I wouldn't sign up. That's because no matter what people tell me on my visit on a recruiting trip, the physical evidence I would see around me would cause me to question the university's commitment to the one athletic program that I want to be a part of. Then I go to Butler and see the new Butler Bowl. I visit a D-III school like Franklin or DePauw and note how nice the football surroundings are. I want to feel good about my decision and my 4 year experience. I conclude that I don't want to lose most of my games over 4 years at a school that hasn't made the same commitment to football that I did.
:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
I think Coach Carlson is going to have a real tough time recruiting this coming season. Going into year 4 his overall record will be 1-32. That's a tough sell to any recruit, especially when he's going to look at this coaches history and their recent success. In year 3 you should at least be making progress in turning the program around. You really can't blame the previous staff for the success you're having now since you've had plenty of time to install "the system" you hope to run. I hope I am wrong, but I doubt it.
Quote from: milanmiracle on October 23, 2012, 06:45:07 PM
I think Coach Carlson is going to have a real tough time recruiting this coming season. Going into year 4 his overall record will be 1-32. That's a tough sell to any recruit, especially when he's going to look at this coaches history and their recent success. In year 3 you should at least be making progress in turning the program around. You really can't blame the previous staff for the success you're having now since you've had plenty of time to install "the system" you hope to run. I hope I am wrong, but I doubt it.
I have been patiently optimistic since Dale came on board. I admire the things he has brought to organizational and program logistical improvements. I listened to the concerns about no talent left on the roster for season #1. I understood that he got a late start on his first class. I followed season two closely and saw some spotty improvement and watched the Campbell win along with a the GameTracker for a fairly close Davidson loss to end the season. It was my understanding that this year a new DC would bring an aggressive, attacking defensive approach to that side of the ball. I was looking forward to fewer one-sided track meets and more football games. I was excited over a targeted and touted group of incoming freshman melding with the now experienced players from recruiting classes 1 and 2. I could still envision a winless season, but, except for YSU, I was looking for and expecting, 24-27, 21-34, 34-38, 14-21 type scores against all other opponents including Duquesne. But that has not come to pass. Something is missing. Our kids are certainly mismatched against a YSU (who has tanked in the second half of the season, can you believe that?), but size-wise, speed-wise and skill-wise they are NOT 45 points worse than Dayton or 39 points worse than Butler. They lost to PFL #1 Drake by 14. That one game has been the only clear reflection of the talent and skills that are out there each Saturday. Why is that? It's not that they are still young -- this is recruiting class 3. That is not valid anymore.
Quote from: VULB#62 on October 23, 2012, 07:40:28 PM
Quote from: milanmiracle on October 23, 2012, 06:45:07 PM
I think Coach Carlson is going to have a real tough time recruiting this coming season. Going into year 4 his overall record will be 1-32. That's a tough sell to any recruit, especially when he's going to look at this coaches history and their recent success. In year 3 you should at least be making progress in turning the program around. You really can't blame the previous staff for the success you're having now since you've had plenty of time to install "the system" you hope to run. I hope I am wrong, but I doubt it.
I have been patiently optimistic since Dale came on board. I admire the things he has brought to organizational and program logistical improvements. I listened to the concerns about no talent left on the roster for season #1. I understood that he got a late start on his first class. I followed season two closely and saw some spotty improvement and watched the Campbell win along with a the GameTracker for a fairly close Davidson loss to end the season. It was my understanding that this year a new DC would bring an aggressive, attacking defensive approach to that side of the ball. I was looking forward to fewer one-sided track meets and more football games. I was excited over a targeted and touted group of incoming freshman melding with the now experienced players from recruiting classes 1 and 2. I could still envision a winless season, but, except for YSU, I was looking for and expecting, 24-27, 21-34, 34-38, 14-21 type scores against all other opponents including Duquesne. But that has not come to pass. Something is missing. Our kids are certainly mismatched against a YSU (who has tanked in the second half of the season, can you believe that?), but size-wise, speed-wise and skill-wise they are NOT 45 points worse than Dayton or 39 points worse than Butler. They lost to PFL #1 Drake by 14. That one game has been the only clear reflection of the talent and skills that are out there each Saturday. Why is that? It's not that they are still young -- this is recruiting class 3. That is not valid anymore.
