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Wasn't it Einstein who is credited for saying the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again while expecting different results?

How long will we buy this whole progressing nicely and they're young guys   Narrative?

At what point do we say our expectations are higher than this? As others have pointed out, this is not the same MVC as it was a few years ago with Wichita State in it. And this isn't the same HL as the one that saw some really good rivalries Valpo had with butler, Detroit, and later Oakland.

Would we be doing better in the current HL? Who cares. That's the real answer.

That's a moot point, isn't it?

Per Paul's write-up, we had ~2,000 fans in attendance last night. Now, idk if they all stuck around for the second half after that shellacking but .... wow. There were 2 inches of snow. It was doable for locals in the community. The roads were iced. Not progressing nicely.

Wow. That was tough to watch yet alone enjoy as some form of cruel irony. When will the buck stop with the coaching?

When patterns remain - even after all sorts of players transfer - and our head coach is the lone common denominator ... when will we face the music?

We have the talent. We do not come out prepared. Plain and simple. Our body language says it all. The fans, student section, etc. (or lack there of) say it all.

We are not progressing nicely. Things are not going well. Bearing other bottom of the league teams and digging ourselves out of holes for mediocrity is not good enough - is it?

I'm at the point where I don't even get upset any longer. It's become an expectation. And I'm having a hard time - apart from tradition and a financial investment - wondering why I continue wasting my time and money.

If MLB gives Matt a 4 year extension, we all need to accept this is the Valpo way. This is it and as good as it's going to get. We'll win some here and there ... beat teams out of pure talent or luck or by having a good night or by the other team not but mediocre would be a goal at this point.

That was an incredibly boring game day experience. No way administration can be there and think this is trending in the right direction.

I'm an eternal optimist but come on.

Great posts here. Lots of good dialogue. As many of you pointed out when it happened, the loss of Smarolla allows for a much quicker tempo offensive pace, which is exciting.

As pointed out, I'd love to see some sets with Mileek and Krikke. Mileek had a nice post move last game, which was exciting. I'd love to see him muscle guys around more. He's got the size and frame. But, he's really more of a stretch 4 - he seemingly prefers shooting outside the arc than in the paint.

Krikke - though nowhere near the mass yet - has some post moves no doubt. Just seems more natural to him.

As for Clay, I'll admit that I wasn't on the wagon like many others were from the get go. After watching him play 20 games, he's far-exceeded my expectations.

Next year could be a good one for us. Gotta feel for Ryan as he still doesn't look 100%. Kiser is a good floor general and hustle guy, which the younger players need.

Been pleased with Daniel's play as of late and excited for Gordon and Nick as they find their roles.

Last night, we all got to witness what Krikke brings to the table. We've seen it in spurts. But, last night he finally got the minutes. He's the best post player  we've got from a pure basketball standpoint. As in, he's a basketball player who has the touch, the finesse, the basketball IQ, and several of the other intangibles.

You don't have to make a couple hundred grand a year or be a basketball savant to see that. It's time for Krikke to get more PT. We've all said it - I know John is the fan favorite and is to be respected for his effort and so forth. But, Krikke takes us to a different level. No reason why Krikke should be spilling John. John gives 100% no doubt. But when you really watch the game he just flat out gets out-sized and out-athleted by guys. Not his fault. He's a role player but we need to recognize what we've got behind him.

Also, I'd love to see Freese-Vilien get some PT. It's not rocket science to see the chemistry some of these guys have when you put them in at the same time.

Does Krikke deserve his own thread? Time shall tell but I think so ...

Most of the rationales for buying into Matt aren't factors that represent being locked into a commitment to this program as a marquee one. Hence the routine emphasis on him being a nice guy, and a family man, and a good high school player. I just don't get how those are features that will get us over the hump by making up for the poor arena, lack of energy / student support, small school, hefty tuition, and crappy weather.

I'm a confident 4-5 on this one. 5-4 at best.

With the sheer number of cuts that seem to be occurring I've lost interest or motivation on this topic. Just doesn't appear we're treading in the right direction. Hope I'm wrong or that these cuts pay off down the road.

I was surprised to see the baseball stadium announcement and am excited about that. The renditions look good.

As for the ARC, it seems like we've now got bigger fish to fry than renovating the ARC. Again I hope I'm wrong. But night in and night out a half full arena doesn't seem to add to our case that an updated facility would make a difference.

Under Bryce we had an identity. Same crappy arena. Same academic standards. Same funding if not less. Same city. Worse conference. But an identity.

That place during the NIT was rocking and rolling. Best experience I've had in porter county to date and one of the better sporting environments I've been a part of.

Had Bryce stuck around we would've built on that success ... we would've gotten back to the NCAA tournament.

We would've sustained student interest and fan support. We would've maintained an identity. Now we're floundering ... or just getting by at best. Really sad.

We're satisfied with moral victories and the thought of possibly not having to be in a play in game to advance in the MVC tournament or being in the top half of the league but sitting In 8th??

I just don't see it. Again I hope I'm wrong

Wow I'm not against giving the guy 2 years so he can finish out with JFL. But 4 years? What's he done to merit a 4 year extension? And why the fear we need to lock him up? Are other programs really going to be knocking at his door seducing him to come to their program? For more money? If so, based on what? He'd be much better off learning from this experience, being thankful Valpo gave him a shot when nobody else T a comparable level would've had reason to since he'd barely had a coaching career as an assistant and was third it fourth on the bench at that.

From there he'd be better off taking an assistant job at a bigger program. Could still make good money. He's got a lot to learn. Maybe go back to Stanford or the Pac 12 where's he's got some notoriety.

