I'm planning on doing only the Division I opponents this year. All times are Eastern Standard Time.
11/8/2013 Friday
Detroit at South Alabama 2:00 p.m.
James Madison at Virginia 7:00 p.m.
Youngstown State at Kennesaw State 7:30 p.m.
Grand Canyon vs Loyola Marymount 7:30 p.m.
East Tennessee State at Charlotte 7:30 p.m.
Mercer at Texas 8:00 p.m.
Milwaukee at Loyola (IL) 8:00 p.m.
Alabama at Illinois 8:00 p.m.
S.E. Missouri State at Saint Louis 8:30 p.m.
Murray State at Valpo 8:30 p.m.
Oakland at North Carolina 9:00 p.m.
11/9/2013 Saturday
Ball State at Indiana State 1:05 p.m.
Northern Iowa at Ohio 2:00 p.m.
Iona at Cleveland State 2:00 p.m.
Youngstown State vs Florida International 3:00 p.m.
South Dakota State vs Loyola Marymount 6:30 p.m.
Drake at Illinois-Chicago 8:00 p.m.
11/10/2013 Sunday
Eastern Kentucky vs Youngstown State 1:00 p.m.
Jacksonville State at Illinois 6:00 p.m.
11/11/2013 Monday
Milwaukee at Davidson 7:00 p.m.
11/12/2013 Tuesday
Morehead State at East Tennessee State 7:00 p.m.
Evansville at IUPUI 7:00 p.m.
Ohio at Ohio State 8:00 p.m.
Oakland at UCLA 9:00 p.m.
11/13/2013 Wednesday
Florida State at Central Florida 7:00 p.m.
Wright State at Georgetown 7:00 p.m.
Valpo at Illinois 7:30 p.m.
Saint Louis at Southern Illinois-Edw 8:00 p.m.
Cleveland State at San Francisco 11:00 p.m.
11/14/2013 Thursday
Detroit at Connecticut 7:00 p.m.
Loyola Marymount at Long Beach State 10:00 p.m.
Thanks for all the work on this !! Here's a tidbit from cbssports.com...
Two LMU players out indefinitely following injuries from car accident
By Matt Norlander | College Basketball Writer
October 28, 2013 10:34 am ET
Loyola Marymount seniors Ayodeji Egbeyemi and Godwin Okonji are going to miss the start of the team's season after being involved in a car accident. The timeline for the two to return is not known, but both are recovering and attending classes on campus.
The accident occurred more than a week ago, on Oct. 20, but LMU did not release the status of the two players until Friday evening. According to the school, the accident happened around 7:30 a.m., as both were riding to practice. They were released later that day.
"We are very thankful that both Godwin and Ayodeji are doing well and were able to come home following the accident," LMU coach Max Good said in a statement. "While they are doing well, both suffered various levels of injuries that will take time to heal. In talking with our doctors, we feel Ayodeji should be back soon, while we will have to wait and see on the condition of Godwin. He suffered injuries to his left leg that will require further examination from his doctors. At this time, we are just thankful that they are with us."
Egbeyemi was driving his car, which the school said was totaled.
Egbeyemi, who is the student representative West Coast Conference liaison and the national liaison with the NCAA, has averaged 6.5 points and 3.9 rebounds for his career; Okonji has put up 4.5 and 4.6 in those categories, respectively.
That is sad to hear, but glad they are ok. Hopefully they get to play most of the games in their SR year
Saint Louis is playing an exhibition game tonight at 7:00 p.m. central / 8:00 p.m. eastern time. The game will be on the Atlantic 10 Digital Network for free. They are taking on a small Catholic university from St Louis called Fontbonne University.
http://www.atlantic10.com/mediaPortal/player.dbml?&db_oem_id=31600 (http://www.atlantic10.com/mediaPortal/player.dbml?&db_oem_id=31600)
Quote from: bbtds on October 31, 2013, 12:53:37 PMThey are taking on a small Catholic university from St Louis called Fontbonne University.
(http://img.scoop.it/aB6cDKEkgHmK023ggSvT0Tl72eJkfbmt4t8yenImKBVaiQDB_Rd1H6kmuBWtceBJ)
From the SLU website...
Billikens Breeze in Exhibition, 94-38
I don't suppose an analysis is really necessary.
Quote from: talksalot on November 01, 2013, 07:32:49 PM
From the SLU website...
Billikens Breeze in Exhibition, 94-38
I don't suppose an analysis is really necessary.
Fontbonne seemed nervous and had no height to compete with the Billikens height. SLU's defense was just as tough as ever. With 10 minutes to go in the 1st half SLU was up 26-3. Fontbonne didn't make a FG until 9:13 of the 1st half. Suddenly Fontbonne started hitting 3's and got the score down to 32-19 but everything went south from there. SLU held the Griffins to 14 points in the 2nd half while putting 47 points on the board in both halves.
Quote from: bbtds on November 01, 2013, 10:24:34 PMFontbonne seemed nervous and had no height to compete with the Billikens height. SLU's defense was just as tough as ever. With 10 minutes to go in the 1st half SLU was up 26-3. Fontbonne didn't make a FG until 9:13 of the 1st half. Suddenly Fontbonne started hitting 3's and got the score down to 32-19 but everything went south from there. SLU held the Griffins to 14 points in the 2nd half while putting 47 points on the board in both halves.
all better.
So far for the preseason HL basketball I decided to look at the attendance numbers, in terms of both attendance and % of arena filled.
1st Valpo - 57% filled with an average of 2850
2nd WSU - 32% filled with an average of 3337
3rd Oakland - 27% filled with an average of 1100
4th UWM - 18% filled with an average of 2018
5th GB - 17% filled with an average of 1638
6th UDM - 7% filled with an average of a wopping 600
UIC - Attendance wasn't announced
CSU - Has yet to play their loan exhibition
YSU - Decided they were too good for exhibitions
Now that is why Valpo fans are the best in the HL, averaging way more attendees than anyone else for exhibition games, filling up over 50% of the ARC. Bravo to us!!!!!
I would bet that is some of the best attended exhibition games in the country can't wait to be there on Friday night, would imagine it will be close to full!
Side note- I laughed when I saw UDMs number, 7% of the arena filled, talk about a home court advantage.....
Try to get my friends to come to some games. Apparently they are too "cool" for D2 valpo which they aren't even close to being. I find these things funny
Quote from: classof2014 on November 04, 2013, 05:12:04 PMHas yet to play their loan exhibition
they'll pay for that eventually--they don't want to mortgage their future.
(hopefully they won't take too many points on the back end.)
Quote from: Valpofan00 on November 04, 2013, 05:44:02 PMApparently they are too "cool" for D2 valpo which they aren't even close to being.
Does this mean
--"too cool for D2 (vs.) valpo" games?
--"too cool for a theoretically-in-D2-Valpo, which they aren't even close to being, since they're D1 obv."
--"my loser friends aren't even too cool for a theoretically D2 valpo or even the real-life D1 valpo"
Quote from: Valpofan00 on November 04, 2013, 05:44:02 PM
Try to get my friends to come to some games. Apparently they are too "cool" for D2 valpo which they aren't even close to being. I find these things funny
These are the same people who got upset over Florida Gulf Coast busting their brackets.
Quote from: classof2014 on November 04, 2013, 05:12:04 PM7% filled with an average of a wopping 600
i know we don't like detroit but that doesn't make them all racists.
well...maybe 7% of them are italian
Quote from: Valpofan00 on November 04, 2013, 05:44:02 PM
Try to get my friends to come to some games. Apparently they are too "cool" for D2 valpo which they aren't even close to being. I find these things funny
Do they attend Valpo?
Good sign for our close game with Hillsdale College. Toledo needed a buzzer beater to pull out a win... I would say that Hillsdale looked better than I expected them to.
http://www.hillsdalechargers.com/sports/mbkb/2013-14/releases/20131103s04j3z (http://www.hillsdalechargers.com/sports/mbkb/2013-14/releases/20131103s04j3z)
Quote from: Smj on November 05, 2013, 07:25:20 AMGood sign for our close game with Hillsdale College. Toledo needed a buzzer beater to pull out a win... I would say that Hillsdale looked better than I expected them to. http://www.hillsdalechargers.com/sports/mbkb/2013-14/releases/20131103s04j3z (http://www.hillsdalechargers.com/sports/mbkb/2013-14/releases/20131103s04j3z)
This was mentioned by wh in the Hillsdale thread:Quote from: wh on November 04, 2013, 08:41:08 AM Interesting tidbit from Commissioner on the Detroit board: Toledo 85, Hillsdale 84 (OT). The Titans play Toledo twice this year, so there is a little extra interest in what coach Tod Kowalczyk has down I-75. Plus, Hillsdale gave Valpo a battle in last weekend's exhibition game, so here's a chance for comparison. And if I were a Valpo fan, I'd be encouraged, because Hillsdale showed it is a darn good team. Toledo, picked to win the MAC West, struggled mightily against the Chargers, and finally won it on a runner in the lane with 3 seconds to play in OT.
11/8/2013 - Friday
Youngstown State 73
Kennesaw State 57
Milwaukee 72
Loyola (IL) 76
Detroit 58
South Alabama 74
Murray State 74
Valpo 77
Oakland 61
North Carolina 84
Alabama State 63
Illinois 80
S.E. Missouri State 64
Saint Louis 87
East Tenn State 75
Charlotte 80
Mercer 73
Texas 76
James Madison 41
Virginia 61
Grand Canyon 75
Loyola Marymount 78
ah, milwaukee...just in time to remind us that the MVC actually could've picked a worse school.
11/9/2013 - Saturday
Ball State 73
Indiana State 82
Iona 69
Cleveland State 73
Florida International 72 OT
Youngstown State 74
Drake 61
Illinois-Chicago 59
Northern Iowa 64
Ohio 75
South Dakota State 89
Loyola Marymount 98
I watched the end of the Drake - UIC game... what a horrible break for Hayden Humes. Got the last second shot that touched every part of the rim, started to roll in... and bounced out. Would have been another nice win for HL over Valley... but so it goes. Nice crowd atmosphere for the flames... or Comcast had the right camera angles.
Quote from: talksalot on November 10, 2013, 08:36:09 AM
I watched the end of the Drake - UIC game... what a horrible break for Hayden Humes. Got the last second shot that touched every part of the rim, started to roll in... and bounced out. Would have been another nice win for HL over Valley... but so it goes. Nice crowd atmosphere for the flames... or Comcast had the right camera angles.
A win at home against the team picked to finish last in the MVC should be a given. I suspect UIC is in for a long season.
Quote from: talksalot on November 10, 2013, 08:36:09 AM
I watched the end of the Drake - UIC game... what a horrible break for Hayden Humes. Got the last second shot that touched every part of the rim, started to roll in... and bounced out. Would have been another nice win for HL over Valley... but so it goes. Nice crowd atmosphere for the flames... or Comcast had the right camera angles.
Good to see Cleveland State soon against Iona... They were down pretty much the whole game. Iona lost MoMo Jones, but should still win that awful conference... although I did see Manhattan beat LaSalle. Oof
11/10/2013 Sunday
Youngstown State 75
Eastern Kentucky 67
Jacksonville State 62
Illinois 86
http://scores.espn.go.com/ncb/recap?gameId=400503064 (http://scores.espn.go.com/ncb/recap?gameId=400503064)
Illinois beats Jacksonville St. 86-62QuoteSenior guard Joseph Bertrand scored 20 points and grabbed 10 rebounds to lead Illinois over Jacksonville State 86-62 Sunday at State Farm Center.
The Illini (2-0) never trailed, jumping out to a 12-1 lead in the first five minutes of the game and leading 40-27 at the half. Junior guards Rayvon Rice and Tracy Abrams each scored 13 points.
You can watch the Jacksonville St/Illinois game on ESPN 3 in a condensed version.
http://espn.go.com/watchespn/player/_/id/1215887/size/condensed/ (http://espn.go.com/watchespn/player/_/id/1215887/size/condensed/)
Of course, as always, you must have access to ESPN3.
EDIT: The Illinois crowd got a Jaxsnvl St guard to shoot 6 seconds early in the shot clock by counting it down ahead of the shot clock. I hope the coaches make the players aware. I'm sure they will be trying it again this Wednesday.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on November 09, 2013, 06:15:51 AM
ah, milwaukee...just in time to remind us that the MVC actually could've picked a worse school.
UWM picks up a road win at Davidson. Davidson was an NCAA team last year and picked 2nd in the SOCON this year. Nice win for UWM and the Horizon.
This is either great news or bad news for Milwaukee, they beat Davidson a tough team at Davidson. When they had a nice win over the Wildcats last season that was the only bright spot on the season.
But after watching this game I think Milwaukee will be better this year, they have a pretty good JUCO in Matt Tiby, had 21 points and 9 boards for the Panthers and also had 21 in his first game, which was coupled with 10 or 11 rebounds (not sure all I know he had a double-double with 21 points). One thing that was significant improvement from last year is the FT shooting. The commentators said they have only missed 4 shots all year which is a big change from last year. Jordan Aaron doesn't look very good and I thought he was overrated going into the year. Don't think Milwaukee will win the HL this season but they should be respectable foe any night and capable of surprising a few teams. I think last season might have just been a down year in Milwaukee.
But who knows they did lose to Loyola in their first game but overall a nice win for a program that needed to beat a decent team like Davidson. They're probably gonna be around .500 this year and probably won't finish in last place.
11/11/2013 Monday
Milwaukee 81
Davidson 77
ALL TIMES EASTERN STANDARD TIME
11/12/2013 Tuesday
Morehead State at East Tenn State 7:00 p.m.
Evansville at IUPUI 7:00 p.m.
Ohio at Ohio State 8:00 p.m.
Oakland at UCLA 9:00 p.m.
11/13/2013 Wednesday
Florida State at Central Florida 7:00 p.m.
Wright State at Georgetown 7:00 p.m.
Valpo at Illinois 7:30 p.m.
Saint Louis at Southern Illinois-Edwardsville 8:00 p.m.
Cleveland State at San Francisco 11:00 p.m.
11/14/2013 Thursday
Detroit at Connecticut 7:00 p.m.
Loyola Marymount at Long Beach State 10:00 p.m.
11/15/2013 Friday
San Jose State at Milwaukee 6:30 p.m.
Murray State at Old Dominion 7:00 p.m.
Cleveland State at Texas-Arlington 8:30 p.m.
James Madison at Northern Illinois 9:00 p.m.
Oakland at California 11:00 p.m.
11/16/2013 Saturday
Wright State at DePaul 2:00 p.m.
Seton Hall at Mercer 3:00 p.m.
Eastern Illinois at Illinois-Chicago 4:00 p.m.
James Madison at Milwaukee 6:30 p.m.
Wisconsin at Green Bay 8:00 p.m.
East Tenn State at Western Kentucky 8:00 p.m.
Saint Louis at Southern Illinois-Carbondale 8:05 p.m.
11/17/2013 Sunday
Youngstown State at Massachusetts 1:00 p.m.
Valpo at Ohio 2:00 p.m.
James Madison vs San Jose State 2:00 p.m.
Bethune-Cookman at Central Florida 2:00 p.m.
Milwaukee at Northern Illinois 4:30 p.m.
Bradley at Illinois 6:00 p.m.
Northern Arizona at Loyola Marymount 7:00 p.m.
Oakland at Gonzaga 8:00 p.m.
11/18/2013 Monday
Cleveland State at Eastern Michigan 7:00 p.m.
S.E. Missouri State at Ball State 7:00 p.m.
Mercer at Evansville 8:05 p.m.
11/19/2013 Tuesday
Detroit at James Madison 7:00 p.m.
Winthrop at East Tenn State 7:00 p.m.
DePaul at Milwaukee 8:00 p.m.
11/20/2013 Wednesday
Ohio at Morgan State 7:30 p.m.
Northwestern at Illinois-Chicago 8:00 p.m.
Valpo at Evansville 9:05 p.m.
11/21/2013 Thursday
Central Florida at Miami 7:00 p.m.
Samford at East Tenn State 7:00 p.m.
Oral Roberts at Saint Louis 8:00 p.m.
ALL TIMES EASTERN STANDARD TIME
Quote from: classof2014 on November 11, 2013, 08:31:42 PM
This is either great news or bad news for Milwaukee, they beat Davidson a tough team at Davidson. When they had a nice win over the Wildcats last season that was the only bright spot on the season.
But after watching this game I think Milwaukee will be better this year, they have a pretty good JUCO in Matt Tiby, had 21 points and 9 boards for the Panthers and also had 21 in his first game, which was coupled with 10 or 11 rebounds (not sure all I know he had a double-double with 21 points). One thing that was significant improvement from last year is the FT shooting. The commentators said they have only missed 4 shots all year which is a big change from last year. Jordan Aaron doesn't look very good and I thought he was overrated going into the year. Don't think Milwaukee will win the HL this season but they should be respectable foe any night and capable of surprising a few teams. I think last season might have just been a down year in Milwaukee.
But who knows they did lose to Loyola in their first game but overall a nice win for a program that needed to beat a decent team like Davidson. They're probably gonna be around .500 this year and probably won't finish in last place.
Obviously did not watch the game (there was an incredible Temple Kent St game going on), but it I'm not going to change my outlook on Milwaukee based off of one game that had a 40-15 free throw differential. While it will be hard for UWM to be as abysmal as last year, I don't see the Horizon teams that are going to finish behind them (barring major injuries). Detroit? UIC? Valpo? Maybe they have something with Tiby. Hopefully it's not a repeat of last year where they beat Davidson and proceeded to lose 9 of their next 10 OOC games.
If Tiby looks like last night for much of the season - UWM will have a good year. He was better than I expected and will be difficult for some to guard... (they're not rebuilding/reloading - they appear to be rebooting.)
Quote from: classof2014 on November 11, 2013, 08:31:42 PMJordan Aaron doesn't look very good and I thought he was overrated going into the year.
I lol'd
Let's remember that the win over Davidson was at Davidson who is picked second in their conference and has the pre-season POY. A very nice win for the Horizon!!
I definitely think UWM just had a very impressive win....
Quote from: Smj on November 12, 2013, 02:42:28 PM
I definitely think UWM just had a very impressive win....
Agree.
11/12/2013 Tuesday
Morehead State 71
East Tenn State 63
Evansville 84
IUPUI 78
Ohio 69
Ohio State 79
Oakland 60
UCLA 91
Quote from: bbtds on November 12, 2013, 09:53:59 PM
Oakland 60
UCLA 91
I need someone smart (wh, BigDWSU?) to answer this, but does Oakland scheduling and getting blown out by a bunch of BCS teams really help anyone? I assume Oakland gets paid for these games, so it helps pay Kampe's salary, which helps ... Kampe. Does it help Oakland? Does it help the Horizon? I don't know the answer ... I'm just asking.
FWIW, it seems like UWM winning at Davidson and Valpo beating Murray State helps the league way more than Oakland getting their ass handed to them at UCLA and (insert 5 other teams on their schedule).
Kampe believes that the tougher the non-conference schedule, the better it prepares his team for the conference. It's always been his philosophy, and I think it has no factor in paying his salary. For the rest of the league it would be better for Oakland to win more non-conference games. However, I don't think Kampe is concerned with the rest of the league.
Quote from: EddieCabot on November 12, 2013, 10:57:03 PM
Quote from: bbtds on November 12, 2013, 09:53:59 PM
Oakland 60
UCLA 91
I need someone smart (wh, BigDWSU?) to answer this, but does Oakland scheduling and getting blown out by a bunch of BCS teams really help anyone? I assume Oakland gets paid for these games, so it helps pay Kampe's salary, which helps ... Kampe. Does it help Oakland? Does it help the Horizon? I don't know the answer ... I'm just asking.
FWIW, it seems like UWM winning at Davidson and Valpo beating Murray State helps the league way more than Oakland getting their ass handed to them at UCLA and (insert 5 other teams on their schedule).
I think we have to remember where Oakland came from and the huge challenges they faced in trying to attract good basketball players. For starters the Summit is at best a lower mid-tier conference. Oakland's basketball facilities are mediocre. Traveling to play conference opponents several states and hundreds of miles away can be brutal. They belonged to the Summit, yet are located in the heart of MAC and HL country and competed for the same players. Their academic reputation is decent, but nothing special. These are all considerations that they would have had to work extremely hard to overcome every time they knocked on a potential recruit's door.
Simply put, I think Kampe used the allure of playing high profile OOC opponents as his number one way of offsetting all the recruiting negatives and get his share of decent athletes - nothing more, nothing less. Effect on RPI, preparation for conference play, and other OOC scheduling considerations became secondary, if considered at all. After all, the Summit is strictly a 1-bid conference. Its tournament representative will almost always be seeded somewhere between 14 and 16. In the grand scheme of things, a lot of these factors don't carry much weight - positively or negatively - for a conference like the Summit. Certainly, Kampe and company knew that better than any of us.
Kampe was quoted in recent months as saying that now that Oakland has joined the Horizon League, he will be looking to dial down their OOC schedule somewhat. I think that lends credence to the premise that they scheduled the way they did out of necessity, and that he sees this as a necessity no longer exists to the same extent. If so, the proof of the pudding will be revealed in next year's schedule.
Quote from: EddieCabot on November 12, 2013, 10:57:03 PMit helps pay Kampe's salary, which helps ... Kampe.
no fan of his--he's a blowhard--but you could argue that repeatedly getting beaten badly doesn't help a coach at all...just the opposite.
I don't understand Oakland's scheduling. I'm guessing they're getting paid to play these games but they can't be healthy for their confidence knowing they're going to get blown out of the water. Playing 5 BCS schools and another top-notch program in Gonzaga is not real smart if you're Kampe. I can't imagine the players get all too excited for these games, I understand if you had one or two of these programs is nice to have on your schedule but 6 is way too much. Their first four games is also a brutal stretch for them. Starting in North Carolina, travelling to LA, then up the coast to play Cal and Gonzaga, then back across the country to play in a tournament in South Carolina. I understand wanting to play to play top-level programs but there's a way to do it.
If Kampe wants a good schedule to look at, look at Valpo's. Games against: Murray State, Illinois, Ohio, Evansville, Central Florida, Mercer, St. Louis, etc... Those were all very good mid-major's last year (minus Illinois being a BCS) but every one of those games we have a legitimate shot at winning. If we do well against teams like this it will help us at the end of the year and will help a team grow because you're playing tough opponents night-in-night-out but not one of these games is not winnable.