I too think something is missing. I still point back to the inital season where he let those kids get beat down all in the name of "the system" and glorified practice games. I watched every play of that Jacksonville game, and nothing can ever convince me he did anything to help those kids win that game. His talent and what he tried to do absolutely played into Jacksonville's hands. Either he's a terrible evaluator of film, or he just didn't care his players would never win in space against a much faster and more athletic team. After it was clear they weren't going to win, he did nothing to stop a blowout. As a player, this sticks with you, and is always in the back of your mind.
I have also been very patient with the situation. I was extremely enthused by this hire and his past experiences and having been in his shoes as a coach I still have to believe that his record of program startup and turnaround gives his "system" some credibility. This kind of program change just does not happen by accident. He has done a very good job in the past. I will admit that the bloom is coming off the rose a little bit for me making me wonder what is so different at VU versus his other programs.
Quote from: FWalum on October 24, 2012, 09:14:01 AM
I have also been very patient with the situation. I was extremely enthused by this hire and his past experiences and having been in his shoes as a coach I still have to believe that his record of program startup and turnaround gives his "system" some credibility. This kind of program change just does not happen by accident. He has done a very good job in the past. I will admit that the bloom is coming off the rose a little bit for me making me wonder what is so different at VU versus his other programs.
IF I understand correctly, I think his other two programs were startups vs. bringing back from the dead. I know that Tri State was a startup, I can't verify Ohio Dominican. I think it's easier to build from nothing in this case, than it is to change a culture of losing. Take a look at Marian University in Indianapolis. They have a completely new program, with new facilities, and great coaches (who might I add is a Northern Indiana native). I think this has been a much bigger challenge than even Coach Carlson anticipated.
yeah, both startups:
http://www.valpoathletics.com/football/coaches/ (http://www.valpoathletics.com/football/coaches/)
and
http://ohiodominicanpanthers.com/sports/fball/archive (http://ohiodominicanpanthers.com/sports/fball/archive)
so, yeah, maybe the guy you want running a new tech corp, rather than a FB team.
Hey, Jeff Jagodzinski (ex-BC) is down here just helping out with the Ave Maria FB team. Maybe he'd be willing :)
Quote from: milanmiracle on October 24, 2012, 09:48:04 AM
Quote from: FWalum on October 24, 2012, 09:14:01 AM
I have also been very patient with the situation. I was extremely enthused by this hire and his past experiences and having been in his shoes as a coach I still have to believe that his record of program startup and turnaround gives his "system" some credibility. This kind of program change just does not happen by accident. He has done a very good job in the past. I will admit that the bloom is coming off the rose a little bit for me making me wonder what is so different at VU versus his other programs.
IF I understand correctly, I think his other two programs were startups vs. bringing back from the dead. I know that Tri State was a startup, I can't verify Ohio Dominican. I think it's easier to build from nothing in this case, than it is to change a culture of losing. Take a look at Marian University in Indianapolis. They have a completely new program, with new facilities, and great coaches (who might I add is a Northern Indiana native). I think this has been a much bigger challenge than even Coach Carlson anticipated.
It is. The paint on the locker room walls is new, the pads and uniforms smell new - there are no sweat stains. No scuffs on the helmets. First year, it's usually just scrimmages (follow both Mercer and Stetson's FB site). The field and stands are new (check out the building programs that predated the first recruit at Mercer and Stetson as well). An investment is readily apparent and there is no baggage. Any little progress increases campus enthusiasm. And when the first few games result in losses it's to be expected. Even a winless season does not dampen enthusiasm much -- it kinda was expected too.