Valpo should bring in a proven winner with a Valpo background. That's Greg Tonagel. We'd be fortunate if he'd entertain the offer as we didn't give him a shot the last time around.

If the bar set for giving someone a 4 year extension is a mediocre record with declining student interest and a half full arena, then that's very telling.

It's paying off for Valpo WBB. Hiring someone from the outside. And she didn't even have the head coaching tenure Greg has had.

We do not see player development under this regime. Talent? You bet. Credit that to recruiting under-recruited guys. No doubt he'd be good in a talent acquisition role. But no evidence of player development. Mileek still gets in major foul trouble.

Nick does not seem to be getting better than the talent he had coming in. Daniel is playing better but his intangibles are still what carries him.

And we've said it going into the season, it's a bad sign when John gets the PT he's getting. No offense to him I know he's the fan favorite and I respect his work ethic and know he's a veteran on the court. But his playing time is seemingly a testament to the more talented players behind him not progressing nicely enough to substantiate to substantiate playing time

Like others have said - I hope I'm wrong. Matt can be a mid major level head coach in the future and garner success like Porter did. I just don't know that it's possible for that to happen while he's the HC at Valpo. May be better served coaching under someone else.

Look at Diebler and Powell. Both assistants at major high level programs learning a lot Im sure.

At least we're consistent ... in digging a hole that we almost pull ourselves out of and end up with a moral victory.

I've said it before and I'll say it again - Hire Tonagel!!! It would certainly be a pay bump for him and there's incentive from being an alumni

Idk about the rest of you but I'm in complete shock that we dug ourselves into a hole that we'll now work our way out of only to likely have it be too little too late.

See I appreciate some thoughts here that others have posted. For instance - I'm not paid to have solutions. These people are. And they're well compensated for it. Make way more than the average. So ya there should be some responsibility and accountability when you're making really good money .... maybe not anywhere near the Coach Ks of the world but in relation to most of us ... really, really good money. I was raised to believe that with such opportunities the responsibility increases. That's why the Bryce Drew's of the world get booted so quickly .... make a lot of money and don't perform ... you're gone. Right or wrong it's the name of the game.

Haha it was a typo on my behalf but actually end up unintentionally interesting how you read that.

And let's call it like it is. The MVC overall is down this year in talent. Other than UNi it seems wide open.

No excuses. We don't have a new coaching staff and really haven't faced much adversity. The whole one team one boat slogan sums it up. This is what we wanted. We didn't want those "selfish" players. Guess what? They're gone. And cannot continually blame it on young players. Other than Clay, who's a major contributing player that's young? Nick and Eron were around the program for an entire year and are upperclassmen. Mileek is an upperclassman. Kiser is a senior. Javon is a sophomore but the general on the court and rightfully so. Sackey played all last year. We're not that young and I experienced of a team. Just saying.

Tough to even put forth that much energy and optimism when we're halfway through conference season and it still feels like pre-conference play.

Apart from the new MC, the game day environment is awful. What happened to the student survey and MLB talking about game day changes? Here's a thought - bring in a dj like a lot of schools do. Do something. The music they play in warmups is awful! They try to be eclectic but it's just bad. Anyone happy with the fan turnout thus far and the student turnout thus far has much lowered expectations.

We had a way better environment and following when in a worse conference. But people will say oh it's because of streaming. Well ya if you don't offer a game day environment that's worth getting off the couch in the dorm for then why would they walk across campus together go? For a slice of pizza? Give me a break.

To put Bryce and Matt in the same category is laughable. Sorry. And I don't think he'd disagree with you on that. He's not there *yet* at least...

Notice what happens when you let the pure basketball players .... play.

Idk how folks can keep supporting this debacle. Evansville has transfers who are playing in their first year, too. And, they have an interim head coach. As others have said, Kiser does NOT need to start or get this much PT. Mileek does NOT need to start. His PT will take care of itself whether he's making his shots and/or staying out of foul trouble. Need more pure basketball players. Kiser and Mileek are not and it's not their fault. Krikke is a pure player. As is Eron. No wonder we have waaay more bench points. Because they're better than 2 of the starters ....

People who keep buying into the same rhetoric and excuses play into the problem and why we won't be better in the years to come. I have no respect for coaches who continually give excuses instead of owning up to the problem. The man still gets paid likely what $200k+??? Accountability is key.

Good points but I don't think Kiser air balling a 3 helps matters either.

Pretty good effort overall. It was nice to see the place decently full too. Were there some bad calls by the officials? Certainly. But we were out coached down the stretch. Silly stuff. And sorry I know he's the fan favorite but it's a problem if Kaiser is getting this much playing time. And seriously we're going to put Siggy in with a minute left??? He's cold because he doesn't get any playing time. Then again we don't have a play down the stretch with the game on the line. Sooo we blew it. So tired of Matt's mediocrity and excuses. Tired of the whole progressing nicely crap. It's time for accountability if this season doesn't work out. Unless that's the goal - mediocrity. In that case, fine. We'll settle. Sorry but that isn't the same Loyola team that went to the finals. Joke.

Not a bad episode - I enjoyed it. Here's to hoping Paul's feeling better.

Goodness - that's an awful start for HP

Time shall tell then once conference games start up and school is back in session. Here's to hoping we get a student section and a band back for conference play. I know there's ways to stream games and times have changed. But I miss the drum line during introductions and the home court advantage. I do commend them for trying to create more interactions this year to up the game experience. The gentleman who is running that is doing a nice job. Just tough sledding I guess.