There's a reasonable chance Oakland has 6 20+ point losses on their schedule at the end of the OOC. If I were a recruit that wouldn't look too good to me. So what if you play BCS schools? You get killed by all of them.
I think Kampe is a good coach but an awful scheduler. I understand not wanting a bunch of cupcakes on the schedule, like Wright State but going the complete other way and scheduling big-name programs isn't the way to do it either. Valpo probably has the most balanced OOC schedule in the HL, a lot of tough but winnable games against programs people have heard of and have had success. It's not playing 10 IPFWs/IUPUIs and it's not playing 5 BCS schools either.
Are you kidding? Kids love these games against top notch programs, as it allows them to say they played against a storied program. If an NCAA D-1 athlete is not excited to challenge themselves against this type of competition, they need to drop down a level! This doesn't mean they will be competitive, but I am sure almost every single athlete that plays against these teams has no regrets whatsoever...
Quote from: valpotx on November 13, 2013, 09:45:54 AM
Are you kidding? Kids love these games against top notch programs, as it allows them to say they played against a storied program. If an NCAA D-1 athlete is not excited to challenge themselves against this type of competition, they need to drop down a level! This doesn't mean they will be competitive, but I am sure almost every single athlete that plays against these teams has no regrets whatsoever...
But if you go in and lose all those games by 20+ points that proves that you're not good enough to play with the big-boys. I agree, I think kids love playing games like this but 6 is too much. Instead schedule high-level mid-majors that you have a shot at beating instead of 6 games where it's reasonable to say we're gonna get blown out in all of them. When it comes to recruiting, they can say we play the top-level programs but when you do you get killed by all those top-level schools I see it doing more harm than good.
Losing by 25 to NC and losing by 30 to UCLA just shows Oakland isn't ready to play the big-boys. It's nice to say we play these programs but when the results aren't good I think it does more harm than good.
My point was not towards Oakland scheduling the games, it was more to you saying that, 'I can't imagine the players get all too excited for these games.' I bet every single player on Oakland loves all 6 games, regardless of getting their brains beat in ;). I agree with the point that the school should not schedule 6 games with this difficulty.
Quote from: valpotx on November 13, 2013, 11:06:27 AMI bet every single player on Oakland loves all 6 games, regardless of getting their brains beat in .
I agree with this. Most of the former players of both basketball, football, baseball and other sports have posted the same thing. When Valpo schedules a Duke or NC, the players learn and know that they can compete, especially on any given possession. As a team, they've competed for 20 or minutes on several occasions. Football can be a little different, going up against top tier scholarship granting I-AA programs, but the players learn and need that competition.
It is only the alums and fans that appear to not like this scheduling. My guess is that most of them never played the sport, even in high school. At any level, you want to compete against the best.
I'm all for putting one or two of these games on the schedule. But 6 seems a bit much for me, especially when Oakland isn't an elite mid-major program. Perhaps looking to schedule the elite mid-major schools would be more beneficial than 5 BCS schools along with another top program in the country. As a fan I do look forward to when Valpo plays a BCS school, looking forward to the game tonight against U of I but scheduling 6 games against elite teams might be a bit much for a program like Oakland who isn't an elite mid-major program. Right now I'd say they're mediocre and have a chance to move up in the world. But scheduling 6 games where you might have tops 20% chance to be a team like Cal is your best chance I don't necessarily find beneficial.
I'm guessing most of these games were scheduled back when Oakland was thinking they would be stuck in the Summit? I mean 6 BCS games is a lot, but when you're in a league where most of your travel is by plane, it does require a lot of financial planning to make it work. Yes, an 0-6 start will hurt the HL, but did Greg Kampe know when he planned these games that a spot in the Horizon League was going to be there? It should show us how lucky we were that a Horizon League spot opened up for us when it did, or we might have had to have a hard schedule like this to prepare for play in the "League of Geographic Mess" financially. At least in 2014-15, Kampe won't have to schedule 6 practically impossible games to get ready for HL play.
Quote from: valporun on November 13, 2013, 03:44:57 PM
I'm guessing most of these games were scheduled back when Oakland was thinking they would be stuck in the Summit? I mean 6 BCS games is a lot, but when you're in a league where most of your travel is by plane, it does require a lot of financial planning to make it work. Yes, an 0-6 start will hurt the HL, but did Greg Kampe know when he planned these games that a spot in the Horizon League was going to be there? It should show us how lucky we were that a Horizon League spot opened up for us when it did, or we might have had to have a hard schedule like this to prepare for play in the "League of Geographic Mess" financially. At least in 2014-15, Kampe won't have to schedule 6 practically impossible games to get ready for HL play.
Take a look at the "new" WAC. Talk about having to travel. Seattle to Chicago to Corpus Christi.
Georgetown beating up on Wright State early. Halfway through first, Georgetown already in bonus. I don't think Wright State is built to go against larger athletic teams. I think Valpo can use their size against Wright State in the future.
11/13/2013 Wednesday
Florida State 80
Central Florida 68
Wright State 70
Georgetown 88
Valpo 52
Illinois 64
Saint Louis 82
Southern Illinois-Edw. 58
Cleveland State 82
San Francisco 91
Quote from: classof2014 on November 13, 2013, 08:38:11 AMI think Kampe is a good coach but an awful scheduler.
He's been known to half-heartedly agree with you.
Quote from: covufan on November 13, 2013, 02:49:37 PMIt is only the alums and fans that appear to not like this scheduling.
:clap: :clap: :clap:
Decided to subject myself to watching the first half of the Detroit vs Connecticut game. Detroit down 48 to 26 at the half. Needless to say Detroit might be the worst team in the HL, look terrible both on offense and defense. Other than that they're playing really well.
11/14/2013 Thursday
Detroit 55
Connecticut 101
Loyola Marymount 74
Long Beach State 73
Wow, Detroit is bad! I wouldn't think that even a solid CT team would beat them by 46!!
First, I believe the taste in the mouths of the detroit players is bitter... after the crap they've pulled in the past couple of years, it was nice to see someone hand them a karate chop.
Second, Some of you may know that RLH was a close personal friend of Kampe. I had a rather lengthly set of emails with him over Dick's last days, and I told him when Dick passed away. Kampe was graceful, thoughtful and truly cared.
Well, that does my heart good to hear. I will ratchet up my opinion of him accordingly.
Dick Harlan would not associate with fools.
Although I do think a lot of the person who had bad experiences with him. SO not out of my woods yet.
likehecares.jpg
Quote from: talksalot on November 15, 2013, 02:27:39 PM
First, I believe the taste in the mouths of the detroit players is bitter... after the crap they've pulled in the past couple of years, it was nice to see someone hand them a karate chop.
Second, Some of you may know that RLH was a close personal friend of Kampe. I had a rather lengthly set of emails with him over Dick's last days, and I told him when Dick passed away. Kampe was graceful, thoughtful and truly cared.
Yep, what goes around comes around; a.k.a. the law of reciprocity, karma, and retributive justice. It's too bad it couldn't have happened to the group of knuckleheads that perpetrated it; then again, maybe winning 0 conf. championships and only 1 tournament championship over their time there, despite having the most talent in the league, is payback enough.
I can almost bet this game against UCONN was scheduled before Ray, JR jumped to the NBA. The Titans had to be overmatched, but I haven't watched the ESPN3 coverage yet
Quote from: valporun on November 15, 2013, 06:08:29 PM
I can almost bet this game against UCONN was scheduled before Ray, JR jumped to the NBA. The Titans had to be overmatched, but I haven't watched the ESPN3 coverage yet
If I were you I would spare yourself the pain. Detroit might just be the worst HL team. I know UCONN is ranked and all but still, they have nobody, I repeat nobody who can play. When Evan Bruinsma is your star player you're in trouble. I watched that Brundidge kid from Michigan, he doesn't look like anything special either. Detroit is gonna be this year's Milwaukee.
Quote from: classof2014 on November 15, 2013, 06:16:52 PMWhen Evan Bruinsma is your star player you're in trouble.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BX8dI8TCcAAsR1r.jpg:large)
You got that RIGHT!!!!!Get out the cookies!!!!!!!JoBe: That's not sibling love (doughboy giggle)Pillsbury Doughboy laughing (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7wowYBN-ztM#)
11/15/2013 Friday
Milwaukee 64
San Jose State 61
Murray State 60
Old Dominion 70
Cleveland State 83
Texas-Arlington 73
James Madison 60
Northern Illinois 55
Oakland 60
California 64
Eww, Murray State just lost to an Old Dominion team that was terrible last year (5-25 in 2012-2013). Milwaukee beats another team?? Oakland plays with Cal? What a weird day!
Quote from: valporun on November 15, 2013, 06:08:29 PM
I can almost bet this game against UCONN was scheduled before Ray, JR jumped to the NBA. The Titans had to be overmatched, but I haven't watched the ESPN3 coverage yet
And Jr seems to be personna non-grata on the Kings these days, for reasons passing my understanding.
Quote from: StlVUFan on November 16, 2013, 01:07:47 PMfor reasons passing my understanding
probably your verb gives it away
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on November 16, 2013, 01:36:47 PM
Quote from: StlVUFan on November 16, 2013, 01:07:47 PMfor reasons passing my understanding
probably your verb gives it away
Well, that was a big fat cookie right across the plate.
And I don't miss those often, although gotta give it up to covufan for picking up on talksalot's 'wins' vs. 'wind' before I did! :)
11/16/2013 Saturday
Wright State 72
DePaul 81
Seton Hall 74 2OT
Mercer 77
Eastern Illinois 86
Illinois-Chicago 66
James Madison 66
Milwaukee 77
Wisconsin 69
Green Bay 66
East Tenn State 52
Western Kentucky 57
Saint Louis 76
Southern Illinois-Carbondale 67
Wisconsin 34
Green Bay 29 at half time
Sykes has 16 on 6 of 14 shooting
Brown has no points, 2 fouls, and 4 TOs
Thought this might be fun to track as the RPI becomes normalized ...
Here's where we are the day before the game at Ohio... We are predicted at 13-3 in the HL at this point
Date Opponent Opp. RPI Rk Results
11-08 Murray St. 0-2 (0-0) 314 77-74 W
11-13 at Illinois 3-0 (0-0) 84 52-64 L
11-17 at Ohio 1-1 (0-0) 204 64-73 L - Scouting
11-20 at Evansville 1-0 (0-0) 278 65-72 L - Scouting
11-23 James Madison 1-1 (0-0) 270 76-62 W - Scouting
11-26 UCF 0-1 (0-0) 149 74-64 W - Scouting
11-29 Mercer 0-1 (0-0) 46 75-63 W - Scouting
12-04 at Ball St. 0-1 (0-0) 336 71-68 W - Scouting
12-07 Saint Louis 2-0 (0-0) 157 67-65 W - Scouting
12-14 Loyola Marymnt 3-0 (0-0) 175 79-60 W - Scouting
12-22 at UCF 0-1 (0-0) 149 66-72 L - Scouting
12-29 at E. Tennessee St. 0-2 (0-0) 308 74-66 W - Scouting
01-02 Illinois-Chicago 0-1 (0-0) 344 77-61 W - Scouting
01-04 at Oakland 0-3 (0-0) 85 70-69 W - Scouting
01-10 Wright St. 0-1 (0-0) 323 76-62 W - Scouting
01-15 at Detroit 0-2 (0-0) 241 66-71 L - Scouting
01-18 Wisc. Milwaukee 2-1 (0-0) 286 83-57 W - Scouting
01-23 at Youngstown St. 3-0 (0-0) 59 68-70 L - Scouting
01-25 at Cleveland St. 2-1 (0-0) 233 70-69 W - Scouting
01-29 Wisc. Green Bay 0-0 (0-0) 349 79-60 W - Scouting
02-01 at Illinois-Chicago 0-1 (0-0) 344 70-69 W - Scouting
02-07 Detroit 0-2 (0-0) 241 75-63 W - Scouting
02-09 Oakland 0-3 (0-0) 85 78-61 W - Scouting
02-15 at Wisc. Milwaukee 2-1 (0-0) 286 75-66 W - Scouting
02-20 at Wisc. Green Bay 0-0 (0-0) 349 71-68 W - Scouting
02-22 Youngstown St. 3-0 (0-0) 59 76-62 W - Scouting
02-25 at Wright St. 0-1 (0-0) 323 67-71 L - Scouting
03-01 Cleveland St. 2-1 (0-0) 233 79-60 W - Scouting
Current Record: 1-1 (0-0)
GAMER Projected Record: 21-7 (13-3) Which would win the HL Title, they have UDM at 12-4
Wright losing to DePaul is a real loss
Since this thread is a kind of hodgepodge, I hope no one minds me pointing out something Ray McCallum and Hrvoje Vucic have in common:
they both have yet to play a minute in an NBA game.
Gotta wonder if Coach Wardle said something to the Phoenix player who got in Sykes way when he was trying to get a game tying three point shot off against Wisconsin in the last few seconds.
Was it "You @!$#%@#$!@ dumb $#@#!#%$#@! Get your #%$^@#! out of the way!!!!!!!
Or was it "Let's do better on our picks."
http://espn.go.com/watchespn/player/_/id/1320537/size/condensed/ (http://espn.go.com/watchespn/player/_/id/1320537/size/condensed/)
That UWGB vs. Wisconsin game! Wow - I think the Horizon teams are going to be tough this year....
11/17/2013 Sunday
Youngstown State 69
Massachusetts 85
Valpo 72
Ohio 76
San Jose State 66
James Madison 79
Bethune-Cookman 63
Central Florida 83
Milwaukee 82
Northern Illinois 69
Bradley 55
Illinois 81
Northern Arizona 78
Loyola Marymount 90
Oakland 67
Gonzaga 82
What's with UWM? 4-1 with a win over Davidson and a 4 game win streak including the NIU Invitational title. And they are playing a bunch of games back in the US Cellular ctr this season including our game there.
Green Bay only plays 2 D1 games in November. We play 7. They played Wisconsin close (counts as much as getting blown out by 40), but we'll see if they win a home game vs Virginia. If not, the winner of the Horizon may end up with a really poor seed (I don't think any team will have 12 or 13 conference wins this year).
Still not sold on Milwaukee, but I'm glad they're doing much better than last year. This is an extremely skewed sample size, but it's kind of hilarious they have a 221 RPI right now with a 4-1 record. The only wins from opponents of UWM have been UWM, San Jose St and Northern Illinois. But they've done what they've had to do so far and are exceeding all of our expectations.
Quote from: VULB#62 on November 18, 2013, 06:24:00 AMWhat's with UWM? 4-1 with a win over Davidson and a 4 game win streak including the NIU Invitational title. And they are playing a bunch of games back in the US Cellular ctr this season including our game there.
I believe UWM had no intention of playing any games at the Klotsche but with the decision to use the US Cellular Arena coming late scheduling conflicts with previous events already scheduled and under contract at the downtown Milwaukee arena forced the Panthers back to Klotsche.
Sesame Street on Ice simply pays more to the owners of the arena.
Now that I live in Two Rivers, WI, I hope to get at least to the UWGB (35 minutes) and UWM (1 hr 35 minutes) games this winter -- glad the UWM game is at the Cell. Too bad it's not a Friday-Sunday trip up north. The Thursday GB game is a long trip for a midweek game.
Quote from: VULB#62 on November 18, 2013, 04:23:18 PM
Now that I live in Two Rivers, WI, I hope to get at least to the UWGB (35 minutes) and UWM (1 hr 35 minutes) games this winter -- glad the UWM game is at the Cell. Too bad it's not a Friday-Sunday trip up north. The Thursday GB game is a long trip for a midweek game.
Quote from: historyman on November 18, 2013, 02:58:51 PM
Quote from: VULB#62 on November 18, 2013, 06:24:00 AMWhat's with UWM? 4-1 with a win over Davidson and a 4 game win streak including the NIU Invitational title. And they are playing a bunch of games back in the US Cellular ctr this season including our game there.
I believe UWM had no intention of playing any games at the Klotsche but with the decision to use the US Cellular Arena coming late scheduling conflicts with previous events already scheduled and under contract at the downtown Milwaukee arena forced the Panthers back to Klotsche.
Sesame Street on Ice simply pays more to the owners of the arena.
There are only 3 games at the Klotsche Center. Bradley 12/7, Wright State 1/30 and Oakland 2/2 . 12/7 Milwaukee Wave (indoor soccer) vs Baltimore Blast, 1/30 nothing and 2/2 AMSOIL Arenacross (motorcycle Supercross). So no Sesame Street on Ice and not a lot of big money making events.
11/18/2013 Monday
Cleveland State 69
Eastern Michigan 81
S.E. Missouri State 83
Ball State 87
Mercer 76
Evansville 89
ALL TIMES EASTERN STANDARD TIME
11/19/2013 Tuesday
James Madison at Detroit 7:00 p.m.
Winthrop at East Tennessee State 7:00 p.m.
DePaul at Milwaukee 8:00 p.m.
11/20/2013 Wednesday
Ohio at Morgan State 7:30 p.m.
Northwestern at Illinois-Chicago 8:00 p.m.
Valpo at Evansville 9:05 p.m.
11/21/2013 Thursday
Central Florida at Miami 7:00 p.m.
Samford at East Tennessee State 7:00 p.m.
Oral Roberts at Saint Louis 8:00 p.m.
11/22/2013 Friday
Northern Iowa at Loyola Marymount 1:30 p.m.
Houston Baptist at Wright State 5:00 p.m.
Florida Atlantic at Detroit 7:00 p.m.
Chicago State at Illinois 9:00 p.m.
11/23/2013 Saturday
Yale at Mercer 12:00 p.m.
Butler at Ball State 2:00 p.m.
Wright State at South Alabama 2:05 p.m.
Loyola Marymount vs Marist 2:30 p.m.
Robert Morris at Cleveland State 3:00 p.m.
James Madison at Valpo 3:05 p.m.
Stephen F. Austin at East Tennessee State 4:00 p.m.
Toledo at Detroit 5:30 p.m.
Louisiana-Lafayette vs Oakland 6:30 p.m.
Bowling Green at Saint Louis 7:00 p.m.
Murray State at Auburn 8:00 p.m.
Milwaukee at Tennessee Tech 8:00 p.m.
11/24/2013 Sunday
Oakland vs St Francis (NY) 12:30 p.m.
Stony Brook at Detroit 4:00 p.m.
11/25/2013 Monday
Illinois-Chicago vs San Diego 2:30 p.m.
Loyola Marymount at Vanderbilt 5:00 p.m.
Cleveland State at Kentucky 7:00 p.m.
11/26/2013 Tuesday
Mercer at Ohio 7:00 p.m.
Oakland at Western Michigan 7:00 p.m.
East Tennessee State at Tennessee Tech 8:00 p.m.
Evansville at Indiana 8:00 p.m.
Central Florida at Valpo 8:05 p.m.
Middle Tennessee State at Murray State 8:30 p.m.
Saint Louis at Wisconsin 8:30 p.m.
Illinois at Nevada-Las Vegas 10:45 p.m.
11/27/2013 Wednesday
James Madison at Winthrop 7:00 p.m.
Youngstown State at Kent 7:00 p.m.
Alcorn State at Wright State 7:00 p.m.
Ball State at Utah 10:00 p.m.
11/28/2013 Thursday
Green Bay at Pepperdine 9:30 p.m.
ALL TIMES EASTERN STANDARD TIME
Listening to the UWM game on the radio... 2nd half started and they were tied with Depaul. Not much scoring for UWM and its a 12 point game with 6 min left. Did see Detroit win against James Madison.
I also have to add that listening to UWM on the radio is an odd experience. One conversation was "doesn't that referee look like Paul Ryan... (silence) ... you know, Wisconsin US *Senator* Paul Ryan"
Annnd Milwaukee loses 80-71
11/19/2013 Tuesday
James Madison 67
Detroit 71
Winthrop 76
East Tennessee State 66
DePaul 80
Milwaukee 71
11/20/2013 Wednesday
Ohio 65
Morgan State 62
Northwestern 93
Illinois-Chicago 58
Valpo 92
Evansville 100
11/21/2013 Thursday
Central Florida 63
Miami 58
Samford 75
East Tennessee State 89
Oral Roberts 55
Saint Louis 72
Phew, sorry for the delay in reporting opponents' scores. I was so tied after the traveling. I've done almost no physical activity here in CEN-IL but my mind is running a hundred miles a minute. It's just a whole other world on the southeast side of the Illinois River.
If we lose to SLU at home, it has to be less than 17 now! Don't let ORU beat us in anything!
11/22/2013 Friday
Northern Iowa 90 (at St Thomas, VI)
Loyola Marymount 81
Houston Baptist 59 (at South Alabama-Mobile,AL)
Wright State 75
Florida Atlantic 44
Detroit 77
Chicago State 53
Illinois 77
11/23/2013 Saturday
Yale 54
Mercer 81
Butler 59
Ball State 58
Wright State 70
South Alabama 74
Loyola Marymount 76 (at St Thomas, VI)
Marist 70
Robert Morris 74
Cleveland State 87
James Madison 49
Valpo 81
Stephen F. Austin 58
East Tennessee State 66
Toledo 80
Detroit 78
Louisiana-Lafayette 84 (at Coastal Carolina-Conway,SC)
Oakland 75
Bowling Green 47
Saint Louis 74
Murray State 67
Auburn 75
Milwaukee 70
Tennessee Tech 63
ALL TIMES EASTERN STANDARD TIME
Milwaukee strikes again lol
Four scores and several nights ago......
This helps put the HL in perspective.
James Madison 60
Northern Illinois 55
James Madison 66 (neutral site game)
Milwaukee 77
James Madison 67
Detroit 71
James Madison 49
Valpo 81
11/24/2013 Sunday
Stony Brook 104 3 OT
Detroit 102
Oakland 62 (at Coastal Carolina-Conway,SC)
St Francis (NY) 68
Detroit is in double overtimes. .. The stands are - empty. ...
yikes - triple overtime. ...
Two bad losses by the HL today...
Quote from: Smj on November 24, 2013, 05:30:43 PM
Detroit is in double overtimes. .. The stands are - empty. ...
Aren't they always?
UIC hilariously won their first D1 game against San Diego today. Other than Youngstown State's win vs Eastern Kentucky, UIC beating San Diego has been the Horizon League's best win so far.