Contrast that with turning around a losing program with a long history of failure ....and little in the way of additional visible investment to mark a distinct break between the past and the future. The honeymoon is short. The first season is a pass but after that ... the program has to once again carry all that past baggage in addition to improving and winning games. So when Lou Saban goes into Alabama, the money flows into buildings, training facilities and other things that tangibly mark the difference between the past and the future (except they kept the uniforms the same). This is not Alabama, but the principle is still proportionally valid.
QuoteSo when Lou Saban goes into Alabama
Careful...your age is clouding your otherwise great analysis ;)
By year three there must be improvement, something we are not seeing here. True that this challenge was/is a big one, but enough is enough. Carlson does not seem flexible enough to abandon or modify his "system" for the good of his athletes or the university. He has driven the program further into the ground. In retrospect, the excitement over his hiring was probably optimistic considering starting a program and turning one around are obviously different things. This next recruiting class will be a disaster if he is given another year. I, as a parent, would not be on board with my son committing to play for Valpo. Can't imagine that his promises will continue to yield "better athletes." Start the search now so we don't hear the excuse that the new HC gets a pass because he came in late in the recruiting process! Also, give the current underclassmen hope for the future! The system is not working!
As ever, if you build it (and change the dry campus thing), they will come.
Quote from: jetz on October 24, 2012, 06:37:59 PM
As ever, if you build it (and change the dry campus thing), they will come.
Yeah! Look at what that policy has done to the basketball, soccer, baseball, softball, volleyball, bowling and golf teams!! ;)
Quote from: VULB#62 on October 23, 2012, 06:15:58 PMFWIW Valpo is the only FCS school, I believe, in northern Indiana and is 118 miles away from the closest FCS school, NIU, in the midwest. Butler is 154 miles south and Indiana State is 168 miles south as well. There are no FCS programs to the east and none into lower Michigan. That we are in the middle of Northwestern, Purdue and ND (FBS schools) is not an issue -- the kids we want could maybe walk on (a few of them) but wouldn't be offered scholarships. We want kids who are FCS caliber kids who fell through the MVFC cracks or kids who would warrant a D-II FB scholarship, but would rather attend and play for a national D-I university. They are out there. Valpo just has to get them to enroll. But a pathetic W-L record since 2007 (10-52) and only 2 wins in the last 4 seasons with most losses of the epic scale does not inspire players to risk it. A high school senior didn't even check college FB scores until just a year or two ago. Maybe as junior he might even check college athletic web sites to research what schools (and their records and facilities) he might consider. Either way, he has only one memory of VU football -- lopsided losses. In his mind Valpo and winning do not compute. Past PFL titles are ancient history. It comes down to winning some games, sure, but that is not enough. If I was a young man considering attending a university like Valpo purely for academics and campus life (OK, Milan maybe not the party life ;) ), it would certainly be in the mix and has much to draw my attention. However, if I were that same young man, but also loved football and wanted to continue to play football as an undergraduate, right now I wouldn't sign up. That's because no matter what people tell me on my visit on a recruiting trip, the physical evidence I would see around me would cause me to question the university's commitment to the one athletic program that I want to be a part of. Then I go to Butler and see the new Butler Bowl. I visit a D-III school like Franklin or DePauw and note how nice the football surroundings are. I want to feel good about my decision and my 4 year experience. I conclude that I don't want to lose most of my games over 4 years at a school that hasn't made the same commitment to football that I did.
Northern Illinois plays in the MAC in the FBS (or something but used to be Div. 1), not FCS.
BTW, how did the subject change on this topic? We are trying to promote Gameday!
I feel bad for the coach but the university is not committing the way they need to. Either do it right or get rid of football.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on October 24, 2012, 03:17:05 PM
QuoteSo when Lou Saban goes into Alabama
Careful...your age is clouding your otherwise great analysis ;)
Waddaya mean? Lou of course dropped in on the Bear many times to trade Buffalo Bills / Crimson Tide philosophies. :-[
ARGHHHH! You spotted that just in the nick of time!
QuoteYou spotted that just in the
Nick of time? ;)
I am the only one who would catch that, as I am a Bills fan who lived in T-town for a few months 3 years ago. Always got them mixed up--to the amusement of Alabamians...
At Buies Creek, NC where Sagarin ranked 244 Valpo and 245 Campbell slug it out for the worst team in Division I. How often in college football history have the two worst Divsion I teams in America faced each other? We have heard about #1 vs. #2 battles and the battles of the century, but to see the 2 worst teams battle in a multiple false start-offside, inconsistent excuse mindaching contest is one for the ages.
The heck with the Tide's dominating defense, the Ducks's TD in a minute offense, K-State multiple draw plays, and Brian Kelly looking constpated on the sidelines - who wants that?
Eloquently articulated! :thumbsup:
thanks, I am actually suprised this has not gotten any national exposure - I mean, someone has to see this coming up.
Probably because Campbell has been fairly competitive lately. They don't bring a three year 1 - 29 record into the game. They are 10-20 and coming off a 6-5 season in 2011.
So we are #245, sandwiched between Davidson and Campbell.
The good news is the ELO-CHESS, which the BCS uses, has us ahead of both of them!
...
Unfortunately, the PREDICTOR (which does wot it says on the tin) says we will lose to both of them!
I do have to add, though, as a Tigers fan, that it was actually kind of perversely fun in 2003. And the same is true about VU football. Call it a rubbernecking, gapers' delay, whatever, but it's beyond train wreck bad and now we're all talking about it perhaps more than we would otherwise...
245 Valparaiso AA = 18.45 0 8 44.47( 204) 0 0 | 0 0 | 20.25 244 | 17.81 246
246 Campbell AA = 17.64 1 7 43.06( 221) 0 0 | 0 0 | 13.09 246 | 18.02 245
we will need to do a serious breakdown on this game. We should get Lou Holtz to evaluate how many "outstanding" players are on both sides.
Quote from: usc4valpo on October 28, 2012, 04:19:46 PMthanks, I am actually suprised this has not gotten any national exposure - I mean, someone has to see this coming up.
I believe it is not mentioned because most people come to realize that in the end it only serves to hurt the humans and their psyche who are behind the teams that represent their schools.
Quote from: usc4valpo on October 28, 2012, 09:51:35 PM
245 Valparaiso AA = 18.45 0 8 44.47( 204) 0 0 | 0 0 | 20.25 244 | 17.81 246
246 Campbell AA = 17.64 1 7 43.06( 221) 0 0 | 0 0 | 13.09 246 | 18.02 245
we will need to do a serious breakdown on this game. We should get Lou Holtz to evaluate how many "outstanding" players are on both sides.
At 0-8 (vs. 1-7) can't understand why we are not #246. Must be because we got thrashed by more respectable opponents (YSU and Duquesne)?
I'm afraid Coach Carlson's enthusiasm is waning as well. His last blog post was Dayton Pregame. Let's hope they can pull it together and finish out strong(er).
Noticed the same thing. I usually monitor his Twitter and Facebook accounts too -- very few postings, most are retweets.
Quote from: vu72 on October 29, 2012, 09:12:06 AM
I'm afraid Coach Carlson's enthusiasm is waning as well. His last blog post was Dayton Pregame. Let's hope they can pull it together and finish out strong(er).
Quote from: VULB#62 on October 29, 2012, 10:10:22 AM
Noticed the same thing. I usually monitor his Twitter and Facebook accounts too -- very few postings, most are retweets.