11/25/2013 Monday
Illinois-Chicago 74 (at Estero, FL)
San Diego 70
Cleveland State 61
Kentucky 68
Loyola Marymount 68 (at St Thomas, VI)
Vanderbilt 77
ALL TIMES EASTERN STANDARD TIME
11/26/2013 Tuesday
Illinois-Chicago vs Louisiana Tech 6:00 p.m. (at Estero,FL)
Mercer at Ohio 7:00 p.m.
Oakland at Western Michigan 7:00 p.m.
East Tennessee State at Tennessee Tech 8:00 p.m.
Evansville at Indiana 8:00 p.m.
Central Florida at Valpo 8:05 p.m.
Middle Tennessee State at Murray State 8:30 p.m.
Saint Louis vs Wisconsin 8:30 p.m. (at Playa del Carmen, Mexico)
Illinois at Nevada-Las Vegas 10:45 p.m.
11/27/2013 Wednesday
Illinois-Chicago vs Wagner 6:00 p.m. (at Estero, FL)
James Madison at Winthrop 7:00 p.m.
Youngstown State at Kent 7:00 p.m.
Alcorn State at Wright State 7:00 p.m.
Saint Louis vs Old Dominion 7:00 p.m. (at Playa del Carmen, Mexico)
Ball State vs Utah 10:00 p.m. (at Salt Lake City,UT)
11/28/2013 Thursday
Green Bay vs Pepperdine 9:30 p.m. (at Anchorage, AK)
11/29/2013 Friday
IP-Fort Wayne at Illinois 8:00 p.m.
Mercer at Valpo 8:05 p.m.
Green Bay vs Harvard 11:59 p.m. (at Anchorage, AK)
11/30/2013 Saturday
Evansville at Ohio 2:00 p.m.
Western Carolina at Wright State 3:00 p.m.
Marshall at East Tennessee State 4:00 p.m.
James Madison at Richmond 6:00 p.m.
Ball State at Cleveland State 7:00 p.m.
Detroit at South Florida 7:00 p.m.
Austin Peay at Youngstown State 7:05 p.m.
Milwaukee at MO-Kansas City 8:05 p.m.
Murray State at St. Mary's 10:00 p.m.
Green Bay vs Tulsa 10:00 p.m. (at Anchorage, AK)
12/1/2013 Sunday
Wichita State at Saint Louis 1:00 p.m.
12/2/2013 Monday
Wright State at Morehead State 7:00 p.m.
Mercer at Oklahoma 9:00 p.m.
Loyola Marymount at UC-Riverside 10:00 p.m.
12/3/2013 Tuesday
Central Florida at Florida Atlantic 7:00 p.m.
Illinois at Georgia Tech 7:15 p.m.
Northern Iowa at Milwaukee 8:00 p.m.
12/4/2013 Wednesday
Valpo at Ball State 7:00 p.m.
Detroit at Toledo 7:00 p.m.
Cleveland State at Drexel 7:00 p.m.
Robert Morris at Youngstown State 7:45 p.m.
Evansville at Murray State 8:00 p.m.
East Tennessee State at Austin Peay 8:00 p.m.
Southern Methodist at Illinois-Chicago 8:00 p.m.
12/5/2013 Thursday
Wright State at North Carolina A&T 7:00 p.m.
ALL TIMES EASTERN STANDARD TIME
Quote from: bbtds on November 25, 2013, 08:16:22 PM
11/25/2013 Monday
Cleveland State 61
Kentucky 68
This game was closer than what the score indicates. Cleveland State was actually up by 8 late in the second half and it looked like they would pull off the upset. Kentucky realized they're Kentucky and pulled out the win at home.
That's a surprising game, with CSU up 4 at half! I still think they will choke in conference, and be a middle pack team
Quote from: bbtds on November 25, 2013, 08:16:22 PM(at Estero, FL)
estero? what's going on in estero? why does no one advertise these things down here...
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on November 26, 2013, 08:08:02 AMQuote from: bbtds on November 25, 2013, 08:16:22 PM(at Estero, FL)
estero? what's going on in estero? why does no one advertise these things down here...
It's called the Gulf Coast Showcase at the Germain Arena in Estero, FL. There are eight men's teams playing from Nov.25-27 and eight women's teams playing from Nov.29-Dec. 1. The eight men's teams are Louisiana Tech, San Diego, St Bonnaventure, Southern Illinois-C, Stetson, UIC, NC-Greensboro and Wagner. The first day is over but they play today and tomorrow. This is the G. C. Showcase's first year.
http://gcs.bdglobalsports.com/ (http://gcs.bdglobalsports.com/)
oh ok. thanks!
that's just rubbing salt in, that I can't see VU down here but I can watch Jay Harris.
The CSU game was such a surprise that ESPN cut away from Maui to show the end of this game.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle link=topic=1608.msg38908#msg38908 date=13
85494251
oh ok. thanks!
that's just rubbing salt in, that I can't see VU down here but I can watch Jay Harris.
Since this is the Showcase's first year I wouldn't be surprised to see Valpo end up in this tournament in a few years. Keep your chin up.
Quote from: historyman on November 26, 2013, 03:23:05 PMSince this is the Showcase's first year I wouldn't be surprised to see Valpo end up in this tournament in a few years. Keep your chin up.
HUZZAH!
If that happens you can all crash at my place.
(http://media.naplesnews.com/media/img/photos/2013/11/25/1126_NCSP_GCS-SD-UIC1_t607.JPG)
Looks like UIC could have used more fans at the Gulf Coast Showcase. Even the San Diego fans didn't show up. I wonder why. Couldn't the Terero fans have used a nice trip to a warm...................oh, never mind. ::)
look dude, i'd have gone if they'd have publicized it.
seriously, y'all come down now when we play there.
or play FGCU.
11/26/2013 Tuesday
Illinois-Chicago 78
Louisiana Tech 103 (at Estero,FL)
Mercer 67
Ohio 76
Oakland 88
Western Michigan 99
East Tennessee State POSTPONED
Tennessee Tech
Evansville 46
Indiana 77
Central Florida 70
Valpo 85
Middle Tennessee State 80
Murray State 62
Saint Louis 57
Wisconsin 63 (at Playa del Carmen, Mexico)
Illinois 61
Nevada-Las Vegas 59
I was in a restaurant in Kansas City tonight and on the TV in the bar was the Maui Classic (Syracuse v. Cal) and I thought that Valpo needs the exposure these gigs provide. UWGB is in Alaska, UIC in Florida. Next year we should try to get an invite to a holiday tournament. The last two years of individual games just doesn't have the pizazz, plus some of those games are during break and few students hang around -- might as well travel. Love to see VU in Hawaii next year.
In the last 20 years, Valpo has played in 4 Hawaii tournaments, 2 in Las Vegas, The USVI, South Padre, and the Great Alaskan Shoot-out. Awfully impressive for a mid-major. A couple more major tournaments are in the works in the next few years.
Balentine only scores 14 against Indiana in what turned out to be a pummeling by the Hoosiers. Indiana only allowed the Purple Aces to shoot 29.1% while Evansville averaged 52.7% in their other 5 games. Balentine was 0-5 from three and 5 for 12 from two. Simmons was 1 for 5 from three and missed 2 twos. And most importantly the fouls were fairly even with E-Ville 25, IU 22.
In tonight's game at Valpo, the fouls were UCF 22, VU 21.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on November 26, 2013, 01:30:51 PMoh ok. thanks! that's just rubbing salt in, that I can't see VU down here but I can watch Jay Harris.
Don't be surprised to see Jay walking the streets of Naples.
(http://gcs.bdglobalsports.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/WA_Cover.jpg)
WALDORF ASTORIA NAPLES SERVING AS OFFICIAL HOST RESORT OF THE GULF COAST SHOWCASE
Quote from: historyman on November 26, 2013, 11:30:00 PMDon't be surprised to see Jay walking the streets of Naples.
Eh, knowing him, he'll be hanging out about eight feet behind the line.
Probably get hit by an old man on a moped, too.
Just so you know--that Waldorf is hardly worthy of the name. I recommend either of the Ritz Carltons much more highly. Don't be too envious of them.
Little correction and footnote on the games listed as "postponed" above...
11.26.13
Middle Tennessee State 80
Murray State 62 is the final
the East Tennessee State - Tennessee Tech game was postponed..."No Officials were contracted to work the game". From the ETSU website: COOKEVILLE, Tenn. (Nov. 26, 2013) -- Tonight's game between Tennessee Tech and ETSU has been postponed until Wednesday afternoon at 3 p.m... at 12:20 to go in the first half, TTU leads ETSU 18-12.
Just checked the "real time Rippee" site... we jumped from 162 before the CFU game, and 147 right after the game to 120 right now.
the SOS is moving nicely thanks to Illinois, ohio and evansville...
11-08 Murray St. 0-4 (0-0) 290 77-74 W
11-13 at Illinois 6-0 (0-0) 25 52-64 L
11-17 at Ohio 4-1 (0-0) 27 72-76 L
11-20 at Evansville 3-1 (0-0) 65 92-100 L
11-23 James Madison 2-4 (0-0) 235 81-49 W
11-26 UCF 2-2 (0-0) 189 85-70 W
11-29 Mercer 2-3 (0-0) 75 76-64 W - Scouting
12-04 at Ball St. 1-2 (0-0) 139 71-69 W - Scouting
12-07 Saint Louis 5-1 (0-0) 92 67-65 W - Scouting
12-14 Loyola Marymnt 5-2 (0-0) 215 79-61 W - Scouting
12-22 at UCF 2-2 (0-0) 189 67-73 L - Scouting
12-29 at E. Tennessee St. 2-4 (0-0) 243 74-66 W - Scouting
Hard to believe Murray State is 0-fer... and this Mercer team is scary-good! Like the top 6 guys are seniors. They did lose by 9 to Ohio... but we should have.
Quote from: talksalot on November 27, 2013, 02:18:05 PM
Little correction and footnote on the games listed as "postponed" above...
11.26.13
Middle Tennessee State 80
Murray State 62 is the final
the East Tennessee State - Tennessee Tech game was postponed..."No Officials were contracted to work the game". From the ETSU website: COOKEVILLE, Tenn. (Nov. 26, 2013) -- Tonight's game between Tennessee Tech and ETSU has been postponed until Wednesday afternoon at 3 p.m... at 12:20 to go in the first half, TTU leads ETSU 18-12.
Thanks for the correction. I will make sure it's updated.
11/27/2013 Wednesday
East Tennessee State 83
Tennessee Tech 98
Wagner 76 (at Estero, FL)
Illinois-Chicago 94
James Madison 57
Winthrop 69
Youngstown State 79
Kent State 83
Alcorn State 55
Wright State 73
Old Dominion 52 (at Playa del Carmen, Mexico)
Saint Louis 62
Ball State 69
Utah 88 (at Salt Lake City,UT)
Is the RPI getting close to being "Normalized" as more teams play each other...ALMOST...
team 11/16 11/27
Murray State 314 290
at Illinois 84 25
at Ohio 204 27
at Evansville 278 65
James Madison 270 235
Central Florida 149 189
Mercer 46 75
at Ball State 336 139
St Louis 157 92
Loyola Marymount 175 215
at UCF 189 189
at East Tenn State 308 243
UIC 344 260
Oakland 85 229
Wright State 323 283
Detroit 241 176
Milwaukee 286 198
Youngstown State 59 9
Cleveland State 233 113
Green Bay 349 17
t
Wow, Jay Harris and Wagner got smoked by a bad UIC team! Bad game by him as well:
http://scores.espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=400519835 (http://scores.espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=400519835)
Like seeing HL team (UIC) beat Jay Harris at Wagner....
Quote from: Smj on November 28, 2013, 08:22:35 AM
Like seeing HL team (UIC) beat Jay Harris at Wagner....
I looked at the box score which reported Jay had 1 point in 20 minutes. Barlow on the other hand went off for 38. Wagner is going to have a long season.
11/28/2013 Thursday-Thanksgiving
Pepperdine 89
Green Bay 97
11/29/2013 Friday
IP-Fort Wayne 55
Illinois 57
Mercer 117 3 OT
Valpo 108
Green Bay 64
Harvard 76 (at Anchorage, AK)
Illinois squeaks out a two point over IPFW? Illinois must be in some real interesting shape if they barely beat the Mastadons.
Evansville 59
Ohio 81
Western Carolina 77
Wright State 85
Marshall 78
East Tennessee State 88
James Madison 53
Richmond 68
Ball State 55
Cleveland State 78
Detroit 65
South Florida 60
Austin Peay 88
Youngstown State 86
Milwaukee 84
MO-Kansas City 79
Murray State 64
St. Mary's 89
Green Bay 67
Tulsa 59 (at Anchorage, AK)
I wish James Madison and Murray State would snap out of it! Anyway... another milestone on the brink...thanks to a couple of huge blowouts this year
Since we started playing at a D-1 level in 1977... Total Points
Valparaiso 75,673
Opponent 75.667 Difference of 6 that's (.0055) points per game over 1,082 games.
We have never been over the hump since turning D1...(we lost our first 5 games that year by a combined 74 points). Watching parts of the Cleveland State game against Ball State, we have a chance to move ahead of the curve on Wednesday night in Muncie.
OH, several people asked if the 117-108 game on Friday was a school record for points in a game at 225...From the Record Book....quick answer: no.
Consider that the 3-point field goal line was not established until 1986.
At Ball State 2/19/64 Cardinals won 117-116... total points 233
Muhlenberg 12/6/68 Valpo won 138-89... total points 227
Wheaton 3/1/68 Valpo won 121-104 ... total points 225
VU Games where both teams hit 100:
Ball State 2/19/64 L 117-116
At Indiana State 1/5/66 L 113-100
St. Procopius 12/1/66 W 105-101
at Wheaton 3/2/68 L 106-105
Wheaton 3/1/69 W 121-104
at Western Illinois 3/1/93 L 104-100 (OT)
at Troy State 1/15/96 L 115-104
at Oakland 12/21/10 W 103-102
Mercer 11/29/13 L 117-108 (3OT)
NCAA Record... Troy State over Devry 258-141 1/12/92
The highest points-per-game average for a season was 1965-66, under Bartow, the average was 94.71 points per game.... we are at 86.00 this year so far. Some of this may be the new "officiating" where they are trying to get more offense, but to go back in time, here are the results from that 1965-66 season, where no player had a shot they didn't like.
Dec. 4 Wheaton W 100-80
Dec. 7 Hope W 104-85
Dec. 10 Capital ! W 112-59
Dec. 1 Luther ! W 120-85
Dec. 14 at Wabash W 90-69
Dec. 16 Alberta W 120-60
Dec. 18 at DePauw L 80-77
Dec. 22 Purdue W 114-96
Dec. 30 at Washington (Mo.) W 70-59
Jan. 3 at Wheaton W 111-60
Jan. 5 at Indiana State L 113-100
Jan. 8 Evansville W 83-73
Jan. 12 Butler W 89-83
Jan. 22 Washington (Mo.) W 125-92
Jan. 26 at Ball State W 89-76
Jan. 29 Saint Joseph's (Ind.) W 72-65
Feb. 2 DePauw W 110-71
Feb. 5 Indiana State L 101-86
Feb. 9 at Evansville L 95-88
Feb. 12 at Butler L 93-91
Feb. 16 at Air Force L 98-69
Feb. 19 Ball State W 112-87
Feb. 22 at Saint Joseph's (Ind.) L 98-69
Feb. 26 Wabash W 109-77
Mar 1 at Drake L 78-74
Mar 4 vs. Saint Procopius #W 107-76 (NCAA Midwest Regional)
Mar 5 at North Dakota #L 112-82 (NCAA Midwest Regional)
All in all, a pretty impressive season.
Our team looks like a Pro.copious points are being scored.
12/1/2013 Sunday
Wichita State 70
Saint Louis 65
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on December 01, 2013, 11:47:26 AMOur team looks like a Pro.copious points are being scored.
St. Procopius College
In 1897 St. Procopius College (destined to become Benedictine University in Lisle, Illinois) began classes in the building immediately to the east of the rectory.
Benedictine University was founded in Chicago as St. Procopius College by the Benedictine monks of St. Procopius Abbey in 1887. It secured a charter from the state of Illinois in 1890. The College was founded to educate men of Czech and Slovak descent, and most students were of Czech ancestry in the early years. In 1901 the College moved to the more congenial atmosphere of Lisle, in DuPage County. The first building, Benedictine Hall, was dedicated in September 1901. The building was completed by 1921 and new buildings began to be added after 1926. The College became coeducational in 1968 and was renamed Illinois Benedictine College in 1971. In response to community needs, graduate, doctorate and adult learner programs were added. The College became Benedictine University in 1996. The Eagles are 1-4 on this season. NOW... aren't you glad you brought it up?
Quote from: talksalot on December 01, 2013, 07:59:11 AM
The highest points-per-game average for a season was 1965-66, under Bartow, the average was 94.71 points per game.... here are the results from that 1965-66 season, where no player had a shot they didn't like.
Dec. 1 Marquette L 80-79 {Missing from the original list}
Dec. 4 Wheaton W 100-80
Dec. 7 Hope W 104-85
Dec. 10 Capital W 112-59
Dec. 1 Luther W 120-85
Dec. 14 at Wabash W 90-69
Dec. 16 Alberta W 120-60 {that was before Canadians were alowed to play good basketball}
Dec. 18 at DePauw L 80-77
Dec. 22 Purdue W 114-96 {Yes, Purdue!}
Dec. 30 at Washington (Mo.) W 70-59
Jan. 3 at Wheaton W 111-60
Jan. 5 at Indiana State L 113-100
Jan. 8 Evansville W 83-73 {never a question}
Jan. 12 Butler W 89-83
Jan. 22 Washington (Mo.) W 125-92
Jan. 26 at Ball State W 89-76
Jan. 29 Saint Joseph's (Ind.) W 72-65
Feb. 2 DePauw W 110-71
Feb. 5 Indiana State L 101-86
Feb. 9 at Evansville L 95-88 {homers! even then}
Feb. 12 at Butler L 93-91 {was at Hinkle for that one -- we shouddah won}
Feb. 16 at Air Force L 98-69
Feb. 19 Ball State W 112-87
Feb. 22 at Saint Joseph's (Ind.) L 98-69
Feb. 26 Wabash W 109-77
Mar 1 at Drake L 78-74
Mar 4 vs. Saint Procopius #W 107-76 (NCAA Midwest Regional)
Mar 5 at North Dakota #L 112-82 (NCAA Midwest Regional)
All in all, a pretty impressive season.
I was there for every home game that year. That team was unreal in the way they ran and scored. It wasn't a "throw up anything and hope it would go in" offense. It was just a fast paced offense that scored tons of points inside and on breaks. Tallest player was Ken Rakow at 6'6." Tom Smith was at point and Dick Jones was at what is now called the 2. Rich Eynon, Steve Cook (All-American in the 110 High Hurdles and at 6'2" could dunk (it was illegal then in games) with his eyes even with the rim) and Vern Curtis were the forwards (and the basic rotation). That was a 5'9", 5'10", 6'2", 6'4", 6'3", and 6'6" lineup that ran by larger teams and went nose to nose with the Jerry Sloan/Larry Humes Evansville teams in 65 and 66. Brown Gym was an incredible place to watch a game from 63-66 and, as I remember it, we packed in over 4K per game those years (classes never got in the way of watching that team play) -- can't speak about 67 cuz I was outta there by then, but Dick Jones, who also was an ace pitcher on Em Bauer's baseball team, averaged over 18 PPG. I'm proud to call all of them, except Smitty who was a Phi Psi but an honorary brother, brother Phi Delts. In that era we (Phi Delt) owned the basketball, football, and baseball programs on campus. My, how things have changed. But a big point to make was that Gene Bartow was a genius at taking available talent and conjurring up a system that would use each player's talents to the max. We beat Marquette in 65 and lost to them by one point in 66, but it was one of my best memories watching a frustrated Al McGuire dealing with a game he could not control in 65. I had the pleasure and honor of flying from Boston to Milwaukee on the same flight with Al years later -- what a great gentleman. We talked at length. He was one of the great ones.
Wow, DeVry had a basketball team in 1992?!?!
12/2/2013 Monday
Wright State 69
Morehead State 74
Mercer 82
Oklahoma 96
Loyola Marymount 73
UC-Riverside 69
ALL TIMES EASTERN STANDARD TIME
12/3/2013 Tuesday
Central Florida at Florida Atlantic 7:00 p.m.
Illinois at Georgia Tech 7:15 p.m.
Northern Iowa at Milwaukee 8:00 p.m.
12/4/2013 Wednesday
Valpo at Ball State 7:00 p.m.
Detroit at Toledo 7:00 p.m.
Cleveland State at Drexel 7:00 p.m.
Robert Morris at Youngstown State 7:45 p.m.
Evansville at Murray State 8:00 p.m.
East Tennessee State at Austin Peay 8:00 p.m.
Southern Methodist at Illinois-Chicago 8:00 p.m.
12/5/2013 Thursday
Wright State at North Carolina A&T 7:00 p.m.
12/6/2013 Friday
James Madison at Sam Houston 7:00 p.m.
Loyola Marymount at Pittsburgh 7:00 p.m.
12/7/2013 Saturday
Wright State at Virginia Military 1:00 p.m.
Youngstown State at MO-Kansas City 1:05 p.m.
East Tennessee State at Georgia Tech 2:00 p.m.
Akron at Cleveland State 2:00 p.m.
Miami (OH) at Evansville 2:05 p.m.
Denver at Mercer 3:00 p.m.
Lipscomb at Murray State 4:00 p.m.
Bradley at Milwaukee 4:00 p.m.
Illinois-Chicago at Loyola-IL 4:00 p.m.
Virginia at Green Bay 5:00 p.m.
Ohio at Oakland 6:00 p.m.
Stetson at Central Florida 7:00 p.m.
Saint Louis at Valpo 8:00 p.m.
James Madison at Stephen F Austin 9:15 p.m.
12/8/2013 Sunday
Rhode Island at Detroit 2:00 p.m.
Auburn at Illinois 3:00 p.m.
12/9/2013 Monday
No opponents' games scheduled
12/10/2013 Tuesday
Oakland at Indiana 7:00 p.m.
Green Bay at Eastern Michigan 7:00 p.m.
Evansville at Xavier 7:00 p.m.
Dartmouth at Illinois 8:00 p.m.