Maybe the writing's on the wall? I do have to wonder about somebody who preaches enthusiasm, commitment, and all the other motivational speaking terms he uses quitting on something like the football blog. Maybe there's a good reason, or to quote my wife...maybe he can't swallow his own kool aid anymore.
a
Quote from: historyman on October 28, 2012, 11:24:46 PM
Quote from: usc4valpo on October 28, 2012, 04:19:46 PMthanks, I am actually suprised this has not gotten any national exposure - I mean, someone has to see this coming up.
I believe it is not mentioned because most people come to realize that in the end it only serves to hurt the humans and their psyche who are behind the teams that represent their schools.
I have to wonder if the sensitometer is a bit high. We are talking football, bad football , and football is part of the toy department of life (quoting Howard Cosell to an extent) . No one is getting hurt. If you want people bumming out, check out Hurricane Sandy and the politicians from both parties lying away while we have a $16T deficit. The players from both teams will be fine, hopefully taking advantage of a quality education (if they have their priorities set) and learning to persevere from this. The upcoming game is an interesting story which does not happen often by probability.
Quote from: milanmiracle on October 29, 2012, 05:44:37 PM
Quote from: vu72 on October 29, 2012, 09:12:06 AM
I'm afraid Coach Carlson's enthusiasm is waning as well. His last blog post was Dayton Pregame. Let's hope they can pull it together and finish out strong(er).
Quote from: VULB#62 on October 29, 2012, 10:10:22 AM
Noticed the same thing. I usually monitor his Twitter and Facebook accounts too -- very few postings, most are retweets.
Maybe the writing's on the wall? I do have to wonder about somebody who preaches enthusiasm, commitment, and all the other motivational speaking terms he uses quitting on something like the football blog. Maybe there's a good reason, or to quote my wife...maybe he can't swallow his own kool aid anymore.
I certainly can't swallow his kool aid anymore and obviously the team can't either. You can blog and tweet all the motivational inspiration you want, but after awhile you have to show results. That's not happening so I prefer no news from him. He needs to speak through dramatic improvement on the field. Sadly, I think there is no way he can dig himself out of the gigantic hole he has put this team in. Time to move on!
Quote from: milanmiracle on October 29, 2012, 05:44:37 PM
Quote from: vu72 on October 29, 2012, 09:12:06 AM
I'm afraid Coach Carlson's enthusiasm is waning as well. His last blog post was Dayton Pregame. Let's hope they can pull it together and finish out strong(er).
Quote from: VULB#62 on October 29, 2012, 10:10:22 AM
Noticed the same thing. I usually monitor his Twitter and Facebook accounts too -- very few postings, most are retweets.
Maybe the writing's on the wall? I do have to wonder about somebody who preaches enthusiasm, commitment, and all the other motivational speaking terms he uses quitting on something like the football blog. Maybe there's a good reason, or to quote my wife...maybe he can't swallow his own kool aid anymore.
Checked Facebook. Pictures of the 5 players of the game for Marist were posted. As is previous postings there were no names attached to them. That was OK in the past when there was a post game blog post that told us what each kid did special. Without the blog (now missing: Dayton wrap-up, Marist preview, Marist wrap-up and possibly Campbell preview....) it's really hard to identify te kids. That does a disservice to those of us who care and to the kids themselves.
Quote from: VULB#62 on October 30, 2012, 05:58:46 PM
Quote from: milanmiracle on October 29, 2012, 05:44:37 PM
Quote from: vu72 on October 29, 2012, 09:12:06 AM
I'm afraid Coach Carlson's enthusiasm is waning as well. His last blog post was Dayton Pregame. Let's hope they can pull it together and finish out strong(er).
Quote from: VULB#62 on October 29, 2012, 10:10:22 AM
Noticed the same thing. I usually monitor his Twitter and Facebook accounts too -- very few postings, most are retweets.
Maybe the writing's on the wall? I do have to wonder about somebody who preaches enthusiasm, commitment, and all the other motivational speaking terms he uses quitting on something like the football blog. Maybe there's a good reason, or to quote my wife...maybe he can't swallow his own kool aid anymore.