12/11/2013 Wednesday
Howard at Central Florida 7:00 p.m.
Milwaukee at Wisconsin 8:00 p.m.
12/12/2013 Thursday
No opponents' games scheduled
ALL TIMES EASTERN STANDARD TIME
so I flipped over to cbssports.com for the Wright State game... interesting headline... when you read the article... er uh... do ya think an editor did not read the story before keying the headline?
------------------------------------------------------------
Wright State hangs on to beat Morehead State 74-69
Dec. 2, 2013
MOREHEAD, Ky. (AP) Angelo Warner had 19 points, eight assists and seven rebounds to lead Morehead State to a 74-69 victory over Wright State on Monday night.
Billy Reader's dunk with 25 seconds to go put Morehead State in front 72-67 and Warner iced the game on two free throws with 8 seconds left.
Quote from: talksalot on December 02, 2013, 09:41:14 PMso I flipped over to cbssports.com for the Wright State game... interesting headline... when you read the article... er uh... do ya think an editor did not read the story before keying the headline? ------------------------------------------------------------ Wright State hangs on to beat Morehead State 74-69 Dec. 2, 2013 MOREHEAD, Ky. (AP) Angelo Warner had 19 points, eight assists and seven rebounds to lead Morehead State to a 74-69 victory over Wright State on Monday night. Billy Reader's dunk with 25 seconds to go put Morehead State in front 72-67 and Warner iced the game on two free throws with 8 seconds left.
So you're saying cbssports.com got the headline both Wright and Wrong? :o
Last night was the first chance I've had to see WSU in action this season. As everyone knows last year's WSU team made its living on the defensive end by initiating heavy physical contact on every cut and drive. They definitely had a different look last night with being far more limited by the new rule changes. The good news for WSU fans - scoring against D-1 opponents is up by 10 points over last year. The bad, points against are up by 15. This is the struggle that defensive-minded teams like WSU are going to have with the new rule changes. Are they going to be able to find enough offense to make up for what they lose on defense? Maybe Hopkins will help bridge that gap.
Looking forward I don't think we'll know much more about WSU before conference play begins than we know right now. Their 6 remaining OOC opponents have a combined D-1 record of 7-23 with RPI's ranging from 179 to 298. This should be 6 easy wins for a team with everyone back, plus the addition of Hopkins 2 or 3 games from now.
12/3/2013 Tuesday
Central Florida 64
Florida Atlantic 75
Illinois 64
Georgia Tech 67
Northern Iowa 72
Milwaukee 83
ALL TIMES EASTERN STANDARD TIME
Quote from: bbtds on December 03, 2013, 04:54:36 PM
Northern Iowa 72
Milwaukee 83
Watched the 2nd half of this game and was impressed with Matt Tiby. Really high energy guy who reminds me of KVW a little in the post and also was able to step out and stroke a couple of 3's tonight. Very versatile player.
Quote from: FWalum on December 03, 2013, 09:35:08 PM
Quote from: bbtds on December 03, 2013, 04:54:36 PM
Northern Iowa 72
Milwaukee 83
Watched the 2nd half of this game and was impressed with Matt Tiby. Really high energy guy who reminds me of KVW a little in the post and also was able to step out and stroke a couple of 3's tonight. Very versatile player.
This looks like a good win ... UNI was picked 3rd in the Valley. Of note, it took UWM to December 3rd to match last season's win total of 8. They may not be great, but they are definitely improved.
I have been incredibly impressed with UWM. They've beaten some really good teams and look like a legitimate contender this season.
Still cautious though, let us not forget the hot and surprising start UIC was able to get off to last season and they were a big let down come conference play.
Quote from: classof2014 on December 03, 2013, 10:13:24 PM
I have been incredibly impressed with UWM. They've beaten some really good teams and look like a legitimate contender this season.
Still cautious though, let us not forget the hot and surprising start UIC was able to get off to last season and they were a big let down come conference play.
The 7 D-1 teams they have beaten have a combined D-1 record of 14-33, and all 7 have losing records. They also lost to 2-5 Loyola. A better test will be against 5-2 Bradley on Saturday, although the Braves have beaten some real cupcakes themselves.
Quote from: wh on December 03, 2013, 10:29:06 PM
Quote from: classof2014 on December 03, 2013, 10:13:24 PM
I have been incredibly impressed with UWM. They've beaten some really good teams and look like a legitimate contender this season.
Still cautious though, let us not forget the hot and surprising start UIC was able to get off to last season and they were a big let down come conference play.
The 7 D-1 teams they have beaten have a combined D-1 record of 14-33, and all 7 have losing records. They also lost to 2-5 Loyola. A better test will be against 5-2 Bradley on Saturday, although the Braves have beaten some real cupcakes themselves.
Like I said, they're not great, but at least they're winning some games. IMO, beating bad teams is better than losing to bad teams.
You could apply the same skepticism to Valpo ... their 3 DI wins come against teams that are 4-13 against DI competition.
As you point out, it's very tough to draw conclusions this early in the season. Things will shake out over time. My only point was that any non-con win by a league team helps the league.
I am happy that they are winning their out of conference games, that is all I care about at the moment. I won't call them a contender until I see them do it in conference, as they were just plain AWFUL last season. It was like watching a scene from Gravity, one catastrophe after another!
Quote from: EddieCabot on December 03, 2013, 10:46:00 PM
Quote from: wh on December 03, 2013, 10:29:06 PM
Quote from: classof2014 on December 03, 2013, 10:13:24 PM
I have been incredibly impressed with UWM. They've beaten some really good teams and look like a legitimate contender this season.
Still cautious though, let us not forget the hot and surprising start UIC was able to get off to last season and they were a big let down come conference play.
The 7 D-1 teams they have beaten have a combined D-1 record of 14-33, and all 7 have losing records. They also lost to 2-5 Loyola. A better test will be against 5-2 Bradley on Saturday, although the Braves have beaten some real cupcakes themselves.
Like I said, they're not great, but at least they're winning some games. IMO, beating bad teams is better than losing to bad teams.
You could apply the same skepticism to Valpo ... their 3 DI wins come against teams that are 4-13 against DI competition.
As you point out, it's very tough to draw conclusions this early in the season. Things will shake out over time. My only point was that any non-con win by a league team helps the league.
I wasn't taking issue with your comment. I thought 2014's comment about them beating some "really good teams" was a little over the top - nothing more than that. Obviously, I hope they win every OOC game they play. As I noted on another thread awhile back, having a strong Milwaukee is very important to the Horizon League.
12/4/2013 Wednesday
Valpo 69
Ball State 50
Detroit 75
Toledo 91
Cleveland State 82 3 OT
Drexel 85
Robert Morris 75
Youngstown State 84
Evansville 63
Murray State 65
East Tennessee State 80
Austin Peay 74
Southern Methodist 73
Illinois-Chicago 65
If you live in the Chicagoland area, or get Comcast Sportsnet Chicago on your television viewing system, the SMU-UIC game will be on CSNChicago at 7PM CT this evening.
Do we have confirmation that our game will be free today through one of those links?
Quote from: valpotx on December 04, 2013, 05:00:36 PM
Do we have confirmation that our game will be free today through one of those links?
I'm watching their pre-game free right now at the mac site.
However, the WVUR webcast seems to be down. Can't connect from my laptop or from the TuneIn app.
It took me a little bit to get connected on the Tune-In radio app too.
Quote from: EddieCabot on December 03, 2013, 10:12:30 PM
Quote from: FWalum on December 03, 2013, 09:35:08 PM
Quote from: bbtds on December 03, 2013, 04:54:36 PM
Northern Iowa 72
Milwaukee 83
Watched the 2nd half of this game and was impressed with Matt Tiby. Really high energy guy who reminds me of KVW a little in the post and also was able to step out and stroke a couple of 3's tonight. Very versatile player.
This looks like a good win ... UNI was picked 3rd in the Valley. Of note, it took UWM to December 3rd to match last season's win total of 8. They may not be great, but they are definitely improved.
Northern Iowa certainly has some talent but they did not play well against Milwaukee because they didn't match up well against Tiby and Kelm. Valpo will have no problem with that.
12/5/2013 Thursday
Wright State 59
North Carolina A&T State 62
Quote from: bbtds on December 05, 2013, 04:10:36 PM
12/5/2013 Thursday
Wright State 59
North Carolina A&T State 62
Wow, had to double check that to be sure. Wright State really just lost to a team picked 5th in the MEAC.
Quote
The problem is,even if we somehow put it all together for conference play and win the HL, we would be destined for the play in game in the NCAAs. This schedule had no margin of error is was so weak. Losing games like this is completely unacceptable.
Quote
For all the talk by BD about UD not playing us, for all the rants on this board about the schedule, for all the love in the press and USA Today about us possibly being the next mid-major cinderalla...to losing to NC A&T. It really is hard to be a fan for sure. We have season tickets, it's a family thing, and we're still going to go and cheer, but man, this loss is just hard to swallow.
http://wrightstate.proboards.com/thread/740/game-10-north-carolina?page=7 (http://wrightstate.proboards.com/thread/740/game-10-north-carolina?page=7)
Little bit of a freakout happening in Dayton. That's the problem with the really weak schedule. If you drop a couple of those games, you're not going to get a chance to be a Cinderella because you'll be playing Kansas or Michigan St in the first round.
QuoteBD has to learn the changes made in calling fouls makes his thinking of offense and defense more ineffective. Hope we can change and drive more and get to the rim or pass out for three.
Read more: http://wrightstate.proboards.com/thread/740/game-10-north-carolina?page=7#ixzz2mhuRgckX (http://wrightstate.proboards.com/thread/740/game-10-north-carolina?page=7#ixzz2mhuRgckX)
This guy hit the nail on the head. Their style of play has really been adversely affected by the way things are being called right now. It will be interesting to see if this holds into conference play. I don't think that the current hyper sensitive foul calling will continue into conference. In watching some of the B1G ACC "challenge" games it looked like they were letting things get a little more physical. The key will be how consistent the calls will be one game versus the next once the conference season hits. Even with a little relaxation of the current emphasis I don't know if Wright State can be effective playing Donlon's game in this new reality.
Quote from: FWalum on December 06, 2013, 09:10:11 AM
QuoteBD has to learn the changes made in calling fouls makes his thinking of offense and defense more ineffective. Hope we can change and drive more and get to the rim or pass out for three.
Read more: http://wrightstate.proboards.com/thread/740/game-10-north-carolina?page=7#ixzz2mhuRgckX (http://wrightstate.proboards.com/thread/740/game-10-north-carolina?page=7#ixzz2mhuRgckX)
This guy hit the nail on the head. Their style of play has really been adversely affected by the way things are being called right now. It will be interesting to see if this holds into conference play. I don't think that the current hyper sensitive foul calling will continue into conference. In watching some of the B1G ACC "challenge" games it looked like they were letting things get a little more physical. The key will be how consistent the calls will be one game versus the next once the conference season hits. Even with a little relaxation of the current emphasis I don't know if Wright State can be effective playing Donlon's game in this new reality.
I don't care what the rules are, if you can chokeslam a forward to the ground or if you aren't allowed to touch the opponent (Netball World Championship FINAL AUS V NZ 2011 OVERTIME (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgr2zmq9CUk#ws)), you shouldn't be losing to middle of the road MEAC teams.
Quote from: a3uge on December 06, 2013, 09:39:45 AMyou shouldn't be losing to middle of the road MEAC teams.
Agreed!
Quote from: FWalum on December 06, 2013, 04:33:51 PM
Quote from: a3uge on December 06, 2013, 09:39:45 AMyou shouldn't be losing to middle of the road MEAC teams.
Agreed!
Too much athleticism for the Raiders to catch up to finally bit WSU in the nethers. You can say all you want to about how teams must play their defense differently with the way the rules have changed and the varying degrees different officiating crews have interpreted them but Wright State just couldn't catch up to the speed of A&T. Previously the Raiders had athletic teams. This year they simply don't have the speed to catch up with a team like the Aggies.
12/6/2013 Friday
James Madison 76
Sam Houston State 77 (at Nacogdoches, TX-Stephen F Austin)
Loyola Marymount 68
Pittsburgh 85
Could be a good day ... or not... for the Horizon League:
Wright State at Virginia Military 1:00 p.m. -
Youngstown State at MO-Kansas City 1:05 p.m.
Akron at Cleveland State 2:00 p.m.
Bradley at Milwaukee 4:00 p.m.
Illinois-Chicago at Loyola-IL 4:00 p.m.
Virginia at Green Bay 5:00 p.m.
Ohio at Oakland 6:00 p.m.
St. Louis at Valpo 7:05 p.m.
My heart says Wins by YSU, UIC, GBay and Valpo ... 4-4 on the day. (My head says CSU will be the 4th "W")
12/7/2013 Saturday
Wright State 74
Virginia Military 94
Youngstown State 80
MO-Kansas City 88
East Tennessee State 57
Georgia Tech 87
Akron 73
Cleveland State 61
Miami (OH) 65 fouls-27
Evansville 78 fouls-20
Denver 63 OT
Mercer 64
Lipscomb 69
Murray State 73
Bradley 67
Milwaukee 73
Illinois-Chicago 70
Loyola-IL 73
Virginia 72
Green Bay 75
Ohio 56
Oakland 73
Stetson 58
Central Florida 77
Saint Louis 67
Valpo 65
James Madison 57
Stephen F Austin 70 (in Lumberjack Invitational)
Love the student section at VMI!
So, CSU is dominated at home by a very average Akron team, who until today was off to a bad start to the season. Like I said a couple of days ago, Cleveland State certainly is not a "top tier" HL team.
I don't even know what to say about Wright State anymore. And, what's with YSU losing to an absolutely terrible UMKC team?
WSU isn't very good, last year was a fluke. Coach Donlon can stomp and pout about as much as he wants.
The HL conf. RPI is in free fall. Over the past week we have dropped from 12th to 13th to 14th and now 15th.
http://warrennolan.com/basketball/2014/conferencerpi (http://warrennolan.com/basketball/2014/conferencerpi)
Hopefully us along with GB can pull out wins tonight. Would definitely help.
There is no reason why we can't contend for the conference regular season championship and top seed in the tournament. The ONLY teams that I have seen that look halfway decent are Green Bay and Milwaukee.
Great win against Virginia! The conference needs a few more of those.
Quote from: wh on December 07, 2013, 03:38:21 PM
The HL conf. RPI is in free fall. Over the past week we have dropped from 12th to 13th to 14th and now 15th.
http://warrennolan.com/basketball/2014/conferencerpi (http://warrennolan.com/basketball/2014/conferencerpi)
Strange happening. Earlier in the day we were 15th. By day's end we move all the way back to 12th. Also, look who's now in 11th.
http://warrennolan.com/basketball/2014/conferencerpi (http://warrennolan.com/basketball/2014/conferencerpi)
12/8/2013 Sunday
Rhode Island 68
Detroit 70
Auburn 62
Illinois 81 (at Philips Arena, Atlanta)
ALL TIMES EASTERN STANDARD TIME
From Milwaukee's ghostofdylan:
Clearly, Green Bay seems to be the class of the league this year.
After that, Milwaukee, Valparaiso and perhaps Cleveland State should be right in the mix.
The enforcement of the no-hands-and-forearms rule appears to have effectively eliminated the clutch-and-grab defensive technique advanced by Wright State coach Billy Donlon.
As of the moment, it looks like a first team of Kendrick Perry, Travis Bader, Bryn Forbes, Matt Tiby and Player of the Year Keifer Sykes and a second team of Lavonte Dority, Kelsey Barlow, Juwan Howard Jr., Alec Peters and Jordan Aaron.
Agreed.
Quote from: wh on December 08, 2013, 10:53:46 AM
From Milwaukee's ghostofdylan:
Clearly, Green Bay seems to be the class of the league this year.
After that, Milwaukee, Valparaiso and perhaps Cleveland State should be right in the mix.
The enforcement of the no-hands-and-forearms rule appears to have effectively eliminated the clutch-and-grab defensive technique advanced by Wright State coach Billy Donlon.
As of the moment, it looks like a first team of Kendrick Perry, Travis Bader, Bryn Forbes, Matt Tiby and Player of the Year Keifer Sykes and a second team of Lavonte Dority, Kelsey Barlow, Juwan Howard Jr., Alec Peters and Jordan Aaron.
Agreed.
Agree with everything but Bader on the first team. Yes, he's averaging 21 PPG but his he's only shooting 40% from the floor and averages 16 shots a game and only makes about 6 of them. And he's throws up about 11 3 pointers a game and make only about 4 to 5 of those. He's only average 4 rebounds, 1 assist, 1 steal, about 3 PF and about 2 TOs.
I would say LVD deserves it over Bader at this moment. He's averaging 16 PPG, on 46.6% shooting, 40% from beyond the arc. If Dority averaged 16 shots a game he would be in the low to mid 20s. He averages about 3 boards, 2 Assists, and 2 turnovers and about 2 PFs. Overall his numbers are better.
Overall I agree with the list, just flip-flop LVD for Bader. LVD has been much more effective.
What's with UWM? Most of you guys left them for dead in September.
Quote from: VULB#62 on December 08, 2013, 12:54:25 PM
What's with UWM? Most of you guys left them for dead in September.
Tiby and Kelm have been tough to match up against and Aaron has always been a good shooter.
Quote from: wh on December 07, 2013, 03:03:46 PMSo, CSU is dominated at home by a very average Akron team, who until today was off to a bad start to the season. Like I said a couple of days ago, Cleveland State certainly is not a "top tier" HL team.
I don't even know what to say about Wright State anymore.
I watched portions of those games and both teams appear to be relearning how to play defense. Very very ugly defensive performances! I have no idea how long it will take those programs to adjust and fully recover.
On the other hand I have been saying since before the season began that the new way that basketball will be whistled is going to play right into the strengths of our current personnel. Many of these half court drives that LaVonte is now turning into points would have been charges last year. With the addition of Carter I would expect all of our guards to up their attacks on the basket and let the whistles blow. So if HL teams choose to play us tight outside then I will wish them luck with that strategy.(see last nights near upset) If they choose to pack it in with a sagging man or zone then most of those games we win because of our size inside and shooting outside. I do not believe that any HL team will be able to challenge us to that hypothetical war of attrition because who else will go 10 deep with our types of physical talent?
But--continue to be patient, there still are a lot of loose ends tripping us up.
Quote from: bbtds on December 08, 2013, 02:15:05 PM
Quote from: VULB#62 on December 08, 2013, 12:54:25 PM
What's with UWM? Most of you guys left them for dead in September.
Tiby and Kelm have been tough to match up against and Aaron has always been a good shooter.
And Austin Arians, now a sophomore, has been among the most efficient perimeter players in the country.
Thanks, guys. I check the board almost daily and look forward to rekindling a competitive rivalry.
Quote from: talksalot on December 01, 2013, 07:59:11 AMOH, several people asked if the 117-108 game on Friday was a school record for points in a game at 225...From the Record Book....quick answer: no.
Consider that the 3-point field goal line was not established until 1986.
At Ball State 2/19/64 Cardinals won 117-116... total points 233
Muhlenberg 12/6/68 Valpo won 138-89... total points 227
Wheaton 3/1/69 Valpo won 121-104 ... total points 225
And How Could I Forget one! Thanks Dick Briars for finding the highest scoring game... Houston 158 - Valpo 81. Feb 24, 1968... 239 points... skipped right over it
Quote from: talksalot on December 08, 2013, 08:18:42 PMAnd How Could I Forget one! Thanks Dick Briars for finding the highest scoring game... Houston 158 - Valpo 81. Feb 24, 1968... 239 points... skipped right over it
One thing that should be mentioned is that UH team in '68 was coached by Guy Lewis, had Elgin Baylor at center, and made it to the university division final 4. They weren't quite like the 80's Houston teams of the Phi, Slama Jama (do I have that correct?) but they were an offensive juggernaut. With VU having Bruce Lindner putting up awesome offensive numbers if figured to some to be an even match. It obviously wasn't.
Quote from: historyman on December 08, 2013, 09:04:36 PM
Quote from: talksalot on December 08, 2013, 08:18:42 PMAnd How Could I Forget one! Thanks Dick Briars for finding the highest scoring game... Houston 158 - Valpo 81. Feb 24, 1968... 239 points... skipped right over it
One thing that should be mentioned is that UH team in '68 was coached by Guy Lewis, had Elgin Baylor at center, and made it to the university division final 4. They weren't quite like the 80's Houston teams of the Phi, Slama Jama (do I have that correct?) but they were an offensive juggernaut. With VU having Bruce Lindner putting up awesome offensive numbers if figured to some to be an even match. It obviously wasn't.
An even match? I remember hoping that the plane to Houston would be hijacked to Cuba to save us the inevitable embarrassment. BTW, I believe that as the team was preparing for the game, Dick played the role of Elgin Baylor.
Elvin Hayes
Quote from: historyman on December 08, 2013, 09:04:36 PM
Quote from: talksalot on December 08, 2013, 08:18:42 PMAnd How Could I Forget one! Thanks Dick Briars for finding the highest scoring game... Houston 158 - Valpo 81. Feb 24, 1968... 239 points... skipped right over it
One thing that should be mentioned is that UH team in '68 was coached by Guy Lewis, had Elgin Baylor at center, and made it to the university division final 4. They weren't quite like the 80's Houston teams of the Phi, Slama Jama (do I have that correct?) but they were an offensive juggernaut. With VU having Bruce Lindner putting up awesome offensive numbers if figured to some to be an even match. It obviously wasn't.
You are off on a couple of fronts. First for background, our coach, Gene Bartow, was an asst for Guy Lewis and that was the reason the game was scheduled. The second thing is that these type games are scheduled a couple of years before and when that happened Valpo had one of its best teams ever (66-67--where we won 2 games in the college divsion NCAAs) So the game is scheduled when Houston wasn't all that great and Valpo was.
The year of the game (the next year) we went 11-15 and Houston, who had beaten UCLA earlier in the year, lost to them in the final.
The other fact where you were slightly off was with Elgin Baylor, who graduated ten years earlier and not from Houston. The guy in question was Elvin Hayes. Thier team may not have been as good as the Phi Slama Jamma team but was close. That team also has Don Chaney on it. Gene was not pleased that his former coach would run up the score on the clearly out maned Valpo team.
Finally, I don't think Bruce Lindner played in that game. As I recall Bruce would have been a freshman that year and freshman couldn't play with the varsity. The key player on that team was Dick Jones who was the only remaining starter from the great team that scored over 100 seven times, before the 3 point rule was in effect.
Quote from: vu72 on December 08, 2013, 10:01:30 PMQuote from: historyman on December 08, 2013, 09:04:36 PMQuote from: talksalot on December 08, 2013, 08:18:42 PMAnd How Could I Forget one! Thanks Dick Briars for finding the highest scoring game... Houston 158 - Valpo 81. Feb 24, 1968... 239 points... skipped right over it
One thing that should be mentioned is that UH team in '68 was coached by Guy Lewis, had Elgin Baylor at center, and made it to the university division final 4. They weren't quite like the 80's Houston teams of the Phi, Slama Jama (do I have that correct?) but they were an offensive juggernaut. With VU having Bruce Lindner putting up awesome offensive numbers if figured to some to be an even match. It obviously wasn't.
You are off on a couple of fronts. First for background, our coach, Gene Bartow, was an asst for Guy Lewis and that was the reason the game was scheduled. The second thing is that these type games are scheduled a couple of years before and when that happened Valpo had one of its best teams ever (66-67--where we won 2 games in the college divsion NCAAs) So the game is scheduled when Houston wasn't all that great and Valpo was. The year of the game (the next year) we went 11-15 and Houston, who had beaten UCLA earlier in the year, lost to them in the final. The other fact where you were slightly off was with Elgin Baylor, who graduated ten years earlier and not from Houston. The guy in question was Elvin Hayes. Thier team may not have been as good as the Phi Slama Jamma team but was close. That team also has Don Chaney on it. Gene was not pleased that his former coach would run up the score on the clearly out maned Valpo team. Finally, I don't think Bruce Lindner played in that game. As I recall Bruce would have been a freshman that year and freshman couldn't play with the varsity. The key player on that team was Dick Jones who was the only remaining starter from the great team that scored over 100 seven times, before the 3 point rule was in effect.
Okay, okay. I was a little kid and my memory, without looking it up, certainly ran things together--I could have sworn Bruce Lindner played in that game--my apologies. Who wouldn't confuse Elvin Hayes with Elgin Baylor? You know, Baylor-Texas, Houston-Texas, Elgin-Elvin. I did say
some people would think it might be even. An awful lot thought it would
n't be close after the season started. I did not know of the relationship between Lewis and Bartow.
ALL TIMES EASTERN STANDARD TIME
12/10/2013 Tuesday
Oakland at Indiana 7:00 p.m.
Green Bay at Eastern Michigan 7:00 p.m.
Evansville at Xavier 7:00 p.m.
Dartmouth at Illinois 8:00 p.m.
12/11/2013 Wednesday
Howard at Central Florida 7:00 p.m.
Milwaukee at Wisconsin 8:00 p.m.
12/12/2013 Thursday
No opponents' games scheduled
12/13/2013 Friday
No Opponents' games scheduled
12/14/2013 Saturday
Youngstown State at Pittsburgh 12:00 noon
Loyola-Marymount at Valpo 2:05 p.m.
Evansville at Jackson State 3:05 p.m.
Michigan State at Oakland 4:00 p.m. (at Palace of Auburn Hills)
Detroit at North Carolina State 6:00 p.m.
James Madison at High Point 7:00 p.m.
Illinois-Chicago at S.E. Missouri State 8:00 p.m.
Ohio at Alabama A&M 8:00 p.m.
Green Bay at South Dakota 8:00 p.m.
Wofford at Saint Louis 8:00 p.m.
12/15/2013 Sunday
Wright State at Miami (OH) 2:00 p.m.
12/16/2013 Monday
Illinois State at Oakland 7:00 p.m.
Alcorn State at Mercer 7:00 p.m.
Western Carolina at Cleveland State 7:00 p.m.
12/17/2013 Tuesday
Jacksonville at Central Florida 7:00 p.m.
Bethune-Cookman at Youngstown State 7:05 p.m.
Southern Illinois-Carbondale at Murray State 8:00 p.m.
Tennessee Tech at Green Bay 8:00 p.m.
Ball State at Marquette 8:00 p.m.
California Poly-SLO at Loyola-Marymount 10:00 p.m.
12/18/2013 Wednesday
Massachusetts at Ohio 7:00 p.m.
Detroit at Akron 7:00 p.m.
James Madison at North Carolina-Greensboro 7:00 p.m.
Indiana State at Saint Louis 8:00 p.m.
12/19/2013 Thursday
Eastern Illinois at Wright State 7:00 p.m.
ALL TIMES EASTERN STANDARD TIME
Quote from: bbtds on December 08, 2013, 02:15:05 PMAaron has always been a good shooter.
Thanks for the laugh.
Last season he shot 37.13% from the field and 34.54% from three last season. Hell if you take out his horrific three point shooting he still shoots 39.52% from two last season.
This season he is shooting 36.21% from the field and 33.80% from three. HE'S SHOOTING WORSE THAN A BAD LAST SEASON... This guy has always been one of the worst shooters in the league. 61.20% of his shots this season are from three. Please let Aaron shoot 15 threes against us this season. PLEASE!
Quote from: Kyle321n on December 09, 2013, 10:11:14 AM
Quote from: bbtds on December 08, 2013, 02:15:05 PMAaron has always been a good shooter.
Thanks for the laugh.
Last season he shot 37.13% from the field and 34.54% from three last season. Hell if you take out his horrific three point shooting he still shoots 39.52% from two last season.
This season he is shooting 36.21% from the field and 33.80% from three. HE'S SHOOTING WORSE THAN A BAD LAST SEASON... This guy has always been one of the worst shooters in the league. 61.20% of his shots this season are from three. Please let Aaron shoot 15 threes against us this season. PLEASE!
This. And Aaron is not the reason Milwaukee is beating bad teams this year instead of losing to them like last year.
There is no reason why we can't contend for the conference regular season championship and top seed in the tournament. The ONLY teams that I have seen that look halfway decent are Green Bay and Milwaukee
Mr. Ft Wayne, did Valpo beat Ohio? No, but it was on the road right. Oakland beat them by 17, but it was at Oakland. I'm amazed at the things I've read on Horizon league message boards. When has November ever been an indicator how a team will finish. Teams non league schedules are so diverse that how does one really know. Also; young players get better, the top coaches get their teams better. How about the guy who said Bader shouldn't be first team. Really, the guy who is going to be the all time 3 point maker in the History of college basketball. A first team mid major all-american last year and a pre season guy this year isn't one of the best 5 players in the Horizon league. Having beaten Valpo the last 2 years I would think the Valpo fans might have some measure of respect for Oakland, but I guess only time will tell.
I don't know a single Valpo supporter who isn't anything but happy that Oakland is a part of the league. It's a win-win for all of us. You shouldn't paint "Valpo fans" with a broad brush based on a couple of comments. Yes, you had an impressive win over Ohio. That said you can hardly blame anyone for not giving you much love, with nothing to show for your efforts until now but a bunch of blowout losses to teams where you are completely overmatched.
Quote from: Kyle321n on December 09, 2013, 10:11:14 AM
Quote from: bbtds on December 08, 2013, 02:15:05 PMAaron has always been a good shooter.
Thanks for the laugh.
Last season he shot 37.13% from the field and 34.54% from three last season. Hell if you take out his horrific three point shooting he still shoots 39.52% from two last season.
This season he is shooting 36.21% from the field and 33.80% from three. HE'S SHOOTING WORSE THAN A BAD LAST SEASON... This guy has always been one of the worst shooters in the league. 61.20% of his shots this season are from three. Please let Aaron shoot 15 threes against us this season. PLEASE!
Quote from: a3uge on December 09, 2013, 10:48:50 AMThis. And Aaron is not the reason Milwaukee is beating bad teams this year instead of losing to them like last year.
Isn't it obvious. Arians/Aaron. I messed up on the shooters name.
You guys are starting to over react like some on the Saint Louis board.
By the way, how much easier it is to put together Oskland's OOC schedule than ours. Just put out one message in the spring and send it to every high profile BCS program:
Will be your sacrificial lamb for OOC tune-up game in '13-14. Will play anywhere, any time if the money is right. Contact Greg Kampe, Coach, Washington Generals.
Quote from: Grizz on December 09, 2013, 11:59:58 AM
QuoteThere is no reason why we can't contend for the conference regular season championship and top seed in the tournament. The ONLY teams that I have seen that look halfway decent are Green Bay and Milwaukee
Mr. Ft Wayne, did Valpo beat Ohio? No, but it was on the road right. Oakland beat them by 17, but it was at Oakland. I'm amazed at the things I've read on Horizon league message boards. When has November ever been an indicator how a team will finish. Teams non league schedules are so diverse that how does one really know. Also; young players get better, the top coaches get their teams better. How about the guy who said Bader shouldn't be first team. Really, the guy who is going to be the all time 3 point maker in the History of college basketball. A first team mid major all-american last year and a pre season guy this year isn't one of the best 5 players in the Horizon league. Having beaten Valpo the last 2 years I would think the Valpo fans might have some measure of respect for Oakland, but I guess only time will tell.
Ok, you got me. If you have read my other posts regarding Kampe and Oakland I think you would find them to be mostly positive. I did watch the Ohio game and yes, other than the first 15 minutes, you guys played a very good game. I know that your schedule has been brutal, but you would have to admit that it hasn't done much for the
November perception of your team as a possible conference contender.
Quote from: Grizz on December 09, 2013, 11:59:58 AM
How about the guy who said Bader shouldn't be first team. Really, the guy who is going to be the all time 3 point maker in the History of college basketball. A first team mid major all-american last year and a pre season guy this year isn't one of the best 5 players in the Horizon league.
How can you say he's one of the best players in the HL right now. His 3 point shooting percentage is good, at 40% but that's only good enough for 7th in the HL. He is 2nd in points but when you chuck up 11 3 pointers a game and hit 40% of them you're gonna have a high scoring percentage. His shooting percentage is not even 40%. All he is, is a glorified 3 point shooter. Right now he's not one of the 5 best players in the HL, perhaps when you were in the Summit he was but the HL he is not. He doesn't do much in the other stat columns as well, only averages 3 RBs, 1 Stl, and 1 Ast a game. You're gonna score a lot when you hit 40% from 3 and average 11 3 pointers attempted a game.
From watching a few Oakland games this season he has done nothing to wow me. He's a good player who takes a ton of threes which skews his numbers and makes him look like some scoring machine when he really isn't. Having a 39% field goal percentage is nothing special. Bader is a good player, a first-teamer he is not, at least not right now. He's a good 3-point shooter, I'll give him that.
My Dad and I met the team bus after that Houston game. If I am remembering this right, Houston, at that time, was ranked #1 in the country and had beaten UCLA and Lew Alcindor earlier in the season. Houston had The Big E, Elvin Hayes, and (I think) Don Cheaney, another really good player. (Elgin Baylor, mentioned in an earlier post, played at Seattle University and was a multiple-time NBA All Star by 1968).
Coach Bartow was the VU coach at the time, and he never came right out and said this to my dad, but the feeling I got was that Guy Edwards, the Houston coach, completely ran up the score on a pretty darn good, but overmatched, VU squad. Maybe Dick Briars can fill us in on how Houston shamelessly ran up the score. I was 12 or 13 years old at the time and I remember being totally, completely pissed off at Houston and their coach for a long time afterwards. In fact, I STILL root against Houston whenever possible.
Paul
Really 2014.....Bader is the focus of every defense we play. You make me laugh. If he played for Valpo you would have him as the POY already. This summer he was one of 20 players invited by the NBA to the Kevin Durrant skills camp for the 20 top wings in the country. Didn't see any other Horizon League players there. Probably should have been at least 5 Horizon league guys there before Bader but maybe they turned down the invite. Here's what he does for the team. You have to take your best defender and face guard him and not help off him at any time leaving the rest of the players to play 4 on 4. If you don't he will put 45 on you so quick you will say how could that kid do that. Oh well, doesn't really matter what you or I think. The games that matter start on January 2nd.
Quote from: Grizz on December 09, 2013, 02:52:01 PMReally 2014.....Bader is the focus of every defense we play. You make me laugh. If he played for Valpo you would have him as the POY already. This summer he was one of 20 players invited by the NBA to the Kevin Durrant skills camp for the 20 top wings in the country. Didn't see any other Horizon League players there. Probably should have been at least 5 Horizon league guys there before Bader but maybe they turned down the invite. Here's what he does for the team. You have to take your best defender and face guard him and not help off him at any time leaving the rest of the players to play 4 on 4. If you don't he will put 45 on you so quick you will say how could that kid do that. Oh well, doesn't really matter what you or I think. The games that matter start on January 2nd.
I'm really looking forward to January 4th and not because I'm getting married that day.
I wouldn't put Oakland in the top 3 this year, but could consider them as a 4 after seeing some of their games. I see it as GB, Valpo, UWM, then Oakland. It's going to take me watching a UWM game before I put them ahead of us, just because they were that bad last year.
Yes, Oakland has beaten us twice in a row, but honestly, it's going to take a long time before I fear a game against Oakland. We beat Oakland 10 times while I was in school, and you only have a few victories overall in the series including the last several years. It was the same when we played you in baseball, that you were a decent team, but we seemed to always beat you. That perception will take awhile to change.
Quote from: Kyle321n on December 09, 2013, 10:11:14 AMQuote from: bbtds on December 08, 2013, 03:15:05 PM
Aaron has always been a good shooter.
Thanks for the laugh.
I'm sure he was joking. Jordan Aaron as the worst player in the HL last year was a common meme on here.
Quote from: Grizz on December 09, 2013, 02:52:01 PM
Really 2014.....Bader is the focus of every defense we play. You make me laugh. If he played for Valpo you would have him as the POY already. This summer he was one of 20 players invited by the NBA to the Kevin Durrant skills camp for the 20 top wings in the country. Didn't see any other Horizon League players there. Probably should have been at least 5 Horizon league guys there before Bader but maybe they turned down the invite. Here's what he does for the team. You have to take your best defender and face guard him and not help off him at any time leaving the rest of the players to play 4 on 4. If you don't he will put 45 on you so quick you will say how could that kid do that. Oh well, doesn't really matter what you or I think. The games that matter start on January 2nd.
Not saying he isn't a good player because he is. He's a terrific 3-point shooter and will be among the league leader in 3 point field goal percentage. He's just not one of the best HL players. He's very one-dimensional, at leas that's what it seems to me. You've known the Oakland program longer than I have. It will be interesting to see how he fares in the HL, which is much stronger than the SL.
Given that Valpo and OU have played Ohio with OU blowing them away in the 2nd half, I don't see how you can't include OU in a three-way at the top! :lol:
(somebody had to say it)
I agree. If Oakland can keep beating teams like Ohio there is no reason to believe they can't win the HL title, both regular season and tournament. As usual almost every HL game this year will come down to the last few minutes of the game. Even UIC will be tough to beat. And despite Wright St's lapses the Raiders will be ready come January. It's wide, wide open this season. Valpo will get more consistent with Carter. Green Bay will play some what soft on the road and extremely tough at home. In the end most of the HL teams will have a very good chance for first place.
Quote from: classof2014 on December 09, 2013, 05:39:29 PM
Not saying he isn't a good player because he is. He's a terrific 3-point shooter and will be among the league leader in 3 point field goal percentage. He's just not one of the best HL players. He's very one-dimensional, at leas that's what it seems to me. You've known the Oakland program longer than I have. It will be interesting to see how he fares in the HL, which is much stronger than the SL.
Talk about one dimensional. You look at the 3pt % and use that as your logic. Why not put Arceneaux on the 1st team because he shoots an astounding 56% of 3pt? If everyone above Bader on that list shot as many 3's, there is very strong possibility that Bader would end up on top of that list. A 40% clip and making 40 of them is very good. It may be one dimensional, but that is their offense. Don't blame him because of Kampe's offense.
12/10/2013 Tuesday
Oakland .
Indiana . 7:00 p.m.
ESPN2
Green Bay .
Eastern Michigan . 7:00 p.m.
Most likely pay game http://www.emueagles.com/showcase/ (http://www.emueagles.com/showcase/)
Evansville .
Xavier . 7:00 p.m.
FOXSPORTS1
Dartmouth .
Illinois . 8:00 p.m.
Pay http://www.fightingillini.com/allaccess/?media=409668 (http://www.fightingillini.com/allaccess/?media=409668)
(BTN is showing Minnesota hockey at 8:00 ET)
ALL TIMES EASTERN STANDARD TIME
Quote from: classof2014 on December 09, 2013, 02:21:18 PMHe is 2nd in points but when you chuck up 11 3 pointers a game and hit 40% of them you're gonna have a high scoring percentage. His shooting percentage is not even 40%.
Nailed it. If Bader made a lower percentage or took fewer shots, he wouldn't be scoring as many points.
Quote from: motowntitan on December 09, 2013, 06:24:23 PMIf everyone above Bader on that list shot as many 3's, there is very strong possibility that Bader would end up on top of that list.
...this is the opposite of logic.
You have promulgated a self-defeating argument:
--You're saying that the reason his percentage is lower is because he takes so many of them (because...why? does 3FG% have a Law of Diminishing Returns?).
--Implying Bader's percentage would rise if he took fewer of them.
--Therefore, Bader shouldn't shoot so many. He should stop after 4-5 ATT a game, because he's just going to suck after that.
--So, in the end you agree with 2014 and EddieCabot, et al.: Bader had bader not shoot so much.
Really, a breathtakingly poor argument. I would say "stick to sticking up for your own players",
but then it occurs to me...as a Detroit fan, there is like a 5% chance you're actually trying to belittle him in this manner.
If so, well done, and sorry I didn't give you more credit for mocking your rival so cleverly.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on December 09, 2013, 07:35:36 PM
Quote from: motowntitan on December 09, 2013, 06:24:23 PMIf everyone above Bader on that list shot as many 3's, there is very strong possibility that Bader would end up on top of that list.
...this is the opposite of logic.
You have promulgated a self-defeating argument:
--You're saying that the reason his percentage is lower is because he takes so many of them (because...why? does 3FG% have a Law of Diminishing Returns?).
--Implying Bader's percentage would rise if he took fewer of them.
--Therefore, Bader shouldn't shoot so many. He should stop after 4-5 ATT a game, because he's just going to suck after that.
--So, in the end you agree with 2014 and EddieCabot, et al.: Bader had bader not shoot so much.
Really, a breathtakingly poor argument. I would say "stick to sticking up for your own players", but then it occurs to me...as a Detroit fan, there is like a 5% chance you're actually trying to belittle him in this manner.
If so, well done, and sorry I didn't give you more credit for mocking your rival so cleverly.
I can't believe I am going to do this but here goes... I actually understand motowntitan's logic. Oakland's offense is predicated on Bader taking a lot of 3's whether they are contested, off the dribble, in the pocket, early in the shot clock, late in the shot clock or off the break. Every team knows that is what is going to happen because in many cases he is the first option. So as a defender I am going to try and be in the grill of that first option guy every time down the floor. Now if I am the second or third option guy then I just love playing with someone like Bader because my opportunities, while fewer in number, are going to happen with much less pressure. I may even shoot a higher percentage than Bader, but then again I don't really want to be taking the shots that he must take in the Oakland offense, if I did I might be shooting only 25% instead of 45%.
Quote from: classof2014 on December 09, 2013, 02:21:18 PMFrom watching a few Oakland games this season he has done nothing to wow me.
You didn't watch the Cal game then, to name just one.
Quote from: FWalum on December 09, 2013, 08:38:10 PMI can't believe I am going to do this but here goes... I actually understand motowntitan's logic. Oakland's offense is predicated on Bader taking a lot of 3's whether they are contested, off the dribble, in the pocket, early in the shot clock, late in the shot clock or off the break. Every team knows that is what is going to happen because in many cases he is the first option. So as a defender I am going to try and be in the grill of that first option guy every time down the floor. Now if I am the second or third option guy then I just love playing with someone like Bader because my opportunities, while fewer in number, are going to happen with much less pressure. I may even shoot a higher percentage than Bader, but then again I don't really want to be taking the shots that he must take in the Oakland offense, if I did I might be shooting only 25% instead of 45%.
That's not what he said. He didn't say "if they were in Bader's place they would not shoot as high a percentage as he does", which may or may not be true; he said "if they took more they would miss a higher percentage of shots", which is still silly.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on December 09, 2013, 09:11:40 PMThat's not what he said. He didn't say "if they were in Bader's place they would not shoot as high a percentage as he does", which may or may not be true; he said "if they took more they would miss a higher percentage of shots", which is still silly.
I agree that it's silly. What's even more silly is that Capobianco, a 56% three point shooter, doesn't take more three pointers, since his percentage wouldn't drop with an increase in volume. If he shot a 3 pointer on every possession, that would equate to nearly 1.7 points per possession and Valpo would be unbeatable. Clearly, LAA has a better grip on the game than FWAlum.
Quote from: EddieCabot on December 09, 2013, 09:46:49 PM
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on December 09, 2013, 09:11:40 PMThat's not what he said. He didn't say "if they were in Bader's place they would not shoot as high a percentage as he does", which may or may not be true; he said "if they took more they would miss a higher percentage of shots", which is still silly.
I agree that it's silly. What's even more silly is that Capobianco, a 56% three point shooter, doesn't take more three pointers, since his percentage wouldn't drop with an increase in volume. If he shot a 3 pointer on every possession, that would equate to nearly 1.7 points per possession and Valpo would be unbeatable. Clearly, LAA has a better grip on the game than FWAlum.
You had me at hello on this one EC, but the Bobby example was the icing! Nice post!
Doesn't just about every team have that one guy you need to prepare for and elevate the rest of the team because they draw a lot of attention
GB has Sykes
YSU has Perry
CSU has Forbes
VU has Dority
UWM has Tiby
UIC has Barlow
UDM has Howard
WSU has Arcenaux
OU has Bader
Each team has that one guy that you need to prepare for. Obviously some players are much better than others but each team has a guy to watch and just by doing that makes the rest of the team better. Other than his high PPG, he isn't anything really special. I'm sure he'll have games this year where he has 35-40 points because if he takes 15 3 pointers and hits 10 of them there's 30 points but those games won't happen often. Every shooter can get hot so yes, when he's hot it will look real good because he shoots, shoots, and shoots again. When he is off though, he might go 3-14 and have 11 points. If he truly elevates the play of his team that much shouldn't Oakland be much better than they are?