Checked Facebook. Pictures of the 5 players of the game for Marist were posted. As is previous postings there were no names attached to them. That was OK in the past when there was a post game blog post that told us what each kid did special. Without the blog (now missing: Dayton wrap-up, Marist preview, Marist wrap-up and possibly Campbell preview....) it's really hard to identify te kids. That does a disservice to those of us who care and to the kids themselves.
:clap: :clap: :clap:
I don't mind if he decided to stop the blog, for whatever reason, but it would have been nice to release a statement saying as much.
The Marist players of the week on Facebook are all identified on their pictures as they have been for all the games this season. Not sure what you are talking about VULB#62. Check again, all the info is there.
After noting your comment 90, I went back through every pic or album for the Marist game. I could not see any names. Yet, if I looked at other postings, like the Breast Cancer Awareness picture, I could readily see a clearly written caption with the names of the people involved. I saw a written entry about Pastor Char. There is a clearly visible note about Sandy and people on the east coast. I finally clicked on one of the players photos and it revealed the hidden detail. I stand corrected. But it took your comment and it has taken me this long to figure out something that IMO should have been presented a bit better. I'm not a Facebook fan and only an occasional viewer (actually only for Valpo FB) and I suspect there may be others that look for and appreciate simple, more straightforward presentation. It's a small thing, but ......
One thing I will add is that I am glad that these pics are still being posted despite the scarcity of blogs lately.
Sounds like we are in full "retweet".
Hey, "USC", keep up the Gameday scenario! Nice work!
But I wouldn't object if Fox picked up the game (after a bidding war) and we got to see Erin Andrews commentary. Actually, she really does a heck of a job on that channel and knows her stuff cold. Joey.....not so much.
Since the game is in Buies Creek, NC, and when Gameday "comes into their city," would it be more appropriate to open up the show with the Andy Griffin theme song?
Quote from: usc4valpo on November 02, 2012, 07:40:08 AMSince the game is in Buies Creek, NC, and when Gameday "comes into their city," would it be more appropriate to open up the show with the Andy Griffin theme song?
Andy Griffin, the English footballer who plays for Doncaster Rovers at full back? Does he have a theme song?
Andy has also played for Stoke City (3 times), Newcastle United, Tyneside, Portsmouth, Derby County and Reading. He was once bought for 1.5 million pounds.
QuoteHe was once bought for 1.5 million pounds.
heavy, man
Pre-game tailgating and hoopla?.........that features Lee Corso eating "possum stew"?
Quote from: jetz on October 24, 2012, 06:37:59 PM
As ever, if you build it (and change the dry campus thing), they will come.
This is a program that's gonna give it a shot. Chicago State is the baseball equivalent of Valpo football. The Cougars were 12-40 last year and had an RPI of 294 (out of 297). They had less than 10 wins in 2011 as well, I think. Even with that track record, check out this plan:
http://www.collegebaseballinsider.com/12Articles/CSU%20Stadium.html (http://www.collegebaseballinsider.com/12Articles/CSU%20Stadium.html)
Good for them. Great to see a down and out program try to lift itself up. Plus, they are on the Valpo baseball schedule so we'll get to play on their nice new field. Why can't we do this?
Jetz, it's the same question many of us have been asking over and over.
And yet, Chicago State will still struggle to get the kind of student-athletes the big schools would get with a stadium like this.
Chicago State had a terrible field, but one where you could easily hit HRs. I believe Brian Wolotka hit 3 or 4 HRs in a doubleheader there my FR year of ball. Good for them in building this, but they will still have trouble attracting better athletes to that school, especially without a true conference. I feel bad that my ex-teammate is no longer the head coach there after being let go this past summer, as he had very little to work with budget-wise to make that program into anything special. I am not sure that $2.5 million can buy you much in the way of stands or extra amenities?