He's Will Bogan that shoots 3 Xs as much and thus has 3 times the points, he doesn't take many FTs only averages 4 a game, does't rebound much, nor is big on assists. Put Bader on any other team and I bet he is nothing more than a 3 point specialist. Kampe's coaching style plays into his game which is the 3 pointer. Like I've said he's a very good shooter but very one dimensional, like anyone he can have really good games.
Bader is a good player and he's in the perfect system. He's a good player but not among the very best in the HL.
Quote from: classof2014 on December 09, 2013, 02:21:18 PMRight now he's not one of the 5 best players in the HL, perhaps when you were in the Summit he was but the HL he is not.
Very astute. Bader is averaging 21+ against Oakland's extremely soft non-league schedule, but once he's facing Horizon League competition, he'll be lucky to score in double figures.
Quote from: EddieCabot on December 09, 2013, 10:27:34 PM
Quote from: classof2014 on December 09, 2013, 02:21:18 PMRight now he's not one of the 5 best players in the HL, perhaps when you were in the Summit he was but the HL he is not.
Very astute. Bader is averaging 21+ against Oakland's extremely soft non-league schedule, but once he's facing Horizon League competition, he'll be lucky to score in double figures.
:thewave:
Quote from: classof2014 on December 09, 2013, 10:12:40 PM
He's Will Bogan that shoots 3 Xs as much and thus has 3 times the points.
Once again, you're on point. Bogan was a 40% 3 point field goal shooter, which is very good. Why he didn't shoot more is a mystery to me. Either he was way too unselfish or Bryce totally dropped the ball. If you have a guy who can shoot 40%+ from beyond the arc, you have him shoot every time.
Quote from: EddieCabot on December 09, 2013, 10:42:56 PM
Quote from: classof2014 on December 09, 2013, 10:12:40 PM
He's Will Bogan that shoots 3 Xs as much and thus has 3 times the points.
Once again, you're on point. Bogan was a 40% 3 point field goal shooter, which is very good. Why he didn't shoot more is a mystery to me. Either he was way too unselfish or Bryce totally dropped the ball. If you have a guy who can shoot 40%+ from beyond the arc, you have him shoot every time.
Agree about that. Bader is a great 3 point shooter who isn't afraid to take a shot. Simply put Bader is in the perfect system for him to thrive. I would much rather have a Keifer Sykes or Kendrick Perry before a Bader type. Put Bader on Valpo he probably averages 10 or so PPG. While you put a Sykes, Perry, Tiby, or even an LVD type player they'll be successful in most any system because they can score in more than one way, to me that's what makes a great scoring threat.
Quote from: EddieCabot on December 09, 2013, 10:27:34 PM
Quote from: classof2014 on December 09, 2013, 02:21:18 PMRight now he's not one of the 5 best players in the HL, perhaps when you were in the Summit he was but the HL he is not.
Very astute. Bader is averaging 21+ against Oakland's extremely soft non-league schedule, but once he's facing Horizon League competition, he'll be lucky to score in double figures.
Oh, pardon me. I assumed you were being sarcastic.
Tell me you were being sarcastic.
Quote from: EddieCabot on December 09, 2013, 10:27:34 PM
Quote from: classof2014 on December 09, 2013, 02:21:18 PMRight now he's not one of the 5 best players in the HL, perhaps when you were in the Summit he was but the HL he is not.
Very astute. Bader is averaging 21+ against Oakland's extremely soft non-league schedule, but once he's facing Horizon League competition, he'll be lucky to score in double figures.
EC, you were doing so well, but now you're starting to lose me. You may recall one of our early season exhibition opponents -Robert Morris College. They had a guy that really went off that night from 3, hitting an amazing 7-14 attempts. In fact, he had a great all around game. And yet we did nothing special to try to shut him down, as we were clearly in control throughout. Do you think Bryce would have allowed that to continue unabated if we were playing someone we were more evenly matched against. Obviously not. Ryan Broekhoff came up against a lot more gimmick defenses in HL play than he ever did against OOC opponents that clearly overmatched us. I think Mr. Bader will find the same thing to be true, especially in the second half of conference play when the other teams know him and Oakland better. As you know, the HL is a defensive minded league, far more so than the Summit. Teams like CSU, WSU and GB will be doing everything in their power to limit his 3- pt attempts.
Quote from: EddieCabot on December 09, 2013, 10:27:34 PMOakland's extremely soft non-league schedule
Let's review that extremely soft non-league schedule:
North Carolina
UCLA
California
Gonzaga
Louisiana (Lafayette)
St Francis-Brooklyn
W Michigan
Rochester
Ohio
Indiana
Michigan St
Illinois St
E Michigan
Robert Morris
Defiance
I, too, hope you were being sarcastic.
Amidst all the sarcasm, let's assume that, for some reason, you stop being who you are and the more you shoot, the more your % declines.
(Never mind that if this were true, you should stop practicing immediately.)
If this were true, then either
--Bader is a chucker
and/or
--Kampe's offense is predicated on driving down his best player's efficiency through overuse and/or use in non-optimum circumstance.
Take a look at his True Shooting %, or eFG%, or PPWS, you name it--it says "someone is shooting shots he shouldn't". Even his eFG% is buoyed by his almost 95% FT%. From the floor, he's struggling.
If I didn't have an argument, I would just use sarcasm too, EC.
Quote from: wh on December 09, 2013, 11:41:15 PM
Quote from: EddieCabot on December 09, 2013, 10:27:34 PM
Quote from: classof2014 on December 09, 2013, 02:21:18 PMRight now he's not one of the 5 best players in the HL, perhaps when you were in the Summit he was but the HL he is not.
Very astute. Bader is averaging 21+ against Oakland's extremely soft non-league schedule, but once he's facing Horizon League competition, he'll be lucky to score in double figures.
EC, you were doing so well, but now you're starting to lose me. You may recall one of our early season exhibition opponents -Robert Morris College. They had a guy that really went off that night from 3, hitting an amazing 7-14 attempts. In fact, he had a great all around game. And yet we did nothing special to try to shut him down, as we were clearly in control throughout. Do you think Bryce would have allowed that to continue unabated if we were playing someone we were more evenly matched against. Obviously not. Ryan Broekhoff came up against a lot more gimmick defenses in HL play than he ever did against OOC opponents that clearly overmatched us. I think Mr. Bader will find the same thing to be true, especially in the second half of conference play when the other teams know him and Oakland better. As you know, the HL is a defensive minded league, far more so than the Summit. Teams like CSU, WSU and GB will be doing everything in their power to limit his 3- pt attempts.
Good points, wh. It probably will be tougher for Bader in the HL when teams are more familiar with him and more focused on slowing him down.
FWIW, IU is very aware of Bader and how good he is. It will be interesting to see if they give him special attention tonight, and if so, how he handles it.
I'm looking forward to watching Bader tonight against another "softie"... Hoosiers in Bloomington... ESPN2 7ET/6CT
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on December 10, 2013, 03:57:40 AM
Amidst all the sarcasm, let's assume that, for some reason, you stop being who you are and the more you shoot, the more your % declines.
As crazy as it sounds, I believe this. For the sake of argument, let's say that Bader takes 20 shots a game, consisting of:
- 5 layups
- 5 wide open 3 pointers
- 5 contested 3 pointers
- 5 end of shot clock heavily contested heaves
My guess is that if he only took the layups and wide open shots, he would be pretty efficient, and that as he incrementally takes additional, and more difficult, shots he becomes less efficient. Agree?
So your next question will be why he takes contested shots instead of just taking layups and wide open shots, right? Well, there is another team out there playing defense and sometimes they do it very well, leaving a contested shot as the only option.
Should Bader be passing up contested shots to pass to a teammate? Possibly, but in the last 5 seconds of the shot clock, Kampe may feel that Bader from 25 feet is a better option than some other guy from 15. Whether a given shot is a "good shot" sometimes depends on what the other options are. A Bader 25 footer at the end of the shot clock may not be a "good shot" in relative terms, but it may the best they can get in that situation.
I really don't think we're that far apart.
The difference is you seem to subscribe to "heroball" (e.g. Kobe Bryant, Finals MVP, on 6 of 24 Game 7 shooting). At least it's better than "feelingsball" (e.g. "he's a gritty leader whose impact can't be measured because it's PURE MAGICKAL and it's GRIT and SWEAT AND LEADERSHAPE").
I subscribe to a theory perhaps best delineated by noted 20th century philosopher Mary Chapin Carpenter: "The stars might lie, but the numbers never do."
The number of shots it takes him to get to that number of points...just doesn't statistically seem like the best use of possessions. And if he shot less often, he would find himself less contested when he did in fact shoot.
SCIENCE
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on December 10, 2013, 09:59:43 AMI really don't think we're that far apart. The difference is you seem to subscribe to "heroball" (e.g. Kobe Bryant, Finals MVP, on 6 of 24 Game 7 shooting). At least it's better than "feelingsball" (e.g. "he's a gritty leader whose impact can't be measured because it's PURE MAGICKAL and it's GRIT and SWEAT AND LEADERSHAPE"). I subscribe to a theory perhaps best delineated by noted 20th century philosopher Mary Chapin Carpenter: "The stars might lie, but the numbers never do." The number of shots it takes him to get to that number of points...just doesn't statistically seem like the best use of possessions. And if he shot less often, he would find himself less contested when he did in fact shoot. SCIENCE
Isn't "seem like" more of a "feelingsball" kind of verb. How can a person or even a number "seem like" statistically?
Oakland looks like hott garbage
Sent from my ADR6400L using Tapatalk
Quote from: historyman on December 10, 2013, 04:39:45 PM
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on December 10, 2013, 09:59:43 AMI really don't think we're that far apart. The difference is you seem to subscribe to "heroball" (e.g. Kobe Bryant, Finals MVP, on 6 of 24 Game 7 shooting). At least it's better than "feelingsball" (e.g. "he's a gritty leader whose impact can't be measured because it's PURE MAGICKAL and it's GRIT and SWEAT AND LEADERSHAPE"). I subscribe to a theory perhaps best delineated by noted 20th century philosopher Mary Chapin Carpenter: "The stars might lie, but the numbers never do." The number of shots it takes him to get to that number of points...just doesn't statistically seem like the best use of possessions. And if he shot less often, he would find himself less contested when he did in fact shoot. SCIENCE
Isn't "seem like" more of a "feelingsball" kind of verb. How can a person or even a number "seem like" statistically?
Hmmmm
Keeping myself out of this Bader debate is looking more and more like one of the better decisions I have made in recent weeks. So don't pay me any mind I was just talking to myself. :thumbsup:
Well Oakland got dismantled by a decent not great Indiana squad in an 81 to 54 loss.
To add fuel to the Bader debate Bader did acount for a fifth of Oakland's total point output with a whopping 11 points on 2-15 shooting and 0-10 from downtown. I think this proves a point that when Bader is off he still throws up a ton of shots and going 2-15 shows to me that either he needs to realize when he's off and let other guys shoot or Kampe needs to change the offense when Bader isn't shooting well. It's not like he did much else in any other stat column: 0 ast, 0 reb, 1 stl. He's very one-dimensional and when the shots aren't falling its not like he does much else to help the team.
Therefore, I rest my case on why Bader is not one of the top 5 in the HL.
Green Bay lost to East Michigan tonight by 10
Evansville was leading Xavier for most of the game but then lost in the end.
Not a good night for the HL or for our Rippee... Chef had it right when he did the ESPN call on the Purdue/EMU game last Saturday... that EMU team is good! and I want to thank the family of networks for carrying the OU/IU game last night. We all got to see how to beat OU.
1. Get their one and only BIG in early foul trouble (which doesn't seem too difficult)
2. Keep Bader off the free throw line (he won't go 0-fer very often...but they sure do live and die from 19'9"). They only ran the back door cutter a few times.
The OU - Michigan State game from the Palace at Auburn Hills is also televised (3pm CT, ESPN2). Be interesting to see how Izzo handles this team with all of the injuries he has to worry about.
I have my tickets for the pre-game pizza party and the game at the O'rena on Saturday January 4. 5PM Valpo Time tip off.
Quote from: historyman on December 10, 2013, 04:39:45 PMIsn't "seem like" more of a "feelingsball" kind of verb. How can a person or even a number "seem like" statistically?
All right, it ISN'T the best use of shots. See his line from last night. He sucked it up.
Was that too much of a hedge? Sure, but apparently it seems like you don't understand that the use of "seems like" implies an indirect object reflecting back on the speaker. I make factual errors, not grammatical.
So who are the 5 best players in the Horizon League. If you were picking an all-conference team now, who would it be?
Sykes and Perry. After that no one really stands out.
Howard
Peters and Lavonte
Barlow
Forbes
Fouse?
Bader
Matt Tiby
I'd consider Mondy but I wouldn't vote for the guy for other reasons.
I'd go with Sykes and Perry and 3 of the other 8 guys - probably Forbes, Tiby, and, though I'm not a big fan, Bader, if forced to choose.
I think either Peters or Dority, probably Dority will make it. He will be tough to shut down and on a top tier team will have plenty of exposure, as well as being a senior.
Quote from: oklahomamick on December 10, 2013, 10:50:10 PM
Green Bay lost to East Michigan tonight by 10
I think this shows that there is not a single team in the HL who is going to be able to consistently win on the road during league play. Is it possible that this year the regular season conference champion has 5 or 6 losses?
Also, I like to speculate on what our record would be if we played the same non-con schedule as other HL teams. I think...
Milwaukee = same record as them
Youngstown = 2 more wins
Green Bay = 1 more loss
WSU = 3 more wins
Detroit= 1 more win
CSU = same record as them
UIC = 3 more wins
Oakland = 2 more wins
I also think that Green Bay and Cleveland State would have better records than us if they played our schedule. This year is definitely wide open, but I do think both Milwaukee and us are just a few steps behind Green Bay and Cleveland.
Nothing to do with our opponent's schedule, but still, thought I'd post is anyway! North Dakota State (Summit League) beats that other team from Northern Indiana tonight, at the home of that other team from Northern Indiana!! Nice. :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:
Quote from: EddieCabot on December 10, 2013, 07:16:28 AM
Quote from: wh on December 09, 2013, 11:41:15 PM
Quote from: EddieCabot on December 09, 2013, 10:27:34 PM
Quote from: classof2014 on December 09, 2013, 02:21:18 PMRight now he's not one of the 5 best players in the HL, perhaps when you were in the Summit he was but the HL he is not.
Very astute. Bader is averaging 21+ against Oakland's extremely soft non-league schedule, but once he's facing Horizon League competition, he'll be lucky to score in double figures.
EC, you were doing so well, but now you're starting to lose me. You may recall one of our early season exhibition opponents -Robert Morris College. They had a guy that really went off that night from 3, hitting an amazing 7-14 attempts. In fact, he had a great all around game. And yet we did nothing special to try to shut him down, as we were clearly in control throughout. Do you think Bryce would have allowed that to continue unabated if we were playing someone we were more evenly matched against. Obviously not. Ryan Broekhoff came up against a lot more gimmick defenses in HL play than he ever did against OOC opponents that clearly overmatched us. I think Mr. Bader will find the same thing to be true, especially in the second half of conference play when the other teams know him and Oakland better. As you know, the HL is a defensive minded league, far more so than the Summit. Teams like CSU, WSU and GB will be doing everything in their power to limit his 3- pt attempts.
Good points, wh. It probably will be tougher for Bader in the HL when teams are more familiar with him and more focused on slowing him down.
FWIW, IU is very aware of Bader and how good he is. It will be interesting to see if they give him special attention tonight, and if so, how he handles it.
I don't know if you read this article http://www.indystar.com/story/hoosier-insider/2013/12/10/hoosiers-concerned-by-oaklands-bader/3954881/ (http://www.indystar.com/story/hoosier-insider/2013/12/10/hoosiers-concerned-by-oaklands-bader/3954881/) or where you got your information, but you were right on.
I'm guessing that every HL team will be studying film from this game.
I said I would periodically post what the "real time Rpi" site thinks will happen for VU ...Kinda interesting...meaningless, but interesting.
12-14 Loyola Marymnt 6-3 (0-0) 177 88-68 W - Scouting
12-22 at UCF 3-3 (0-0) 315 79-78 W - Scouting
12-29 at E. Tennessee St. 4-6 (0-0) 207 84-71 W - Scouting
01-02 Illinois-Chicago 2-6 (0-0) 258 86-60 W - Scouting
01-04 at Oakland 1-8 (0-0) 171 83-73 W - Scouting
01-10 Wright St. 3-6 (0-0) 298 90-67 W - Scouting
01-15 at Detroit 4-5 (0-0) 94 75-83 L - Scouting
01-18 Wisc. Milwaukee 8-2 (0-0) 118 88-68 W - Scouting
01-23 at Youngstown St. 4-4 (0-0) 125 79-78 W - Scouting
01-25 at Cleveland St. 4-5 (0-0) 196 81-75 W - Scouting
01-29 Wisc. Green Bay 3-3 (0-0) 45 81-72 W - Scouting
02-01 at Illinois-Chicago 2-6 (0-0) 258 82-74 W - Scouting
02-07 Detroit 4-5 (0-0) 94 84-74 W - Scouting
02-09 Oakland 1-8 (0-0) 171 86-60 W - Scouting
02-15 at Wisc. Milwaukee 8-2 (0-0) 118 80-77 W - Scouting
02-20 at Wisc. Green Bay 3-3 (0-0) 45 73-80 L - Scouting
02-22 Youngstown St. 4-4 (0-0) 125 87-70 W - Scouting
02-25 at Wright St. 3-6 (0-0) 298 81-75 W - Scouting
03-01 Cleveland St. 4-5 (0-0) 196 90-67 W - Scouting
Current Record: 4-5 (0-0)
GAMER Projected Record: 21-7 (14-2)
According to their update as of Noon CT on 12/11/13:
VU 14-2 (perfect at home, Losses at UDM and GBay)
UDM 13-3 (perfect at home, Losses at GBay, YSt and Valpo)
GBay 10-6 ( perfect at home, losses everywhere on the road except UIC and Oakland)
Y.St 7-9
CSU 6-10
Mil 6-10
WSU 6-10
Oak 5-11
UIC 5-11
Haha, I would love to go 17-2 the rest of the way, but not likely :)
I give us going 17-2 the rest of the way about a 15% chance of occuring.
I would say 14-5 is much more reasonable. I would say anywhere from 9-10 to 17-2 is reasonable to happen. I would love to finish 17-2 but I don't see that happening, reasonably. We'll probably lose a few games against inferior teams on the road.
17-2 would be nice though!
Quote from: classof2014 on December 13, 2013, 10:28:45 AMI give us going 17-2 the rest of the way about a 15% chance of occuring.
RPI Forecast gives it a 2.31% chance, and I believe them because of the 3rd sig. fig.
A less than 2.5% likelihood of Valpo going 17-2 the rest of the way would be a statistically significant prediction that Valpo will not get 17 or more wins in its remaining games. A researcher would publish a finding with similar significance. However, I question the statistical methods used in the predictions above (beyond the pure common sense problems).
How can this have any statistical validity until we are able to solve for the unknown x ( or kc if you prefer)? ;)
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on December 13, 2013, 01:07:11 PMQuote from: classof2014 on December 13, 2013, 10:28:45 AMI give us going 17-2 the rest of the way about a 15% chance of occuring.
RPI Forecast gives it a 2.31% chance, and I believe them because of the 3rd sig. fig.
THAT is NOT a "seems like" feeling.
Quote from: historyman on December 13, 2013, 02:51:15 PMTHAT is NOT a "seems like" feeling.
You could say it seems like I don't want to give you an opening.
The percentages seem like made-up, but I have determined that they are the product (in the mathematical sense) of our win probabilities. Which is why the chances of us going undefeated the rest of the way are currently 0.02%.
E.g., the chances of going undefeated over 3 games in which your win probabilities are 50%, 70%, and 10% would be 3.5%.
UDM 13-3 HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA No. Maybe 3-13
Quote from: classof2014 on December 10, 2013, 08:33:49 PMWell Oakland got dismantled by a decent not great Indiana squad in an 81 to 54 loss.
"decent not great" for Indiana translates to "dominant" when I transpose to the key of HL, so I'm really not sure what this statement proves. If you think Indiana would do less than run the table in convincing fashion in the HL, then this is where I pull out the motto for the State I live in and say, "Show Me". I'm not buying that.
I'll just say this. I don't think we can put Travis Bader in the same category Valpo fans used to put Mike Helms in. I think he's better than that. OU is probably still going to live and die by Bader 3s, as they lived and died by Kangas 3s and Helms 3s in the past, so there's that.
As for EC, I'm starting to get the reaction of some around here. His initial comment had to be either clever sarcasm at your expense or a scrambled brain. There is no in-between.
Oakland leading the Spartans 45 to 43 at the O-Rena with 10 minutes to go. Happy Kampers?
QuoteOakland leading the Spartans 45 to 43 at the O-Rena with 10 minutes to go. Happy Kampers?
No.
I took a quick glance at all of the Horizon Leagues remaining non-conference games and was a little surprised. Right now we are significantly behind the MVC and not much ahead of the Colonial and Mid- American but maybe that could change. That wall of can't win games is behind us and the non-con schedules now show a majority of winable to very winable games. On top of that our Realtime RPI conference strength of schedule rank is now rated at 4th vs the MVC at 13th. So if our teams as a group can play well until January we could at least be right on their tail and maybe better.
So go Horizon League and I retract every nasty comment that any of us have made about Oaklands insane schedule. ;)
Quote from: justducky on December 14, 2013, 11:17:53 PMSo go Horizon League and I retract every nasty comment that any of us have made about Oaklands insane schedule. ;)
Oakland scedule
HL - Plus
OU - Negative (shoulda, coulda, woulda tonight)
I guess you can say Oakland has been the sacrificial lamb this year to help our league strength of schedule.
Wright State continues to struggle, losing to a bad Miami-Ohio team (2-5) 59-56. This was WSU's fourth consecutive loss. They now have an RPI of 326.
Of note Chrishawn Hopkins played his first game in a WSU uniform. He had 4 points, 3 assists and 4 turnovers in 24 minutes.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on December 09, 2013, 07:35:36 PM
Quote from: motowntitan on December 09, 2013, 06:24:23 PMIf everyone above Bader on that list shot as many 3's, there is very strong possibility that Bader would end up on top of that list.
...this is the opposite of logic.
You have promulgated a self-defeating argument:
--You're saying that the reason his percentage is lower is because he takes so many of them (because...why? does 3FG% have a Law of Diminishing Returns?).
--Implying Bader's percentage would rise if he took fewer of them.
--Therefore, Bader shouldn't shoot so many. He should stop after 4-5 ATT a game, because he's just going to suck after that.
--So, in the end you agree with 2014 and EddieCabot, et al.: Bader had bader not shoot so much.
Really, a breathtakingly poor argument. I would say "stick to sticking up for your own players", but then it occurs to me...as a Detroit fan, there is like a 5% chance you're actually trying to belittle him in this manner.
If so, well done, and sorry I didn't give you more credit for mocking your rival so cleverly.
Sorry, that was not my intent.
My remark was in response to Classof2014's statement that Bader was one-dimensional (i.e only shooting 3 pointers). But then he uses only one dimension (3pt %) to argue that Bobby is better than Bader.
So your comment was as follows "-You're saying that the reason his percentage is lower is because he takes so many of them (because...why? does 3FG% have a Law of Diminishing Returns?)"
It is not diminishing returns, but rather statistical sample size. Case in point, see the NCAA site:
http://www.ncaa.com/stats/basketball-men/d1/current/individual/143/p1 (http://www.ncaa.com/stats/basketball-men/d1/current/individual/143/p1)
That site does not have Booby, nor his 55% listed. Why not? Because he has not shot the minimum amount of shots that they consider for addition to the list. They also do the same thing with Free Throws. Otherwise, the NCAA record books would be loaded with bench players that have shot 100% of their 3 point and/or Free Throws because they may have only made the one shot they took.
So, no, I'm not agreeing with Eddie. If Bryce thinks Bobby can keep making 3 point shots at 55%, then please have him start chucking up 10 per game.
Here is Wiki's take from the NCAA's record books
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_NCAA_Division_I_men%27s_basketball_career_3-point_scoring_leaders (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_NCAA_Division_I_men%27s_basketball_career_3-point_scoring_leaders)
So, according to Classof2014's logic, Bobby is better than JJ Redick as well, because JJ only made 40% of his shots (like Bader).
Anyway, the Horizon League has bigger problems right now than worrying about All-League players 10 games into the season.
I never said Bobby is better than Bader. All I am saying Bader is way overrated. He's a good 3-point shooter and that's it. He's one dimensional and the IU game proves that. He had an awful game because not one of his 10 3s fell, or even if 2 fell through he would be 2-10. He shoots 3s, 3s, and more 3s. He averages 11 attempts a game. Connects about 40% of the time. So 12-15 points a game due to 3 pointers, add 4 due to FTs, and two or three two pointers a game and you have 21 points by going 6-17 from the floor. Going 5-13 from 3 point land, 1-4 from 2, and 4-4 from the charity stripe.
He's a good 3 point shooter. Is Bobby as good of a shooter? Hell no. But Bobby isn't one-dimensional he can post-up and scores many of his points under the basket and rebounds well too. Does Bader do that? Nope, just shoots 3s. Never said Bobby was a better shooter because he is not.
Quote from: motowntitan on December 15, 2013, 09:40:08 PM
So, no, I'm not agreeing with Eddie. If Bryce thinks Bobby can keep making 3 point shots at 55%, then please have him start chucking up 10 per game.
So you're not agreeing with me either? Darn! :'( However, I made the same point about Bobby, so I think you are agreeing with me, in an around-about way. :thumbsup:
One thing to keep in mind - It's incredibly difficult to be a great three-point shooter, take a lot of attempts each game and still make over 40%. If you consider what Bryce Drew or JJ Redick or Jon Diebler went up against each night, you'd have to be amazed they still made a high percentage. Teams would have their quickest most athletic defender on them, and would switch thru every screen. Bryce would take 8 or 9 three's a game and maybe 1 or 2 were open looks. Bobby is 11/20 from 3 thus far this year. How many have been wide open clean looks? I'd say 17. Thus 85% of his attempts are wide open. Could you imagine what Bryce's % would be or Bader's for that matter if 85% of their attempts were wide open. My guess would be about 65%.
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on December 10, 2013, 03:57:40 AM
Amidst all the sarcasm, let's assume that, for some reason, you stop being who you are and the more you shoot, the more your % declines.
Quote from: chef on December 15, 2013, 10:26:25 PM
One thing to keep in mind - It's incredibly difficult to be a great three-point shooter, take a lot of attempts each game and still make over 40%. If you consider what Bryce Drew or JJ Redick or Jon Diebler went up against each night, you'd have to be amazed they still made a high percentage. Teams would have their quickest most athletic defender on them, and would switch thru every screen. Bryce would take 8 or 9 three's a game and maybe 1 or 2 were open looks. Bobby is 11/20 from 3 thus far this year. How many have been wide open clean looks? I'd say 17. Thus 85% of his attempts are wide open. Could you imagine what Bryce's % would be or Bader's for that matter if 85% of their attempts were wide open. My guess would be about 65%.
You two seem to be in disagreement ... I'll step aside and let the two of you battle this out.
Quote from: motowntitan on December 15, 2013, 09:40:08 PMThat site does not have Booby, nor his 55% listed. Why not?
because his name is Bobby!
Quote from: EddieCabot on December 15, 2013, 10:46:52 PMYou two seem to be in disagreement ... I'll step aside and let the two of you battle this out.
I think the answer is obvious...shot selection. Being able to choose when to shoot--and when not to--makes you a good player. In the words of noted basketball analyst Bob Seger "what to leave in, what to leave out".
Bader shoots 36% from the floor, yet everyone thinks he's great. He's not even in the top 50 in the conference in points per shot (1.09). He's behind even LVD, who we in kinder moments call a "volume scorer".
The bottom line is you are what your numbers say you are. If you're really good, a Michael or LeBron, it doesn't matter how many people they drape over you. If you're not that good, you have to find the open man--which is in itself another skill to be good at. If it takes you THAT many shots to score that many points, then you're hurting your team.
Is Bobby lucky for taking unguarded 3s? Or is he just smart for not taking them when it's not a good shot?
Here you go:
http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/44191/a-better-option-than-a-superstar (http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_/id/44191/a-better-option-than-a-superstar)
http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/7649571/nba-kobe-bryant-not-money-think-espn-magazine (http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/7649571/nba-kobe-bryant-not-money-think-espn-magazine)
I think for the most part we agree. I don't think you wished Bryce had only taken open 3's in his Valpo career? For what it's worth, Bader is a career 40% three-point shooter. His numbers are slightly down this year, but that's mainly because of the IU game.
Oh, sure--I'm not advocating only open shots--because until the rule changes this year, there would be approximately 6 shots per game each side! (Now there are 9.)
I advocate smart shots. I think we all know in our gut what this is. When you're at your Y or rec league game, and you get p-y-s-t at some guy for taking shots he shouldn't, you acquiesce to this principle.
Obviously Bader is a good player and good shooter. But part of BBall IQ is knowing when to shoot. Everyone else on the floor on his side was also good enough to earn a D1 ride, so it's not like he's on your rec league team (in which case, he'd have green light passim, no pun intended for once).
I look at his numbers and after my stomach turns, I remember things, like Grady Little saying something to the effect that a visibly-dead-tired-from-space Pedro Martinez was still better than any arm he had in his bullpen. It's the sports equivalent of the "great man theory" in history--that one person accomplishes, and should, everything by himself.
I think we're smarter than that these days.
Completely agree. When somebody is closely guarding Bader chances are at least one other player on Oakland is relatively open for a shot. If Bader is 6 of 16 on the day (which is his average) there's 10 misses on the day. Chances are 9 of those misses are taken by the defense, Oakland is dead last in the league in rebounding margin at -10, so chances of an offensive board are slim. So if Bader passes on many of his contested looks and lets say Oakland scores on 40% of those there's an extra 10 or so points a game. Bader would do his team much more good if he were 4 of 9 for 13 points than 6 of 16 for 19 points.
Quote from: classof2014 on December 16, 2013, 09:31:21 AMBader would do his team much more good if he were 4 of 9 for 13 points than 6 of 16 for 19 points.
True--and a lower usage rate would give him more open looks later--i.e. if the opponents gameplanned for 20 shots and he takes half that, or less, they start to adjust, and then OH YOU GOT PUNCHED
http://www.homestarrunner.com/sbemail51.html (http://www.homestarrunner.com/sbemail51.html)
So the OU Grizzlies come down to earth tonight against a Middlin'-MVC 5-4 Illinois State (#107) team (coming to ORena on a 4-game win streak).
Real Time RPI has ISU winning 79-78; and on Saturday, OU hosts Eastern Michigan (#85). the site predicts an 80-77 OU victory; and the play a back-to-back weekend at home, with Robert Morris (RPI 221), and the predictor has OI winning 81-77.
I'll be interested to see if that OOC schedule really did them any good as they come down the HL level of play.
They did lose 2 very winnable and should win games against St. Francis (RPI 116) who is 5-5, which was at home. They also lost to Western Michigan (208) on the road. Although they beat Ohio, I think we'll know much more about Oakland after these next few games. I'm guess they'll have 10-12 wins come season end. They'll probably win anywhere from 7-9 games in the HL.
Oakland beat Illinois State last night 90-75. They are now 2-3 against mid major competition, having won their last 2 in impressive fashion over Ohio and Illinois State. Finally, we can start to get a feel for who Oakland really is, and I like what I see right now.
I think the next OU game will be a real teller. That Ypsilanti team formerly known as the Hurons is really good at basketball, unlike before when they were just a big flightless bird... emu.
Detroit with a 22-11 first half lead at Akron. That could be another nice HL win. Its on MAC Sports.
JINX! Detroit loses by 19 after being outscored in the second half 58-30!
Murray State beat Southern Illinois 73-65 on Tuesday, after which SIU coach Barry Hinson goes into a classic rant:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQKbLsoCt28#t=35 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQKbLsoCt28#t=35)
Quote from: wh on December 19, 2013, 04:01:18 AM
Murray State beat Southern Illinois 73-65 on Tuesday, after which SIU coach Barry Hinson goes into a classic rant:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQKbLsoCt28#t=35 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQKbLsoCt28#t=35)
Hystrical line..."I've been telling my wife for years that size doesn't matter"!!!! Wonder if she has any eligibility left!!
Quote from: vu72 on December 19, 2013, 07:31:37 AMQuote from: wh on December 19, 2013, 04:01:18 AMMurray State beat Southern Illinois 73-65 on Tuesday, after which SIU coach Barry Hinson goes into a classic rant: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQKbLsoCt28#t=35 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQKbLsoCt28#t=35)
Hystrical line..."I've been telling my wife for years that size doesn't matter"!!!! Wonder if she has any eligibility left!!
Does anybody remember when Barry Hinson was the coach at Oral Roberts and coached against Valpo? Actually when he was at Missouri State, I believe he coached against Valpo then, also.
Only one HL team in action tonight. Eastern Illinois heads to the Nutter Center. I see Donlon is undefeated at home.
11-13 at Georgetown 7-2 (0-0) 86 70-88 L
? 11-16 at DePaul 7-4 (0-0) 114 72-81 L
11-22 vs Houston Baptist 2-8 (0-0) 281 75-59 W
? 11-23 at South Alabama 3-5 (0-0) 186 70-74 L
11-27 Alcorn St. 0-7 (0-0) 333 73-55 W
11-30 Western Carolina 4-7 (0-0) 252 85-77 W
? 12-02 at Morehead St. 6-5 (0-0) 166 69-74 L
?? 12-05 at N.C. A&T 2-8 (0-0) 304 59-62 L
?? 12-07 at Virginia Military 3-4 (0-0) 219 74-94 L
?? 12-15 at Miami (OH) 2-5 (0-0) 214 56-59 L
12-19 Eastern Illinois 1-6 (0-0) 299 81-64 W - Scouting
This may be just what the raiders need. EIU is horrible, their only win is against UIC.. Western Illinois beat Eastern 60-32 on Dec.4.
RealTimeRPI updated their season projection for the raiders... Wins at home over UIC and Oakland.... final record: 2-14. Who'd a thunk it?.
Southeastern Stats after their Milligan game on Wednesday. The video on their site is Password Protected, and since I don't work at Target, I can't get into their site.
Their stud (#1 Dwayne Johnson) was a DNP ..." With senior point guard Dwayne Johnson shelved with a lower-body injury, Southeastern was put in the unusual position of playing against visiting Milligan College without its senior floor general."
2013-14 Team Rankings
Ranks Number 6 in Division II in Total Rebounds per Game (44.545)
Ranks Number 8 in Division II in Blocks per Game (4.545)
Ranks Number 10 in Division II in Defensive Rebounds per Game (30.091)
Ranks Number 10 in Division II in Offensive Rebounds per Game (14.455)
Ranks Number 12 in Division II in Scoring Offense per Game (91.182)
Ranks Number 14 in Division II in Total Blocks (50)
Ranks Number 27 in Division II in Field Goal Pct (0.487)
Ranks Number 29 in Division II in Total Rebound Margin (5.909)
Ranks Number 37 in Division II in Turnover Margin (1.636)
Ranks Number 40 in Division II in Scoring Margin (9.455)
Ranks Number 41 in Division II in Total Total Rebound Offense (490)
Ranks Number 44 in Division II in Total Scoring Offense (1003)
Ranks Number 48 in Division II in Field Goal Pct Defense (0.434)
2013-14 Individual Rankings
Timothy Mitchell Ranks Number 1 in Division II in Defensive Rebounds per Game (8.727)
Timothy Mitchell Ranks Number 1 in Division II in Total Rebounds per Game (12.909)
Timothy Mitchell Ranks Number 4 in Division II in Blocks per Game (2.455)
Timothy Mitchell Ranks Number 4 in Division II in Total Total Rebounds (142)
Timothy Mitchell Ranks Number 5 in Division II in Total Blocks (27)
Timothy Mitchell Ranks Number 5 in Division II in Offensive Rebounds per Game (4.182)
Dwayne Johnson Ranks Number 17 in Division II in Assists per Game (5.700)
Dwayne Johnson Ranks Number 24 in Division II in Points per Game (21.000)
Timothy Mitchell Ranks Number 24 in Division II in Field Goal Pct (0.587)
Dwayne Johnson Ranks Number 33 in Division II in Total Assists (57)
Quote from: talksalot on December 13, 2013, 09:37:56 AMAccording to their update as of Noon CT on 12/11/13:
VU 14-2 (perfect at home, Losses at UDM and GBay)
UDM 13-3 (perfect at home, Losses at GBay, YSt and Valpo)
GBay 10-6 ( perfect at home, losses everywhere on the road except UIC and Oakland)
Y.St 7-9
CSU 6-10
Mil 6-10
WSU 6-10
Oak 5-11
UIC 5-11
OK... here's the 12/19 update... the word parity comes to mind...
1. VU 11-5 Losses at UDM,YSU,CSU,UWM,GBY
1. UDM 11-5 Losses at VU, YSU,CSU,UWM,GBY (tie-breaker ?)
3. GBY 10-6 Losses at VU,UDM,YSU,CSU,UWM,OAK
4. UWM 9-7 (Split with YSU and CSU)
4. YSU 9-7
4. CSU 9-7
7. OAK 6-10 All Road Losses; and home losses to VU and UDM
8. UIC 5-11 All Road Losses; and home losses to VU, UDM and GBY
9. WSU 2-14 Only wins are home to UIC and OAK
Quote from: talksalot on December 20, 2013, 12:10:35 PM
Quote from: talksalot on December 13, 2013, 09:37:56 AMAccording to their update as of Noon CT on 12/11/13:
VU 14-2 (perfect at home, Losses at UDM and GBay)
UDM 13-3 (perfect at home, Losses at GBay, YSt and Valpo)
GBay 10-6 ( perfect at home, losses everywhere on the road except UIC and Oakland)
Y.St 7-9
CSU 6-10
Mil 6-10
WSU 6-10
Oak 5-11
UIC 5-11
OK... here's the 12/19 update... the word parity comes to mind...
1. VU 11-5 Losses at UDM,YSU,CSU,UWM,GBY
1. UDM 11-5 Losses at VU, YSU,CSU,UWM,GBY (tie-breaker ?)
3. GBY 10-6 Losses at VU,UDM,YSU,CSU,UWM,OAK
4. UWM 9-7 (Split with YSU and CSU)
4. YSU 9-7
4. CSU 9-7
7. OAK 6-10 All Road Losses; and home losses to VU and UDM
8. UIC 5-11 All Road Losses; and home losses to VU, UDM and GBY
9. WSU 2-14 Only wins are home to UIC and OAK
Eh, RealtimeRPI has always been run under the assumption that winning on the road is practically impossible, and winning at home is pretty much guaranteed. I would imagine Detroit is going to finish near the bottom, and WSU probably towards the middle. I don't have historical information on this, but if you were to look at this last year, it probably would have had UIC winning the division with Green Bay at the very bottom (ahead of UWM, of course).
RPI Forecast probably does a little better job, as it uses Sagarin's predictions to generate a winner probability, not the GAMER method. After each week is simulated, the predictor is run again, until an entire season is simulated. Then 10,000 seasons are simulated and the RPIs are averaged together. RPI Forecast predicts a 7-9 record for Detroit, which sounds a bit more accurate than RealTimeRPI's projector. The GAMER system, in my opinion, always predicts too many home victories.
Unless it's the last few weeks of the season a team's actual RPI is pretty misleading. Sagarin's ratings are pretty decent, but knowing RPI Forecast uses his predictor makes it easier to trust the expected RPIs.
Current Sagarin rankings:
Green Bay 8
Valpo 100
CSU 110
Mil 147
Oakland 168
YSU 173
Wright St 192
Detroit 195
UIC 253
These are out of 351 total schools in the rankings. Loyola is 277th !!!
That would be "Green Bay 81"
Two huge offensive performances by HL players this afternoon:
- Alec Brown 40 points/8 rebounds: 12-17 FG, 2-2 3pt, 14-15 FT
- Travis Bader 33 points: 10-15 FG, all 3-pt. shots
Quote from: wh on December 21, 2013, 03:13:52 PMTravis Bader 33 points: 10-15 FG, all 3-pt. shots
Credit where credit is due.
Although since I've rained on his parade before, it's a shame he doesn't have a higher FT rate since he makes over 90% of his FT :/
Illinois beat #23 Missouri by 1 in their "Braggin' rights" game in St Louis tonight. That certainly will help the RPI.
Hey 2014....Oakland played the hardest non-league schedule...right???? After it Bader leads the league in 3 catagories and the nation in 1. The last 4 games ( 3 really good mid-majors) without high major 6-8 athletes hanging all over him he goes 28 for 46 from the 3. He's shooting 43% from the 3. Now I know he would only average 10 points a game if he played for Valpo, but you REALLY don't think he is one of the top 5 players in the Horizon.
I know I have to let this go. I have to let go, I have to let go.....................
It might well be a case of "the Beatles are the greatest band of all time". I don't really agree, but it's hard to make a convincing case otherwise.
Clearly some players have been doing some remarkable things, but rather than posit my own 5, does anyone know whether the conference team is chosen expressly based on conference play, or over the course of the whole year?
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on December 28, 2013, 10:32:39 AM
It might well be a case of "the Beatles are the greatest band of all time". I don't really agree, but it's hard to make a convincing case otherwise.
Clearly some players have been doing some remarkable things, but rather than posit my own 5, does anyone know whether the conference team is chosen expressly based on conference play, or over the course of the whole year?
I'm not sure if the league gives any instructions with the ballot, but chef (and maybe pgmado?) has stated in the past that he votes based upon performance in league games only. Maybe they can share whether that is the directive given by the league office or just the approach they take.
UIC was beating Illinois by 10 at halftime at the United Center, only to quickly lose the lead early in the second half, losing by 14 or so. I only watched the second half, but apparently Barlow was dominating in the first half, and was awful in the second half.
Loyola Marymount beat BYU at home in the first game of WCC action for them, a good win.
Quote from: valpotx on December 29, 2013, 12:13:25 AM
UIC was beating Illinois by 10 at halftime at the United Center, only to quickly lose the lead early in the second half, losing by 14 or so. I only watched the second half, but apparently Barlow was dominating in the first half, and was awful in the second half.
He was "awful" in the 2nd half because Rayvonte Rice was on him like glue the whole time.
He was taking the same shots they showed in the first half, they just weren't falling in the second. He made some tough shots in the first half that shouldn't have gone in...
Oakland had a good chance to knock off GB at GB last night, if not for Bader continuing to be mired in a shooting slump. He was 2-11 from 3 and 2-13 overall for 8 points. He has now failed to reach double figures in 3 of his last 4 games, for which he was accumulatively an anemic 7-39 from 3 (18%) and 8-46 (17%) overall. His 0-8 3-pt. performance against Milw 4 games back was only the 2nd time he failed to score a 3-pt. FG in his last 73 games spanning 3 seasons. His other 0-for came earlier this season against Indiana.
I know he's chasing the all-time record for made 3-pt FG's. Maybe the pressure of that is starting to affect him?
http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/article/20140121/GPG020101/301210468/Men-s-basketball-UWGB-hopes-wins-thrills-bring-crowds?nclick_check=1 (http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/article/20140121/GPG020101/301210468/Men-s-basketball-UWGB-hopes-wins-thrills-bring-crowds?nclick_check=1)
I try not to be a pedant or grammar nazi, but the subject/verb disagreement when referencing "the Phoenix" in the above article about GB attendance really grated on my nerves when I read it:
The Phoenix has lived up to the hype after being picked as the preseason favorite to win the Horizon League in October.
The Phoenix has not drawn exceptionally well for years.
Following is the rule for sports teams as noted in the Guide to Grammar and Writing:
The names of sports teams, on the other hand, are treated as plurals, regardless of the form of that name. We would write that "The Yankees have signed a new third baseman" and "The Yankees are a great organization" (even if we're Red Sox fans) and that "For two years in a row, the Utah Jazz have attempted to draft a big man." When we refer to a team by the city in which it resides, however, we use the singular, as in "Dallas has attempted to secure the services of two assistant coaches that Green Bay hopes to keep."
Quote from: wh on January 23, 2014, 11:02:38 AM
http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/article/20140121/GPG020101/301210468/Men-s-basketball-UWGB-hopes-wins-thrills-bring-crowds?nclick_check=1 (http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/article/20140121/GPG020101/301210468/Men-s-basketball-UWGB-hopes-wins-thrills-bring-crowds?nclick_check=1)
I try not to be a pedant or grammar nazi, but the subject/verb disagreement when referencing "the Phoenix" in the above article about GB attendance really grated on my nerves when I read it:
The Phoenix has lived up to the hype after being picked as the preseason favorite to win the Horizon League in October.
The Phoenix has not drawn exceptionally well for years.
Following is the rule for sports teams as noted in the Guide to Grammar and Writing:
The names of sports teams, on the other hand, are treated as plurals, regardless of the form of that name. We would write that "The Yankees have signed a new third baseman" and "The Yankees are a great organization" (even if we're Red Sox fans) and that "For two years in a row, the Utah Jazz have attempted to draft a big man." When we refer to a team by the city in which it resides, however, we use the singular, as in "Dallas has attempted to secure the services of two assistant coaches that Green Bay hopes to keep."
More troubling than the grammar is the content. They drew 2569 against Oakland last night.
Quote
There was a Resch Center-record crowd of 9,906 for a showdown against Wisconsin in November and another 6,491 for Virginia in December.
The other seven home dates [sic] have drawn an average of 2,261.
That's insane with how well they're doing, but it's not all that surprising. They'll bring crowds in once they host the tournament, but commuter schools rarely bring large crowds for regular season games. UWM is one of the worst offenders - they have a student population of 30,502 and a metro area of 1,566,981, so you'd think they'd be able to get more people at their games, or at least, more than a couple students for their student section (literally).
Quote from: wh on January 23, 2014, 11:02:38 AM
http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/article/20140121/GPG020101/301210468/Men-s-basketball-UWGB-hopes-wins-thrills-bring-crowds?nclick_check=1 (http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/article/20140121/GPG020101/301210468/Men-s-basketball-UWGB-hopes-wins-thrills-bring-crowds?nclick_check=1)
I try not to be a pedant or grammar nazi, but the subject/verb disagreement when referencing "the Phoenix" in the above article about GB attendance really grated on my nerves when I read it:
The Phoenix has lived up to the hype after being picked as the preseason favorite to win the Horizon League in October.
The Phoenix has not drawn exceptionally well for years.
Following is the rule for sports teams as noted in the Guide to Grammar and Writing:
The names of sports teams, on the other hand, are treated as plurals, regardless of the form of that name. We would write that "The Yankees have signed a new third baseman" and "The Yankees are a great organization" (even if we're Red Sox fans) and that "For two years in a row, the Utah Jazz have attempted to draft a big man." When we refer to a team by the city in which it resides, however, we use the singular, as in "Dallas has attempted to secure the services of two assistant coaches that Green Bay hopes to keep."
My impression is that there is a mandate up there to break these basic grammar rules. I can still remember Mark Lazerus writing adamantly in his column and saying adamantly on press row when I used to say hi to him, "I refuse to treat Phoenix as singular when it's the nickname of a team, I don't care what they say up there." It'd be interesting to hunt down their media guide and see if that is the culprit.
I'm right there with ya, by the way.
Oakland buzzer beater over UIC yesterday. Great finish for the Golden Grizzlies, a heartbreaker for the Flames:
Duke Mondy Buzzer Beater vs UIC (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXn-Vc3vOtY#ws)
My respect for Oakland went down quite a bit more after that game. UIC is winless in the HL and 5-16 overall. Oakland nearly lost to them, what the hell are you storming the court for? If UIC was ranked, made it deep in the tourney last year, if you're a winless team, or a DII beating a DI (don't know why it'd be a home game for a DII) then if you win that's a time you can storm the court.
Congratulations, you probably should've lost to the worst team in the league.
Eh, it's Oakland. They don't have many more than 5 wins themselves.
Never know when they'll win another! As the famous epigrammatic poet Ricardus Vitalus once said, "CARPE DIEM, BABY!!!"
Quote from: classof2014 on January 26, 2014, 09:21:05 AM
My respect for Oakland went down quite a bit more after that game. UIC is winless in the HL and 5-16 overall. Oakland nearly lost to them, what the hell are you storming the court for? If UIC was ranked, made it deep in the tourney last year, if you're a winless team, or a DII beating a DI (don't know why it'd be a home game for a DII) then if you win that's a time you can storm the court.
Congratulations, you probably should've lost to the worst team in the league.
I wouldn't be quite so hard on them for storming the court. First, it was their homecoming game and was full of suspense where they trailing most of the game. To win on a buzzer beater would naturally lead to an emotional outpouring, not base on rankings. Can you imagine a bunch of college kids (and youthful alumni) calculating the effect of storming versus not storming? Your expectations are way to analytical versus the emotion involved..
Hmmm Wright St with a loss at UWM 68-64. Didn't expect that. Did anybody watch?
I saw the 2nd half. Milwaukee had a 20 point lead in the second half and did everything they could to blow it. Glad they held on!
For Friday's pair of games, we need Detroit to beat Cleveland St and Oakland beat Youngstown. If Cleveland St loses we jump to 2nd. If Oakland wins, both Oakland and Youngstown move to 4-4.
Quote from: oklahomamick on January 31, 2014, 07:34:34 AM
For Friday's pair of games, we need Detroit to beat Cleveland St and Oakland beat Youngstown. If Cleveland St loses we jump to 2nd. If Oakland wins, both Oakland and Youngstown move to 4-4.
Note: we
are in second right now, and if we split the season series, we are in a good place for that coveted 2-seed with the double bye. If split, the tiebreaker goes to the best record of the highest seed, all the way down to UIC at the bottom. This is of course, very premature, so it's safe to say we're tied for 2nd in the standings.
Quote from: a3uge on January 31, 2014, 07:57:05 AMthe tiebreaker goes to the best record of the highest seed
? Please elucidate.
Quote from: HC on January 31, 2014, 07:02:11 AMMilwaukee had a 20 point lead in the second half and did everything they could to blow it.
HC, reminiscent of http://www.valpofanzone.com/forum/index.php?topic=1134.msg24222#msg24222 (http://www.valpofanzone.com/forum/index.php?topic=1134.msg24222#msg24222) a little? :) (or their last year game AT WSU)...
(HC read up in that thread for your exchange with BigDWSU : )
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on January 31, 2014, 10:17:12 AM
Quote from: a3uge on January 31, 2014, 07:57:05 AMthe tiebreaker goes to the best record of the highest seed
? Please elucidate.
Substitute "against" for "of" and reread the entire sentence. How's that for pithy elucidation?
Very nicely done, thank you. Even Martial would be proud!
Quote from: wh on January 31, 2014, 10:49:55 AM
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on January 31, 2014, 10:17:12 AM
Quote from: a3uge on January 31, 2014, 07:57:05 AMthe tiebreaker goes to the best record of the highest seed
? Please elucidate.
Substitute "against" for "of" and reread.
Thanks. Yeah so like hypothetically (ignore wins adding up)
1. GB 14-2
2. Valpo 12-4
3. CSU 12-4
4. YSU 10-6
5. WSU 8-6
6. UWM 8-6
7. Oakland 8-6
Ect...
Say Valpo and CSU both went 1-1 against GB, it would go to each team's record against the next highest seed, YSU. If Valpo goes 2-0 and CSU 1-1 against YSU, Valpo is awarded tie breaker.
If there's a three way (or more) tie, like with the 5-7 seeds above, the records against teams involved in the tie are added up... So say UWM was 1-1 against WSU and 1-1 against Oakland... That record combines to 2-2. WSU beats Oakland twice and splits Milwaukee: 3-1. Oakland combines to 0-4 because they never beat UWM or WSU. So they're seed 7.
But what if the record of three teams is 2-2 in the 3 way tie? Then it goes to the best records against the top seeds. This happened to valpo, CSU, uwm in 2010. Valpo (eventual #6 seed) had an 0-2 record against #2 WSU while Uwm and CSU split WSU. You had to go all the way down to CSU's 0-2 record against #7 Detroit to resolve that tie. If by some miracle that formula still doesn't work, it goes by RPI.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
Quote from: a3uge on January 31, 2014, 11:54:51 AM
Quote from: wh on January 31, 2014, 10:49:55 AM
Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on January 31, 2014, 10:17:12 AM
Quote from: a3uge on January 31, 2014, 07:57:05 AMthe tiebreaker goes to the best record of the highest seed
? Please elucidate.
Substitute "against" for "of" and reread.
Thanks. Yeah so like hypothetically (ignore wins adding up)
1. GB 14-2
2. Valpo 12-4
3. CSU 12-4
4. YSU 10-6
5. WSU 8-6
6. UWM 8-6
7. Oakland 8-6
Ect...
Say Valpo and CSU both went 1-1 against GB, it would go to each team's record against the next highest seed, YSU. If Valpo goes 2-0 and CSU 1-1 against YSU, Valpo is awarded tie breaker.
If there's a three way (or more) tie, like with the 5-7 seeds above, the records against teams involved in the tie are added up... So say UWM was 1-1 against WSU and 1-1 against Oakland... That record combines to 2-2. WSU beats Oakland twice and splits Milwaukee: 3-1. Oakland combines to 0-4 because they never beat UWM or WSU. So they're seed 7.
But what if the record of three teams is 2-2 in the 3 way tie? Then it goes to the best records against the top seeds. This happened to valpo, CSU, uwm in 2010. Valpo (eventual #6 seed) had an 0-2 record against #2 WSU while Uwm and CSU split WSU. You had to go all the way down to CSU's 0-2 record against #7 Detroit to resolve that tie. If by some miracle that formula still doesn't work, it goes by RPI.
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LAA, I don't think me and the d see eye to eye on much of anything. :-X
I know, that's why it was so funny.
For those who didn't click through:
after someone relates that WSU snatched conference victory #1 from Panther jaws
HC: Too bad, I don't care for WSU.
BigDWSU: :-*
I didn't get to catch the game, but saw the result of YSU vs. Oakland. It was an Oakland victory with a couple seconds left. Did they storm the court?
Quote from: oklahomamick on February 01, 2014, 02:22:17 PMI didn't get to catch the game, but saw the result of YSU vs. Oakland. It was an Oakland victory with a couple seconds left. Did they storm the court?
It's in the replay section of ESPN 3 now. After the refs gave Perry a fortunate foul call and he made 2 FT's, Felder, a freshman, was fouled 4 seconds later and the kid stepped up and, like Perry, made a tying and go ahead FT to win it for the Grizzlies. YSU got off a 3/4 court Hail Mary shot that hit the rim but was no where near close to going in.
Just tuned in the Oakland-Cleveland State game on the HLN. Why is Oakland in dark uniforms? You can barely tell the 2 teams apart.
Bader has 6 3's and 20 pts. at half, CSU leads by 7.
Barber's and Kaplan's picks for HL 1st Team at the half way point:
Forbes CSU
Dority Valpo
Sykes GB
Bader Oakland
Perry YSU
Quote from: wh on February 06, 2014, 09:00:18 PM
Barber's and Kaplan's picks for HL 1st Team at the half way point:
Forbes CSU
Dority Valpo
Sykes GB
Bader Oakland
Perry YSU
Bader over Brown? Questionable.
Seems like a solid list to me, going to be pretty hard for a guy on a winless team to make the first team squad.
I'm guessing it'll be Brown over Bader and Bader will be on the second team. Bader is very one dimensional, all he does is shoot threes, when he's on he's gonna have a great game, like tonight going 10-13 from 3, for 35 points. But many times he's off and has a 5-17 shooting performance for 15 points. While Brown can shoot, post up, rebound, and block. If one part of Brown's game isn't there he has some other way to contribute, while when the 3 doesn't fall for Bader he really doesn't do anything else special.
I know I was hard on Brown earlier this season but he really has lived up to the hype this season. So bravo to him and hope he makes on the first team because he deserves it.
Quote from: classof2014 on February 06, 2014, 09:17:17 PM
I'm guessing it'll be Brown over Bader and Bader will be on the second team. Bader is very one dimensional, all he does is shoot threes, when he's on he's gonna have a great game, like tonight going 10-13 from 3, for 35 points. But many times he's off and has a 5-17 shooting performance for 15 points. While Brown can shoot, post up, rebound, and block. If one part of Brown's game isn't there he has some other way to contribute, while when the 3 doesn't fall for Bader he really doesn't do anything else special.
I know I was hard on Brown earlier this season but he really has lived up to the hype this season. So bravo to him and hope he makes on the first team because he deserves it.
I think Brown is having a better year than Forbes. I'd say Forbes is the last 1st teamer and Bader is the first 2nd teamer. The "Bader 1st Team" seems rather reactionary after tonight. But we don't really have to argue this until the end of the year. Plenty of games left.
Also Murray State is playing Belmont on ESPNU and you all need to be watching this.
It would be nice for CSU to lose one of the two games this weekend....@WSU Saturday.
Quote from: valpo84 on February 07, 2014, 08:26:26 AMIt would be nice for CSU to lose one of the two games this weekend....@WSU Saturday.
exactly what i'm thinking.
Bader a 1st teamer???????? You've got to be kidding...emotional over load here for a few people.......he is a pretty good one-dimensional guy. When you shoot basically only three-pointers for your career, even at 38% you are bound to make a lot of them.
1st team
Sykes
Dority
Brown
Perry
Bader
2nd team
Forbes
Howard
Petros
Barlow
Darling
Defensive team
Mondy
Brown
Fernandez
Fouse
Perry
Newcomer team
Felder
Barlow
Williams
Lowe
Peters
* Maybe Adekoya instead of Lowe???
Quote from: oklahomamick on February 07, 2014, 12:36:31 PM
1st team
Sykes
Dority
Brown
Perry
Bader
2nd team
Forbes
Howard
Petros
Barlow
Darling
Defensive team
Mondy
Brown
Fernandez
Fouse
Perry
Newcomer team
Felder
Barlow
Williams
Lowe
Peters
* Maybe Adekoya instead of Lowe???
The one name I would take exception with being on either team is Darling. He is averaging less than 9 PPG and only plays about 20 minutes. Injuries have really taken their toll. He did, however, have 20 points in their last game. Maybe he can work his way back into consideration if he can stay healthy.
Yes, I was just trying to find someone on WSU....Who would you put in place? And I know some won't agree with Bader on 1st team.
Quote from: oklahomamick on February 07, 2014, 01:42:54 PM
Yes, I was just trying to find someone on WSU....Who would you put in place? And I know some won't agree with Bader on 1st team.
Off the top of my head, I'd probably go with Tiby. He's been somewhat inconsistent, but overall he's been a really good addition for Milwaukee.
Wow, Milwaukee beats GB at GB, and CSU holds on late at WSU. We really could have used that W last night, as if it still would have played out this way today, we would actually have had a chance for 1st by end of season...
With the loss by GB we still have an outside shot at the regular season title. If we win out we get 2nd and if we win and one other loss by GB we get the regular season title.
Am I saying it's gonna happen this way? NO
This is a possibility and as a fan of Valpo basketball I still have some hope that we can run the table and win the league as well as the tournament, although the tournament is more likely than winning the league at this point. Like I said we need the double by. Winning 2 in a row is much easier than 3 or 4 in a row.
Does seem like road teams have the edge so far this weekend. Doesn't bode well for us tomorrow, if we lose that one our chances of finishing first is just about .2% and finishing in 2nd is much lower than right now.
CSU is he best team in the league right now. The double bye is big, but I'd say just about any team outside UIC and Oakland (don't play defense) could pull off 3 in a row and win the title.
CSU shouldn't have won. Wright State got screwed at the end - Late down 2, Grady threw up an ugly 3 before double dribbling and the refs called a shooting foul. Grady hit all 3 free throws.
Quote from: a3uge on February 08, 2014, 05:49:46 PM
CSU shouldn't have won. Wright State got screwed at the end - Late down 2, Grady threw up an ugly 3 before double dribbling and the refs called a shooting foul. Grady hit all 3 free throws.
It was Charlie Lee I believe.
A poster on the Horizon League forum posted his newcommer team.
All Newcomer Team:Kahlil Felder, Oakland
Matt Tiby, Milwaukee
Kelsey Barlow, UIC
Trey Lewis, Cleveland State
Jon Harris, Cleveland State
Read more: http://horizonleaguefans.freeforums.net/thread/580/conference-awards#ixzz2tJ7Oydcb (http://horizonleaguefans.freeforums.net/thread/580/conference-awards#ixzz2tJ7Oydcb)
In my opinoin I think he left some Crusaders out.
Guess somebody is jealous. Both Lexus and Alec are locks in my opinion, while Jubril has a shot if he finishes really strong. The only one I truly agree with is Felder, Tiby should be a first or second teamer, he's a big reason why Milwaukee has been such a surprise. Barlow shouldn't get anything, he's a senior on a terrible team and he's okay.
There is absolutely 0% chance that we put 3 on the all-newcomer team. It's laughable that one poster thinks that 3 Oakland players will make second team, with the second worst record in conference...
I agree with both of you, but thought I might be biased. I think Peters and Williams should make. Jubril's impact is huge but his numbers aren't near Matt Tiby, Kelsey Barlow, Trey Lewis, Jon Harris. To be honest, even Peters and William's number are a little lower than the players mentioned above.
Oakland and Detroit put on a great show tonight in front of a packed house at the O'rena and a national TV audience on ESPNU. The final score was Oakland 83 Detroit 82 in O.T. The game featured a big time shootout between Howard (33 pts) and Bader (30 pts), as well. This new rivalry can't help but give a boost to both programs and the league. Congratulations to both teams. There were no losers tonight.
Except Detroit, who actually lost the game :thumbsup:
Don't really have a vested interest but Detroit should have been shooting free throws at the end of regulation for the possible win. ... obvious foul that really should have been called.
Quote from: wh on February 14, 2014, 08:53:41 PM
There were no losers tonight.
Quote from: HC on February 14, 2014, 09:34:13 PMExcept Detroit, who actually lost the game
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I'd say Felder sewed up Newcomer of the Year tonight. Always seems like there's a couple fearsome guards to contend with, and now that Perry is (finally) moving on, there's definitely someone to pass the torch to.
(Or The Scorch, if he visits us during baseball season.)
Fielder had the second triple double the year for the HL and nearly pulled of the first quadruple double with his 9 turnovers!
He and Lexus are going to be fun to watch go head to head at point the next few years.
Last night's Detroit/Oakland game got some great coverage in the Detroit Free Press, including this video post game report and press conference:
http://www.freep.com/article/20140214/SPORTS08/302140148/oakland-detroit-recap (http://www.freep.com/article/20140214/SPORTS08/302140148/oakland-detroit-recap)
I'm assuming Detroit TV stations gave it a lot of pub, as well. As someone who lives in the Chicago media market, I can vouch for the fact that Loyola/UIC games NEVER received this kind of publicity, or more accurately never received publicity period. This is definitely a nice step change for the Horizon League.
Quote from: wh on February 15, 2014, 11:28:54 AM
Last night's Detroit/Oakland game got some great coverage in the Detroit Free Press, including this video post game report and press conference:
http://www.freep.com/article/20140214/SPORTS08/302140148/oakland-detroit-recap (http://www.freep.com/article/20140214/SPORTS08/302140148/oakland-detroit-recap)
I'm assuming Detroit TV stations gave it a lot of pub, as well. As someone who lives in the Chicago media market, I can vouch for the fact that Loyola/UIC games NEVER received this kind of publicity, or more accurately never received publicity period. This is definitely a nice step change for the Horizon League.
But even for the Free Press, that coverage was wildly out of the ordinary -- for either team. Even the Titans often get short shrift (The Oakland Press covers Oakland fairly well, so I'm really digging on the Free Press for their usual coverage of the Titans -- it's not Chicago bad, but it is kind of disappointing).
Even if all the additional press coverage applies only to the times they play each other, that's still better than what they were receiving - and far beyond what the Chicago media ever did for UIC and Loyola.
Quote from: wh on February 15, 2014, 01:37:21 PM
Even if all the additional press coverage applies only to the times they play each other, that's still better than what they were receiving - and far beyond what the Chicago media ever did for UIC and Loyola.
Is it because chicago's college team is northwestern or DePaul? There are more/better college teams in Chicago than the 2 in Detroit.
Quote from: oklahomamick on February 15, 2014, 02:08:41 PM
Quote from: wh on February 15, 2014, 01:37:21 PM
Even if all the additional press coverage applies only to the times they play each other, that's still better than what they were receiving - and far beyond what the Chicago media ever did for UIC and Loyola.
Is it because chicago's college team is northwestern or DePaul? There are more/better college teams in Chicago than the 2 in Detroit.
It's not the Free Press's job to cover Northwestern or DePaul. It *should* bloody well be their job to cover the Titans with something better on a weekly basis than the equivalent of a bland AP report.
you know, i was shocked looking at the B1G standings (I normally don't look very far, since Michigan is at the top, ahem) and saw Illinois.
They are awful. I thought they might be a middle-of-the-pack team, but that makes two years in a row we've lost to a bottom-feeder in the B1G.
After last night, though, I don't want to underestimate Bryce. Maybe he's just playing pool shark and once they think it's safe to schedule us more then
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Watched much of the WSU- Oakland game which WSU came back from down 13 late to win 72-71.
The more I watch Petros play the better I appreciate his talents. Wright St couldn't make the big run until Petros fouled out. I think that if this were pro ball and I were General Manager I would offer Kampe a trade of any 2 of the trio of Capo, Fernandez or Gueye and if he took it we would (for this year) get the better of the trade. Petros will occasionally set a high ball screen but the Oakland versatility of movement seems to make the WSU defense much less physical. Thoughts?
I think Petros is a fine player who I like, but I think you might over-value him a bit. After all, in the recent game between Oakland and Valpo he got 14 points & 7 rebounds while playing 39 minutes. The combination of Gueye & Capobianco score 19 points and had 14 rebounds in only 35 minutes of play.
Still, I think Petros and Oakland were robbed today. Petros fouled out on a phantom foul like the ones we've seen against our big men. After he fouled out, Oakland fell apart and lost a game they seemingly had won.
Once again, someone saying that Petros is actually good. He must play better in these other games, as he looks like crap to me when he plays Valpo, regardless of his end of game stats. This isn't my brown and gold-colored glasses either, as I think that Tiby from UWM is good, and will be tough over the next 2 years